2026-08-06 - Historical Commission

0:00to the Thursday, August 6, 2026 meeting

0:03of the city of Worcester Historical

0:05Commission. My name is Erikica Hnarski

0:07and I will chair tonight's meeting.

0:09Before we begin, I have a few brief

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2:01be heard or postponed that night. Once

2:03an item is called, there will be a brief

2:05presentation followed by any additional

2:07comments and clarifications from members

2:09of the city staff, then an opportunity

2:11for anyone from the public to speak on

2:13that item before we proceed to board

2:14discussion and action. Please also note

2:17that all approval votes will be by roll

2:19call which will be administered when the

2:21time comes. I will now take a roll call

2:23of commissioners and city staff present

2:25this evening. Commissioner Bernett

2:28>> here.

2:29>> Commissioner Gutierrez Labot

2:31>> here.

2:32>> Commissioner Baker.

2:35>> Commissioner Forester

2:37>> here.

2:38>> Commissioner Andre.

2:41>> Commissioner Santoso

2:42>> here.

2:43>> And Chair Helarski here. and city staff

2:46Michelle Johnstone

2:47>> um present. And then also just for the

2:49record, we do have Vanessa here.

2:50Vanessa, I muted you because I was

2:53getting feedback, but if you just want

2:55to say here.

2:56>> Here.

2:57>> Okay. Thank you. Great.

2:59>> Okay. So, on to our first item, which is

3:037 Westland Street. We have a request for

3:07a leave to withdraw. So, can I please

3:09have a motion for a leave to withdraw?

3:11The commission hereby issues a leave to

3:13withdraw for seven Westland Street

3:15without prejudice.

3:18>> Second.

3:18>> Second.

3:20>> And then on that motion, Commissioner

3:22Andre,

3:23>> yes.

3:24>> Commissioner Brunette,

3:25>> yes.

3:25>> Commissioner Gutierrez,

3:27>> yes.

3:27>> Commissioner Forester,

3:28>> yes.

3:29>> Commissioner Santos Rivbo,

3:30>> yes.

3:31>> And Chair Holarski,

3:32>> yes.

3:34>> Okay. And on to item two, certificate of

3:37non-applicability for nine Crown Street.

3:39Are the applicants present or online?

3:43>> So through the chair, I know they're not

3:45here in the audience and I am not seeing

3:48anybody online. I think this is one that

3:52you can probably just take without the

3:54petitioner here.

3:55>> Oh, okay. So they don't need to be here

3:57to do this. Okay.

3:58>> For certificates of not So I mean really

4:01they should be, but this is a like inind

4:03replacement. It's asphalt chingle for

4:05asphalt shingle. So, I mean, if you

4:08want, what we can do is we can hold it

4:10till the end and Oh, that's not him.

4:13That's not him either. Um, no. So, we

4:15can hold this one till the end. Um, or

4:17until they appear. And if not, I think

4:20that you should feel comfortable. Yeah.

4:23>> All right. So, we'll hold it to the end

4:24just to see if somebody shows up. But if

4:26they don't, we can still vote on it. So,

4:28we'll go forward with item three, which

4:30is one Hancock Street.

4:33Are the participants present?

4:36here.

4:37>> Yes.

4:38>> How's it going?

4:39>> Good. Thank you. Could you please

4:40introduce yourself and just give us a

4:43brief explanation of um what your plan

4:47is here?

4:48>> Yeah. So, good evening, chair, members

4:50of the commission. My name is F. I'm

4:52here on behalf of the applicant, which

4:54is First Windsor Holdings LLC. Uh first,

4:56I want to say thank you for taking the

4:57time to read the application. What we're

4:59asking for is the retroactive approval

5:01of the existing replacement windows and

5:03front door. um along with approval of

5:06the proposed changes to the dorm or trim

5:08so the front of the house looks closer

5:09to its original look. So the windows and

5:14front door were installed before we

5:15purchased the property. We're not aware

5:17at the time of purchase that this was

5:19done without approvals. So once I became

5:21aware of that, reached out to Michelle

5:24um so we can get on the same page and

5:27apply to you guys to get the acceptance

5:29open. Um, in the materials I included

5:32the historic photograph, which is the

5:34one, the first one on the left, the

5:35current condition, which is in the

5:36middle, and the proposed design. So, you

5:39can kind of see what we want to do in

5:41the project. So, the biggest change

5:44they're proposing to bring back the

5:45arched detail around the dormer and the

5:48front windows. That was an important

5:49part of the original design. I think in

5:52restoring it will improve the look of

5:54the house. Also, I mentioned removing

5:57the black gutters. those were not

5:59original.

6:01The previous owner had put them on.

6:03They're vinyl plastic ones and we're

6:05happy to remove them. Um, and then it's

6:08also a matter of trying to take a

6:10practical approach. So, the existing

6:12windows are all brand new now. The front

6:14door, these are all in good condition

6:16and they've already been installed. So,

6:17rather than removing everything, we're

6:20proposing to restore the architectural

6:22details around them and make the

6:24original facade more historically

6:26appropriate. So, the big plan of this is

6:30pretty much get the house to look as

6:33close to how it looked in the past and

6:37just making it work while at the same

6:40time not wasting branded windows and for

6:42example the door. Um, we're open to

6:45commission's feedback and certainly

6:46willing to work with staff on any

6:47reasonable details and recommendations.

6:52I mean, we totally understand the

6:54situation that, you know, this wasn't

6:56work that, you know, you did yourself.

6:59It was already here. And we do

7:00appreciate you adding some of the

7:02architectural features back. I mean,

7:04ultimately, I know that we would love to

7:07see the first floor window um recreated

7:11on the second floor with the

7:12architectural detail and for the the

7:15front door to be replaced, but also

7:17hearing your concerns of these being,

7:19you know,

7:21new items that are in good condition.

7:23Um, you know, we also understand that as

7:26well. What are some comments from the

7:29rest of the commission about this?

7:33>> You said you were going to uh remove the

7:36gutters. What will you be replacing? And

7:39what will you be replacing them with?

7:41>> The gutters we're not doing anything

7:43with, so they're black. The shutters.

7:45Sorry. Oh, shutters. Yeah, the shutters.

7:48If you see, they installed them on all

7:50the windows. So, proposing to just

7:52remove them and have the more original

7:54look.

7:55>> I thought you said gutters as well, and

7:57I was like, that's application.

7:59>> Yeah, sorry. I might I might have

8:00misspoke, but no,

8:03>> sorry about that.

8:05>> I have a question about the siding.

8:07>> Um,

8:09is that was that original siding of the

8:11shingle?

8:12>> Yes. So the existing siding um is so

8:17this came before the commission several

8:19years ago now and the gentleman I

8:22believe that owned [snorts] it

8:24previously um had proposed replacing the

8:27siding and that was denied. So what he

8:29did is he replaced sections of the cedar

8:33with new cedar and he just painted it.

8:35So it is still the original siding

8:37except for the rotten parts.

8:39>> Okay. Thank you.

8:40>> Yep.

8:42I have a question. Um, what happened to

8:45the original door? Is it still on site

8:47or

8:49>> So, the original door was never on site.

8:51So, if you look at photo when we

8:54purchased it, it's it's just a black

8:56steel door, six panel.

8:59So, it's

8:59>> Okay. So, it's no longer there.

9:01>> Yeah, I know. Exactly. It's nowhere to

9:03be found.

9:10Is there a rear door to the house and

9:13was that replaced or is that original

9:15and that if it's similar to the front

9:17door or could it be moved to the front

9:18and the steel door moved to the back?

9:21>> There is no rear door because it was a

9:24it's a single family. So you have the

9:25door in the front. There's a side door

9:29towards underneath where if you look in

9:31the first picture, you can see the side

9:33of the uh porch. So it's directly

9:35beneath the side the porch. It's the

9:38same thing. six panel steel door painted

9:41black

9:45>> so it's not directly straightest on the

9:47side of it so you don't see it from the

9:49street

10:02it's it's a difficult thing because we

10:04know it's of no fault of of their own um

10:08we appreciate them, you know, willing to

10:10work with us to restore certain

10:12features. It is a shame that the

10:15original window um is no longer there

10:18because I really feel like makes such a

10:21huge difference. I I do like the fact

10:23that the shutters are going to be

10:24removed. Um

10:30>> how are we feeling here?

10:33Is there an appetite at all to replace

10:36that front door with something

10:39remotely resembling what the original

10:43door was?

10:45>> Uh we could potentially do, for example,

10:48they have the six panel, well the six

10:51light um steel doors or fiberglass.

10:56You have the six panel. So, it's pretty

10:58much going to look like a grid window

11:00just on the top of the door. It's not

11:03the entire uh length of it. So, it's

11:05going to be a little bit smaller glass

11:06obviously, but that way it'll match the

11:10grid pattern on top as well if you guys

11:12prefer that.

11:15>> So, I don't know.

11:16>> That would be much uh more um in keeping

11:20with the integrity of the house versus

11:23a black steel door. Um

11:29>> I mean if

11:29>> are they willing are they willing to uh

11:32to consider that and to do it because

11:34you know

11:37>> Yeah. So that would be fine. And then if

11:39through the chair if you guys prefer it

11:41be white black open to ideas. It can be

11:44painted black how it is if you guys like

11:47it white so it matches with the windows

11:50and everything. That's completely up to

11:52you guys.

11:53>> I have a question.

11:55So on the original photo, are there grid

11:58patterns on the window up above?

12:00>> No.

12:01>> No.

12:01>> No.

12:02>> But you're proposing So you now you have

12:05eight over eight in that center.

12:07>> So the

12:08>> Yeah. Sorry to cut you off.

12:10>> That's okay.

12:10>> So the windows they put are all grid

12:13windows, but I'm saying for the front

12:15door I could do with the grids or I

12:18could do without grids. Just so you'll

12:20have this little door and then you'll

12:21have glass on it. That way we have some

12:23nice natural light as well.

12:25>> No, I'm I'm talking about the the upper

12:27window. So the picture all the way to

12:29the right. You said that was the

12:31proposed

12:32>> No.

12:33>> So So through the chair Oh, yeah. That

12:36Well, it is, but he's not proposing to

12:38replace any windows. He's replacing to

12:40build new trim around it.

12:42>> All right. Well, how come that it's 8

12:43over?

12:46>> Yeah. It's like a different size.

12:48>> Yeah, it's 6 over six and the other

12:49one's 80. So that it's going to stay

12:51this the one in the middle. Okay,

12:54>> that's AI, isn't it?

12:56>> I just caught it. Honestly, boy.

12:59>> Wait a minute. If we're willing to

13:01change

13:02>> the grid pattern, then let's change the

13:05whole window. But now I I see what

13:08you're saying.

13:08>> So the grid the grids don't come out

13:10there.

13:10>> So it's going to be the middle one. It's

13:12going to be the exact same windows.

13:14>> Remove the plastic shutters and then add

13:17the architectural detail around the

13:18window.

13:20>> Okay.

13:22had my hopes up there for a minute

13:23because

13:24>> I didn't because I we we discussed it so

13:26I knew it was staying the same. That's

13:27why I was

13:29>> good eye.

13:30>> Ultimately, I would prefer the proposed

13:34look over because I feel like that

13:35window on the second floor is kind of

13:37just huge for the massing. I mean, if

13:40you're willing, my personal opinion, I

13:42don't know about the rest of the

13:43commission, but I'd be willing to

13:44compromise on the proposed work for the

13:47window if the front door could be

13:50switched out, [cough] do something a

13:51[clears throat] little bit more

13:52appropriate.

13:54>> And and it should it really should, if

13:56you're going to go that route, it

13:58should, if you're going to do a

13:59fiberglass um door, you would have, you

14:02know, three panels on the bottom and

14:04then just a single light up top rather

14:05than the grids to try to match what was

14:07there.

14:09And I mean, obviously, they can reach

14:11out for any sort of direction with what

14:13to to choose, but I'd be willing to

14:16compromise. Keep them keeping the

14:17window, adding the feature, removing the

14:19shutters if they swap out the door.

14:22>> Um, I feel like that would kind of tie

14:23the the property a little bit more

14:26together. Um,

14:30yeah.

14:31>> Yeah, no problem.

14:32>> How does everybody else feel about that?

14:34>> That seems fair to me.

14:37Okay,

14:38>> I think that's okay. I'm still really

14:39sad about that on the bottom, though.

14:42>> I know. And I mean, it's not like really

14:44left with any original material when

14:46they bought the place. It was already

14:47kind of done. So,

14:50>> all right. So, um

14:54would we still do the certificate of

14:55non-applicability or do we need to come

14:57back with this?

