2026-10-05 - City Council Regular Meeting

22:09All right. Good evening. I'm going to

22:12call to order the October 5th, 2026

22:17meeting of the PaloAlto City Council.

22:19Madame Clerk, would you please call the

22:20role?

22:21>> Of course. Council member Lowing

22:23>> here.

22:24>> Council member Rectal

22:25>> here.

22:25>> Council member Lou

22:27>> here. Mayor Vinker

22:29>> here, council member Bert here,

22:31>> council member Liths here, Vice Mayor

22:33Stone here for the record, all present.

22:35>> All right. Thank you. And just uh want

22:37to make a preliminary statement. Um last

22:40week we had to recess because our

22:42meeting was disrupted to the extent that

22:44we could not conduct the business of the

22:46city. So I need to remind all of us that

22:49this council meeting will be conducted

22:51in an orderly manner in alignment with

22:53the PaloAlto municipal code and city

22:55council policies and procedures on

22:58decorum. And out of respect for the

23:00residents we serve and to ensure a fair

23:03opportunity for all public commenters,

23:05staff and council members to be heard in

23:07turn, we ask that everyone work with us

23:09to follow the rules so that we can have

23:11a productive meeting. And with that, I

23:14will turn to our first item of business,

23:17which is boards, commissions, and

23:19committee appointments. And I will turn

23:21it over to the clerk.

23:45Good evening. I'm Christine Prior, the

23:46assistant city clerk. I'm joined by

23:48Mahani Aun, the city clerk. And tonight,

23:51the city council will be making

23:54appointments to the human relations

23:56commission, the parks and recreation

23:57commission, and the planning and

23:59transportation commission. Next, please.

24:04This slide briefly summarizes the

24:06vacancy information for these three

24:08bodies um as well as lists the

24:12candidates that the council interviewed

24:13in previous meetings. I will briefly go

24:16over the vacancies. So for HRC we have

24:19two fullterm vacancies and one partial

24:22vacancy. For planning and transportation

24:25there is one partial term vacancy. And

24:28for parks and recreation there are four

24:31fullterm vacancies.

24:36As a reminder on the process,

24:39each council member will have one vote

24:41per vacancy. Four votes are needed to

24:44appoint a candidate, and we will conduct

24:47additional rounds of voting if necessary

24:49to break any tie votes. We have um just

24:53now emailed you an electronic ballot to

24:55your city email addresses.

24:58And

25:01>> and then at the mayor's discretion, if

25:03the council would like to take public

25:05comment now or um at what point?

25:11>> Well, I think we need to take it before

25:12we vote. So, we might as well go ahead

25:14and do that now. On this item,

25:23we have one request to speak. Henry E.

25:34Henry E.

25:36That concludes public comment on item

25:39one.

25:42>> Okay.

25:44So,

25:47my city email just went out. So, um

25:52>> we we do have a paper ballot if the

25:53electronic ballot is not working for

25:55whatever reason.

25:58I could do it on my phone probably.

25:59Should we Why don't we take a moment and

26:00do this first round and then while

26:02you're toting we can move on to uh the

26:04proclamation and then see where we

26:06stand. All right. So, let's all vote

26:09now.

29:11We called public comment. We called all

29:13who signed up to speak and those who

29:15were in the room and we waited. So

29:16public comment is now closed on this

29:18item. But please please we we need to

29:27Okay, I need to I am obligated to warn

29:30you that your behavior is now disruptive

29:32because you are out of order and uh you

29:36have it was called and you are not

29:38present. So if you do not if if you do

29:42not allow us to restore to order then we

29:46your failure to comply could result in

29:49your removal from this meeting. I don't

29:51want to see that. So, please let us

29:54regain order because we No, we we

30:00>> Okay, we need I I I don't want to remove

30:03you, but I need to warn you that removal

30:05will happen if you do not restore to

30:08order.

30:24There will be other items and when you

30:26are present you may have time but you

30:28are currently out of order and I need to

30:30warn you again that if you continue to

30:33be out of order I could will regrettably

30:35have to ask that you be removed. Okay.

30:40Right.

30:41>> I demand

30:42>> you demand that I arrest you. I just

30:44want to make sure that is on the record

30:45that you demand that I arrest you.

30:58>> Okay. Well, I'm I'm trying to vote and

31:01I'm finding it difficult to do so at the

31:03moment. So, if we don't uh if we can't

31:05restore order and get the votes in, we

31:07will need to recess. That is the next

31:09step.

31:19Just on the voting item, the general

31:21public comment is still coming and we

31:22welcome you back for that.

32:30Has everyone had a chance to submit

32:32their votes?

32:34Anyone still working on it? No. Okay.

32:37Well, then while they're telling them,

32:39why don't we move on to our special

32:41order of the day and then we'll return

32:42to this for a total? Okay. Excellent.

32:46So, our special order of the day is a

32:48proclamation recognizing fire prevention

32:51week and I have asked council member

32:53Rectal to uh read the proclamation.

32:55Okay.

32:56>> Thank you. Fire prevention week October

32:594th through 10th 2026.

33:02Whereas the city of Palo Alto is

33:04committed to ensuring the safety and

33:05security of all those living in, working

33:08in, and visiting the community. And

33:11whereas lithium ion ion biometry fires

33:15remain a serious and growing hazard

33:17primarily caused by thermal runaway a

33:19chain reaction triggered by damage

33:21overcharging or manufacturing defects

33:24with micromobility devices such as

33:27ebikes, scooters, laptops, and cell

33:29phones frequently involved. Whereas all

33:33household members should develop and

33:35practice a home fire safety and escape

33:37plan that includes buying, charging, and

33:40recycling lithium ion batteries safely,

33:43having two exits from every room in the

33:46home with a path to the outside from

33:48exits, installing smoke alarms in all

33:51required locations, and designating a

33:54meeting place outside where everyone in

33:56the home will meet upon exiting.

33:59And whereas the city of PaloAlto fire

34:02department first responders and dedicate

34:04are dedicated to reducing the occurrence

34:07of home fires and home fire injuries

34:09throughout prevention and education.

34:12Whereas the city of Powaltto residents

34:15are encouraged to participate in public

34:16education measures so they can take

34:19personal steps to increase their safety

34:20from fire. And whereas the city of

34:23Powalto's 2026 fire prevention week

34:26theme, charge up safely, effectively

34:30serves to educate the public, including

34:32many residents who rely on ebikes,

34:34scooters, and other micromobility

34:36devices about simple but important

34:39charging habits that can help reduce the

34:41risk of lithium ion battery fires,

34:44keeping themselves and those around them

34:46safe. So now therefore, Vicky Vanker,

34:50mayor of the city of Powaltto, on behalf

34:52of the entire city council, does hereby

34:54proclaim October 4th through 10th, 2026

34:58as fire pretend fire prevention week in

35:02the city of Palo Alto and urge all

35:05community members to participate in the

35:07public safety activities and efforts of

35:10the city of Powalto fire and emergency

35:12services departments during fire

35:14prevention week.

35:16Thank you, Council Member Rectal, Fire

35:19Chief Lindsay. Welcome.

35:22>> Good evening, Mayor Vinker, Vice Mayor

35:24Stone, and Council Members. Steve

35:26Lindsay, fire chief for City of Palo

35:28Alto. I want to just take a moment and

35:30highlight the good work that our fire

35:31prevention bureau does year round. Uh we

35:33do thousands of inspections both in

35:35business, multi-residential uh

35:38facilities, schools, and also new

35:40construction. On top of that, we do

35:42wildland urban interface inspections.

35:44All this work happens year round to

35:46reduce the risk to the community. And

35:47although this week is a campaign for

35:49public safety and public education,

35:52there's a lot of great work that our

35:53bureau does. And I'd like to introduce

35:55our acting fire marshal Dave Villa so he

35:57could talk a little bit more. Um, one

35:59thing I wanted to highlight though is

36:00that this Saturday, October 10th, at

36:03Fire Station 2, we'll be hosting a fire

36:05prevention week open house. Um, it

36:08starts at 10 a.m. So, please spread the

36:10word and everybody's welcome to join.

36:11Thank you.

36:13Thank you. And I believe this is our

36:15acting fire marshal, David Varel.

36:18Welcome.

36:19>> Good evening, Miss Mayor Vinker, Vice

36:21Mayor Stone, City Council. My name is

36:23Dave Vill. I'm the acting fire marshal

36:25for the city of PaloAlto. Thank you to

36:27Fire Chief Lindseay for their

36:28introduction.

36:30Excuse me. I'd like to recognize the men

36:32and women of the Palo Alto Fire

36:34Department for all the hard work they

36:35do. Uh, fire prevention week has been

36:38obser observed nationally since 1922.

36:41It commemorates the great Chicago fire

36:44of October 1871 which killed more than

36:47250 people and left 100,000 homeless.

36:50It's the longest running public health

36:52observance in the country and its

36:56purpose is to never is it's never

36:59changed to remind households most fires

37:01can be prevented. This year runs October

37:044th through the 10th. This year's theme

37:07National Fire Protection Association

37:09charge into safety. Safe charging is a

37:11superpower. It focuses on lithium ion

37:14battery and safe charging practices.

37:17Think about how many of these batteries

37:18are in this room right now and our

37:20laptops, our cell phones, our earbuds,

37:24um, and so on. They also

37:28control our tablets, power tools,

37:30ebikes, and scooters. These batteries

37:32store a tremendous amount of energy in a

37:35small space. When they are damaged,

37:37overheated, or charged the wrong way,

37:39they can fail suddenly, thus resulting

37:41in fire growth that is difficult to put

37:43out.

37:45To bring the message into the community,

37:47we are sharing a free grade level

37:48self-charging lesson with Palafala

37:50Unified from kindergarten through middle

37:52school. We're also posting safety tips

37:55each day on the city's on the fire

37:57department and city's social media

37:58channels. And once again, as Chief

38:01Lindseay said before, we invite everyone

38:02to our annual community open house

38:04Saturday, October 10th from 10 to 2 at

38:07Fire Station 2, 2675 Handover Street. Uh

38:11families can meet their firefighters,

38:13tour the station, pick up on safety tips

38:15to take home, and there's some goodie

38:17bags for the little ones. Thank you

38:20again, city council, for this

38:21proclamation and for your continued

38:23support of the fire department. And

38:24thank you to our residents. Every time

38:26you plug in, you should have the power

38:28to keep your family safe. All

38:31right. Well, thank you very much and uh

38:33thank you to the brave men and women of

38:35the Pala Fire Department and uh to you

38:38who lead it and keep current on issues

38:40like these new batteries and the fire

38:42hazards related to them. So, uh we

38:44appreciate it. Thank you.

38:47All right. So, why don't we return and

38:49see how we're doing on our vote count on

38:51item one.

38:53Mayor, we are still tabulating the vote

38:55results. If you'd like, we can move on

38:58to inerson public comment and then

38:59return back to the vote result.

39:02>> Yeah, if you're still tabulating, we'll

39:03move forward. I think the next thing is

39:05agenda changes, additions, and

39:06deletions. Mr. City Manager,

39:08>> thank you, mayor. Uh, one change to your

39:10agenda this evening. There had been

39:12added a closed session at the end of the

39:14evening, AA1, that is no longer needed.

39:16So, we'll be removed from the agenda.

39:18That's the only change this evening.

39:20>> Great. Thank you very much. All right.

39:23So, now we will move on to in-person

39:25public comment. Um, madame clerk, how

39:28many speakers do we have?

39:33>> We have four requests to speak.

39:35>> Okay.

39:45Our first speaker is Neva Y.

39:58Good evening, mayor and city council. My

40:01name is Neva Jarkin, and I live on

40:03Churchill Avenue, five houses from the

40:06train tracks. My neighbor was awakened

40:09Sunday morning at 4:30 a.m. and I

40:12finally got up at 6:00 a.m. At 7:10, I

40:16went to find out what was making all the

40:18noise at the Churchill train crossing. I

40:21saw the train crossing gates were down.

40:24Blinking red lights on Alma Street were

40:27flashing for cars and other train

40:30noises. I called Cal Trains at 7:15 in

40:33the morning. At 800 a.m., 45 minutes

40:36later, when I left my house, the above

40:39problems were still going on. This is a

40:42train accident waiting to happen with

40:44car backups at the intersection of Elma

40:47and Churchill. A similar problem

40:50happened last Thursday before 6:15 in

40:54the morning. I kept hearing all kinds of

40:56noise at the train tracks. When I left

40:59my house at 6:45, the problems were

41:02solved. Today, Monday, a hitand-run car

41:06accident happened around 9:00 in the

41:08morning on Churchill at the same

41:11intersection. I would be grateful for

41:13someone from the city to handle the

41:15train problems and address my traffic

41:18concerns. Thank you for your time.

41:21>> Our next speaker is Aram F.

41:28>> I'll go off script. I'll go off script

41:29here for a minute. I wanted to thank the

41:31fire department personally. Two years

41:34ago, December, they actually saved my

41:36life. But we'll get into the story of

41:37that. But I want to thank you, but I

41:39wouldn't be here but for the

41:41professionalism of your folks.

41:43You have a good evening. Okay. So, um,

41:47Julie Lithu, you probably know Tanahashi

41:50Coats. Um, and there is uh I'm reading

41:54the message and in there there's a

41:57description of his having traveled to

41:59the West Bank, Hebrron and Ramla.

42:02And in this book

42:04he describes the treatment of the

42:07Palestinians people as

42:10similar to the Jim Crow era, the

42:12treatment of African-Americans. And he

42:14has a lot of affinity there. But one of

42:16the best lines I've ever seen to

42:18describe the disgusting genocidal

42:20behavior of the Israelis is this line

42:23right here.

42:26So that in thinking about my trip in

42:28setting my sides

42:31upon the field, my frame excluded any

42:34def any defense of the patently immoral.

42:40And here's the line. I would sooner hear

42:44a defense of cannibalism than I would

42:46hear any brief for what I saw with my

42:49own eyes in Hebron and Ramla.

42:54I think that says it all about the

42:55despicability

42:57of the state of Israel and the US

43:00support for them. So, congratulations

43:02for Tanahashi for putting that out. and

43:04you know he suffered a lot of abuse and

43:07controversy uh for his statements about

43:10his trip there with other writers. So um

43:14I'm running out of time here but I just

43:16wanted to say that um I found

43:19Ed Lowing's statements to the on the

43:22front page of the

43:24PaloAlto Daily on uh Thursday the

43:28October 1st. She says the city could put

43:30signs at the entrance to the city to ban

43:33RVs without a parking permit. Boy, right

43:36out of the uh the Zionist script, huh?

43:38We're going to try to you make Palo Alto

43:41an apartheid city, but this isn't Gassa

43:44and this isn't West Bank and Zionists

43:46don't have the authority to do that

43:48here. I know you'd like to bring that

43:49that playbook right here to PaloAlto,

43:52but I'm an anti-sionist Jew and I'm

43:54going to resist your Zionism and your

43:57apartheid state of mind every day for

44:00the next four years if you get

44:02reelected, so don't worry. Or every

44:04council meeting. Um, so it's it's

44:06despicable. And then he goes on to say,

44:08"Council's already voted to permit about

44:1040 RVs at the edge of the city. that

44:14covers what uh I think uh it feels like

44:17we should uh and then he he goes on to

44:19say that's enough. You know, we don't

44:21need to do anymore. That's that's the

44:24the bottom line for what he thinks we

44:26should do for the unhoused. Easy for

44:28multi-millionaires to say h

44:32>> Thank you.

44:33>> Our next speaker is Henry E.

44:43Yesterday, my seatmate at Moravian

44:46Church or attend who helps me with the

44:50uh himnels because I'm a newbie there.

