2026-09-16 - Planning Board Meeting

0:086 o' I'm going to open the September 16th, 2026 child and clean board meeting.

0:15We will next Energy 261 North Road. Um there

0:27just a field change request. um which just any screening changes.

0:34I think that one is all set, but I would say just take that to the Octo October second. We'll deal with it all together.

0:43Okay. Make a motion to move the next Sera Energy um field change to October 2nd.

0:51Do you have a second? Second. All in favor?

0:56Oh, sorry. Roll call vote because we have on on the phone. Um, I

1:14passes.

1:17We have 100 Worster Roads B waiver requests. Um, applicant is changing use from mixed use to residential in the community.

1:29zoning district. Um, the applicant proposes no exterior changes.

1:54I don't know if you have them or not. Yeah.

2:02That's the plan of the land.

2:10This is Raet Shenoda. He is the owner of the land and the h and he lives in the house there and he has for four years

2:18and I'm his friend and I'm just I'm going to speak for him if I may. Uh he does speak English but he's

2:25I speak for language but directly yeah a little bit maybe Germany but English y the butters on either side our

2:34residential use uh this property has been empty for 16 months he's been trying to find a commercial tenant. He can't because of the Jersey barrier.

2:46We've been told more times than not that's why the old tenant left. Um, we need housing in Charlton. Um, he needs

2:55to rent it. So, he would like to convert it to residential. He lives upstairs with his family on the upper level. Now,

3:05we just need a waiver to change the use.

3:12Now, if you'd like, I can introduce this here. This is uh so I put together it's a site plan review waiver decision and I gave in the packet uh just a procedure

3:21of how we would want to handle one of these. So it looks like we can allow for uh public comment any deliberation on anything in here but the big things that

3:29need to be done is uh findings have to be made. There's six uh findings that the board kind of drafted them together

3:38here uh that all have to be made in the informative in order to grant the waiver. Um, I said this all ahead of you time for review. So, if there's no

3:47objections, somebody can make just a motion to accept the findings. Um, and

3:54then after that, I have just kind of standard conditions that we put on any site plan. Um, or

4:04special permit or in this case, waiverss that are just essentially saying, you know, the basic things, administrative fees have to be paid. uh the decision is

4:12with the land those sorts of things and then I have which I'll introduce here site specific conditions at least four

4:19parking spaces shall be kept available on the existing case areas no parking is allowed on the grass inland or within Worcester road layout uh before building

4:28permit issued the applicant shall provide evidence of the board of health and sewer commission approval as applicable for the increased number of

4:35bedrooms and then construction vehicles dumpsters all material shall be kept um on the existing paved areas of the property. So, relatively standard stuff.

4:46Um and the board of health already said that we're on town sour the building is on town. So,

4:53and and then uh so then the board could then also accept conditions or oppose any impose any additional uh conditions

5:02they so choose. And then after that, the board would take a vote to grant the waiver or deny the waiver. And a denial

5:08of the waiver would not uh they would just have to then come back recycling. It would be denial of the project.

5:20How much land is there?

5:23It's about 34, right? It's about you know where the blue A-frame is.

5:33This is right next to the blue A-frame.

5:36They're on the left and a a a gray or brown ranch is on the right.

5:42But we just changed the room and we add the shower. We don't do anything outside.

5:46I was thinking more of Yeah. Yeah. Just inside. The parking we have? Oh, no. Oh, open space for the tenant.

5:52No, the parking I have like 10 car parking car parking.

5:57Yeah. He he has three children upstairs and he said, you know, if there was

6:03kids, they could come and play in his backyard. That's fenced in. Oh, that's Yeah, that's my concern.

6:12Yeah, I did the fence. I did. Yeah, but you know, it is it is safe.

6:22Thank you. Yeah, if I remember right, isn't there a cottage out back on this one, too?

6:29There there is a building out back and and um there is a permit for an ADU there. Okay. Yes.

6:38It's not the same house. It's separate, right? Totally separate. Yeah, it shows on the picture or what?

6:50Yep. Yeah. Okay. Yeah. They're not attached.

6:53And that's currently rented also or No, that's that's just about to be converted into living space.

7:11I think it was before the ADU and then before February and they said no wait I think they were told to wait

7:18why don't you wait my memor is not great but I do remember that yeah

7:35so there's a parking lot for that additional that additional parking is going to stay or is Oh, yeah. They will not touch anything else.

7:44No, right now there there are nine parking spaces that have lines, but the ones in the back are not even

7:53I did I did everything to rent it, but

8:02so the use will be

8:18The proposed plan is for three bedrooms, but he has been talking and it will probably be turned into two bedrooms

8:27and all has to go back through car anyways, right?

8:30Yep. Still needs all building permits, everything like that.

8:44And you are doing it out. So yeah, just for the safety of the location, everything

8:52this little girl on the bus. So if I if I got the approved for the apartment, I try to put the tree in the front with

9:00like fence between the Yeah, I cover the Yeah, but that it's protecting the house.

9:08That would be part of the building from now. I don't do anything. It's should be business one. See, but if it's apartment, I have to do clean.

9:19Anybody else have questions, comments? I think that whenever we go to a greater use, I I'm

9:27worry more, but it's actually going to be less less use.

9:39Um, so I'm not again there's like no drainage, no no nothing outside.

9:48Why go through sight plan?

9:50It has no shower. So I want to add shower and I want to add kitchen outside never and never

9:58sits in that's yeah it's already has four bedroom now I used two bedroom shower and the kitchen that's it

10:06you're talking of drainage on the outside that's that's really what we're looking at in the change of use if

10:13it get more use we would worry more but it'll get less traffic less use

10:18um less water use less everything. So, anybody questions or can we have a

10:29motion to that we just vote on it and you want to vote to uh accept the findings. Um and then you want to after

10:36that make a motion to accept the conditions. I have one stipulation about that. I want to strike one of these

10:44conditions for this um application condition nine that would essentially prevent doing any changes after the fact

10:53such as if you wanted to add green space or fence or something like that.

10:58So that's on uh that's just a procedure document. This is the or the one right below it should have a copy don't

11:07I have actually on the screen here might just be easier to show it there. Um so it's the waiver of cycle interview is granted only for the change in use or

11:14occupancy described in the application is expressly conditioned on board's finding that no substantial construction or improvement on the cycle will occur.

11:22Um I want to just modify that to remove this section here. Um

11:29so for any substantial construction or site improvement is undertaken or use changes in a manner uh that would affect

11:37or actually I don't want to sorry just this section here substantial construction site plan improvement

11:45or just so that way if it's becoming strictly residential it would still allow them to

11:52improve property without voiding the uh underlying um waiver.

12:00So my recommendation would be accept the findings uh accept the conditions as modified and then take

12:08these both to uh three three questions.

12:19So what are you changing um through the chair? I'd like to ask um what's being changed. Uh it was the language on

12:27section N that would say any changes to the uh to the site. Um I don't think we have this

12:36I don't think I might have included that in your packet here.

12:41We do have it yeah on the screen here for everybody. So I now have the new condition. Uh one of you should have that document. If you look at nine, it

12:49now reads, "The waiver of the site plan review is granted only for the change in use for occupancy described in the application expressly conditions binding

12:57that no substantial construction or improvement on the site uh occur. If the use changes in a manner that would

13:04affect existing grading, vehicular or pedestrian circulation patterns, parking demand, this waiver shall be void and the application for the site plan under

13:13200-7.1D shall be required. Uh so the only modification there is it's allowing him

13:20to be able to make uh site changes to his property. Um essentially that wouldn't uh impact.

13:29Y scroll on the waiverss just a little

13:36bit. I want to look at go through each of these if the board

13:44likes. That's uh not a typical you can go through with

13:51the standard conditions. All work shall be performed in substantial conformance with the approved plan.

13:56I think I think we're okay with at least I'm okay with the standard conditions.

14:03The other one was just these three here.

14:07Yep. Just making sure that for be available um just making sure that they get any board of health or super commission approval

14:14needed and then Everything from the construction all

14:24okay so you need three votes sorry so the binding vote the

14:32conditionally

14:44um Make a motion that we give over the findings from the the point of records

14:50for 100 I'm sorry 100 second

14:58sorry oh I'm sorry call vote um Don Clay I

15:06said I have to go back I should we do the waiver First remove the conditions first.

15:19Make a motion to approve the the change in use with the conditions documented

15:31little. Do you have a question?

15:42Just a second.

15:43Okay. Um Don Clay I Bob Bar.

15:48I motion passes.

15:54And a um I'm make a motion that we approve the waiver request for the CB zoning

16:03district to allow residential mixed use. You have a second.

16:11I bound I second the motion. Roll call vote.

16:15Don Clay I Bob I passion passes.

16:27Okay that's it. Thank you. Thank you. You're all set. Good luck. Absolutely. Absolutely.

16:35Thank you. You're welcome. You're welcome.

16:39You got two big I see one. No, that's all right. One more big one.

16:47Is there another um point there? There we go. You want to keep one for record? You want to keep one each?

16:54We just keep one for Yeah. One for one and one. Perfect. Thank you.

17:08Thank you.

17:15We have the continued public hearing on the Leansky 123 Whistler Road on 20.

17:39Good mom.

18:03Madam Chair, Kevin Quinn of Quinn Engineering on behalf of the applicant.

18:07Robert Mansky's with me tonight. He's again promised he will speak only once spoken to my fingers crossed.

18:14Should we take money?

18:17Putting the rules of the road down before we go too far.

18:21Um, we were in front of the board September 2nd. There was some issues with uh storm water. We resubmitted plans that um amend or resolve the

18:30concerns that Graves engineering had. Um Graves did submit back to you in your letter a favorable finding. He he

18:37concurs with that that design. Um we also submitted a a lighting plan photometric plan which basically shows

18:45that on the perimeter of the site the lighting is no higher intensity than 4/10 of a foot can. And that's kind of

18:52the agreed upon reasonable limit, not a not light spill that's offensive to to people on joint properties. Again,

19:00Graves has weighed in on that to you as well. Um Dylan drafted up a a um a draft

19:07decision submitted. Um we went through it. It's pretty favorable to us. We have comment on one of the conditions though

19:15that we're going to ask the board to look at. Condition 13 requires that the applicant secure variance for the driveway separations. The board may

19:24remember recall that the bylaw says that driveways can be no closer than 50 ft apart. This one is less than that. Um in

19:31the the draft condition says that we've got to secure a variance for that. Um my submission to the board, I would submit

19:38to the board that um the it it is in fact a zoning issue. So it goes to that

19:46board but the first level of review would be the building inspector. We would ask the board direct us to seek

19:53the building inspector's um rendering of how he feels about that. Um building inspector is a first level code

20:00enforcement and if he's he's able to issue that finding that would be it.

20:06Now, if he says if he if he feels that that we don't comply, the plan doesn't comply, then we seek the verance. So, I

20:15I would suggest the board maybe draft that condition in a way that allows us to a um submit this for a ren for an

20:23opinion by the building inspector and if his fa if his findings is unfavorable, then we would seek the guidance.

20:32either does it.

20:34I No, if I may, if I may, it doesn't look very is. Yeah, it's a

20:40there's an existing driveway there and we feel that it's a pre-existing non-conformance that we shouldn't need

20:47to seek relief for. Um, that's supported by the fact that DOT put a curb cut and

20:54roundings to to service that driveway where it's shown. We did submit to the board photos, but in fact it's a zoning issue.

21:04So the plane board really doesn't you can't even w if a waiver were appropriate plane board really shouldn't do that. It needs to go through the

21:13building inspector and if necessary the board of appeals. So can can the um building inspector zoning inspector I'm

21:21not sure he can wave that but that's only but he can give the opinion that yeah it's a pre-existing non-conformance but you'd still have to go before they

21:30change it's just being a change of use now is with well my opinion my opinion would be I'm an engineer not a lawyer but my opinion

21:37would be that that an existing driveway is existing if it doesn't comply it was probably created before that bylaw existed So, it was a driveway for what?

21:48A driveway to a a farm stand that existed on the property years ago. I think the the name of the owner was T-Berry, which um we we'll be able to

21:57submit this to the to the building inspector. I think I do think the building inspector has the um responsibility and authority to look at

22:04away that and if he feels it's a pre-existing non-conformance that that he has the ability to make that call. And if he doesn't if he

22:13doesn't agree with us if he doesn't agree with us then we seek the variance.

22:19Does that I mean I would ask Dylan to Yeah. Uh I mean I can I can weigh in two. One with uh you this has been sent

22:27to the building commissioner for comments. The building commissioner has no objections with this condition. Um

22:35secondly and just to to speak on pre-existing nonconforming pre-existing non-conforming in state law generally pertains uh overwhelmingly for

22:44protections for single family and two family columns. That's where you can get modifications generally also through a

22:51finding from the zoning board of appeals even those aren't uh granted administratively

22:58to get to be able to maintain or sometimes intensify uh nonconformities.

