2026-09-16 - Housing Authority

00:10Good afternoon. It is 4:02

00:13and we're starting the truth housing

00:16authority regular board meeting for

00:18September 16th, 2026.

00:21Good afternoon and I want to first thank

00:23um the towers here for um hosting us. Um

00:28and

00:30someone want to make a motion on the

00:31minutes for the August meeting.

00:32>> Chair, I would like to make a motion

00:34that we approve the minutes for August

00:364th.

00:37>> You're good.

00:38>> We approve the minutes for the August

00:394th meeting as printed.

00:41>> We have a motion. Do we have a second?

00:42>> Second.

00:43>> And we uh any questions, comments,

00:46discussion?

00:46>> There being none, all in favor?

00:48>> I

00:48>> I unanimous. Thank you very much.

00:51>> All right. Treasures report.

00:55>> I trust all is in order.

00:57>> It is all in order.

00:58>> Very helpful.

00:59>> Yeah.

00:59>> Everything looks good. Um

01:03>> any questions?

01:04>> First time we've crossed that threshold.

01:05>> The five.

01:06>> Yeah.

01:06>> Yes.

01:07>> Am I I'd like to call that out to the

01:09board.

01:10>> Yeah.

01:11>> The the number on the bottom. It's the

01:12first time we've ever crossed that

01:13threshold, at least in my memory.

01:15>> Okay.

01:17>> All right. Um any questions, comments,

01:20discussion other than that?

01:22>> Okay, moving on. Uh we're going to do

01:24the revolving account. Do we have any

01:26questions, comments, discussions on the

01:27revolving account?

01:33>> If not, do we have a motion?

01:35>> I make a motion that we approve the

01:37check register 57 checks in the amount

01:40of 125

01:4276916.

01:45>> Second. Any questions, comments,

01:48discussion? There being none, all in

01:50favor?

01:50>> I.

01:51>> Unanimous. Thank you,

01:53>> Mr. Chair. If you don't mind, I'll keep

01:55going. I'd like to approve the four

01:57section 8 voucher checks in the amount

01:59of 5960

02:0120 cents.

02:03>> We have a second.

02:04>> Second.

02:04>> Second.

02:05>> All in favor?

02:06>> I.

02:07>> Unanimous. Thank you.

02:09>> You're on behalf of there. Oh, so Kelly,

02:11I don't see the other.

02:13>> Um, it's the landlord check register.

02:16Landlord tenant check register in the

02:17amount of 125,769.

02:20>> Is it out of order?

02:23>> I don't have I don't even have it.

02:26>> Yeah, I don't have it unless

02:28>> um I make a motion that we approve the

02:31landlord check register in the amount of

02:33$210,63

02:36>> 200. Wait, right.

02:38>> Yeah.

02:38>> Yeah. Yeah. 2 210,538.

02:41>> Second.

02:44>> What's going on here? Scroll down.

02:45>> Oh, I have the wrong

02:48thing.

02:48>> Okay.

02:49>> I think it was a motion and a second.

02:52>> Questions, comments? All in favor?

02:54>> I

02:56nays.

02:57>> Unanimous. Thank you.

02:58>> No, Mr. Chair, I'd like to approve the

03:00August uh I'm sorry. Yes, the August

03:03payroll as corrected.

03:04>> Okay, we have a motion.

03:06>> Second. All in favor?

03:08>> I I unanimous. Thank you very much.

03:11>> We have the vacancy reports to discuss.

03:13Kelly,

03:15>> we have one at Francis, two at

03:19Elizabeth. We're getting one more

03:24at Francis. We just had someone pass

03:26away there this week. Um,

03:30I did

03:32uh

03:34the guys are in the apartment right now

03:36making ready.

03:37>> Which one? The Francis one. Apartment

03:39one.

03:40>> Apartment one.

03:41>> Okay.

03:41>> And they're in 1828.

03:43>> So they're in all three.

03:44>> They're in all three. They're like

03:46stretched out thing. Um, in apartment

03:50one, it's going to be a local resident.

03:54>> Yay.

03:54>> Um, we're still working on CHAMP.

03:58Waiting on courties right now on 188.

04:03>> Waiting on quaries.

04:04>> Yes.

04:04>> Okay. Any are they local as well? No.

04:08>> One is

04:11council.

04:11>> Yes, please.

04:12>> Um I received a call because someone had

04:14the champ packet. Um so I just wanted to

04:16see is the procedure the same as it used

04:18to be. You when we have one vacancy you

04:20pull 25 and mail it to everybody. Does

04:22that still happen that We just pulled 70

04:27>> because 70 all at once. You did 25 and

04:29had to do 25.

04:30>> No, we pulled just 70 people because

04:32we're getting no responses with the

04:35supplemental application. Once we pulled

04:37them, we have to send them the

04:39supplemental application and they have

04:41to fill all that out. A lot of people

04:43are not responding supplemental.

04:45>> So instead of the 25, you're pulling

04:47pulling 70.

04:48>> And we sending that still that huge

04:50package. So we're spending on portion on

04:51postage.

04:52>> Yes.

04:52>> Okay. Part two of that question is she

04:55this person um also received an

04:57application from another town and they

05:00wanted to know if they could only reply

05:02to one or they had to reply to two. I

05:03told him two. I said do both but I

05:04wanted to make sure I was right.

05:05>> Yes. Cuz each supplemental application

05:07will say it's from Shbury Housing

05:09Authority or another. Okay.

05:11>> Surrounding town housing authority.

05:13>> All right. Good. I wanted to I said you

05:14worst case do both just in case. But um

05:17Okay. Good.

05:20>> Okay.

05:22Next

05:24>> is

05:29>> family units are always up.

05:31>> Yes,

05:34there's two vacancies here and we just

05:37got another one this week. We just had

05:40another person pass away here. Um,

05:44and those are both in process, meaning

05:46maintenance are in them and they're both

05:48walks. Excellent. Good.

05:52Okay. So, a lot of turnovers. Lot of

05:54>> lots of turnovers.

05:56>> Lot of work. Is Gary here?

05:57>> No.

05:58>> I just saw Gary.

05:59>> He's He's working.

05:59>> He's working.

06:01>> Yeah. He's in apartment one right now.

06:04>> Okay.

06:05Section eight.

06:07>> 100%. Thanks.

06:08>> Very good.

06:11Okay. So, uh, as you can see folks from

06:13the social services report,

06:19Patty saw 24 residents.

06:23>> She's been busy.

06:24>> She has.

06:31Any questions?

06:35Okay,

06:38moving on.

06:41Um CPC and affordable housing trust

06:45updates.

06:47CPC I I attended my second meeting uh

06:51the other night. Um still getting my

06:54feet wet to say the least. Um

06:58uh I I struggle a little bit with the

07:01definitional part of their decision-

07:03making as you probably did when you

07:05started as well.

07:07>> Um and Um, I'm going to work a little

07:12bit harder with them relative to the uh

07:17annual plan that they're putting

07:18together now because they do an annual

07:20report plan and uh our housing section

07:24is a little bit outdated. So, I'll I'll

07:25be working with Kelly to come up with uh

07:28the numbers that are right now based on

07:322021 numbers. So,

07:34>> Wow. That's because I did it in 2022.

07:36>> Yeah. Yeah. So, it hasn't been updated.

