2026-10-06 - Finance Committee

02:22rally. Are you ready?

02:26>> Okay. Aloha. Welcome to the Committee on

02:28Finance. Today is

02:34>> October 6, 2026.

02:36It's a good day. Today is 3:45 p.m.

02:41and I'm calling this meeting to order.

02:43We have today in our chambers here in

02:44Hilo, Council Members Kimell, Gimba,

02:47Onishi, Hust, and Kagiada and myself,

02:50Council Member Zinaba and Kirkowitz will

02:52be joining us shortly. And Council Snow,

02:54Council Member Zinaba and Viegas will be

02:57joining us. Oh, good times. Okay.

02:59Council member Vinaba has just joined

03:01us. Council member Viegas will be

03:02joining us shortly. And Council Member

03:03Kirkowitz is excused. Okay.

03:07Um, so Mr. RSelli, do we have any

03:09testifiers for our meeting today?

03:12>> Thank you, chair. Confirming that we do

03:14not have any testifiers at this time for

03:17your meeting.

03:18>> Thank you very much. I appreciate that.

03:19Also noting today is the 45th session

03:22and we did start at 3:45. These are also

03:24good numbers that we can live by. Mr.

03:27Clark, you want to start off by bringing

03:29in communication 970.1,

03:31please?

03:32>> Sure. Last chance. If anyone would like

03:33to testify in communication 970.1,

03:36please speak up now.

03:39Hearing and seeing none, communication

03:41970.1,

03:42tabular summary of net funded debt as of

03:45August 7, 2026 from finance director

03:47Diane Nakagawa dated August 28, 2026

03:50transmitting the above report pursuant

03:52to chapter 47C of the Hawaii revised

03:55statutes.

03:57>> I have a motion.

03:58>> A motion to close file communication

03:59970.1.

04:01>> Second. I have a motion by council

04:02member Huis and a second by council

04:04member Kimble bringing us to

04:05communication 970.1. Is there any

04:07discussion? Council member Hustus.

04:09>> Thanks chair. Just welcome director or

04:12finance team if they wanted to provide

04:14any updates on the tabular summary of

04:16net fundedness for the county.

04:24>> Miss Kai when you are ready.

04:27>> Good afternoon Kai deputy finance

04:29director. Um, no, just updated statement

04:32as a there was a $40,000 draw for the

04:35Eeky Place project which will actually

04:38be paid by the special tax. So,

04:42no real change in debt at this point,

04:44but just an update.

04:46>> Okay, any other questions?

04:49Hearing and seeing none. Thank you very

04:50much, Deputy Director Kai. Motion is on

04:53the floor to close file on communication

04:54970.1. All in favor?

04:58>> Any opposed?

05:00Mr. Clerk, let the record reflect we

05:02have eight members in favor with council

05:04members Kirkwoods excused.

05:07Motion carries. Thank you.

05:10>> If anyone would like to testify in

05:11resolution 694-26,

05:13please speak up now.

05:17>> Hearing here with the Office of Housing.

05:22>> Thank you. We'll be right. We'll be to

05:24you in a minute.

05:24>> Oh,

05:27no.

05:29Thank you. Hearing and seeing none,

05:31resolution 694-26

05:34authorizes the mayor to enter into an

05:36intergovernmental agreement with the

05:37United States Department of Housing and

05:39Urban Development to receive a grant for

05:41the Cukuola Supportive Housing Project

05:43in North Kona. Allows for the receipt of

05:451,892,000

05:47in federally derived funds to assist

05:49with the planning, design, and

05:50construction of the Cukuola supportive

05:52housing housing project introduced by

05:54council member Kane Kleinfelder by

05:56request. There's a companion bill 198 to

05:59this measure.

06:00>> Chair, I move to forward resolution

06:02694-26 to council with a favorable

06:04recommendation.

06:05>> Motion by council member Houston,

06:07seconded by council member O'Neing

06:09resolution 694-26 to council with a

06:11favorable recommendation. Is there any

06:13discussion? Council member Huice.

06:14>> Sure. I welcome housing to speak to the

06:16resolution, please.

06:19>> Yes. Uh, good afternoon. This is an

06:21Bailey. I'm with the Office of Housing

06:23and Community Development. I'm the

06:25manager of the development division and

06:27we're very pleased to bring this

06:29resolution and bill before the council

06:32today. Um it's to bring 1.892

06:38uh million dollars of federal funds uh

06:41provided by the community uh development

06:45grant through HUD to our county to help

06:49build phase two of Kokuola.

06:52um our Kakuola project, a supportive

06:55housing project here in Kyua Kona, uh

06:58almost directly across from the West

07:00Hawaii Civic Center. Uh the grant will

07:03be used in part to build uh a total of

07:0650 supportive housing units for members

07:09of our community who are very low and

07:13moderate income levels. Uh there's we

07:17plan to have a community center based

07:18here that will provide companion support

07:21services by agencies here in the county.

07:24The total estimated cost for the

07:26development of this project is roughly

07:29$22 million.

07:31Uh so this is just the beginning of the

07:33capital stack for the project. Um so we

07:36look forward to your support today to

07:38bring these funds into the county. And

07:41if you have any questions, I'd be happy

07:43to answer them.

07:47Thank you very much. What So given it's

07:49a $22 million project, this is 1.89

07:52million. What is the 1.89 million uh do

07:56for the project?

07:58>> Um right now it'll be used to support

08:00some of the initial infrastructure work

08:02for phase two. Um with our current phase

08:05one work, which you may not uh may not

08:08be directly um knowledgeable about, but

08:11I'll tell you a little bit about it. It

08:12was to build a supportive was to build a

08:14shelter here in Kyloakona again across

08:16from the civic center. Um we are

08:18probably 80 85 89% complete on that

08:23project. Uh we expect to deliver that to

08:27the county as a finished product

08:29probably within before December, end of

08:31December. Um that project features um an

08:36assessment center, uh a resident manager

08:39center, a commercial kitchen, uh laundry

08:42facility, uh conjugate uh bathrooms, uh

08:46showers, um family rooms, uh uh paved uh

08:52driveway area for parking, uh overnight

08:56parking, um which will hopefully relieve

08:58some of the burden um on the streets. in

09:02Kona of people camping out. And in

09:06addition, we have 16 units um single

09:09single units studio size that will be

09:11built there. Um like I said, we're about

09:1589% complete. We're we're on the final

09:18phase of wrapup. This project, the same

09:21driveway will lead into Cookola 2, which

09:24is at the bottom of the parcel. Uh and

09:27we plan to build 50 supportive units.

09:29This initial phase of funding will help

09:31build the infrastructure to service all

09:34of the 50 units there at the site.

09:38Um, this parcel, as you may or may not

09:41know, was executive order to the county

09:43of Hawaii um from the state to the

09:46Hawaii Housing Finance Development

09:48Corporation. um it is leased to the

09:50county uh to build this specific project

09:54and that's exactly what we're doing and

09:56we're very grateful for council's

09:58support of all the funding that's coming

10:00in this project from the federal

10:02government to build it. So thank you

10:04again.

10:07>> Did you say conjugate bathrooms?

10:10>> Yeah. So they're kind of together.

10:15>> Conjugate bathroom. So, it's like a a

10:17big large bathroom building.

10:21>> Okay. Thank you, Miss Bailey. Uh, Mr.

10:23On.

10:24>> Thank you, Chair.

10:26>> So, how many of these units are going to

10:28be for families with children?

10:32>> Uh, this supportive housing project is

10:34strictly for singles and maybe couples.

10:38It's not for families. Uh based on the

10:40data we have here in Kona, the most

10:43underserved population of houseless

10:47individuals are singles and couples.

10:50We have currently the county already has

10:53a family project here in Kona at Ulvini,

10:57the homes of Ulvenini which supports 96.

11:00>> But that's already all

11:02>> that's that's full. Yeah. But the data

11:04shows that here in Kona, I think we're

11:06only down to like three to five uh

11:09families. And

11:10>> what about here? East Hawaii.

11:12>> Uh East Hawaii, I don't know that data.

11:15Um at this moment, I don't know. But

11:16yeah, there's there's probably

11:18>> Are you in charge of the islandwide or

11:19just this one project on the west side?

11:22>> I'm just working on this project on the

11:23west side.

11:24>> So you're located on the west side?

11:26>> I am located in the west side. Yes.