23:05But for business uses, um, if you have pre-existing non-conforming unzoning changes and nothing is changing, you get

23:14a continued use. But the driveway that hasn't been used for a business purpose like that, if the site wasn't changing,

23:23I would say yes, you you get to maintain that nonconformity, but given the extent of the change of the site here,

23:32pre-existing nonconforming wouldn't cover this driveway. This has gone to both the building inspector, our peer reviewer, uh, and myself, and we're all

23:40in concurrence that this will require a variance from the ZBA.

23:43Has has has the building commissioner actually waiting on that though?

23:46Uh, he has reviewed this. I've spoken to it. I don't have it in writing. Uh, it would be something that if you would request that this be waved,

23:54my recommendation, my only request to the board would be that you allow us to explore this with the building commission. If if he if he

24:01feels that that's the build pre-existing non-conformance doesn't apply either, then he can deny us and we appeal. I

24:08don't even think I can go before the board of appeals without a denial from the building inspector. I think I have to get a denial from anyone.

24:18You can get you can apply for the variance from the zoning board of appeals. However you want to want to do that.

24:23Again, of all the experience I've had and all of the people that I've ever talked to, the zoning board of appeals, you have to have a refusal. And with the

24:33refusal, then you're able to go to that board and say, "We need relief." And that's how I've always experienced that.

24:41And I'll tell you, you know, and again, the board's going to do what they want, what what they feel feel they need to

24:48do, but there uh if if I go back to 159 Worester Road, uh this is this is where

24:58the the the dentist is. My next door neighbor, our our our driveways a butt.

25:07How do we how do we get 50 ft between?

25:09We can't get 50t place. So, we're we're in violation. I believe the veterinarian property that

25:17uh my family owns, I don't think we got 50 ft uh from our property line with with with that uh driveway next to our a

25:27neighbor. I mean, the thing is it's driveway to driveway, not driveway to to neighbor.

25:33Well, this is and again, we I've got uh it's close. It's close. I'd have to measure it. It goes on and on and on. If

25:40if I may, I don't want to interrupt my client when he's on a roll, but no.

25:46Um this is important to us for a couple of reasons. For one, um my client does have a tenant that he's hoping to get

25:52this building in place for before he loses his tenant. And if we're delayed too long, he risk losing his tenant.

25:59That's our problem. That's not the board's problem. But that's why we're a little bit urgent about this. Secondly, if if we're compelled to redesign the

26:07driveway, our the plan, which we we think is pretty functional, is is it turns the plan inside. I think I talked

26:15to the board about this the last time the phone that it does kind of throw the whole plan out, which is again that's our problem. That's our issue, but

26:24that's why we're being a little bit persistent about this. That's our our reason for being I think that

26:31actually make them go against a variet variance anyways. So yes, because because he's going to want to tick all the boxes,

26:41this ultimately, if I can, this really is kind of the the compromise that I've put together in order to get this passed

26:48today that if you folks would look to have this removed based on your belief that the the building commissioner would

26:56be okay with this removal, then my recommendation to the board would be continuance to be able to get that in writing from the building commissioner

27:03before we could have this here today, which I believe you were going to be overwhelmingly in front of the zoning board of appeals seeking a variance. It could.

27:11And you would not need a denial from the building commissioner. You would if you had a denial from the building commissioner, then you could appeal that to the zoning board of appeals. season

27:20of variance or a special permit which the zoning board of appeals has the ability to grant for those to be honest

27:28respectfully to the board I think it's perfectly fine to amend a condition to say resolve this issue with the building

27:35commissioner and or the or seek a variance as necessary I don't think it needs to delay the process um to to

27:44include that language it's just a saying yeah go to the building commissioner if he says this is

27:51a pre-existing non-conformance then we have a a green light my opinion

28:01if I may mad chairman is this uh is this going to be a new standard of the planning board on an

28:09approval letter to be 21 pages long 21 pages long it's got a lot of information in here

28:16just in case it's how our planning director chooses to it's over. Why we can't some of you do

28:23do that? I know didn't work out, did it? No.

28:28This is my first time up at that. I could understand it. We've had other projects we've gone through and the thing is is this seems just way out

28:37there and it's fitting the the mode of Massachusetts overregulating. That's what you're doing. Okay. Thank you.

28:44Okay.

28:47But So if we approve it as is and obviously this is and now it kind of goes into

28:54Kurt's Yeah, I think we really need to get Kurt's and so but recommendation on that.

29:00Is Kurt gonna he's what is he going to say? No, you don't have to do it. Like I don't think he'll I can't imagine him doing that.

29:11No. Again, he reviewed this. I didn't specifically request him to comment on this exactly. I request general comment

29:20to which he provided. I can provide one in here. For example, he has uh a con recommended condition 16 uh H

29:30which is one that I want to highlight for you folks. Kurt wanted to have site plan updated to show four required electric vehicle ready parking places.

29:39Massachusetts Energy Code section C405.13.C.

29:45So Kurt has read this document. Uh he is I've directed his attention directly to that condition. I didn't specifically request that he write a brief for the

29:53board on what his opinion is on the matter. Uh I can relay my conversation

30:00which is that he is okay with that condition. My understanding is that is the leap that he will be before the zoning board of appeals requesting a

30:08variance. Um if the board would like a written statement from Kirk with an opinion on that condition, we can get

30:17that but it required a continuence for to our October meeting to get that together.

30:23So do you want this do you want this approved? I had talked to my clients from lately October 21st probably October.

30:35Oh, I know that. I know. No, no, just accept it as it is. Well, I appreciate my gone.

30:42No, my tenants gone.

30:44I was just telling have I, you know, without a without a firm decision to go forward, uh, my

30:53tent's gone. I already got got the letter to where I had spoken to them two weeks ago and

31:01said, "Look, we we think we're in pretty good shape because we we started this back in June and I

31:09thought maybe we would have the building up and also turn it over to them by the end of December." Uh, obviously that's

31:16that's not going to happen. The thing is a special a variance is going to take a minimum of 60 to 75 days. Then after it

31:25gets approved, we've got another what 20 days for appeal just like today. So if this get approved today, we really

31:33couldn't get a building permit for another 20 days because you got to have 21 days because you you've got to have

31:40that uh appeal period expired for the clerk to say no one is appealed and now you can go forward. But look, you know,

31:49you you would think from a tax base point of view, the Lammanskies are coming in here as they have done before,

31:56produce properties that turn taxes over to the town of childhood. This new building would be

32:02about 13 to 14,000 a year non-stop. I mean, try to get an annuity for yourself that's going to create that kind of

32:10amount of money. Uh, it's just, you know, the town is going to lose out on this and I think it's really too too

32:19bad. But you you put put me in a situation to where I've got no other choice but to say no, we've got to stop.

32:2821 pages, Dylan, it's insane. Actually, Rob, I have to defend Dylan.

32:33We've been in so many lawsuits. I like the fact that all the information is there there and up front might come down.

32:41I thought it was I I I don't necessarily disagree after reading multiple group briefs in my lifetime because that's what I felt I was reading.

32:50Okay. But uh and the thing is so we can approve this just the the way

32:56it's written. Um we can we can change um I mean Kurt can modify Kurt can decide

33:04or or and and then or we could continue it till the next meeting to have Kurt weigh in on it. So there's three choices.

33:15I'm probably not inclined to the choice of improving it and let let Kurt do do his job.

33:20And and I I also I I believe so Kurt doesn't read he doesn't skip around when he reads. He's he's a detail reader if

33:27you feel experienced his his um uh but but I know too he's not going to let he's going to he's going to have you go to work

33:36because it's a change in use. It doesn't meet our zoning. He can't make that call himself.

33:40It's a change in some community business. Oh, excuse me. Highway.

33:44It's been an empty lot for 20 30 years now.

33:47The question is do do we want to do we want to hold out and to get Kurt's opinion or accept the decision as it's as it's written? accept the decision as it's

33:56written based on on on approval. I I got no problem with that because then that gives us the ability of rolling the dice

34:03and and ma making uh our our I don't want to call it a but making

34:10position if you folks want to add a modification

34:21you you very well can it is within your perview to do so. I again don't recommend doing so. Uh I have had this discussion both with our peer reviewer

34:29and with Kurt about this condition specifically. Uh I tried everything I could to see if there is a waiver provision in here. Is there something I

34:38can do with pre-existing non-conforming and I did my due diligence to try to avoid the need for variance because when I look at it I agree with you. I think

34:47it's where why would you need to move it? It was already there. I think it's fine, but as the conversations I have

34:55had in the past about this sort of thing, this is coming from checking the box on our side. That's what it is. It's checking.

35:01We make our own rules as the the town.

35:05The biggest stipulations that we follow our own rules once we've made them. Our rules are relatively clear about this.

35:12This is something that need to be granted from the zoning board of appeals. If you put a condition in here

35:18where now Kurt has to have a a two-hour browbeating session to say no, go to the the zoning board.

35:27You certainly can.

35:28What what my client is saying is we we'll we'll let that go. We'll we'll live with the decision as as drafted.

35:36We'll seek the verdict. Close the public hearing.

35:40Make a motion to close the public hearing for 23. Is there anybody just anybody here? Any other comments from the audience?

35:47Sure. And I have I do have one other thing that I would like that the board's opinion that I feel I I kept it in here as a bit of a placeholder, but I feel

35:55like it may be a little bit over overly bureaucratic. Um I kind of highlighted it. It's

36:03everything's supposed to match the owner. the the applicant or we're supposed to have some forms of saying that uh the applicant is representing

36:13the owner executive owner is Kathleen Lammansky and we have Robert Lammansky.

36:18Is the board okay waving those strict requirements there? That's fine. I can do that all administratively so I don't need to get records of deeds and things like that.

36:27Yeah.

36:28Okay. So, the the four uh electric vehicle ready spots, is that a building code?

36:35Correct. That is just how many parking spots are there already? I thought it was just for some 40.

36:43Is that a stretch code or is that a building code? That's built.

36:46That's just I think that means they need to be prepped but not actually wired. Correct. That's my understanding.

36:51That just means they've put the conduits in for they don't have to wire at at this time. just and it's just showing I believe he has update to show the four required

36:59electrical vehicles that parking place and then just combine that's fine.

37:07I I have to if if I'm sorry if if you if you built me a two pack garage at home nowadays and you say I've got electric

37:16cars and we're going to put put the humans in there. I again just spent three days with my electrician. It's a

37:23it need a 400 amp service. 200 amp service won't do it. And the thing is it's like now seven or eight grand

37:31to do do that. It's it's again stretch coat's got to go away.

37:36Next town argument for me again next town meeting.

37:39Well, I can can't do anything about that. Rob, I know, but I'm just I'm trying to gain votes.

37:46Okay. I make a motion we close the public hearing list. I second the motion. Roll call vote.

37:54Clay I Okay.

38:03Any other anything else you see here that may need to be modified?

38:12Um I've got no problem with the name change. I think business has businesses.

38:22That is okay too.

38:25As far as I'm concerned, I think I had a condition in here. I didn't take note of it. It's saying that everything has to be rectified. I'll just straight that

38:33one. Um, so you don't have to do all of that.

38:56One more thing I wanted to to highlight is to make sure I have the uh hours for solid waste collection as

39:06not between 9:00 p.m. and 7 a.m. Is that okay with you folks? You need that not between not a night.

39:15It was uh from Graves Engineering. Uh this is represented by the African engineer. Solid waste shall be stored in wheeled containers that are rolled out

39:24of the enclosure for collection. Return properly afterwards. Collection shall be scheduled outside of business hours when the parking lot is substantially vacant and not between 900 p.m. and 7 a.m.

39:35That's a condition I highlighted here because I want to make sure that it's not a big deal out here. We've got property in AI and the thing is is just

39:44just today Cassella hasn't picked up in three weeks because and this is on Route 12 in

39:51Auburn which is which is a mile and a half away from Cassell. It's where they have 40 trucks that pull out of there every day and again it's a beauty salon

40:00and the the parking lot's full by 9 9:30 and the driver comes and says well I can't get in there. He keeps on going.

40:06In the meantime, you know it's it looks like a Christmas all decorated with all this trash. Um, so I I begging them to

40:15say, you know, pick it up, you know, in, you know, in A.M.

40:19But, um, anyways, it was just So, this is a standard business condition that we've had.

40:29I think I think the board has always had that, haven't they?

40:33Yeah. Yeah. We're not those hours are okay that that nothing between 9 and 7. I don't know if they come early or if they get there at like

40:406. I don't want to bar something like that.