07:39So um it's time uh especially um noting

07:44that uh they also

07:47stated that the threshold for affordable

07:50housing insurg was 5% instead of the 10

07:53for new housing and for our for our for

07:56our requests to try to get up to the

07:59affordable threshold um in order to deal

08:02with the 40b issues. um it's 10% not 5%

08:07and and that needs to be corrected. Um

08:10so there were a number of things and and

08:11I wasn't happy with the with the way

08:14that uh they had titled the housing

08:17section of that plan because they kind

08:19of just rolled into us without giving us

08:21a delineation and you know housing is is

08:24one of the main categories. though and I

08:28don't I think it was I think it was in

08:30this draft frankly and so I pointed it

08:33out because then she said well that's

08:35not been the case in the past so I don't

08:36know what happened so

08:38>> yeah because I don't think it didn't say

08:395% in the past either at the same time

08:41>> yeah so this there's been a mixup yeah

08:45so and I think the uh number of housing

08:49units in town number of affordable

08:50housing in units in town they need to be

08:53stated so that people have a clear view

08:55of what uh that committee and and that

08:58section of the committee is all about so

09:01that we can advocate for that because um

09:04with that in mind um and I'll save the

09:07rest of this discussion for the

09:08Elizabeth Street update. Um with that in

09:11mind, I think um that falls into um

09:17we have a role in both that as well as

09:20um developing affordable housing in in

09:22town. Um, and I think we need to address

09:25both simultaneously and CPC can help us

09:28with that. As far as the affordable

09:30housing trust, do you have anything?

09:32>> I do not. No.

09:33>> Okay. All right. So, that's my brief uh

09:37introductory comments about the the

09:39community preservation committee. Um,

09:43stay tuned. I will be able to make them

09:46next meeting. So, we're all there. Okay.

09:48>> Happy to serve as your backup.

09:49>> Yeah. And I haven't approached the

09:50subject of having backup, but I but I

09:52don't see any reason why we can't do

09:54that. So, I'm going to

09:55>> I mean, I don't think we're I think the

09:57mandate is that we have a

09:59representative. That's the charter. I

10:02don't think they I mean, I don't mean to

10:03sound cavalier, but I don't think they

10:05can tell us what that charter

10:07representative member has to be. I could

10:09be wrong, but

10:10>> Yeah.

10:11>> But we'll see.

10:12>> You have to be sworn in.

10:13>> Yeah, that's the key. You have to be

10:14sworn in. So, I could be wrong. I'll

10:16repeat the last part again. Well, we

10:19we'll look at that.

10:20>> We'll look at that.

10:21>> So, with that, um, anything else you

10:24want to add to that CPC discussion?

10:26>> Is there something in the draft where

10:28you can send it to me where I can

10:30update?

10:31>> Yes.

10:31>> Oh,

10:32>> yeah. I'll have Emma send. She was

10:34supposed to have sent it out yesterday.

10:35I didn't get it. Um, but I'll follow it

10:38up. Okay.

10:39>> Thank you.

10:39>> All right.

10:41>> It's Emma at the town hall.

10:43>> Emma.

10:45>> Um, all right. Elizabeth Street.

10:48Um,

10:51apparently council was still working on

10:54the contract with the consultant that we

10:56haven't met yet, right?

10:58>> Yes.

11:00And

11:07>> so, uh, they're still working on the

11:09contracting process with BSC Group,

11:12which is the consultant that apparently

11:14the, uh, Mass Housing Trust has chosen.

11:18Um and Emma there said that she will be

11:22in touch as soon as uh the contract is

11:24in place and work is ready to begin.

11:28Again, it's going to come down to what

11:30work we're talking about and what and

11:32what avenue we're going on this thing.

11:35>> Right. And my question, if I may, is if

11:38the contract isn't completed,

11:41how do we isn't it a chicken and an egg

11:43with the contract and the scope of work?

11:44Unless maybe the scope of work is an

11:47addendum or an appendix to the contract

11:49or something. But what are we

11:50contracting for that's incomplete if we

11:52don't know what we're doing?

11:53>> Well, that's the problem.

11:54>> My understanding of this is they're

11:57working on their contract with the

11:59consultant, which is the BSC group. Once

12:01they finalized their contract, then

12:04they're going to come to us and work on

12:05the scope of roof work and then

12:07hopefully go to RFP in the spring.

12:09>> Okay. So, when they say the contract

12:11isn't complete,

12:12>> it's their contract.

12:12>> Third party. It's not us. those two

12:14parties. Okay. Well, that makes my

12:15question.

12:16>> Was that your understanding as well?

12:17>> My understanding is also that the the

12:19consultant was hired for the due

12:21diligence work.

12:23>> Um I'm not sure that they've actually

12:25defined that for us. Um I'm assuming

12:28some of which we've already done. Um but

12:34other than the due diligence work, um we

12:38have other decisions that would have to

12:40be made. I I thought I thought we were

12:42going to get a consultant that would

12:44help us with that decision-m process.

12:47Um, yes.

12:49>> I believe it's just exactly what Kathy

12:52said was

12:54who they're working with now is going

12:57like they're going to like bid it out

12:59for the consultant.

13:03>> You mean the consultant's going to bid

13:04out

13:05>> for what?

13:05>> The consultant's going to help us

13:06develop the the RFP that we can put up

13:09to bid. So then we'll be involved

13:11working on that

13:12>> if we go that way. Yes.

13:13>> Right. And and I guess we'll have to

13:16wait till they finally get in touch. So

13:17the our meeting with them was there was

13:20snow on the ground. I we were [laughter]

13:23months.

13:24>> Yeah.

13:26>> Yeah.

13:26>> All right.

13:28>> And then that they did say that they

13:30>> I'm concerned that Yeah. I'm concerned

13:31that we don't want to be steered in one

13:33direction here, right? I mean that

13:35that's my concern. Agreed.

13:37>> We can fight on our back.

13:39see if she has an update.

13:41>> Well, I her update is from yesterday.

13:43>> Yeah, her update is her update. So,

13:45>> and thank you for reaching out. I nudged

13:47our legal team.

13:48>> Yeah.

13:49>> Last week and they're working on it. So,

13:52>> so and and the goal, she said in her

13:54previous email, is to wrap up due

13:56diligence by the fall and hopefully

13:59target a spring 2027 RFP.

14:03>> Wow.

14:05>> That's close to a year.

14:07>> Yes. I mean, if not a year, eight, nine,

14:1010 months,

14:10>> no war because again with snow on the

14:12ground.

14:13>> Yeah. Well, bearing in mind that we meet

14:14once a month um and and that there are a

14:18number of decisions that need to be made

14:20that's not that outrageous because um

14:24I I think

14:28I mean we have a lot of decisions to

14:31make such as type of housing, how much

14:35housing,

14:37you know, type of housing is huge. uh

14:41you know other concerns that we may have

14:44in the area there,

14:45>> environmental issues, aesthetic issues,

14:48all of these things. So, it's going to

14:50be a process that's going to take a

14:52little bit of time. So, that doesn't

14:56surprise me or or concern me as much as

14:59I I'm wondering

15:03what kind of due diligence they say

15:05would lead us to an RFP. Yeah, I mean

15:08we've already done some due diligence to

15:10>> Yes.

15:11>> but maybe not

15:15>> right [snorts]

15:15>> per their understanding or requirements

15:17of what they deem due diligence to be.