11:28>> So who is your counterpart on the east

11:30side? my counterpart. Uh I don't have a

11:33counterpart. That would be me. Um are

11:36you looking for data specifically for

11:37the east side because I'm not here to

11:39talk about

11:39>> I've done some ride alongs and there's

11:42families that are homeless living in

11:44their cars.

11:46>> That's true.

11:47>> Yeah. And so I it's more than I think

11:49four or five on the east side.

11:52>> Yeah. On the east side it's pro it may

11:54very well be more. But I'm just speaking

11:56about the west side today.

11:57>> I understand. But I'm just saying about

11:59the families cuz I think that's where we

12:00got to focus is having

12:03>> those families with children, especially

12:05younger children,

12:08>> getting off the streets and getting them

12:10into homes.

12:12>> Yes.

12:12>> Right.

12:12>> I think that's true. I think if we're if

12:14we're lucky, um we have a couple

12:17projects in the pipeline now that are

12:19not supported um directly with county

12:22funds, but through the Hawaii Housing

12:24Finance and Development Corp that are

12:27hopefully going vertical in the not too

12:30distant future on the east side. Uh

12:33there's the Capolani project by the Big

12:37Lies. um they've just received funding

12:40allocations

12:42from the state so hopefully that'll move

12:44forward. Uh Mr.

12:45>> I think we're going off subject but

12:47thank you. Yeah,

12:48>> last thing I have so out of the 22

12:51million how much of that is going to be

12:53from private and public like say state

12:58or federal governments.

12:59>> Um we typically build only um projects

13:03that are funded with government dollars.

13:05So federal, state or county,

13:07>> right? or private, right?

13:09>> Uh we at this point we are not building

13:12projects with um private funds.

13:15>> So this 22 million going to be just from

13:16government funds?

13:18>> Yes, that is

13:19>> totally.

13:20>> Yes.

13:21>> Wow. Okay. And so who's the developer?

13:24>> That would be the county of Hawaii.

13:26>> Oh, so you guys are in charge of

13:28>> developing and constructing?

13:30>> Absolutely. Right now we're we we do a

13:33lot. We are renovating 50 units on the

13:36east side at Koule Manu. Just about done

13:39with that. We're building a wastewater

13:41treatment plant at our OE Kahi treatment

13:44plant and putting in drainage

13:46improvements there.

13:47>> I think we went off subject again, but

13:48thank you very much. I yield.

13:49>> We do a lot. Thank you for the question.

13:53>> Thank you, Council Member.

13:55>> Thank you, Chair. Uh, Miss Bailey,

13:57sorry. I just uh one question about the

14:00capital stack that you're working on for

14:02phase two. Are you going to be

14:04considering

14:05uh working with the state and the

14:07governor uh with Calhale on that? It

14:10sounds kind of similar in some ways.

14:13>> Um we're we're we've had some

14:16discussions. Um

14:18we are again we have uh applications in

14:22at the federal level. Um so we're kind

14:24of waiting to see how those hit

14:26um before we bring in Kohalei. Kahali's

14:30um uh these are these units that we've

14:33uh designed are single uh one-bedroom

14:36units and it's specifically um

14:40addressing individuals that have uh

14:43subsidies already lined up for them.

14:46Could be section 8 voucher, could be

14:48veterans assistance. Um

14:51uh

14:53yeah, because we have to operate the

14:55project as you know. Um,

14:59so the performer requires that we line

15:01up those subsidies in in parallel as we

15:04move forward.

15:05>> Okay. And then one last question. What's

15:07the timeline on this?

15:09>> Uh, we want to go as fast as we can. Um,

15:12unfortunately, we're kind of waiting for

15:15uh we're going to wait to see what

15:16happens uh at the federal level here

15:18soon. Um, we do have applications in at

15:21that that level. Um, and we've been

15:24actually quite good at uh bringing in

15:27these um federal dollars um overall

15:31um over the years. So, we're we're

15:34feeling confident. Um we have support

15:37from our senator and representative

15:39staff

15:41um and the entire county is is behind

15:44this project. So, um, we just need to

15:47massage a little more and hopefully, um,

15:49things will be more favorable, um,

15:54in a few months.

15:55>> Okay. Thank you. Um, look forward to

15:57seeing what what gets done there. I

15:59yield.

16:04>> Thank you very much, Miss Bailey. Thanks

16:05for what you're doing. Appreciate it.

16:07>> Thank you. Thank you, council.

16:10>> Okay, we have the motion on the floor to

16:11forward resolution 694-26.

16:14the council with a favorable

16:15recommendation. All in favor?

16:18>> Any opposed?

16:19Mr. Clerk, you have eight members in

16:21favor. Miss Kirkwood's excused. Motion

16:23carries.

16:27If any like to testify in Bill 195,

16:30please speak up now.

16:34Hearing and seeing none, Bill 195 amends

16:36chapter 19 of the Hawaii County Code

16:381983 20ou 2016 2016 edition as amended

16:41relating to the non-deedicated

16:43agriculture use assessment. Extends the

16:45sunset date of the non-dedicated

16:47agriculture use assessment by one year.

16:49Introduced by council member Onishi.

16:52>> Motion to approve bill 195 and forward

16:56to the council with a positive

16:57recommendation.

16:59I have a motion by council member

17:01Ronishi and a second by council member

17:02Galima to forward bill 195 to council

17:06with a favorable recommendation.

17:08Council member, thank you chair. Um, I

17:11wanted to bring up Deputy Director Kai,

17:14but then just to kind of I got some

17:17phone calls to my office about, you

17:19know, I guess, um, applicants that were

17:24trying to get this before the deadline

17:26and they were having problems and so,

17:28but I did refer them to property tax,

17:30but then and what I don't know what ever

17:33happened after that, but then I just

17:35wanted to have a deputy to kind of give

17:38some I guess information or background

17:40about this whole thing and you know and

17:43what the administration feels. Go ahead.

17:45>> Sure. Yeah. U Malia Kai, deputy finance

17:47director. Um yeah, the the mayor's

17:51office wanted you know to bring this

17:53forward because they said that they have

17:55both uh received

17:58a lot of complaints personally

18:00themselves, phone calls, that kind of

18:02thing to themselves and also through our

18:03complaint system. They've also received

18:05a lot of complaints about this in

18:09basically the deadline that came and

18:11passed. Um, but they also basically said

18:14that they would like to be able to

18:15provide the public a little bit more

18:17leeway, have a little [snorts] bit more

18:18information provided to them and relieve

18:21the the unnecessary stress at this time

18:23with all the storms and everything that

18:25have been happening to give them a

18:27little bit more time to to get into

18:28these new egg programs.

18:34and chair. I'll yield at this time to

18:36other members. Thank you.

18:37>> Thank you, Council Member Kimble.

18:40>> Yeah. Thank you. Um,

18:43Council Member Onishi,

18:45you were not on the council during the

18:47time that we passed these bills to

18:48sunset the non-dedicated egg program.

18:51And so, I'll give you a little bit of

18:52history. Um the intent of the non the

18:56the sunsetting and the non-dedicated egg

18:58program and transitioning to the short

19:01and long-term program was really to

19:05protect important egg lands, ensure food

19:08security by making sure that

19:10agricultural lands were used for

19:12agriculture and to reduce the amount of

19:15speculation on agricultural lands. Um

19:18there was a report an audit done in 2012

19:22which indicated that the non-dedicated a

19:25program was insufficient in terms of

19:29controls for fraud, waste and abuse and

19:32it was recommended at that time that

19:34paperwork be included in the application

19:37process so that the finance department

19:40and RPT could verify that the tax breaks

19:44provided for farming were given to

19:47people that actually were doing farming.

19:49That's the objective. Um in addition to

19:51that, there was the report that was done

19:53in 2014 by the um folks that that it was

19:59a a group of um the tax folks and the A

20:03folks. They had similar recommendations

20:05and those were actually all incorporated

20:07into the bills that created this short

20:09and long-term dedication programs. Um

20:12when we passed the bill, there was a sub

20:15a significant amount of community

20:17outreach that was done. Um and there

20:20because of the time it took to the pass

20:21the bill, we actually did already extend

20:25the deadline once. Um with the creation

20:28of the kapuna a program that council

20:30member Hustus and I worked on, it's

20:32about 800 folks that actually just

20:35qualified for that and so they don't

20:36need to reapply and renew. Um, and then

20:40there's there's um still still several

20:43folks out there that haven't. I

20:45appreciate what

20:47the concern is, particularly with the

20:50storms. Um,

20:53but what I I think is perhaps a better

20:56approach, if I may recommend this, is

20:59that

21:01the department or the the folks will get

21:03their assessment and if they've not

21:06reapplied to one of the dedicated

21:09programs, it will be reflected on their

21:11assessment. At that time, they will have

21:13the opportunity to appeal and reassess.