40:44We don't have We have the nearest house is 1,000 ft away from the So even if they came at 5:00 a.m., no one would say anything. That's my point.

40:53Gotcha. Thank you.

40:57Do we have um make a motion to approve the uh site

41:04plan um as written with the conditions in the document um for 123 West Road.

41:15Second. Second the motion. Roll call vote. play.

41:31There's three motion approved. All set. Thank you.

41:44Thank you. I know.

41:57Definitely a lot. Yes, I am trick myself.

42:00I don't want I'll catch you, but I don't want you to fall. Yeah. Good luck.

42:09Have a good night. Thank you.

42:12We have um the continued public hearing for the new company site plan um to install an eligible

42:21substation to provide power.

42:28Excuse me. So I have a hard time hearing you. You mind if I sit here? No problem.

42:35That helps me.

42:45You can get you an application and a name tag too.

42:49My hearing sure you have

43:00a couple uh documents too I think. Um not sure if they're necessarily need to be looked at but uh at least there are

43:08two These are the um the latest and greatest uh that were submitted to the peer reviewer today.

43:15Yep. They were just submitted today that they reviewed.

43:17They were submitted today, but the uh a substantial amount of the uh peer

43:24review comments had been satisfactorily addressed. They're just kind of the last minute changes.

43:28A couple more uh two cops.

43:34This is the This is for the sub station, not the This is for the sub station, not 35 North Street.

43:4345.

44:07Is that a matter? Oh, yeah.

44:11I wasn't sure if I missed everybody just wait till I um go ahead.

44:20Um so my name is Jar Duket from law firm Dwey. I'm here tonight on behalf of Newman Power Company. I'm joined by several representatives of uh Miller

44:29Power Company as well as the civil engineer for the project. Um we did present just as a refresher uh we did

44:36present uh to this board back in July uh on this project um for a the construction of a permanent substation

44:44on this site. Uh back in 2023, we had gotten a temporary substation permitted for this. So now the intention is to

44:52build a a a more permanent substation and then once that is built out the temporary substation will be uh retired

44:59and removed. Um prior to the last meeting that we had in July, the first round of peer review

45:07comments came in. Uh so we weren't able to really address them at the meeting.

45:12So we just talked at a high level about the project scope which I can certainly go through again if the board would like. Um

45:21I would prefer to just discuss what's happened since. Um just I mean I'm happy with just the update of the new the new items over the course.

45:28Great. So so we had gotten a peerreview memo. It was about 34 um items to be addressed. A substantial amount of them

45:36have been satisfactorily addressed. Um, and with the latest set that was just submitted today, we anticipate that would be a full I mean substitute pe

45:46reviewer review, but we don't anticipate really any any issues. Uh, there were two comments uh that we might want um

45:54we're happy to talk more about if the board is interested as to um what those remaining

46:02items are. But by and large, um, Dylan Maxfield circulated a draft decision to,

46:08um, Curtis Mascus, the peer reviewer, and knowing the power company, and together we've worked on a a set of conditions of approval for this project

46:17that we're all on board with. Um included included in those conditions of approval um is a a catchall that uh we

46:26will submit um any plan revisions that is required by the peer reviewer subject to the reasonable if we can't comply

46:34with something subject to the reasonable um interpretation of the peer reviewer.

46:38So there is a catchall there as well as if there are any field changes that'll be back before uh this board um either

46:46administratively or for for a full hearing if you see fit. So I think in terms of any remaining review comments

46:54uh the board still certainly has um perview over those even if it were to grant an approval today with those conditions as written.

47:03Um that is quite by and large what we have uh done since the last meeting. The the substation continues to be a

47:10significant distance even further than where the temporary substation is currently located from the road. Um we had heard from the abuters last time

47:19that um natural grid's been a great neighbor which I'm just echoing um but um in that they there's no real

47:27disruption to um where they are. We did propose some landscaping um on their property to their satisfaction and the

47:35phase 2 project for the temporary substation has been issued a completion letter by the peer reviewer. Um I think

47:42that is all of the updates I have but we're happy to answer any specific questions the board.

47:49One thing I just want to point out to the board, uh, everywhere you see in orange, these are the kind of latest rounds of revision based on the

47:57applicant's feedback that I incorporated, but I then just haven't been able to touch base with on the applicant to get their feedback on it if

48:05they're okay with it. The board's okay with it. So, um, that's just what that highlighting is.

48:14Um I guess at a high level conditions one through 14 are general conditions.

48:19They're applicable to I think moving forward most projects that require site plan and special permits. The um ones

48:27that are specific to our project start at additional conditions section B or 15 through 29. So we have 14 conditions of approval there.

48:38The board want to focus their attention on the chair. Remind me what's being done with the old substation. Is that going to be decommissioned and moved or?

48:48So it will be decommissioned and removed. I believe you said 2028 is that current timeline for that is up and running.

48:57Correct. Property restored or is the pad still?

49:05Uh the the the pad's going to rem there's no restoration of the temporary substation. That's compensated. Um there

49:14may be future uses there, but if there are future uses of that, we'll come back before. So,

49:21but for now, we're just taking it

50:03Just a quick question for you folks. Do you have any objections to the important comments that I incorporated since uh we last communicated?

50:16Primarily the fire department comments.

50:18Um, we did not have any issues with the uh fire department um issues, but I will

50:25let them see it in case they haven't standard still

50:35standard from Yeah. Yeah. There's a standard for this type of a project, but you would just shut every project.

51:03Do you need questions from the board?

51:11I just have a comment. Um, it was interesting that over a hundred people watched the last meeting because I think

51:18of some of these projects they were interested in. And I want residents to understand this isn't just for Amazon.

51:25It's for future growth. And I keep hearing conservation, they say it's for Amazon, but like I clarified at one

51:33meeting, it's what's coming down the road. It's twice as big. So, the residents aren't shocked. Thank you.

51:44Probably.

51:48Do we have any comments from

52:01So, do we want to close the public hearing?

52:06Um, sure. I'll make a motion we close the public hearing for 29 road station.

52:14I second motion. Lady, are you on here? I am here. Okay, perfect.

52:22Um, so we need to have a roll call vote or Sure. Don, play any

52:34motion passes. Um, we get a roll call.

52:38Um, and a motion to

52:44um any other questions on the board or it's all fine. Um, what what are the

52:51outstanding issues right now with with um I think the big ones were just updates to have things reflected on the plans uh

53:00accurately. um was really most of them when I kind of went through it. There was several of those. I think there was a

53:08recommendation the applicant I was prime of with that to just except one condition was when we put it as 15 that just says rectify all the um everything

53:18that was in peer review too which really had a lot of the outstanding um things that need to be shown the plan

53:26forms to be submitted so on and so forth. Um something else on

53:35Should we change peer review to get the current and future peer reviews and just in case a third one is required by some

53:45other change or something final review final care review or something like that so we do have uh yeah to the satisfaction of the planning order it's

53:53designated um and I can change this view to all in Number two is the GI Per review.

54:04That's just Yeah, I think GI review is fine or any subsequent language review.

54:22Excellent. Uh identified in Ger.

54:38Okay. Um, I'll make a motion to approve the special permit and site plan approval. Do we need to do two separate special permit and then site plan or just give?

54:47Yes. And I would also make one to just accept the findings. So, be three total.

54:53Okay. Make a motion to accept the findings as documented in the planning director's documentation.

55:02Second roll call. Bob Ionard.

55:15Make a motion to approve this special permit request for New England Power Company and 39

55:23Snake Hill Road for uh power station.

55:30I second the motion. Roll call. I motion passes.

55:40And I make a motion for site plan approval for 29 Snake Hill Road with all the conditions documented in the planning director's report.

55:51I second the motion. Roll call. Don Clay.

55:55I passes. Thank you guys. Thank you. Can't wait to see that extra power.

56:20Thank you.

56:28You don't have to drive it. You don't want

56:35We have the contin approval to remove the mini golf

56:42structure and constru

56:55any major changes to plan other than uh so we have one unfortunate not sure if you heard of All right.

57:09Very tough right there dealing with that now. Um, unfortunately we speak with Dylan trying to get everything figured out. Uh, trying to work with get a new

57:16engineer to finalize everything. Um, I know that Craig was mentioned something about the the water retention. So there

57:23I no idea what the issue was. We have a new guys going to be looking into it.

57:28So we talked to Dylan to come today and kind of if you guys have anything you want to talk about or comments that we need to work on outside of that.

57:35From what I remember, I think you you had additional parking spaces that we had originally requested.

57:40I I think those ended up beyond there. I think opening was the the the providing

57:48a list of of uses. So, we were going to approve with your list of uses. So, later on if you kind of changed it a

57:55little bit or whatever, you wouldn't have to come back I know we're wonderful, but um you know

58:04um that you guys it makes sense. So I don't know if they kind of did that research and uh we went over the list together. I'm

58:12just not sure where that stands as far as what you guys want to approve or not approve.

58:16Yeah. So it looks like just given what the parking is, I think you guys were at 23 on kind of the last submitted plans,

58:23but 25 is the requirement for just that general business use. would be granting

58:29a waiver for parking. And I think if we were trying to get the approval tonight, as I was trying to get everything

58:38settled with this, going through the graves, realizing it was storm water, it was an outstanding issue, which just really isn't something that the board

58:45could want to wave. Uh that my understanding would probably be just keeping as a blanket use. The

58:52primary use would be uh kind of like a tradesman uh central hub like you know base of

59:01operations for you know somebody doing electricianing or plumbing or something where there's not a lot of traffic coming there and going out that that can

59:08be blanket approval where kind of going beyond that would be a little bit more difficult but if you folks are going to be getting

59:16or not approving tonight you're getting the engineer my recommendation would be is install storm water really see what you can do with parking ask your

59:24engineer on that if you don't want to expand It's just not feasible to expand beyond what is have

59:31or limit it to specific uses like you feel where you know if it's something the board approves

59:39um and you decide to open up an auto shop there at some point that would not be allowed as long as it's not in that those conditions. So come back for a variance.

59:48You'd have to come back for a variance and that which would change parking which would change it. So where it's where it's kind of construction, it's not customer oriented type of business.

59:56I think I'm okay with a parking that's contractor.

1:00:02So it's just you got to kind of list out what businesses could go in there. We'll include those businesses and if anything ever changes, you'd have to come before.

1:00:11So I mean you could change.

1:00:13We just need to see what the business fits. So you just drop a little list would go in there.

1:00:19you'd end up with um the question how how definitive are the definitions in the use table not vary. Um and that

1:00:27could be something that we would condition of this type of use limited that you know each bay would be only moved to three parking spaces meaning no

1:00:36type of customerf facing business really go in there unless again you were to add more parking to be able to handle that.

1:00:44Um, so we would do exclusions versus more exclusions than like my worry is that

1:00:52people will be changing oil and there won't be the right drainage and you know so I want them not not to be an auto

1:01:01shop where you're um could potentially cause enval anyway. So

1:01:11we always do anything you know condition that it's still any of these types of uses would still need review from the building commissioner and reviewed from

1:01:19any relevant forest board of health or whoever it might be. Um the state of what changed the water retention was the

1:01:26fire department wanted to get their their mediumsiz apparatus around the building. So we had to pull the building forward and that changed like the whole entire

1:01:34original plan. So that's why everything and then unfortunately this happened. So we can't explain.

1:01:39Okay. So, how much time do you think you're going to need to if we continue this to middle of October or you want the first meeting of October?

1:01:47Why don't we do the middle of October and we'll keep in touch with Dylan and hopefully get everything squared away.

1:01:52We have another engineer looking at stuff now. Hopefully get an answer the next day or two. Um, our previous engineer son-in-law just to get us all

1:01:59the files and everything. So, we're just trying to get through all that now.

1:02:02Unfortunately, that Okay. Um, so you know what you have to do. know what we have to do. Um, make

1:02:10a motion to continue the public hearing for Jesse Jesse Properties to October 21st.

1:02:20As far as conservation, will that automatically get extended? Are we up there?

1:02:23You probably have to just send a message to conservation, ask them to continue.

1:02:29They can do that without they will need to continue to the motion.

1:02:38Second that motion. Clay Iard.

1:02:46I thank you so much. Good luck. Thank you.

1:02:53You'll be fine. You'll be fine. Just a little delay.

1:03:06Property. Yeah, for you.

1:03:14This is You have to open the public.

1:03:25This is a new public hearing. This is a new public hearing. New public hearing.

1:03:46I might have given them all here. Sorry.

1:03:51Okay, you can look on with this. Oh, I can Yeah.

1:04:07Oh yeah, sorry. It's doublesided 35.

1:04:12Don't worry. The one that went like flipping it up.

1:04:27Right. Sorry.