15:19That's

15:20>> we don't know where the uh what the

15:22exception report is between our due

15:24diligence and their due diligence is

15:26what I think you're saying.

15:27>> Right. There's a there's so many ways to

15:29to go about this this type of um

15:35development. Um you know, in some towns,

15:40um the housing authorities team up in a

15:42private public partnership with a

15:45builder who has an obligation because of

15:48the affordable housing components in in

15:50projects to either fund projects or

15:54build affordable housing. Some housing

15:57authorities I'm I'm aware of have

15:59actually partnered with builders

16:02together with CPC money together with

16:05affordable housing trust money in order

16:07to put developments together using the

16:10uh fund allocations that they've set

16:12aside as a result of their own

16:13developments

16:14>> and they they've actually used that in

16:16order to go forward and build. So, I

16:20don't know how you get from where we are

16:22now to that type of RFP. And I was

16:25hoping that these consultants could give

16:27us options

16:28>> versus running their own

16:30>> versus running their own playbook, which

16:32I wasn't that thrilled with to begin

16:33with.

16:34>> Correct. Understood. I don't know the

16:35answer to that, but I understand your

16:36angst.

16:37>> Okay. Okay.

16:39>> I think we have to wait for them to

16:41>> finish their stuff and then come and

16:42tell us and then we'll better handle on

16:44what the steps are. Yeah, I just wanted

16:46I just wanted to be out in the open as

16:48to you know what

16:49>> my thoughts are about it. Anybody else

16:51have anything else to add?

16:53>> Like I said, I understand your angst,

16:56concern, lack of clarity. I think

16:58there's a lot of that

16:59>> and I think once to Miss Mcweeny's point

17:02once we have a green light to engage the

17:05consultant, I think the very first step

17:07should be an open Q&A discussion forum

17:11up that inviting her to one of our

17:13meetings or something. who put her, him,

17:15whoever the consultant is in expressing

17:18>> the exact concerns you just laid out.

17:20Maybe a little more methodically. Maybe

17:22we do a slide or bullets or a list or

17:24something to provide them with the our

17:26questions ahead of time or something.

17:28>> Sure.

17:28>> But but agree those are the questions we

17:30need answers to.

17:31>> Okay.

17:32>> Do we have any indication of their

17:34timeline being reasonable?

17:37>> Well, we don't know any more than what

17:39they've told us, which is which is we're

17:41working on it.

17:41>> Okay.

17:42>> Yeah. [laughter]

17:43which yeah, we're kind of at their

17:45mercy.

17:46>> Yeah. And and that well, we're at their

17:49mercy if we want to utilize them. We're

17:52not at their mercy if we if we don't

17:53want to utilize them. But I was hopeful

17:56that we would be able to use them for

18:00ideas on how to go forward, ideas on how

18:02to put these projects together,

18:05alternatives for various for various

18:08types of proposals. Um,

18:11that's what I was looking for was was

18:13really the alternatives. So,

18:16>> but I guess we're just going to have to

18:18wait and see. Um,

18:23any other questions, comments, or

18:25discussion about that?

18:26>> When are we allowed to say

18:28>> in a few minutes? Okay.

18:30>> In a [laughter] few minutes. We I'll

18:31open it up to public discussion in a few

18:33minutes. Okay.

18:33>> Yep. And I will I will recognize the

18:36fact that we have people from the

18:38Elizabeth Street area here. Um and um we

18:43will open it up in a bit in a bit. Um

18:47before I do that though, I wanted to get

18:49one more um agenda kind of agenda matter

18:52out of the way because previously we had

18:54talked about our legal services

18:56>> and um as you know Karen Island has

18:58represented represented us for years um

19:01as she was um regionally based um and

19:05provided us good representation for many

19:07years. Um we're losing her. So, um, as

19:12you can see from the email from Sarah

19:15Liry, um, we are being allocated a

19:18certain, um, dollar amount in order to

19:22provide to provide legal services to the

19:24housing authority in the event that we

19:27need them, which as you know, we do use.

19:30Um, I am going to note that this is for

19:33state only. Um, so federal uh is is an

19:38aside. That's another whole story alto

19:40together. And hopefully between the two

19:43we're coming.

19:44>> Yes.

19:44>> Um and we're going they're going to be

19:47providing us with um um I think names of

19:52attorneys that we'll be able to use and

19:55that they probably have vetted uh and

19:59probably have experience in the housing

20:01courts. Anybody have any thing to say

20:05about that in terms of discussion

20:06because there's not much we can really

20:08decide on. Um this is this is just going

20:11to be developing as we go forward.

20:14>> Yes, Kathy.

20:16>> So the attorneys that were presented or

20:18the attorney firm that was presented

20:20last month, we are not using them. We're

20:23going to use someone locally with the

20:24funds that they're authorizing.

20:27I will know 100%

20:30next week when we're in the team's

20:33meeting with

20:36Sarah Larry, probably Karen Olives,

20:39probably these other attorneys. Um, but

20:42>> probably speak up a little bit so they

20:43can hear.

20:44>> There's I think there's going to be like

20:47a pool, okay, of attorneys. Um, I think

20:52maybe the attorneys who reached out to

20:54us were probably I don't know, jumping

20:58the gun thinking maybe they could get a

21:00contract before Sarah sent out.

21:04>> I'm 100% sure.

21:06>> And these these people may be on the

21:08list, but

21:09>> I was just going to say

21:10>> for all we're going to know.

21:10>> I was going to say maybe the ones that

21:12reached out are one and the same that

21:13are going to be presented.

21:14>> Yeah, I mean I I have their various

21:16resumes here from what we had last time

21:19and they're all over the state. Right.

21:21>> So, my question about that though to

21:23follow up on Cathy's is is um would we

21:27then be using someone like them for the

21:30federal work and someone else for the

21:32state work or is our regional attorney

21:34good for both?

21:35>> No, our regional attorney is only good

21:37for state,

21:38>> right?

21:38>> So, we still need another attorney.

21:40>> I use Jonathan for the federal like he's

21:46great with the section 8. He's great.

21:50Okay.

21:50>> Here. Um,

21:51>> and we're allowed to

21:52>> we're allowed to Jonathan's only federal

21:55>> like I mean I'm sure he does private

21:57sector also, but he doesn't

22:01>> I have never seen him doing state work

22:05cuz Karen was always free to our housing

22:08authorities.

22:09>> Yep. Okay. All right. I have a question

22:12as well. Yes. The last paragraph says

22:14they're allocating. It doesn't seem like

22:16much to me. Kelly, what's our annual

22:18legal budget? They're allocating 11,500

22:21for their shared services,

22:23>> right, for state

22:24>> for the state. But that doesn't seem

22:25like a lot.

22:26>> It's not.

22:26>> That's a,000 a month. That's nothing.

22:29>> It's not.

22:29>> We never had a state budget because

22:34every time we would use or call Karen,

22:38she was contracted with DHC.

22:40>> So it was So her money, her bills went

22:44straight to DAC.

22:45>> Yes.

22:45>> So on the one hand, we weren't paying a

22:47dime. Um, and on the other hand, we're

22:51getting 11 for free, but starting at 115

22:54and one, it's on our desk.

22:56>> Clearly, we're going to be shorted and

22:57clearly we're going to have a deficit

22:59and clearly we're going to have to

23:00address this.