21:17Um what I think is a good compromise

21:20here and I I talked to um Deputy Cooper

21:23Creation Council Wong yesterday because

21:25it is in it is codified the deadline. So

21:27this would have to be a legislative

21:30solution would be to allow also at the

21:33time period when people get their bill

21:35the opportunity to appeal and get

21:39reassessed because the concern is

21:42there's a handful of people that despite

21:44all the notification and they've gotten

21:45notifications with their tax bill.

21:47They've gotten two letters of of

21:51assistant administrator Joe. it it was

21:53two mailings to all the folks in the

21:55non-dedicated program. So they there's

21:58been a ton of notification.

22:01If you've looked at the applications,

22:02they're super easy. It's three pages. Um

22:05it is not a lot to ask for the thousands

22:07of dollars of benefits that are people

22:09are getting. There's always going to be

22:11some though that just they're not

22:12connected, right? They're not hearing

22:13it. And so I think that that is a better

22:17mechanism than just moving the goalpost.

22:20And for you particularly, Council Member

22:22Nishi and Council Member Kagi and

22:24Council Member Viegas, those of you that

22:26represent urban areas, I I'd be hesitant

22:29to say, "Okay, we're going to continue

22:31subsidizing fake farms out there um at

22:35the detriment of folks that are in your

22:38urban areas paying full price for their

22:40property values. So, um I don't think

22:42it's the right thing to do right now to

22:44move the goalpost on the the deadline. I

22:46would rather use the compromise of

22:48providing the finance department an

22:51opportunity

22:53to

22:55reassess for those people that only

22:57finally get it once they they get the

22:59bill. Thank you.

23:10And just to clarify, back in 2012 on

23:13when I was on the council, I was on a

23:15task force on egg and we were looking at

23:18how to get them to prove that they doing

23:21egg and that part of it was about their

23:24production or their submitting invoices

23:27to get that. Yes. But I I've been

23:30working on this from way back before you

23:32guys were and so I know kind of about

23:34it. But I'm just asking and we can play

23:38by I mean we can see how it votes go

23:40down but we could extend or we don't

23:43have to. It's up to the members. Are you

23:47>> Thank you. Council me.

23:49>> Thank you. I'm wondering if um real

23:52property tax can come up.

23:58>> Thank you, Deputy. Um can you do you

24:01have a sense of how many people have

24:03already um

24:05given that the initial date was

24:07September 1st um have already applied or

24:11yeah applied for this

24:12>> assistant administrator for the real

24:14property tax division Kada Joe um when

24:17we started this process uh in 2024 we

24:20had 7,698

24:22properties participating in the

24:24non-dedicated act program um to date we

24:28have 3,984

24:30applications that are pending so more

24:33than 50% uh of the applications of

24:36people participating in the NDA program

24:38still have yet to apply if they're still

24:40doing active agricultural use if their

24:42intent is to continue that benefit.

24:44>> Okay. But over 3,000 people did meet the

24:48deadline

24:49um and follow the rules. And then

24:51there's some people that are still maybe

24:54we don't know maybe there that's all

24:56that are going to do it or maybe there's

24:57some people that just um uh haven't got

25:01with the program yet but they still want

25:03to do the non-dedicated A. So it it

25:06sounds like to me [clears throat] it I

25:09feel like it's not fair to the people

25:11who've you know really uh paid attention

25:14and done what they were supposed to and

25:16got in line here. Um,

25:19yeah, I there's lots of opportunities.

25:22There are appeals. There are lots of

25:24things that people can do if they don't

25:25think things are fair. But if we keep

25:28moving the goalposts time after time,

25:30we'll never kind of get to where we need

25:32to go here. So, um, I'm not going to be

25:35supporting uh this amendment as written

25:39or this bill as written. Thank you. I

25:40yield.

25:42>> Thank you.

25:47Mr. Joe, say say it again. You have

25:49what? 7,000 people in and then three

25:523,000 people jumped into other programs

25:54or pending applications. What does that

25:56mean?

25:57>> So, we had um 7,698

26:01uh individual properties participating

26:03in the non-dedicated a program as of

26:052024.

26:07Um, we have 3,984

26:11properties that have yet to file or

26:13refile an application.

26:15>> So, they're still in the non-dedicated.

26:18>> Correct. Until um the deadline passes

26:22and if they don't apply, then uh their

26:252027 taxes will revert to market value

26:29for their land.

26:31>> Okay. Uh how many mailings have we done?

26:34Uh we've done two official mailings. Um

26:37one to notify individuals um when it

26:40came down to the finance director

26:41creating the rules and regulations. Um

26:43and we did a reminder um notice as well.

26:46Um that does not include the numerous um

26:50u mailings that are or information

26:52sheets that are included within our

26:53assessment notices on an annual basis.

26:56>> Those are the registered mail that's

26:58sent out.

26:58>> Um no, they're sent regular

27:00>> regular mail.

27:00>> Correct. Then is there a notice in the

27:02regular real property tax bill that goes

27:04out too?

27:04>> Um, not in the bill itself, but in the

27:06assessment notices that are issued March

27:0815th of every year there's an

27:10information sheet um that highlights

27:12some of the program changes and upcoming

27:14deadlines.

27:16>> Okay. Uh I do remember actually uh I got

27:20a number of phone calls and then we were

27:22asked to push it back by one year and

27:25then we did that because it was it felt

27:28right at the time that we didn't have

27:30enough leeway for people to jump in. I

27:33forget what was going on at the time.

27:34There's something going on. There's

27:35always something going on in government.

27:36Yeah. And on county. Um so we did do a

27:40one-year rollover already.

27:43And then this bill, this bill just rolls

27:45it over by one year because there's

27:47there's a lot of Do you look you look

27:49this bill over? Do you have the bill in

27:50front of you?

27:51>> I do. It pushes out all of the the

27:53filing dates and and the extension of

27:56the non-dedicated egg use benefits um

27:59that were originally um going to expire

28:02uh June 30th of 2029. I believe it

28:05pushes it out to June 30th of 2030.

28:09>> Okay.

28:09>> So, it's just moving the all the dates a

28:11year. Okay. And then administrator Mira

28:15is not here today.

28:16>> Um, she's actually joining us in our

28:19Kona chambers.

28:20>> Oh,

28:22I I don't have any questions actually

28:26for her, but thank you.

28:29Okay, council members, any other

28:30questions? Council member.

28:34[clears throat]

28:34>> Thanks, chair. Assistant administrator.

28:36just, you know, about so about 3,000 are

28:39kind of just have yet to yet to apply.

28:44Why why might you think that is the case

28:48beyond maybe not wanting to participate

28:50anymore? Are there other sort of

28:52situations kind of playing out possibly?

28:56>> Yeah, I mean it could be, you know, uh

28:58people not checking their mail and not

29:00really realizing that this is an

29:01important um thing, right? Um, so you do

29:05have that. Um, I do want to mention that

29:08our intent is to send another mailer um,

29:11the end of February to notify all

29:14individuals who have not applied by the

29:16deadline um, should this legislation not

29:18move forward um, to let them know your

29:21assessment notice is not going to be

29:24inclusive of an agricultural use benefit

29:26and um, there is a provision to file an

29:29appeal.

29:31>> Thank you.

29:34Thank you. Any other questions?

29:38>> Yeah, I think it it bears asking either

29:41to assist an administrator or if if

29:44administrator Mirror is over there. I

29:46mean, the the sentiment of the

29:49department and the staff at this time.

29:51Um, again, I I think the more

29:53appropriate solution is the appeals

29:55process and then potentially a

29:56legislative grace period fix. I think

29:59that's cleaner. Um, and it it helps us

30:04um,

30:06you know, get get everybody into

30:07compliance and deal with that fairness

30:09issue that was was raised by Council

30:10Member Kagi. But I don't know if you

30:12want to respond um, ad assistant

30:14administrator or I don't see Lisa over

30:17there.

30:17>> Yeah, I don't see administrator. Um, I

30:20would say that the division's neutral

30:21about it. It's been a very long arduous

30:23process for us. We've reached out to the

30:25community um dozens of times through

30:28community meetings over the the course

30:30of the last few years um and the

30:32mailers. Um you know, I I I would be

30:36aiss if I didn't say that part of us

30:38wants um to see the deadline come and go

30:43um so that we can move on with other

30:44projects.