44:53She told me that she had been laid off

44:55from her job in Palo Alto as a school

44:58crossing guard. She made $21 in the

45:01morning and $21 in the evening as a

45:04school crossing guard. She was laid off

45:07at the end of the at the end of the

45:09service uh after the collection. I saw

45:12since she was sitting next to me that

45:14she was slipped a packet of money that

45:16came from the collection box. So

45:18redistri redistribution of wealth was

45:20going on in Palo Alto from part of the

45:24one part of the working class to

45:26another. I spoke uh before about Yan,

45:29the three-year-old who would like a

45:31library card. I spoke about uh Hilig

45:35Harold Hilig workingclass hero who ran

45:38German auto that the city of Palo Alto

45:40will not allow a permit to continue so

45:42we can have a benchmark of service. I

45:45had to pay a lot more to get service for

45:47a car when they were closed. Harold

45:49Hilik deserves to be recognized as do

45:51other members of the Palo Alto working

45:53class. That is my point for today. If I

45:57made an outburst before,

45:59it was because last week the mayor

46:02didn't allow me to speak in public

46:04comments. So, I was sensitized to be not

46:07allowed again, and that's why I was a

46:10bit insistent.

46:11Thank you, Madame Mayor.

46:15Well, I still have a lot of time left.

46:16My god. Well, I will just use it to say

46:20I didn't expect to be here today. I'm

46:23supposed to be keynoting a conference in

46:25Brazil.

46:27The person who was bringing to the

46:29conference scammed me. I was supposed to

46:32get a premium ticket, but when time came

46:35to go, the ticket was

46:38economy class. My wife is very

46:42perspacious and seeing details and she

46:44told me it's not the right ticket. I

46:47have uh a foot problem and I was told by

46:51my colleagues in Brazil, Henry, if you

46:53had gotten on that plane, you would not

46:55have gotten off it. [clears throat] So,

46:57I did not fly. And I decided instead I

47:00should stay here for the two weeks and I

47:03will address the meeting in Brazil

47:06virtually and go another time

47:10later in the year as I did after the

47:12last uh election round uh when I was

47:15invited by the Brazil Marines uh to

47:17speak. They held up their meeting until

47:20it was time for me to attend. So that's

47:22how I happen to be here with you today.

47:25and look forward to making additional uh

47:27comments and to explaining why the city

47:29needs a super residentialist on the

47:32council. Someone who will look out for

47:34the light air

47:37and

47:39space of every resident and will be a

47:41voice against the

47:45>> developers. So I say money push the

47:49money changes out of the temple of Palo

47:51Alto. No developers

47:54Our next speaker is Matt S.

48:02>> Hello, my name is Matt Schlegel and I'm

48:07a member of

48:09safety over surveillance PaloAlto.

48:13Last week, I reported each city council

48:17candidates's position on mass

48:20surveillance and on the use of the mass

48:24surveillance tool flock. I would like to

48:27correct the record on one candidate's

48:29position on mass surveillance.

48:33Although Henry Escovitz is in favor of

48:36surveillance

48:38undertaken under a court approved

48:41warrant consistent with the Fourth

48:43Amendment. He is not in favor of

48:47warrantless mass surveillance.

48:50We have changed candidate Ecoit's

48:54response to reflect that position and I

48:57apologize for my understanding of his

49:00position.

49:00>> Thank you for your pause. I would like

49:02you to play me.

49:04>> So in summary,

49:07one candidate is in favor of both block

49:12and mass surveillance, and that's Gary

49:14Gelchick.

49:16Four candidates have expressed

49:19disapproval of Flock, but are in are

49:22open to evaluating other mass

49:26surveillance tools despite our Fourth

49:29Amendment rights. Those are Vicky

49:32Vinker, Briana Chang, Ed Lowing, and UDI

49:37Deng. And there are three candidates who

49:41say they will prioritize PaloAlto

49:44citizens fourth amendment rights and

49:47object to the use of both flock and mass

49:50surveillance tools.

49:53Those candidates are Raymond Goens,

49:57Brian Hamichek, and Henry Eskavitz. Full

50:01disclosure, I'm supporting Remy Goen's

50:04campaign.

50:05Fighting fascism is not easy. If it were

50:09easy, everyone would be doing it. But

50:13every day is a beautiful day to be

50:17fighting fascism.

50:20Please don't give the fascists an inch

50:24because they will take a mile. Please

50:27cover the flock cameras. Please

50:30terminate the flock camera. Please ban

50:33mass surveillance tools. The eyes of

50:36fascism in our city. Thank you.

50:40>> And that concludes in person public

50:42comment for items not on the agenda.

50:45>> All right. Thank you. Thank you to our

50:47public commenters. Um so do we have

50:50totals at this point? Okay.

51:00All right, I will announce votes for um

51:05the commissions that have

51:08enough votes to appoint the candidate

51:10for the two fullterm positions on the

51:13human relations.

51:15Oh

51:18yeah. So, first I'll announce the um the

51:22votes and then the candidate that will

51:23be appointed. Aji Aliti received votes

51:26from Bert and Lowi.

51:29Cynthia Wood, Ellen Bob, and Haley

51:31Hannah did not receive votes. Haiti

51:34Causy received votes from all seven

51:36council members. Raisel Rosenberg

51:38received votes from Lou Lithcot, Hayes,

51:41Rectal, Stone, and Vinker. Sunny Dyel

51:44did not receive votes. So Katie Causy

51:47and Raisel Rosenberg will be appointed

51:49to the two fullterm positions on HRC.

51:55Now moving to the one partial term

51:58vacancy on HRC.

52:00Aji Eliti received votes from Lithcot

52:03Hayes. Cynthia Wood did not receive

52:05votes. Ellen Bob received votes from

52:08Lowing Breall and Vinker. Haley Hannah

52:11received votes from Bert Lou and Stone.

52:15Katie Cosy, Raisel Rosenberg, and Sunny

52:17Dyel did not receive votes. A second

52:19round of voting is required for the

52:22partial term on the HRC

52:24and we will um distribute an electronic

52:28ballot with this and any other um second

52:30votes as needed.

52:34Moving on to the parks and recreation

52:36commission. Aubrey Whitcom received

52:38votes from

52:42wowing lithotes

52:46and rectal.

52:48Um,

52:50Virginia Ruiz

52:52Albvesete received votes from Lowi Lou

52:55and Stone. Um, Object

52:58Saloni received votes from Bert.

53:02Sterling Watson did not receive votes.

53:06Shaunie Klein House received votes from

53:08all seven council members. Ben Lenol

53:11received votes from Bert Rectal and

53:13Vinker. Mark Shonen received votes from

53:16Lowing, Lou, Stone, and Vinker. Leo

53:20Hodberg received votes from Bert,

53:22Lithcot, HS, and Rectal. And Bing, Betty

53:26Wei received votes from Lou Lithcott,

53:29Hayes, Stone, and Vinker.

53:33So, we will be appointing candid three

53:35candidates, Shaunie Fleinhouse, Mark

53:37Shonen, and Bing, Betty Wei. A

53:40tiebreaker vote is needed to fill the

53:43fourth vacancy

53:46and the vote will be between Aubrey

53:48Whitam, Virginia Ruiz Aldisete, Ben

53:51Lenol, and Leo H. Hotchber.

53:57And finally, for the one vacancy on the

54:00planning and transportation commission,

54:03Christopher Cow received votes from

54:04Lithot HS. Jeff Watt did not receive

54:07votes. Tom Seagull received votes from

54:10Bert, Lowing, Lou, Rectal, Stone, and

54:14Vinker. Tom Seagull will be appointed to

54:17the Planning and Transportation

54:18Commission. We will now distribute

54:21another round of um electronic ballots

54:25and um we we can announce the votes at

54:29the chair's discretion.

54:33I think we should take the time to vote

54:35and then we can uh move on while you

54:37count them.

58:09We've received all votes, but it will

58:10take us um a moment to tabulate the

58:12votes if you'd like to move on to our

58:14next.

58:15>> Sure. Thank you. All right. So, why

58:17don't we do that and let's move on to uh

58:20council member questions, comments, and

58:23announcements.

58:24colleagues.

58:33Council member Liths.

58:36>> Thank you, Mayor. Um, in advance of

58:38consent calendar item five coming before

58:40us, I want to take a moment to remind us

58:43where we are regarding the future of our

58:45Cubly Community Center and how item five

58:47relates to that.

58:49As we all know, council's vision for a

58:52revitalized Cubberly is that it would be

58:55quote a vibrant, beloved, and adaptable

58:58destination that promotes learning,

59:00interconnectivity, joy, and well-being

59:02where all cultures and generations

59:04belong. Having placed a measure on the

59:07ballot to fund the acquisition of the

59:09remaining seven acres of buildings from

59:10the school district, the city continues

59:13to engage with community partners to

59:15advance some elements of the Cubly

59:17project through a combination of city

59:19and private investment. Partners would

59:21contribute financially to site

59:23development while offering a diverse

59:25range of programs at Cberly for people

59:27of all ages and abilities, helping to

59:29move the Cberly project forward. Last

59:32week, as many know, we approved a letter

59:34of intent with the Sunnyvale Maker Space

59:37called Maker Nexus, which envisions a

59:39maker space for all ages at Cberly. Last

59:42week, we also approved a term sheet with

59:44a different partner, Friends of Palo

59:46Alto Recreation and Wellness, which

59:48intends to build a gym facility at

59:50Cberly, and has committed to raising the

59:52cost of that facility, raising the funds

59:55to pay for that facility, which is

59:56estimated at $40 million.

59:59Tonight, two additional partnership

1:00:01opportunities are before us. One with

1:00:04Avanitus and another with Heartfit for

1:00:06Life. Those letters of intent are item

1:00:09five on the consent calendar. Both

1:00:11Avanitus and Heartfit are current

1:00:13tenants at Cubberly and are devoted to

1:00:15supporting the health and well-being of

1:00:17aging adults in our community. They

1:00:19recognize that their shared mission to

1:00:22support the lives of adults as they age

1:00:24provides an opportunity to work together

1:00:26to share space and resources in a future

1:00:29Cubberly.

1:00:31Avanitus has operated the Avanitas

1:00:33Chinese Community Center at Cberly since

1:00:352018. Expanding their services at

1:00:38Carbully would provide space for senior

1:00:40services currently offered at their

1:00:41downtown location so more adults can

1:00:44access services that support healthy

1:00:46aging while continuing the important

1:00:48programs offered at the Chinese

1:00:49Community Center. The letter of intent

1:00:52includes the intent to quote explore a

1:00:54funding model in which the city and

1:00:56Avanitus jointly support the capital

1:00:58development of the facility. Avanatus

1:01:01may initiate and lead fundraising

1:01:03efforts to raise a substantial portion

1:01:04of capital costs through through

1:01:07philanthropy, grants, and other external

1:01:09funding sources to supplement city

1:01:11investment.

1:01:13Heartfit for Life has been at Carberly

1:01:15for 23 years operating cardiac therapy

1:01:18and rehabilitation programs so adults

1:01:20can live longer, healthier lives. A

1:01:23partnership with Hartfit would allow

1:01:24continuity of their programs while

1:01:26supporting additional community

1:01:28programming to support health and

1:01:29well-being. regarding collaborating on

1:01:31providing capital to the Cberly project.

1:01:33The Heartfit for Life letter of intent

1:01:36states, "Heartfit for Life will

1:01:38undertake a fundraising effort to raise

1:01:39a substantial portion of the expected

1:01:41capital development costs for their

1:01:44dedicated space at Cberly and possibly

1:01:46more and will endeavor to supplement

1:01:49funds acquired by the city or others.

1:01:52Avanatus and Hartit's plans to raise

1:01:55funds for Cubberly are critical

1:01:57components of the overall vision for how

1:01:59the Cberly renovations and improvements

1:02:00will unfold and be paid for. We are so

1:02:03grateful that they share the city's

1:02:05vision and want to join the city in

1:02:07building a community center we can be

1:02:09proud of for generations to come. Thank

1:02:12you.

1:02:15>> Thank you. Any other colleagues?

1:02:23All right. Um, well then, uh, I just

1:02:25have a couple of things. And, uh, first,

1:02:28just, uh, for the record, I want to say

1:02:30that I did welcome, uh, Mr. Escowit's

1:02:33public comments during the early live

1:02:35public comment last week for general. It

1:02:38was at the end when it was Zoom time

1:02:39that we declined to give him a second

1:02:41chance. Um, now I want to uh mention uh

1:02:47a topic. So, the Know Your Neighbor

1:02:49grant program that we are so proud of um

1:02:52that allows the building of community in

1:02:55neighborhoods ran out of money this

1:02:57year. So, the Know Your Neighbor grant

1:02:59program uh is one that the vice mayor

1:03:02and I would like to uh support by

1:03:05proposing that $15,000 from the council

1:03:10contingency fund be added to that grant

1:03:13program. And it would help our

1:03:15neighborhoods build community. And it

1:03:16would also include the uh Midtown uh ice

1:03:19cream social a couple of weeks back that

1:03:21did not get their usual grant because we

1:03:23had run out of money. So uh just want to

1:03:27ask and give an opportunity for any

1:03:28council member who has concerns or

1:03:30objections about that uh transfer or

1:03:33that deployment of funds.

1:03:37I'm not seeing any. So I'm happy to say

1:03:39that we will allocate that $15,000 to

1:03:43the know your neighbor grant program.

1:03:45So, thank you all for your support in

1:03:47that.

1:03:49Um, and then lastly, uh, I'm pleased to

1:03:53announce that today the city and the

1:03:56school district made a joint statement

1:03:58regarding how we arrived at the purchase

1:04:01price for a portion of the Cberly

1:04:03properly property. Uh, transparency on

1:04:07this issue is important to residents and

1:04:08voters. So, I want to thank uh, my

1:04:10colleagues and the school board members,

1:04:12all of whom supported this disclosure.

1:04:15We work together once again to provide

1:04:16more than just a number and the

1:04:18following statement sets forth

1:04:20additional facts and context related to

1:04:22the negotiation process. So this is the

1:04:25joint statement of the city of PaloAlto

1:04:27and PaloAlto Unified School District

1:04:29regarding conditional sale agreement of

1:04:31a portion of the Cberly property.

1:04:35The city and the PaloAlto Unified School

1:04:37District believe it is in the best

1:04:39interest of our constituents that a

1:04:41portion of the property at the Cubly

1:04:43Community Center be sold to the city by

1:04:46the district so the property can be

1:04:48refurbished and used as a thriving

1:04:50community center for many years to come.

1:04:53Following years of community advocacy

1:04:55and negotiation, the city council and

1:04:58the school district have reached an

1:04:59agreement for the city to purchase a 7

1:05:02acre portion of the Cubberly Community

1:05:04Center currently owned by the district.

1:05:07Because the city owns eight building

1:05:09occupied acres of the site and the

1:05:12district owns the remaining seven

1:05:14building occupied acres, separate

1:05:16ownership has hindered long-term

1:05:18planning, investment in renovations, and

1:05:20improvements that are now overdue.

1:05:23Consolidating owner ownership under the

1:05:26city ensures permanent public use and

1:05:28advances the plan to modernize the

1:05:30campus for wellness, arts, culture, and

1:05:33outdoor programs. Alongside city

1:05:35funding, nonprofit partners, as was just

1:05:38mentioned, uh plan to contribute tens of

1:05:40millions of dollars to expand the

1:05:43variety and quality of programs offered

1:05:45at Coverly. The city will maintain its

1:05:48lease on the remaining 20 acres of

1:05:50playing fields and parking lots from the

1:05:52district, preserving the community's

1:05:54popular athletic activities.

1:05:57for the community. This property

1:05:59presents a rare opportunity due due to

1:06:01its size and adjacency to the city's

1:06:04current coverly property and valuing the

1:06:08coverly property is imprecise due to a

1:06:10lack of comparable sites. Further, it is

1:06:14zoned for public facility use and state

1:06:16law prioritizes public agency buyers.