23:00>> Yeah, that's where I was

23:01>> in a future budget discussion.

23:03>> We need to let um

23:05>> James,

23:06>> thank you. James know that we're going

23:08from zero but we don't know how much

23:10they spent in build to 11 allocation

23:12which my sense is is probably a drop in

23:16the bucket 10 or 20% of our

23:18>> if you get into the wrong type of

23:19litigation you're absolutely right.

23:21>> So okay

23:22>> I'm sure accountant fees

23:25will be in on this team's meeting. Okay.

23:27>> Like James and B.

23:29>> Maybe even ping James ahead of time and

23:31let him know before.

23:32>> Oh, I'm sure he already know.

23:33>> I think he already know

23:35>> before [clears throat] we

23:36>> he's on top of this type of stuff. Okay.

23:38>> But Kelly,

23:39>> I will touch base.

23:40>> Yep.

23:40>> Question.

23:41>> Yeah.

23:41>> Um I know we've never had to pay it, but

23:44do you have any idea of the how many

23:46hours we used Karen over the course of

23:48the year?

23:48>> Oh my god. I can tell you this. I can

23:50tell you.

23:50>> Okay.

23:51>> Um on one case alone, I'll bet you she

23:53had 100 hours.

23:55>> So,

23:56>> if not more. Yeah.

23:57>> Yeah. So, unless she charges a dollar,

23:59the new ones that charge a dollar an

24:00hour, [laughter]

24:02>> and pick a number, pick 300 an hour or

24:05100 an hour, we're still 5, 10, 20x that

24:08number. That's what I mean, a drop in

24:10the bucket.

24:10>> We're faced with a with a drastic change

24:13here that that I think the state is is

24:16clearly underfunding and under

24:19misunderstanding. I

24:21>> think they want us to have a brawl in

24:22the parking lot and settle it that way.

24:24Well, you know, you can't do that

24:26anymore.

24:27>> That's what I'm saying. [laughter]

24:29So, so

24:30>> well, I just worry about how far 11

24:31grand the legal spend at one time. At

24:34one point, [laughter]

24:36>> um, so, um, I I just think we're on to

24:39funding here and and we're going to find

24:40that out.

24:41>> Yeah.

24:41>> The hard way.

24:42>> Exactly. Okay.

24:43>> We can anticipate it. James will have

24:45more to tell us once he's,

24:47>> uh, participated in that meeting if he's

24:49going to. Um, Joe, you know, I would

24:52suggest to you, look, we wait until

24:54Kelly and James have a have a chance to

24:57digest what they have to say and then

24:59we'll revisit this at the next meeting.

25:00Let's make sure it's on the agenda.

25:02>> Right.

25:03>> Yeah.

25:05>> Okay. Does anybody have any other new

25:07business?

25:08>> Um, one item. I mentioned it prior. uh

25:12you know that in one of my earlier

25:14capacities years ago as treasur I picked

25:16up the uh uh ELOC's certification

25:19responsibility and I just continue to

25:21maintain that light

25:22>> happy to help but for the record I

25:24continue to maintain that it requires um

25:27I think it's every 60 or every 90day

25:29certification in Kelly which I try to do

25:30every 30 so I never miss it and get

25:32locked out and all that they went

25:34through a revamp of their system and I

25:36essentially I'm simplifying it but have

25:38to be reertified as the administrator

25:41and there's a do two factor

25:42authentication and password and protocol

25:44and portal and I went through all that

25:45on behalf of this board. So just for the

25:47public record I will continue to do

25:49that. Now it's on its newer version of

25:51consult system.

25:52>> Thank you Paul.

25:53>> I I for one thank you

25:55>> profusely because that was a very

25:58difficult system for me to navigate.

26:00>> It's marginally better for whatever it's

26:01worth now with this latest round of um

26:03updates. But

26:04>> but I got to tell you it was a bear.

26:06>> Yeah, it was very integrated. I mean

26:07it's not much better but it's marginally

26:09better. Yeah,

26:10>> they basically put a veneer on top of

26:12the old system. So, you log into a

26:14newer, more current system, and once

26:16you're logged in,

26:17>> you're basically passed back into the

26:19old system, but it's not the old system

26:21logging you in. The new system does the

26:23verification and passes you through.

26:24>> Good.

26:25>> So, just for the record.

26:26>> Good.

26:27>> Okay. Anybody else have any other new

26:29business before we go to the public?

26:30Okay. This is

26:31>> Kelly.

26:32>> Yes,

26:32>> I do.

26:33>> Yes.

26:33>> Uh, last meeting Paul asked regarding

26:36the waiting list.

26:37>> Yeah. So, I printed the statistics for

26:41the Shoesbury Hustle 30 CH champ waiting

26:43list and

26:46as of today there's 29,224

26:50applicants,

26:5223,585

26:55families,

26:586,842

27:00elderly,

27:02and 2,987

27:05young disabled.

27:06>> Is that state.

27:08>> I think the basis for my ask if I recall

27:11was is it still on average a couple

27:13years because when I get asked a

27:15question from the constituents always

27:16want to know

27:17>> what's Yeah, I I think that that's a

27:19good question because I think we all

27:20like to know

27:22>> how long does it take for someone who's

27:23a for instance afree resident.

27:27>> It depends what priority they have.

27:28>> With camps it prioritizes in a way so

27:31you know if you're homeless you go right

27:33to the top of the list.

27:34>> Yeah. or you're being evicted or if

27:36there's a fire, a flood or whatever,

27:38you're going to jump. If you

27:39>> But if you don't jump, if you're just an

27:41average person,

27:43>> you're going to sit there

27:44>> free.

27:44>> Yeah, you are because all these people

27:47>> So years is the answer.

27:48>> All right.

27:49>> Unless you

27:50>> And it's the family housing. It's always

27:51been years.

27:53>> Many years.

27:54>> Okay. So, all right. Thank you, Kelly. I

27:55appreciate that.

27:56>> I wish I'd asked that person a call

27:58question, you know, when she initially

28:00put the application in. next time we get

28:01one or if anyone gets a call like I did

28:03the other day that'll be, you know, just

28:05a good gauge way for us to get a gauge.

28:07>> That's why I was asking because a couple

28:08people called me and said, "Do you know

28:09how long it is?" And I was ashamed to

28:11say I didn't. I said I knew it was

28:13years, but I didn't have anything more

28:15>> clear than that.

28:16>> So the total is 29,000 people on the

28:18waiting list

28:19>> on the champ

28:21state just for Shbury.

28:24>> So people Shbury on the on the champs

28:26list.

28:27>> Yes. Is 28,200.

28:30Wow.

28:31>> Yeah. [laughter]

28:32>> But they also picked other talents.

28:34>> They also picked other talents. And

28:35that's why we could pick somebody

28:40>> and they could be residing in Boston.

28:44>> They might not want to come to Shbury.

28:46They might want to stay in the city. So

28:49that's just people because they can pick

28:5125 housing 30s.

28:52>> Okay.

28:53>> Thank you. Um in the federal

28:57>> we have 43 locals

29:02>> out of

29:03>> 127.

29:05>> Oh, that's not

29:06>> No,

29:07>> that's not bad. That's a third.

29:09>> And last year at this time,

29:12>> just just for your knowledge, federal is

29:14this building.