30:46But you balance that off with, you know,

30:49the will of of the community and the

30:51feedback that they may be giving um

30:53council and and other elected officials

30:55where we don't see that um in our roles,

30:59right? People come to the real property

31:00tax office, we're about implementation,

31:03assisting them with their applications.

31:04So, we don't see that side of things.

31:06So, I I wouldn't be able to speak on

31:08that dynamic, per se.

31:10>> Yeah. Thank you. Um I'm anxious to see

31:13the deadline come and go and move on to

31:14other things as well. But um you know my

31:17my experience with this has been early

31:19on at the before we did the first time

31:22extension. I was getting a lot of calls.

31:24I walked a lot of people through the

31:25process. Um but my constituents aren't

31:28aren't asking at this point anymore for

31:30an extension of the deadline. They're

31:31they're good. Um there are there are a

31:34few vocal people that have been and um

31:39most of those folks would not qualify

31:42technically under the non-dedicated

31:43program anyway. Um, and that's that's

31:46kind of what we've been trying to get to

31:48here is um, while

31:52the the paperwork requirements are

31:54elevated in the short-term and long-term

31:56dedicated program as a sort of a

31:58preemptive thing, there's still within

32:00the finance department rules the

32:03requirements that you actually do to get

32:05the egg benefit. And um, that that is

32:07just not enforced because we don't have

32:09that documentation at this point. So,

32:12um, you know, I can say at this point

32:15there are there are three people in my

32:17district that are still orary about

32:20this. Um, one of them ran against me.

32:22So, [laughter]

32:23there's other motives there. One of them

32:25is our friend, one of our friends that

32:27talks frequently about the general plan.

32:30And then, um, the third one is is

32:32somebody that owns a large parcel that

32:33that doesn't want to do egg on it and

32:36wants to still get the tax breaks. Other

32:38than that, my community is actually fine

32:40with the deadline, so I'm not going to

32:42support this. Thank you.

32:44>> Okay. Thank you.

32:46>> So, to the vote. Thank you, Mr. Joe.

32:50Uh, council members,

32:52on the motion to forward bill 195 to

32:55council with a favorable recommendation.

32:58Uh, roll call, please. Mr.

33:01>> On the motion to forward bill 195 to

33:03council with a favorable recommendation.

33:05Miss Kima,

33:06>> no. Mr. Eustace,

33:08>> no.

33:09>> Mr. Inaba,

33:11>> no.

33:12>> Miss Kagi,

33:13>> no.

33:14>> Miss Kirkowitz.

33:16>> Miss Kimell,

33:17>> no.

33:18>> Mr. Onishi,

33:19>> I.

33:20>> Miss Viegas,

33:22>> no.

33:23>> Chair Connelly Kleinfelder.

33:24>> No.

33:26>> Chair, you have one vote in favor. Mr.

33:28Onishi, you have seven nos and one

33:30absent. Miss uh Kirkowitz. The motion

33:34moves forward with unfavorable

33:35recommendation.

33:40Bill 196, please, when you're ready.

33:42>> If anyone would like to testify in Bill

33:44196, please speak up now.

33:49hearing and seeing none, bill 196 amends

33:51ordinance number 26-44, the operating

33:54budget of the county of Hawaii for the

33:55fiscal year ending June 30, 2027.

33:58Appropriates revenues in the state

33:59grants coffee berry bore coffee leaf

34:02rust pest pesticide subsidy program

34:04account $150,000 and appropriates the

34:07same to the coffee bearer bore coffee

34:09leaf rust pesticide subsidy program

34:12account. Introduced by council member

34:13Connie Lee Kleinfelder by request.

34:15Chair, I move to forward bill 196 to

34:17council with a favor recommendation.

34:20>> Motion by council member Houston,

34:22seconded by council member Glima,

34:23forwarding bill 196 to council with a

34:25favorable recommendation. Is there any

34:26discussion? We do have R&D here in the

34:29chambers.

34:30If there are questions hearing and

34:33seeing none, motion is on the floor. All

34:34in favor?

34:36>> Any opposed?

34:38Mr. Clerk, you have eight members in

34:39favor. Miss Kirkwitz excused.

34:42Thank you for being here. Research and

34:44development

34:45If anyone would like to testify in bill

34:47197, please speak up now.

34:52Hearing and seeing none, Bill 197 amends

34:54chapter 19, article 7 of the V County

34:56Code 1983, 2016 edition as amended

34:59relating to a temporary real property

35:01tax amnesty for certain hosted transient

35:04vacation rentals. Establishes a tax

35:07amnesty for properties that have

35:08existing vacation rentals in violation

35:10of the restrictions of the homeowner

35:12class. requires either ceasing the

35:14rental activity or properly registering

35:16the rental activity without being

35:18assessed, roll back, taxes, penalties,

35:20and interest. Introduced by council

35:21member Kimble.

35:23>> Chair, motion to approve bill 197 and

35:25forward to council with a favorable

35:27recommendation.

35:29>> Motion by council member Kimble,

35:30seconded by council member Glimbo. Miss

35:32Kimble, you have the floor.

35:33>> Thank you. Um, you guys are not all

35:35experiencing deja vu. This is a new

35:38bill. Um

35:40173, if you recall, required the

35:43creation of a new property tax class

35:45specific for homeowner bed and

35:47breakfasts. Um there didn't seem to be

35:49an appetite from the body for that.

35:51There clearly wasn't an appetite for the

35:52body from the body for that. So what

35:54I've done is I've just pulled out the

35:55amnesty piece. And really what I'm

35:58trying to do with this is incentivize

36:01folks to register because if they

36:05haven't been in the right tax class up

36:08until this date, as long as they

36:10register, they will go into the new tax

36:12class, but they won't be liable for the

36:14penalties. It is incentive and we can

36:16have an argument about whether or not

36:17that's fair. Um, the other part of this

36:20too is if they decide to stop because

36:22for whatever reason they were unaware

36:25that operating a hosted vacation rental

36:27bumped them out of the homeowner tax

36:29class and now with all of this going on,

36:31they learn that that happens. They will

36:33have an opportunity here until the end

36:35of the year to just say, "I'm not going

36:36to do it anymore." And without that that

36:38that allows them to keep their 3% cap.

36:41you know, for for our kuna um who have

36:44lived in their homes a long time that

36:46weren't aware and you can argue not

36:48whether or not you should be aware um

36:51you know this is a protective measure

36:52that I think is important for them to

36:54realize okay if I want to continue doing

36:57this there are going to be real tax imp

36:59implications and part of the process

37:01with the registration make sure that

37:03they acknowledge that and they know

37:05that. So, I wanted to provide that

37:07opportunity to say, "Okay, I realize

37:10this is not going to be financially

37:12feasible for me. I'm going to jump out

37:14before those penalties and the switch um

37:17happens." Because if you recall from

37:19that graph that I provided with um 173,

37:24it's really the loss of the 3% that is

37:26the big hit, especially for people that

37:28have lived in their property for a long

37:30time. So, um hopefully this is amendable

37:33to you folks without the creation of the

37:35new property tax class, but it's just

37:36this temp temporary amnesty um that

37:39allows people to that by the end of the

37:42year make a decision one way or the

37:44other and get into compliance. Thank

37:46you.

37:49>> Thank you, council members.

37:55Council member

38:00Houston.

38:02All right. Thanks, Chair. Um,

38:05[clears throat] I probably asked this

38:07question before with 173 and this is

38:10maybe a question more for real property

38:11tax. Um just curious on the number of

38:14properties that we estimate that would

38:16be able to qualify for this amnesty and

38:19then what is that kind of estimated

38:22amount that's going to be waved

38:25>> between zero and 10,000

38:28>> okay [laughter]

38:29>> properties? No. Um this is this is one

38:31of the things we don't know and it is

38:33one of the requirements for

38:36what one of the re reasons that we need

38:38that registration process is this has

38:40been this has been the unknown that help

38:43that has been a barrier for us in terms

38:45of regulating TPRs is how many are

38:48actually out there. So I'm I'm being a

38:51little facicious when I say one in

38:5310,000 but it really is that broad of a

38:56we don't know. No, it's a I mean it's

38:58that's why I've asked the planning

39:00director about the registration every

39:01time. Like I the number in the economic

39:04impact study shows one figure, but we're

39:07just not seeing kind of that some of

39:08that transition. So I'm just curious on

39:11kind of those those metrics there. Okay.