1:06:20The district's as asking price of $90

1:06:23million reflected the site's potential

1:06:26value to interested third parties under

1:06:28a long-term lease, including possible

1:06:31use as a private school. The city based

1:06:34its offer on its 2024

1:06:37property appraisal of 43.6

1:06:40to $60.2 million.

1:06:44Following protracted negotiations, the

1:06:46city and district ultimately agreed on a

1:06:49purchase price of $60.65

1:06:52million in 2024,

1:06:55which is equivalent to the $65.5

1:06:59million 2027 purchase price.

1:07:04So, with that, I will uh close our

1:07:08council member comments and return to

1:07:11the clerk to see if we have a vote

1:07:13total.

1:07:17>> Not on this one. No. No. The next one.

1:07:45All right. So, I will announce the votes

1:07:46of round two for the HRC partial term.

1:07:49Ellen, Bob received votes from Lowing,

1:07:52Rectal, and Vinker. Haley, Hannah

1:07:54received votes from Bert, Lou, Lithcot,

1:07:57Haynes, and Stone. So, Haley Hannah will

1:08:00be appointed as to the partial term for

1:08:02HRC.

1:08:05>> All right. Thank you.

1:08:06>> And oh, we also the the only other uh

1:08:08second round of voting that was required

1:08:10was for the fourth and final vacancy on

1:08:12the parks and recreation commission.

1:08:15Aubrey Wickcom received votes from Bert

1:08:17and Lipkott HS. Ben Lenol received votes

1:08:19from Rectal and Vinker. Leo Hodber did

1:08:22not receive votes and Virginia Ruiz

1:08:25Albvesete received votes from Lowi Lou

1:08:28and Stone. So Virginia Ruiz Alvesete

1:08:31will be appointed to the parks and rec

1:08:32commission. Thank you.

1:08:34>> All right. Well, thank you and I want to

1:08:36thank all of the applicants for making

1:08:38our job really hard.

1:08:41>> It was an extraordinary number and

1:08:43extraordinary quality. Uh one of my

1:08:46colleagues commented to me after we were

1:08:48done doing interviews last week, can we

1:08:50just double the size of some of these

1:08:51commissions uh because we just do have

1:08:54such talent. So uh thank you very much

1:08:56to all of the applicants for your

1:08:58willingness to serve. Uh we always

1:09:00encourage you to reapply if you were not

1:09:02appointed this time and several of the

1:09:04people who uh become appointed are

1:09:07second or third time applicants as we

1:09:09just have such a wonderful wealth of

1:09:11talent in this community. So thank you

1:09:15Okay, so with that we will move on to

1:09:17our study session. Item three, best

1:09:20practices in managing consultant

1:09:22services. And I will turn to the city

1:09:24manager.

1:09:25>> Thank you very much, mayor. Members of

1:09:26the council, if I could ask the city

1:09:29clerk to queue up our uh slide, we've

1:09:31got a brief uh slide presentation to

1:09:34walk through. I would also welcome our

1:09:37um management fellow, Katherine

1:09:39Foronberry, who will be joining me in

1:09:42this presentation. For those unaware,

1:09:44management fellow is a program that many

1:09:47uh cities take advantage of where we

1:09:49take recent uh graduates of masters of

1:09:52public administration uh programs uh and

1:09:55give them a taste of what it's like in

1:09:58local government. They uh Katherine has

1:10:00done rotations in several offices

1:10:02including city manager's office. She's

1:10:04currently in a rotation in the human

1:10:06resources uh department and uh is

1:10:10finishing that up and will be uh moving

1:10:13on to next steps in her career uh once

1:10:16that is completed. Uh so that said uh

1:10:19Katherine assisted uh our team in uh

1:10:22really project managing uh this effort

1:10:24over the past year in order to uh bring

1:10:28uh the the product that we've got in

1:10:30front of you this evening. So, with

1:10:32that, uh, city clerk, uh, next slide,

1:10:34please.

1:10:39All right, just a quick, uh, overview of

1:10:40what we'll cover this evening. Discuss,

1:10:43uh, the ongoing work that again our

1:10:45staff team has done to ensure quality

1:10:47and valuable services, uh, and, uh,

1:10:50discuss uh, both current status and next

1:10:53steps. Next slide, please.

1:10:59As noted, uh this effort really started

1:11:01early last year where the city council

1:11:04uh noted uh interest in focusing uh on

1:11:08our management of consulting services

1:11:11and ensuring that we were uh doing what

1:11:14our best basically to uh ensure that we

1:11:18were getting quality services. Our work

1:11:21has uh provided uh again noted a staff

1:11:25team to identify the strengths and

1:11:27challenges in our current processes. Uh

1:11:29it's focused on improving our oversight

1:11:32of uh the uh consultants that we bring

1:11:34on board and really uh I think fair to

1:11:37say that uh has positioned the city to

1:11:40lead in this area. Uh the media has

1:11:43noted that we have a complicated quote

1:11:45unquote relationship with consultants. I

1:11:47think it's certainly accurate to say

1:11:49that this has been a topic that's been

1:11:51something of a lightning rod uh when

1:11:53things are are do not go well or where

1:11:56uh we are unhappy with uh products. Uh

1:12:00that said, we are also very reliant on

1:12:03consulting services to bring on

1:12:04specialized expertise in area that staff

1:12:07uh do not uh possess or do not u

1:12:09maintain sufficient uh ongoing

1:12:12experience with and as such uh has

1:12:15enabled the city to tack tackle many of

1:12:18the progressive issues that are

1:12:20priorities for the city council. So as

1:12:22noted again on this last note uh they

1:12:24really believe that this is an effort

1:12:26that the city can be proud of and uh

1:12:29would provide a model for other agencies

1:12:32uh to pick up on uh as we were unable to

1:12:35find any other agency that has taken

1:12:37such a comprehensive approach in

1:12:38tackling this topic. Next slide please.

1:12:43>> All right with that miss for Bear.

1:12:46>> Thank you city manager Shika. Good

1:12:48evening, Mayor Vinker, Vice Mayor Stone,

1:12:50council members. Happy to speak with you

1:12:52this evening on the progress to date on

1:12:54this this initiative. In order to

1:12:57understand the landscape and what

1:12:58existed as current practice in the city,

1:13:00we first conducted conducted an initial

1:13:02assessment asking project managers in

1:13:04each city department to outline their

1:13:06current consultant engagement practices.

1:13:09We asked them to share any efficiencies

1:13:11that they have in their workflows, area

1:13:13areas they may need support and areas

1:13:16that are potentially open for an

1:13:19opportunity to review. This assessment

1:13:21has allowed us to progress through the

1:13:22project with the real list of PaloAlto

1:13:25examples of those existing practices and

1:13:28to give us a tangible starting point

1:13:30from which to build.

1:13:33Our second step involved integrating a

1:13:35greater review of consultant

1:13:36expenditures into the FY26 budget

1:13:39development process. We partnered with

1:13:41the office of management and budget and

1:13:43work to develop and systematize

1:13:46uh consideration of the city's need for

1:13:48consultants costs and overall placement

1:13:51in annual resource planning. This

1:13:54process will continue in future budget

1:13:56cycles. The next step was to take

1:13:59everything we learned from that initial

1:14:01assessment and formulate best practices

1:14:03and practical resources that could be

1:14:05developed to support our staff. This

1:14:07involved research of other agencies and

1:14:09organizations and this stage included

1:14:12included a thorough review from our city

1:14:14auditor who was able to highlight some

1:14:17of those opportunity areas for us and

1:14:20that can be found in attachment B for

1:14:22this item that report from city auditor.

1:14:25The next step was to assemble an inter

1:14:28interdep departmental team of subject

1:14:30matter experts to lean on their

1:14:32expertise and experience and help ensure

1:14:35that the resources we develop are useful

1:14:38across the breadth of types of

1:14:40consultant engagements the city manages.

1:14:43This team has met regularly since 2025

1:14:46to collaborate on defining those best

1:14:48practices and developing staff tools.

1:14:52These efforts are outlined in the best

1:14:54practices guide which can be seen as

1:14:57attachment a to this item.

1:15:00The aim is that of the guide will

1:15:02provide staff with a common reference

1:15:04for approaching the full life cycle of

1:15:06consultant engagement and I'll hand it

1:15:09back to city manager Shakata to discuss

1:15:12these stakeholders.

1:15:17>> Thank you. Actually, before we get to

1:15:18that, I'll just do a quick overview of

1:15:20what Katherine described as a life cycle

1:15:22and and has been referred to in the best

1:15:25practices guide. We've developed life

1:15:27cycle of consultant engagement really uh

1:15:30starting before consultants are brought

1:15:32on board. Uh so just to quickly

1:15:33highlight a few of the the key topic

1:15:35areas covered in the best practices

1:15:37guide. Uh it begins really as precursors

1:15:41uh to outsourcing which includes uh the

1:15:44budgeting process as well as priority

1:15:46setting that then goes into the

1:15:48outsourcing process itself which the

1:15:50council sees as a part of uh contracts

1:15:53that come uh to the council for approval

1:15:56that you ultimately see the the uh

1:15:58conclusion of that. But before uh the

1:16:02item is brought forward uh for uh

1:16:04council approval, there's a development

1:16:07determination of scope of services, a

1:16:09scope established for community

1:16:11engagement. Then there's a selection

1:16:13among uh providers uh that might be

1:16:16available and have the expertise

1:16:18necessary. Uh then once uh in terms of

1:16:22the uh process uh once a provider is

1:16:26selected uh the guide goes into

1:16:28discussing how contingencies are managed

1:16:31as things uh may come up. There may be

1:16:33situations such as inadequate responses

1:16:36uh from qualified proposers or issues of

1:16:40where budgets do not align with the

1:16:43costs expected from uh the consultants

1:16:46that are interested in proposing. So

1:16:48there are a number of contingencies

1:16:49identified there. Contract management is

1:16:52an area largely administrative but

1:16:54ensuring that payments and uh the

1:16:56administrative duties are handled uh

1:16:59appropriately. uh establishing points of

1:17:02contact, community expectation,

1:17:03communication expectations in handling

1:17:05professional differences is one of the

1:17:08we call it the soft areas in some area

1:17:10some ways but nonetheless uh important

1:17:12in order to ensure that our staff are

1:17:15able to escalate issues as they arise

1:17:18during the course of uh projects as well

1:17:21as having established uh clear

1:17:24communication expectations on both uh

1:17:27sides of the relationship and also So

1:17:30again, handling professional differences

1:17:32where in some cases we are bringing in

1:17:34very qualified uh and and with specific

1:17:37expertise areas and how to manage that

1:17:40in ensuring that their findings are

1:17:43aligned with uh the interests and and

1:17:46concerns raised uh in the project uh

1:17:49description. And finally uh performance

1:17:52management and quality control how those

1:17:54issues are managed through staff review

1:17:57of administrative drafts uh before

1:17:59products are issued publicly. Uh then

1:18:03discussion of risk management of uh

1:18:05issues that could arise and how to

1:18:07mitigate risks and then finally uh the

1:18:10importance of closing out a project

1:18:12ensuring adequate or appropriate

1:18:14documentation is provided and along with

1:18:16evaluations.

1:18:18Next slide please.

1:18:23Then uh as Miss Foronberry pointed out

1:18:25uh one area that is highlighted in the

1:18:28staff report was noting the uh uh touch

1:18:31points that different stakeholders can

1:18:33have uh during this uh life cycle as is

1:18:37described uh on how consultants are

1:18:40brought on board. uh where projects

1:18:42decide this uh project decisions are

1:18:44made on what uh might involve

1:18:47consultants and then how the selection

1:18:50and the work proceeds. And as noted

1:18:53here, uh you will frequently see the uh

1:18:57lead department and lead department

1:18:59management uh responsible for uh some

1:19:02areas, but my office, city manager's

1:19:04office, uh very uh heavily involved

1:19:07throughout uh there may be points at

1:19:10which as noted early on in the annual

1:19:12budget and priority setting where the

1:19:14city council uh has the opportunity to

1:19:16weigh in and provide direction on which

1:19:19projects are undertaken and the relative

1:19:23priority of those as well as in the

1:19:25budget itself where there is a little

1:19:28more detailed but perhaps a different

1:19:31type of review is done including how uh

1:19:35decisions would be made on what would be

1:19:37in insourced staffing uh resources as

1:19:41opposed to those provided by consultants

1:19:44under financial tracking. The lead

1:19:45departments are primarily responsible

1:19:47but administrative services also

1:19:50provides an important role in ensuring

1:19:52costs are tracked and uh accounts

1:19:54payable and the like are handled

1:19:56appropriately. The outsourcing process

1:19:59involves the lead department's

1:20:01administrative services that runs our

1:20:03procurement office. Human resources may

1:20:05be involved again where there are

1:20:07decisions made between uh in-house staff

1:20:10and outsourcing as well as city council

1:20:13where city council approval would be

1:20:15involved. Performance management,

1:20:17quality control and timeliness. Uh those

1:20:20are certainly uh primarily the

1:20:22responsibility of the city uh city's

1:20:24lead department uh but also city

1:20:27manager's office will be involved as

1:20:29issues may arise. this topic of managing

1:20:32high visibility and controversial

1:20:34projects. We spent a bit of time

1:20:37discussing how not every project is the

1:20:39same and some in particular those that

1:20:42have a high level of visibility,

1:20:44community concern and quite frankly are

1:20:47controversial within the community may

1:20:49require a higher level of uh both

1:20:52diligence uh scrutiny, time involved and

1:20:55uh uh rigor to the process of everything

1:20:59uh from how the consultants are selected

1:21:01to how comments are responded to and the

1:21:03like. stakeholder engagement. Uh we've

1:21:06established a new framework that is used

1:21:09for uh scoping and really setting out

1:21:12plans for how community engagement will

1:21:15proceed, including how uh commissions

1:21:18and city council uh approval will

1:21:21ultimately be sought um and and how that

1:21:25uh workflow proceeds. And then finally

1:21:26again close out and evaluation. The lead

1:21:29department has primary responsibility of

1:21:31its city attorney's office.

1:21:32Administrative services are also

1:21:34involved as it relates to contracting.

1:21:36Next slide, please.

1:21:39Then finally, just to highlight a few

1:21:41recent examples uh where some of these

1:21:43practices have been put into place or

1:21:45that are being put into place where uh

1:21:48the work is ongoing. Obviously the

1:21:50everything you see listed here are is an

1:21:53important and high visibility uh project

1:21:56uh from a community awareness

1:21:57perspective and as such uh again we can

1:22:01talk in more detail on how those uh uh

1:22:04practices have been put into place with

1:22:06each one of these projects. Next slide

1:22:08please.

1:22:10Then finally uh to looking forward based

1:22:13on your discussion tonight we want to

1:22:15confirm uh that we've addressed the

1:22:17issues that have been raised based on

1:22:18your prior study session and uh other

1:22:21committee uh input. Uh we are working on

1:22:25training modules that will be uh

1:22:27provided to our broad staff given the

1:22:30number of staff that are involved with

1:22:32managing consultant engagement. Uh we

1:22:35will proceed uh as noted here in annual

1:22:38budget priority setting ensuring that

1:22:40we're highlighting uh consultant

1:22:42decisions as they come forward as well

1:22:45as uh continuing to solicit consultant

1:22:47feedback on these this practice guide

1:22:49now that we've uh got it put together in

1:22:51a in a form that can be shared publicly

1:22:54and will really set expectations I think

1:22:57uh across uh all of our partners and

1:22:59then uh expect this to be an ongoing

1:23:01process as noted this was not a one and

1:23:04done uh issued by any means. Next slide.