29:14>> Yes,

29:16>> this building's federal

29:20was 114 applicants. So, we went up

29:24marginal

29:26>> 30.

29:27>> So somebody's better off applying in and

29:30we're staying around the 41.

29:33>> The conclusion I heard which I think

29:34Kathy just started at the state is if

29:36you want to move quicker apply to

29:38federal over state.

29:39>> That's what I tell.

29:40>> Okay. You tell

29:42if you're local. Y

29:45>> So that's a good takeaway for us as um

29:50>> elected officials constituents when they

29:52say I'm trying. What can I do? The

29:53takeaway can be well my understanding is

29:56federal booms much faster for

29:58>> all right thank you

30:00>> good

30:01>> anything else

30:01>> that's it

30:02>> anything else with that we open it up to

30:04the public hello

30:05>> hi there [laughter]

30:09I take it you want to speak

30:11>> yes my name is Chris Nickel is my

30:13husband Wes

30:15>> um we actually live right across the

30:17street from Elizabeth Gardens

30:20>> on Jordan just off Jordan

30:21>> just off of Jordan we're one of those

30:22little tiny private roads. Y so

30:25>> very familiar.

30:26>> Yes. Um we've been there for coming up

30:29on 30 years. So we're very familiar with

30:31the area. We have a lot of investment in

30:33the area. Okay. When I saw the article

30:37come out in February and community

30:39advocates that they planned on doing

30:41this. Okay. My husband went up to the

30:44town and we already have a plot plan.

30:47So, I'm listening to you guys talking

30:49about, you know, we're waiting to

30:51hopefully get alternative, you know,

30:53like possibilities and things like that.

30:55I'm going, you guys have plot planned

30:57already. Okay. And for us as a Butters,

31:01that does not feel good. All right?

31:03Because number one, nobody in the

31:04neighborhood wants this. Okay? First of

31:07all, this is an area that around the

31:11pond in general, the town is supposed to

31:13be maintaining is open space. Okay?

31:16Obviously, it doesn't say to you how far

31:18in, but it's a very, very enjoyed area.

31:24Okay, we're a dead end. We get lots of

31:27people that come down here

31:30>> um to go fishing when they stop the

31:32pond. You know, there's not enough

31:34parking in other spots. So, even though

31:36technically they're not really supposed

31:37to park, you know, at the end the dead

31:39end stuff, people do. It's, you know,

31:41it's usually not a problem. um and

31:43everything. We have a ton of wildlife

31:46that's literally been viewed right there

31:48in those little woods. You guys want to

31:49rip apart. Okay. Um we have kids in the

31:53neighborhood. You have a school right

31:55there. Um I have concerns about who are

31:59we moving in because you have children.

32:02You have a school. Okay. We haven't been

32:06informed of anything. And I understand,

32:08you know, because you guys aren't at the

32:10part in the process yet where you would

32:12be doing that. Okay. But he had been a

32:15town meeting man member many many years

32:17ago. No, but the feeling the feeling

32:22that had always happened from when he

32:24was doing that was right now you're in a

32:26very early phase which to us as a

32:29butters feels like this is the time you

32:31should be talking to the neighborhood to

32:34get our feelings about it. possible

32:36other ideas of use of the space and

32:39things like that. Not by the time you

32:41reach further along because at that

32:43point once you've got contracts and

32:45designs and all this stuff you're

32:46already in it. So if you're waiting till

32:48then to inform us as a butters you're

32:51not getting to say because you've

32:53already made your decision. He learned

32:54that a long time ago. Okay, as a town

32:56meeting member once you reach a certain

32:58point it doesn't really matter what the

33:00abutter stink. It's just going to

33:02happen. Okay. Unfair. You've already had

33:04plenty of litigation that's gone on up

33:06in the center of town over Beiel and all

33:08this other kind of stuff. We've got so

33:10many projects already going on in

33:12Shersbury to aid the, you know, need for

33:15low-income housing and the apartments

33:17and all this kind of stuff. For us, it's

33:20like, why are you going to attack this

33:21one little tiny small area? Okay,

33:24because what you're talking about doing

33:26is if you've never been down there, take

33:28yourself a little walk. Okay? There is a

33:31deadend barrier. Your project is going

33:34to take you all the way down to that.

33:35You are now impacting into the woods.

33:38Okay? So, you are impacting the

33:40environment there. All right? You're

33:43impacting the neighborhood. All right?

33:46Um, we personally, that's not something

33:49we want to be looking at. Um, I

33:52certainly don't want to see any street

33:54access. Okay. Because there are kids on

33:57the, you know, the street.

33:59>> Yeah. Um, and everything. So, this is

34:03it's not giving us a very good feeling

34:06about this project. And I was I mean, we

34:09were just talking about it earlier. I

34:11would love to see a different design if

34:12you're going to insist on going through

34:14with this because of whatever mandates

34:16the state tells you. And I understand

34:18that, you know, you guys kind of

34:20sometimes don't always get the choice

34:21because you're talking about the

34:22percentage that you need to have um

34:26within the town to meet the needs that

34:28they expect us to meet. Okay, I get

34:30that. everything. But I think you need

34:33to take a good look at you've got bigger

34:36projects going on. You have bigger areas

34:39and everything. This town, I hate to put

34:41it this way, but it's how I always

34:42describe it, has raped so much land,

34:45okay, and taken away so much open space.

34:50Why do you want to impact an area that

34:52is a little bit of open space, sort of a

34:55little piece of heaven to those who come

34:56down to enjoy it? Okay, our animals. All

35:00right. The wildlife is already keep

35:01getting shoved out everywhere.

35:03>> Not talking squirrel, rabbits. We're

35:06talking lyns, coyotes, and some of those

35:10things you might not want, but they're

35:11in there.

35:12>> Deer, turkey. We've actually had bear

35:15Yeah, that's what I meant by Bobcat.

35:18>> Yeah,

35:18>> we've had bears go through. I mean, all

35:20kinds of wildlife goes through our I

35:22mean, they go right through our yard.

35:24>> Yep. And they're in that little they're

35:26in that little wooded section that you

35:28guys look at decimating for housing.

35:30>> Okay?

35:31>> And no offense, I know that we sit here

35:34and go, "Well, we we have the human

35:36needs, but you still have to give

35:38consideration to your environment, too,

35:41okay? Because eventually, I mean, how

35:42many times have you driven around now,

35:44okay? Just from all the land that gets

35:46used up." We laugh because you literally

35:49see huge like uh groups of turkeys

35:53literally sitting in people's front

35:54yards now. Okay, because we keep taking

35:57everything. All right, you can't

35:59continuously take every little piece of

36:02ground. Okay, but I just feel like

36:05there's also a larger impact to this

36:06because um his mom used to live here

36:10when it was still just under Shrewsbury

36:12before it became federal. Once it became

36:15federal, things changed and she reached

36:18a point where she actually chose to stay

36:20in a nursing home when she was there for

36:22rehab because she was afraid.

36:25Okay? Because it became a different

36:27clientele from what it was when she had

36:29first moved in here. I have concerns

36:32about who's going to go in because the

36:34wording that was in the community

36:35advocate made it almost sound like

36:38whoever you're leasing this land to to

36:40build upon gets to decide who lives

36:42there. I'm like, I'm sorry. We have a

36:45school. You do have el elderly people

36:47that already live within the community

36:49already right there, Elizabeth. Okay.