14:58>> It's it's it's demolition delay. So, um,

15:02you would, so for one Hancock Street,

15:05you would need to open it up for public

15:07comment. Um, and then you would need a

15:11demolition delay waiver for the work as

15:14completed on the condition that trim is

15:17added around the second floor grouping

15:20of windows on the facade, that the

15:22shutters are removed, and the front door

15:26is swapped for a more appropriate panled

15:31and glazed um, fiberglass door to be

15:34approved by staff.

15:35>> Okay.

15:35>> Something to that effect.

15:36>> Okay. So, I'm going to open it up for

15:38public comment at this point.

15:44Nothing. Okay. Can I have a motion to

15:46close public comment?

15:47>> I'll make a motion to close public

15:48comment.

15:49>> Second.

15:50>> Okay.

15:51>> And on that motion, Commissioner Andre,

15:54>> yes.

15:54>> Commissioner Bernett,

15:55>> yes.

15:56>> Commissioner Gutierrez,

15:57>> yes.

15:58>> Commissioner Forester,

15:59>> yes.

16:00>> Commissioner Santos Rivo,

16:01>> yes.

16:02>> And Chair Holarski,

16:03>> yes. And now, can I please have a motion

16:05for a demolition delay waiver?

16:07>> Yes, I should make a motion for a waiver

16:09of the 12-month building demolition

16:11delay. The commission finds that the

16:14partially retroactive demolition at one

16:16Hancock Street consisting of replacing

16:19the window trim,

16:21removing the shutters,

16:24and replacing the front door with a more

16:28appropriate fiberglass door potentially

16:31with three panels on the bottom and one

16:34window panel on the top

16:37would not be detrimental to the

16:39historical or architectural resources of

16:41the city of Worcester.

16:43And also replacing the windows in

16:46addition to the window trim, but other

16:48than that, sounds good.

16:49>> Replacing the wi

16:50>> Yeah, because the windows were already

16:52replaced.

16:52>> Replacing the window. Yes.

16:54>> Yeah.

16:55>> Sorry, I crossed that out. And replacing

16:56the windows.

16:57>> I can do this over again if you want.

16:59>> Nope. I'm We got it.

17:02>> All right.

17:03>> We have a second. Okay. And then on that

17:04motion, Commissioner Andre.

17:06>> Yes.

17:07>> Commissioner Bernett,

17:08>> yes.

17:08>> Commissioner Gutierrez Lavod,

17:09>> yes.

17:10>> Commissioner Forester,

17:11>> yes. Commissioner Santos Rebo.

17:12[clears throat]

17:12>> Yes.

17:13>> And chair Harkski.

17:14>> Yes.

17:15>> All right, CJ. You're all set.

17:17>> Thank you. Appreciate it.

17:18>> Thank you.

17:20>> Of course.

17:20>> And now moving on to item four, 180

17:23Harding Street.

17:30>> Can you please just introduce

17:32yourselves?

17:34>> I'm

17:35Dina.

17:36>> Oh, you it was You can hit it again.

17:38It'll light up for you.

17:40It'll there you go. Now it's on.

17:42>> Hi, I'm Dino Laruso. I own uh 180

17:45Harding Street and uh property owner.

17:50>> And I'm Jay Galant, architect working

17:52with Dino.

17:54Uh so Dino owns uh other properties in

17:56the Canal District, most notably

17:59Crompton Place at 138 Green Street, and

18:02his vision is to turn this into a a

18:06smaller scale version of that. uh

18:08restore some of the things that have

18:10been you know neglected over time uh

18:13make the building more vibrant.

18:15Obviously, the first floor has been

18:16renovated previously, but the second and

18:18third floors u is what he's going to

18:21tackle now. And um first step is to take

18:25those windows that are there, which some

18:28are boarded up, some are falling out.

18:30They're they're in really really poor

18:32condition, not really salvageable, and

18:35replace them with with new units

18:38[clears throat] as shown in these

18:39drawings. We actually have some uh

18:40Dino's been working with a couple of

18:42different vendors and has some more

18:43specific ideas for the windows

18:45themselves with some of the grill

18:47patterns, etc. But um the idea is to uh

18:50take the old units out and put new ones

18:52in each of the openings.

18:57>> Okay.

18:58>> And renovate the two floors that are

19:01currently vacant in two apartments.

19:05So we So the um the rear elevation is

19:09going to have different windows than the

19:11front. Correct.

19:12>> Yes. The rear elevation as I opened up

19:15the back was 6 over one.

19:17>> Okay.

19:17>> There was only one window behind the

19:19block. All the rest are gone.

19:20>> We love these pictures so we can see.

19:23>> We're trying to put six over one. I

19:25think it's appropriate.

19:26>> Yeah, I think that's great.

19:27>> Perfect.

19:29Um, I can go on to the the front uh two

19:32sides, which is east and south. Uh, I

19:36tried to figure out I'm not sure if

19:38these were the original windows, if they

19:41were changed at some time, but what I

19:44inherited is that basically dry rot.

19:48They then fiberglass the front. Birds

19:52got in behind it. The birds have been

19:54living in there. The backside windows

19:56are broken. Most of them are are gone.

19:59And if you try to open up one window,

20:01all of the woodwork just falls apart.

20:04>> There's just nothing that I could say.

20:06>> These are the swivels. So those

20:08>> they're on a pivot

20:09>> in the middle.

20:10>> Okay.

20:11>> And I just don't know what to do with

20:13them. Uh if there's

20:15>> Yeah. It it like kind of swings like

20:17>> Oh, they're those kind.

20:19>> Yeah.

20:19>> Ah, it's it's And there's nothing left

20:21to the windows. If there's a there's the

20:24middle windows are there.

20:25That's where you based the new windows

20:28off of is that this one that's kind of

20:30still visible in the front.

20:31>> Yeah, there's one that you see that's

20:32pivot. The one on the right I couldn't

20:34because the whole bottom just fell

20:36apart. But those are the good windows.

20:39>> The [laughter] rest of them the rest of

20:41them are just nothing there.

20:44>> Sort of using that as a template.

20:45>> Yeah, I like So the with like the lights

20:48on top like that. I like that because

20:49the other ones I'm assuming it must have

20:51or maybe not. So, so the way they, so

20:55the way they were before, it looks like

20:57it's really broken up into six sections.

21:00So, it's like there's three big ones on

21:01the bottom and then they're almost like

21:03transoms on top of them.

21:04>> Yeah.

21:05>> And so, what they're proposing now is

21:08>> double hungs,

21:09>> I think. Um, double hung and to do the

21:12transoms in all of them.

21:14>> The transoms and then so what is going

21:16to be the operating mechanism for the

21:18center?

21:19>> Nothing.

21:19>> It's just going to be fixed,

21:21>> which it is fixed now. The two side

21:23windows are um this is

21:25>> kind of closer to after working it a

21:27little bit more.

21:29>> Okay, that's helpful.

21:32>> Okay. Okay.

21:34>> So, they're going to they're going to

21:35have grids.

21:36>> Do you like the grids?

21:37>> Yes. Okay.

21:38>> Are there grids on the transom there? On

21:41the each side of the transom?

21:43>> I don't see that on there.

21:45>> Right. I I kind of worked it. I like

21:47that. I like this more. I like this.

21:50>> Which one's original? Hi.

21:52>> So, so we don't know. Those aren't

21:55original. They're historic. They're over

21:5650 years old, which is why they're here.

21:59>> So,

21:59>> I mean, I like the grids in the the

22:02double, but the transoms, I don't like

22:04the grids in the transoms, but I mean,

22:06>> um,

22:07>> it's preference.

22:10>> Yeah. Yeah.

22:11>> I like it. It's not

22:14>> No, I know. I know. I know.

22:15>> And and I've gone through a lot of

22:18window companies. I've got a bunch of

22:20them. This was my favorite. Yeah.

22:22>> With the theme I wanted and we

22:23appreciate that there's a lot of this is

22:26gonna fill in below and on the side and

22:29I wanted to carry

22:31>> like cohesive look. Yeah.

22:32>> So if you're coming down the back and

22:34you come and see the side I want to see

22:36some cohesive does bring some

22:37consistency to the building and it

22:39doesn't really

22:41two top floors will have some

22:45>> I didn't want in the back.

22:47>> Exactly. Did it go back off again?

22:50unmute it.

22:51>> Oh, it's muted.

22:53>> Sorry.

22:54>> Oh, that's

22:55>> my Italian hands.

22:56>> No, that's [laughter]

22:58all.

22:58>> It gets the point across. I mean, that's

23:01really my only comment. Again, that's a

23:03personal preference, and we know they're

23:04not original, so that doesn't really

23:05take any, but um any other comments from

23:08the

23:09>> Well, they're not original, but they

23:10have been there a long time. And what

23:12I'm looking at right there is to to me I

23:14still see a grid pattern because you've

23:17got the line going up, you know, into

23:20the transom. So to me it's it still has

23:23that effect if that's what you're

23:25looking for rather than introducing

23:26another.

23:27>> I like the transom. The the side windows

23:30didn't have it. I thought it was off. It

23:33was something was wrong for me when I

23:34looked at it all. So when I put the

23:37transom in on both sides, the south side

23:40and the uh east side, the transom worked

23:44for me. The two windows, one over one

23:47works, but then when I put the grid in,

23:48it just f it came around to the back.

23:51>> Which grid? Because I think you showed

23:52two different grid patterns you want.

23:54Which one do you prefer?

23:55>> What I tried to bring is this is the

23:56left side and this is the right side.

23:58You see there's one window

24:00>> and then there's one more big window in

24:02the middle.

24:03>> Okay.

24:04>> Okay. So, if you're looking at it, this

24:06is the left side. That's the right side.

24:08And there's one more window in the

24:09middle so you could see.

24:10>> I see what you're doing. Okay.

24:12>> Okay.

24:14>> Okay.

24:14>> And it just flowed for me.

24:16>> Especially if you're doing the six over

24:17one in the back, right?

24:18>> And and if I'm coming down Harrison

24:20Street, I kind of was going, "Oh, all

24:22right. You're going to see one side." If

24:24you're coming down Harding Street, you

24:25go past, you look back.

24:27>> I just wanted some consistency.

24:29>> No, I agree.

24:32I mean, I think it's going to look

24:33great. So, I mean, I don't know how

24:36>> I just have a question. Is the garage

24:38part of this or is No. Or No. No. Thank

24:41you.

24:42>> It was renovated pre uh not that long

24:44ago. Right.

24:45>> The garage. Yeah. It It's kind of I I

24:48I'm sticking will come.

24:50>> I've only owned it less than 60 days.

24:53Try working on the building.

24:54>> Just want to know if it was part of the

24:55project. Thank

24:56>> I I don't want to sound dense. I'm down

24:58here. So, I'm I'm having trouble with

25:01with what you have on the side windows,

25:05right? Did Did you say it's four over in

25:08that picture?

25:13>> It's six over six on the single window.

25:16>> Yeah.

25:17>> The single window,

25:18>> but this would match the back.

25:19>> But this this is what I'm asking about.

25:21You've got

25:22>> two, four, and two because that's that's

25:24what lines up. You have to kind of line

25:26it up. I 6 over six time with single

25:30windows on the side. He's trying to

25:32match

25:346 over one

25:36here. He's got four over one.

25:38>> The three panel transom, six over one,

25:41two panel transom, four over one, one

25:44panel transom, one big one that does

25:47that's stationary, doesn't move. And

25:48then you're just repeating two two panel

25:51transom, four panel over one. Yes.

25:56>> Okay. And then this

25:57>> he's only doing the six over one to

25:59match the rear elevation.

26:00>> This is the outside and the matching one

26:02more in the middle.

26:03>> Okay, that's clear. I think that is that

26:06clear?

26:08>> Yeah. I just picture

26:09>> Can you show the rear elevation again on

26:12the So that's what he's trying to match

26:14with the single windows on the front.

26:15>> Right. The other picture didn't have

26:18this pattern. It just had the one line.

26:20That's what I'm

26:20>> But that's what he preferred.

26:22>> That's why I brought in

26:23>> I had a bunch of windows to come at me.

26:26and I had to put an application in, but

26:28what I finally this is costing a lot

26:30more money.

26:31>> Yeah.

26:32>> And it's kind of what I think fits best.

26:35>> So, this is what you're proposing. This

26:36is your preference.

26:37>> Mhm.

26:38>> Okay. That is helpful.

26:42>> Okay.

26:44>> And what are these made of? These

26:46windows that you're

26:47>> vinyl black.

26:49>> That's they they they were they were

26:51proposed as aluminum clad wood.

26:53>> I'm sorry, what? That was what that was

26:56what was in the proposal, I believe.

26:57>> Aluminum over wood.

26:59>> Yeah,

27:00>> that that is what was in the proposal.

27:02>> We've gotten some u gotten some quotes

27:05and

27:06>> yeah,

27:06>> the vinyl is uh

27:09>> looking better.

27:11>> It's it's it's I I I really like the

27:15vinyl. It's all over the neighborhood.

