2026-09-03 - Legislative Review Committee

00:01All right.

00:02Hi, welcome to the Legislative Review

00:04Committee Thursday, September 3rd, 20

00:0716 meeting in City Hall. It's 1:00 here.

00:11We

00:13right now present at the meeting two of

00:15the

00:16members, myself, Commissioner Myers and

00:18Commissioner Wright. So, we do not have

00:20a quorum. However, we do have uh

00:24community members and and staff here and

00:27our attorney's office who are ready to

00:28discuss this. So, we're going to go

00:29ahead with the presentations that they

00:31have prepared for.

00:33However, we will not be able to do any

00:35of the approvals of the minutes or the

00:38agenda as are laid out here.

00:41Um

00:42so, we will skip

00:44A and B. If there's someone, but not at

00:46this

00:47>> She's on the bus. She's back. Can't see.

00:49Okay.

00:49>> So,

00:50let's let's just move ahead to D, the

00:54commission identified um

01:02Um

01:03let me just note to the record here

01:05as we already have that after that

01:08Commissioner

01:09Tiffany Johnson has just entered so that

01:11we now do have a quorum and we can go

01:14back to A and B, approval of the agenda

01:16and the minutes. So,

01:19back to make it, yeah.

01:21Motion to approve the agenda.

01:24>> So moved.

01:25>> Second.

01:25>> All in favor?

01:27>> Aye.

01:28>> Okay, and we'll move on to approval of

01:31the Thursday, August 6th minutes.

01:34>> So moved.

01:35>> Second.

01:36>> All in favor?

01:36>> Aye.

01:37>> Aye.

01:37>> Okay. So, now we do not have anyone from

01:40the public here. We have a lot of

01:42visitors here, but no one from the

01:43public. So, we will move on to the

01:46commission identified item of interest,

01:48which is

01:49the recommendation

01:51to to evaluate and see if we're going to

01:53move forward on the recommendation of

01:55the Solid Waste Advisory Commission to

01:58ban plastic bags at point of sale.

02:01Um and so I'm going to hand it over to

02:04Who Who am I handing it over to? Who?

02:06>> In a phone.

02:07>> Me.

02:08>> In a phone. Taylor.

02:10>> Uh I think it's

02:10>> In a phone. I'm just reading from the

02:12agenda.

02:12>> Well, it's No, something.

02:14>> Oh, I I mean yeah, well, we're not we're

02:16not up to that yet. I'm just reading

02:17from the agenda.

02:19>> So, uh

02:19>> Which is the actual charge?

02:21>> Yes, yes, the charge.

02:22>> Yes. So, y'all, this is the first time

02:24you're going to be hearing about this

02:25topic. Uh Mayor Garcetti, who happens to

02:28be present today, he has signed the

02:29ticket mini on May 5th.

02:32Um and so this came out of the Solid

02:35Waste Advisory Commission. This

02:36recommendation was initially done Suki,

02:38correct me if I'm wrong, April of 2024

02:41is when this originally got passed by

02:43the Solid Waste Advisory Commission.

02:45>> Correct.

02:45>> Um and so now that it's before y'all in

02:48Legislative and Rules Committee, um we

02:49have a lot of members of our Solid Waste

02:51team here present in case there are

02:53questions. We also have Taylor Madelene.

02:56Did I say that right?

02:57>> Yep.

02:58>> Oh, okay. I was like

02:59>> Testimony

02:59>> No, you're good.

03:00>> Um and Taylor was very instrumental on

03:02the Solid Waste Advisory Commission with

03:04helping to present this topic to them

03:06when they first originally brought this

03:08up in committee.

03:09Um and so we have a whole whole group

03:12here. Um Suki is adjoining us virtually

03:14and she will be helping to run us

03:16through just an overview, just to kind

03:18of introduce it. So, as y'all are

03:19hearing this information, if you have

03:21questions, be also thinking, okay, where

03:24are we going to go from here? We'll hear

03:25a little bit from the Attorney's Office

03:28uh today over what research they've done

03:30so far, but we imagine this will

03:31probably be a multi-meeting topic. So,

03:34as you kind of hearing things, think

03:36about what you're wanting to see from

03:38staff as you move this forward.

03:41So, I'm going to share my screen and

03:43Suki,

03:45you let me know

03:47if you can see it. Can you see it on

03:49your end, Suki?

03:50>> Yes, I can see it. Beautifully.

03:52>> Okay.

03:54Perfect.

03:55>> And Sarah, can I can I

03:58advance? I guess no, I'll have to ask

03:59you to advance, correct?

04:01>> You should be able to control.

04:04>> Right, let's see here.

04:07>> Let's

04:13>> It doesn't want to let me move it.

04:18>> Okay, well, I'm I'm moving it for you,

04:20Susan.

04:21>> Thank you. Sorry about that.

04:23>> I will be your Vanna, Susan. So, you

04:25just let us know when you are ready to

04:27advance.

04:27>> Excellent. I want to thank team members

04:29that are in there in I know I heard

04:31Sarah say that, but I want to reiterate

04:34this. If there's any background noise or

04:36issues here, Susan is ready to jump

04:38right in. She's been a part of this

04:39process. So, I want to thank Susan Lyon

04:41for being there, Taylor Madeline,

04:43Stacy Farrell, Stacy Smith actually gets

04:47the shout-out for all the data that was

04:50in this this presentation, and also

04:53Denise Clemmons for being Excuse me,

04:55Denise Young for being there. So, thank

04:58you all for being there and supporting

05:00this topic. So, what we're going to go

05:02over today is the Solid Waste Advisory

05:04Commission, we call it SWAC,

05:05recommendation, a little bit about the

05:08bag ban fee history from our that's

05:11happened to date, some data that we were

05:14asked to accumulate over time if we ever

05:18wanted to bring this forward again, or

05:20if Mayor and Commission wanted to bring

05:21this forward again.

05:23And then one of the policies that came

05:25out of this discussion back in 2019 was

05:28a policy that's in place, which is our

05:30policy that actually requires recycling

05:34at events, but also that it requires if

05:36you have two or more food vendors to

05:38have compostables

05:40have to be used by all restaurant or

05:42food vendors if we have two or more at

05:45an event on public property or an event

05:48that's sponsored by Athens-Clarke County

05:50Gov. So, we're going to talk a little

05:51bit about the success of that policy,

05:53and then at any time if you have

05:55questions, we got a great group of

05:56people

05:57in the room. Go ahead, Sarah.

06:02And these pictures are not AI generated,

06:04y'all. These are pictures that are all

06:06over our community and were captured by

06:09staff. Thanks to Susan and Stacy Smith

06:11for these pictures.

06:13Um the recommendation overview, we

06:15didn't just look at plastic bags when we

06:17were asked to back in 2019, but we also

06:20looked at Styrofoam. And now I'm going

06:22to tell you in this presentation, and I

06:24will accidentally say it probably, but

06:26Styrofoam is a brand name. So, we're

06:29really talking about expanded

06:31polystyrene, which we call EPS,

06:34and that's what we're talking about

06:35here, both film plastic or plastic bags,

06:38and then

06:40expanded polystyrene, Styrofoam, EPS. Um

06:44just some background why we're here

06:45again today is 2 million plus single-use

06:48takeaway bags are used annually, and

06:51that's an estimate

06:53here in Athens-Clarke County. Over 25%

06:56of the local restaurants here in

06:58Athens-Clarke County use expanded

07:00polystyrene EPS to-go items.

07:03And then plastic film and plastic foam

07:05are in the top 10 most littered items in

07:09Athens-Clarke County, and we'll go over

07:11that data. And those materials show up

07:14on the sides of the roads,

07:16and in our systems where they shouldn't

07:18be, at the MRF where they should not be,

07:21the recycling facility. MRF is the slang

07:24term for it, sorry. And in our storm

07:26drains, in our litter traps, which you

07:29have some data in this presentation

07:31about, and then of course in the natural

07:32landscape in general.

07:34So, back in 2019

07:37when we started researching this and

07:39discussing this, um, uh,

07:42we did a tremendous amount of research,

07:44discussions, and then COVID hit you all,

07:46so there is a big gap you'll see in the

07:48history, and that's mainly because of

07:50COVID.

07:51But the directive back in April, um, of

07:542024 that SWAC put forward was to the

07:57extent not to to conflict with ADA

08:00requirements, all government departments

08:02and retail establishments within ACC

08:05shall immediately begin to phase out the

08:07single the use of single-use expanded

08:09polystyrene Styrofoam service ware and

08:12single-use plastic carryout bags by

08:15incrementally eliminating or substitute

08:17such products with viable alternatives

08:20where possible. The aim back in 2024 was

08:24to fully implement, um, that directive,

08:27um, by April 30th, 2025, and we'll talk

08:30about what happened there. Sarah, if you

08:33could forward the slide.

08:35>> Okay.

08:38>> Little bit about the history. Um, again,

08:40I mentioned in, um, October 9th, 2019,

08:43we've started conversing a UGA Bag the

08:45Bag led the conversations and presented

08:48to SWAC. They also presented, um, and

08:51sat with many of our commissioners and

08:53the mayor.

08:54In 2019, um, Mayor Girtz charged SWAC

08:57with drafting the ordinance, um, or the

08:59directive we just I just read to you

09:02all. Um, he gave us an outline of what

09:04he would like to see, um, from that

09:06directive, and so we put that together.

09:09Um, but the unfortunate nature was at

09:11that juncture back in 2019, we didn't

09:14have as much data as we have now. So,

09:16the attorney's office asked us to pause

09:18that. Sherry Hines was instrumental in

09:21those early conversations with us. Came

09:24to SWAC, discussed what we would need to

09:26do if, uh, we ever brought this forward

09:28to the mayor and commission or to LRC

09:30again.

09:31Um, so, again, the the lag time here

09:34from 2019 to 2023 has almost everything

09:37to do with COVID, you all, but you can

09:38see Taylor Madeline, Dr. Taylor

09:40Madeline,

09:41in the room with you today, has a

09:44plethora of knowledge and works with Dr.

09:47Jamback on campus. And she started to

09:50educate we SWAC members about bag and

09:53EPS bans and the impact that bags, film

09:57plastic, and EPS have on our

09:59environment. So, all of those

10:01presentations were made available to the

10:03public. We did those the fall of 2023.

10:07We saw the presentations discussed and

10:09then came up with the recommendation and

10:12approval that Sarah sent out to you all

10:14as a PDF. It was multiple pages and that

10:16was the recommended recommendation from

10:18SWAC April 17th of 2024 and that was the

10:22directive I read on the previous slide.

10:25All right, Sarah.

10:26Yes.