36:52You have children on our street and

36:54everything. And I think that there's a

36:56lot of things that need to be considered

36:57before we just sort of, hey, let's just

36:59keep throwing in some more houses. Every

37:01little piece of ground that we can find,

37:03you know, if there are other projects

37:05going on and other potential areas that

37:08are larger. Okay. They just built the

37:10Elm I believe down on 20 which has not

37:13you guys directly but it has you know

37:15like 13 units in it. They're supposed to

37:17be for lowcost housing. Okay. So if we

37:20have these kind of big projects going on

37:21where a certain percentage of that can

37:24also be dedicated to lowcost housing and

37:27everything then again give consideration

37:31to

37:32what you're going to kind of destroy in

37:34this little area. Okay? And again, in a

37:37neighborhood that really doesn't want to

37:38see this happen.

37:41So, you know, we just want you guys to

37:43really take a serious look at what

37:45you're going to do there and is this

37:47really the best spot to do it and is,

37:50you know, is it necessary or is this

37:52potentially could be done somewhere else

37:54as part of another larger project.

37:58So, thank you for listening. [laughter]

38:01>> Sure.

38:03Um first let me point out that the plan

38:06that you are talking about that you

38:08found at the town hall I guess um we

38:12have discussed that plan several times

38:14in in these public meetings. Um that was

38:17a conceptual plan that we hired an

38:19engineer to uh determine what could be

38:23built there right

38:25>> not what will be built there. Um, so no

38:29decision has been made whatsoever as to

38:33what exactly is going to be built there.

38:35I will point out, however, that though

38:37that it is housing authority land.

38:39>> I know

38:39>> um and and our our job as the Shrewsbury

38:42Housing Authority is to do whatever we

38:44can within reason. Um bearing in mind

38:48that we we don't like to upset

38:50neighborhoods any more than anybody else

38:52does. Um, you know, our job is to, if we

38:57can, produce more affordable housing in

38:59this community. Um,

39:02you know, that being said, I hear what

39:05you said. Uh, I'm I'm sure we all have.

39:08Um, we need to be sensitive to the

39:10neighborhood. We need to listen to your

39:13concerns.

39:14Um, some of which I will tell you that I

39:17don't necessarily agree with myself. Um

39:20because the people that move into these

39:22these houses and these units, whatever

39:25they may be, they're frankly just people

39:28like you and me. I mean, we don't put

39:30criminals in there and we don't in fact

39:33we have we have restrictions that keep

39:34us from putting criminals in there.

39:36>> The wording in the community advocate

39:38did not give it a good light.

39:40>> It also did not come from us.

39:42>> That was written by a reporter. That was

39:43nothing from this board,

39:45>> right? But that's what's being put out

39:47there. And so maybe that reporting needs

39:50to be a little more sensitive or or

39:53>> but that's up to them and reporters will

39:54do what they want to do.

39:55>> I know. So um and and newspapers will do

39:58what they want to do.

39:59>> They always have.

40:00>> But um I can assure you that as part of

40:04the process for anything like this, um

40:08we would naturally be reaching out to

40:10the neighborhood for comments and and

40:12concerns. We're not to that point yet.

40:14Uh, as you can see from our discussions

40:18here, yeah,

40:18>> we don't even know what we're going to

40:22be proposing,

40:24>> but I can assure you we will be

40:26proposing something because it is

40:27housing authority land. And um, I think

40:31we're all agreed that we, you know, we

40:34have our housing hats on here and it's

40:36our job to to try to produce more

40:39housing for those that need it and those

40:42that can't afford to stay here. Um, all

40:44of us know people that grew up in town

40:47that um haven't been able to stay here

40:49because it's so expensive. Um, that is

40:52what a affordable housing seeks to

40:54address. Um, senior housing is is is

40:59solely needed. Um, you heard from Kelly

41:02what the lists are. Um, you know, the

41:05waiting list for housing in Shrewsbury

41:07is years long. Not one, but in some

41:11cases several. So um I I hear hear what

41:15you said. So personally I understand u

41:18exactly what you're saying. Um again I

41:21don't necessarily agree with the couple

41:23of your comments but I think that's you

41:25know everybody has their view points on

41:27these things.

41:28>> Another one more thing I did.

41:30>> Oh go ahead. Go.

41:32>> I was wondering if you could clear

41:34something up for me because it's

41:35probably my perception that

41:37>> Sure.

41:37>> You're leasing the land out. No, I don't

41:40know. Okay, because that's what they

41:41said.

41:43I didn't write that article.

41:44>> I know. I know. Again, it's giving this

41:47we have present

41:49here. This is why we're here. Fair

41:51enough.

41:51>> I can tell you this that that would be

41:54an option for us. We could just say,

41:56"Hey, we have this piece of land. Go

41:58build it." But that's not our intent.

42:00But the only reason I would have concern

42:03over that is I prefer you to maintain

42:06control than just leasing it out to

42:09somebody else.

42:10>> As do we.

42:10>> Yeah.

42:11>> I think you have a 100% agreement on

42:13that.

42:14>> Always believe in that. It's

42:15>> Yeah.

42:16>> Something's better done in house than

42:18>> sending it out. And that's

42:20>> No, rest assured, we take pride in what

42:22we do. We take pride in the housing that

42:25we that we have around town. And you

42:26would be surprised at some of the houses

42:28around town that we have people in and

42:30and that we own.

42:31>> Well, so right May I

42:34>> Sure.

42:34>> right around the corner from you.

42:35>> Yeah. recogn Franchesca's um belly.

42:38>> We were well aware of that when it was

42:40>> so that was an that was an initiative

42:42that in many ways I don't want to

42:45oversimplify or over complicate but I

42:47sat in this chair more than once and

42:49said I would like to do a repeat of road

42:52small duplex familyfriendly neighborhood

42:55centric not a complex etc. So that those

43:00three units and five three buildings,

43:02five units, Kelly.

43:03>> Yeah.

43:04>> 35.

43:05>> Y

43:05>> those three SL5 building units was the

43:09last project that we did.

43:10>> So but that unit actually at first when

43:12I saw that I was like, "Oh, what are

43:14they doing?" But honestly, it made sense

43:16because it was literally this little

43:17tiny piece of property that honestly got

43:20trashed by people walking by, literally

43:22dropping trash and doing all these

43:24things and everything. So when I looked

43:25at that, I'm like, "Well, that makes

43:26sense because it actually looks better,

43:28too."

43:28>> And the land you're talking about is

43:30Yes. It's woods right now. Yes.

43:32>> And it and it's woodland

43:34>> and some of it some of it's driveway.

43:36>> Some of it is driveway, but

43:38>> but a lot of where you're going to

43:39extend into because like you said,

43:41looking at the plot plan, not

43:43necessarily that those are the exact

43:45design, but still looking at location.

43:48You're going all the way down to that

43:50dead end area.

43:52>> I recognize that. Yeah. Um, the other

43:53issue I did want to bring up that and I

43:55mentioned this to Kelly that we have a

43:58huge problem with down there and not

44:00that this is the purpose of your land

44:02there. Okay, but

44:05>> all the trucks that come down, okay,

44:07it's a dead end

44:07>> pitches. I'm just going to show them

44:09while you're talking.