1:23:08And then finally uh just to reflect on

1:23:09some principles that were uh stated at

1:23:12the uh at the beginning of the uh best

1:23:14practices guide to note that contracting

1:23:16is a partnership. It does uh reflect the

1:23:19subject uh the service providers

1:23:21providing particular expertise and other

1:23:24uh qualifications staff needing to bring

1:23:27the local knowledge including a variety

1:23:29of forms. uh and then finally that these

1:23:33uh perspectives uh do need to work in

1:23:35concert and in uh teamwork in order to

1:23:39produce uh the valued uh products that

1:23:41we would expect and I believe that

1:23:44completes our uh presentation. So mayor

1:23:46back to you and look forward to your uh

1:23:48comments, questions and any public

1:23:50input.

1:23:52>> All right. Well, thank you very much for

1:23:54that uh presentation and analysis. Um

1:23:57why don't we do a round of uh questions

1:23:59or comments and then we'll go to public

1:24:01comment then we'll bring it back. Um so

1:24:05colleagues if you have anything

1:24:06preliminary

1:24:11Vice Mayor Stone.

1:24:14>> Thank you Madam Mayor. This is just a

1:24:17general round

1:24:18>> anything because this is not an action

1:24:20item. So just

1:24:21>> sounds good. Thank you. Uh, well, I

1:24:24appreciate staff bringing this forward.

1:24:26I've been eager for us to to kind of

1:24:29review how we manage consultants for

1:24:31quite some time. And I think this is a

1:24:33really really good start. And I in

1:24:35particular, I appreciate the focus on

1:24:38kind of scoping community engagement and

1:24:41building that into the into the process

1:24:43and recognizing that there are going to

1:24:46be times when we may not need contract.

1:24:49We not we might not need to to go

1:24:51outside the organization or outside the

1:24:53city and find a a contractor because we

1:24:56have the expertise

1:24:58in house, not necessarily with staff,

1:25:00but with our own community members. And

1:25:04step one of the guide is, I guess, just

1:25:07the need to assess the need for

1:25:10consultant services. So, is it built

1:25:13into into that? I couldn't really find

1:25:15anything quite explicit. the need for

1:25:18staff to really consider whether there

1:25:20is sufficient local resident knowledge

1:25:23that we can tap rather than going into

1:25:25consultant services. And I know that's a

1:25:27challenging thing, but I think there are

1:25:29there are certain um maybe more niche

1:25:32areas within the city that we do have

1:25:33some just true um kind of talent on the

1:25:37bench with with residents and not sure

1:25:40how that is built in and how does staff

1:25:43identify those and reach out to those

1:25:46community members. Can you talk more

1:25:47about that?

1:25:48>> Sure. Sure. It it uh to to your point,

1:25:50it's not explicitly called out as an

1:25:52alternative to outsourcing. You know, I

1:25:55think that uh that's definitely an issue

1:25:58we'd want to res review on a case-bycase

1:26:01situation to see where it might be

1:26:03applicable. You know, I I absolutely

1:26:05agree. we as the term embarrassment of

1:26:08riches uh can apply and maybe may not

1:26:11have the best connotation but it

1:26:12certainly applies when we talk about the

1:26:14expertise that exists within the Palo

1:26:16Alto community. Uh that said, finding

1:26:20situations where and where that

1:26:22expertise can best be deployed in uh

1:26:25addressing an immediate question or

1:26:28project need uh will vary by timing you

1:26:32know of the availability of the people

1:26:33and uh also what uh effort level of

1:26:37effort would be required. So what's

1:26:39called for in the guide is that uh where

1:26:43situations like that come up, my office

1:26:45would be primarily responsible for

1:26:47fleshing it out uh as stated with staff,

1:26:50but certainly uh there could be a

1:26:52discussion when uh specific projects are

1:26:55coming forward either again at their

1:26:57annual priority setting or budget or uh

1:27:01when individual projects are coming

1:27:03forward as as a proposed RFP. So we

1:27:06could we could deal with it in that

1:27:08context.

1:27:10>> Okay. Just wanted to make sure that that

1:27:12doesn't get kind of lost in the in the

1:27:14steps that we're going to take because I

1:27:16do think that's important and great way

1:27:18to not only I think oftent times use

1:27:22residents who have deeper knowledge than

1:27:23the consultants we we hire, but also to

1:27:26be able to to save the city money as as

1:27:28well. And then continuing on that on

1:27:30that theme of scoping community

1:27:32engagement, how is staff developing that

1:27:36to ensure that community engagement

1:27:38isn't simply a box that consultant or

1:27:42staff are merely checking off, but

1:27:45really rather true engagement and and

1:27:48feedback that is being incorporated into

1:27:49the final product that that the

1:27:51consultant is being asked produced. cuz

1:27:53I think it this is one of those where it

1:27:55could be it can become very easy and

1:27:57tempting for staff to be able to say

1:28:00we did it but how do we ensure that

1:28:02that's truly being incorporated into the

1:28:04process.

1:28:06>> There are a couple of uh tools that uh

1:28:09we've uh developed here and again it I

1:28:12think it'd be fair to acknowledge not

1:28:14every project will require the most um

1:28:17exhaustive approach to that. So let me

1:28:20describe the most exhaustive approach to

1:28:21that which is uh that I mentioned we've

1:28:25actually created uh something of a

1:28:26template for scoping uh uh we don't call

1:28:30it community engagement stakeholder

1:28:31engagement in order to be a little

1:28:33broader and uh a worksheet that's uh put

1:28:37together uh by the project managers uh

1:28:40with uh consultation with my office. uh

1:28:43you know that may be something for the

1:28:46more uh involved projects for us to

1:28:48share with the council so you could

1:28:49confirm whether the approach to the

1:28:51community engagement is uh consistent

1:28:54with your expectations. Uh so that's at

1:28:57the outset. Then as you proceed through

1:29:00you know there are some uh tools that we

1:29:03have not always applied but on the more

1:29:05involved projects we have such as uh

1:29:08actually being very rigorous on comments

1:29:10and how comments are responded to not

1:29:12unlike an environmental impact report.

1:29:14So you can track here are here are the

1:29:16comments made and here are how that was

1:29:18reflected in the product that results.

1:29:21Uh again that that does take more time

1:29:23and effort and you could translate that

1:29:25into cost associated with a project but

1:29:27sometimes that is necessary in order to

1:29:29demonstrate the clear tracking uh of uh

1:29:33the the input that's received as well as

1:29:36uh in in some instances the methods that

1:29:40are used to collect that feedback and

1:29:42and the like. So those are all uh

1:29:44reflected in the uh in that worksheet I

1:29:46described.

1:29:47>> Okay. Appreciate it. And I appreciate

1:29:49the the the clear tracking and I'm

1:29:51curious to see as we move forward how

1:29:54we're ensuring that it's being that it's

1:29:56really truly being implemented and that

1:29:59consultants aren't just seeing it as a

1:30:01checked box but really as a valuable um

1:30:04step in this process. I think you'll

1:30:06hold off on comments till the next

1:30:07round.

1:30:08>> Council member Rectal.

1:30:10>> Yeah, thank you. Uh I had really mixed

1:30:12feelings when I read this because

1:30:14there's a lot of really good stuff

1:30:15there. It's really comprehensive. talks

1:30:17about a lot of aspects of consulting uh

1:30:20but it kind of gets into the weeds and

1:30:23you know big picture what our what

1:30:24council and community's concerns were

1:30:26were much more narrow and this while

1:30:29it's really good information I don't

1:30:31think it directly addresses the concerns

1:30:33the concerns are are we getting value

1:30:36are the consultants having do they have

1:30:38local knowledge and uh are our use of

1:30:42consultants inhibiting our bench

1:30:44development inhouse expertise. If we

1:30:47keep on using consultants, now we come

1:30:48wedded to consultants. And there are

1:30:52parts in the document that talk about

1:30:53that, but they there's kind of at a high

1:30:55level and really diving into that would

1:30:58make it a much more valuable document

1:31:00because those are really the sticky

1:31:01issues. And it's not trivial. It's not

1:31:04like, oh, you need to do this. How how

1:31:06you decide these hard questions is hard.

1:31:10And I think we really want to dive in

1:31:11and understand can we make a better

1:31:14document that guides us to avoid those

1:31:16pitfalls.

1:31:18Uh a second issue is that you know when

1:31:21we're consulting when we're constructing

1:31:23the budget each year we look at each

1:31:26department's headcount and we use

1:31:28headcount as a proxy of you know what's

1:31:30the trend. Are we adding to this

1:31:32department or subtracting this

1:31:33department? And one bad thing about

1:31:36consultants is it really muddies the

1:31:38water. it makes it harder to look at

1:31:39these trends from year to year because

1:31:42consultants aren't reflecting that

1:31:43headcount. And so now when we're

1:31:46creating budgets, we don't know where

1:31:48are we spending the extra money or where

1:31:50are we saving money. And so I think we

1:31:52really do also a separate issue is we

1:31:54have to look at how we form budgets and

1:31:57how we uh count account account for the

1:32:01fact that we have consultants or other

1:32:03outsourcing in these departments when we

1:32:06are describing their workforce in

1:32:09headcount and we just now have just

1:32:11full-time employees. We don't have we

1:32:13don't include outsourcing. So I think

1:32:15that would help us also when we are

1:32:17setting the budgets to have a a better

1:32:19insight. Okay. Thank you,

1:32:24>> Council Member Lou.

1:32:26>> Thank you. And I uh plus one the

1:32:29comments from Council Member Rectal.

1:32:31Firstly, thank you and thank you, Miss

1:32:33Forenberry. Uh uh I don't know if this

1:32:37is your first presentation to the full

1:32:38council, but I recall uh your

1:32:40presentations before and I appreciate

1:32:42the work here. Um, I like Council Member

1:32:46Rectal appreciate the attention to the

1:32:48process and attention to detail, but

1:32:51that said, I'm more curious about

1:32:53outcomes and how this would uh change

1:32:57outcomes in the past that we didn't like

1:32:59or has changed outcomes uh over the

1:33:02previous months while this was in

1:33:05development. So, the staff report

1:33:08contemplates this a little bit. There

1:33:09was a slide that contemplated this a

1:33:11little bit, but I don't think was in the

1:33:12presentation. Can you talk about some

1:33:15examples that in the past that maybe

1:33:19could have gone differently and how this

1:33:20could have affected that? Or can you

1:33:22talk about cases more recently that have

1:33:25gone the better because of these um of

1:33:28these practices?

1:33:32Let's bring uh slide seven up if we

1:33:34could.

1:33:38I didn't speak to the specifics here,

1:33:40but uh perhaps might be helpful to do

1:33:43so. And and let me lead off by saying I

1:33:47don't know if there's such a thing as a

1:33:49perfect project where at the end of it

1:33:53there's unanimous agreement that it

1:33:55couldn't have gone better or that

1:33:58whether it's the consultant staff or any

1:34:00other stakeholder uh performed uh

1:34:05exceptionally. Uh but that said, in the

1:34:08case of the synthetic turf study, that

1:34:10was an example of where uh the level of

1:34:14rigor I I described in response to

1:34:16council member or vice mayor Greer's uh

1:34:18Stones um question applied where there

1:34:23were hundreds

1:34:24almost more than hundreds of comments u

1:34:27made on that study. And so in order to

1:34:30uh demonstrate how the feedback was

1:34:34incorporated into the conclusions and uh

1:34:38the outcome of the synthetic st turf

1:34:40study uh there was a very rigorous

1:34:42comment response to comments uh

1:34:44tabulation and uh overall uh I'd like to

1:34:49say that the consultant team and staff

1:34:51team uh did uh perform admiraably in a

1:34:55extremely tense high

1:34:59visibility uh and uh largely

1:35:02controversial uh topic area. So that's

1:35:04one example. In the case of the

1:35:06pedestrian uh cycling uh connectivity,

1:35:09that's also an area where uh my office

1:35:12and working with the office of

1:35:13transportation uh have really stepped up

1:35:16and laid out a stakeholder engagement uh

1:35:20uh plan in advance that uh has we've

1:35:25since been uh executing on. And perhaps

1:35:28as the conclusion of that study comes

1:35:32back uh to the city council, we can

1:35:34reflect on how that plan uh of outreach

1:35:38occurred and can get council feedback on

1:35:41whether you feel that that worked well

1:35:43or we might do something different in

1:35:46the future. What what I pause on in

1:35:49saying that is as you know every one of

1:35:51these projects is has unique qualities

1:35:54to them and as such some of the the

1:35:57tools we are applying we certainly want

1:35:59to apply where they fit but we also

1:36:01recognize that sometimes it's not a

1:36:04perfect fit. rail railroad quiet zones.

1:36:06Uh that's also a work in progress and

1:36:09having reviewed the scopes of service

1:36:11and engagement. Uh this as a example of

1:36:16uh the local knowledge here once again

1:36:19staff will need to provide the local

1:36:21knowledge. The consultant's not expected

1:36:23to provide that and so we will need to

1:36:25provide both that very specific

1:36:28knowledge of the city's crossings,

1:36:30sensitivities, the issues of concern,

1:36:32the priorities uh to the extent possible

1:36:34while then uh uh really doing our best

1:36:37to prepare the consultant to do their

1:36:40work accordingly. And then finally uh on

1:36:44last one is simply uh acknowledging

1:36:45where we have actually increased the

1:36:47staffing in the transportation office

1:36:49with actually uh council member Lou your

1:36:52suggestion and that has reduced our

1:36:54reliance on consultant services. Okay. I

1:36:58I think these are useful examples. I

1:37:01think

1:37:03uh like you said there might be some

1:37:05debate or feelings at the margins of

1:37:07like how the consultants performed in

1:37:09certain areas here. Um,

1:37:13maybe I'll loop back to this, but I

1:37:14think it's still hard to get really

1:37:16crisp in my mind uh sort of what the

1:37:19before and after actually looks like or

1:37:21what the uh improvement in their

1:37:23performance uh of performance in these

1:37:26cases are. Uh, and I don't want to spend

1:37:28all my time like deep diving into this,

1:37:30but um uh there's a larger discussion

1:37:34there. Thank you,

1:37:36>> Council Member B.

1:37:38>> Thank you. Um, so I'd like to follow up

1:37:40on some u valuable comments my each of

1:37:43my colleagues have already made. Um,

1:37:45first on uh the vice mayor's questions

1:37:49about how do we tap into uh

1:37:51community-based expertise of domain

1:37:54experts within our community uh in a

1:37:57given circumstance. And really in each

1:38:00of these issues that we're talking

1:38:03about, I really appreciate that there's

1:38:06no black and white kind of uh rule that

1:38:09we'll be able to follow. So um it makes

1:38:13it difficult to um to do more than set

1:38:16up a set of of guiding principles. But

1:38:20uh for instance on that issue is with

1:38:23within this um

1:38:26uh

1:38:29what is it our our manual we'll call it.

1:38:32Uh um will there be like for different

1:38:36departments as they go into evaluating

1:38:39consulting essentially a checklist to

1:38:41make sure they're consciously going

1:38:43through and saying does this apply here?

1:38:46not that it must apply but really go

1:38:48through that deliberate thought process.

1:38:50Is that part of what's planned?

1:38:52>> Yes, to an extent although I will

1:38:54acknowledge that that um the question of

1:38:57seeking local experts has not been a

1:39:01part of that process to date.