10:27>> I have a question before you advance

10:29because I had someone

10:30reference previous history to this that

10:33this had come up before earlier than

10:362019.

10:38Um

10:39is there any earlier history

10:42in terms of the county

10:44exploring this option?

10:46>> Um

10:47we've discussed it

10:49before. I think it was even in an

10:51earlier I'd have to look back and see if

10:52it was in an earlier rendition of not

10:55our strategic plan, but our regional

10:56plan. I think it was mentioned in the

10:58regional plan in the regional plan and

11:01then Commissioner excuse me, Mayor

11:03Denson,

11:04when it was brought and discussed

11:06before.

11:08Staff not staff, it was Commissioner.

11:11I'll look back, Commissioner Myers, and

11:13make sure I have all the dates for you,

11:14but there was actually a push to do this

11:18during Mayor Denson's time.

11:21It did not make it to be discussed fully

11:24at that time, too. The plastic

11:28council, American Plastics Council,

11:31um, and Grocers, uh, the Grocers

11:34Association were coming out with, um,

11:37kind of canned legislation across the

11:40country to get bans on bags or Styrofoam

11:45or any plastic items

11:48out of local control. And so, at that

11:50juncture, um, and I can look up all the

11:53dates and the time, and I apologize that

11:54they're not here. I was trying to keep

11:56it to the most recent, but yes, there

11:57were, um, conversations um, when Mayor

12:00Denson, um, was

12:02the mayor, um, and, uh, it was,

12:06uh,

12:07uh, not, um, not move forward at that

12:10time.

12:13>> Are you going to be discussing anywhere

12:16in this presentation today whether the,

12:19uh,

12:20what would you say, the American Council

12:22on Plastics or other, have they changed

12:24their strategy,

12:26uh, in terms of

12:28lobbying

12:29states and other on it, or is that just

12:32as strong?

12:33>> Um, I would say it's just as strong. We

12:35have staff, uh, has already been reached

12:37out by, uh, folks that represent some of

12:40those organizations, um, and, uh, to let

12:44us know they would be reaching out to a

12:46mayor and commission and sharing, um,

12:49their feelings and their information

12:51about plastic bag bans and Styrofoam

12:54bans.

12:56>> The biggest here.

12:56>> Should it well, uh,

12:58kind of we're talking sort of historical

12:59context and timeline. You know, that

13:02earlier endeavor was also before a lot

13:04of coastal South Carolina, for example,

13:06implemented similar bans.

13:08Um,

13:09yours maybe in a different context

13:10historically.

13:11>> Right. And I I remember that the

13:13enthusiasm for it was, uh, majority of

13:16the commission

13:17when Mayor Denson, uh, was, uh, mayor.

13:20And, um, then that's where it ended at

13:23her desk. She was very adamant of not,

13:26but of her feelings against it against

13:29us doing that. And then, um we were

13:32hopeful with Kelly as mayor. And then,

13:36um

13:37>> What was the other piece that you just

13:38mentioned?

13:39>> [laughter]

13:39>> I mean, I can remember specifically

13:41going, "When can we just go back?

13:43Remember when we were just trying to do

13:45banned banned classic bags?" It was just

13:48like just, you know, and that's what I

13:50mean. I mean, it was big.

13:52It was a big idea and it was a great

13:53idea, but it just

13:55social unrest and the pandemic. I mean,

13:57it just like we've got literally

14:01>> Thank you for that.

14:03back

14:03>> Okay.

14:04>> But, I we don't have any of that

14:06information from outside sources in this

14:08presentation, but certainly can bring

14:10anything to a future meeting if

14:12necessary.

14:15Okay.

14:18Sarah, can you Thank you. And

14:21because of our conversations with Sherry

14:23Hines, and then our continued

14:25conversations with Courtney Davis in the

14:27attorney's office,

14:29we have been collecting data ever since,

14:33you know, well prior 2019, but we

14:35weren't focusing on foam fragments, foam

14:38foam plastic as much as we started to do

14:42when we were told that we need to show

14:44the impacts of those particular type of

14:46plastics on the environment. So, these

14:48this data is mainly from Keep

14:50Athens-Clarke County Beautiful. Stacy

14:52Smith is our data queen. She is awesome.

14:55And she gathers all this information for

14:57us annually. And so, the slide we're

14:59looking at right now is from the litter

15:01index. And the litter index, I want to

15:03emphasize before we go forward, is just

15:06a snapshot in time. It's one day where a

15:10handful of folks in Athens go to a

15:12stretch of roadway, and we count the

15:14number of litter items and identify

15:17those litter items, and send that back

15:19to Keep Athens-Clarke County Beautiful.

15:21So, this is a glimpse of of that period

15:25of time in this this early summer that

15:27we do that from 2021 to 2026. This is

15:30what our findings are. You can see that

15:33the bulk of what we find on the road is

15:36a plastic item. You're all So, we have

15:3963% of what we find on the side of the

15:41road is going to be a plastic item. Of

15:43that 63%, 18% are

15:47made up of bags and foam. And you can

15:49see bags are about 3.9% and foam 14.9%.

15:53That's what we're seeing on the side of

15:55the road. 37% are other materials from

15:57aluminum cans, glass bottles, paper,

16:00clothing, shoes, you name it. We have

16:02found it on the side of the road.

16:04And vapes now, cigarette butts, all of

16:07those make up some of the other items

16:09that we're seeing

16:11according to our litter index done in

16:13June of every year. You can go to the

16:14next slide, Sarah.

16:18Um and Stacy's done a good job at just

16:20showing you

16:22how

16:23how again foam fragments and plastic

16:25bags make up what we see on the side of

16:28the road. You can see here

16:31litter index item counts by year. So,

16:34you can see from 2021 to 2026 how many

16:37items we picked up or identified at that

16:39time. I think more importantly than the

16:42graph was what Stacy put together over

16:44on the chart at the top that tells you

16:46from 21 to 2026 how many plastic bags,

16:50the number of foam fragments,

16:53and then the number of foam items. So,

16:55items would be larger items like the

16:57clamshell that made it and hasn't broken

16:59down into the 5,000 foam fragments that

17:02it will eventually break down into.

17:05Again, this information is just from a

17:08single collection event across 30 100-m

17:12sites each year.

17:14So, like KCCB has indicated here, there

17:16are many other litter items all over the

17:19county that we are not collecting. This

17:21is a snapshot so we get a idea of what

17:23litter looks like in Athens-Clarke

17:25County.

17:26Next slide.

17:31Um

17:32and this slide I think is one of the

17:34best is the top 10 litter items in

17:36Athens. Um these are the wanted items

17:38that we don't want on the side of the

17:40road, we don't really want at the

17:41recycling facility. Um some need to go

17:44straight to the trash and some need to

17:45go um to the charm. But you can see the

17:48ranking um of the items from 2021 to

17:522026. Foam items and fragments has

17:55mainly been in the number one or number

17:57two slot. So it is hanging in there um

18:00at number one and number two and plastic

18:02bags um have been um as low as number

18:05nine as the most littered items to

18:07number 11. So you can see plastic uh

18:10foam fragments and plastic bags have

18:13been in the top 10 or 12 um since we

18:16have been pulling this information out

18:18so we could show how these types of

18:21plastics affect our waterways and how

18:24they affect our environment. Um so

18:27that's our cumulative ranking from again

18:28the litter index that KCCB does

18:31annually. And I don't know if Stacy

18:32Smith has anything. I think the next

18:34slide goes into the litter traps. Sarah,

18:36you can forward it but I'm going to see

18:37if

18:38Stacy Smith had anything to add. This is

18:40her data.

18:42>> We started in 2021 using the UGA Debris

18:47Tracker. Before that we did just a

18:49visual survey of like one to four how

18:51littered things are. But this has been

18:53able to get us more specific

18:55information. It's citizen science that's

18:58linked into Dr. Jambeck's and

19:01uh you guys's lab. And so and we find

19:04that these numbers track pretty well

19:06with also what's being found in the

19:08um

19:09the litter traps on the rivers and also

19:12tracks closely with um

19:15what we're seeing from the UGA data

19:18for the entire year.

19:24>> Thanks, Stacy. And speaking of litter

19:26traps,

19:27we have litter traps in Athens-Clarke

19:30County that the sustainability

19:31department places and monitors, and

19:34Stacy Farrell

19:36was joined the sustainability department

19:39during the last cleanout, which was in

19:42early Excuse me, back in August.

19:44The Dudley Park trash trap on Trail

19:46Creek.

19:48And what they found there, you can see

19:50right here. It talks about foam

19:52fragments and film frag- Excuse me, foam

19:54fragments and plastic beverage

19:57containers.

19:58And the number of items collected The

20:00number of items collected in August of

20:032026, it was 2,594

20:06of the items collected, the fragments of

20:09items that land in the traps,

20:122,466 were foam fragments. And then of

20:16course plastic beverage containers, you

20:17can see. And you can see the the

20:19poundage or the weight, 282.56

20:23lb.

20:24And then the total that was Excuse me, I

20:27jumped to July of 2023. It's showing you

20:29the difference between July of 2023 and

20:32then August of 2022 of this year. So you

20:35can see a visual and then some of the

20:38data that we're receiving from the trash

20:40traps trash traps. And if you could

20:42forward to the next slide, this gives

20:43you even more information and a visual

20:46from the trash traps' most recent

20:49cleanout.

20:51They haven't uh

20:54Film plastic is lighter, you all. So on

20:57the last slide you did not see film

20:59plastic listed, and that's because a lot

21:01of times the film plastic, either by the

21:03time it makes it into the litter, it

21:04might be a unidentifiable piece of

21:06plastic. It can also be weighted down by

21:09rocks or water and it remain in the

21:12channel until it starts to break down.

21:15So, it's a little harder to see plastic

21:18bags in their original form in the trash

21:22traps.

21:23But they did Stephanie Green with the

21:25sustainability department was shared

21:27this information the number of plastic

21:28bags collected since trash trap

21:31installation. You can see right there

21:33where how many and what trash traps the

21:37plastic bags were in. So, 73 in the

21:40trail creeks

21:42trash traps, 98 in Tanyard Creek, 11 in

21:45Trail Creek, and then 26 in Car Creek.

21:48And then Stephanie also summarized their

21:50lightweight film bags do fill with water

21:53and they sink, they get caught in

21:54branches, rocks

21:56and in the stream channel and don't

21:58always reach the trash traps. Not that

22:01pieces and parts may not be there, but

22:03they may start to disintegrate before

22:04they make it to the trash traps.