27:17First of all, if you go to um every

27:21single building around me is just black

27:23vinyl. I'm not something different all

27:26of a sudden. You know, there isn't one

27:28building in the neighborhood that

27:30doesn't have vinyl or aluminum. That's

27:32all we have in the neighborhood.

27:33>> The issue we have is that it wasn't put

27:35in the application for that

27:37>> application material. Yeah. I mean, the

27:39application was put forward for

27:40replacement windows with aluminum clad

27:42wood

27:44>> with what?

27:45>> Okay.

27:47>> Which that's there are aluminum cladwood

27:50in the neighborhood that were installed

27:51with tax credit funds. Um, but anyway,

27:55so that that is what specifically was in

27:57the application.

27:58>> And I mean, we would be from what I

27:59gather, we would be okay with the

28:01proposed design, but now that it's a

28:04different material, that's where the

28:05problem comes in.

28:07>> Can we amend the application?

28:10>> You can amend it, but getting it

28:12approved is a different story. So, I

28:14mean, you could take a straw poll, see

28:16how they feel.

28:19>> Okay.

28:20>> Yeah.

28:23So, you're saying tax credits were

28:25applied to

28:26>> not for this. She's speaking of a

28:28different

28:28>> I was giving other examples in the

28:29neighborhood of the type of of where you

28:31could find that type of window.

28:33>> Would you use it? Comprompton, please.

28:35>> Vinyl and aluminum on

28:39project.

28:39>> There's vinyl on Harrison Street and

28:41aluminum on 138,

28:43>> but the aluminum had to be for the um

28:46hopper window. You just need that

28:48strength for that hopper.

28:50>> But double need to be.

28:53>> So through the chair, why don't you take

28:56um just a straw poll of how people feel

28:59so that way you can give them an idea of

29:01whether or not it's advantageous to take

29:03a vote or not.

29:05>> I mean, before we do that, all I will

29:07say is that I know that I don't feel

29:09comfortable taking a vote because I

29:11don't have any financials of what the

29:13difference is between the two types of

29:16windows

29:17>> um material-wise.

29:20That's my personal opinion. How is

29:22everybody else feeling about voting on

29:25the same proposed design but with vinyl

29:27instead of what was proposed in the

29:28application?

29:31I

29:31>> think I think I'd like to see the

29:33financial stuff too and and if they do

29:36come back maybe elevations with the grid

29:39um because they're coming back anyways.

29:41But any I guess my saying is

29:43>> I would need some more information

29:44>> regardless of what that is. I is that

29:47how the rest of the commission is

29:48feeling as well to see the same kind of

29:51jobs with the proposed design that

29:53you've chosen since submitting as well

29:56as the financials between the two

29:58different types of materials for

30:00windows.

30:00>> Can I ask what is this material that

30:02they're talking about J?

30:04>> Like an Anderson window where where it's

30:07wood instead of vinyl

30:09>> window itself

30:10>> because that's what was in the

30:11application. So that's what we thought

30:13we were

30:14>> cost difference. I know I I did Jay I

30:16and so for the financial

30:17>> that was a mistake on Jay's part

30:20>> and it happened it's not don't it's not

30:22just him it happened the first

30:24>> and so

30:25>> my my problem is is that

30:28>> this is still six to eight weeks out

30:31>> time is important I don't have 30 more

30:35days to come back and do all of this and

30:38then place the order winter's coming

30:41>> and I need to close up this we have

30:43meetings every two weeks

30:45>> so we could I mean if you're able to get

30:48the the you know the cost differentiate

30:50with you know the pictures that show

30:52that

30:52>> and so they would if you were going to

30:54do that you would have to do the

30:55financial hardship supplement so I could

30:57provide that so I mean if it's it would

30:59be a rush to get all of the financials

31:01together to prove that there's a

31:02financial hardship um and you know then

31:05you would vote on that in in two weeks

31:08>> so yeah

31:11>> could we vote on the revi could we do on

31:13the whole thing in two weeks.

31:17>> Yeah. Um you you could so so if if you

31:20wanted I mean you could get a vote

31:22tonight which um I mean I don't know how

31:26that's going to go and then you could

31:28continue discussion for financial

31:30hardship. Give you two weeks to prove

31:32that you have a financial hardship that

31:34you only have so many incomeroucing

31:36buildings and that you can't afford the

31:38windows um that were proposed in the

31:41first place. and then they could vote

31:43under financial hardship in two weeks.

31:46>> So is it really is it a financial

31:48hardship or is the cost differential

31:51that extreme

31:53>> between the I would guess two to three

31:56to one. These build this building's been

31:59boarded up for 75 years. I'm willing to

32:01open it up and make it look gorgeous.

32:04>> And it's it I I'm going to spend a ton

32:06of money on these windows. I can't

32:09triple that. I can't get my return back.

32:12>> We've already spent millions

32:14>> and that's the thing. We appreciate it,

32:15but as this commission, our specific

32:17duty

32:19is historical preservation and

32:21architecture. So to set a precedence for

32:23anybody else that comes before us, we

32:25don't want people, oh well, you let them

32:26get away with it. We need to be like,

32:27okay, well, they provided us with the

32:29financials. We looked at it. We made We

32:31can't just be throwing out decisions

32:33without, you know, just like you make

32:36your decisions. It's got to make sense

32:37to you. It's got to make sense to us. So

32:39that way going forward people don't come

32:41and say, "Oh, will you let them do it?"

32:43Well, yeah. We asked for the material.

32:45We got it and we made a decision based

32:46off that. And that's really what it's

32:48all about. We're very grateful that

32:50you're willing to restore this building

32:52and and I don't want you to think that

32:54we're not. It's just that there's

32:55certain procedures that we have to

32:57follow through as well.

32:58>> I I question is there a precedent for

33:01the vinyl windows in other buildings in

33:03that area that we has the commission

33:05approved vinyl windows in the past? What

33:07is the most recent that we have approved

33:10in that? Because it's been quite

33:12>> Yeah. I mean, I've been in this role for

33:14seven years and

33:17there have been times when people have

33:19provided like disability paperwork and

33:21things like that where you've allowed

33:22for vinyl um where they truly cannot

33:25afford anything else. There's also been

33:27cases where you have allowed vinyl on

33:29side elevations

33:30>> kind material replacement type things

33:32I'm sure.

33:33>> Yeah. And I mean there's also been cases

33:35where um like side and re rear

33:38elevations you've allowed vinyl um and

33:40then the facade elevation you've

33:42required wood.

33:43>> Yeah.

33:45>> So yeah, I mean it's it's not unheard

33:47of, but since I've been here, I can't

33:49think of a time where you've allowed a

33:50full a full replacement of wood windows

33:54with vinyl. There have been times where

33:56you've found buildings to no longer be

33:59under your jurisdiction because of how

34:02altered the whole building is. Yeah.

34:04Where it's it's been allowed that way.

34:06But no, there's not since I've been here

34:09that hasn't happened.

34:10>> Can you tell me of one building in the

34:11neighborhood that has wood windows?

34:14>> The um

34:16the I think it's Walker Shoe that just

34:18got done. Is that Walker Shoe or is that

34:21um

34:23Haywood? the one that um Anthony Rossy

34:25just that that was a tax credit project.

34:27So that would have been either wood or

34:29aluminum clad wood

34:30>> table talk pie building.

34:31>> No. Okay. That was not that was not a

34:33tax credit project and that also isn't

34:34historic. So it didn't go before the

34:35commission.

34:36>> Yeah. I'm not looking for a tax credit.

34:38>> No, we don't.

34:39>> No. I'm I'm saying the reason why some

34:42buildings need to have those windows is

34:43because the National Park Service won't

34:45give them the money unless they put them

34:46in. So that's why I know that there are

34:48some there. My question is is has there

34:50been a building that has been approved

34:53with wood windows in the in the canal

34:55district?

34:56>> I don't think that anybody's come to us

34:58other than Anthony Rossy's project there

35:00which that got approved for wood windows

35:01or or clad wood.

35:03>> Mhm.

35:11>> How are we feeling?

35:13>> Is there an appetite to

35:16like we've we've done this before. We we

35:19we negotiated having aluminum clad

35:23wooden windows in the front and then

35:26having the full vinyl on the side just

35:30to

35:30>> just so the facade has that.

35:32>> Yeah. To keep the the integrity of the

35:34facade. Is that something? So how many

35:38window? Okay, that's the facade. So

35:40you've got

35:41>> six big ones and four smaller ones. And

35:45on the side you have one, two, you've

35:47got

35:48>> several.

35:50>> Is that right?

35:51>> 600 it looks like.

35:53>> Yeah. Yeah.

35:55>> I guess you could show the the elevation

35:58drawings. Are they on there? That might

36:00be easier to count them.

36:01>> Yeah.

36:01>> Okay. Yeah.

36:02>> Yeah. So there's um obviously on top and

36:07then on the side there's six and then on

36:08the rear there is all the CMU that is

36:12being removed. I mean, in the case of

36:14the CMU, I would be be inclined just to

36:17approve it even administratively because

36:19there's there's no window.

36:20>> Well, that's what I'm saying. There's

36:21nothing there to begin with. Um, so a

36:23replace anything there is better than

36:26>> better than

36:27>> nothing. Yeah. Um,

36:32>> so aluminum.

36:34So we're we're talking just wood now.

36:37>> Aluminum clad wood.

36:38>> Yeah. We haven't even So So just

36:41aluminum sash hasn't even been talked

36:42about. Yeah, that's what I'm asking.

36:45It's aluminum an option.

36:47>> So, is there an appetite to do that for

36:50to

36:53>> do the aluminum clad wood on the on the

36:57front facade and vinyl on the side.

37:00That's one way to get this done. This

37:02this

37:02>> or just aluminum

37:03>> or just aluminum

37:04>> or just aluminum

37:07>> instead of the

37:08>> on front and then do your vinyl on the

37:11side. Is that

37:13>> and the rear as well? Correct.

37:15>> The whole building. So, we're just

37:16looking for the front to beat the

37:18aluminum.

37:18>> The other thing is we also have to talk

37:20about um like whether there are grids

37:23between the glass or simulated divided

37:25light because that's something else that

37:26the commission generally opines on.

37:29>> So, will these

37:30>> I'm sorry Michelle I didn't understand

37:31what you said.

37:32>> Understand that.

37:33>> So, Jay,

37:35>> are they are they simulated divided

37:37light or are they grids between the

37:38glass? Does it have the applied uh

37:41material on the inside and outside or is

37:42it just between the glass the grids that

37:44you talk to these folks about?

37:47>> Uh the the grid is inside in between the

37:49glass.

37:50>> Okay.

37:50>> Okay.

37:52>> So that's one thing.

37:53>> Okay.

37:54>> And the grid does bring the price up,

37:58>> right? The grid patterns will make it

37:59pricier for you.

38:01>> Yeah. But there's a certain look I'm

38:03looking for.

38:04>> Yeah. But so so Kristen there is no so

38:06the grids are between though between the

38:09glass that's not the applied yeah

38:12>> grid glass

38:14>> yeah which

38:15>> one pane of glass the grid another pane

38:18of glass grid another pane of glass

38:22>> so you are amendable to the glass

38:26plastic grid glass like the sandwich

38:29type is that correct

38:32>> okay

38:32>> that that's what he's

38:33>> that's what he That's what you have.

38:35Okay. We know the other one is

38:38>> brings up the price considerably.

38:40>> Yeah.

38:41>> But we typically prefer

38:46>> I mean again I'll leave those up to the

38:48commission but typically um even with

38:51vinyl you've allowed vinyl on side

38:54elevations so long as they're simulated

38:56divided light. So that's the muttons

38:58mechanically attached on the inside and

38:59outside.

39:01>> So it couldn't just be on the inside. It

39:03have to be outside of the glass too.

39:06>> I'm not following.

39:09>> Jake, do you want to explain a simulated

39:11divider light window?

39:12>> So there are, I guess, three different

39:15ways to to

39:17construct windows, right? One is with

39:19like you are proposing in the center

39:22with no grids at all. Another is to as

39:26you described have a pane of glass and

39:28then the

39:31>> plastic usually Yeah, the grid

39:34>> grid

39:34>> simulation in between two panes of glass

39:37because it's two it's a double pane

39:38window, right? And then the third way is

39:41where you apply

39:44uh the material to the outside and

39:46usually also to the inside.

39:48>> Correct.

39:48>> And then and then ideally a spacer bar

39:51in the middle.

39:52>> If it's the grid that is a problem,

39:55we'll go back to that design

39:57>> to the no grids at all.

39:59>> No grid. If that's a problem,

40:00>> I mean, we would do the grid. But it

40:01would just need to be applied on the

40:03outside as well, not in between the

40:07pain.

40:08>> I will do my best to do that.