39:13Um

39:17if they're

39:21if the so the owners registered in

39:23chapter 6

39:26and then they're later determined this I

39:28know this is a short window of time you

39:29have it until December of this year. So

39:32it's this kind of temporary

39:34amnesty.

39:37um

39:39what happens if they're later found like

39:40they they're kind of out of compliance

39:42like we've been talking about this

39:43legality of some some of our STVRs about

39:47number of bedrooms all these different

39:48things and considerations

39:51is there an ability to recover those

39:52funds and those taxes if they were

39:54actually deemed out of compliance and

39:56deemed um operating legally technically

40:02>> you know that's sorry chair if I may um

40:06you pose an interesting

40:11kind of let me think that through that I

40:13I don't think there is a mechanism for

40:15that particularly but there could be one

40:17built into this bill and I think it's

40:19worth doing um where if they so we're

40:23giving them the choice sign the

40:24affidavit that they're going to stop or

40:26keep going and get into the next class

40:28the next year but then they could be in

40:31violation and if they had known they

40:33were in violation they would have signed

40:34affidavit and got out. So, I see what

40:37you're saying and I think that has merit

40:39and um I'm willing to what I what I do

40:44want to keep this bill moving because of

40:45timing issues, but at the next hearing

40:47I'm I'm willing to work on an amendment

40:49that provides a a step back from that

40:53because I think I think that's something

40:55that could be doable. Yeah.

40:57>> Okay. Thank you. Yeah, appreciate kind

40:59of bringing this conversation back.

41:00Thank you. Thanks, Chair.

41:02>> Council member No, you had your light

41:05on. No, off. Council Brody.

41:07>> Thank you.

41:09Finance and property stay there too,

41:13but then too bad planning is not here

41:14too. But I mean

41:18we so my my concern is or my frustration

41:23is like we passed this registration,

41:26right?

41:28And then now we coming in with this

41:31bill, right? to give them this break. I

41:34mean, why wasn't this all thought of

41:38earlier?

41:40I mean, wasn't you folks consulted?

41:44>> Um, I I can't speak to the conversations

41:47that were had previously. Sorry, I don't

41:51I don't have an answer for that

41:52question.

41:55Um, I think there was some work with the

41:57the division um to discuss um the

42:02creation of the the classification or

42:04the new long or short-term vacation

42:06rental class or bed and breakfast rental

42:08class, how however it's worded. Um but

42:12um there was also um discussions on the

42:14provision for this amnesty piece of it.

42:18I would say that the amnesty when it's

42:20self-reported right now, it's the

42:23division's um process not to roll

42:25someone back. So, if someone comes

42:27forward and lets us know I'm doing a

42:28short-term vacation rental um you know,

42:31they refile their homeowners application

42:33indicating that that use, we're not

42:35going to rule them back um utilizing a

42:39provision. So, my understanding of this

42:40bill is it just memorializes that in the

42:43code to make it clear that there is no

42:46not going to be any roll back. um

42:48>> after

42:49>> um up to December 31st of 20.

42:51>> So anything after that then you get

42:54penalized, right?

42:55>> Um I I I would I would I would probably

42:59say that the division would still go the

43:02route of self-reporting and we would not

43:04roll people back even if they're

43:06entering into this new um program

43:09register.

43:09>> I think to you look at it, it's October

43:12already. Mhm. [clears throat]

43:14>> By the time this pass is going to be

43:16like the first week in November, right?

43:19Mayor has to sign it what? Within seven

43:21days,

43:23right? 10 days. Okay. So, that leaves

43:27them with not too many more days.

43:31So, would you folks suggest we extend

43:33this or make this longer? I mean, what?

43:38It has no real procedural effect

43:41[snorts] on how we treat it now. I think

43:44it's just simply codifying it and

43:46putting it into code. I would think that

43:48that would be a question for the maker

43:50of the bill.

43:51>> But then for the department, I mean, so

43:54you guys are going to be at the end of

43:57this whole thing where you guys going to

43:58have to answer to the public.

44:00>> Yeah. Procedurally, it's nothing for us

44:02to to to do this. Um, we already do it

44:06is what I'm saying. Um, so the date is

44:08is not necessarily a a determining

44:12factor for us on whether we can do

44:14something or not or the timing of the

44:15the communication or whatnot.

44:18>> Okay. Wait. So you're saying that

44:24this I mean you folks are already doing

44:26it

44:28>> correct?

44:28>> Right. But then only to the end of this

44:31year with this bill being passed, right?

44:36Correct.

44:37>> So if we don't pass it, then it could be

44:40extended.

44:43>> I I I would say we're doing this

44:45already, right?

44:46>> That's what we're doing. So we rather it

44:47it it goes through December 31st of

44:492026, we're still going to continue and

44:51treat this as a self-reporting

44:53mechanism.

44:54>> So I I think there was some concerns

44:56from from what I understand from the the

44:59constituencies that there was some fear,

45:02right? like even if you're telling me

45:04that's a procedure that the department

45:06or the division does, it's not anywhere

45:09in the code, right, to codify that. So,

45:11I think that the intent of this

45:12legislation, if I'm understanding

45:14correctly, was to allay those concerns

45:16and say, "Hey, no, this is truly what's

45:19going to happen if you self-report, you

45:21register, or you decide not to."

45:23>> Right. And then if you don't, then this

45:26could be your penalty. Correct.

45:30Um,

45:31it's it's not going to be the the

45:33penalty either way. You I mean, if you

45:35don't register and we catch you,

45:37>> we're rolling you back. Correct.

45:38>> Oh, yeah. Absolutely. Sorry. Yeah. Yeah.

45:40Right.

45:41>> Yeah. Okay.

45:41>> Sorry. It took me a while to get that.

45:43[laughter]

45:44>> Yeah.

45:45>> Right. Okay. Okay. Thank you.

45:48>> Thank you,

45:51Council.

45:52>> Yeah. I I just wanted to kind of

45:55reiterate that a big part of this is

45:59that like as as Kada said like the

46:02department is already doing this and but

46:04it's not a rule, it's not code, it's not

46:06anywhere and and to make it legit like

46:09we need to kind of do this and it's all

46:11based on self-reporting. So now you have

46:12a situation where people are registering

46:15with the county and in essence

46:17self-reporting there and that's why the

46:20date is important. I if if there's a

46:23need to extend it for some extenduating

46:25circumstances, I'm willing to revisit

46:27that later, but I don't think there is

46:29um at this point in time. And and the

46:31key thing is again, I I don't want to

46:33lose sight of like that that step that

46:36allows people to get out, right, if they

46:40they at this point before um they start

46:43to get hit with those tax penalties

46:44because it, as some of the testifiers

46:46have indicated, it can be quite

46:48burdensome to some folks. Um and just

46:51again

46:53to council member Onishi. Um, it

46:57probably be good to take a look at bill

46:59121 when you have an opportunity because

47:01this was in there and like I said

47:02before, bill 121 had like everything in

47:05the kitchen sink. It had the

47:07registration, it had the land use

47:08change, it had the amnesty thing, it had

47:10vacation destination notes. It was this

47:12ginormous bill. And in order to proceed,

47:17it was it became clear talking with body

47:19we needed to separate all these things

47:21out. And that's why you're getting this

47:23now as a separate thing as opposed to

47:25having it be part of the registration

47:27process because it was just you think

47:29147 is complicated, you should have seen

47:31121. That's all I'm saying. I'll leave

47:33it there, but I hope you folks can

47:35support this today. Thank you.

47:38>> Thank you.

47:41Thank you.

47:44You see, um, thank you, Council Member

47:48Kimo, for bringing this forward. You

47:49know, there's been a lot of moving parts

47:51for this and I think I'm I'm just going

47:54to let things stand where they are. Um,

48:00we've gone through a lot of bills and I

48:02think

48:03I've also had constituents come

48:07at us, myself and real property tax

48:10division for roll back taxes

48:13um, just in the last few months.

48:18And in all fairness, I think, you know,

48:21however you folks are treating things

48:23right now, I think we just need to be

48:26consistent. So, I'm I'm not going to

48:28support it, but I I appreciate the the

48:30intention as we try and roll out

48:33registration and all the other bills

48:35that we passed. Thank you. Thank you.

48:42>> Sorry, Mr. Jill. I was listening to show

48:46and my I don't know what what he was

48:48saying, but I think I got it.

48:51A of this bill

48:54talks about

48:57the director waving back any penalties,

49:01taxes, blah blah blah blah.