1:39:02>> Okay. So, but the other elements it's

1:39:05conceptually that's and and recognizing

1:39:09that not all each each of these will

1:39:12fall into different uh circumstances. Um

1:39:18you had mentioned that it in identifying

1:39:21that expertise in the community that

1:39:23would maybe go through the city

1:39:24manager's office but really um it's as I

1:39:29think back at times over the last 20

1:39:31years or so that we have actually done

1:39:33that to a more deliberate degree. Uh the

1:39:37council in each of those times has had a

1:39:39role but not the exclusive one. And

1:39:43council members have knowledge of a lot

1:39:46of people in the community and are more

1:39:50knowledgeable in general about who's in

1:39:53our community with different expertise

1:39:56than staff is. Um not exclusively so but

1:40:00just in general. And the council doesn't

1:40:02exclusively have that knowledge. uh we

1:40:04have you know people who have been uh

1:40:07deeply involved in a given domain in our

1:40:11community for a long while and question

1:40:13would be how do we tap into them not

1:40:15only sometimes to be those domain

1:40:18experts but more importantly to know who

1:40:21they are uh and so there's no great

1:40:24formula and then of course we do

1:40:26supplement it by a general outreach when

1:40:28I think about when we uh oh 15 plus

1:40:32years ago we we looked at

1:40:34a new a redo on our website and lo and

1:40:37behold, not shockingly, we had a lot of

1:40:40uh real experts in that field residing

1:40:43in our community. Uh when we have our

1:40:45infrastructure blue ribbon task force,

1:40:47we had folks and things like that. So I

1:40:50think that is has been an underutilized

1:40:53asset and I want to support that. Um

1:40:56second uh on this issue of how do we

1:40:59know how much benefit we're getting from

1:41:04adopting this new approach and there's

1:41:07no way that you can just clearly

1:41:10quantify it. Um but there is reference

1:41:13that it was used in the FY26 budgeting

1:41:16cycle and presumably FY27.

1:41:20But we as a a finance committee who had

1:41:22really pushed for this approach over a

1:41:25couple year period, we've continued to

1:41:27ask for well, can you share with us

1:41:31where we're seeing savings and how? And

1:41:34I recognize that's not easy. Um because

1:41:38how do you prove a negative? Um but

1:41:41there are examples. I'm convinced that

1:41:43that staff could come and say, "All

1:41:45right, here are three good examples.

1:41:48Here's how our old approach would have

1:41:50done it. Here's the estimate of what it

1:41:52would have cost us. Here's how we did

1:41:54it. And uh between using in-house

1:41:57services and and starting to use AI for

1:42:01research where appropriate and other

1:42:03ways, we we saved a certain amount of

1:42:06money and it's not going to be precise.

1:42:10But that doesn't mean we shouldn't get

1:42:12any information along those lines.

1:42:15that's very important to us is how

1:42:18valuable this is in our budgeting and

1:42:22our efficient use of the public's uh

1:42:24purse. Um

1:42:27and then a part of what I uh you know as

1:42:31we look at how to do this well is a

1:42:35question of has there been a

1:42:36deconstruction process of past

1:42:40consulting projects? Um, I know you

1:42:44mentioned the the turf study, uh, but

1:42:47we've had a whole series going back, if

1:42:49you go back however many years you want

1:42:51to, 5 years or whatever, we've had, you

1:42:54know, you you look at the ones that were

1:42:55sore spots, um, the retail and economic

1:42:58development had its concerns.

1:43:01um some of the uh traffic calming in

1:43:04Crescent Park and now we have a new one

1:43:06in on Bryant and are those really ones

1:43:10first that threshold of should they be

1:43:13done primarily by consultants? Are those

1:43:16the scale of a project that really needs

1:43:18to have a multi-year expensive

1:43:21consulting contract to figure out how to

1:43:23do relatively modest uh traffic calming?

1:43:26I'm not dismissing the the complexity of

1:43:30it, but uh I think back going 30 years

1:43:33in my experience with our staff and

1:43:36there were really times where we

1:43:37wouldn't have defaulted to consultants

1:43:40for projects like that. Other areas

1:43:42where it's great. Um all right. Uh let's

1:43:46see. I'm over so well I'll hit it next

1:43:48time.

1:43:50Sounds allowing

1:44:00I'm just going to ask a couple things

1:44:01right now and then listen to public

1:44:03comment. Um, so who actually was the

1:44:07final author of this report? Is it

1:44:09somebody on staff or

1:44:11>> Yes. U it really was a committee uh that

1:44:16drafted the document. I'd say I was the

1:44:18editor, final editor-inchief, so to

1:44:20speak. So that that's that anticipates

1:44:23my second question. Were you just sort

1:44:26of debriefing the participants or

1:44:28listening in and taking notes or how did

1:44:30that work?

1:44:33>> You mean in terms of how the team

1:44:35operated? H

1:44:36>> how did you come to your conclusion? Was

1:44:38it sort of debriefing or it

1:44:40>> it's a combination as uh maybe it's

1:44:43worth going back a couple of slides to

1:44:45slide

1:44:48four that Miss Foronberry uh went over

1:44:52it. It started by reviewing the current

1:44:55practices and then identifying the gaps.

1:44:58And so the the gap identification was

1:45:02done through small subcommittees that

1:45:05looked more deeply into the issues and

1:45:07then brought it back and and kicked

1:45:10those around to to identify what would

1:45:13be useful from a citywide perspective to

1:45:15improve practices.

1:45:16>> Okay. And then you said this the the

1:45:18packet says you started this in early 25

1:45:21and now it's late 26. So why why was

1:45:23that the timeline?

1:45:26to be honest, it's this is fill-in work

1:45:28for folks, including myself. You know,

1:45:31we got to it as we could. Okay, that's

1:45:35that's a a fair answer. Um,

1:45:38it I mean, I'm I'm glad you have this

1:45:41report now, but I guess my other

1:45:42question is what was here before this?

1:45:45Just best practices internally that were

1:45:48verbal instead of written.

1:45:52I would probably describe it as more

1:45:54fragmented and that uh pieces existed,

1:45:58better practices in one office

1:46:00department than others. And so this

1:46:03raises the bar among all of them uh to

1:46:06uh have greater consistency and uh

1:46:09really seeing how the pieces fit

1:46:10together in ways that perhaps were not

1:46:12as clear.

1:46:13>> Okay. Um

1:46:16uh then to get to one of my sort of key

1:46:20concerns here is that what

1:46:24and maybe you decided this was out of

1:46:25the scope but one of the concerns that

1:46:28we've had as a city and particularly on

1:46:30planning where I served is uh when we

1:46:33get consultants that however you want to

1:46:35define that it needs to be defined are

1:46:37not working out it's not working uh we

1:46:40need to have a process in place to

1:46:43ultimately either get them on track or

1:46:44tell them goodbye and not pay for the

1:46:46rest of the contract.

1:46:47>> Okay.

1:46:47>> And there's nothing about that in here.

1:46:50>> Oh, actually

1:46:50>> in the terms well, you talk about

1:46:53evaluating them, but I don't see it that

1:46:54it could happen at any time.

1:46:58>> Well, I I won't try to find the the

1:47:01specific page, but it's definitely

1:47:02covered and it's definitely an issue of

1:47:05uh interest and again one that we're

1:47:07providing tools uh to departments to

1:47:09ensure that escalation occurs in a

1:47:11timely manner. So if a decision is made

1:47:13or it needs to be made that it's not

1:47:15working out, we can make that decision

1:47:17and move on quickly.

1:47:18>> All right. Maybe I just didn't see the

1:47:20word termination, so I got worried. But

1:47:22uh

1:47:23um All right, that's all for tonight.

1:47:28>> All right. And I will defer my comments

1:47:30till after public comment. So let's turn

1:47:32to public comment. Madame Clerk, how

1:47:34many uh speakers do we have?

1:47:41We have two requests to speak.

1:47:43>> Okay. Very well.

1:47:46>> Our first speaker is Henry E.

1:47:52council

1:47:57is beginning to get to the heart of the

1:47:59issue, especially council person Rectal

1:48:02who began to ask some key questions such

1:48:05as are residents interests being taken

1:48:08into account in setting the criteria

1:48:12because obviously they are not but

1:48:15that's a big question but I will I'll

1:48:18address one other thing before we get to

1:48:20that one is in talking about local

1:48:22source of expertise. It's not just

1:48:24individual source of activity. We happen

1:48:27to be located next to one of the world's

1:48:30leading universities with policy

1:48:33expertise. No mention was made of this

1:48:36as a possible source to draw upon

1:48:39because there's a bifocation between the

1:48:42university and PaloAlto uh which needs

1:48:44to be cured by annexation and there

1:48:48should be one university and one city.

1:48:51Now, that's a big big picture, but I'll

1:48:53go into a minor part of it. I brought

1:48:55out a graduate of MIT Sloan School as my

1:49:00campaign uh operations director. Uh at

1:49:04the meeting with uh the the uh directors

1:49:07of departments, she took over the

1:49:10meeting and started asking all kinds of

1:49:12questions. And after she spoke,

1:49:16the city manager ran over to me and

1:49:18asked, "Who is she? Who is she?" And I

1:49:20told her she is my operations director

1:49:24and obviously she had a higher level of

1:49:26training from MIT than he did. She was

1:49:29more professional. However, she was

1:49:32still totally wrongheaded in looking at

1:49:34narrow issues. Narrow narrow issues

1:49:37which is the problem here. We're not

1:49:39getting to the heart of the issues which

1:49:40is first of all that we're spending

1:49:42enormous amounts of money on consultants

1:49:45when there's no need to when we have the

1:49:47expertise available for free. if it was

1:49:49organized in a proper way. Now, this

1:49:51happened on one issue several years ago

1:49:53when a professor of mechanical

1:49:54engineering volunteered his class to do

1:49:57a study of undergrounding the railroad

1:49:59that was almost not wanted, but he went

1:50:01ahead and he did it anyway.

1:50:03But that has never happened again. Gun

1:50:05High School has a project in which

1:50:08students uh work with the city council,

1:50:10but it happens according to the standard

1:50:12process of narrowly drawn alternatives.

1:50:16Walmart or no Walmart, for example. Not

1:50:19what should the apartment mix of uh

1:50:22subsidized and unsubsidized business be,

1:50:25but that's typically what produces at

1:50:27every meeting here. It's narrow

1:50:28alternatives late at night. There's a

1:50:31vote, usually 7 to 0 or 6 to zero if

1:50:33someone's recused, in which one of these

1:50:36alternatives is accepted that goes

1:50:38against the wishes of the residents of

1:50:40Palo Alto who come here begging, begging

1:50:42you, don't tear down my house. Don't

1:50:45block my view. It's pitiful to watch

1:50:48people stand up and try to get the ear

1:50:51of the council. Upgrade my neighborhood

1:50:53so there will not be uh blockages of my

1:50:57views. Don't don't build across from the

1:51:01mold. All of these happen because the

1:51:03council is structured.

1:51:04>> Your time is up.

1:51:05>> Do the wrong thing.

1:51:07>> Do the right thing for the people of

1:51:09Colorado. Fire the city manager. Change

1:51:12the entire process.

1:51:13>> All right. Your time is up and I need

1:51:15for you to move on. So out of fairness

1:51:17to your the residents you talk about

1:51:18will you need to move on and yield to

1:51:20the next speaker please. Thank you.

1:51:22>> Our next speaker is Raymond G.

1:51:32>> Uh city council. Um, I want to say that

1:51:35this is one of the first times I've sat

1:51:37in city uh hall and heard you guys speak

1:51:39and I was proud to hear you guys speak

1:51:41and hold our city uh manager accountable

1:51:43for what's going on with our budget. Um,

1:51:46from everything I've heard as a a

1:51:48resident um from the questions you guys

1:51:51were asking, he didn't give you guys not

1:51:52one clear response. And that's troubling

1:51:55for somebody that's a manager and

1:51:57manages all our funds. He was speaking

1:52:00like an attorney that was cautious of

1:52:01what he said because he didn't want

1:52:02nothing to be that he was saying to be

1:52:04used against him and that was somebody

1:52:06that has something to lose and something

1:52:08that if he's not speaking to you

1:52:09straight forward and how can you trust

1:52:11anything that's going on

1:52:13the clear vice mayor stone said why

1:52:16don't we invest in our local talent and

1:52:18as opposed to you saying yes that's a

1:52:20great idea you gave an excuse by why

1:52:22it's not

1:52:23we are we live next to the greatest one

1:52:26of the greatest institutions of

1:52:27education in the country local talent is

1:52:30an abundance.

1:52:33We have students that go to Pali, the

1:52:34number one uh education system in

1:52:37California. And when I talk to the

1:52:39students when I'm campusing, I ask them,

1:52:41they ask why can't we come back and want

1:52:43to work here? Why can't we raise our

1:52:45students to come back home and work in

1:52:47the neighborhood they grew up at?

1:52:49Why is that something so difficult and

1:52:51so hard to conceptualize?

1:52:54Is basic humanity and treating people

1:52:55like people and not like a budget? How

1:52:57to move numbers around. We talk about

1:53:00contracts, consultants. We guys have one

1:53:03in Mike Janeo. I don't know if you guys

1:53:05seen the video. I shared the video with

1:53:07most of you guys. You guys are paying

1:53:09good money for an oversight that doesn't

1:53:10do no oversight. You guys have contracts

1:53:13in tasers.

1:53:15Tasers do more harm than they do good.

1:53:17If you watch the video, was the money

1:53:20best invested in tasers and our

1:53:22oversight or in having somebody respond

1:53:24to non- mercy situations where that

1:53:27person could have had a different

1:53:28outcome?

1:53:30This is not about me versus the police

1:53:31or me trying to defund the police. It's

1:53:33me trying to put humanity back in Palo

1:53:35Alto.

1:53:38It's never been about defunding the

1:53:39police. It's about having people see

1:53:40people for people no matter what their

1:53:42economic status is.

1:53:45Now, I don't have an Ivy League

1:53:46education, but our manager is not

1:53:49equipped to do his job

1:53:52because it's a manager should be able to

1:53:54answer you a quick concise answer when

1:53:56you ask something of importance that

1:53:58that is concerning to the residents of

1:53:59Palo Alto. What you heard was legal

1:54:02jargon. I've dealt with enough lawyers

1:54:05in my life to know it when I hear it.

1:54:09So

1:54:10I do hope you guys look into your

1:54:12contract with my genetic and no group.

1:54:15Defund remove tasers out our city.

1:54:19Give us compassion. Give us empathy and

1:54:21give us love. Stop giving people weapons

1:54:23to destruct and destroy.

1:54:26We all are smart. We all know the

1:54:28history of this country. We all want a

1:54:29better country for everybody. That means

1:54:32everybody despite what your economic

1:54:34status is.

1:54:34>> Time is up. And that concludes public

1:54:37comment for study session item three.

1:54:42>> All right. So I'll bring it back to the

1:54:44DAS for any further comments and

1:54:46questions on this study session item.

1:55:00>> Vice Mayor Stone.

1:55:03>> Thank you, Madam Mayor. Um just one last

1:55:05point that I wasn't able to get to on

1:55:07the in the first round. I think really

1:55:10important that within probably within

1:55:13performance management that it's made

1:55:16clear to to consultants. I don't know if

1:55:20that's within that initial meeting with

1:55:22the with the consultant that ultimately

1:55:25consultants are intended to do the work

1:55:27that they are being hired to do and not

1:55:30merely advocate for their own positions

1:55:33and and desires. And I I think there's

1:55:36obviously a balance of they're being

1:55:37hired to provide their expert opinion.