44:10>> A dead end street. Okay,

44:13>> the only people they have any smarts

44:14about honestly when they come down there

44:16is the trash guys because they back down

44:18the street knowing it's a dead end.

44:20Okay. So, for us, like the bottom of our

44:24driveway in the street is being

44:25destroyed because whether it's a town

44:28truck, a state truck, a delivery truck,

44:29it doesn't matter who it is. We're all

44:31turning around in our driveway and it's

44:33like there is Well, before Kelly shows

44:36you that, there was at least a little

44:37bit of space that somebody had

44:40previously cleared that worked for the

44:41town. Okay. So, that the bigger trucks

44:44could at least have a way to back in and

44:46then go back up the street.

44:48>> This road. So, what street are you? I

44:50was ask Florence.

44:52>> No, we're Lillian Terrace, which is

44:54right off

44:56>> you can see it.

44:57>> So, you guys for

44:59have stairs that come down to our street

45:01because there's no drivethru on the

45:03Jordan.

45:04>> Okay. So, you have Roberts, but then you

45:07have Jordan Road, then you have

45:08Elizabeth,

45:09>> right? So, we're we're a little tiny

45:11spot off of sort

45:13>> off of Jordan. Yes. I will take a ride.

45:15>> You won't you won't even see a sign.

45:17>> Okay.

45:17>> Yeah. There's no sign here. I'm going

45:19down Jordan. You'd be on my left

45:22>> if you're going towards our woods.

45:23>> The last house.

45:24>> Last drive on the left.

45:25>> You see a driveway go up. That's our

45:27house. Yeah.

45:28>> But that's not Jordan.

45:29>> Jordan is the last one. You see a

45:31>> No, it is our

45:32>> fire hydrant there.

45:33>> I'll take that's there's a house there's

45:36a house that's the last house

45:38technically on Jordan with a house

45:40behind it. That's our neighbor Kathy. So

45:43her she had paved her part of of our

45:46private road so she could Yeah. So she

45:49could actually get in out there safely

45:50with a car in the snow and whatever. So

45:53that's just the two of us

45:55>> and that little piece of road.

45:57>> Miss Sweeney,

45:59>> I think we spoke on the phone. I think

46:01um you called me after. Yes, we talked.

46:03Yeah. So absolutely I heard we heard

46:05exactly what you said. I did share it

46:07with my Richard and I are on the

46:08subcommittee obviously the whole board.

46:10So we heard what you said. Um, and I did

46:12take a ride by, so I do know exactly

46:14what you're talking about. But I just

46:15wanted to say that I remember the

46:17conversation. I think of it often when

46:19we're talking about this project. And

46:21when we get any further, we'll revisit.

46:23And I think I said that to you at the

46:25time, like we're, you know, we want to

46:26hear what you have to say. And um, what

46:29was there was just the conceptual thing.

46:31We're not trying to build that. That's

46:33not probably not even what's going to go

46:34out to RFP. We just don't know.

46:36>> Although I will tell you that I liked

46:37that better than what we heard from MHP.

46:40So, I mean, there is going to be

46:43something there. We don't know what yet.

46:46Um, we will certainly listen to the

46:48neighbors, including you. Um, but but

46:53you know,

46:55if I were to if I were predict, I'd say

46:57something's going to go there.

46:58>> Well, and we were already talking about

47:00that, too, that, you know, it's probably

47:02like something's going to happen and

47:03stuff. And and we've even had our own

47:05ideas. Now, mind you, we are certainly

47:07not architects, right? That kind of

47:08stuff. their way,

47:09>> right? But it's like we're sitting there

47:11thinking about it like, well, you know,

47:13if they tried doing something like this

47:15that would be less impact but still like

47:18do what you need to do, you know, type

47:20of thing. So, I'm hoping that as you

47:22move forward, you will get people who

47:25come in and give other conceptual ideas

47:28of what the area could end up being. You

47:31know, like I said to him, I said, I'd

47:32rather actually see you extend what you

47:35have for apartments already behind it.

47:37And even if you had to extend the

47:39parking lot somewhat into those woods

47:42would be better to me than having a

47:44bunch of houses facility there because

47:45to be honest then take up a fence.

47:48>> I understand that. Um I will point out

47:50to you though that Elizabeth Street's

47:52residents may not agree.

47:53>> I know.

47:54>> Um so we will be faced with competing

47:57concerns.

47:58>> Yeah.

47:58>> Wouldn't the observation commission be

48:01involved?

48:02>> Absolutely.

48:03>> Yeah.

48:04>> Yes.

48:05>> Absolutely. Yep. They will read.

48:10>> Anybody else have anything to say?

48:12>> Me

48:15>> these two flags

48:16>> about just about that this subject. Are

48:19we done with this subject?

48:20>> No.

48:21>> I think so.

48:22>> Okay. Thank you for coming and thank you

48:23for your for your thoughts. and we will

48:26we will make a note to um notify you of

48:30meetings um that we but but except for

48:33the public meeting that we have once a

48:35month which as you probably know is

48:37pretty well scheduled every single

48:39month. So

48:41>> when is the next one

48:45>> October 13th

48:46>> typically not always but typically it's

48:49the second Tuesday of every month at

48:514:00.

48:52>> Okay.

48:53>> The location does move.

48:55changes, but if you go to the town

48:56website, if you have the app and you can

48:58look at um you can download agendas.

49:00>> Yeah.

49:00>> And then you can look at our agenda and

49:02then the top of the agenda will say

49:04where our meeting is and if the date has

49:06changed. So like you know today's agenda

49:08says

49:09>> Wednesday, usually we're Tuesday says

49:10Wednesday the 16th at the towers.

49:12>> We had scheduling issues. That's why

49:13we're here.

49:14>> I was here.

49:14>> Okay. So normally you're Tuesday.

49:16>> Second Tuesday of the month.

49:17>> Okay. Unless someone has you told me

49:19that

49:20>> which is what October 13th should be.

49:22>> Yeah, it is. April.

49:24>> Okay.

49:24>> Yeah. Next one. Next again. Thank you

49:26very much. We appreciate you listening.

49:28>> Yeah. And I hope you understand. We have

49:29to be frank and honest and and objective

49:31objective with you and and I I

49:33understand your concerns.

49:35>> So So

49:36>> we'll we'll be discussing this further.

49:38I I assure you.

49:39>> Well, that's why I look forward to

49:40actually like having more discussion and

49:42seeing what else, you know, actually

49:44develops out of the, you know, concept

49:47for what needs to. So

49:49>> good. Good.

49:51Your last comment uh strikes me as

49:54something that we will be discussing

49:55too. So about the type of building. So

50:00>> so interesting.

50:02>> Yeah.

50:02>> Thank you.

50:04>> Yes ma'am.

50:04>> These two flags were removed from the

50:07property at Francis on June 25th.

50:12>> I was extremely

50:16>> I tried to get an answer why they had

50:19been removed. One of them was hanging on

50:22the fence that separates

50:26from poly length

50:28>> and the other was mounted on a bracket

50:31on a trim.

50:33>> Why?

50:34>> Well, that's why we

50:36>> Well, they were put up by a tenant

50:39because they respected the flag, respect

50:42the country, etc. And then they were

50:45sumearily taken down.

50:48I asked why and I still have not many.