1:04:32Um, pursuant to MDL chapter 48 section 5

1:04:38hearing on Wednesday, 2026 in the 21 office um

1:04:50for a site plan approval to buy and construct nine duplexes. The property is located at 35 North Main Street. Um,

1:04:59um, mass on 507, assess map 35, block C, parcel 9, set property, um, village district.

1:05:11All right. Well, I hope you didn't miss me too much. Um, Joe Duket again, uh, more bad here on behalf of GM Properties

1:05:18LLC, and I'm here tonight with the civil engineer for the project, James Spectro.

1:05:22Um, the board is familiar with this property. uh it's been before you for for some time now. Um this is the latest

1:05:29iteration of that of this project. We um so just at a very high level we we had previously proposed uh when well prior

1:05:38to our engagement there was a larger multifamily uh development project that was proposed. Um, we came aboard and it

1:05:46was reduced to a townhouse development with 33 uh, dwelling units and um, we heard your concerns about density and

1:05:55water and sewer commission's concerns about capacity and we've come up with what we hope to be um, for a lack of a

1:06:02better term, the final solution of um, this project um, which is a nine duplex.

1:06:08So it's nine individual lots each with a duplex on it. Um all um the property

1:06:15itself is uh six over 6 acres of land but there's a substantial portion of it is wetlands and what we think is a

1:06:22primary driver for this and benefit of this is the two private roads that were previously in in the prior iteration of the project are completely eliminated.

1:06:32So there's substantially less impervious surface that's going in here. Um it is um again two duplex or a duplex on each

1:06:41lot in each of them with their own individual driveways and um with the exception of lot 8 their own private garage. Lot 8 has a little bit of sight

1:06:50constraints. So there's just two exterior parking lots for lot eight for those residents. But every every other

1:06:57duplex will have um will will look exactly as it's shown on the plans that

1:07:03you see before you. Um, you know, we're we did get the peerreview comments um recently. Um,

1:07:12most of them are just we don't really see much of an issue with them. We'll we'll update the plans and everything.

1:07:18So, this is more to garner feedback from the board in terms of like what you think about this project. Um, we think

1:07:25that, you know, this is a a great project. It's a difficult site to work with, but we've we've really tried to be creative with this. Um, we got water and

1:07:34sewer commission approval for connections for lots one through seven and lots eight and nine will have their own septic. Um,

1:07:44and I'm trying to think what else is there. Um, I I'll turn it over to James who's certainly got more hands-on

1:07:52knowledge with the sight specific civil conditions at this point. Um, James Tedra from Expedited Engineering here

1:07:59representing GM Properties LLC. uh everything that uh that Joe just said in uh in introducing the project and

1:08:07contrasting it to the previous version is correct. Um I would just note um as

1:08:14uh as as Joe said uh the sewer commission uh voted to accept uh sewer

1:08:22discharges from these lots. They would all have an individual connection out to the street. Uh as he noted these two on

1:08:31El Stevens Road would have septic systems in the back. Um on this plan you have the same wetland boundary as uh

1:08:39previously. We um heard from the commission at as we were going away from the other project

1:08:48and uh that what they wanted and as much as possible we've given them that uh

1:08:54their guideline of staying 25 ft at least off the wetlands. That's I think is done on all of lots one through seven. If you're looking at the plan,

1:09:03you see the wetland line, you see a 15 foot offset and a 25 foot offset and all the proposed work on one through seven

1:09:11uh stays out of even the 25 ft uh uh no disturb zone that the commission would like.

1:09:18uh on eight uh because of uh some space restriction and getting flows out to the septic systems, we are as close as no

1:09:27closer than 15 except for a couple of uh leeching trenches which are just to uh gain pollutant removal. Um uh I would

1:09:35note that uh again if you're looking at the plan you see the red lines that's riverfront area based on uh this is

1:09:44still considered perennial screen uh from uh um the property south of El Stevens and south. So you have 100 and

1:09:52200 foot out uh riverfront area boundaries there. We're in compliance with what is allowed uh on there. you

1:10:00allow up to 5,000 square feet of alteration where it doesn't count uh specifically drainage infrastructure

1:10:06like right there. Um, I would just note that the way

1:10:13all these lots on uh on North Main Street are going to work is that you have the duplex, you have the two units,

1:10:21you have a driveway coming into the side of it and it's coming down to a lower level uh in each case. And we're showing in

1:10:30addition to uh garage spaces, three parking spaces outside uh of every one

1:10:36of these units. And the way the drainage is working here is that essentially uh

1:10:43lots are sort of paired up. Uh we would have a curbing on the edge of the parking areas on these. You have a catch

1:10:51basin here picking up all the runoff on this parking area. You have catch basin here picking up all the runoff on this area. They both go to a drain in hole, a

1:11:00CDS storm water filter unit, then in ground detention, and you have an outlet. And that's the way these all work is that they're there pairs of these working together.

1:11:10These two lots work together. Um, these two lots work together. Um and I

1:11:18would just note um otherwise uh just in regard to water service again there's water service on both of these streets

1:11:26uh right now that'll serve each of these these lots. Um I would just also just

1:11:34parathetically as uh Joe said we received the uh peerreview comments from Graves Engineering. We went through

1:11:42those uh uh Joe and uh his fellow attorney Josh and I. Uh and uh I would just note that the very first one in

1:11:50regard to uh we didn't show enough frontage on lot 9 has been fixed and I think there was one other one that we

1:11:59disagreed with as an interpretation, but we'll work that out with uh the folks at Graves. Uh most of the others were I I'd

1:12:06say sort of clarification items. Like he said, "Well, you didn't make it clear enough whether this is going to be a curved uh a curb at the edge of that

1:12:15parking area or not." And he's right going back and looking at it, but we will address those. And part of what we

1:12:23want to do here is if there are specific things that the board sees, you know, we'd like you to change this, alter

1:12:30this, lessen this, increase that, or whatever, we'd like to get feedback from the board and and integrate that into the same changes we're going to make for the peer review.

1:12:41So, I'll leave it at that and try and answer any questions.

1:12:43Sure. Through the chair, you said there were three spots per per unit. Is that what you said? Per building.

1:12:49Not per per building. Um per spots per building.

1:12:52Yeah. If you if you noted throughout three outside spots per building, correct?

1:12:56So, it's three outside and and one garage space in each. units. So, 18 dwelling units and a total of 45 parking spaces.

1:13:11No. Uh yeah, it is 45.

1:13:13It's actually because we gave five outside spaces to to correct.

1:13:19Does that unit have water retention? You mentioned these.

1:13:23Is there water retention where the septic system is going to be?

1:13:27No, this is just going to drain across this in the future. This would just be a grass surface over this run

1:13:34off from the butters on El Stevens Road just kind of flow across this flow into the woods to the wetlands get to the street.

1:13:48No, these these two are just uh going through catch basin then a storm water filter and out actually to a a leeching

1:13:56trench in each of these cases but not a structuring ground with chambers as we just didn't have unfortunately have no space.

1:14:09So the sorry go ahead no here my my question my next question to the chair is this these drawings are really small it's difficult for us to

1:14:18see so I'm going to ask you some questions uh sidewalks yeah we're we're still showing the proposed which I believe is required in

1:14:26the village zoning district sidewalks all along uh the front of all these slots in including the getting to the

1:14:33corner and and the road in fact we we just simply left it on from the previous uh project.

1:14:41Um okay. So all they all these houses have sufficient finances. This is site plan. This doesn't require special permit because it's allowed. Correct.

1:14:51Yep.

1:14:52With with the exception as a submitted was pointed out by raves of we didn't show enough on lot number nine.

1:14:58But you said you resolved that. So this we have but we have not submitted that revised version to you. Okay.

1:15:08And looking at the elevations, are are they all planned on being the same design?

1:15:14Um there's uh really two different designs. Lot nine. Well, you could say you could say three.

1:15:22Yeah, there's there's lot nine, which is a completely different footprint.

1:15:25Um these are all going to be the same with walkout back. The same same footprint, but walk out back. This one

1:15:33will not have a walk out back. Will not have a garage. Um, but it is the same from first floor up will be the same structure.

1:15:43My my only complaint or concern is this is this is our main street and these kind of to me look like factory housing,

1:15:52tenement housing. Is there a way we can create some sort of design to them? I mean, they're just pretty plain jane boxed all the same. Add some dormers.

1:16:04Add some bow windows, something to make it a little bit different or more completely different floor plans, even

1:16:11if they're very similar in front of that's just something that looks different from the outside where you look from the outside. You know, this is this is Main Street. This is Main Street Charleston.

1:16:19That's a great point.

1:16:20Um, and I something I'd like to see there like as colonial as possible.

1:16:28Yeah, they could kind of village.

1:16:30Yeah. Something that has some sort of colonial design to it. some sort of arch architecture to it instead of a

1:16:39cigar box, lack of a better word.

1:16:44And I again, especially if we're going to alternate through the this might be the prime choice, too, because this is going to be the most visible one.

1:16:53We'll be kinder than that to the architect, but we'll tell him that we message received.

1:17:00You know what? If they ugly, don't build. I won't call it a cigar box, but I've seen the signs. People buy those quick.

1:17:08Yep. More interesting facade owners.

1:17:11Just something to to break it up a little bit, make it look like a little more colonial. It's a color, too.

1:17:17It's a historic town. That's a master plan does really focus on keeping improving and and and keeping

1:17:25the downtown that that colonial look. So, It makes it makes a difference, you know.

1:17:34And not we're not asking great cost, just the general design some architectural.

1:17:42Thank you.

1:17:44You pointing um as far as the parking goes, it's um

1:17:51I'm okay with it. It's it's not a a street parking type of ordeal like we had the last time. So, uh, one garage

1:17:59spot, one driveway spot, and a spot to move a car if you need it. So, and it's not on a main road. So, um, there is no parking on the road on Main Street.

1:18:10Correct. And that would be probably one of the conditions. I think that's And just so you know, they, uh, couple that are a little different. Uh, lot n

1:18:18lot nine, that uh, unit would have parking similarly around the bath.

1:18:22Yep. Uh lot eight would have uh two spaces over here and three spaces over here. Okay.

1:18:31Off street.

1:18:32Yeah. All off street. No no no garage on on building also building number eight.

1:18:37And that's that's primarily to the topography of that particular lot.

1:18:43Do you have screening on this plan like you did on the apartments for L Stevens Road between that house

1:18:51that's uh landscaping? Yeah.

1:18:57We sort of both in different areas. We had we had fence and we had arborite and

1:19:06no arbites get taller but I'm not sure of others here that might green.

1:19:12The good thing with the arborites is is they get tall and they create a good screen. If it's a green giant arborite,

1:19:20green giant variety. It's got a single style and a good um caliper.

1:19:24You play them close enough together and it after about six years it's a hedge.

1:19:30After about 10 years, it's a 30 foot high hedge. Exactly. Yeah. Okay.

1:19:39Just street level and um separation between the the dwelling units or each individual lot. I think I would suspect

1:19:48they're looking to existing res existing existing res if they wanted to buy in without having

1:19:57it there. That's their belief. But people that already lived over over here if they, you know, whatever they whatever woods there are

1:20:04that folks would see through, you're just going to see a stretch of high grass. Right. Right. Yeah.

1:20:11One of my questions 36. Um, are you taking out all of the trees?

1:20:19It depends on where where you're looking. That's a leech field. Do you do you have a tree cutting plan?

1:20:25We we show the proposed tree line on this and what's colored in green is what's expected to be altered. For instance, in this area, the expected

1:20:34location of the septic system leeching area for for line 9 is here. Um, beyond that, we're just expected to be left

1:20:41alone. And expected uh leeching area for lot eight is over here and beyond it beyond it towards the wetland woods are

1:20:49expected to be left as well. And I I sent this uh um to uh I sent it to Jane and to to Dylan to this plan to uh so it

1:20:58might help uh might be easier to look at. So if you were to guess like um sorry or or no what's the like width of the uh the septic where the septic is?

1:21:12Oh this is this is under the expectation of like 350 foot lines. So this is this is really about 1,000 square feet. It's

1:21:19about 50 by 20 is I like the width of like the tree clearance. Oh yeah.

1:21:28So that the first thing you will be clearing all the way up to the lot line. Is that what you're saying?

1:21:33Close. We because we've got to assuming we've we're more than the minimum off the the line there. And then we're going

1:21:40to have to probably fill uh up even on the uphill side. Assuming a typical, you know, 3 to 4 foot uh um depth to

1:21:49groundwater. It's usually about 7 feet to wherever that you find groundwater to the new ground surface. See, if we found

1:21:56it 4T down, then we've got a new ground service is going to be 3 ft higher than this. So, we'll end up filling almost to the to the property line.

1:22:05Will you have two perks?

1:22:06It'll be at least uh it'll be it'll be two perks and two deeps in in each of these areas is what has to be done.