22:07So, that's additional data we wanted to

22:09make sure we shared with you about the

22:10impact of

22:12film plastic and foam on our waterways

22:16which is why many bands across the

22:19United States and Orfees have been put

22:22into place because of the impact on

22:24waterways from oceans, lakes, creeks and

22:28streams that are are near

22:30many of the communities.

22:32All right.

22:33>> And and so so gave back again just

22:34really quickly to another set um

22:37from a I mean beyond environmental from

22:39a municipal standpoint we had some

22:41conversations with the some of the storm

22:43water management staff as well and there

22:45was a survey back in 2020 where they

22:47kind of sampled the storm drains

22:49semi-weekly and actually categorized the

22:50different traps that they had to pull

22:52out from it.

22:53And over a course of a month when they

22:55from the 10 storm drains they pulled out

22:57almost 300 plastic bags back in the end

22:59of 2020 and they said that that number

23:01is still relatively consistent today.

23:04>> Mhm.

23:05>> Thank you.

23:05>> A month?

23:06>> In a month.

23:10It was the 286 plastic bags we picked

23:13up.

23:14>> Oh, thank you, Taylor.

23:17And then I I'd be remiss if we didn't

23:18add how much we spend annually and it's

23:20estimated every year the Litter

23:22Abatement Steering Committee or I

23:24wouldn't say every year, but almost

23:25every meeting we try to capture how much

23:28we're spending as different departments

23:31on litter abatement. Um and then the

23:34last time we really put all those

23:35numbers together have been a couple

23:37years ago, but we are averaging just

23:40over we with GDOT over a million dollars

23:43annual on litter cleanups, not just the

23:45film plastic and Styrofoam, but as you

23:47saw they make up uh especially Styrofoam

23:50some of the bulk of what we're seeing in

23:51our roadways, on the side of our

23:53roadways and in our waterways. So, we

23:56wanted to make sure you understood the

23:58cost and that cost comes from the great

24:01work that the Litter Abatement Steering

24:02Committee does. Next slide, please.

24:08Additional costs, um one of the big

24:10conversations and why we want to bring

24:11this forward, we don't have the exact

24:14numbers for our MRF, but we have we'll

24:17be working with RDS to see if we can get

24:19a better handle on exactly how much not

24:21so much Styrofoam or expanded

24:23polystyrene, but plastic bags. What the

24:27picture is showing you are star screens.

24:29Those are screens that move cardboard

24:31and other material along so that it can

24:33be properly separated and sorted at

24:36recycling facilities. Plastic bags along

24:39with other tanglers, but mainly plastic

24:41bags will wind around our star screens

24:44that cost again at thousands of dollars

24:46to replace. Um a simple bag that costs

24:50less than a penny to make can cost us

24:52thousand. In the United States, it's

24:54estimated that over 500 million dollars

24:56is spent annually damaging

24:59Murph's infrastructure.

25:01Um and in in Athens-Clarke County

25:03thousands are spent by our third party

25:05and ourselves

25:08Athens-Clarke County Solid Waste

25:09Department on operational expenses,

25:11manual labor.

25:13Staff has to physically climb up there

25:15and cut out the bags. Unfortunately,

25:18there's no easy way to get them out. So

25:20sometimes we'll have hours of downtime

25:22each week to try to get the plastic bags

25:25and other tanglers out. Um and then like

25:27I said earlier, thousands of dollars

25:29will have to be spent annually to repair

25:31star screens and other screens because

25:34of

25:35film plastic that gets wrapped around

25:37those screening devices. And then of

25:39course, film plastic doesn't belong at

25:41our Murph. At the charm, it's great.

25:43We'll take it, we'll bail it, and we'll

25:44sell it at the the the recycling

25:46facility. We do not want it. So we have

25:49to dispose of it as trash because once

25:51it makes it through our facility, it's

25:52not clean enough to be recycled and

25:54that's the same about Styrofoam.

25:56Styrofoam we do not want at our Murph

25:58either. So along with the thousands we

26:00spend on repairs and productivity

26:03downtime, we also have to dispose of

26:05Styrofoam and plastic bags in the

26:07landfill because they're not the quality

26:09that the charm can take for recycling.

26:12Sarah, you can go to the next Go ahead.

26:14>> And secondly, just two other quick

26:15things to you. Another

26:17in terms of staff time, another burden

26:19is that anytime you do any mowing or

26:21like landscaping around Athens, you also

26:23have to clean out and I guess I was

26:25going to have to go through ahead of

26:25time and think out all the bags and

26:26that's I've I've heard that that's been

26:27a major issue too because it's similar

26:29functioning. It becomes a big tangler.

26:31You know, it gets caught up in mowing

26:32equipment and things like that. So just

26:33extra time that we have to put.

26:36We're also in the process of working on

26:38a new Murph and upgrading the Murph

26:39here. So this would be like a perfect

26:41time to kind of set a precedent going

26:42forward, you know, as we're revamping

26:44kind of all of our recycling facilities

26:46in Athens to not have to deal with one

26:48of the lead lead tanglers.

26:50And on the point of the charm, yes, our

26:52charm does take plastic bags and that is

26:55a source of income because as he said

26:57they're able to bail it. But in talking

26:59to the charm actually their primary

27:00source by weight of the film plastic

27:03that they get in for that is secondary

27:05packaging so like the wrap that goes

27:06around things like um

27:08like shipping crates and things so they

27:10come from like Walmart or Target and

27:11things like that. So the residential and

27:13people that actually bring plastic bags

27:14from their home is actually really small

27:16portion of that so they would not it

27:18wouldn't necessarily like lose charm

27:19income. They would actually be happier

27:21to see a cleaner stream that's primarily

27:22that that secondary packaging.

27:25>> Cleaner and more yes, definitely more

27:26lucrative stream. Like Taylor said

27:29we

27:30the heavier plastics that we can get

27:31from places like Anheuser-Busch

27:33historically and UGA bring us more money

27:36too. The film plastic is a better grade

27:38of film plastic.

27:40Um and then lastly we just want to touch

27:42base on

27:44out of all of this conversation from bag

27:47bands to foam bands

27:50we were when we were discussing

27:53Commissioner Davenport

27:56really wanted to see something happen

27:57when we just started all of our

27:59discussions in SWAC and we felt like

28:02even though we couldn't ban bags or

28:05Styrofoam and it wasn't being brought

28:07forward to to discuss at that time

28:09pre-2019

28:12that something he wanted to see

28:14something done. So what he did we opened

28:16up our material management policy again

28:19and in SWAC they recommended SWAC

28:22recommended that anytime that we have

28:24two or more events on public property or

28:27ACC gov sponsored

28:30excuse me two events with two or more

28:32food or beverage vendors they have to

28:34use reusable, recyclable or compostable

28:37materials for single use items. What we

28:40have found that most of them it makes

28:42sense for compostable materials and so

28:45staff has been diligently working with

28:48um our major events. I will say in 2019

28:51when this was passed, it had to be

28:53paused due to COVID. There were no

28:55events for us to actually implement this

28:57policy for. So, we didn't have data for

28:59the first several years. Um staff's been

29:02doing a really good job at trying to get

29:03the major events like Twilight, AthFest,

29:06Hot Corner, Latinx,

29:08um and involved with this policy. Those

29:11are the major events that this policy

29:13applies to. But, then also a large event

29:15that we do internally that we've seen a

29:18lot of excess is the ACC Gov Employee

29:20Picnic hosted annually at Sandy Creek

29:22Park. Um and this is just a great

29:24example of how good policy can work um

29:27with lots of staff help though and staff

29:29guidance and education. You can see just

29:31this past year um our appreciation

29:34event, we used all compostables um or

29:36recyclables. We did have some recycling

29:38items there as well. Uh and a minimal

29:41trash. And I I really want to say

29:43it was embraced by outside uh company.

29:46Um and I'm not going to tell that

29:48company here, but I want to tell you

29:50that this company is not one that you

29:51would think it it's not one of our

29:53leading sustainable local government

29:55local, excuse me, um restaurants that

29:58want to see this happen. This was a

29:59restaurant that really went the extra

30:01mile to make sure everything was

30:02compostable or recyclable. Um and they

30:04did it and they've done it now for

30:06multiple years at our picnic. And this

30:08most recent one um because of their

30:10efforts working with uh staff and not

30:13just our staff, but Leisure Services

30:15staff and other staff that organized the

30:17picnic, um we had a 83.6%

30:20diversion rate from landfill. And that's

30:22just one snapshot, but um staff works

30:25really hard to work with all the major

30:28events mainly in downtown um to make

30:30sure they're in compliance and that

30:32we're seeing, you know, people using the

30:35compostable materials. And then what

30:37we're trying to do is make sure they put

30:39them in the compost bins so they can

30:40actually get composted. Sometimes that's

30:42where uh the policy what we can

30:46give the materials and work with the

30:49events to make sure they have the

30:50materials, but we can't always follow

30:52everybody around to make sure they're

30:54actually putting it in compost bins. So,

30:56that's sometimes the hardest part of

30:58this policy, but I think staff does a

31:00great job and I wanted to elevate this

31:03policy as an example of week of staff

31:07making it work and it was a great um

31:09addition to our material management

31:11policy back in 2019.

31:13And I think that's all we have today.

31:15Sarah, if you could, I think that was

31:17the last

31:18slide

31:19for today.

31:21>> [laughter]

31:23>> You there?

31:26Did you lose me?

31:28>> We did lost you for a minute briefly,

31:29but you're back.

31:34>> I think I'm done with that slide.

31:36I think that

31:37I think we're done. I think that was all

31:39we were going to discuss today is the

31:41history, the data, what the data shows

31:44about bans, uh excuse me, about film

31:47plastic and Styrofoam,

31:50and um a little bit about uh the success

31:53we've had with our material management

31:56policy.

31:59>> [clears throat]

31:59>> Does the committee have any questions

32:00related to what we've heard with the

32:02presentation

32:03so far?

32:05>> I have a question about formulation of

32:07plastic. Okay. So, Suki, is there a

32:10particular formulation of plastic that's

32:12less harmful others? And what I'm

32:15thinking about are

32:17um poop bags for um your pets.

32:22I guess

32:23>> Commissioner

32:25Yeah, Commissioner Johnson, I I didn't

32:26hear quite what you said. I I heard poop

32:29bags, but that's about all I heard.

32:32>> I was curious about if is there a

32:34formulation of plastic bags that is less

32:37harmful than in most. And

32:40my example is

32:42poop bags for animals.

32:44>> Got you.

32:44>> Like everybody uses those. Is there

32:47something different that people are now

32:49transitioning to?