1:55:41But if that opinion is provided and

1:55:45council rejects that opinion uh and we

1:55:49are making an alternative request, I'd

1:55:52like to see it kind of made be made

1:55:54clear to them that then it is their job

1:55:58to be able to respond to whatever the

1:56:00new direction is is being is being

1:56:03given. um and to kind of get out of that

1:56:06advocate phase and move into more of um

1:56:10more into the role of then

1:56:13I guess getting it getting it done based

1:56:16on what that that new direction is. It's

1:56:17just it's it's something that I've

1:56:19noticed that has happened just

1:56:22frequently over my my time on the on the

1:56:25council and a frustration that I have

1:56:26frequently had with with consultants and

1:56:28I I understand human nature. They've

1:56:32created a product, they're presenting

1:56:33it, they want to defend it, but it

1:56:36becomes frustrating when it's kind of

1:56:38clear that that is not what the council

1:56:39desires and they kind of continue to to

1:56:42push back in that way. So, not sure

1:56:45where is that

1:56:48is that a kind of appropriate I mean I

1:56:51know it's appropriate but how would we

1:56:53kind of how would we engage the

1:56:55consultants in that kind of expectation

1:56:58setting and any thoughts?

1:57:00>> Yeah. No. Well, excellent point. Uh I

1:57:03believe it's fair to say it's really not

1:57:05addressed. So, let me take that back and

1:57:07and look at with the team how best to

1:57:11incorporate that into the instructions

1:57:13provided.

1:57:14>> Okay, that'd be that'd be helpful.

1:57:16That's all I have. Thank you,

1:57:19>> Council Member Lowing.

1:57:22>> Okay, thanks. Uh yeah, just to continue

1:57:24with just a short but a number of items.

1:57:27Um it somewhere I started to look for it

1:57:31in the overreaching goal which starts

1:57:33this but I didn't find it but somewhere

1:57:35um I I I think we want to put on the

1:57:38table the elephant in the room which is

1:57:40costs and it it doesn't say anything in

1:57:43here like you know make sure you're

1:57:44getting the right cost benefit or at at

1:57:47every phase you know try to minimize

1:57:49cost or things like that just so that

1:57:51it's that it's right there. Um,

1:57:55it doesn't have to say cut the costs of

1:57:57consultants, but it should get kind of

1:58:00close to that because um we we just want

1:58:03to be able to um make that obvious to

1:58:06the folks that are looking at the

1:58:07decision set to begin with. Do we need a

1:58:09consultant or not? Uh and and that

1:58:11correctly is the first thing that you

1:58:13have in the list. Do we need one or not?

1:58:15Um I also do want to salute you for

1:58:18bullet point four which we just talked

1:58:20about but um you emphasizing the Palo

1:58:23Alto's local context because we have

1:58:26some bad case studies where that didn't

1:58:28happen and it caused us a lot of delay

1:58:30while we're still paying them. So u

1:58:32appreciate that. Um

1:58:38on page let's see oh over on the table

1:58:40one where you talked about when council

1:58:42should be uh included I I would suggest

1:58:45that you just leave list council on

1:58:47managing high visibility and

1:58:49controversial projects. Um we're we're

1:58:52in it anyway so it's going to come up

1:58:54because we're we're going to hear from

1:58:56our our residents about that

1:59:00and also on outsourcing. So, let's see.

1:59:03This is page 17.

1:59:08Major projects may involve city review

1:59:11and scope of services. Um, we understand

1:59:14that this is operating decisions where

1:59:16you're picking contractors, but perhaps

1:59:18you could put something in there like

1:59:20over a certain amount would be the

1:59:22guidelines for maybe taking this to

1:59:25council so we know in advance as opposed

1:59:27to just having it show up on the on the

1:59:30consent calendar.

1:59:39So,

1:59:42I'm I'm I'm a little bit surprised that

1:59:44this is sort of at a fundamental sort of

1:59:47in introductory level. I think I was

1:59:49expecting something a little bit

1:59:50different, but uh if that's what you

1:59:52need, that's what you need. And I'm glad

1:59:53we now have that as a um a training

1:59:56ground for everybody that's that's

1:59:58dealing with this and and respecting

2:00:00that there were differences amongst uh

2:00:02departments previously. Um

2:00:05but also be interested in the in the

2:00:07next phase of as council member Bert

2:00:10said, you know, laying out some things

2:00:11about what what are what are the options

2:00:13here even with existing contracts if we

2:00:15decide that nh we could really roll that

2:00:18back and fit it in here a little bit

2:00:19here a little bit there. So that's why I

2:00:22was concerned before my comment about,

2:00:24you know, looking at it in the middle or

2:00:25twothirds of the way through and say

2:00:26times have changed. What what can we do

2:00:28about that? And of course, in the

2:00:30beginning, you want to you want to tie

2:00:32that into the contract.

2:00:34That's all. Thank you, Mayor.

2:00:38>> Council member B.

2:00:39>> Thank you. Um, so I did want to follow

2:00:42up on uh council council member Lowing

2:00:45and Rectal's

2:00:47um uh point that they were making on the

2:00:51need for really a a more a more clear

2:00:55overarching goal. Um, on page three of

2:00:59the staff report, we actually have a

2:01:00really good section, the purpose of the

2:01:02consulting management review, which goes

2:01:05into kind of those sub goals, I'd almost

2:01:08call them, but the overarching one, I

2:01:11think, is along the lines of assuring

2:01:13that we are uh using the most effective

2:01:19and cost-effective approaches in man

2:01:23consultant engagement. and then all the

2:01:26rest of that seems to fit underneath

2:01:28that. Um, and then I was also glad to

2:01:32see that uh on

2:01:35uh slide number eight, the last bullet

2:01:37is ongoing reinforcement and refinement

2:01:39of processes. So this recognition that

2:01:43this is going to be an iterative

2:01:44process. This is a major step to have

2:01:48this manual uh and presumably to now go

2:01:52back and incorporate some of the things

2:01:54that we've provided as input uh in that

2:01:58first version that comes out um uh

2:02:02shortly. Um but then in this recognition

2:02:05that yeah we we need to then uh look at

2:02:09how well it's working and how to improve

2:02:11it as opposed to assuming that we got it

2:02:13all right uh out of the gate. So, um I

2:02:17encourage those um uh the the continuing

2:02:23uh to work on optimizing it and um and I

2:02:27really do think it has the potential to

2:02:30uh provide for higher performance

2:02:34um lower costs

2:02:38and um and greater utilization of our

2:02:41own staff capabilities, present or

2:02:44future staff. And I think those would be

2:02:46really some uh some excellent outcomes

2:02:49that we could see. Uh we're I think

2:02:53starting to see now and we'll hopefully

2:02:55see in the next year or two as this

2:02:57becomes fully implemented. Thanks,

2:03:01>> Council Member Lou.

2:03:03>> Thank you. I agree with uh largely all

2:03:07of the comments that have been made so

2:03:09far. Uh

2:03:11uh I'll but my first point just that I

2:03:14in future iterations of this I'd be

2:03:16interested to see more about outcomes

2:03:18and uh

2:03:20ways the process could have or uh have

2:03:25changed outcomes understanding that of

2:03:27course counterfactuals are hard. um on

2:03:31some of the process. I appreciated the

2:03:34detail of uh in the staff report on uh

2:03:38different phases and how these phases

2:03:42have guard rails and checks. One thing

2:03:45I'd also be interested in seeing is

2:03:47getting a bit more specific about

2:03:50uh at these different checkpoints what

2:03:53outcomes can actually change. Um there's

2:03:57some reference into appendices for

2:03:58example that describe how we can send a

2:04:01letter to a consultant if they their

2:04:03performance is not meeting expectations.

2:04:05I think that is good and useful and uh

2:04:10would love to see the appendices when

2:04:11they're available.

2:04:14But I feel like there's something more

2:04:15there that uh you alluded to, but I also

2:04:18missed in the staff report. Like if

2:04:20consultants do poorly, can we not just

2:04:22send them a letter? Can we make it

2:04:24standard practice in certain kinds of

2:04:26consulting contracts to have a uh option

2:04:30to terminate? Um

2:04:33uh

2:04:35if consultants do poorly and they

2:04:37complete their assignment, do we have

2:04:39good mechanisms not just to grade their

2:04:40performance but

2:04:43uh weigh their a weigh their next RFP or

2:04:47their next bid in a way that sort of

2:04:49complies with the procurement laws. I

2:04:51think tying these practices into

2:04:53specific hooks that will just make every

2:04:56contract and consultant work better than

2:04:58the next is uh

2:05:01the next little bit of specificity I

2:05:04would like to see. Um I'll also just

2:05:07bump the use cases for AI. I think AI is

2:05:11very situational. A lot of this is not

2:05:13ready for prime time, but uh just from

2:05:15Cal Cities and other contexts, I think

2:05:17there are consultant driven workflows

2:05:20that are increasingly displaced with AI.

2:05:22Things like class and comp studies or

2:05:25other potentially

2:05:27uh slightly tedious contracted work. Uh

2:05:32uh various financial services, things

2:05:35like that, V studies. Uh there are

2:05:39AI native or software or uh consulting

2:05:43companies that potentially can offer

2:05:45lower prices and better service. Uh

2:05:48appreciate the work so far. Looking

2:05:49forward to seeing the next steps and

2:05:51thank you.

2:05:54>> All right. Well, I'll see if I can bring

2:05:55it home here. Um it's been a it was a

2:05:59great presentation in terms of setting

2:06:02us on the path to really thinking

2:06:04through you know how how we will manage

2:06:07uh this going forward. Really appreciate

2:06:09the the thought process going into that

2:06:11but also concur with a lot of my um

2:06:13colleagues comments about um how as we

2:06:17see it implemented we can keep tabs on

2:06:19it, grow it, correct not correct it,

2:06:22revise it, conform it more to our city.

2:06:25Um, it's an interesting conversation for

2:06:28me to listen to because, um, I've

2:06:31retained a lot of experts over the

2:06:32course of my legal career. Um, we've

2:06:35retained expert witnesses. I've helped

2:06:37them write reports. I've defended them

2:06:39in depositions. And I've taken

2:06:40depositions of a lot of expert

2:06:42witnesses. And um I think that one of

2:06:45the things I'd like to add because most

2:06:47of uh most most of what should be said

2:06:50has been said by now um is that and and

2:06:54it I was trying to find it amongst the

2:06:55bullet points here and it's it's a

2:06:58little squishy so it probably wasn't

2:06:59called out but I think we need to make

2:07:02clear to the uh consultants

2:07:06uh really help them understand their

2:07:08role in interacting with us because you

2:07:11guys do and in the sense that um you

2:07:15we're the people making the policy

2:07:16decisions. You bring analyses and

2:07:20options and data and information and

2:07:22reports and and feedback and all those

2:07:25good things. But what I have noticed

2:07:28from time to time with the experts uh

2:07:31that speak to us is that they tell us

2:07:35what we should be asking them. They tell

2:07:37us, you know, what we should want to

2:07:39know from them and I want to know what I

2:07:41want to know, not what they think I

2:07:43should want to know. And um I've seen

2:07:46that a a couple of times. Um I can't

2:07:50remember the precise issue, but I

2:07:52remember we had we had two sets of noise

2:07:55experts. One was for the quiet zones

2:07:57with the train and that what came up in

2:07:59in rail. This was two three years ago.

2:08:01Um, and it was, you know, talking about

2:08:03peak noise versus noise over a period of

2:08:05time. And then we had a noise expert

2:08:08for, I think it was setbacks for heat

2:08:09pump water heaters and how far they had

2:08:11to be back so there wasn't too much

2:08:12noise in in in the next door yard. And I

2:08:16remember struggling with each of them to

2:08:19get them to answer what I was actually

2:08:21asking from a technical standpoint

2:08:23because they thought I shouldn't need to

2:08:25know that. It's like, well, you can

2:08:27think that, but you still ought to try

2:08:29to answer it. because I felt myself

2:08:31going into deposition mode and then you

2:08:33know drilling down until I actually did

2:08:34get the ex the answer. So I think the

2:08:37goal here is to keep me out of

2:08:38deposition mode um by talking to them

2:08:41upfront about uh trying to help us uh

2:08:43understand whatever it is we're curious

2:08:45about. Um and uh similarly

2:08:50uh when we did the synthetic turf study

2:08:53that was quite an undertaking and we got

2:08:55a lot of great stuff but uh

2:08:59I remember I I had been pushing um

2:09:01analysis of a hybrid option and um it is

2:09:06quite costly. It's new. It's that's why

2:09:07I wanted an expert to tell me what was

2:09:09going on and where where it was headed.

2:09:11And I felt that they were quite

2:09:13dismissive of that option because it was

2:09:16expensive. And I remember saying, but

2:09:19that's my job is to say if it's too

2:09:21expensive and whatever, you shouldn't

2:09:23not do it. And they did do some of it

2:09:25and eventually we pushed and got more.

2:09:27But again, I think it's all of these

2:09:30boil down to them understanding their

2:09:32role and helping us make decisions. And

2:09:35I think that's just a a a piece that

2:09:37could be added to this. But uh overall

2:09:40uh I'm very pleased we've hit kind of a

2:09:43milestone here and uh that we have a

2:09:45framework for going forward.

2:09:48So with that um I will close out this

2:09:52item and uh with with uh thanks and

2:09:55appreciation.

2:09:58Okay.

2:10:02So, that brings us to our Nope, that

2:10:05brings us back to uh Madame Clerk, we

2:10:07have to to have a little uh postcript.

2:10:12>> Yes, I'm so sorry. I apologize. Um I

2:10:16incorrectly

2:10:18um stated that we could appoint some uh

2:10:20one of the candidates for the parks and

2:10:21recck commission. However, this

2:10:23candidate only received three votes and

2:10:25four votes are required. So, thank you

2:10:28to those of you who pointed it out.

2:10:29Again, I apologize. Um, so we do need a

2:10:32third round of voting to um resolve

2:10:37which candidate will be appointed to

2:10:38this seat. And so I will send out

2:10:41another electronic ballot. Thank you.

2:10:50>> Okay. Okay. Well, since it's a fairly

2:10:52simple one, uh

2:10:57why don't we go ahead and take public

2:10:58comment on the consent calendar. If

2:11:00madam clerk, if that's not asking you to

2:11:02parallel process too much.

2:11:27We have four requests to speak on the

2:11:29consent calendar items 4 through 9. And

2:11:32our first speaker is Charlie W.

2:11:43Good evening de Mayor, Vice Mayor,

2:11:45Council, Charlie Wans, Palo Alto Chamber

2:11:47of Commerce. I'm here tonight to voice

2:11:49the chamber's support or approval of the

2:11:51business retention expansion and

2:11:54attraction strategy as recommended by

2:11:56the economic development committee. The

2:11:58Bria strategy creates a proactive

2:12:00partnership between the city business

2:12:02community to strengthen our commercial

2:12:03districts and a path forward to a

2:12:05thriving local economy in three ways.

2:12:08First, business retention. It is far

2:12:10more effective to keep an an existing

2:12:13PaloAlto business here than to replace

2:12:15one. The Bria strategy prioritizes

2:12:17outreach to our merchants to understand

2:12:19their needs. It considers changes to

2:12:21zoning restrictions, permitting

2:12:23processes, and removing unnecessary

2:12:25hurdles to keep our storefronts occupied

2:12:27and our local jobs secure. Second,

2:12:30business expansion. This strategy

2:12:32encourages local entrepreneurs to grow

2:12:35right here in PaloAlto by providing

2:12:37resources, updating policies, and

2:12:39enhancing district vibrancy. The Bria

2:12:42strategy allows for our successful it

2:12:45allows our successful small businesses

2:12:47and tech innovators to scale up locally

2:12:49rather than moving to neighboring

2:12:51cities. And finally, business

2:12:53attraction. When prospective employers

2:12:55and retailers look for a home, they look

2:12:57for cities that actively support

2:12:59business. The Bria strategy signals that

2:13:02PaloAlto is open for business. By

2:13:04positioning our commercial corridors as

2:13:06destinations, we attract highquality

2:13:08retail, dining, and corporate partners

2:13:10that fill vacancies and generate crucial

2:13:12tax revenues. The chamber looks forward

2:13:15to collaborating with staff to turn this

2:13:16plan into action, and we support

2:13:18council's council to approve the Bria

2:13:21strategy tonight to secure PaloAlto's

2:13:23longtime economic vitality. Thank you.