40:11>> Yes.

40:12>> So

40:12>> that if I can get approval on that.

40:17>> So speaking as someone who owns an old

40:19home.

40:20>> I'm sorry, what? Speaking as someone who

40:22owns an old home, I have um like in my

40:25dining room, I've got four windows with

40:27diamonds,

40:29>> individual cuts of diamond, and there's

40:32wood on the inside and then the outside.

40:35That's a lot more expensive to fix

40:38>> uh to replace and I hope I never have

40:40to, but um

40:42>> it's much more aesthetically appealing

40:45than the plastic. I in my opinion I'd go

40:50I'd rather you go one over one

40:54no grid

40:56>> have it tasteful clean

40:59and and that way it should be less

41:02expensive

41:06>> even if you want to uh even if we

41:11discuss and we agree that you have the

41:14vinyl on the side and on the front you

41:16have the aluminum clad wood,

41:19but still

41:20>> there's still transom three, you know,

41:22three transom, but they're single.

41:24>> Yeah, we've got the

41:26>> We're going back to that drawing. It's

41:27okay.

41:29>> But there's still the question of the

41:30rear elevation with the six over one.

41:32What would that grid be?

41:35That that's

41:37>> I mean, so through the chair, if you're

41:38asking for my opinion on the rear, it's

41:41concrete block right now, so I think

41:43anything's going to be better than that.

41:45I think the main discussion should be on

41:47the front and side elevations.

41:49>> Okay.

41:49>> Okay.

41:50>> So, I think the way we're leaning is to

41:52approve the vinyl windows on the sides

41:55and the rear the way that you have them

41:57proposed,

41:59but the front we're looking to have no

42:01grids

42:04and to have

42:06the type of window that was proposed in

42:09the application originally.

42:12>> I I have a question. The side are the

42:15sides going to have the grids and the

42:17front not have the grid.

42:19>> No, I

42:20>> that's so from what I understand from

42:22what I'm gathering is the what Erica is

42:27saying is that everything is going to go

42:29back to exactly how it was originally

42:31proposed. Yes.

42:32>> Except they're she's saying that she's

42:35leaning towards doing a motion to allow

42:37the vinyl on the sides and back but not

42:39the front.

42:42So you would have to get aluminum clad

42:44wooden for the front

42:45>> with no grids.

42:46>> No grids. Exactly how transom exactly

42:50how it is proposed.

42:52>> Yeah.

42:53>> Is that a compromise that

42:55>> we're willing?

43:00>> Uh yeah,

43:02>> it's real expensive. So just be sure

43:04because you don't want to have to come

43:05back.

43:06>> Is aluminum less expensive?

43:07>> Aluminum would be less expensive.

43:08>> Yeah. Just straight. You could I'd be

43:10okay with just straight aluminum on the

43:12front. Fine with a straight aluminum

43:14field paintable aluminum.

43:15>> So I'm concerned with mixing materials.

43:19>> I know. I just want to get this all

43:20done.

43:21>> Right. Exactly. So So if we can

43:24>> It's something that's done quite often

43:26on this commission. This commission does

43:28that all the time.

43:29>> It's all the time. It's really the front

43:31facade that has most of like, you know,

43:34the architectural integrity that

43:35>> I would argue that this building has two

43:37fronts. I didn't want to go there. I

43:40agree with you. [clears throat] I agree

43:41to go there, but that's not good for

43:43your Don't We're trying because if you

43:46when you bring that up, then we're going

43:47to be like

43:49>> straight aluminum though.

43:50>> Yeah.

43:51>> Yeah. We're okay with that as well.

43:52>> Straight aluminum.

43:54>> I I when I price it out, if it's not

43:57much more money, I would do two sides

43:59aluminum and the back vinyl, but I want

44:02to have that option if I can.

44:03>> Well, then that's that's perfect because

44:05So, I mean, here

44:06>> that'd be wonderful.

44:08So

44:09>> that's Vanessa. Oh,

44:11[laughter]

44:13>> so so then it sounds like once we open

44:16it up for public comment and close it

44:18and everything, the motion will be

44:19something to the effect of replacing all

44:22windows on the second and third floors,

44:25the the Harding Street elevation to be

44:28replaced with either aluminum or

44:31aluminum clad wood. And then the sides,

44:35the side to be replaced with either

44:38vinyl or aluminum or aluminum cladwood

44:41and then the CMU in the back to be

44:43replaced with 6 over1 vinyl.

44:46>> Okay.

44:46>> Whichever is I think that's a really

44:49fair compromise,

44:52right? So that way it's still

44:53financially feasible, still has the

44:56look. Um,

44:59are we happy with that?

45:00>> Just going to write it all down.

45:02>> All right. So, I'm going to open it up

45:03for public comment then.

45:07>> I don't think there's any not seeing

45:09anybody.

45:09>> Okay. Can I have a motion to close

45:10public comment, please?

45:12>> I'll make a motion to close public

45:13comment.

45:14>> Second.

45:15>> And on that motion, Commissioner Andre,

45:18>> yes.

45:19>> Commissioner um Bernett,

45:21>> yes.

45:21>> Commissioner Gutierrez Lavod,

45:23>> yes.

45:23>> Commissioner Forester,

45:24>> yes.

45:24>> Commissioner Santos Rivo,

45:26>> yes.

45:26>> And Cher Harkski,

45:28>> yes. And now, can I please have a motion

45:30for a certificate of non applicability.

45:33>> Oh, no. This is this is the building

45:35demo de delay.

45:37>> Yes.

45:38>> Okay. Okay. I'll make a motion for a

45:40waiver of the 12 month building

45:42demolition delay. And just bear with me.

45:45The commission finds that the proposed

45:47demolition at 180 Harding Street

45:49consisting of replacing all the windows

45:52on the second and third level.

45:57uh specifically the Harding Street

45:59elevation to have no grid aluminum

46:04windows.

46:06The side windows to be replaced with

46:10either vinyl or aluminum clad wooden

46:13windows

46:14>> or aluminum aluminum

46:15>> or aluminum windows, sorry. and the CMA

46:18to be replaced with the proposed six

46:21over one

46:23orientation

46:24>> grids between glass vinyl

46:25>> grid with

46:27>> between glass

46:28>> between glass

46:29>> grid between

46:31>> glass okay

46:34>> between vinyl okay

46:38what be detrimental to the historical or

46:40architectural resources of the city of

46:42Worcester

46:45>> second

46:46>> and on that motion. Um, Commissioner

46:48Andre,

46:49>> yes.

46:50>> Commissioner Bernett,

46:51>> yes.

46:51>> Commissioner Gutierrez,

46:53>> yes.

46:53>> Commissioner Forester,

46:54>> yes.

46:54>> Commissioner Santos Rebo,

46:56>> yes.

46:56>> Chair Harkski,

46:57>> yes.

46:58>> Thank you.

46:58>> Thank you.

46:59>> Thank you.

47:02>> Okay, moving on to item five. Uh, 104

47:05Pleasant Street. The applicants present.

47:17Can you please just introduce yourself

47:19to the commission?

47:25>> It's a pleasure for me to be here.

47:28>> Make sure it's on. The lights on.

47:30>> Perfect.

47:31>> Okay. Now, can you please just explain

47:34um what has already been done to the

47:36property?

47:45So I was asking the owners.

47:52>> So the owner and the person that rented

47:54the place,

47:56what has been the work that has been

47:57done there?

48:00So they mentioned to me that they

48:02changed the door.

48:11And so and they they changed the metal

48:15of the door.

48:22>> And then the outside color was changed

48:25as well by another color too.

48:44So I was not the one that did the work.

48:46It was someone else. Um he asked what

48:49was the reason why this changes were

48:51made. Um so he said he willing to

48:54explain to you guys when you guys ask

49:03Do we

49:05>> So, um, through the chair, this came

49:08before you as a violation like several

49:10weeks ago.

49:11>> Um, he he and the owner were both very

49:14responsive. They got an application in.

49:17So, there's really like three primary

49:20things here, which that wouldn't be

49:22primary. There's three there's there's

49:24three things. So the first thing as was

49:27just described is the storage system

49:31where the security grate is held was

49:34painted. So it used to be like a maroon

49:36color. It's now black.

49:38>> Mhm.

49:39>> The front door

49:40>> still comes

49:41>> which we don't really know what the

49:42front door looked like before because in

49:45all the Google Street View pictures

49:47there's a great in front of it but we

49:48know it was replaced because it doesn't

49:50look the same on the left as it does on

49:53the right. So, we know that the front

49:54door was replaced. The last thing is the

49:59grate system used to look like this.

50:03>> Mhm.

50:05>> Now,

50:06it looks like this. So, the metal, as

50:10far as I understand, was rusted out. So,

50:13it was replaced with this new metal. Um,

50:17since the violation was issued, and you

50:20can correct me if I'm wrong, the great

50:22has been in the upward position.

50:25>> Since the violation has been noticed,

50:27the has been issued. The great has been

50:30in the upward position. Is that correct?

50:43>> No, no changes.

50:46No. So, so since I issued since we

50:48issued the violation, the grates have

50:50been up, right? So, you can't see them

50:52right now.

50:53>> They've been stored up.

51:13So, yes, they have been elevated.

51:15>> Yeah. Okay. That's what I That's what I

51:17thought.

51:18>> He's saying that since they got the

51:20citation, they haven't been back to work

51:22on anything on that.

51:24>> Right. No, no, no, no, no. Yeah. No, I

51:25know. I'm just saying like if you drive

51:27by it right now, you wouldn't see that

51:28because they're in the up position.

51:30They're elevated.

51:34CL.

51:36>> So, for a moment there, I was confusing

51:38this with another property, but

51:39>> yes.

51:41>> So, this is really just

51:45them showing what was done and it's

51:47really just a matter of the paint color

51:50wasn't approved and they switched out

51:52the material of the security grate that

51:54was already there.

51:55>> The security grate. Yeah. which is not I

51:58mean it's not always going to be

51:59something you you can see because

52:01>> Exactly.

52:02>> Yes.

52:03>> And then there's the front doors

52:05>> which we don't even really know.

52:06>> We don't unfortunately know what the

52:08front doors looked like.

52:09>> Okay.

52:12>> So just for clarification

52:17>> this is what it looks like now. Yes.

52:19That looks like

52:22>> that's with the

52:23>> It's down. It's in the down position

52:25there.

52:26>> And that is what they look like before.

52:29>> Yes.

52:31>> Down.

52:32>> And so this is a I mean this is a

52:33pre-existing security grade. These

52:36generally are not allowed in the local

52:38historic district, but this

52:39>> but it was already

52:40>> it was there before 2013.

52:42>> Yeah.

52:42>> Another question. Are all these elements

52:45still

52:47>> in?

52:48>> Yes.

52:49>> Yeah. It's kind of hard to see with um

52:52>> they've been painted.

52:53>> Okay. But they were painted a long time

52:54ago.

52:55>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

52:56>> But what about that area?

52:59>> Oh, this this got hit by a car,

53:02>> didn't it?

53:09Or is that why that it's not there? It

53:11was replaced.

53:13>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.

53:14>> The gates aren't down.

53:16>> Yeah, because it got hit by a car at

53:18some point and it was just on the far

53:21left that it got hit by a car. Huh?

53:23>> I don't know why. So, but this wasn't

53:26there anyway.

53:26>> That wasn't there anyway. That this is

53:29from like 2011.

53:33>> I mean, personally,

53:35>> I don't have an issue with this. It's

53:38just a matter of the paint color is

53:40different.

53:41>> Um, the material of the security grate

53:45is different, but again, those are only

53:47going to be down when the business or

53:49establishment is closed. It's not going

53:50to be visible all of the time. And the

53:53door is just

53:56>> I mean, it's really kind of even hard to

53:58see what it was um

54:00before.

54:02Does anybody have any issues or comments

54:04about the work that was done?

54:11>> I mean,

54:11>> so the door was just painted. That

54:13That's the only change.

54:15>> No, replaced.

54:16>> Oh, the door was replaced. Okay. Yeah,

54:18you can you can like kind of see it.

54:21>> You can kind of see the outline of it.

54:23Um, and through the interpreter. Do you

54:26do you when was the door replaced? Do

54:29you have any idea?

54:42He said he asked, but they didn't give

54:44him like in a specific date, but it was

54:46done a while ago.

54:57>> So he he just wanted to make sure that

54:59you guys know that he was contracted

55:02like right after they did the changes,

55:04not before. So he's not aware like of

55:07any other work that was being done.

55:13>> So that's that's the reason he couldn't

55:14like bring any other pictures from

55:16before because it wasn't part of it.

55:18>> And the doors are not on site. The old

55:21doors are not there anymore.

55:31>> No longer there

55:34can't see.

55:46Which is the current door? The one on

55:48the right.

55:48>> The one on the right.