32:51>> Well, I think already in the mix for

32:54fecal matter pick up for poop bags for

32:56animals,

32:57what we've seen, it's not 100% but

33:00compostable bags. Now, here's the bad

33:03thing about compostable bags and poop

33:05bags. The bag may be compostable but we

33:07don't want your dog poop at our compost

33:10facility.

33:11So, it's a little misleading in some

33:15some of the packaging that's sold out

33:16there is a little misleading, makes you

33:18think that a compostable uh

33:21commercial composter wants that poop bag

33:23with the poop in the bag and that's not

33:26the case. But often compostable bags are

33:30at least a different solution and many

33:34places around the US still allow what I

33:37would call a film plastic bag but they

33:39have asked for it to be a compostable

33:41plastic bag. So, there are some examples

33:44that we could bring. I don't know how

33:46many communities and Taylor may know

33:47more about that but I do know some

33:49communities have stayed away from bans

33:51but have moved towards compostable wears

33:55and instead of an outright ban. But I

33:57will say poop bags might be the example

34:00um

34:01that yes, you can spend a little bit

34:03more on that compostable bag. We just

34:05won't want to confuse people and think

34:06that we want that dog poop at our

34:08compost facility cuz we do not.

34:11>> And I and I think something too like the

34:13the material you use is really only as

34:15good as the systems that you have to

34:16manage it. So, for example, if you've

34:18got a place that where you switch

34:20entirely to compostable plastic bags but

34:22they can't be accepted in a system or

34:23they're just as likely to end up in the

34:25environment then it's then it's not

34:26going to be as beneficial. If you have a

34:28better kind of collection mechanism or

34:30if you're if they're able to be

34:31compostable then that's great. Um

34:33there's also in terms of from a policy

34:35standpoint there's a lot of fine print

34:36in terms of the different types of

34:38plastic. So for example, there are some

34:41things that would be considered

34:42compostable which are actually just

34:44oxodegradable. So they just kind of

34:45break down faster in the environment but

34:47they're the same kind of fossil fuel

34:48based polymers.

34:50>> Yeah.

34:50>> Um so it it kind of depends on the

34:51system that you're in.

34:52>> But the take away is you don't want to

34:54poop.

34:55>> You don't want to

34:55>> Yeah. [laughter]

34:56>> Yeah.

34:57>> You do not have the poop.

34:58>> Yeah.

35:00>> But I also see that you have in the

35:02policy itself poop bags are exempted.

35:06>> And then you can craft in there certain

35:08types of exemptions. Um that's one that

35:10you know would be potentially up for

35:12discussion but we had put that in there

35:14um just because there are a lot of

35:16people that use those and it and it is

35:18in some cases better than using the

35:20traditional plastic.

35:21>> Yeah.

35:21>> Um yeah, so if you want to speak more to

35:23the poop bag exemption.

35:25>> No, we were just trying to make that

35:26exemption cuz we do and here's the

35:28unfortunate thing, the reason we put

35:30that in there is because we see so much

35:33uh

35:34dog poop left behind. Here's the bad

35:36thing. We see it left behind on trails,

35:38you all. I think people have good

35:40intentions. They bag the poop, leave it,

35:42and think that on the way back out

35:44they'll pick it back up. So we were

35:46making the exemption there because we

35:48know that a town that has many dogs that

35:52a film plastic or a biodegradable

35:55plastic might still be the best way to

35:58be able to while running on the greenway

36:00or enjoying the Firefly Trail, the best

36:02way to cart off your the poop from your

36:04fecal matter. We were leaving that for a

36:06future discussion.

36:08>> Okay.

36:09In terms of this presentation, I I do

36:11have a question. Um you talked about the

36:15you know, obviously the litter is the

36:18litter that's one is seeing out there in

36:21the world and the effect on the machines

36:23at Murph and such. Um

36:26is there any information

36:28in terms of effect on health and how

36:31this can address that because I think

36:33there's been a lot more awareness of

36:36plastics as a health hazard.

36:39Um and so would there be

36:42it seems to me like that might be Would

36:44that be another reason for having a bag

36:48and foam

36:50ban whatever we're doing looking at

36:52here. Yeah.

36:54So Tiffany, you want to take that or do

36:55you want me to

36:55>> Go for it, Taylor, please.

36:57>> So I I would argue yes. I think that um

37:00you know, these types of policies

37:01haven't been in place long enough to

37:02necessarily measure human health impacts

37:04over time. Um we're at the point where

37:06we are able to say definitively that

37:08they do decrease litter of certain types

37:10of items. They decrease um household use

37:13of these types of plastic items. So we

37:15know that these type of mechanisms

37:17decrease the quantity and the exposure

37:19that people have to these plastic items

37:21and then simultaneously we know that um

37:24certain type of plastics contain

37:26chemicals that are known

37:36health challenges. So I think that you

37:38could you could make the argument. I

37:39think there aren't necessarily studies

37:41out there that draw a direct line

37:42because they just haven't really been in

37:43place yet and doing those sort of

37:44longitudinal health studies are are

37:46difficult because there's so many

37:47compounding

37:48>> there haven't been studies on the effect

37:51of a ban on health.

37:53>> Directly on the

37:54>> But there have been studies of the

37:55effect of plastics on health.

37:58>> Yes.

37:58>> Okay.

37:59>> Yeah. So there have been effects studies

38:02that have shown bans have led to

38:04decreased use of these types of

38:06single-use plastics in households. You

38:08know, they're less less prevalent in the

38:10environment in those places. And then

38:11yes, simultaneously there have been

38:13studies on human on human health and

38:14plastics, but I think there hasn't been

38:16like that direct line drawn. But you

38:18could I I think that you could make the

38:19case personally, but that's with my with

38:21my very academic hat.

38:23>> Well,

38:23>> it's I think also in terms of how the

38:27public perceives this. I mean, I think

38:30it's pretty clear that there is a health

38:32effect of plastics in the environment on

38:35on humans that we don't quite understand

38:38the extent of it, but it's there and

38:39there's a lot more awareness of it now.

38:42So,

38:43any kind of public I mean, this is

38:45public education

38:47against plastics in general. So, I think

38:51there is a that kind of

38:54effect on how people perceive plastics.

38:57>> Yes, definitely.

38:58And I'm I'm happy to provide some more

38:59data on that. I think another important

39:01part of that education is that you know,

39:02not not necessarily all plastics are

39:05created equal, but things like Styrofoam

39:07and plastic bags are things that people

39:08are regularly exposed to that we know

39:10have some you know, nasty chemicals in

39:12them that are likely to end up in the

39:14environment. So,

39:15it's not something where we want people

39:16to be afraid of like using their

39:18cardboard or using you know, chairs or

39:20pens or things like that and medical

39:22devices, but I think that there is a

39:23really important public message to get

39:25through about like tackling the things

39:26that we know are problematic.

39:28>> Thanks, Taylor.

39:29>> Thank you.

39:30>> Yeah, I feel like also like you know,

39:32when you think about the public one one

39:33thing that came to be

39:35that really seemed to impact public

39:39interest in this was like the

39:41microbeads, the plastic microbeads.

39:43Right, that became So, just to speak to

39:45what you're saying, that all of a sudden

39:46became something loud and clear that

39:51you know, people really started to

39:52change their behaviors and what they

39:53were purchasing.

39:55Industry started to change what they

39:56were putting in their products because

39:58there was an outcry from the public

40:00saying, "We don't want We don't want

40:02microbeads in our you know,

40:05shower gels and our face washes and so."

40:09>> Okay. Any other questions from the

40:11committee on the presentation?

40:13You heard a lot about the whys Um, I'm

40:15sure you will continue to hear about and

40:17beyond, as it's such an important part

40:18of this recommendation. But, Suzi, I

40:20almost wonder if it might be helpful to

40:22also kind of walk them through that Word

40:23document of the recommendation. I'm

40:25going to pull it up just to kind of

40:27orient them with the elements, you know,

40:30we referenced the exemption for food

40:31bags. That way you just kind of continue

40:33to do it at least at a large level. They

40:36all have a copy in front of them, and

40:37for anybody watching online, you can

40:40also find this with the calendar link.

40:43Um, but I'll

40:45But, Suzi, do you mind just walking us

40:47through a little bit of the

40:49actual recommendation?

40:50>> Yeah, could you scroll

40:52Can you Yes, thank you, Sarah. Can you

40:54move it up just a little bit? Um, I

40:56don't know that I need to go over I I

40:58read the directive, um, and then there

41:00are definitions so you would know what

41:02exactly we're talking about when we

41:04discuss department retail establishment

41:07in this document because basically this

41:10directive was for Athens-Clarke County

41:12government departments along with retail

41:15establishments phasing out

41:17uh, EPS and phasing out film plastic.

41:21Um,

41:22and if you could scroll up. And oh, and

41:24I I'll I will say retail I will You know

41:27what, Sarah? I know she paused there. I

41:29will say what a retail establishment is

41:31is any person, corporation, partnership,

41:33business venture, public sports or

41:36entertainment facility, government

41:37agency, street vendor or vendors at

41:39public events.

41:41So, um, and we

41:43public events including festivals,

41:45organizations that sell or provide

41:46merchandise, goods, and materials.

41:48Basically, we were trying to cover, um,

41:51most places that use the higher volume

41:54of bags. And then we gave examples also

41:57The examples include, again, this is not

41:59a limited to we I'm sure we did not

42:02cover everything. But, department

42:04stores, clothing stores, jewelry stores,

42:06grocery stores, and pharmacies, home

42:08improvement, liquor stores, convenience

42:10stores, and the list goes on. So, we

42:12wanted to make sure we um made it known,

42:15and there are some communities that

42:16don't have the bans and or fees placed

42:19on some of these, but this is where we

42:21felt like would be uh as a SWAC organ as

42:24our commission, where we felt like we

42:26would want to see those bans, and that

42:28this would make the biggest impact. So,

42:31if you can scroll forward just a little

42:33bit, Sarah, so everybody can see it as I

42:36Uh also

42:37Oh, go ahead.

42:39>> Suki, this is Allison again. Um

42:41in the category B, it can we

42:43What Why is that last sentence Why are

42:46we allowing

42:48>> 501(c)(3)

42:49>> distributions? Because in in my district

42:51in particular, there's a lot of bags

42:54thrown in food distribution.

42:56Um

42:57there, and I'm wondering why we would

43:00pick

43:01pick that sentence to be in there.