1:22:12So, is that going to leave a valley in between? Um, no.

1:22:19Um, we actually have to title five prescribes that you should grade so that runoff won't come on. Actually, what

1:22:28what we'll end up doing is leaving a really minor swale right here which leads the water around on each side.

1:22:35Same thing on on this one. It won't be set up to create a puddle.

1:22:40That's not good for the system. It's not good for anyone, right? Um it's again you're asked to grade so that water doesn't sit there go

1:22:49onto it and doesn't sit next to it so they you know go around. Is that downgrade from your property?

1:22:56We have a we have a build that they're I think is this garage? That's garage.

1:23:03Okay. That says this is 882 right behind the garage. This is probably 877

1:23:10right here in the middle of this trench and you you're at roughly 880 879 as you get to your property line. So you've

1:23:18dropped a couple feet and right now it's a couple feet more but we'll probably end up if test goes as they likely will

1:23:26filling two to three feet over the system. So we'll end up filling almost level with the with the property line.

1:23:32Okay. And we'll have to create a little, like I say, a little bit of swell on each side to leave the water around it.

1:23:37You just don't like that area to get wet.

1:23:39So, I have a question. So, you're going all the water's going to start draining down into the back. Is that what you're saying? It's not going to start draining.

1:23:48Well, it's going to drain.

1:23:49All right. Now, the behind here there's like a little pond. When that floods, I'm over here. Okay.

1:23:56My land of butts off of L. Stevens. when that little thing over here starts filling up my backyard

1:24:04is a total it you can take a tugboat in the back of it. So my concern is with all this digging and stuff that you're

1:24:12doing what's going to happen to that that little pond right there and what if that plugs again?

1:24:17Well that's my concern.

1:24:19We had to submit as part of this to both the conservation commissioner and the planning board. Actually, I just got the front few pages of it. Uh, a drainage

1:24:28report that by all the accepted methodology identifies the area that's drained to it's really all coming out to this culvert.

1:24:37Right. And that cover goes into my yard. Yes. Right.

1:24:40And it's this 6 acre site plus if I get it right is like 70 acres more total

1:24:47from area including some of like between H. Putinham and and uh North Main Street and and not including any Route 20 drainage, but going all the way to it.

1:24:57If you're at the CVS and you see those odd dark piles, that area comes here. Okay?

1:25:04And what we're doing here is what what we're affecting here is a small part of the overall drainage area. Okay?

1:25:11But we have to adhere to EPA standards about how you let water out. You can't

1:25:18increase the peak flow of runoff to butter after this is done. What all the calculations say that we've submitted

1:25:27and that people are reviewing on behalf of the town is that this will be a very very slight decrease from what's going there now.

1:25:36But that decrease, just so everyone has a realistic conception, that decrease is

1:25:42like on the order of a percent or a half a percent and year-to-year fluctuations are, you know, 50% more rain in this

1:25:51year than that year. Um, so you're not going to notice a difference if the year well if the year after this

1:25:59is done, you there's more rain, you know, there's more runoff. It's not necessarily because of how this project was done. It's just the natural

1:26:06fluctuation from year to year. But we have to there's a whole methodology of how this has to be looked at and

1:26:12calculations done to see what will happen and to prove to their satisfaction, the reviewer's satisfaction that we're not sending more water.

1:26:22So I there are people looking at that quite seriously in this case on your behalf and it's a part of the normal

1:26:29process. They cannot make it they cannot make it any worse and and often it makes it a little bit better.

1:26:37Okay. I'm just curious.

1:26:39The problem is not it's not so much this project is the water runoff on old Worester Road. The culvert is smaller

1:26:48than the prior culver. So it it throats down. So we got a 24 inch culver that all this goes into but when it goes

1:26:55under the wister road it's like a a 12 or an 18inch culver. So that's where it backs up. So So even whatever they do

1:27:04here, the problem still exists. So I don't know, I don't know if they can make this a requirement of the project

1:27:11that the city that the town corrects that as part of this because it all has to do with the water flow

1:27:17and right now we have a bottleneck on West Road.

1:27:22I don't think that's a perview of this board. One one of the one of the sir I just want to say too one of one of the

1:27:29problems you you find is if you remove a bottleneck at some point in the in the the process of the water flow and all of

1:27:36a sudden the water now gets through much more easily to the next culvert crossing all of a sudden you find that culbert crossing downhill is overwhelmed where

1:27:45it really was never before. You almost have to do a whole system by 45 North Main Street becomes your holding tank.

1:27:53And that's because we have a bottleneck.

1:27:56Uh you know, you don't you don't throttle down unless it's on purpose to so you don't have a flash flood. Uh but

1:28:05that bottleneck is not to stop a flash flood. It's by poor design. I I would I would tell you that the the hundred-year

1:28:14storm flows to this uh pair of of culverts here uh ends up flowing over the road.

1:28:22I'm not trying to build that one.

1:28:23Oh, I know. But I'm just as an example does flow over the road.

1:28:26As an example of a of a minor bottleneck, um if you had a 100redyear storm here, whether this is built or not, you would have some flow going over that road.

1:28:36Well, if you want to create a bottleneck there, you can use that as holding tank that's fine with me, you know, but you know another comment I

1:28:45said and Mark I don't know what the setback requirements are but I agree with Dawn that if you're driving down M towards downtown this is a wall

1:28:55effectively um because it looks like they're all set back about 10 ft uh a 10ft set back I don't know if that's

1:29:03dependent on the requirement yeah the frontier setback I think is it's required to be between 10 and 25 ft

1:29:10And we are have a couple of these you would have the ability to set further back, but we're also trying to create

1:29:18the requisite parking and the the drainage behind them. But so there are a few of these that could be set a little further back. Yes,

1:29:26I think if you sort of modulate it like if you look at uh five and five and six, we have some land in back of it and

1:29:35maybe the corner one maybe five five, six and one are are the best candidates for if any were to to be

1:29:42stepped back. One is it's already trying to stay 25 ft out. were already putting a wall just off the side of the parking and you got the same thing in in place

1:29:51on but those maybe Don's director that's I mean they could be a different unit. kind of a good idea to make it look less like little houses.

1:29:59Okay.

1:29:59Or it could be a different design unit so that you know it's a different location, but but this location but but for the

1:30:06the the village district 10 ft is we're trying to trying to get things close to the road to make it look but

1:30:13you'd like it to be a little less like the opening shot of all the family. It's like

1:30:20I don't know but you know like what the curve you talk about curving in the back.

1:30:27What kind of curving is that going to be?

1:30:28Oh, we were just going to use uh Cape Cod burn. What's that? Cape Cod burn asphalt. Yes.

1:30:34Yeah. See the problem I have with that is that you get a 15t drop. Snow plows

1:30:41are going to hit that curvy and wipe it out. Uh, and so now we the the without the curving the catch basin is not going

1:30:49to work and the water is just going to flow right over the edge.

1:30:52So the Cape Cod curb isn't isn't a straight curve. It's kind of a an angled

1:31:00be asphalt. It will be asphalt, but it's not.

1:31:03It's a It's a Where's the old A cross-section or the the something called the the bread loaf cross-section

1:31:10rises 6 in in just a couple of inches more like this, right? It has some

1:31:20the the the primary worry with the the Cape Cod Burn is that the guy drives over it. He goes past it. So, who who

1:31:28would we go to to address the uh wish road conservation conservation conservation?

1:31:35Well, DDW DW conservation on the street the highway department would be the one.

1:31:45So, it's older you talked about as you get down further down off of road. So the problem with that is if you make a

1:31:54bigger culvert there then was it hemlock or or what's the other yeah the the houses downstream from that are going to

1:32:02get that same flooding and that's the lowest point and it's going to get a bigger rush through. But if the but if they have been contacted have them look

1:32:10at it maybe there's something else something that needs to be addressed on a big scale but they they always

1:32:17might just take cleaning of a culvert or remove a beaver dam

1:32:24as well as the beaver da um okay I had another question about the

1:32:31buildings on house that one is really close to the property line how far off the property line is number

1:32:39the the minimum sideyard setback is 10 ft. So it's at least 10 feet. Um it's either 11 or 12 ft. Sorry.

1:32:50But um based on some feedback we have here, we'll look into proposing some screening landscaping there. Um

1:32:58I mean is is it possible to only put one building on that lot instead of trying to squeeze into?

1:33:03That's a pretty significant economic move. I mean, we went from we went from a a lot of units to less than way better.

1:33:13Yeah, this is probably like 1/4 the units that were initially proposed. So, I think the developer would fire me if I propose a further reduction of of units.

1:33:22Um, so the problem is it it means the setbacks. It's allowed use of that zone.

1:33:28It's it's as long as the the buildings are are nicer, it really does it does really goes to what are thinking at in the village district. It it does very well.

1:33:39So, um and I don't have any I'm not I'm not like cringing going, "Oh my god, this is such a safety issue. It's it's

1:33:46it's I called water sewer and they confirmed that they are going to get approved." So, they're going to be really close together.

1:33:55Uh well, it took this is it's what's allowed for that.

1:34:01Is it weeks? Actually, it's it's much more than what's allowed. The distance between these because we're bringing the driveways in on the side. For instance,

1:34:09uh 3 to 4 is 59 ft. Four to and they could really be 20 if each was 10 ft off

1:34:17the sideline. 4 to 5 is 40T, 42 feet, 30 feet.

1:34:28So that so this last house here is gonna is that going to be like right on the corner?

1:34:33No, because the actual the actual pavement of L. Stevens Road, I'm tracing it with my finger. Comes up here and here's where the actual corner

1:34:42is. But it's one of the oddities of this street that this thick line is the actual right of way line, the the

1:34:49property limits, if you will, of the street, but this is where the pavement is.

1:34:54So, it's actually going to be and just it's qu just off the screen. There's a uh there's that hydrant that you see.

1:35:01That's probably about where I've got my finger now.

1:35:04Um I don't know if you know the folks RE Grim Grimway Trust. This is a a building over here be basically opposite that.

1:35:15It's not.

1:35:16Wow. Maybe it looks bigger from there, but from when you're looking at the property when you go and buy it, it's like how you going to fit all them in that.

1:35:25Well, it this is going to be this area at the corner is going to remain as is treated but with with a sidewalk

1:35:32installed for a distance of you know the lot. It's like 130 ft. Yeah.

1:35:40So if you're at that hydrant that's there now.

1:35:42Yeah. you'd have to basically pace 130 ft towards Route 20 before before you're going to have any trees cut for this lot.

1:35:52It's an oddity of how this road is. It's you don't usually see a road where the you know the road curves like this, but

1:35:59the actual pavement is way away from there like this. It's very unusual.

1:36:06It's because of the as it goes down. I know that. And that's what I'm saying. like how no you that's further away from so

1:36:14have you been before conservation uh no we yesterday right first yeah or we will be in front of them and

1:36:23and actually we actually have to get their comments from uh their outside reviewer Art Allen also

1:36:32so sort of going to try and put three sets of comments together you're outside of you overall better design.

1:36:45Is it still rental property? Sorry.

1:36:47No, the Well, I should say that right away.

1:36:50Yeah, I don't know if that's been formally decided whether or not they're um like for sale or if they're rent. I don't I don't know if we've made an

1:36:57official We can get back to you on that, but I don't think it's been a formal decision.

1:37:04Any of these designated as low income?

1:37:08As far as affordable affordable I don't believe so

1:37:18but part of the town's affordable pool under 40

1:37:2740 is for which one affordable housing um yeah 40b is the comprehensive current but 40 have to have one.

1:37:39No, I mean in one in one. You know what I'm asking? Yes.

1:37:41You mean Okay. So, if we were doing a 40B. Yes.

1:37:44No, this isn't I'm not saying is it 40B, but can it be counted?

1:37:48You could. The town's affordability just because it's a department. We we I don't know. Yeah, they could be designated as local action

1:37:57units if we were providing them as affordable units at I think at least 80% AMI area median income. But, uh that is not presently contemplated. Okay.

1:38:07And just because again this is site plan approval I if the applicant wanted to add anything but it's got something special.

1:38:19Unfortunately it's a big it's a big subject now.

1:38:23It's very difficult in this current environment um with rates the way they are to get anything built let alone affordable units.

1:38:31Understood. Understood.

1:38:34So we've got some valuable feedback. We appreciate that. We'd like to see some architectural variety, some consistency with sort of colonial standards of the center town.

1:38:44Uh perhaps modulating the distance off the road of uh a few of these to uh break up the line of sight a bit and

1:38:52then a street street landscaping and separating from existing both those green j are probably the best.

1:39:03Thank you. Overall, I don't see any other big changes as far as I'm concerned.