55:49>> Yeah, the glass door.

55:51>> The glass door.

55:51>> So that's Okay.

55:52>> My question about that too is

55:55>> did they make the opening bigger? Yeah,

55:57it looks like it's Is that just one

55:59giant door prior and then now did they

56:02bring it forward or

56:03>> I think it's just doors with one window

56:05on top.

56:06>> It used It was a double door. You can

56:08see I zoom in. It was a double door with

56:12the with the openings on top. You can

56:14still see the pie here.

56:17>> Yeah.

56:18>> Um so I don't I don't think they made

56:20the opening any bigger. They might have

56:22brought it a little bit forward though.

56:24>> I'm thinking Yeah. I mean, it's a shame

56:26because I love double doors, original

56:28double doors, but again,

56:30I mean, where where is it? We don't

56:32know. And that's awful.

56:34>> We also don't know what it looks like.

56:37>> Yeah, it's really hard to

56:38>> It would be ideal if we knew what it

56:40looked like because then we could have

56:42that recreated.

56:43>> Yeah, because I mean, does that look

56:46like it was the original wood door? I

56:48don't know.

56:48>> That's an awful big

56:50>> That's Yeah, to be an original Oh, okay.

56:54If you look on the Zillow, you can get a

56:57back view of the old doors.

56:59>> Oh, they used to look like I didn't look

57:01on.

57:02>> They I mean, they're sort of similar.

57:03>> So, they're recessed.

57:05>> They're [clears throat] recessed.

57:06>> They were definitely Yeah.

57:07>> And they they have like wood on the

57:09bottom and then a big square.

57:11>> Yeah. On each they were the nice

57:12original wood.

57:14>> It looks nothing like that.

57:15>> Nothing like that one. You can tell.

57:17>> So, I don't know if there was a door in

57:18front of it.

57:19>> Like a vestibule door type.

57:21>> Yeah. I think that's I think that's just

57:22the vestibule cuz I don't think that is

57:24not bad at all.

57:25>> So never mind. I take that back. Yeah.

57:27>> So we don't know.

57:28>> That would have been nice. But again,

57:30>> yeah,

57:32>> I mean I don't have a problem with the

57:34paint color or the new security grade

57:36system. Um and the door situation is

57:38unfortunate, but we understand that

57:41>> that was something that was already done

57:42before it became your responsibility. Um

57:46>> and we can't even really see what the

57:48door was prior anyway.

57:54Everybody, does everyone agree with

57:55that?

57:56>> All right. So, I'm gonna um open it up

57:58for public comment then.

58:03>> No public comment. All right. Can I have

58:05a motion to close public comment?

58:07>> Make a motion to close public comment.

58:10>> Second.

58:12>> And on the motion to close public

58:13comment, Commissioner Andre?

58:15>> Yes.

58:15>> Commissioner Brunette,

58:16>> yes.

58:17>> Commissioner Gutierz Lavote,

58:18>> yes. Yes. Commissioner Forester.

58:20>> Yes.

58:20>> Commissioner Santoso.

58:21>> Yes.

58:22>> And Chair Hollarski.

58:23>> Yes. And now, can I please have a motion

58:25for a certificate of appropriateness?

58:28>> I'll make a motion for certificate of

58:30appropriateness.

58:31The commission finds that the

58:33retroactive changes at 104 Pleasant

58:35Street consisting of painting the

58:38exterior, replacing the components of

58:39the security gate, and replacing the

58:41front door are appropriate for the Crown

58:44Hill Local Historic District.

58:48Second.

58:49>> And on that motion, Commissioner Andre,

58:52>> yes.

58:52>> Commissioner Gutierz,

58:54>> yes.

58:54>> Commissioner Bernett,

58:55>> yes.

58:56>> Commissioner Forester,

58:57>> yes.

58:57>> Commissioner Santos,

58:58>> yes.

59:00>> Yes. So, you're all set to approve.

59:05>> Thank you very much. God bless.

59:07>> Thank you.

59:07>> Thank you. Thank you.

59:08>> Thank you for your assistance, too.

59:12>> So, thank you.

59:13>> Yes, you're all set to go. Thank you.

59:16Now we are moving on to item six which

59:19is 77 Chattam Street.

59:25>> So through the chair Justin I see you.

59:28You can go ahead and unmute yourself.

59:31>> Hello everybody. How's it going?

59:34>> Good. How are you? Um do we just need

59:36you to introduce yourself please for the

59:38record?

59:39>> Yeah I'm Justin Bartania. I'm the senior

59:42director of housing for Aby's House.

59:46>> Thank you. And could you please just

59:48explain the project to the commission?

59:52>> Yeah, absolutely. So, we have um some

59:55pictures of the fence. It's very

59:56deteriorating over there. Um

1:00:00like almost leaning over at this point.

1:00:02Um, and as we were thinking through it

1:00:05before I realized that some things were

1:00:08not kind of pre-approved uh for

1:00:12um uh without getting it approved from

1:00:15historic committee. I was looking for

1:00:17just more sustainable materials other

1:00:18than wood. It just rots out over the

1:00:21years and it's more um of upkeep

1:00:24throughout the year. So, uh, just kind

1:00:27of got quotes for a vinyl fence and that

1:00:31that is why I'm here today.

1:00:36>> Um,

1:00:37there's also a question about the porch

1:00:39as well.

1:00:40>> Yeah. So, also with the porch um through

1:00:44our capital needs assess and both of

1:00:46these are through our capital needs

1:00:47assessment. the porch. Um, if you can,

1:00:50there are some, um, some of the posts

1:00:52are not even sitting on footings, so

1:00:54they're just on the brick. Um, and some

1:00:57of the posts uh, where the handrailings

1:01:00are are just floating above what is

1:01:04there for the footer. It's not even

1:01:06really um, attached

1:01:09at that point. Um, a lot of the deck

1:01:11hangers are rusted and again similar to

1:01:14the fence, just looking for more

1:01:16sustainable materials. Um, so we wanted

1:01:19to go with Trex decking. Um, uh, if you

1:01:21do notice the the deck obviously itself,

1:01:24the deck boards are not TX decking, but

1:01:27and again, this work was done before my

1:01:29time, but the stairs and the stair

1:01:31treads are are TX deck.

1:01:35and through the chair. This side porch

1:01:37is on a 20th a late 20th century

1:01:40edition.

1:01:43>> So, we're just talking about the side

1:01:44porch. We're not talking about the front

1:01:46porch.

1:01:47>> Correct. Just the side porch.

1:01:48>> Okay.

1:01:50>> Um,

1:01:53is it visible from the street?

1:01:56>> Um, yes.

1:01:57>> Um,

1:01:57>> it it is

1:01:58>> we rarely on the side of our property it

1:02:01is it's kind of a hill on the side. So

1:02:05when you're walking, it's more like

1:02:07where you where I took these pictures,

1:02:09I'm way far back on the other side of

1:02:12the street. So yes, um when you're kind

1:02:15of on my side of the street, ours,

1:02:18depending on how tall you are, yes and

1:02:20no. Um some of the other pictures, I'm

1:02:23obviously right up underneath it. Um

1:02:27>> do is there

1:02:28>> So just just depending where you are on

1:02:30the street. Yes.

1:02:32>> Yeah. So, um, what I was getting at when

1:02:35I was saying it's a new addition though

1:02:37is track stacking is appropriate for a

1:02:39new edition. The new edition wasn't

1:02:41appropriate anyway.

1:02:41>> Yeah. So, so it's not going to hurt it

1:02:43so much. Um, but yeah, it is available.

1:02:46It it is um visible from the public way.

1:02:48>> Um, and this is the material that is

1:02:51being proposed for the decking and then

1:02:54the fence.

1:02:55>> But what about the railing for the

1:02:57decking? Like

1:02:58>> this is not it's a different project

1:03:00that you're thinking. You're thinking of

1:03:01the

1:03:01>> No, no, no. Like if they're replacing

1:03:03the decking, you see how it has the

1:03:04white railing that goes with the

1:03:06decking? Are they are they keeping that

1:03:08and just replacing the boards with the

1:03:11TX?

1:03:12>> Yeah.

1:03:13>> So, it would all be TX decking like even

1:03:15the even the railings would be um like

1:03:18the same um kit that comes with the TX

1:03:22decking like what you would see there.

1:03:24>> Okay. So, what I was asking is would it

1:03:26be the brown and black or would it be

1:03:28the white that is already on the

1:03:31pictures now?

1:03:32>> Um, I would like the black, but if we

1:03:35want to keep what is there, I can also

1:03:37just I'm not opposed to keeping what is

1:03:39what is there.

1:03:40>> No, I mean I have no I have no issue. I

1:03:42think that it would look, you know,

1:03:44better with the brown and black with the

1:03:46the new decking.

1:03:47>> I do too.

1:03:48>> I don't have an issue with I was just

1:03:49unclear if that was um you were picking

1:03:52the same color.

1:03:53>> Yeah. So the the the TX decking comes

1:03:56with a a rail system which is what you

1:03:58saw in that brochure and that's what I

1:03:59would like to use is the brown and the

1:04:01black.

1:04:01>> Okay. Um I think that would be fine. I

1:04:05And in regard to the fence though um

1:04:10I I can see that the you know the

1:04:12current condition of the fence that is

1:04:13there is not great at all. Um, but to

1:04:17have big white vinyl panels um against

1:04:23>> that I don't it seems a little

1:04:28just not appropriate.

1:04:31>> Okay.

1:04:32>> How's everyone

1:04:34>> I wasn't clear on what they were saying

1:04:36the color of the vinyl would be.

1:04:39>> Oh, for the fence would be the white

1:04:40vinyl. Now, we're the porch is going to

1:04:43be the exact system that was showed in

1:04:45the previous slide. It comes with a kit.

1:04:47So, the the decking is going to be the

1:04:49brown and the railing is like the black

1:04:51spindles with the the brown railing to

1:04:53match.

1:04:54>> This is the proposed fence um to replace

1:04:58the

1:04:59>> the wood picket kind of.

1:05:02>> Correct. Correct. Correct. That is what

1:05:04we chose because it was the cheapest out

1:05:06of all vinyl options. However, if you do

1:05:10uh pull up the slide that has the

1:05:13brochure from the fencing,

1:05:15>> there are vinyl materials that

1:05:19um are wood grained and colored.

1:05:24>> So, through the chair, I didn't want to

1:05:26confuse the members of the commission,

1:05:27so I didn't include that in the slides,

1:05:29but they do have it in the materials.

1:05:31Yeah. So, they can look at them.

1:05:32>> Do you know what page? Because a lot of

1:05:34pages.

1:05:34>> Yeah. So, if you go all the way to the

1:05:36bottom, get once you get past all Yeah,

1:05:38it's better to see on bigger because on

1:05:40my phone earlier, I couldn't even really

1:05:42see it that well.

1:05:43>> You want to gather around?

1:05:46All right.

1:05:48>> And again, I my apologies. I did not

1:05:51pick a I did not pick a color from that

1:05:55brochure for the colored or wood grain

1:05:57textures. Um, but again, if the white is

1:06:01a no and you

1:06:03>> would be willing or not opposed to one

1:06:06of the colored wood grained options,

1:06:08>> then I would

1:06:10>> either come back

1:06:11>> Yeah.

1:06:12>> or

1:06:12>> I think the um

1:06:14>> smooth

1:06:15>> the colored option with the wood grain

1:06:17of the the weathered. I mean,

1:06:19>> if we're trying to tie it into the new

1:06:20decking color by I feel like um

1:06:24>> that would be way better than the white.

1:06:25The white is kind of just like a

1:06:27>> dark

1:06:28>> very just Yeah. in your face.

1:06:30>> It's a sore thumb.

1:06:31>> Yeah. And in contrast, especially to the

1:06:33colors of um you know the the building.

1:06:36So I mean

1:06:39I I like the wood grain look better. I

1:06:43think it would look much better than the

1:06:44smooth. Um

1:06:46>> I think that that's totally fine.

1:06:48>> The weathered Yeah, we're looking at the

1:06:50weathered blend color in that brochure.

1:06:52>> Premium. the um finishes or

1:06:56>> there's the smooth ones like I wouldn't

1:06:57I mean you're not going to see it.

1:06:59>> Yeah,

1:06:59>> the smooth probably is but

1:07:02>> which is the um

1:07:04>> Yeah,

1:07:05>> I think those either the select or

1:07:07premium

1:07:08>> select or premium. Yeah,

1:07:10>> there's also standard. It's hard to

1:07:12know.

1:07:13>> Just more of like a a wood the wood

1:07:16grain with the wood color.

1:07:18>> Yeah. What I can do is because this was

1:07:20a picture from the contractor to me

1:07:22because he wasn't um around that day.