43:03>> Um at that time um we were

43:07I can't recall the exact conversation,

43:09and so I might not have to have Steph

43:10help me, but at that time we felt like

43:12we didn't want to make it cumbersome if

43:14there wasn't an alternative for um food

43:17banks or food assistance programs, and

43:19that became a conversation with at that

43:22time um the person that was running the

43:24Northeast Georgia Food Bank um was

43:26asking

43:28for

43:29had conversations and asked for um grace

43:32when it came to plastic bags. But, if

43:35somebody remembers the entire

43:36conversation, um

43:38I'm sorry, you're some of y'all are

43:39breaking up a little bit, and I

43:40apologize.

43:42>> Uh

43:43Suki, it's Allison again. Um

43:45I guess my ideal was that would be the

43:47one of the easiest groups to supply

43:49reusable bags to.

43:51It's a tar you know, that's that would

43:53be a more targeted educational

43:56component versus um

43:59others. Anyway,

44:00but it's just a

44:02but we're we're just

44:04brainstorming on what you put in front

44:06of us.

44:06>> And and that's also something too where

44:08you could allow, you know, a slightly

44:09longer grace period for adoption with a

44:11with a certain stakeholder group or if

44:13further consultation was needed, but I

44:14think I think Sophie's right that it

44:16could that came from a conversation

44:18specifically with the Northeast Georgia

44:19Food Bank at the time. Um and I don't

44:22think it was necessarily a, you know, a

44:24fully black and white. I think it was

44:26just more like we need to have more

44:27conversations about how we can roll this

44:28out with these with this stakeholder

44:30group.

44:31I know it hasn't been done before. Yeah.

44:33>> Correct.

44:35>> Thank you.

44:37And then we go on to define. You can see

44:39litter, plastic, single use. There's the

44:42definition we talked about before,

44:44expanded polystyrene, um and I think I

44:47explained that towards the beginning.

44:49The EPS service wear single use plastic

44:51carryout bag. We tried to define as many

44:54things so there would be um

44:56no misunderstanding of what we were

44:58talking about. Um exempted items, uh you

45:02can see right here, would be bags used

45:04by customers while shopping within the

45:05retail establishment establishment to

45:07package loose bulk items such as fruit

45:10or vegetables. Um so if you're in the

45:12produce section, um we were not um

45:15actually singling those out at this

45:17time. Um although sometimes people find

45:20that the easiest to bring in with them.

45:22Um but produce items and then items when

45:25you go to Lowe's, um you may not have a

45:28bag if you go to get, you know, loose

45:30nails or screws, bolts, things like

45:33that. That was also um items that we

45:35would exempt from this policy. Um and

45:39you can also see the the

45:41uh wrapped frozen foods, meat, fish, uh

45:44whether prepackaged or not, or um also

45:47uh wrapped flowers, um potted plants, or

45:51other other items. So some of these are

45:54I guess more logical. Um it's a little

45:56bit harder um once you make it into the

45:58store um to have uh

46:02those bans in place as well, but these

46:04are the items that we were exempting.

46:06Also, newspaper bags, which I are almost

46:09non-existent anymore, um but we listed

46:11them in here. Door hanger bags, which we

46:13see every once in a while. Dry laundry

46:16dry cleaning bags that um are placed

46:19over the the clothing um when you get it

46:22back. Or bags sold in packages

46:24containing multiple bags intended for

46:26garbage or pet waste. So, those are some

46:28of the exempted items. So, nobody gets

46:30upset. We're not trying to go into the

46:32stores and exempt some of those smaller

46:34bags that may still be needed um for

46:38items such as produce or small items um

46:42or uh meat items in in in some of those

46:45stores.

46:46Um so, that that was some of the

46:49exempted items. Again, this could be

46:51still a conversation. Commissioner

46:53Wright, like you brought up the point of

46:55the food banks. So, that could be a

46:58conversation point as well.

47:00Um and then as far as acceptable plastic

47:02ware for service, um you can see in many

47:04case in cases where plastics may be used

47:07such as service ware that is not EPS

47:09such as plastics deemed acceptable shall

47:11be defined as BPI certified. That's what

47:14we use now, and that's the certification

47:18that the US Composting Council, the

47:19Georgia Composting Council, and we

47:21locally want in our composting

47:24infrastructure. Um BPI comes with a

47:26level of confidence. That certification

47:29is harder to come by, and it comes uh

47:32because it's compo it actually is

47:34compostable. It doesn't tain uh contain

47:37uh certain materials um

47:39uh

47:41that don't need to be there. Um and it

47:44it it it's a great certification, and

47:46that's what we want when we're talking

47:47about compostables. Also, um BPI

47:50certified has eliminated PFAS and and

47:53PFA compounds from their plastic bags.

47:57Um so, that would be acceptable service

47:59ware, uh, 100% uh, recyclable, which

48:01might be a little bit harder to come by.

48:05>> I spoke too fast, sorry.

48:06>> Nope.

48:07And so you can see that I wanted to just

48:09point out those those pieces for the EPS

48:12service ware. So then it goes into the

48:14public education requirement. We knew

48:16this wasn't going to happen overnight,

48:17so we wanted to make sure that we had

48:19phased in application or phased in

48:23um, components so that people would

48:25understand what is coming.

48:27And so that's the public education

48:28requirement that we had. Also in here is

48:32potentially the solid waste department

48:34or ACC gov providing bags for people

48:37that may not be able to afford cloth

48:39bags. Um, that was also um, discussed

48:43um, in the SWAC. So we wanted to make

48:46sure everybody was able to have bags.

48:48Um, so um, and sorry, I think um,

48:53I hiccuped and went into another

48:54department. Sorry about that, you all.

48:58>> You're good.

48:59Any question about that um,

49:01the education um, timeline? It confused

49:05me because I thought the I thought the

49:07implementation of this program

49:10uh,

49:12back on the effective date was basically

49:14a year out after

49:16the passing of the ordinance or whatever

49:19we're we're calling it here.

49:21Um,

49:22so and then the education was

49:25made public no later than 15 months so

49:28after the effective date. So I'm a

49:30little

49:32confused.

49:32>> Exactly. 15 months before the effective

49:35date.

49:36>> Well, earlier it says the effective date

49:38is

49:39like on the first page is is one.

49:41Otherwise, I think it was that. So it's

49:44it's just a year out. So Suki,

49:47is there a am I missing something?

49:49>> What we were trying to do was from the

49:51passage of this until the actual

49:55implementation. We were trying to phase

49:56it in in over a year. I think, and I

49:59apologize commissioner, I didn't maybe

50:01hear the entire question and there could

50:03be a miscommunication from the the

50:05beginning of the document to this part,

50:07but we were trying to phase this in over

50:09a year.

50:10Um, after mayor and commission approved.

50:15>> I have a feeling that there was a there

50:16was a may have been like a terminology

50:18completion here in terms of when it it

50:20was

50:21I mean when it's actually implemented is

50:22when it was passed maybe. Um, or when,

50:25you know, when the plans actually start

50:26being developed. I think that might have

50:28been, yeah, that might have been the

50:30completion. But you're right, I think

50:31that if we

50:33if we are if the plan is to have it be

50:36fully rolled out within a year, I think

50:38the education program needs to happen

50:39within that timeline.

50:40>> Yeah, okay.

50:41>> The whole time. It needs to be the whole

50:43time.

50:44>> Yeah, that's just

50:46>> given some

50:47>> Good question though.

50:48>> Yeah, yeah.

50:48>> Yeah, but it's a consistency

50:50>> in but

50:51>> Yeah.

50:51>> And this makes it sound like you're not

50:53going to have that you don't have to

50:54have it until 15 months afterwards and

50:56then you'd start doing the education.

50:58>> Right, yeah. You don't you don't want to

50:59do that.

51:01>> Yeah, I think

51:01>> Okay, all right. So then you can clean

51:03that up.

51:03>> Yeah.

51:04>> Well, it seems to me that with all the

51:06budget needs, the um,

51:09education requirement uh, it almost

51:11seems that the education roll out could

51:14be a year and we could we we'd be able

51:17to have enough data to even see the

51:19difference in the education part

51:22and

51:23to help us as it happened as it's

51:26happening in the education part of it to

51:28me because that because that gives um,

51:32more a stronger uh, support for it.

51:35>> And it seems

51:36>> to those timelines.

51:37>> Yeah, and I think in the implementation

51:39study we had we had outlined when when

51:41we should be kind of collecting data or

51:43at least compiling collected data to

51:44see, you know, effectiveness and track

51:46that over time. For the when the bag ban

51:49went into effect in DC, they were able

51:50to see changes in litter

51:53changes in the usage of plastic bags by

51:55consumers and the change in sale of

51:57plastic bags from the point of sale

51:59after 6 months.

52:00So, I think we would recommend doing at

52:01least at 1 year and then 2 years.

52:04But, I yeah, I think I mean even within

52:05the first 6 months or so after it's

52:07fully in effect, you should be able to

52:08see some of those differences and you

52:10can tailor it to see the

52:11>> Yeah, and remind me, is it New York City

52:13or the whole state that banned it?

52:15>> Um, I think that one is state-wide. I

52:17have no idea.

52:18Um

52:20Uh, yeah, New York's got a state-wide

52:21ban.

52:22>> Cuz I Does it say what when what year it

52:24was?

52:25>> I don't know.

52:25>> Cuz I remember thinking if they can do

52:27it

52:28>> Sure.

52:29>> That was not that long ago. I want to

52:31say I know I want to say It seems I

52:33don't have a date on here for that for

52:34New York, but they do have a state-wide

52:35ban.

52:37>> Anyway.

52:37>> And it's growing.

52:38>> Yeah.

52:39>> Um, and there are there are several

52:40cities um that do have um you know,

52:43city-level, municipal-level policies in

52:45place in the absence of a state-level

52:46ban. Um, so there is precedent for that,

52:48too.

52:49>> Any in GA?

52:50>> Um, so there is one in

52:53I mean, it's a Fulton Is it South

52:56Fulton? Is it South Yeah, South Fulton's

52:58got a plastic bag ban in place. Um

53:01Hartsfield-Jackson, which is basically a

53:03city in itself, has got a bag ban in

53:05place.

53:06Um, I think Columbus had drafted one.

53:09I'll check.

53:11Um,

53:12what did I say?

53:12>> Well, we can speak to that a little bit.

53:14Taylor, do you

53:15>> Give you all the info.

53:15>> Yeah, yeah. Um, we've done So, So, South

53:18Fulton probably has the most First, I

53:20guess base and Taylor can show you the

53:22map.

53:23>> These are not plastic bag bans are not

53:25necessarily uncommon. I mean, right?

53:27They're Um, certainly growing Um

53:30and throughout the United States. They

53:31are not very common in Georgia.

53:33Um, they are very common on the coastal

53:35South Carolina to um Mayor Burts' point.

53:38Um but the city of South Fulton has the

53:41what I would call the really the only

53:43ban plastic bag ban in the state.