1:39:08Yeah. Much much much much better. Um, when do you guys want to come back?

1:39:14Uh, when do we think we'll be able to get plan revisions then?

1:39:20We really need that letter from the uh the compounds reviewer. We don't even have that yet.

1:39:26I mean, what what is your meeting schedule? Uh October 2nd, October 20, sorry, October 7th, October 21st,

1:39:34November 2nd.

1:39:39Um, yeah. Can we do Can we shoot for the 21st? Yeah, you can always extend. Oh, exactly. Right.

1:39:44How we doing for the 21st? Can we have It's pretty busy. It's pretty busy, right?

1:39:53Also busy.

1:39:54Yeah. Well, we can um Is the 21st too busy? Is it something

1:40:01you have planned for them or Yeah, I think we can we can still fit you guys on the 21st or the Yeah.

1:40:09Okay. October.

1:40:11We're probably not going to have all the answers by then anyways, but at least Okay.

1:40:18Ask we would request to please continue to that meeting. Okay.

1:40:22Um I'll make a motion to continue 35 North Main Street GM Properties LLC to October 21st meeting.

1:40:31I second the motion.

1:40:35Don Clay, if you have any questions as it goes through. Sorry about that.

1:40:45Oh, I do not know. Thank you, Jess. Great. Thank you.

1:40:52So there's 40 things that are engineers,

1:41:05right?

1:41:10So excited to have that. So if you want to move that I'm hoping they keep the trailer

1:41:18looking affordable unit

1:41:25because that's the zone that goes

1:41:34and you can look it up and it'll tell you what zone size

1:41:48Pursuant to MGL chapter 48 section 5, the child board will hold a public hearing on Wednesday, September 16th,

1:41:542026 6 p.m. in the plainwood office 37 main street and mass on the petition of land owners Bernie Gothier to amend the

1:42:04child and zoning map by reszoning approximately 15 acres from business enterprise park to community business the area is located at 269 Wister road

1:42:13parcel 36 2.5 listed at Chelton assessor map

1:42:23Sure. Mom, my nerves are all gone now.

1:42:31So, does everybody know where 269 is?

1:42:35Yeah, I believe so. That's the property next to 808.

1:42:40Little small map here, but that has the uh this section right here.

1:42:48Company wise uh just before that uh between And so it's okay. In Gary Kazowski's old place. Yeah.

1:42:56Yeah.

1:42:57So that that property goes um so you're just talking about the the section that's that's uh currently CB.

1:43:06It's currently currently BP. Yeah.

1:43:09Okay. Not the uh not the agricultural. Okay.

1:43:12No, we're just leaving that the way it is. And u because I had my engineer redesign some things preliminary wise

1:43:21if you want to see just a rough sketch of what the land is. But um so this is this is Route 20 right here.

1:43:33Mhm.

1:43:34And this is 80 road right here where the light is and Gary's landscape is right over here.

1:43:42So there's an entrance right off Route 20 right here. And this is just a pulmonary drawing of what would possibly

1:43:49fit in here and there's the boundary line for BEP and agricultural. There's another 15 acres here. But this is BE

1:43:59currently and I'm hoping to get it converted to community business so that we can lend to more options in a in a later type development.

1:44:09Okay. Is this CB over here too or is this No, this is currently BEP. This is BP all the way right here. AD. I don't

1:44:17know what it is, but this is community business across the street.

1:44:24Community business is directly across the street up here and all on that side of the road.

1:44:30And then you guys added some community business along Route 20.

1:44:35I think just to kind of visualize the whole park, it's this one. This section right here it is that section. Yes.

1:44:41Yeah. So you have community business along this section there. Yeah.

1:44:47My only concern is this. Could it be considered

1:45:00almost extending? It's like that into the green.

1:45:05It's the green piece right here. It's It's a spot that's just this section of green piece right here.

1:45:13Yeah.

1:45:14It's just this taking a bite out of the loud.

1:45:19I mean all along with 20 CB

1:45:28it's almost more creative that be versus

1:45:36and and if you look at that area now you've got I mean this this section here is landscape

1:45:43kind of uh am I he's right here okay he's right here and this is all Dan proud Um and then this is all vacant pre.

1:45:52Yeah.

1:45:55Um old little old steel building right about there.

1:46:01There is an old gas steel building where you kids still hang out at. Yep. You didn't do that in here.

1:46:08Oh yeah. It was up there 16. Yeah. A dirt road, you know. Um

1:46:15what is the the What do you think you're going to do there? Just out of curiosity. Just so I had this whole speech, but it's a

1:46:24little can. So, um, it's going to depend on whoever want whatever tenants want to come in here.

1:46:32Um, but the people up in the Carol Hill area, everybody, I've got a lot of customers up there. They're like, "We

1:46:39need a restaurant in the area and we don't we're tired of going to Sturbridge, but Sturbridge has a nice environment, but this would be a nice

1:46:48pedestrian walking through area type thing right off of CO

1:46:55instead of just being another commercial building, another storage building." Well, I do actually have this presented

1:47:03to put storage in, but this is behind this little wet spot. So it would be screened and this building was screened from ADT's junkyard.

1:47:13I don't want to say that in front of Bruce, but you know that way forever still up there.

1:47:18Yeah. So if I do put a building here, it's this screens me from his property and screens

1:47:25the wet line screens uh the storage building.

1:47:30But this building is going to be one solid climate control building for storage. About 24,000 ft.

1:47:39It' be nice. It's not going to look like just a box.

1:47:48It's all going to be indoors though. Um I can have some drive ups, but it looks better if you don't have drive ups. Um,

1:47:57but this was all drawn out for additional space and restaurants or whatever else can go here with the parking.

1:48:08I I I like the idea. It's a and I see where you're going with that. My only

1:48:14concern is you're taking a chunk out of the BEP to create a CV zone in there and

1:48:22whether that's considered spot zoning or not could could hurt you.

1:48:28Well, as far as going in front of this is a town meeting that would have to do this.

1:48:34Yeah. My my research has shown that B zone though is really not as economically valuable as as used to be.

1:48:44I mean, we've we've parsed all our industry to other countries. We don't have these industrial yards anymore. Um,

1:48:51you know, it's people want to have a walkound type environment. Um, I know we're not where

1:48:59Spags was. We don't we don't have that infrastructure yet, but it would be a mini type of complex that would lend itself to that.

1:49:07Is this something you're shooting for the fall time meeting for? I'm shooting for Isn't it on the agenda?

1:49:13Is it on the agenda for meeting on the Yeah. Okay. Yeah. So, it is. So, this this board would not be making the

1:49:22decision. They would be making decision whether it or not. Okay.

1:49:26I think that's kind of what would what would it take for it to sound for

1:49:33it to be more viable for what the town's looking for? You know, I'm I'm not looking to put in something like garages down the street.

1:49:42So, and who knows what's going to end up out in front of that building. You know, I don't want that.

1:49:47If you look at what's on Route 20 on that section, I'm not talking about what's behind, but what's on Route 20, most of the businesses on Route 20 fit

1:49:56in a CV zone. None of those would would be allowed in a DEP zone. If you've got

1:50:03an auto repair, you've got a landscape supply, um, and you've got, you know, You go up a little further. You've got a contractor.

1:50:11What about dressing it up though a little bit? So that's what I'm thinking.

1:50:14My feeling is that whole front section there, leave the back be and maybe resone that whole from Carol Hill to the

1:50:23industrial park because everything in there right now is CB.

1:50:30So instead of spot zoning just your property.

1:50:33Yeah. Maybe I don't know if you could talk to some of the other property owners and see if they would support you. How far back are you going?

1:50:42How far is So if you look at that about how far back is this?

1:50:46Yeah, the prop. No. Yeah. How far back is the Sorry. Carol Hill probably. No to to to here.

1:50:54I'm going to guess it's um 500.

1:50:57Yeah. So you've got this section of of I'm done over here. Yeah.

1:51:05So, you've got this 500 foot section here that is already from the industrial park over there is kind of already BP.

1:51:13There's nothing. Well, a lot of this is swamp right here.

1:51:16Sorry, it's BEP now, but every the businesses in here currently are CBased businesses. Businesses that would be allowed in the CB, right?

1:51:24Um Oh, water. White water. You mean uh even Whitewater is still it's a

1:51:30contractor. to is that I was thinking back to when it was plumber when it was back to was that the industrial

1:51:38well water is back here. What's what's the first building on the on the right hand side?

1:51:42This is the industrial park. This is Dan's park.

1:51:44What's the first building on the right hand side of business? It is. It's got junk everywhere. Plumbing. Yeah. The pipes.

1:51:51He's got equipment laying around all I wish it was cleaner.

1:51:55Um he used to be um what was the mechanum, right? It was me.

1:52:01So it used to be mechum used to be just a plumbing contractor's house which would be allowed ma'am in the CV business.

1:52:07How about housing? I know you mentioned possibly condos or town houses. Well, that's what these are.

1:52:13Those are Yeah, that's why we talked about stores and walking pedestrian type thing going on here. It's kind of a mixed use.

1:52:20Yeah, that's pretty popular now. Mixed use to have something to sustain. Mixed used is very popular right now.

1:52:26That's it is Florida. You can't go once.

1:52:29Any of them designated as she must have by accident. Um, we can make it happen.

1:52:38Welcome back.

1:52:40Hey, thank you. I'm sorry about that interruption earlier. I didn't have myself muted. It was a

1:52:47You thought you were yelling at us. Um, yeah, absolutely not. So it's selling it at

1:52:55town meeting that's it's really up to the up to the voters and it's this is I mean I think the approach I think would

1:53:05be right my my options with a BE I could do A B C and D with a B with a B and and

1:53:13not all those are attractive well that's a thing things or if I go to CB this is what my options are and this is what I'm

1:53:21thinking right I I mean it's an honest story.

1:53:24I was on that committee to do VEP and it was going to be parkike settings with driveways and buildings but like you said sorry very little around feelings.

1:53:34No, it was a long time ago.

1:53:35Well, that's what I mean. It was 20 years ago. Yeah.

1:53:38So, we look at what it was a long time ago.

1:53:41Plus, we wanted to ask for a driveway out to Carol Hill. So, u and that's why I'm getting a lot of feedback from my tree customers. This would be great.

1:53:51They would love spot right down the street. But that might be a hardest cell because you're putting more traffic Carol Hill

1:53:59with some of those residents, but it allows them to hit. That's what it does. That's It's true. That's what the problem with it.

1:54:06That's going to turn around the wall down Route 20.

1:54:11Yeah, I get it. I get it. And and I think some improvements to that road could happen.

1:54:17Um in my expense.

1:54:22you want it, right? Be careful what you ask for.

1:54:29But I mean, it's it's really how how you going to sell it to town.

1:54:32Um, I'm just, you know, the architect is saying this is what's happening everywhere.

1:54:38It's it's you mean out in West Bro and South Bro, no more box stores.

1:54:42I think the board gets it. I think the board gets It's not like you said, how am I going to coffee shops? So, I would look at the the list of what's allowed in the BEP,

1:54:51compare that to what's allowed in the CB district, uh explain what you want to do there, why you want to do it there,

1:54:58and keep it under and how it's going to benefit the town.

1:55:02Yeah, that's I mean, I don't know. Like, it's um the

1:55:11um not planning to sponsor, but do what do we want? We would have to vote to recommend it or not recommend it.

1:55:23Can I write the waiver for last year's thing where you guys did change things to community business? Is there a way I can get on that line?

1:55:30Well, that's the same thing is that still had to go through a a town meeting.

1:55:33Oh, any change in voting has to be voted in by the town. It can be it can be sponsored by I was really surprised.

1:55:43It could be sponsored by the planning board. Um or it could be sponsored by a citizen. Yeah.

1:55:49With and then the planning board and the board of selectment would have to vote to either recommend or not recommend.

1:55:56Um if you try to do this Yeah.

1:55:59and it fails, you can't do it again for two years. Great.

1:56:04So it pretty much locks you down for for for two years and then you'd have to go through the whole process again.

1:56:11Um if you took your time maybe talk to some of the other property owners up there to see if they would

1:56:20like to do the same thing. We could reszone that whole section from the industrial park back 500 ft and over

1:56:30where there's existing buildings in there already built that would be allowed in the CD zone. You could make it nonconforming, but you could gonna be

1:56:39a hard a hard sell to the town. Do you really think I don't think it's going to be a hard sell because I mean I right now they're going oh my god data

1:56:48centers warehousing and you and when when you say in CB we can't I want to build a restaurant and maybe

1:56:56some retail people are going to be like in I mean we can't we I'm just saying the

1:57:02way the way the what you're seeing for people's you know anxiety of bad things right is data centers and big warehouse

1:57:10house. They're like, god forbid something like Amazon. Not that that space, but you understand like that they

1:57:17just they want this I I I don't think you'll have a hard time. They want the village field.