49:05as long as by December 31st, 2026, the

49:08owner submits an affidate saying they're

49:10going to stop

49:12before December 31st, 2026

49:15or they register.

49:17Right?

49:19And then

49:24the next section doesn't apply to any

49:25owner who prior to the effective date of

49:28this ordinance was subject to the same

49:30things we're saying that we're going to

49:32wave.

49:36But he's I mean he's right in that

49:41it's October 6 is his first hearing. So

49:43that' be October November.

49:47So basically give people a month if we

49:49if we went fast

49:55month and a half. It's called a month

49:56and a half.

49:59So 45 days is that I mean what

50:03What? But you're already doing it. Is

50:05that what I just heard?

50:08>> I think it's up to the the council to

50:10determine whether that's a reasonable

50:12time or not. I think what this

50:13legislation does is it says, you know,

50:16self-report or else, right? Um, this

50:20also represents what we currently do. If

50:22someone self-reports, we're not rolling

50:24them back in taxes. If we catch them,

50:26we're rolling them back. whether you

50:28think that that month, month and a half

50:31is a reasonable time to encourage people

50:33to register their short-term vacation

50:36rental. I mean, I think that's a

50:37different question

50:40>> that we won't be able to answer,

50:41>> but that's different different subject,

50:43>> but well, we're talking about like 45

50:45days

50:49>> roughly. If if this was to go fast pass

50:52and then get signed by the mayor, like

50:53Mr. She brought up 45 days maybe. Yeah.

50:59Who who would

51:03would the department be mailing anybody

51:05anything or No, it's just it's up to

51:07them. So, they'd have to know we passed

51:09this bill and there'd be no noticing for

51:13the public and then they'd have to know

51:15to come in and let us know they're going

51:17to stop or register, one of the two.

51:19>> Yeah. So, anytime someone applies for a

51:21homeowner's exemption, um the

51:24application itself um asks a few pointed

51:26questions in regard to the use of the

51:28property, if there's a short-term

51:30vacation, rental use, less than 6

51:33months, things like that. Um there's

51:35also um information that we provide on

51:38an annual basis with the assessment

51:40notices letting people know if you have

51:41a homeowner's exemption and the

51:42homeowners tax class. Be reminded that

51:45if you do short-term vacation rental on

51:47your primary residence that you could

51:49get rolled back and you could pay a

51:51significantly more amount, you know, in

51:53your taxes. Um so it we're not going to

51:58issue any more notifications within that

52:01short period of time. Okay. Was

52:07it sorry to the maker? It's Miss Kimble.

52:09I mean, is this intentional this 45day

52:11thing? Like if it was a pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:13pass pass pass pass pass pass pass

52:15like this this that's what your your

52:16goal was? Yeah, I mean, if I may, that

52:19the um the intention was to pass this

52:22sooner, right, when I introduced Bill

52:23173, which had happened way back then. I

52:25also had requested a wave to council so

52:28that we'd have a little more time um but

52:30that was the disallowed. Um it it is a

52:33tight time frame but um it it is

52:38intended to align with the registration

52:41process in and of the because the

52:44registration process is an in essence

52:47self-reporting right and so again to

52:54this this bill 175 codifies

52:58what the department is already doing.

52:59So, it legitimizes that in terms of

53:01waving these penalties and fees when

53:03they're self-reporting,

53:05keeps the bit where if people are not

53:07reporting, they are penalized and then

53:10but also creates this other like side

53:13thing where you can sign the affidavit

53:15and get out, right? Um

53:19I intend to have when the planning

53:24department the planning department has

53:26their website if this passes then there

53:29will be something put on the planning

53:30department registration site that's like

53:32hey reminder one more time this is going

53:34to affect your taxes and you can sign

53:36the affidavit and get out. That's that

53:38will be the notification process for

53:40that. So that was a long answer to say

53:43yes it's intentional. Yes, I think it's

53:45enough time.

53:46>> Okay,

53:48Mr. Joel, last questions. You know, you

53:51notice I put a S on the end of the

53:53questions. Yeah, that was smart,

53:54[laughter] right, Miss Jesus? That's a

53:56good one. Try last questions.

53:59Just put a S on the end. Then you're

54:00open. You can leave it one or two.

54:04Right now, if someone has come in and

54:07registered as a TVR in the past month,

54:13what happens to them?

54:15And they were in the homeowners class.

54:18>> Yeah. If they register as a TVR, we

54:20would consider it self-reporting

54:22>> and no roll back.

54:24>> And as such, you're you're going to nail

54:26them like they get nailed with

54:27everything they should have been.

54:28>> No, we would we would remove their tax

54:32um classification. So, the preferential

54:34tax rate and the 3% cap moving forward

54:37because they're no longer eligible. But

54:39we're not going to go back in time and

54:40say could have, would a, should have for

54:42the last two years. We're going to roll

54:44you back to on your taxes because it was

54:48a self-reporting.

54:50>> So, we don't give them a violation. They

54:52don't get a hefty fine, but they do get

54:55rolled back. But it was

54:57>> there's no roll back whatsoever. It's a

54:59move forward. So moving forward, you

55:01don't get the homeowners tax class.

55:03>> Okay?

55:04>> Right? So the only difference between um

55:06someone who doesn't do TVR um on their

55:10primary residence and someone who does

55:12is someone who doesn't gets the lower

55:16tax rate, the homeowners tax rate, which

55:18is $5.75

55:20instead of paying, let's say, the

55:21residential tax rate, which is $1110.

55:24Um they also um if you're using it

55:28strictly as your primary residence, you

55:30also get the benefit of a 3% cap,

55:32meaning year to year to year, your

55:34assessment is only going to go up 3%.

55:36Even if the market doubles, you're only

55:38going to go up 3%. But when someone

55:40registers for a T

55:44um and

55:47at that point it breaks their they don't

55:49get the homeowners class, they don't get

55:51the 3% cap, but that's moving forward.

55:54We're not going to roll them back. So,

55:55we're not going to go back to 2025 and

55:582024 and say, "You've been renting it

56:01for the last two, three years. You

56:03shouldn't have received this benefit.

56:04We're not rolling them back."

56:06>> That's the difference.

56:08>> That's the difference.

56:08>> This bill passes. That's the difference.

56:10>> Um, this bill doesn't effectively change

56:13what we're already doing now. It just

56:15codifies it.

56:17>> So, 45 days, we're going to codify

56:19something for 45 days that you're

56:21already doing. I think it's making it

56:23clear for the now [snorts] and and the

56:24future, right?

56:28>> Oh, there she is.

56:30You can't hide from us, Lisa. [laughter]

56:33>> She wants to

56:37>> I think I I think I confused myself.

56:39Administrator Mera, what what what am I

56:42missing here?

56:44>> So, Lisa, Mural Property Tax, I just

56:46want to clarify. There's something

56:48called the current year taxes. So that's

56:50what we're currently in right now. We're

56:52collecting for the 2026 tax year. And

56:56there's the roll back which is on prior

56:58years.

57:00So

57:02we do I just want to clarify we do

57:04adjust the current year's taxes. We

57:07don't go backwards. So we do current

57:10year and forward if it's self-reporting.

57:14The one thing this bill does do, and I

57:16think this is where, um, there might be

57:18some hangup, having nicely sat on the

57:20side, um, not coming up, is the

57:23notorized affidavit. When someone says,

57:26"I was doing it, but I'm going to stop

57:28and not do it, not register."

57:31I believe that's what's protecting them.

57:34From what I understand, the

57:35registrations have been very has been

57:38slower than they anticipated because

57:40people are afraid that real property is

57:43going to come in and roll them back for

57:45the two years plus penalties as well as

57:48the current year and it's a it's a very

57:51valid concern because we've gotten those

57:54calls as well. So, I think that's the

57:56difference. There has been many bills or

57:59other bills in the past that did cover

58:02this and the timeline would have been

58:04met, but those bills all died or council

58:07through it said separated out. So, it

58:10wasn't that we all like seeing December

58:1231st. It's just a culmination of I think

58:17council making so many changes to the

58:19actual original short-term vacation

58:22rental, transit rental, whatever it's

58:24called, of less than 180 days. And now

58:27we're limited to this because we're

58:30seeing that maybe people aren't as

58:33willing to come forward and register for

58:35the hosted rental because of some action

58:37real property may take. So, I don't know

58:39if that helps answer it and if I didn't

58:41say my name is Lisa Mirror, property tax

58:43administrator.