53:46And then the city of Atlanta has a

53:49plastic bag ban and also like a

53:51Styrofoam ban for its own properties

53:53which includes Hartsfield-Jackson. So

53:55you can imagine Hartsfield-Jackson is

53:56big as Atlanta airport now.

54:00And then there are a couple of other

54:01cities

54:01and those are both by ordinance. The

54:03others

54:05Clarkston, Savannah, they all have

54:07resolutions that are much more

54:09aspirational and it's really about their

54:11own government own property, government

54:13leased properties. So I would say that

54:15if we're going to look to any example

54:17within the state you would look to South

54:18Fulton city of South Fulton.

54:20And it is it's actually very very very

54:24similar to and it has the same exception

54:27as the whole lot I imagine. It is very

54:28much in South Fulton had.

54:29>> [laughter]

54:31>> What

54:32I would and I it to my knowledge I don't

54:35believe that it's been challenged

54:37at all. I do have a curiosity and we

54:40would want to look into more about the

54:42enforceability. Like what to what extent

54:44it's being enforced. I will say I sort

54:46of

54:47South Fulton does a really good job of

54:48publishing their ordinance violations

54:51and I was scrolling through them the

54:53other day and I and did you know I just

54:55kind of scanned through a couple of

54:56years and I didn't see any ordinance. I

54:58didn't see any citations for

55:00So I am curious about enforceability.

55:03Yeah, right.

55:06So that is something I really want to

55:07look to. Now they do for their own

55:09government property I believe that they

55:10you know in their own spaces they do.

55:12But they do have a retail ban on

55:14plastic bags as well.

55:17>> And that's kind of the direction I would

55:19like to see for the next meeting is us

55:22seeing those Would you say the city of

55:25South Fulton and the city of Atlanta

55:28that's including Hartsfield?

55:29>> City of Atlanta is only for its

55:31properties. It's not for retail

55:32establishments. But I mean the

55:34Hartsfield-Atlanta is obviously a ton of

55:37retail establishments. Yeah.

55:39>> patron

55:39>> Mhm.

55:40>> um exchange opportunity to

55:43>> Mhm.

55:44>> help, I think, cuz a lot of education on

55:47this

55:48of the why

55:49and and the feasibility is is going to

55:52be key.

55:53>> Yeah.

55:53>> Um just to even get this one out of

55:56committee and to approved.

55:59>> the part of it and

56:00>> full grand Um but the data also is

56:04I didn't realize that they were waiting

56:06for the data.

56:08That's part of

56:09>> of the

56:09>> The first half part of the history was

56:11waiting for that part of it. Um see the

56:14more impressive.

56:15>> I also like to add in a couple of places

56:18that are not Georgia. So in this like

56:20>> Oh yeah, sure.

56:21>> And I'm doing research and turn this

56:23semester and about it. She does some

56:25great research so we can compile that

56:26for you guys especially at a

56:28I told her to avoid places like

56:30California and stuff or if you maybe

56:31it's not as translatable. Yeah.

56:34Um so she really she pulled most of the

56:36coastal South Carolina city ordinances

56:38and things like that. So we'll share

56:39those with you guys as well.

56:41>> And including anything that can be

56:42gathered on enforceability, you know.

56:45>> And that is our Yeah, and I

56:47Is it okay if I just

56:48>> Yeah, come out of it.

56:49>> So this is great because I know when

56:51this has been brought up previously

56:52Cherry um

56:54suggested that what we really needed I

56:55mean the best ordinances most defensible

56:57ordinances are ones that show that oh

56:58there's this very demonstrated need and

57:00this is how we are It's a it's a public

57:02policy like a um need and this is how

57:05we're going to address it. So this is a

57:07great

57:08great augmentation. I would like to see

57:09Taylor, you mentioned it. The only thing

57:11I I would like to also build up sort of

57:14the connection between So I see how much

57:16plastic bags are in um circulation and

57:19are part of litter, but that information

57:22you talked about how we have enough data

57:23now from other communities to show okay,

57:25well once they put a bag ban in place,

57:27it reduced litter by this much. That

57:29would be really helpful.

57:31>> Yeah, I've got I I have I have a couple

57:32of those that I have a couple of them on

57:33hand, but I can also just share the

57:34studies around. But they yeah,

57:37it decreases I think they they found

57:39like anywhere it's usually around 30% in

57:41the first couple years. Um, but yeah,

57:43I'm happy to share that.

57:44>> Okay.

57:44And I think having the

57:46the longer

57:50build up to it with the education

57:51component is also going to allow people

57:55the the food bank example. That they

57:57will have gone through their supply and

58:00to know that they should go a different

58:01route. Um, something like that. It's

58:04giving the supply

58:06whittle down. I think um

58:09>> Yeah, and I think that long run way

58:10definitely helps with that. Um, the

58:12other enforceability is is so key and I

58:14think that there's a lot to be learned

58:15from from South Fulton. Um, I think

58:17another another component of the

58:19enforceability is I think that we we've

58:20learned over time. I mean at the one

58:22point there were over 500 like

58:24ordinances related to plastic bags in

58:26the US and I think that was back in

58:272021. So it's probably gone down a bit

58:29because there's been some state level

58:30preemptions.

58:32Um but uh we've learned a lot about

58:34language that leads to unintended

58:36consequences. So like things like um

58:39you know, if you if you say that it's

58:41only like a certain thickness of plastic

58:43bag that people will just switch to a

58:44thicker bag which will lead to more

58:45plastic waste ultimately. Um, or if you

58:48you know, don't clarify what what type

58:50of compostable you want then it will

58:51lead to sort of unintended consequences

58:53again kind of usually environmental um

58:55consequences. But I think that you're

58:57absolutely right that it's only as good

58:58as it's enforceable. Um, and there have

59:00been a lot of lessons that have been

59:01learned um over the last couple years

59:03and and what works and what doesn't work

59:05on that. And I think that the those

59:06little details are really important.

59:08>> Okay, so that's great. That's exactly

59:10what we were thinking through too. Um,

59:12and so I sat down yesterday. Laura Cobb

59:14does most of our ordinance violation cuz

59:16this would be an ordinance violation,

59:17right? You would be cited for it. You'd

59:19be there

59:20fine associated with it. So we kind of

59:22talked through enforceability, kind of

59:24just questions we would have for other

59:26communities. And certainly, I am curious

59:28about if they are really enforcing it.

59:31But also, we discussed a lot and this

59:33came up in all of our ordinance

59:35discussions previously,

59:37recently, who decide? Right? Do you know

59:40or do the retailers? Like

59:41>> What what was the word I just used?

59:42>> Who decide? So, the manager of Kroger at

59:47that on that shift or the Do you know

59:49what I mean? The owner of You know, the

59:51So, the sort of thinking through things

59:53like that.

59:54>> Yeah, definitely.

59:54>> Um and even if there's I mean, we can

59:57build in some flexibility there, but

59:58what is effective? And then who who's

1:00:01deciding? Um

1:00:02>> It's It seems like it's I mean, am I

1:00:04missing something or is it easier to

1:00:06prove and forget about the citing part?

1:00:08You know, like the family ordinance or

1:00:10even the noise thing, some of those are

1:00:12hard to prove, it seems like. And And I

1:00:15know there's a personnel and staff, but

1:00:18um you know, again, you go into Kroger,

1:00:22you take picture, they're there, they're

1:00:24not there. You have your evidence. I

1:00:25mean, am I

1:00:26>> Yeah, that does seem Yeah.

1:00:28>> [laughter]

1:00:28>> Seems like the Kroger seems like much

1:00:30less time and intensive than the going

1:00:33after the family ordinance violation,

1:00:35which seems to be like a whole like, you

1:00:38know, a whole debate

1:00:39there.

1:00:40>> Yeah, I don't know about I mean, yes,

1:00:42that seems likely.

1:00:43>> be I'd be interested on that as well.

1:00:45Because any There's if that's trickier

1:00:48than that, are you allowed to take

1:00:50pictures? I mean, what was the thing we

1:00:51discussed last week where you had to

1:00:54Right. Go.

1:00:55>> About having probable cause and and and

1:00:58>> Right. Go and take a picture and start

1:01:00an investigation about whether a family

1:01:02exceeds the divisor, these kind of

1:01:03things. So,

1:01:04>> I would imagine like Charles County and

1:01:06Beaufort County would be able to say,

1:01:07"Hey, here's here's functionally what we

1:01:09do on our

1:01:09>> Right. Right. Right. Yeah, exactly.

1:01:11>> And And you could just have um

1:01:14I mean,

1:01:15I I was just shocked last week or last

1:01:17month when we saw the

1:01:19the small number of ordinance um

1:01:23complaints that had been submitted on

1:01:25the family.

1:01:26>> Yeah.

1:01:27>> Yeah, violation of the definition of

1:01:29family based on the how big of issue of

1:01:33discussion it is. So, um

1:01:35>> Yeah.

1:01:36>> This seems like it'd be really easy to

1:01:38like

1:01:38>> It feels like it does it. We will check

1:01:40in. I

1:01:41My concern

1:01:42At least at least

1:01:44just from the outside looking in it's

1:01:46helpful in my

1:01:47My suspicion is it's not really being

1:01:48enforced. Do you know what I mean?

1:01:50That's just based on I know there are

1:01:52smaller cities that will do like

1:01:54randomized checks.

1:01:55>> Yeah.

1:01:56>> Um you know, like they'll the the um

1:01:58retailers will be made aware that like

1:02:00at you know, at some point in the next

1:02:01several months there will be someone

1:02:02that will come in, you know, not being

1:02:03too specific about it, but they'll do

1:02:05like a random check where someone will

1:02:06have to go around every couple months

1:02:08and see if

1:02:08>> Right.

1:02:09>> you know, if they're are selling or are

1:02:11distributing plastic bags. Um and that

1:02:13way it's someone that if they do find it

1:02:14they can say like, I'm an official, this

1:02:15was a check.

1:02:16>> Um

1:02:17>> Right.

1:02:17>> But I think that Oh, but that's a good

1:02:18question too about whether or not

1:02:20something like someone taking a picture

1:02:21that was, you know, time stamped or

1:02:22something would be relevant. Um and then

1:02:24exactly figuring out like at what scale

1:02:26along the supply chain do you do you

1:02:28find someone that

1:02:28>> Exactly. Well, and to your point about

1:02:30the So, I will say this, most code

1:02:32enforcement, this would be a code

1:02:34enforcement

1:02:35Most code enforcement cases are it's

1:02:37complaint driven.

1:02:39>> Right.