1:57:25Not the village people, but the village field.

1:57:27Well, yeah. They want to they want the small town Route 20, you know.

1:57:31And you and you want, you know, um buildings that are rentable that that that are earn money. But the big thing is there's a lot of tax dollars there.

1:57:40The residents on top like having units on top in that mix is a huge it's it's

1:57:48all of Massachusetts more than Massachusetts.

1:57:51So couldn't Bernie um do your homework on what you want to say at town meeting.

1:57:55If it gets the sense that it's not going to pass based on people commenting, I believe you can vote to table it.

1:58:02Yeah, table it, which will cancel the vote. cancel everything and then you can put it on the next meeting after you get you can you can table it. You can you can make a motion

1:58:11to table it and you can vote to table it and that'll stop it without a vote from the 100 people that you can almost like test it by.

1:58:20Yeah, that's a pretty good bit of advice.

1:58:23The other option is like I said the the only concern I have for you going going to town meeting is because you're taking a little bite out of an existing BEP

1:58:31that's a much larger both east, west, left, right, and above. Yeah.

1:58:35People are going to go that's spot zoning. We don't want spot zoning. like like that's typically a planning board concern because we don't really want the

1:58:44spot zoning. But again, um I I I don't think they're going to say, "Oh man, why are you breaking up this this BEP section? We really wanted

1:58:52a giant warehouse like we want we want, you know, um would the would the planning board support

1:59:00taking that whole section from Carol Hill over to the Industrial Park Road? I can't name that road down but stark or whatever that is.

1:59:10Yeah, you know where I'm talking in the woods.

1:59:13No, no, further further. That's that's up behind landscape, right? But I'm talking going all the way down to the the industry.

1:59:24Uh yes. Yes. making that whole section be I mean that's something the the planning board could recommend and put

1:59:31together doing the businesses that are in there now are are you know existing existing existing

1:59:38non-conforming for be they but they are conforming for CP I mean there's a couple empty lots in there that

1:59:45I don't think there's anything that could not be done for the fall but

1:59:52it could possibly be considered for the How soon do you I I know you probably um it shouldn't get moving on it but I

2:00:00don't want to I have a project going on an auction which has kind of got me tapped out so I can wait till spring because that might better something that we would look at because it it makes sense.

2:00:10It it doesn't I mean it makes sense to me. What do I know?

2:00:14It's all pre-existing non I think we have to look at what was in there and um lots now that we have

2:00:22Google maps so much easier. Remember when we didn't? Yeah.

2:00:25And we feel bad cuz we're going on our phones looking sometimes like from seeing seeing it from that. So they're not playing. You're all set.

2:00:32Okay. What?

2:00:36Uhial map satellite versus what we see.

2:00:40So I can just look at I have not gotten that set up yet. It's something I want to do.

2:00:45Be nosy because you can really see what's going on.

2:00:48Yeah, you get the near maps. Near maps is great. uh one of the soft I don't think it would be hard

2:00:58based on the um you know the general consensus of what people don't want.

2:01:05So so honestly it's it's you've got that and um

2:01:13uh Benoy is that does Benoy Bruce Benoy own the section between Carol Hill and me? Yes.

2:01:20Yep. Five acres.

2:01:21And that's uh part of ADP, right? Or um is there a house in there, too? There is a house in the middle of that.

2:01:30Yeah. Okay. So, I mean, you've got that property, you've got your property.

2:01:35Um but ADT's property goes around that house. So, so I don't have to worry about the house.

2:01:43Yep. That would be broken out. And then then what I'm saying is go all the way, you know, even

2:01:51You can probably go over to gardener's um how far back? No, I guess it doesn't go that far back. So, I mean all the way over to um

2:02:01uh Kazowski's property uh and include Kazowski's property in that. that would make that whole section

2:02:08from really the industrial park over where there's already existing businesses with the exception of your

2:02:15property um that are already community business based I think and interesting that it's in line with the thoughts from master's plan too to

2:02:25to allow I'll try not to do it again right that because also I mean when you

2:02:33make when we're making decisions we you kind of look at that master plan and and what we're thinking before and what we

2:02:40think now is that there's there's there's not going to be many big box stores.

2:02:45That's right. There's a lot of vacant storefronts even ones. Yeah. Office space.

2:02:50So that so that more again that makes that housing.

2:02:54Yeah. That would leave Gardener and um Proud's property as VEP.

2:03:00That's all off the road, which makes sense. But whatever was on Route 20 would convert that. I mean, I I would

2:03:07especially if there's access that I would support that, too.

2:03:11Yeah, I would support that, too. And I think if you're if if as long as you know your your neighbors would support it. I don't see why they wouldn't. I

2:03:20don't think they might like it.

2:03:21Um have another option because anything behind them that's commercial. I know that the agricultural portion. Mhm.

2:03:32So that that's an option. So I have some homework.

2:03:36Yeah. I mean that's meeting if you decide.

2:03:39It's completely up to you. You can go to the town meeting the fall and try to push it for your individual property or table it and then

2:03:48remind us because we're having a busy we've got a busy fall but before the next town meeting you know propose something to the planning board and if

2:03:56you can get those others to buy in on the planning board would put forth the article to to change it but in the spring that in the spring for the spring

2:04:05I mean if you if you want to push it I don't I don't I don't think there'll be an issue if you explain it with

2:04:12and it may not be and it may not be but you mean at the next meeting if you wanted if you wanted to wait for the spring then we could

2:04:19I'd like to do that and then like you said if I don't like the way it's going table yeah before

2:04:28so maybe I'll bring Rob you have to really you lose people if

2:04:36you get too worried so have your facts ready Yeah.

2:04:39Um, this is what's this is what I could do here. This is what I could do here.

2:04:44I'd like to do this. I'd like to do this. I'd like to have a new How long How long have you owned that property? Just curious. Four years.

2:04:50Okay. So, you just recently been cleaning it up for 40 years.

2:04:55I see your truck's in there. It looks nice. Yeah, my trucks are in there. I did. They did a nice job. Yeah.

2:05:00It's like a little park when you drive by. You got some trees and some gravel park.

2:05:06I mean, it' be a nice location for what you want to do. I think that's a good spot for it. And I I kind of like that road to car just so you can get that late.

2:05:15That's what I like. It's just it's it's a narrow road at that point. You have a bunch of extra traffic. So that's what you have to look at.

2:05:22Could you be able to use what extra traffic?

2:05:25Uh you could make that one way just because it it what it is already is a two-way. Um No, no. The driveway I think it's just going out.

2:05:35That would be Yeah. Eastbound goes this way. goes that way, right? I don't know. We did it for that.

2:05:41Yeah. No, that's just that road trip down.

2:05:45And then again, they'll probably look at how the stack is for the light too long. It's quite a ways back.

2:05:52Yeah, it's back 500 ft.

2:05:54Either I'll I'll tell you anything you do, it's probably a traffic sign. No problem. So, that just so you're aware.

2:05:59Okay. Just because you're at a lake there, you're under 20 traffic.

2:06:08But yeah, so there's your options. Uh, it's a lot to think about. Thanks.

2:06:16So, I guess we'll stay on for this fall.

2:06:18Yep. Give a try. Um, do we vote to support it tonight or how do you go?

2:06:24Um, I'd make a motion. Um, support it.

2:06:32I really would like the whole the whole thing changed, but I mean I suppose if we supported this, we could do that later. That would probably make it even easier to do that later, right?

2:06:39No. And I think there's a there's reasoning behind it now because we I mean I think that it's the trend and and I think that it goes along with the how

2:06:47the master plan committ um planning board supports the zone

2:06:56change from uh EP 259 was Oh, actually, do we have to close public hearing first? Is this a public hearing?

2:07:04Is it a public hearing? Public hearing a public hearing? It is.

2:07:07Um, and it was and and anybody here any comments?

2:07:12Do we we kind of have to make it now, right? Because we're running out of time for the town meeting. Town meeting is

2:07:1919th of October, but the warrant closes on Tuesday. So, it needs our support or not support by this meeting

2:07:26by this meeting. Okay. and it was advertised in. Okay, then I'll make a motion to close the public hearing.

2:07:34I'll second the motion.

2:07:37Roll call vote, please. Don Clay I um make a motion for the planning board

2:07:47to recommend the zoning change for 259 um Worcester Road

2:07:55from BEP to CB for for the port yeah for the portion

2:08:02that is currently BEP to CD not the whole property right I'll Second motion, please.

2:08:10John, I go hopefully that'll help.

2:08:19I appreciate it. You guys will volunteer. Bill, what's that? We have Bill EDC.

2:08:26Yeah. Yeah. Bill Economic Development Commission. They would support you have an idea. Really? All right.

2:08:34I was on that. Well, there's a they they meet occasionally, but um one of our board members is on the BBC also, so he

2:08:41may go under at this point. No, not yet.

2:08:48Yeah, it's a good it's a good group of businesses that we we the childhood business alliance and all that.

2:08:57We're moving up.

2:08:58Yeah, it sounds just got to do with this.

2:09:02I'm on board doing what I can. That's right. Thank you all very much. Thank you. Greatly appreciate your luck. Take care. Thanks.

2:09:10Okay, we have Chris go back to the ANR.

2:09:18It's my road, but I'm not in the water.

2:09:35here a few folks. Each lot has the required um acreage and frontage for

2:09:43legal building lot was one to two here.

2:09:49Is this the right way you saw this?

2:09:53Oh, there's so many of those random little Yeah, I thought it was like the gas or anything.

2:09:59What is that? is the lake access.

2:10:03Yeah, a lot of people on the other side of the road have lake access. So you kind of there's a whole bunch of others that go.

2:10:17Yeah, yours does. I remember. Yeah, it's kind of far from the hills, too.

2:10:27I drove by and saw

2:10:37one with my glasses off.

2:11:08It's a nice room to believe.

2:11:15It's pretty inexpensive. It is the best one in your childhood.

2:11:22Just saying.

2:11:28Those arenic arsenic. You don't?

2:11:33I thought too that whole day.

2:11:42Wow. I had to visit every day. Is that a really? Wow.

2:11:50That's so cute. It's like a new pet. Yeah. My dog wasn't outside. Wow.

2:11:58It is pretty cool.

2:12:01So, it everything looks fine, too, right? Nice house.

2:12:06Yeah. Yeah. We've got a big property up there. Um, make a motion to approve the NR for 189 Daniels Road.

2:12:17I'll second the motion.

2:12:21Don Clay, I uh since I can't see it, should I vote at all? Should I abstain here?

2:12:30Sure, you can abstain.

2:12:31It's a pretty It's a very nice set of lots on a beautiful road. So, um

2:12:39I three eyes and abstain. Motion passes.

2:12:45All right. Do you need signatures? I'll do that at the end. Is that all right?

2:12:49Get through everything else and then we can all We have decommissioning.

2:12:56Nope. That's also going to get pushed out. Uh no motion has to be made for that. That's just an administrative item.

2:13:0321 or the seventh. Uh I believe there uh I believe there's seven. the 7th. Is that correct about that? It's when they said they were coming back.

2:13:11Yep. Yep. The 7th. Leave it when we see it. Move.

2:13:20Acceptance of the town housing. We didn't really get any further than that. Do you any changes detective?

2:13:27No, I realized I I never got that document from you, so I never sent it over to them. Uh I let them know I need

2:13:34to get that to them. uh called and there you're good to come for October 7th. Okay.

2:13:39Um I mean really it's just the that we're going to we will we will research it whatever that that's

2:13:47the biggest change right that we're not really we should wait probably

2:13:58and then just a couple of updates here.

2:14:01Uh, number one, uh, I'm not going to say it necessarily in the meeting, but I agree 21 pages is a little bit longer than I really want.

2:14:10You had said that before you even started. So, yeah, I do.

2:14:14I wanted to make sure I, you know, covered all the bases, but again, timewise, usually I'd like to take that time to then really see and group things

2:14:22a little bit better, make it flow a little bit nicer and just cleaner of just having, you know, findings much more neat than kind of

2:14:31what I had them. Um, and then as well as conditions, trying to get them to flow in a different way of saying, you know, all of this before

2:14:40building permit gets issued, all this before occupancy, makes it easier for the building department. So, as I keep going and I start getting my templates

2:14:49built more and more from from lessons learned, I want to start getting those as well. Um, the procedure document that

2:14:56I had for the waiver, is that everyone find that one helpful?

2:15:00Uh, yeah. Yeah. I mean, anything, you know, when we when we come in here, just my feeling is when we come in here on a

2:15:07Wednesday, um, the more information we can have in front of us, the better.

2:15:15So that's it's um

2:15:25Yeah. I mean I'm Well, so we're voting on the finding. It's It was the different votes that kind of confused me.