50:54>> I was told if I wanted the flag I could

50:58come to the office and pick them up and

51:01I did. And this is what

51:06>> Okay. So they're they're still in good

51:07shape. They're

51:08>> they're still they're usable. They're

51:11not

51:14>> Okay. All right. And then the standard

51:15American flag.

51:16>> Yes. Okay,

51:18>> Kelly, do you have anything to say about

51:19that?

51:20>> Yes, they were on the fence area

51:24>> and we took

51:27it down. They should be able to hold

51:30nine yards did take the flags down

51:33because it was hanging on

51:35>> cuz they're hanging on the fence instead

51:37of a flag pole.

51:38>> Yes. And there was one

51:42flag on the street

51:45>> on the tree. Like it wasn't as soon as

51:48you walk in the middle of where the

51:51community room these were all on the

51:52corner. And if we allow

51:57that in that corner, then I'm going to

52:00have to allow another person to allow

52:03the Trump signs in another corner. It

52:07>> Yes, Paul. I thought and I I could be

52:10very wrong, but this came up years ago.

52:12I thought we had a policy on flags and I

52:14thought, and Kelly, please refresh me,

52:16that the policy was no political flags.

52:19So, I don't think the Trump USA argument

52:21holds there, but I don't know that is it

52:24no flags or is it no political flags

52:26would be my question.

52:29>> Political settings.

52:30>> That's what I the policy, but

52:33>> policy.

52:34>> Well, I think we agreed that there were

52:35no political flags allowed,

52:36>> right?

52:38um

52:38>> for obvious reasons.

52:39>> For obvious reasons.

52:41>> Um I'm concerned that we have flags

52:44being draped wherever people want to

52:46drape them, too.

52:48>> I don't know that I don't know if we

52:49have a policy that covers that.

52:50>> Good question.

52:51>> Um I would prefer to see the flags on

52:55the flag pole

52:57um

52:59>> rather than draped on a fence.

53:04was tied respectfully.

53:06>> Pardon me.

53:07>> It was attached to the fence

53:10respectfully.

53:12It wasn't just

53:16my biggest part of the issue is what

53:20they've been there for several years.

53:23Why

53:26just a few days before our fabulous

53:29anniversary to the country where they

53:32would would they eliminate or illuminate

53:34it because that is flag policy. They

53:36have to be lit. So that I

53:38>> if it's not there's not a light on it

53:4020, you know, at night then it shouldn't

53:42be hanging,

53:43>> right?

53:44>> Okay.

53:45>> And that's flag etiquette.

53:46>> Yeah, that's what I was going to say

53:48too. It's like there is

53:51>> so

53:54that's why the flag has to be eliminated

53:56if the flag is up at night.

53:57>> Yeah. You either need to take it down

53:58which is why

53:59>> myself a patriot. I didn't even know

54:00that. Okay. If you're in a military

54:01base, they take it down at dusk is

54:03rather than light.

54:04>> Okay. Thank you.

54:07>> And if you're there while they're taking

54:08it down, playing tap, you need to stay

54:10at attention.

54:10>> I did.

54:11>> Which is one of the reasons why I made

54:13my comment about, you know, I'm okay

54:15with them being on a poll because a lot

54:16of times polls are lit or else the flag

54:19comes down at night.

54:21>> So, so I

54:25I can only tell you that I think this is

54:27the beginning of a discussion about a

54:29policy,

54:30>> right? And um I think it's something

54:32that we need to look at. I will tell you

54:36that it seems to me that the answer is

54:38that our maintenance people took the

54:40flags down. Um be that as it may, I

54:45think that the that um as MC Sweeney

54:49pointed out, um there is etiquette that

54:53goes along with the draping of flags.

54:55So,

54:56>> so I think um we probably should address

55:00that now. I think it's unfortunate that

55:02it was done just before the 4th of July.

55:04Um and um I'm sorry that that happened,

55:08but

55:09>> the fact that I couldn't get an answer.

55:11That's true. Why?

55:13>> Yeah.

55:17And the political flag there was

55:21tolerance of a political flag. A very

55:25large political flag.

55:29>> Was there one?

55:30>> No, it's gone. It's gone. It's gone. I

55:33was there today. So I was just trying to

55:35be

55:39>> So if I am to understand this, it sounds

55:42to me like our administration was trying

55:45to balance the the political versus the

55:49non-political, but um I think we need to

55:53address it and probably

55:56get back to you on what the policy would

55:58be.

56:01Um, so that with that in mind, Kelly, if

56:04you could make a point of

56:07putting out to all of us uh in in the

56:10mail a copy of whatever policy we may

56:12have now about flags on and politing

56:16political flags, but regular flags as

56:19well. Um, see if it's addressed. Okay.

56:21>> And maybe there is a um

56:24>> a suggested policy uh by the

56:28Commonwealth of Mass. relative to

56:30housing authorities

56:31>> and how they address this because if

56:34nothing else we like to be consistent.

56:36>> We all actually we don't have flag

56:41attendant at frame of gardens anymore.

56:44Beth Murray um

56:46>> God bless her soul.

56:47>> I know I I know you have recent

56:51information about her. Um she was the

56:55flag lady when it needs to be lowered.

56:58She did.

56:59And she's

57:00>> well she also worked on the garden. She

57:02did a lot of lot of work down there.

57:04>> She was a great president.

57:05>> So now the flags are

57:08lower forward. It doesn't have because

57:10nobody has

57:13>> Okay. We're going to see if we can

57:15address this a little bit better.

57:16>> Thank you.

57:16>> All right. I mean now you brought up the

57:19flags to our attention to see if we can

57:21do something about that.

57:22I'm one of the crazy people who when I

57:24hear the national anthem

57:27tell me.

57:30>> My response to that is there's nothing

57:32crazy about being patriotic. I just

57:34think we need to be fair and consistent.

57:35And I I think a policy that enables

57:39patriotism is fine without politicalism.

57:42And I think we should see what that

57:43policy is.

57:44>> Yes, I agree.

57:47>> But I think Miss Mini made a great point

57:49that I wasn't even aware of. this a

57:50protocol that we need to follow.

57:52>> Yeah. And the one that I forgotten it

57:54can't find in climate weather. So it

57:56have to

57:57>> that that I knew that but so yeah I

58:00think we I won't say we I'm very

58:02supportive of the patriotic flag as long

58:04as we adhere to the protocols of the

58:07flag as well as the protocols to Mr.

58:10Rick's point about you know housing and

58:12all that. I do think that's entirely

58:15separate than political.

58:16>> Yeah. But flag um

58:19hanging and presentation and protocol

58:22needs to be addressed. It needs to be

58:24respectful and I think um we will try to

58:28address that in the form of of a policy.

58:31Okay. If we haven't already, I'll be

58:34interested to see what we get.

58:36>> I haven't seen

58:37>> a lot of policies a lot of policies are

58:39are many years old. You know how old you

58:41know how old this building is. So,

58:43>> and then there's the few that don't

58:45exist yet. Yeah. Yeah.

58:47>> We'll take care of that, too.

58:48>> Yeah. We try not to uh continually

58:50legislate

58:52>> unlike our legislators.

58:54>> So, um anybody else on this?

58:57>> All right. If there is nothing else to

58:59be

59:00>> Mr. Ricker, I would like to make a

59:01motion to adjourn.

59:03>> We have a motion. Do we have a second?

59:05Second.

59:05>> All in favor? Bye.

59:06>> Bye.