2:13:27>> Our next speaker is Henry E.

2:13:35First to follow up directly on Charlie's

2:13:37point, I asked a question of Educata.

2:13:42Why are you driving German auto out of

2:13:45Palo Alto, a viable business that

2:13:48repaired and kept alive our Volkswagens

2:13:51and Volvos in a cost effective,

2:13:54efficient manner. The family would like

2:13:57to keep German auto after Howard Hilig's

2:14:01death by renting to a similar person, an

2:14:04ethical auto repair person that kept the

2:14:07dealers honest. The family has been

2:14:10refused

2:14:12ability to do that. They say the city

2:14:15has turned them down. A perfectly viable

2:14:18business is being driven out of Palo

2:14:21Alto. But I want to make the larger

2:14:22point here. The larger point is that the

2:14:26joint process of city council and and

2:14:30city manager operates in a way that

2:14:34gives us narrow options that lead to

2:14:38projects that are killing our city at

2:14:42each meeting. There is a project.

2:14:44>> Mr. Esquitz, I would like you see how

2:14:46the other item we'll pause your time.

2:14:48You'll get your time.

2:14:48>> I am Is this respective so we can hear

2:14:51it and understand it? This is to help us

2:14:53make votes on the consent calendar. So

2:14:55which item are you speaking to?

2:14:56>> I'm speaking I'm drawing an inference

2:14:59about the business development process

2:15:01which is part of a larger picture of how

2:15:04the city works. You keep it to the

2:15:07specific to the general. My mentor was

2:15:10professor Robert K. Merin the theory of

2:15:13the middle range in sociology. I'm now

2:15:16going to that middle range which is the

2:15:20which is the unholy alliance between the

2:15:23council and the uh city manager which

2:15:27goes into secret sessions and out of

2:15:30those sessions they come up with a vote

2:15:34that turns out to be 6 to 0 to 7 to zero

2:15:37which always does something at the

2:15:40request of a developer to build

2:15:42something that is killing our city. It

2:15:44could be housing on the bay lands. It

2:15:46could be it could be a garage

2:15:49that even Councilman Laauo says is not

2:15:51needed. So I am addressing the

2:15:55underlying issue and the answer is to

2:15:59remove from the council all those who

2:16:01did not take leadership in keeping out

2:16:04the builder's remedy. Okay, I really

2:16:09stay on the topic of calendar

2:16:14process here.

2:16:16>> Thank you. Okay, so Mr. Escus, I need

2:16:18for you to talk about the consent

2:16:20calendar items, please. We're happy to

2:16:22listen to those. No,

2:16:28>> no, I I I'm not hearing. You have not

2:16:30identified an item.

2:16:34>> Hold on.

2:16:37I'm an attorney and so I'm used to uh

2:16:39talking about relevance and I would like

2:16:41for you to identify relevance. So I'm

2:16:43going to turn your mic back on. You have

2:16:4447 seconds. I would suggest that you

2:16:46identify an item and so we can stay in

2:16:49order. And if you do not then I think we

2:16:51need to move on. So I'm going to

2:16:52officially giving you the warning now

2:16:55that you need to adhere to and not be

2:16:58disruptive. Okay. So that is your

2:17:00warning. I'm turning your mic back on.

2:17:02You have one chance to uh talk and tell

2:17:04us which item and tell us what

2:17:05>> which item would you like me to speak

2:17:06to.

2:17:09>> Okay. I will continue to speak as I said

2:17:12to the broken process of consultation.

2:17:14You're going to turn my mic off now,

2:17:16right? Because you do not want to hear

2:17:18what's wrong.

2:17:20>> Hear about that during general public.

2:17:23We're just going to let your time run.

2:17:24>> Which item would you like me to speak

2:17:26to, Madam Mayor?

2:17:28It's up to you that what when people

2:17:30come for consent and so next week when

2:17:31you come for consent I'd like it if you

2:17:33would help us with whatever items you

2:17:35care about and tell us about those

2:17:36>> I care about all those items and in

2:17:39total I care about the vote no on the

2:17:42coverly tax because it's not necessary

2:17:45we can do eliminate zero budget

2:17:48consultation zero

2:17:50>> your time is now up thank you very much

2:17:51>> start again

2:17:53and unbreak the process by having the

2:17:56council

2:17:57Our next speaker is Brian S.

2:18:02Mr. Eskins, I need for you to yield the

2:18:04podium to the next speaker, please. Out

2:18:05of fairness to your fellow residents.

2:18:08Now,

2:18:08>> fairness to me, you should.

2:18:10>> Okay. So, I am uh warning you that if

2:18:12you continue to be disruptive, we will

2:18:14we may have to remove you and I don't

2:18:16want to do that. So, please. Thank you.

2:18:18All right.

2:18:20You may not mind if I'd prefer not to,

2:18:22but I need for you to sit down now so

2:18:23that we can move on to Brian S. Please

2:18:27>> Google is a great thing

2:18:29to realize.

2:18:31>> Okay. Now, okay.

2:18:35>> Good evening. I'm Brian Smiley,

2:18:37president of the board of directors of

2:18:39the cardiac therapy foundation of the

2:18:41mid peninsula, which is better known as

2:18:43HeartFit for Life. Like so many PaloAlto

2:18:47residents and Cubberly nonprofits,

2:18:50Heartfit enthusiastically supports the

2:18:53Yes on J ballot initiative.

2:18:56We along with other PaloAlto nonprofits

2:19:00including Avanitus are tonight signaling

2:19:03this commitment by presenting the city

2:19:05council with a letter of intent

2:19:07concerning the renovation of Cberly.

2:19:10For over 55 years, Hartfit has provided

2:19:13medically supervised exercise,

2:19:15education, and support services to

2:19:18thousands of aging PaloAlto who suffered

2:19:21life-threatening

2:19:23cardiac events. Cberly is the beating

2:19:27heart of the HeartFit community.

2:19:30We look forward to the city council

2:19:32accepting our letter of intent as

2:19:34Hartford continues to work to empower

2:19:37hearts and transform the lives of Palo

2:19:41Alton's at the Coverly Community Center.

2:19:44Thank you so much.

2:19:46>> Our next speaker is Christina L.

2:20:03Yes. Right there. Uh, in anticip my name

2:20:07is Christina Lugo, CEO with Avanitus.

2:20:10Um, in anticipation of the council's

2:20:12consideration of the consent item

2:20:14regarding our letter of intent, Avanitus

2:20:16is very excited about the opportunity.

2:20:19uh it reflects our strong interest uh

2:20:22not just to strengthen our public

2:20:23private partnership with the city um but

2:20:26also with Hartfit. We feel um

2:20:31uh sorry lost my train of thought. Uh

2:20:33recognizing u many participants that we

2:20:36both serve in this community and uh with

2:20:39the growing housing population in South

2:20:41Palto, we are uh very interested in uh

2:20:45creating a more unified uh experience

2:20:48for older adults in our community,

2:20:50expanding access, coordination, and

2:20:52impact for those we serve. And

2:20:55ultimately our shared goal is simple uh

2:20:57to ensure that every older adult in Palo

2:20:59Alto has access to highquality programs,

2:21:03meaningful connections and support uh

2:21:05they need to age. So we're very excited

2:21:07about the opportunity uh to bring uh

2:21:11together trusted community partners.

2:21:12Thank you so much.

2:21:15>> And that concludes public comment on

2:21:16consent calendar items 4 through 9.

2:21:19>> All right. Thank you very much. Um, so

2:21:22colleagues, do you have any questions,

2:21:25no votes, requests to pull or recusals?

2:21:30>> Oh, I have to I keep looking at the

2:21:32lights to my left because I've been

2:21:33doing that for a year and now I have to

2:21:35look on my right. Um,

2:21:39Gur is out of business. Sorry, Vice

2:21:41Mayor Stone is out of business now. Um,

2:21:43I actually have a question

2:21:47and I don't know that Mr. Andrade is

2:21:49here, but I just wanted to um Oh, and

2:21:53oh, sorry. Hi. Um I I just wanted to uh

2:21:58clarify that on item I've lost it.

2:22:02Whichever the one is, that is the the

2:22:03business one that Mr. Widen spoke about.

2:22:05Was it five or four? Item four. Thank

2:22:07you. Yes.

2:22:08>> On item four, um uh which by the way,

2:22:11I'm quite excited about and I I do

2:22:13support it, but um I wanted to clarify

2:22:16whether or not uh

2:22:19It includes um

2:22:22there's a lot of talk about retail.

2:22:24We've done a lot of retail work. There

2:22:25was one mention of talking to three of

2:22:28the more major employers. Um but uh we

2:22:33are doing this major employers event in

2:22:35a couple of weeks and I'm curious

2:22:38whether that feedback from that can be

2:22:41looped in to this process whether that

2:22:44is part of it so that we can have one

2:22:46comprehensive

2:22:47um strategy with respect to economic

2:22:50development and not just focused on

2:22:52smaller businesses. So let me uh respond

2:22:55uh quickly noting again this is on the

2:22:58consent calendar so a little bit awkward

2:23:00uh but just very quickly that

2:23:02>> we now have the process where we can ask

2:23:03questions for a few minutes before. Yes,

2:23:05we have both.

2:23:06>> It needs to be pulled in order

2:23:09>> only to why you want to pull it. That's

2:23:11all you're permitted to do.

2:23:12>> Okay. Well, I guess the question is if

2:23:14it's not within there I would want to

2:23:15pull it. That's so that's exactly why

2:23:17I'm asking. You're Thank you. Well, I

2:23:20did not preface it with that, but I am

2:23:23>> just quickly if you just answer that,

2:23:25then I will know whether or not I have

2:23:26to. It

2:23:28>> it will be included in a way that will

2:23:31allow us to feed it into future

2:23:33iterations of the strategy.

2:23:35>> Okay, that was unclear to me. So, thank

2:23:37you. Then I do not wish to pull it. Um,

2:23:42any anybody else have any recusals, no

2:23:44votes, anything for the consent

2:23:46calendar? All right. Seeing none, madame

2:23:48clerk, would you please call the role?

2:23:49>> I move calendar.

2:23:52>> Second.

2:23:53>> Little off my game. All right. I don't

2:23:55know who won that.

2:23:57>> I think Council Member Rectal moved.

2:23:59Council member Lith seconded.

2:24:04>> All right. Is that right?

2:24:09>> Good enough. Is it tie?

2:24:17Oh,

2:24:18>> just a reminder, we are now doing

2:24:20digital voting. This is our first

2:24:21digital voting on your iPads. So, the

2:24:25the ballots or the votes are now open.

2:24:43So, do I announce it or do you? This is

2:24:46our first time, folks. This is historic

2:24:47moment. Uh, bringing back the uh

2:24:50electronic voting here on the consent

2:24:52calendar.

2:24:57>> Motion carries unanimously.

2:24:59>> Okay. Thank you very much.

2:25:03All right. Um, so with that, we move on

2:25:06to city manager comments.

2:25:10Hey, follow for a second. Wasn't sure

2:25:13what to do next after that

2:25:14electronically. Um, city clerk, could I

2:25:17get request your assistance with just a

2:25:19few slides here?

2:25:26Great. Next slide, please.

2:25:33>> Well, uh, let's see. At the risk of

2:25:36stating the obvious, uh it is a very hot

2:25:38week and the National Weather Service

2:25:41has issued a heat advisory through

2:25:43Thursday. Uh would note that uh again

2:25:47much of this hopefully is very uh

2:25:49familiar to members of the community,

2:25:51but that we do want to flag for you

2:25:54resources identified on our city

2:25:57website, pelaltto.gov/hotweather.

2:26:00also uh

2:26:03remind community members that our

2:26:05libraries serve as cooling centers. Our

2:26:08five libraries located throughout the

2:26:10city and again additional information

2:26:13here is provided on our city website.

2:26:15Next slide please.

2:26:19As it relates to fire risks and again it

2:26:22being fire prevention week with our fire

2:26:25chief and fire marshall here uh earlier

2:26:28this evening. Uh just to reiterate a

2:26:30couple of points uh that on Saturday,

2:26:34this Saturday, October 10th, from 10:00

2:26:36a.m. to 2 p.m. at fire station 2 on

2:26:38handover street at handover and uh page

2:26:41mill. Uh you'll see uh displays,

2:26:44opportunities to learn uh other uh

2:26:46resources and tips for fire prevention

2:26:50as well as uh as was noted earlier

2:26:54particular uh awareness related to

2:26:57rechargeable batteries and the

2:26:59importance there. Next slide please.

2:27:03Then an odd uh transition here from fire

2:27:07to storms. So as we are approaching uh

2:27:10the winter uh storm season and as also

2:27:13top of mind for many community members

2:27:15uh the expected El Nino uh that uh would

2:27:20like to uh note that we will be issuing

2:27:22a community update uh later this week

2:27:25with a roundup of ongoing activities.

2:27:28Here is a quick snapshot on some

2:27:31upcoming events. Uh first off uh that

2:27:34later this month on the 19th there will

2:27:36be our seasonal street sweeping uh in

2:27:38particular noting around areas of uh

2:27:41both leaves and and clean up around our

2:27:43storm drains. On the 26th city council

2:27:46scheduled to have a storm or a study

2:27:48session on this topic uh where we can

2:27:51talk more u real time about ongoing

2:27:54preparedness and ways community members

2:27:56uh can uh both support themselves and

2:27:59their neighbors. On the 29th of October

2:28:03at Fire Station 3 on Embaradero Road,

2:28:05Embaradero and Newell, uh there will be

2:28:08an open house uh with additional

2:28:10in-person uh activities and uh

2:28:13demonstrations uh for community members

2:28:15on storm preparedness. November 1st,

2:28:18which is early uh as uh typical among

2:28:21years, uh this is an early year where

2:28:24sandb sandbags will be made available at

2:28:26various uh locations. And then on

2:28:29December 10th, we'll do our annual test

2:28:32of the emergency alert system and uh

2:28:35community members can sign up here on

2:28:37pelto.gov/connect.

2:28:39So upcoming activities, much ongoing

2:28:42activities related to uh storm

2:28:44preparedness. Next slide, please.

2:28:48Then uh and brighter news, uh look

2:28:51forward to this weekend's uh launch of

2:28:54the Pelto History Museum's event. uh

2:28:58occurring this Saturday uh and leading

2:29:02to a series of events through April of

2:29:04next year. This Saturday from 4:00 to

2:29:076:00 p.m. at the Heritage Park uh we'll

2:29:10have the PaloAlto Rocks theme uh event

2:29:14at Heritage Park and at the museum. Next

2:29:17slide. Oh, information here at

2:29:20pelto.gov/musicintheart.

2:29:22Next slide, please. Then our community

2:29:25impact fair also coming up this weekend

2:29:28on Sunday, October 11th in particular

2:29:30led uh really thanks to the human

2:29:33relations commission took the lead on

2:29:35pulling together this event and we

2:29:38expect to see 30 nonprofits or more than

2:29:4030 nonprofits uh really focused on uh

2:29:45support to our most vulnerable community

2:29:48opportunities uh to volunteer uh and so

2:29:51really invite community members to come

2:29:53Monty Mitchell Park Community Center on

2:29:55Sunday afternoon. Next slide, please.