2:15:35Yeah. So and I'm not sure we need to do that. I I think that just I think if if we vote on the request alto together.

2:15:47It's it's because we're not going to vote no on the findings and vote yes on this. This seems more like a procedure.

2:15:52This seems more like our procedure like the the um person Yeah. I think one vote I don't I I we've always done it that way and it has

2:16:01never been a problem. Um was there a reason for for breaking it out like that? Was there a legal

2:16:08standing on issues that came out or It's more it's a a more standardized approach to have the findings where when

2:16:16it does go to appeal if you've done all the findings and you've kind of done it really kind of the the most ironclad way is you read every single one of those

2:16:25findings and I am not about to ask the board to do that. We'll be here uh all night. Um, yep.

2:16:32But generally, if you take just kind of one of blanket to say, you know, these these are all kind of pre-written findings. Well, they just make that

2:16:40motion to say you're accepting this document as evidence. So, I I mean, any court um they're looking for consistency

2:16:47with the way you treat things and even reading them or not, having them in in the memo in documented, it's these are all the the standard things we consider.

2:17:00Um the like I I do like the authority piece like it it um makes sense the um

2:17:08the again this is kind of our procedure we do we look at these particular things every single time it does really hold I

2:17:15don't think we have to vote on them um the so what I can do with this procedure uh

2:17:22the board like to have one motion that would be to accept the findings accept

2:17:29the conditions and then approve the your findings are in the decision and it's are part of the site.

2:17:41Yep. So there'll be the section for findings and the section for So if we just vote on this document that's going to cover everything that

2:17:48that's in the document. So if this is our our decision um and this is what we're voting on that's

2:17:57going to cover all of it. So, I think one vote to cover the whole have it in the document. Yep. It'll all be in there.

2:18:02And it really I like it shows consistency, right? So, every time that we like for like the waiver way like if if we're going to wave something so

2:18:10someone else can't say you waved theirs but you wouldn't wave ours, we can say well it's because of of

2:18:19that whatever. So, I I do um I just think one vote is is covers us and

2:18:27You know, if if we have a attorney in front of us and and they say, "Whoa, that's bad." Then just

2:18:35like I said, I think we haven't had a problem before. I like having

2:18:44the written document for I I do that. So, if it's, you know, coming up to the point where you think there's going to be a vote taken, it's great way to do it. Appreciate that.

2:18:55Huge. the other decision is um as we kind of get going it's even a type of thing where I'd like to get it to

2:19:03there's you know to have a kind of incomplete decision that's even that I'll be sharing with like here it is this finding hasn't been made must be

2:19:11made by so on and so forth and that is a guiding document um but we can do that I'll make sure uh anything procedurally that you folks

2:19:20want to do one vote for everything um and and vote on everything tonight. One vote.

2:19:30Uh yes, for each each plan. And this was something I I only learned today. Um

2:19:38where our uh zoning bylaw only allows for the associate member to vote only on special permit. Yeah.

2:19:48And that's pulled essentially from the the wording of state law like one for one just pulled from it. But

2:19:55my interpretation of that is state law allows for an associate member to vote

2:20:02on special permits. But because we just copied and pasted it into our bylaw, it then restricts the associate member to

2:20:11only being able to vote on special permit. where otherwise if we were to write it differently in our bylaw

2:20:19associate member could participate in you know matters before the planning board such as site plan approval. Um

2:20:26I thought that was only if a if a quorum needed to be met. My understanding is

2:20:34that you can uh not only can they do uh site plan approval or other matters, but

2:20:42you can even do in all cases uh so anything just administrative or procedurally that requires a vote. Um

2:20:49you can even have an alternate member participate in that. This is something that we'll we can look at with legal

2:20:57counsel to get their take on it. Let's take a look at it.

2:21:01I know other communities I've been in, anytime you have an alternate serve, they're effectively operating as a full board member for whatever is on the

2:21:08agenda. Uh it's possible that the previous two communities I've been involved with were wrong on that. Um

2:21:17my understanding was they could serve in and vote on a special permit if needed if the quorum wasn't met type of thing.

2:21:25But I could be that was just all when I was when I was an alternate way back when

2:21:33um I they it was like a big deal for them to let me vote. So whenever there was a special permit I it wasn't if there were somebody didn't vote. It was

2:21:41if there was a special permit they would just let me vote. But I don't know again if that was correct or not.

2:21:49Good to look into. something to look into, but as long as the board if the board wants to keep the process, it's not something that's I mean, we can look into it when

2:21:57you have time. Don't put that high in here.

2:22:00We're not getting in time for the fall, so this would be a uh spring town meeting. All right, copious free time.

2:22:09Hey, look, I'm getting settled in here.

2:22:11It's it's it's coming together more and more. So, um I will put that as something between now and uh the warrant

2:22:21for next year. So, yes.

2:22:35Oh,

2:22:47June in July and August copy of the draft notes.

2:22:59So, I'm going to get some copy.

2:23:02Oh, sorry. Thank you. Write this in the kill file.

2:23:25They all say draft on the top of your back, but it's not. I got some

2:23:33right here. Right here on top of them all over first and do them all together.

2:23:56Any word from Panica Hill by the way?

2:23:58Yeah, they want to be on for the 7th as well. Correct.

2:24:01Um, no. I think this the one 21st.

2:24:07Yeah, we continue them to the 7th and then we have to continue again. Is that it? No, I think they said the 21st.

2:24:13I I took it right up there. There is some clearing that they've done.

2:24:19I did not see anything washing down the road.

2:24:24It's just pretty high grass. Maybe they do test.

2:24:30Yeah, I mean it just might need to get some equipment if they were to do park tests.

2:24:38Well, they got to get something. They might have monitoring wells or something.

2:24:44I didn't see overly clear, but there's got to be some road clearing in there.

2:24:50If you if you're committing to putting a road in, I'd want to know what kind of ledge was underneath there and what I was dealing with. So like it's

2:24:59Yeah, the uh the listing has like an estate lot for sale

2:25:06in a speak

2:25:31So any other making progress?

2:25:49Yeah, something had to be rescheduled up.

2:25:56It's moving forward those, you know, slowly. Yeah.

2:26:01Well, it was about getting everybody into those individ before we do anything else, they have to meet all of the designated um stakeholders.

2:26:12Yes. Yeah. They still complying that list getting some contact information.

2:26:38Looks like the 21st announcing

2:26:53that one's not I don't remember a long time ago.

2:27:10You don't have to come. We can always set up here. Get it on the screen with the uh camera here. So, it's where is it live?

2:27:20I believe it's a team meeting.

2:27:22Um What did you say? What date was it? The 21st at 4:00.

2:27:34Okay. Uh, make a motion to approve the planning board minutes for May 20th.

2:27:42I second the motion.

2:27:47Call vote. say I Howard passes.

2:27:58Want to make a motion for the 17th. All right. See if I do it right.

2:28:05Yeah. Go for it.

2:28:07Um I make a motion that we accept the minutes from the meeting from June 17th.

2:28:16I second.

2:28:18Call I get I want a head shot.

2:28:25Yes. Go. Go ahead. I need to go back.

2:28:33While you're at it, I make a motion that we accept the minutes from the July 15, 2026 meeting.

2:28:42I second. Don't play.

2:28:51Maybe. Shall we go?

2:28:59Make a motion that we accept the minutes from the meeting of August 12th, 2026.

2:29:06Second.

2:29:11Let's get that done. Playing your eye.

2:29:20I'll approve. Yay.

2:29:30No, I believe that covered everything.

2:29:32Uh, the ANR was the big one. I set myself a reminder for the only one to be tabled, so I think we're good.

2:29:40Any What's the the last item? Anything not expected for you guys in advance? Do you have anything?

2:29:47Um, nothing. Just like I said, a question on the um the master plan, but I guess that's moving forward. Um, that was the only question. Curious.

2:29:59I just wanted to mention the the letter to the EFSB and the DPV with the three pins that I was

2:30:07requesting. Um, so this was already approved in February. It became effective July 1 and

2:30:15then all of a sudden it's they're sending another amendment per se. They're calling it um worksheet or something.

2:30:24But they've basically removed so many things.

2:30:32Let me just see.

2:30:34Um they the they are taking away their own power. Um

2:30:43they removed areas of critical environmental concern. They weakened air pollution.

2:30:52They removed force cutting practice including they because all eyes are off of it now that now they can change it to be what they really want.

2:31:00Well, the only people paying attention are national grid. Ever source and the energy companies and it hasn't been voted.

2:31:08So no one's looking at these things at all because we're not looking at them, right?

2:31:11Well, we figured we were and and the gentleman from Shootsberry is the one that went item by item. They weakened lighting noise.

2:31:21They they weakened that. And I won't go into everything, but I should send you his comments. Um it's crazy. Uh

2:31:28vegetation buffers, surface water. Uh there's a lot here that they just removed.

2:31:36And then um ESA submitted a letter. So that jumped out at me on on the website.

2:31:42It came from West stating they were preparing their consolidated permit. And they have a couple things there they

2:31:50want to see changed. They don't like they want to see 27% of

2:31:58what's the grading because on part of their property. So they want sight footprint uh defined more.

2:32:08They're saying 15% is it's not enough whereas right now it's it can't be on a slope more than

2:32:1615%. But we'll see what happens. It's kind of sad.

2:32:23Yeah. Noise is an issue.

2:32:26Why would they take why would they why would they take away that oversight. So nobody nobody sees it.

2:32:35Well, that's not they're not looking at it, right?

2:32:39You know, well, this is for large clean energy.

2:32:43So, it goes to the the FSB and they're putting a lot diminishing their power.

2:32:48So, does that mean that when if we have representatives like an attorney representing the town and the the

2:32:57attorney has we have people are saying that it's really loud or it's going to it's it's there's an issue there in one of the where is it still going to be

2:33:06discussed at the EFS like is it is it just going to be rubber stamped at that point?

2:33:11Yeah. Like I don't know. I think they'll have an interview but um like like we said the

2:33:17um the he vote to ignore it. I want them to vote

2:33:25on right if they say we don't really care that you're there's an issue with the you know in whatever with the noise

2:33:33but I don't want them to chart but I I'll forward things to you so you can it's there's a lot

2:33:40and again on my request we're getting how many it's been a year and a half

2:33:48where I've been writing them saying the decommissioning bonds it's not just removable removal. Where does it go?

2:33:56That's a huge cost. Um, is I'm just so sick of this that I did everything according to what they

2:34:05wanted. I went to workshops. I was on the Zoom calls. I did the writing. I came here and said, "Would you guys approve this?" So, this one I just

2:34:12submitted that I was, you know, former boy health and all that stuff.

2:34:19I just feel like they're going to do what they want to do. That's exactly They have an end goal.

2:34:23this is their angle. It doesn't matter how they get there. It's their it's the goal. It does. So, so with the large ones, my letter was

2:34:31things that we can require that are going to protect the residents and what they're already complaining about is the water and and like my letter stated, the CMR

2:34:40code is for public water suppliers or resource, you know, areas, individual wells.

2:34:47It does not do anything. I know until they poison them all and then there's a 10year lawsuit and and and in the

2:34:54meantime um people can't live on a normal life. That's right. And it doesn't matter.

2:34:58And I had I put that in the letter. Um you know drilling a new well or giving a homeowner a bottle of water is not a

2:35:07solution. They should prevent it from happening to begin with. So like I said to ESA on the fire call, why if if just

2:35:16by doing uh fire water containment prevents it, then why wouldn't you just

2:35:23do it for us? It's you're spending what a millions and millions to do this. What is to protect our wells? So, if we're

2:35:32going to be forced to do it. Oh, they even took away the fire department approval.

2:35:37So, no, they promised that they would seek public comment. They sought public comment. Yeah.

2:35:43Who didn't have to do anything with Well, the same thing. That's what on the hearings it was. Thank you for your comments. Thank you. Yes. Okay. Thank you for your comments. But then they

2:35:51listen to National Grid or the lobbyist for the solar.

2:35:55This is This is It's just disheartening.

2:35:59Oh, I didn't have to cheat because I don't

2:36:0916 Fire suppression system. Fires are a

2:36:18real concern with us and removing the requirement for the local fire to approve the fire suppression system design is welcoming problems. The approval power should not be removed.

2:36:29They took it out. I would like our fire chief to say the suppression is sufficient. Even if he's just reviewing

2:36:37the manufacturer's paperwork, it needs to be more strict than State fire.

2:36:45Prep care for the worst. For the best. Okay. Yeah. It's crazy. It's just sad.

2:36:55All right. Anything else?

2:37:00Motion to uh motion to adjurnn. The motion.

2:37:06Done. I really

2:37:21Thanks ally. Thank you.