1:07:24What I can do is just grab this actual

1:07:26brochure and bring it to city hall and

1:07:29then we can I can you can circle the

1:07:32actual color that

1:07:34>> would that be that you're approved or

1:07:36could it be or

1:07:37>> it really it can't be. So, what you

1:07:39would have to do is you would have to

1:07:41>> take um a vote on what you're talking

1:07:44about and then he can bring the brochure

1:07:46to city hall and I can circle it based

1:07:48on what you say.

1:07:49>> Okay.

1:07:50>> Okay.

1:07:50>> Do you have a sense of the price

1:07:52difference because we can just see the

1:07:54premium versus select versus

1:07:56>> Yeah, I I I do not. I did get a quote

1:07:58for wood, which was probably almost

1:08:02double the price of the vinyl, but um I

1:08:06can get a a

1:08:08>> we're just talking

1:08:09>> a new quote for the updated

1:08:12>> vinyl. Yeah, we're we're just talking

1:08:15about the the um different It's just

1:08:17like the different names of what they're

1:08:19called in the brochure. There's like

1:08:20three different types.

1:08:22>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. With the dollar signs

1:08:24next to them. Like the $2 sign, $3 sign.

1:08:27standard is fine.

1:08:28>> Yeah, even the standard look is fine

1:08:30because it has the wood grain on it. Um,

1:08:34>> so basically what we're looking to uh to

1:08:37have you do is to mimic the color as

1:08:39much as possible

1:08:42>> to the back.

1:08:43>> Match the with the TX match it as

1:08:46possible.

1:08:47>> So in your motion you could do something

1:08:49to that effect and we'll look at the

1:08:51finishes together before they get

1:08:53installed.

1:08:54>> That's basically Yeah. like a wood

1:08:58mint wood.

1:08:59>> A dark wood grain.

1:09:00>> Yeah, exactly. A dark gray.

1:09:03>> Okay. All right. So, with that being

1:09:06discussed, I'm going to open it up for

1:09:08public comment.

1:09:13All right. Can I have a motion to close

1:09:14public comment?

1:09:15>> I'll make a motion to close public

1:09:17comment.

1:09:18>> Second.

1:09:19>> And on the motion to close public

1:09:21comment, Commissioner Andre.

1:09:23>> Yes.

1:09:23>> Commissioner Bernett,

1:09:24>> yes. Yes. Commissioner Gutier.

1:09:26>> Yes.

1:09:26>> Commissioner Forester.

1:09:27>> Yes.

1:09:28>> Commissioner Santo.

1:09:29>> Yes.

1:09:30>> Yes. And now may I have a motion for a

1:09:34certificate of appropriateness?

1:09:36>> I shall make a motion for a certificate

1:09:38of appropriateness.

1:09:40The commission finds that the proposed

1:09:42changes at 77 Chattam Street consisting

1:09:46of replacing components of the side

1:09:49porch with with proposed TX materials

1:09:54and replacing a fence

1:09:58to match the color

1:10:01of the proposed TX materials

1:10:06>> which is in the color saddle.

1:10:08>> Pardon me. which is in the color saddle

1:10:10just for the record.

1:10:11>> Yeah. Our appropriate for the Crown Hill

1:10:14Local Historic District.

1:10:17>> Thank you very much.

1:10:19>> Second.

1:10:19>> Yeah.

1:10:20>> And on that and was there a question?

1:10:23>> No, it was a second by Vanessa already.

1:10:25>> Okay. And on that motion, Commissioner

1:10:27Andre,

1:10:28>> yes.

1:10:28>> Commissioner Bernett, yes.

1:10:30>> Commissioner Gutier Zodi,

1:10:31>> yes.

1:10:32>> Commissioner Forester,

1:10:33>> yes. Commissioner Santos Ribo, yes. And

1:10:35Cherki,

1:10:36>> yes. Okay.

1:10:39All right. Now you're all set.

1:10:40>> Well, he's Well, he's up again.

1:10:42>> I'm the next one as well.

1:10:43>> Okay. So, 19 Crown Street straight.

1:10:47>> Yeah. Um, so the repointing and the and

1:10:51the painting was on here separately. We

1:10:52just forgot to remove it. We got

1:10:54approved for that in the um

1:10:58>> uh non-applicability one. We're not

1:10:59changing it.

1:11:00>> Mhm.

1:11:01>> And we're not repainting it.

1:11:03>> Perfect. Yes, I remember that. Um, as

1:11:05far as the front porch, same deal. Um,

1:11:09just looking to upgrade the railings

1:11:11there. They're just black pipe. And as

1:11:14you see on the actual deck right now,

1:11:16there is no,

1:11:18um, railings.

1:11:21Uh, and we just wanted to use TX decking

1:11:23there as well.

1:11:26>> So, the difference with this is is that

1:11:29this is the front of the house.

1:11:31>> Yep. uh highly visible.

1:11:34Um

1:11:36I personally do not think that TX

1:11:41nor a handrail is appropriate

1:11:44um for this property, especially on the

1:11:47front facade.

1:11:51What are the feelings about this?

1:11:55>> I agree.

1:11:57>> I also agree. I feel like the railings

1:11:59are going to look, especially if it's

1:12:01trucks, they're not going to look right.

1:12:05>> Yeah, it's

1:12:06>> that's a whole other thing. This the

1:12:07railings.

1:12:09>> Yeah, that's um the the the tracks. I

1:12:12just don't think I mean it would be so

1:12:14visible you'd be able to tell.

1:12:20>> And it's just like the welcoming aspect

1:12:23of this home. It's it's too much to be

1:12:26>> to to be replaced. Um, I understand, you

1:12:29know, the durability of of it or

1:12:31whatnot, but I mean, what year is this

1:12:34house again?

1:12:35>> Yeah. And I mean, the decking is still

1:12:40still holding up pretty well. I mean, it

1:12:44probably does need repairs, probably

1:12:46does need repainting, but

1:12:48>> I can't really justify

1:12:50doing a entire replacement with tracks

1:12:54on this porch.

1:13:00So through the chair um to Justin, it

1:13:03doesn't sound like the commission is

1:13:05willing to allow for a handrail or the

1:13:08replacement of decking. So what needs to

1:13:11be done to bring this porch to a place

1:13:13where you can use it? Do you need to

1:13:15just replace like select ports in kind

1:13:19or is it something that you want to

1:13:20continue for a couple of weeks so you

1:13:22can think out your other options? So, I

1:13:25mean, cosmetically, um, I guess we could

1:13:28just paint it, um, and not worry about

1:13:30the railings at all. I could even just,

1:13:32and again, same color that was already

1:13:34on there. So, I would just get the color

1:13:36match from, if you see the front, um,

1:13:38trim board there, it's like that almost

1:13:40purplish color.

1:13:42>> Yeah.

1:13:42>> Mhm.

1:13:43>> Um, and then obviously it just repaint

1:13:45the black handrailings black.

1:13:48>> Um,

1:13:49>> I would consider that

1:13:50>> Yeah, I think

1:13:51>> it's so little. I would consider that

1:13:52general maintenance. Yeah.

1:13:54>> And then um the only other thing that

1:13:57was brought to my attention from the

1:13:58contractor is is the far right post here

1:14:02is a 6x6

1:14:05um footing and it's not really sitting

1:14:08fully on the footing anymore.

1:14:11So to still at least jack it up and

1:14:14possibly pour a new footing underneath

1:14:16it and then just put back whatever is

1:14:18there and then cosmetically we could

1:14:20touch it up.

1:14:22Can we see what's being talked about?

1:14:26>> I don't think Yeah, that corner post

1:14:28right there.

1:14:29>> Yeah.

1:14:29>> So, that's like a 6x6 post and

1:14:31underneath it. I didn't I didn't I don't

1:14:33have pictures of it on here, but um it's

1:14:37not fully sitting on the on the full

1:14:41footing. It's some of the post is off of

1:14:44the footing.

1:14:45>> Yikes.

1:14:47So, so does that that post can it just

1:14:49be repaired or do you need a whole new

1:14:51pore support there?

1:14:52>> No, I think what could happen is is that

1:14:54the the post is not rotted or anything.

1:14:56What I'm almost positive can happen, I

1:14:57can check with the contractors, is they

1:14:59can just jack up that root side so like

1:15:03the roof and everything is supported.

1:15:05>> Remove the whatever footing is there and

1:15:08reppour a new footing for that to sit on

1:15:12>> squarely

1:15:13>> under the deck. You mean pouring

1:15:15>> under the deck? Yeah. And then the

1:15:16lattice would go back up. You wouldn't

1:15:17even see it.

1:15:18>> Yeah, I think um I mean definitely

1:15:21saving money there. Um those old pipe

1:15:23railings, I love them. And if they can

1:15:25just be touched up,

1:15:27>> even better. Um and also I feel like if

1:15:30the TX decking was to go there, it would

1:15:31totally take away from that adorable

1:15:33fence to the right.

1:15:35>> Um such a stark contrast to it. So

1:15:38>> I not a problem.

1:15:40>> I am I am

1:15:42>> best.

1:15:43>> I'm all I'm willing to save the money.

1:15:45Yeah.

1:15:46>> Okay.

1:15:46>> Okay. So, my recommendation once you

1:15:49open up,

1:15:50>> I will um get paint samples over. Do I

1:15:53need to

1:15:53>> Yeah, there's still

1:15:54>> resubmit like a

1:15:56>> a different

1:15:57>> Is your mic on

1:15:59>> application? My my mic is Justin. Can

1:16:01you hear me?

1:16:04Can anybody hear me?

1:16:06Oh, no.

1:16:07>> I know. Did your mic go dead?

1:16:09>> No, it's on.

1:16:10>> Oh, so Michelle's trying to talk, but I

1:16:12don't think that you can hear her. So,

1:16:13basically, we just kind of have to up

1:16:15for a public comment first.

1:16:17>> Couple more remarks before we actually

1:16:19vote. Um, and we're going to see if this

1:16:22works.

1:16:22>> Can you hear me now?

1:16:23>> Yeah, I can hear you.

1:16:24>> Okay.

1:16:24>> Okay. So, what I was saying is, um,

1:16:28there's still like we're not going to

1:16:29withdraw your application because you

1:16:30still do do need to do some work. So, my

1:16:33recommendation once the commission opens

1:16:35up for public comment and stuff is going

1:16:37to be um that the commission um finds

1:16:43that the amended scope of work,

1:16:46including

1:16:48jacking up the front porch, pouring a

1:16:51new footing,

1:16:53and

1:16:55repainting and selective carpentry as

1:16:58needed. Just so you kind of cover

1:17:00everything.

1:17:01>> Write that fast. amended scope of work.

1:17:03>> The amended scope of work to include

1:17:05jacking up the porch.

1:17:07>> Pouring a new footing.

1:17:09>> Jacking up the porch.

1:17:12>> Yep.

1:17:12>> Pouring a new footing.

1:17:14>> Pouring a new footing.

1:17:17>> Selective carpentry as needed.

1:17:26And would it be the repainting to match

1:17:28the maroon?

1:17:29>> And repainting to match existing

1:17:31throughout on the front porch.

1:17:33>> Repainting to

1:17:34>> match existing on the front porch. Match

1:17:37existing

1:17:39>> on the front porch.

1:17:40>> On the front porch.

1:17:44>> Okay.

1:17:46Can I open it up for public comment now?

1:17:48Okay.

1:17:51>> Is that in the proposal? So I was

1:17:54reminded when I was at my conference a

1:17:56couple of weeks ago, this was on a

1:17:58previous application. He is not painting

1:18:00the foundation.

1:18:01>> Yeah. So that will not be part of your

1:18:03motion. So when I say proposal as

1:18:05amended, anything that's excluded,

1:18:08>> it's not it's not going in the in the

1:18:10decision. So

1:18:10>> perfect. Okay. Um so I'm going to open

1:18:13it up for public comment.

1:18:17>> None, I don't think so. Um can I have a

1:18:19motion to close public comment, please?

1:18:20>> I'll make a motion to close public

1:18:21comment.

1:18:22Second.

1:18:24>> And on the motion to close public

1:18:26comment, Commissioner Andre,

1:18:28>> yes.

1:18:28>> Commissioner Bernett,

1:18:29>> yes.

1:18:30>> Commissioner Gutier Zodi,

1:18:31>> yes.

1:18:31>> Commissioner Forester,

1:18:32>> yes.

1:18:33>> Commissioner Santos Rivo,

1:18:34>> yes.

1:18:34>> And Chair Harkski,

1:18:36>> yes.

1:18:37>> Okay.

1:18:38>> So, are we just doing a motion for

1:18:40certificate of appropriateness and not

1:18:41the demo anymore?

1:18:42>> Yeah, there's no demo anymore.

1:18:43>> So, can I please have a motion for a

1:18:45certificate of appropriateness?

1:18:46>> I'll make a motion for a certificate of

1:18:48appropriateness.