1:02:39>> So, somebody would walk in to Kroger.

1:02:41>> Oh, I hate to keep using Kroger.

1:02:42>> They're the ones who are actually trying

1:02:43to get rid of them.

1:02:44>> Yeah, yes.

1:02:45>> So,

1:02:46Kroger's a good Kroger is a good

1:02:48corporate partner.

1:02:50They are.

1:02:51Okay, well, we'll say Walmart.

1:02:53Commissioner Johnson has said Walmart.

1:02:55>> [laughter]

1:02:58>> Somebody could walk in, see the bag, and

1:03:00then report it to code enforcement,

1:03:01right? And that

1:03:02>> That therein lies your complaint driven

1:03:04sort of process. So, we were also

1:03:06talking through whether or not it is a

1:03:08complaint driven process, which is more

1:03:10typical for code enforcement, or whether

1:03:12it's more like the health department

1:03:13that goes on and does these normal

1:03:14inspections. So, those are kind of

1:03:15things to think through from an

1:03:17enforcement perspective as well.

1:03:18>> Definitely. Maybe a great class project

1:03:20because the health department actively

1:03:22out there

1:03:22>> Looking Well, you know how the the

1:03:24restaurant like yeah, the health

1:03:26inspections.

1:03:27Um and then sorry, I was writing notes

1:03:30as everybody was talking just so I make

1:03:31sure I talked about it all. I think also

1:03:33in terms of the data that would be

1:03:35provided, I think something that could

1:03:36and I'm just trying to think ahead about

1:03:38anybody who would challenge a ban

1:03:41would be also why a ban and not a

1:03:44um

1:03:45You know

1:03:47>> Because a lot of We've all been to

1:03:48places, right? Where it's 10 cents a bag

1:03:49or something like that.

1:03:51>> Um so why a ban is more effective than a

1:03:54fee, I think that would be really

1:03:55helpful.

1:03:56>> And there there was a great study that

1:03:57came out in 2025 that looked across a

1:03:59bunch of different plastic bag bans and

1:04:00found that in terms of translation to

1:04:03like less litter ending up in the

1:04:04environment, places that had outright

1:04:05bans that did did translate to a much

1:04:07higher percentage of great of reduction.

1:04:11That said, you know, the benefit of

1:04:13something like a fee or a ban and that

1:04:14then you do have a certain amount of

1:04:15revenue that potentially goes back into

1:04:17community and however you want it to.

1:04:19But um from an environmental perspective

1:04:22and an outright ban is definitely better

1:04:23and it will also

1:04:25hopefully save retailers funding over

1:04:27time too because it at least in DC it

1:04:29cut their, you know, this distribution

1:04:31and purchasing of plastic bags from

1:04:33retailers by like half in the first 6

1:04:35months or so.

1:04:36>> And if retail establishment could decide

1:04:39that let's say you ban the plastic bags,

1:04:42they could decide to charge you know, a

1:04:44maybe people themselves for the paper

1:04:46bag.

1:04:48>> Or a lot of places the city of South

1:04:50Fulton requires I think I think it was

1:04:52the

1:04:52requires actually that you sell reusable

1:04:56bags.

1:04:57That's part of the ordinance is that you

1:04:58actually sell reusable bags

1:05:01in your establishment or retail

1:05:02establishments.

1:05:05>> Courtney, could you check Sherry Hines

1:05:07told us that the fee she wasn't sure

1:05:10that we could actually implement the fee

1:05:13in Georgia. That's why we stayed away

1:05:15That's why we stayed away from that

1:05:17almost completely, Courtney, is cuz one

1:05:19of our meetings with Sherry, she told us

1:05:21to stay away She kind of im-

1:05:23I think she outright told us, if I look

1:05:25in the minutes, I'll have Susan

1:05:26double-check,

1:05:27uh to stay away from the fee and move

1:05:29towards the ban. She felt like that was

1:05:31a better path forward in Georgia. So, I

1:05:33just want to make sure we captured that

1:05:35um in

1:05:36>> There was a concern that it could be

1:05:37challenged as a

1:05:38>> as a tax.

1:05:39>> as a tax.

1:05:39>> That makes sense, yeah.

1:05:41But, I know other communities have been

1:05:42able to, you know, impose these fees.

1:05:45And I just think we

1:05:47think through it in terms of

1:05:49why it's not a great alternative.

1:05:50>> And care I know that we'll have several

1:05:52meetings on this with the different

1:05:54topics. Some other considerations I'd

1:05:57like to learn about is um

1:05:59what I would imagine is improved

1:06:02alternative supplies.

1:06:04Or the educational component about how

1:06:08Yes, you could put a hot drink in a a

1:06:10non-Styrofoam

1:06:12I think uh or any I'm hoping that it's

1:06:15not going to be costing more to have a

1:06:18non-Styrofoam

1:06:20plate to go in and stuff like that. So,

1:06:23>> Yeah, and it'd be good to to pull some

1:06:25feedback and some data from the

1:06:26transition that we've been doing for

1:06:27like a vendor event. Cuz

1:06:29>> Yeah.

1:06:30>> So, that's some additional details I

1:06:33think that'll need to come forward in in

1:06:34the educational part of it. We We can't

1:06:38um

1:06:38recommend a specific brand, but we can

1:06:41be knowledgeable about what's out there

1:06:44as substitutes. And then the other one

1:06:47you talked about um coastal the bans on

1:06:50coastal. I would also like to see if

1:06:53Columbia, South Carolina, as a college

1:06:55town

1:06:55>> Okay.

1:06:56>> that if they might be a comparable

1:06:58community if they could do that cuz I

1:07:01think that the campus is going to be a

1:07:03huge ally for this.

1:07:05>> Yeah.

1:07:05>> There's been a lot And there's been a

1:07:06lot of groups student groups and and the

1:07:09office of sustainability EPA can think

1:07:10about this a lot. So, I think when we

1:07:12did our our internal presentation at

1:07:14SWAC we did have a section where we

1:07:15specifically were looking at college

1:07:17towns that have done this. So, again,

1:07:18there could be some good data on that

1:07:19and I can look up the cities that we

1:07:21>> Yeah.

1:07:21>> briefed into.

1:07:22>> Perfect.

1:07:23That'd be great.

1:07:24>> Yeah, if you already have that, that

1:07:25would be very helpful. I have

1:07:27>> Well, we have the mayor here. Um

1:07:30let's just make sure because the scope

1:07:32that was sent to us was to ban plastic

1:07:34bags.

1:07:35>> The presentations we did for the meeting

1:07:37and the information is there and

1:07:39back and forth and back.

1:07:42Um

1:07:43mayor.

1:07:44>> I'm I'm I'm I'm happy with the slightly

1:07:47expanded scope. I mean, it really

1:07:49addresses the main question.

1:07:51>> Okay.

1:07:51>> And as a

1:07:52long outer litter collector in this

1:07:55town, uh I do see an enormous number of

1:07:58not just the whole container, but the

1:07:59fragments particularly.

1:08:01It's amazing how quickly they become

1:08:03confetti out there when running over by

1:08:05the number of number of doors.

1:08:07>> And the data there appears to support

1:08:09the last one. I'm glad that you're good

1:08:11with that. Thank you, mayor.

1:08:14>> Absolutely.

1:08:15>> Can we offer ideas?

1:08:17>> Yeah.

1:08:18>> Or is that next meeting?

1:08:19>> No, um you're welcome.

1:08:20>> Okay. So, you know how Suki at every

1:08:23presentation you give to the public, you

1:08:25always bring a ton of recyclable bags,

1:08:28those big large green ones with the

1:08:30pictures.

1:08:31And so, I see them all the time when I

1:08:34go to the Cleveland Road recycle um area

1:08:39and people use them. So, I was curious

1:08:43um what about a smaller size, like a

1:08:45grocery store size, you know, as um

1:08:49one per you know, paid customer and it's

1:08:52a start. I actually got shamed. I went

1:08:55to a store and I didn't have any bags

1:08:57and I actually bought bags. Um but they

1:09:00weren't expensive and I'm not sure if

1:09:02what the revenue cost of that would be,

1:09:05but ever since I I paid a dollar for

1:09:09like their correct bag, I I got three

1:09:12more, you know, when I buy like a full

1:09:14like a full week's of gro- full week of

1:09:16groceries and I always have them.

1:09:20And they and they are some are insulated

1:09:22and and two are not, but I see more and

1:09:25more and more people once they start the

1:09:27one like me like they they add on to it

1:09:30and then you don't even think about

1:09:31plastic bags.

1:09:32Um is that an an initiative

1:09:35if revenue is available

1:09:37to like maybe give a bag to like the

1:09:40paying customers and maybe talk to the

1:09:42private haulers like to kind of join

1:09:44that same

1:09:45um conversation just to initiate like

1:09:49the importance of what we're trying to

1:09:51transition to.

1:09:53>> Uh yes, and we have given out bags. Uh

1:09:55Commissioner Johnson, I know probably

1:09:56not since you've been Commissioner, but

1:09:58we have KCCB has given out canvas bags

1:10:02and then the waste reduction division

1:10:04has given out uh from Chico bags to uh

1:10:08to other types of bags. Canvas bags I

1:10:10think is what waste reduction has right

1:10:12now as well. We have done it, but we can

1:10:15what I'm hearing from you is a

1:10:16continuance of what we have done if

1:10:19funds are available. Um is that what

1:10:21you're asking from me, Commissioner

1:10:22Johnson?

1:10:23>> Yes, that's correct if funds are

1:10:25available.

1:10:26Um just maybe like one per paid

1:10:28customers.

1:10:30>> Yeah, and you have that you have that in

1:10:33there and I don't know if you I mean I

1:10:35It was It's in the public education D in

1:10:38there and so maybe even presenting us

1:10:41with some kind of uh budget requirements

1:10:44would be needed for that. And I don't

1:10:46know if you were

1:10:48what kind of budget, you know,

1:10:49requirements would be if you would need

1:10:51any budget for that so that we could be

1:10:54preparing for for you know, for the

1:10:56education part. Um the D part says we'll

1:10:59provide reusable bags. Does that include

1:11:01Does that include I mean, I think you

1:11:03guys have your for the recycling you get

1:11:06that gigantic bag and the canvas bags.

1:11:09And I mean, we're might be getting too

1:11:11micromanaging in our bag use here, but

1:11:13like I have a lot of micro I have a lot

1:11:15of canvas bags, but I never use them for

1:11:18groceries and I have the ones from

1:11:21uh that I purchased maybe a Jittery Joe

1:11:23not Jittery Joe's that Trader Joe's and

1:11:26uh you know, and I have a bag of those

1:11:28bags for using the groceries. So,

1:11:32uh you know, is Does that count as What

1:11:34is it counted? What are they made of?