58:47>> Thank you, administrator. Mirror,

58:52I still feel lost on this. I don't know

58:54why. Maybe today is not my day. So, it

58:56sounds like the department is already

58:58doing what this says anyway.

59:01>> We're just clarifying it for the public

59:02and then adding in this notorized

59:04affidavit.

59:07I believe you're correct.

59:12>> Okay. I think Thank you. Thank you,

59:13administrator. Miss Call, you want to go

59:15ahead.

59:15>> Thank you. Yeah, I just um I I'm

59:18supporting this because it is doing just

59:20what you said. It's not making a major

59:22policy change, but I think it is

59:24important to um let people know. Um, so

59:28right now it's happening when people

59:31come in, but we're not necessarily like

59:33letting people know that this is the

59:35case. Um, we're giving people one more

59:38chance now um to to go in in within this

59:41time period and do the right thing

59:44whether it's uh declare that they're,

59:46you know, not going to be doing it going

59:48forward or um, you know, pay their just

59:52get into the right category and

59:53self-report. I think it's really

59:55important that we do this little piece

59:57to help our homeowner residents because

1:00:01we've we've missed a couple

1:00:02opportunities and these are the people

1:00:04that I am the most concerned with around

1:00:07this whole short-term vacation rental

1:00:10thing is our homeowners who you know

1:00:13we've tried to look at can we do certain

1:00:16things just for them and we haven't been

1:00:18able to and you know we've we've tried

1:00:20to do some different things that haven't

1:00:22passed but this is a small thing and I

1:00:24think for our residents, for our

1:00:26homeowners as we go through this hard

1:00:28time. I want to do all I can to try to

1:00:31help them because they're not really the

1:00:34major target, I guess I'd say, in a lot

1:00:37of this stuff. Um, and we and I don't

1:00:40want to penalize them anymore than than

1:00:43um they already feel like they're being

1:00:45penalized. So, I think it's a small

1:00:47thing we can do, but I think it's an

1:00:49important one and it shows goodwill to

1:00:51our to our resident homeowners. So, I'll

1:00:53be supporting. I yield.

1:00:56>> Council.

1:00:57>> Yeah. Um

1:01:00in in an effort to

1:01:02clarify this um you know if a no vote on

1:01:07this bill means that

1:01:10once the county through the planning

1:01:12department's registration process

1:01:15of short-term vacation rentals or TVRS

1:01:19um

1:01:20that information will be available to

1:01:23the real property tax department and so

1:01:26you will have a a set of folks that have

1:01:30not reported themselves

1:01:32purposefully to RPT, but they are

1:01:36reporting that we're going to know about

1:01:38them because of the registration. And so

1:01:41a no vote on this means that you're okay

1:01:43with

1:01:45doing roll back and penalties on those

1:01:47folks once that information becomes

1:01:49known.

1:01:51There is an argument for that because

1:01:53there are people out there that have

1:01:54already had to pay roll back and

1:01:56penalties because they didn't

1:01:57self-report that they were operating a

1:01:59TBR. But my interest at this point is

1:02:03getting people registered and I have had

1:02:05specific requests and concerns. I'm I'm

1:02:08worried about registering because it

1:02:10means now they're going to know that I'm

1:02:12doing this and my property taxes are

1:02:14going to change. It's like well that's

1:02:15not the problem. But um you know so so

1:02:19to council member Inava's comment this

1:02:21is actually more consistent with what

1:02:23the the real property tax has been been

1:02:26doing. It is in alignment with the

1:02:28decisions that have been made so far

1:02:29with self-reporting. It it really what

1:02:32it really does is it's it identifies the

1:02:34registration process as a form of

1:02:37self-reporting and then also provides

1:02:39that escape hatch for people that don't

1:02:41want to do it anymore where they

1:02:44wouldn't be liable for for the back

1:02:45taxes.

1:02:47Does that help or did I just make it

1:02:49worse?

1:02:51>> It it it helps. Council member Council.

1:02:56>> Yeah. Um you know, if I had a quarter

1:02:59for every time I've heard while sitting

1:03:01in this seat, um the intention for us to

1:03:05use carrots and not always just sticks.

1:03:11How many quarters would I have? I

1:03:13wouldn't need to find another job after

1:03:15I term out. [laughter]

1:03:18Um, I see this as a carrot and I see

1:03:22this as an opportunity for us to extend

1:03:25an olive branch to people and um provide

1:03:28a means to motivate them to register and

1:03:31to

1:03:35we we can't make it better for

1:03:37everybody, but um we can help ease the

1:03:40burden for these people as they um

1:03:44ideally come into compliance and

1:03:46register and um we move forward as a

1:03:50county. Uh yeah, so I'll be supporting

1:03:53this today. I yield.

1:03:59>> Okay. Thank you. Okay. Uh Mr. Clerk,

1:04:02roll call on foring bill 197 and council

1:04:06with a positive recommendation. on the

1:04:09motion to forward bill 197 to council

1:04:11with a favorable recommendation. Miss

1:04:13Kimba,

1:04:16>> Mr. Houston,

1:04:17>> hi.

1:04:18>> Mr. Inaba,

1:04:20>> no.

1:04:21>> Miss Kagiwara,

1:04:22>> hi.

1:04:23>> Miss Kirkowitz,

1:04:25>> Miss Kimell,

1:04:26>> I

1:04:27>> Mr. Onishi,

1:04:29>> no.

1:04:30>> Miss Viegas,

1:04:32>> I

1:04:33>> chair Connley Kleinfelder.

1:04:35>> No.

1:04:37Chair, you have four votes in favor,

1:04:39three nos, two absent, Miss Kimba, Miss

1:04:43Kirkowitz. The nos were Mr. Inaba, Mr.

1:04:46Onishi, and yourself. Um, the motion

1:04:50moves forward to council with

1:04:51unfavorable recommendation. Only four

1:04:53eyes.

1:04:54>> Thank you.

1:05:01>> Bill 198, please.

1:05:03If anyone would like to testify in bill

1:05:05198, please speak up now.

1:05:10Hearing and seeing none, bill 198 amends

1:05:12ordinance number 26-44 as amended. The

1:05:15operating budget of the county of Hawaii

1:05:17for fiscal year ending June 30, 2027

1:05:20appropriates revenues in the federal

1:05:21grants Kukuiola supportive housing

1:05:23project account 1,892,000

1:05:26and appropriates the same to the Kuiola

1:05:28supportive housing project account.

1:05:30Funds will be used to assist with the

1:05:32planning, design, and construction of

1:05:33the Kukui Olola supportive housing

1:05:35project introduced by council member

1:05:36Kane Kleinfielder by request. This is

1:05:39the companion measure to resolution

1:05:41694-26 that the body took up earlier.

1:05:44>> Chair motion to for bill 198 to council

1:05:46with a favorable recommendation.

1:05:48>> Motion by council member Houston,

1:05:50seconded by council member

1:05:53Kagi.

1:05:54Any discussion?

1:05:57Hearing and seeing none. Motion is on

1:05:58the floor. All in favor?

1:06:02>> Any opposed? Mr. Clerk, you have seven

1:06:05members in favor.

1:06:08Council members Kirkowitz and Gimma

1:06:10excused.

1:06:15>> If anyone would like to testify in Bill

1:06:172011, please speak up now.

1:06:23Hearing and seeing none, bill 201 amends

1:06:25ordinance number 26-45 relating to the

1:06:28public improvements and financing

1:06:29thereof for the fiscal year ending June

1:06:3130, 2027 adds the man mass transit

1:06:34agency Kyua Kona hub and park and ride

1:06:37facility project $5 million to the

1:06:39capital budget. Funds for this project

1:06:41shall be provided from general general

1:06:43obligation bonds, capital projects fund

1:06:45fund balance and or other sources

1:06:47introduced by council member Connie Lee

1:06:49Kleinfelder by request. Chair. Motion to

1:06:51forward bill 2011 to council with a

1:06:53positive recommendation.

1:06:56>> Motion by council member Hues, seconded

1:06:57by council onishi to forward bill 2011

1:06:59to council with a favorable

1:07:00recommendation. Any discussion? Council

1:07:02member Huis.

1:07:03>> Thanks chair. Curious anyone from Mass

1:07:06Transit's here to speak to this item.

1:07:09Deputy director might just be you then.

1:07:12>> Just uh curious um the CIP budget

1:07:16measures coming before us um off cycle a

1:07:19little bit. So just kind of curious um

1:07:21the if there's any motion or progress

1:07:23being made to this measure at all.