1:18:50The commission finds that the proposed

1:18:52changes at 19 Crown Street as amended

1:18:55consisting of the scope of work, sorry,

1:18:59to include jacking up the porch, pouring

1:19:02a new footing, selective carpentry as

1:19:05needed, and repainting the matching to

1:19:09match the existing paint.

1:19:12Is that everything?

1:19:13>> Yes.

1:19:15would are appropriate for the Crown Hill

1:19:18Local Historic District.

1:19:20>> Second.

1:19:21>> And on that motion, Commissioner Andre,

1:19:24>> yes.

1:19:24>> Commissioner Bernett,

1:19:25>> yes.

1:19:25>> Commissioner Gutierz Loy,

1:19:27>> yes.

1:19:27>> Commissioner Forester,

1:19:28>> yes.

1:19:28>> Commissioner Santos Robo,

1:19:30>> yes.

1:19:30>> And Cherki,

1:19:31>> yes.

1:19:33>> You're all set, Justin.

1:19:35>> Thank you very much.

1:19:36>> Thank you. So, now we are moving on to

1:19:39item eight, 244 Pleasant Street.

1:19:44So through the chair I think probably

1:19:47Matt, are you here for this item?

1:19:50You can go.

1:19:52>> Yes, I am.

1:19:53>> Okay. So go ahead and introduce yourself

1:19:55and describe the project.

1:19:58>> Hello. Um good evening guys. Uh thank

1:20:01you for taking the time uh to go over,

1:20:05you know, the application I made um

1:20:09regarding 244 Pleasant. Like I said, my

1:20:11name is Matt. Uh I am the property

1:20:14manager for 244 Pleasant. Um,

1:20:19and I know there was a there's a couple

1:20:22items

1:20:24that were brought to your attention

1:20:27um, regarding like the sign, the

1:20:30measurements, uh, believe it's the

1:20:33glass, the window proportion, the roll

1:20:36down gate,

1:20:38um, and the door handles on the,

1:20:43um, the right side of the commercial

1:20:45property. Um and so yeah, so basically

1:20:49um at least regarding the roll down

1:20:52gate, I've been in communication with

1:20:54the tenant. Um

1:20:58and I believe it's scheduled the pulled

1:21:00up permit to have the roll down gate

1:21:03removed believe next week.

1:21:06>> Okay. Um,

1:21:07>> and then regarding those other items, we

1:21:09were just looking to see, you know, um,

1:21:15if we could potentially keep it as is,

1:21:19but obviously want to work with you guys

1:21:21to

1:21:23what works.

1:21:27>> So, my biggest gripe with all of it is

1:21:30honestly the the great and storage

1:21:32system. Um, but you said that it was a

1:21:34little choppy. You said that that is

1:21:37scheduled to be removed next week.

1:21:39>> Yes, correct.

1:21:40>> Okay.

1:21:41>> Yes, I know. I know that was a big issue

1:21:42for you guys and so um

1:21:44>> Well, not just us, but the grant money

1:21:46that you received specifically states

1:21:49you cannot have that.

1:21:50>> Of course. Yeah. So, I do apologize

1:21:54about that even being installed on the

1:21:56first place.

1:21:57Um, so the next issues we need to really

1:22:00discuss are, um, I know the door

1:22:03hardware is different than what was

1:22:06approved. I personally don't think that

1:22:08that's a huge issue, um, because they're

1:22:11new doors anyway.

1:22:13>> Um, however, the window proportions

1:22:19and these decal signs on the window are

1:22:22kind of what we need to really focus on,

1:22:24I think. And if somebody does have an

1:22:26issue with the door handles, then you

1:22:27know, please

1:22:30speak up.

1:22:36I'm I have a little bit of an issue with

1:22:38the sign coming up higher.

1:22:42Um, is that attached to the building?

1:22:46>> Yeah, of course it is.

1:22:49When you take out the the grading thing,

1:22:53can you lower the sign to in line with

1:22:56the rest of the facade and away from the

1:23:00brick, the stonework?

1:23:03>> Yeah, I believe that is possible.

1:23:05>> Okay, that would be great.

1:23:06>> Just have to work with the contractor

1:23:09just to,

1:23:11>> you know, just confirm and check if that

1:23:13realistically is possible. I think they

1:23:15would, you know, the tennis would love

1:23:17to keep that sign. So maybe they're able

1:23:19to just lower it instead.

1:23:21>> Yeah, it looks like there should be room

1:23:23freed up once that storage system is

1:23:26removed for you to just place it down.

1:23:27So it's all kind of in line with what's

1:23:29already there. Um

1:23:33and I see that the the open sign is also

1:23:36an issue. Um right, is that what I'm

1:23:40seeing pointed at?

1:23:40>> Well, I mean it's unapproved. I wouldn't

1:23:42necessar necessarily say it's an issue.

1:23:44And I mean again, especially with the

1:23:47storage grate being removed, obviously

1:23:49if the storage grates down, the place is

1:23:50closed. You know what I mean? But now

1:23:52that we're taking that away, maybe you

1:23:54keeping the open sign wouldn't be an

1:23:56issue because now it's really going to

1:23:58So we don't have an issue with that.

1:23:59It's really just the you know,

1:24:02>> sign being moved down once the grading

1:24:04system um the the storage system is

1:24:07removed. Um does anybody have an issue

1:24:09with the door hardware?

1:24:11What was proposed again for the door

1:24:13hardware? Uh,

1:24:14>> it was up and it was it was vert was

1:24:17vertical handles that was proposed

1:24:19before.

1:24:19>> So, I don't have an issue with the door

1:24:21hardware.

1:24:22>> Um,

1:24:25and yeah,

1:24:27>> and I mean the proportions of the

1:24:28windows are different.

1:24:31>> Not by that much.

1:24:32>> Yeah, exactly. I mean, the big the big

1:24:36visible things of course are like the

1:24:39vinyl decals and the sign and the great

1:24:41>> Exactly. The only thing that really

1:24:43throws it off to me with the door is

1:24:45that it's it's not really as recessed

1:24:49as the other one or is it?

1:24:51>> It was never proposed to be. So, it it

1:24:54was what was approved was flush

1:24:56>> for it to be flush. Okay. So there's

1:24:58there's a solid there's solid panels up

1:25:00above the window and the door

1:25:03>> there.

1:25:03>> But it's behind the grate now.

1:25:06>> So yeah.

1:25:07>> Yeah, I believe it's Yeah, it's fairly

1:25:08similar to the the size to the the left

1:25:13side, I believe. So I think

1:25:15>> it's a narrow it's a narrow transom. And

1:25:17then there's

1:25:18>> Yeah. Yeah. Fairly similar to that

1:25:20style, I would say.

1:25:24>> Um

1:25:27I mean, I'm I'm happy to know that the

1:25:31the the great and the security, you

1:25:32know, storage system is going to get

1:25:34moved. My biggest thing is the sign

1:25:36being moved down. Um,

1:25:40everything else is okay to me. I mean,

1:25:43the vinyl

1:25:45applications on the windows,

1:25:48um, I understand that that's like a a

1:25:50business,

1:25:52you you know, move. How does the

1:25:54commission feel about the vinyl decals

1:25:55on the window?

1:25:59>> Are they They seem to be rather busy and

1:26:02they they block a lot of the activity

1:26:06that's going on inside

1:26:08that establishment.

1:26:11>> Is that the purpose?

1:26:12>> Is that is that the purpose? I don't

1:26:14even know what this establishment does.

1:26:19>> You can uh Yes. So, believe they kind of

1:26:23I just want to confirm exactly how

1:26:28>> we can't we can't hear you very well. If

1:26:30you could try speaking into um your your

1:26:32microphone a little bit better.

1:26:38>> Yeah, let me give me one second. Let me

1:26:40just try to do that for you.

1:26:42>> Can I ask if the great the security

1:26:45grade is coming down is anything else

1:26:47being used in itstead? No.

1:26:51>> Just

1:26:52>> which is great.

1:26:52>> No.

1:26:53>> Um, so what we're trying to understand

1:26:55is the the final applications that are

1:26:58on the Windows is the the purpose of

1:27:00those to create privacy from what's

1:27:03going on or is that just the the design

1:27:06of the business?

1:27:09>> Yeah. Can you hear me uh hear me a

1:27:11little bit better?

1:27:12>> Yes.

1:27:12>> Okay, perfect. Yeah. Sorry about that.

1:27:14So basically kind of like they they work

1:27:17with like holi they say like holistic

1:27:20wellness

1:27:22um

1:27:22>> okay

1:27:22>> medicinals I would say and so I think

1:27:26they kind of

1:27:28>> you know put that on their storefront as

1:27:30a way to you know show it's more of like

1:27:32a holistic and more natural

1:27:36uh supplement I would say

1:27:39at least that's the way they would they

1:27:41were communicating that to

1:27:44Okay.

1:27:46>> Is that something over which we have any

1:27:48jurisdiction? Decals on a window. Okay.

1:27:51Okay. All right.

1:27:55So, I myself, since I don't live too far

1:27:58from this building, I I'm not a fan of

1:28:02the the decals.

1:28:05>> I think they are they I think they're

1:28:08rather inappropriate for a building that

1:28:10old.

1:28:11>> Yeah. Um,

1:28:12>> and we have visuals right here of what

1:28:14the windows looked like without the

1:28:16decals. And honestly, I think it looks

1:28:19>> way better. You can see inside, see what

1:28:22you offer, especially when that sign

1:28:24gets moved down. Um, I think it'll make

1:28:28it actually stand out more on its own

1:28:30and that the decals wouldn't even really

1:28:32be necessary. Um, it it just does seem

1:28:36very

1:28:38>> busy.

1:28:40It shouts.

1:28:41>> Yeah.

1:28:42>> And it's and it's being it being in an

1:28:45historic

1:28:46uh neighborhood district rather. Um I

1:28:51find it most inappropriate.

1:28:53>> I'm certain there are other ways that

1:28:55they can uh communicate the nature of

1:28:58their business without sticking these

1:29:01massive decals on the windows. I mean,

1:29:04not only being historic, but you know,

1:29:06when you apply for grant funds, there's

1:29:09certain, you know, things that have to

1:29:12be met and adhered to. And

1:29:15>> I think even just not having them on the

1:29:18doors, I think, would be helpful because

1:29:19I think just having it across the whole

1:29:22the whole

1:29:23>> side is just a lot.

1:29:26>> I I really think they should all go for

1:29:29both door, both windows and both doors.

1:29:32>> I mean, you know, perview over this, but

1:29:34it'd be lovely to see the details gone

1:29:36in like

1:29:37trees and on the inside.

1:29:41>> Here's a suggestion. Tell me, Michelle,

1:29:43if this would be allowed. I don't know

1:29:44if the color scheme of the blue and

1:29:46green is something that is their

1:29:47business. What if when they lowered the

1:29:50sign divine down? Would they be able to

1:29:52paint the words divine, the green and

1:29:54the blue, as opposed to having the green

1:29:57and blue decals on the windows? I mean,

1:29:59I don't know if it's a color scheme of

1:30:01their business, but I don't know if

1:30:03that's like a a comp. I don't know if

1:30:05that would be

1:30:06>> I I have a hard time directing too much

1:30:08on this. Uh, but I do uh I would

1:30:11consider something much smaller if they

1:30:14have a brand that they're trying to

1:30:15translate, which looks like they have

1:30:17other stores or something, um, to

1:30:19minimize that so that you actually see

1:30:21the windows. Um, uh, I can't tell if

1:30:25that's inside, outside. [laughter]

1:30:26So, uh, I would

1:30:30like to suggest coming back with

1:30:32something a little bit more in line. I I

1:30:34don't want to tell you what your brand

1:30:35should be, but that's kind of over the

1:30:38top.

1:30:40>> So, through the chair, it sounds like

1:30:42what I'm understanding is the commission

1:30:44is not going to approve the vinyl decals

1:30:48remaining. Sounds like those got to go.

1:30:50Um, but it sounds like they're okay with

1:30:52you keeping the divine sign on top as

1:30:55long as it's moved down. Um,

1:30:58>> yeah, more proportionate.

1:30:59>> Yep. So, move down to to be where the

1:31:02security um great storage system is now.

1:31:05>> Um, it sounds like they're okay with you

1:31:07keeping all the door hardware as it is.

1:31:09It's you don't have to replace any of

1:31:11the windows or anything. They're okay

1:31:12with those proportions. So at Do you

1:31:17have anybody from the business here or

1:31:19is it just you?

1:31:21>> Hey, it's just currently me right now.

1:31:24>> Okay. So So why don't ju just it's their

1:31:27business so they need to they're not

1:31:29allowed to keep what they have but they

1:31:31I'm assuming want to come up with

1:31:33something different.