1:11:36>> Well,

1:11:37um

1:11:38the bags that we have for recycling are

1:11:40woven polypropylene. Um so, that's what

1:11:43we use for the recycling bags and

1:11:45certainly they make smaller ones out of

1:11:48all different types of uh material that

1:11:50we can look at. So, just most recently

1:11:53in my head were the canvas bags from

1:11:54KCCB and the waste reduction uh

1:11:56division, but we have certainly had

1:11:58other material bags as well.

1:12:01>> Right. And you guys like do such a great

1:12:03job as I've said before with your

1:12:05graphics. So, you could get such like

1:12:08good graphics on there, you know, like

1:12:10uh just on You just do

1:12:13creative and informative stuff. So, I

1:12:16look forward to those bags.

1:12:20>> Thank you.

1:12:20>> the thing we can add specifics in here,

1:12:22too, in terms of like the definition of

1:12:23reusable. Um you know, if we can we can

1:12:25specify in there what that would mean.

1:12:27Um you could even think about having

1:12:29some collection service cuz I know I'm

1:12:31the type of person that like we're

1:12:32cleaning out our house right now and I

1:12:33have I have too many of those woven poly

1:12:35non-woven polypropylene bags. Um and

1:12:37they technically, you know, they can be

1:12:38repurposed, recycled. Um you know, I've

1:12:41seen us use them in like the the floats

1:12:43for um

1:12:44Oh gosh, what was it?

1:12:45>> For um

1:12:46>> The Christmas.

1:12:47>> Yeah, for the Christmas

1:12:48Yeah.

1:12:49I mean, there's all there's all kind of

1:12:50like, you know, fun things you can think

1:12:52about it that So, it incentivizes people

1:12:54again not to litter those or dispose

1:12:56them at the end of their life, but like,

1:12:57you know, really see that as something

1:12:59that's reusable.

1:13:00>> Um question, I guess.

1:13:02>> I I um

1:13:03only place that I always like to think

1:13:06about who's already doing work cuz

1:13:08there's nothing new up under the sun.

1:13:10But, um

1:13:13I think that

1:13:15I I would like Have Have we looked at um

1:13:17Aldi, for example?

1:13:19>> Yeah.

1:13:20>> as part of our

1:13:23poster making a pitch.

1:13:25>> Yeah.

1:13:25>> Because

1:13:26>> Yeah.

1:13:26>> Um I do think that um

1:13:29it's not an inconvenience at all.

1:13:32>> Right.

1:13:32>> Uh and when we do it enough times, you

1:13:35just just you don't really even got your

1:13:37bag. But, now they even sell the the

1:13:39brown bag, the paper bags that you can

1:13:41get your bag. You know, you can buy uh

1:13:44and it's very nominal. It's real cheap.

1:13:46But, uh I think that um

1:13:50a store like Aldi,

1:13:52it it makes helps make our case

1:13:55that it can be done. It doesn't have to

1:13:57disrupt your whole life. It's just

1:13:59a change of of how we're doing it and

1:14:02why we're doing it. So, I hope that um

1:14:06that would be one of our examples.

1:14:09>> Definitely.

1:14:11>> Okay. Good point. Good point,

1:14:13Commissioner.

1:14:14>> Yeah, quickly.

1:14:15>> Yeah.

1:14:16>> Well, a lot of these larger grocery

1:14:18grocery

1:14:19companies are required to do it in other

1:14:21places, right? I mean, like Kroger's

1:14:23part of a bigger grocery company.

1:14:26Um Publix, too. And you just think even

1:14:28places like Aldi, right? It's totally

1:14:30voluntary, but people show up with their

1:14:32bags every time at Aldi. So,

1:14:34>> Yeah.

1:14:34>> I mean, it's just kind of like

1:14:36Commissioner Jordan said, it's just a

1:14:37new way of thinking about doing things.

1:14:39>> But, once you have your habit

1:14:40>> Right.

1:14:41>> Once you have your bags,

1:14:42>> Right.

1:14:42>> like Commissioner Jordan said, you don't

1:14:43really think about it anymore. You just

1:14:45have your bags in the car, and when it's

1:14:46time to go and throw it away, you just

1:14:47do it.

1:14:48>> We adapt.

1:14:49>> Yeah, you walk in the first time, and

1:14:50you're like, "Where's the bag?"

1:14:53I did that.

1:14:56>> I was supposed to bring a bag?

1:14:59It's Costco the same

1:15:00>> Yeah.

1:15:01>> Yeah, Costco's the same way.

1:15:06>> And it's still it is still caught up

1:15:09Yeah, it is still caught up in

1:15:10approvals, but there was a Senate bill

1:15:11passed last year

1:15:12for for Georgia to potentially come to

1:15:14nine states to ban plastic bags like

1:15:15other states. So, it could be too that

1:15:17like Athens in you know, in conjunction

1:15:19with Atlanta and a couple of other major

1:15:20cities can can show that like prove to

1:15:22the state at large that like this is

1:15:23doable.

1:15:24Which excites me because I worked on

1:15:26lots of local policies then.

1:15:29>> Okay, so for next meeting, are we ready

1:15:30for summary and things that we'll be

1:15:32ready to kind of perk with, and let me

1:15:35know what I'm forgetting. So, number

1:15:36one, attorney's office will be looking

1:15:39at some possibilities and some good

1:15:41examples,

1:15:42um specifically as relates to the

1:15:45enforceability, and it sounds like

1:15:47specificity is pretty important.

1:15:49Um

1:15:51maybe looking at city of South

1:15:53Fulton because they've got the piece

1:15:55about um

1:15:57having the establishment be required to

1:15:59sell reusable bags.

1:16:01Um it sounds like looking at and

1:16:03quantifying the educational component,

1:16:05um cost of supplies and alternate um

1:16:08alternatives buys,

1:16:10um looking at some of the data from ACC

1:16:13Gov's transition to requiring

1:16:15compostable

1:16:17um

1:16:18wares during permitted events,

1:16:21um

1:16:22and then also potentially looking at the

1:16:25definition of reusable within the

1:16:27ordinance. What did I forget?

1:16:29>> Uh fee versus bag, I think, um

1:16:33and maybe a cost cost analysis. I think

1:16:35somebody wanted a cost analysis of the

1:16:37alternatives for EPS.

1:16:39>> Mhm.

1:16:40>> Was that under the same

1:16:42three that you said about the

1:16:44educational component and alternative

1:16:46products. That That could be tucked into

1:16:49that one as far as

1:16:51um examples of it and and if we got to

1:16:54where

1:16:55in that educational part, we're able to

1:16:57highlight who's already doing it.

1:16:59>> Right.

1:16:59>> And if we

1:17:01um

1:17:02it would be helpful.

1:17:03>> Did you include I might I might have

1:17:05been thinking of, you know,

1:17:08what kind of budget requests would be

1:17:10needed to for the educational materials

1:17:12as well. Um and the other thing is that

1:17:15this this recommendation is not in

1:17:20attorney attorney language and includes

1:17:22a lot of implementation and language for

1:17:25education. So, um like, you know,

1:17:28we have to get a draft of

1:17:30>> We'll lawyer it up.

1:17:33>> But also having the other ordinances

1:17:36>> Right. Right.

1:17:38>> [laughter]

1:17:41>> Well, if we're if we're if we're going

1:17:43to be Well, if we're if we're going to

1:17:44be reviewing

1:17:47>> Bring the other ordinance.

1:17:48>> We're going to bring South Portland

1:17:49because I think this is

1:17:50Let's pick their apart first.

1:17:52>> You got it.

1:17:53Okay. Okay.

1:17:54>> You got it.

1:17:56>> I will say just since we're back I know

1:17:57we're closing up, but it does it does

1:17:58say all retail establishments must

1:18:00provide reusable bags to customers

1:18:01either for sale or at a minimum charge

1:18:03of 10 cents per bag during limited time

1:18:06store promotions.

1:18:07>> Mhm.

1:18:08>> Whatever that means. So, I'm curious

1:18:09about how they're implementing

1:18:10>> money back.

1:18:10>> Mhm.

1:18:11>> Oh, that's um

1:18:12>> That's all.

1:18:13>> I like that one.

1:18:13>> It sounds a little bit odd cuz usually

1:18:15the bags are like

1:18:16>> 10 cents.

1:18:17>> Yeah, or but they also have all the

1:18:19reusable ones, too.

1:18:20>> Yeah.

1:18:21>> And the boxes.

1:18:23>> Yeah.

1:18:24Yeah. Did you also want more information

1:18:26on health impacts?

1:18:28>> Oh, yeah. Yeah.

1:18:29>> If there's any I think that would be

1:18:30good.

1:18:31>> Uh that's another

1:18:34good response if we have the plastic

1:18:36companies come after us.

1:18:41>> Okay.

1:18:41>> All right. Good job, team.

1:18:43>> So, next we got to figure out when our

1:18:45next meeting is.

1:18:46>> So, if we keep our normal cadence, I

1:18:48think October 1st at 1:00.

1:18:51>> Is the 1st Thursday of the month?

1:18:54>> It's the 1st

1:18:55>> That's the only thing we have.

1:18:56>> That'll be it.

1:18:56>> That's a

1:18:57>> That's a different thing now for us

1:19:00because we don't have any Thursdays on a

1:19:021st. So, is that going to work for

1:19:04everyone cuz this is no um voting

1:19:06meeting. At least we don't have anyone.

1:19:08>> Oh, you mean so when we skip town

1:19:10because there's no voting meeting every

1:19:11week?

1:19:13>> Right. Right.

1:19:15>> It's football season all week.

1:19:18>> If you have football then

1:19:19>> Oh, there is a football game that

1:19:21weekend.

1:19:24>> Uh home football game that is. Okay. Um

1:19:26will that work for everyone October 1st?

1:19:29>> October 1st

1:19:30>> at 1:00 p.m.

1:19:31>> 1:00 p.m. Got

1:19:32>> Do you want to reach out to our thread

1:19:34so John will know?

1:19:35>> Yes, we'll put it right there.

1:19:38>> We'll do a first reminder to put it put

1:19:40it on your own calendar.

1:19:41>> Sarah will do that as well and we'll

1:19:44we'll be ready to go.

1:19:46>> Thank you for all of you being here.

1:19:48It's been very helpful. Hopefully

1:19:50we will move ahead with this.

1:19:53>> Motion to move

1:19:54>> Motion to adjourn. Second?

1:19:58>> I'll second.

1:19:58>> Second.

1:19:59>> Okay. All in favor?

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