1:07:25>> Yes, absolutely. Malia Kai, deputy

1:07:27finance director. Um apologize. Zach

1:07:29Bergam um MTA administrator is is out of

1:07:31town right now. So sitting in for him as

1:07:33best as I can. Um yes, there has been

1:07:35some movement. We bring this forward as

1:07:37a midyear because we have the um we are

1:07:41working on purchasing a lot in in Kona

1:07:43to to create this park and ride. I know

1:07:45right now currently um people are

1:07:47standing out in the sun next to Target.

1:07:49It's not a great a great um situation. I

1:07:52think um I think we're averaging I think

1:07:56writership is about 200 people a day or

1:07:58something out there. So um this will

1:08:00have an opportunity to have a uh park

1:08:03and ride location set up a place where

1:08:05there could be you know a bus stop with

1:08:07you know coverage for for people to sit

1:08:10under and everything. And so this figure

1:08:12represents the the purchasing price

1:08:15possibly for uh property. So you've

1:08:18identified some some locations maybe to

1:08:21be that exact site.

1:08:22>> Yes, we have identified uh we were

1:08:24looking at uh two to three locations

1:08:27down um near Elite E drive and we've we

1:08:30continue to work with the landowners and

1:08:32figure out which one we can purchase.

1:08:34And yeah, this represents kind of the um

1:08:38what we think to be the appraised value

1:08:40of the the properties.

1:08:43>> And this would be also in alignment with

1:08:45um the mass transit master plan in terms

1:08:48of standing up that hub going in the

1:08:51future. So it's not just it's beyond the

1:08:53park and ride facility as an initial

1:08:55step, but kind of being able to

1:08:57accommodate a future hub for the Kona

1:08:59area.

1:09:00>> Yeah, I think um obviously finances

1:09:03permitting We we we hope to see that in

1:09:05the future that it starts kind of small.

1:09:07We be able to sand it up quickly and

1:09:10then with the proper other steps we can

1:09:12grow it into a proper hub.

1:09:15>> So kind of that analysis and assessment

1:09:17of the property will include kind of you

1:09:20know this would be substantial enough to

1:09:21be able to then become a hub in the

1:09:23future.

1:09:25>> Yeah.

1:09:26>> Yes.

1:09:26>> Okay. Okay. So kind of making that kind

1:09:29of foresight and like this is going to

1:09:30be this will be the place where we want

1:09:33to establish the hub then going forward.

1:09:36>> Yes.

1:09:36>> Okay. Okay. Thank you so much.

1:09:39>> Thank you counc.

1:09:41>> Thank you. I don't did we have a

1:09:42presentation on this before from mass

1:09:45transit? I don't remember seeing it.

1:09:46>> Um I don't think so.

1:09:50Not on this specific specific property.

1:09:52There's been a few different properties

1:09:53that we've been looking at um uh in that

1:09:56same area just kind of that we we

1:09:59haven't really we weren't previously

1:10:01able to kind of nail down which one was

1:10:03would become available to us to

1:10:05purchase. So yeah, there wouldn't have

1:10:06been a presentation.

1:10:07>> I mean it would be great to maybe hear

1:10:09about from Mass Transit, you know, what

1:10:11what the plans are.

1:10:12>> Yeah, absolutely. I'm I'm hoping that

1:10:14they're available at the next hearing.

1:10:15Yeah, they're just both out of town

1:10:16right now.

1:10:17>> Okay, great. Yeah. And then um funding,

1:10:20this is coming out of general obligation

1:10:24bonds. Um just wondering in the past it

1:10:27seems like mass transit is one of the

1:10:30places that we've been able to get a lot

1:10:32of federal funding and other funding. Is

1:10:34are there other are you did you have

1:10:37your eye on some funding for the actual

1:10:39build and everything?

1:10:40>> Um yeah, if you look at the FIS actually

1:10:42I think it identifies get funding. Okay.

1:10:44But the um we keep it kind of broad just

1:10:47in case we need to switch um to a

1:10:49different type of funding like bonds or

1:10:51something. But most likely we're hoping

1:10:53that we can use get funds because it is

1:10:55a transportation part of the

1:10:56transportation infrastructure,

1:10:57>> right? But even get funds those are our

1:10:59funds.

1:11:01>> Yeah. I mean we get that through taxes

1:11:03but yes right.

1:11:04>> Yeah. If there is an opportunity to use

1:11:06federal

1:11:06>> so you at this time you don't have

1:11:08federal dollars in sight or anything

1:11:10>> not identified. In fact, a lot of times

1:11:12it slows the process down. Um, so just

1:11:14for the acquisition, we won't be

1:11:16probably looking to federal funds, but

1:11:18because it usually takes more time and

1:11:20it gets more complicated, but for the

1:11:22actual buildout, probably we will look

1:11:24at federal funds at that time.

1:11:25>> Okay. I hope we can we can find those.

1:11:28Yes.

1:11:28>> Given all our other costs. All right.

1:11:30Thank you. I yield.

1:11:33>> Thank you.

1:11:34>> Is this a project that needs to be

1:11:36rushed? Um, I would

1:11:40I I don't want to go slow. Let's just

1:11:43say that much. I mean, I think we're

1:11:45trying to are we're trying to get it

1:11:47done before the end of the year.

1:11:49>> Oh, okay.

1:11:49>> Yeah. So, yes, we don't want to drag our

1:11:52feet, I guess, is the question. Yeah.

1:11:53>> Because I was just wondering maybe we

1:11:54could postpone it and then listen. No,

1:11:56but just listen to what the presentation

1:11:58is, what going to be with this $5

1:12:00million, what's going to include and

1:12:02everything, right?

1:12:02>> Yeah. Well, the the $5 million is just

1:12:04the lang land acquisition at this time.

1:12:06Yeah, that doesn't include buildout.

1:12:10>> Okay.

1:12:10>> Yeah.

1:12:10>> Okay.

1:12:12>> Got it. Yeah. Yeah.

1:12:14>> Thank you.

1:12:16>> Is this all fully recognizing lights?

1:12:24>> Yeah. I just want to thank you for being

1:12:25here for Mass Transit today and say that

1:12:27um from District 7, there has been a

1:12:30dire need. Um, I think we started

1:12:32talking about this issue and the

1:12:36creation of a transportation hub in Kona

1:12:397 years ago and finding a piece of

1:12:42property, a willing seller, market

1:12:45rates, all those different things has

1:12:46been an uphill battle. So I'm really

1:12:49excited to hear uh that there is uh

1:12:52something in the works and u just ask

1:12:56for my colleague support in moving this

1:12:58forward and then would look forward to

1:13:00having a more detailed presentation from

1:13:02Department of Transportation having

1:13:04received a number of um scathing emails

1:13:08and phone calls from people that are

1:13:10standing there in the hot sun by Target

1:13:12and just the need for us to have that

1:13:15piece of infrastructure.

1:13:17uh put in place uh for the west side I

1:13:21think is a really wise choice in the

1:13:25right direction. So thank you for that.

1:13:26I yield.

1:13:28>> Thank you. Is this tied to the the

1:13:30baseard? Mass trans baseard or

1:13:34>> this? No, this won't be a parcel for a

1:13:35baseard just a hub.

1:13:37>> Okay. I remember asking you guys was

1:13:39asking mass transit if they could

1:13:40combine like public works needs a base,

1:13:42mass transit a baseard and trying to be

1:13:45efficient. So totally separate.

1:13:47>> Yeah, this property wouldn't be ideal

1:13:49for that. That probably would be more

1:13:50like an industrial area. Yeah.

1:13:53>> Thank any other questions.

1:13:56Okay. Thank you, Miss Kai. You're our

1:13:58last for today. Thank you very much.

1:14:01Okay. Seeing

1:14:03no further discussion, we have a motion

1:14:04on the floor to forward bill 2011 to

1:14:06council with the favorable

1:14:06recommendation. All in favor?

1:14:09>> Any opposed?

1:14:10>> Mr. Clerk, you have no nos. Seven eyes.

1:14:14>> Mr.

1:14:16Sorry, Miss Gima, Miss Kirkwis excused.

1:14:20Motion carries. That brings us to the

1:14:22end of our agenda. Seeing no further

1:14:24business, we are adjourned. It's 4:56.

1:14:26Oh, nice one. 456 p.m. We started at

1:14:293:45 and we finished at 456.

1:14:33>> Good job. Well done.

1:14:37I tell you.

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