1:31:34>> So yeah, what we could do is

1:31:38>> you you need to remove the security

1:31:40great no matter what. And that's that's

1:31:43that's scheduled.

1:31:44>> But why don't we

1:31:47Is two weeks enough time for you to talk

1:31:49to the business owner and see if they're

1:31:51willing to come up with a different

1:31:52design or if they're just going to be

1:31:53okay with having no signage?

1:31:56>> Yeah. Referring to the like the vinyl on

1:31:59the windows, right?

1:32:00>> Yes. That signage.

1:32:01>> Yeah. Yeah. I I I can definitely talk to

1:32:03them. I think them, you know, like you

1:32:06guys already kind of working with us and

1:32:08allowing, you know, the sign and whatnot

1:32:09and just, you know, being patient with

1:32:12that. I I think that will that could be

1:32:14a good solution. And then, you know, for

1:32:17him to propose like a a new, you know,

1:32:20new potential, you know, vinyl in the

1:32:22front,

1:32:23>> smaller, less bright, less um kind of

1:32:27out there graphics on the windows.

1:32:29>> Yeah. what just so um I can just provide

1:32:33a better scope for the the owner. Is

1:32:36there like maybe like a an outline of

1:32:38like how it should generally be just so

1:32:41you know um

1:32:42>> I mean you could look at our design

1:32:44review guidelines. our design review

1:32:45guidelines are really developed more for

1:32:48um residential architecture. But I can I

1:32:51can tell you that something that would

1:32:53be more palatable to the historical

1:32:54commission would be a smaller

1:32:58>> um a smaller sign where you still see

1:33:01like the proportionality of the windows

1:33:02and everything like they were saying

1:33:04like this looks like it could be inside,

1:33:06it could be outside. It's bright and it

1:33:07totally takes away from the fact that

1:33:09that's even a storefront. Um, yeah.

1:33:11>> So, I would say something smaller that

1:33:14gets the point across without um taking

1:33:17up the entire storefront.

1:33:19>> Yeah. Yeah, that makes sense.

1:33:20>> And I just want to clarify with the

1:33:22divine sign that it be moved off of the

1:33:26stone

1:33:27>> completely. Not just down, but

1:33:30completely off of the stone on the black

1:33:33panel completely that's there,

1:33:36>> which I think I think there will be

1:33:37enough room. If not, we're going to have

1:33:39to figure something out.

1:33:40>> Okay.

1:33:41>> Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I don't know if maybe

1:33:43um they I don't know if it's like a a

1:33:46wooden or some way where we can maybe

1:33:50trim it out to make it look more even

1:33:52and presentable. I bet there's something

1:33:54we can I can, you know, be in

1:33:57communication with the owner to, you

1:33:59know, have that sign, you know, more pro

1:34:02proportionate and obviously

1:34:05down.

1:34:06So,

1:34:07>> so

1:34:08>> I got another one more one more question

1:34:10that

1:34:12say the the owner

1:34:14is okay with the removal of the de the

1:34:17decals and

1:34:20>> the the the windows just remain clear.

1:34:25>> Why would you need an open sign when

1:34:28people can see whether

1:34:30>> people are there,

1:34:31>> this store is open?

1:34:33That's getting a little too

1:34:34>> Well, but what I'm saying is okay, we've

1:34:37got an old building.

1:34:38>> We got a neon open sign.

1:34:41>> Well, when you're It's not It's not

1:34:43permanent.

1:34:44>> It's just a plugin. It's like a

1:34:45removable. And when you're driving down

1:34:47the street and you're dealing with

1:34:48traffic and everything, you don't have

1:34:49time to really kind of look in and get a

1:34:51scope

1:34:52>> of how many people are there and if

1:34:54they're working like it's I had a

1:34:56business

1:34:57>> and I mean I I wish I could see what the

1:34:58inside of the business looked like

1:35:00because even vinyl decals on the windows

1:35:02might not even be necessary. If it's a

1:35:03holistic place and it's bright and

1:35:05beautiful inside, let that be shown on

1:35:07the street, you know?

1:35:09>> Yeah.

1:35:10>> Okay. So, here's what I think. We need

1:35:12to figure out if it's plausible to move

1:35:15that sign down.

1:35:17>> Um, number one. Number two is we need

1:35:19the business owner to come up with an

1:35:21additional signage plan for their

1:35:23windows.

1:35:24>> Yep.

1:35:24>> Um, so you said that the security grade

1:35:28is scheduled to be removed next week?

1:35:31>> Yes. So, is August 20th good for you to

1:35:34come back with a plan for how and where

1:35:36you're going to put that sign, if you

1:35:37need to trim it down, and then what

1:35:39you're going to do with the signage for

1:35:41the windows?

1:35:43>> Um, give me one second. You need

1:35:46>> That's two weeks from today. Otherwise,

1:35:48we have September 3rd.

1:35:54>> Uh, is there is it possible we could do

1:35:57the week after? Sorry, it's my that's my

1:36:00wife my anniversary. Um

1:36:03>> so we could do September 17th

1:36:05>> September.

1:36:08>> Yeah, I think that works. Yeah, that

1:36:11that's great.

1:36:12>> So we're not going to do any vote on the

1:36:14security system. It's going to be just

1:36:16it was there without being permitted.

1:36:19It's going to be removed

1:36:20>> and but we need to continue discussion.

1:36:24>> Okay.

1:36:25regarding the vinyl.

1:36:26>> Okay.

1:36:27>> Yeah. For for everything else, we need

1:36:28to

1:36:29>> in the sign.

1:36:29>> Yeah.

1:36:30>> Yeah. So, we're going to keep So, we're

1:36:32gonna I'm sorry. What What are we

1:36:34>> Sorry, I was It was just about the

1:36:35dates.

1:36:36>> Okay. So, then if you're good with

1:36:39September 17th, um I'm going to go and

1:36:42do an inspection next Friday to make

1:36:43sure that that security gray is gone. Um

1:36:47>> it will be gone by next Friday, right?

1:36:49>> Yeah, that's that's the that's what when

1:36:52they scheduled to have it completed.

1:36:54Okay. And then on September 17th, you're

1:36:57going to come back with a plan to remove

1:37:00the vinyl decals on the window, a new

1:37:03signage plan if he wants one, and a plan

1:37:07for moving that sign down so it's not on

1:37:09the stone anymore.

1:37:11>> Okay.

1:37:12>> Is that what is there anything else that

1:37:14you guys can think of?

1:37:16>> No, that that I appreciate you guys um

1:37:20being flexible with us. And so so when

1:37:22we are moving that sign, so is that

1:37:24something that I would confirm and check

1:37:26with you guys before uh the meeting at

1:37:29September and then you know move it down

1:37:31or I just want to make sure you know

1:37:34>> the processes to

1:37:35>> he has to come back anyway. So So yeah,

1:37:38move it down. Move it down. Um

1:37:40>> we're not going to I mean it's a sign

1:37:41that was never supposed to be there in

1:37:43the first place. So So move it down and

1:37:45then when you come back on we're going

1:37:47to keep the hearing open. When you come

1:37:48back on September 17th, we'll vote on

1:37:50your new signage plan and wherever that

1:37:52sign lands.

1:37:53>> Okay,

1:37:54>> perfect.

1:37:55>> So, should I even open it for public

1:37:56comment, just not close it?

1:37:58>> I mean, you can if you want, but it's

1:37:59we're we're continuing it anyway.

1:38:01>> Okay. So, we'll just continue it then.

1:38:03>> So, um it will be for a meeting on

1:38:06September 17th with a new constructive

1:38:08grant deadline of October 2nd

1:38:09>> with a con new constructive construct

1:38:12constructive

1:38:13>> grant deadline of October.

1:38:16>> Second.

1:38:17Okay. So then can I have a motion to

1:38:20continue 244 Pleasant Street?

1:38:22>> I will make a motion to

1:38:25continue

1:38:27244

1:38:29Pleasant mo to continue 244 Pleasant

1:38:32Street.

1:38:35>> Sorry. I'm not writing as fast as I as I

1:38:38should. All right. Um, we'll make a

1:38:41motion to continue to the September 17,

1:38:432026 meeting with a constructive

1:38:44deadline of October 2nd.

1:38:49>> Second.

1:38:50>> And on that motion, Commissioner Andre,

1:38:52>> yes.

1:38:53>> Commissioner Bernett,

1:38:54>> yes.

1:38:54>> Commissioner Gutierrez Lavod,

1:38:56>> yes.

1:38:56>> Commissioner Forester,

1:38:57>> yes.

1:38:57>> Commissioner Santos Divo,

1:38:59>> yes.

1:38:59>> Commissioner Harkski,

1:39:00>> yes.

1:39:02>> All right, we'll see you on September

1:39:0317th.

1:39:04>> Great. Thank you so much. So, now we

1:39:06need to jump back to item two, nine

1:39:08Crown Street.

1:39:09>> Yeah, just go ahead and

1:39:10>> we're going to just um go ahead and I'm

1:39:12going to ask for a motion for a

1:39:14certificate of nonapplicability.

1:39:16I will make a motion for a certificate

1:39:18of nonapplicability.

1:39:20The commission finds that the proposed

1:39:21changes at 9 Crown Street consisting of

1:39:24replacing the roof in kind

1:39:27are not under the jurisdiction of the

1:39:29commission and therefore approves a

1:39:31certificate of nonapplicability.

1:39:35Second.

1:39:36>> And on that motion, Commissioner Andre,

1:39:38>> yes.

1:39:39>> Commissioner Bernett,

1:39:40>> yes.

1:39:40>> Commissioner Gutierrez Leavote,

1:39:41>> yes.

1:39:42>> Commissioner Forester,

1:39:43>> yes.

1:39:43>> Commissioner Santos Pro,

1:39:45>> yes.

1:39:45>> Carol Narski,

1:39:46>> yes.

1:39:47>> Okay. On to other business. Um, no

1:39:50policies and procedures.

1:39:51>> So, we do have a policy and procedure

1:39:53and that it is more of just um a memo,

1:39:57an FYI. So, we were supposed to be

1:39:59having a um status hearing on 6 Ashland

1:40:03because they had a violation notice and

1:40:06then they ignored us, but we're not

1:40:09having that because they submitted their

1:40:11application. They will be on for August

1:40:1220th.

1:40:14>> Okay. So, item B is an invitation from

1:40:17City of Worcester Housing Division to

1:40:19comment on proposed projects at 37

1:40:21Hapgood Road, one Stevens Road, and 88

1:40:24Stanton Street. Uh we will have no

1:40:25comment on that. Item C and is another

1:40:29invitation from the city of Worcester

1:40:30business development division to comment

1:40:32on proposed project at two Blossom

1:40:34Street. Um, also there's going to be no

1:40:36comment on that. Um, item D, we have a

1:40:40request from Epsilon Associates for

1:40:41updated letters of support for the MHRTC

1:40:45allocations for 134 Gold Street, 240

1:40:48Main Street, 316 Main Street, 340 Main

1:40:50Street, 401 Main Street, and 300 South

1:40:53Bridge Street. Um, I'm going to ask for

1:40:56a motion to send an updated letter of

1:40:59support for that.

1:41:00>> I'll make a motion to send an updated

1:41:03letter of support

1:41:06uh for

1:41:08134 Gold Street, 240 Main Street, 316

1:41:11Main Street, 340 Main Street, 401 Main

1:41:13Street, 300 Southbridge Street.

1:41:19>> Second.

1:41:19>> And on that motion, Commissioner Andre?

1:41:22>> Yes.

1:41:22>> Mr. Bernett?

1:41:23>> Yes. Commissioner Gutier Zodi,

1:41:25>> yes.

1:41:25>> Commissioner Forester,

1:41:26>> yes.

1:41:27>> Commissioner Santos Rivbo and Chair

1:41:29Harkski,

1:41:30>> yes. And item E is a request from the

1:41:33Beantown Companies and Corporation for

1:41:36updated letter of support for the MHRTC

1:41:38allocation for 70 Winter Street. I'm

1:41:41also going to ask for a motion to send

1:41:42an updated letter of support for that.

1:41:45>> I make a motion to send an updated

1:41:47letter of support for 70 Winter Street.

1:41:52Second.

1:41:53>> And on that motion, Commissioner Andre,

1:41:56>> yes.

1:41:57>> Commissioner Bernett,

1:41:58>> yes.

1:41:58>> Commissioner Gutierrez Lavod,

1:42:00>> yes.

1:42:00>> Commissioner Borster,

1:42:01>> yes.

1:42:01>> Commissioner Santos Rebo,

1:42:03>> yes.

1:42:03>> And Cher Harkski,

1:42:04>> yes.

1:42:06>> And we have no approval of minutes this

1:42:08evening. So, I'm going to make a motion

1:42:11to adjurnn. Say I. Those

1:42:12>> in favor? I. I. I. I.