2:29:58And finally, uh looking forward to

2:30:00upcoming city council agendas. Your next

2:30:03meeting on October 19th, noting that

2:30:05next week is a holiday and therefore

2:30:08will not have your regular council

2:30:09meeting on Monday. So on the 19th, we

2:30:12have one action item related to multif

2:30:14family residential zoning. Uh as well as

2:30:18a close session and some other items,

2:30:19but just highlighting action items and

2:30:21study sessions here. Next on October 26,

2:30:24Dream Cord of Protection will be before

2:30:26you for action as well as that study

2:30:29session I mentioned earlier on storm

2:30:31preparedness. Then November 2nd, uh day

2:30:34before election day, the uh agenda

2:30:38includes a study session on greenhouse

2:30:40gas inventory and reports, your 2027

2:30:43calendar, the SP79

2:30:46uh residential development permanent

2:30:48ordinance and ordinances uh related to

2:30:51ADU that has uh deferred from a few

2:30:54weeks back. And then you see a number of

2:30:56items here shown on November 9th and

2:30:58beyond. I won't review those

2:31:00individually, but just want to ensure

2:31:02that uh items are upcoming if you're

2:31:04looking for particular item. And with

2:31:06that, mayor, that completes my comments.

2:31:09>> All right. Thank you. So, we'll take our

2:31:11break now and reconvene at 8 8:00 p.m.

2:31:22for the fourth position. This is the

2:31:25third round voting for the parks and

2:31:26recreation commission. One moment.

2:31:38All

2:31:47right, announcing the results for the

2:31:49third round of voting. Aubrey Wickcom

2:31:51received votes from Lithcot, Hames, and

2:31:53Bert. Ben Lenol received votes from

2:31:55Rectal. Virginia Ruiz Albvesete received

2:31:59votes from Lowing Stone, Lou, and

2:32:01Vinker. Virginia Ruiz Alvesete will be

2:32:04appointed to the parks and rec

2:32:05commission. Thank you.

2:32:07Okay, now we have four and now we have

2:32:09our final appointee. So thank you very

2:32:11much and now we will take our

2:49:42into our action items. The first one of

2:49:44which is item 10, approval of FY2027

2:49:48ARB, HRB, PTC, and UAC work plans. Um,

2:49:53so I'll turn to staff to orchestrate

2:49:55this.

2:49:57>> Uh, city council, just a quick

2:49:58introduction for tonight. will be

2:50:00reviewing the work plans for the

2:50:02architectural review board, the historic

2:50:04resources board, planning and

2:50:05transportation, and the uh utilities

2:50:08advisory commission. We plan to go

2:50:10through each commission one at a time

2:50:12following the order on the agenda. For

2:50:15each presentation, chairs have been

2:50:17asked to start the conversation with a

2:50:195-minute introduction. The introduction

2:50:21will focus on anything they'd like to

2:50:23highlight and/or any particular areas of

2:50:25feedback they would appreciate from

2:50:27council. The full work plans have been

2:50:31published in the agenda packet.

2:50:33Following the five minute introductory

2:50:35introductory remarks, the remaining 15

2:50:37minutes per commission has been targeted

2:50:39for council's discussion and questions.

2:50:42Staff is present as well as to as well

2:50:46to support as needed throughout the

2:50:48discussion

2:50:50for each presentation. Um

2:50:52[sighs and gasps]

2:50:53we'll go through. So the first will be

2:50:56the architectural review board. We have

2:50:57Vice Chair Kendra Rosenberg who I

2:51:00believe is on Zoom and [snorts] staff

2:51:03Jennifer Armor, the assistant director

2:51:05for planning and development services

2:51:07available.

2:51:08>> Hi everyone,

2:51:12Kendra Rosenberg here, uh, vice chair of

2:51:14ARB. Apologies that our chair was unable

2:51:16to make it this evening, so I'm sort of

2:51:17pinching for her at the last moment. So

2:51:19I apologize um that I am dressed as I am

2:51:23and not in chambers today. So, I would

2:51:25have liked to have been there in person.

2:51:27>> No worries. Welcome. We're glad you're

2:51:28here.

2:51:30>> All right. So, to kick us off,

2:51:33apologies. Um, to kick us off, I just

2:51:37wanted to go over the few minor things

2:51:39that we had um accomplished this year

2:51:42and sort of talk about that because

2:51:43apparently our format is a little

2:51:44different this year. So, we used to go

2:51:45over the work plan with you guys and

2:51:47this time we're sort of summarizing. Um,

2:51:50and Jennifer, please jump in here at any

2:51:52point if I am inaccurate on that.

2:52:03Can everyone still hear me? Okay.

2:52:06>> Yes.

2:52:07>> Okay. Um, perfect. So, basically our

2:52:09review of ARB is that we've been um

2:52:12going through projects as they come in

2:52:13to the this the town. um we review them

2:52:18for obviously architectural quality. We

2:52:20have a set of standards that we review

2:52:21um them against and whether or not they

2:52:23proceed forward with adjustments or um

2:52:26as they are presented. Uh we've had many

2:52:30projects come in that are um multifamily

2:52:34projects and along with most of the ones

2:52:36that come through Stanford Shopping

2:52:37Center that are visible from El Camino

2:52:39and uh Sand Hill Road. Um so the

2:52:41Stanford Shopping Center projects are

2:52:42typically a little faster for review. We

2:52:44have minor additions here and there. Um

2:52:46the people that work at uh Stanford

2:52:48Shopping Center for setting up the mall,

2:52:50um they they've got a pretty good system

2:52:52there and the the new people coming into

2:52:55um take residents in those those units

2:52:58are pretty well informed by the time

2:53:00they get to ARB. Um in addition to

2:53:02those, obviously we have the larger

2:53:03scale projects, many of which have been

2:53:05focused in El Camino. Um we've got some

2:53:07going up and down El Camino by by Page

2:53:09Mill towards San Antonio. And then we've

2:53:11also got several projects that have been

2:53:13seen along the San Antonio corridor as

2:53:15well. Um all in all, we've reviewed

2:53:17about 17 projects over the past year. Um

2:53:19we've provided feedback to assist

2:53:21council on the San Antonio road plan,

2:53:23Cubberly master plan, which we I believe

2:53:25heard a little bit of information about

2:53:26earlier this evening, and the California

2:53:28Avenue pre-approved parklet designs. Um

2:53:31coming up this year, we're also going to

2:53:32be learning about the um we're going to

2:53:34be hearing more about cell phone towers,

2:53:36which will be an interesting one for us

2:53:37to be tackling. and we're trying to make

2:53:39sure that we've got a comprehensive

2:53:41system set up for that so that as they

2:53:43come through we've got a systematic um

2:53:45review process for that. Um our

2:53:48designated representatives provide input

2:53:50to council uh planning trans planning

2:53:53transmission council and the urban land

2:53:55institute initiative for the transit

2:53:56center. Um one of the things that I do

2:53:59want to touch base on is that there's

2:54:01often times where we have projects come

2:54:03in for ARB. We give our best advice we

2:54:05send to council. Um, and in years past,

2:54:08we've had the comment that it would be

2:54:10nice to have a circle back where once

2:54:12the project goes through city council

2:54:14that it comes back to ARB. Um, and

2:54:16that's one of those things that I don't

2:54:17think we've set up a formal process for

2:54:20at this point. Um, so we're trying to

2:54:22just sort of touch base on that. Again,

2:54:24nothing urgent, just sort of um

2:54:26something that had been a residual from

2:54:28one of years prior that I wanted to just

2:54:29make sure that we'd sort of touch base

2:54:31on at some point this evening. Um, but

2:54:33that's about it for ARB at the moment.

2:54:35We've been um working away and hopefully

2:54:37we're getting you guys some beautiful

2:54:39buildings in Palo Alto.

2:54:48>> Thank you very much.

2:54:53>> I don't know who's

2:54:54>> so and thank you. Um no comments from

2:54:58staff in addition to that. Um I think

2:55:00this the remainder of the time is

2:55:02available for question and discussion.

2:55:04either if you've got questions for staff

2:55:08uh or for our vice chair who is here

2:55:10with you in regards to the work plan and

2:55:13their accomplishments or f future work.

2:55:22Okay. So, um colleagues, if you have any

2:55:25questions, I guess, uh turn your mic on

2:55:27and uh

2:55:29council member Rectal.

2:55:32Yeah. I have one question about the

2:55:33circle back. Would that just be a like a

2:55:36postmortem saying what did the council

2:55:38change or what do you think the purpose

2:55:41is for that?

2:55:42>> Yeah, it was just a comment. It was

2:55:44again this is a residual from years

2:55:45prior um that we had had where we'll

2:55:48send something off to city council for

2:55:50approval and we just never hear about it

2:55:52again whether it was approved as is or

2:55:54if there was comments or if it was

2:55:55denied. Right. We just don't always get

2:55:57that feedback um in a consistent way.

2:56:00And again, it's nobody's fault. It's

2:56:02just one of those things that we've seen

2:56:03that that's how sort of the process

2:56:04goes. And because we're nosy in the ARB,

2:56:06we like to know what happens to the

2:56:08projects that we review. So, it's one of

2:56:10those that unless somebody's actively at

2:56:12the city council meeting from ARB, we

2:56:14typically don't hear back about it. And

2:56:15there had been a comment that maybe we

2:56:17could set up a, you know, more routine

2:56:19method of getting that information back

2:56:21to ARB, just in a very cursory this

2:56:24project went to city council, it was

2:56:26approved, you know, something just that

2:56:27short. Um, but again, it's not an urgent

2:56:30item and it's just sort of more of a

2:56:32polite request from ARB more than

2:56:33anything else and residual.

2:56:35>> But you'd anticipate that staff would

2:56:37give you a a summary of what happened?

2:56:40>> Yeah, even if it's just as simple as

2:56:41staff brings up during the ARB meeting,

2:56:43hey, this had been seen by city council

2:56:45and it was approved. That's it.

2:56:47>> I mean, I think there would be some

2:56:48value there, especially if council does

2:56:50object to certain things that would give

2:56:51you insight into what council's

2:56:53thinking. So then down the road, you

2:56:54say, "Let's not make that same mistake

2:56:56twice."

2:56:57>> Exactly. We want to make sure that we're

2:56:58sort of setting you guys up for success

2:56:59as well and and having that feedback in

2:57:01two ways is actually incredibly helpful.

2:57:03So, yeah.

2:57:04>> Okay. Thank you,

2:57:07>> Council Member Lowing.

2:57:09>> Yeah, thanks. I actually had the same

2:57:10question. Uh, Council Rex did, but I

2:57:13have another question. Um, so you're now

2:57:17in a situation where on some of the

2:57:19things that are coming in front of you,

2:57:21you have pretty wide control and in some

2:57:23of those you don't have any control

2:57:25because it's builder's remedy or

2:57:26whatever, but you still have some things

2:57:28that you can influence. So my question

2:57:30is, you know, how are the members of the

2:57:32ARB feeling about their overall

2:57:34influence on projects um given that so

2:57:37much is um, you know, dictated?

2:57:40That's a very it's a very good question

2:57:43and it's um I'm going to try and answer

2:57:45this carefully

2:57:48as well as for the board but it is one

2:57:50of those where I find I find that there

2:57:51is some frustration that our our

2:57:53>> sort of um

2:57:56our capacity for input is somewhat

2:57:58limited on a lot of these projects and

2:58:00that can be really frustrating at times.

2:58:02Now we understand why there's rules and

2:58:03regulations. We're trying to do our best

2:58:05to follow it and try and give guidance

2:58:07in those projects where even if they're

2:58:09not required to listen to us, at least

2:58:10we can provide them input where

2:58:12hopefully, you know, as good people and

2:58:14wanting to provide back for the city of

2:58:15Powell so that they would follow some of

2:58:17our input. So, we do do our best to

2:58:19provide, you know, comprehensive input

2:58:21and feedback that could be maintained

2:58:24and and could be sort of integrated into

2:58:26the projects. But, you know, we do

2:58:28understand where some of our limitations

2:58:29are and yes, it is frustrating at times.

2:58:32Um I do believe that we had counted down

2:58:34a certain number. We had had builder's

2:58:36remedy SB330s and we had sort of keep an

2:58:39eye on that number and when those do

2:58:40come in they sort of get a different

2:58:42level of of um sort of attention just

2:58:45because we know

2:58:47we know that there's only so much that

2:58:49we can do and only so much that we can

2:58:51push for but we still try and do our

2:58:53best to make sure that these are the

2:58:54best possible outcomes um given what we

2:58:57can do. That

2:58:58>> that's that's good. And I encourage you

2:59:00to keep doing that because anecdotally

2:59:02um I' I've heard from developers saying

2:59:05I really enjoyed going to ARB because

2:59:07they give me some good ideas.

2:59:09>> Well, that's a good that's good.

2:59:10>> That's great feedback. Okay.

2:59:12>> So, you don't win them all, but you're

2:59:13winning some, I guess, is my message for

2:59:15you.

2:59:16>> That's good to hear. I appreciate that.

2:59:18>> Thank you,

2:59:20>> Council Member Bird.

2:59:22>> Thank you. Um so I I notice under um

2:59:26project uh number two, one of the things

2:59:29is uh uh feedback to staff and council

2:59:33on new guidelines on including on

2:59:36streetscapes and it says as directed by

2:59:38council. So, um,

2:59:43the staff and the ARB and the council

2:59:46spent a lot of, uh, time and effort

2:59:49trying to come up with, uh, good

2:59:51standards for the, um, Calab and in

2:59:55particular the permanent parklets. And,

2:59:58um, I think we all hope that what we

3:00:02came up with was going to be a good

3:00:05solution. Um, I've just been we and we

3:00:10paved the the street this last week. I'm

3:00:13now seeing from um and hearing from a

3:00:16bunch of the restaurants that our

3:00:18parklet designs may uh or standards may

3:00:22result in very significant reduction in

3:00:26outdoor dining for half the year, which

3:00:28is a lot of what creates the vibrancy on

3:00:31the street. Mhm.

3:00:32>> So, do you need the council to um uh

3:00:37refer uh a review of how that's working

3:00:41in order for you to um uh determine uh

3:00:46the effectiveness of of what we all had

3:00:49settled on?

3:00:51>> So, if I understand your question, it's

3:00:53is there a way for us to sort of circle

3:00:55back if we hear that something's not

3:00:57working?

3:00:58>> Yeah. In this thing in particular.

3:01:00>> Yeah. And this one in particular, it's

3:01:01that's actually extremely good feedback

3:01:03because yeah, with the parklets, we

3:01:04really were hoping to encourage more

3:01:06outdoor dining, more vibrancy on the

3:01:08street, specifically Cal Avenue, and

3:01:09then to hear that maybe it's because of

3:01:11how we've set it up that they would not

3:01:13be able to have dining, I would assume

3:01:15during the winter months because of rain

3:01:16and cold and things like that.

3:01:18>> Okay. Um, so yeah, that's definitely

3:01:20something that if we hear that this is a

3:01:22negatively impacting the businesses,

3:01:23absolutely, we would want to hear about

3:01:25it and find a way to circle that back to

3:01:26ARB. So we could either make an

3:01:28amendment to the parklet design or that

3:01:30there's a way to, you know, allow for a

3:01:32certain time of year, a certain cold

3:01:34threshold that something could be

3:01:36adjusted to encourage and enhance that

3:01:38outdoor dining experience. For sure.

3:01:41>> And I think in the past we had some ARB

3:01:43members that just on their own were

3:01:44engaging with some of the businesses and

3:01:47receiving direct feedback. Um so um that

3:01:52might be something that would would help

3:01:54in inform the ARB uh just to get a sense

3:01:59of is it going well? Is there a problem

3:02:02and and not get it filtered through us

3:02:04and staff and everywhere else to

3:02:06actually hear what the problems are.

3:02:08>> Okay, [clears throat] great.

3:02:09>> Right. Thank you.

3:02:10>> Thank you.

3:02:14>> All right. Any more uh questions or

3:02:16comments on the uh ARB work plan?

3:02:22Okay, seeing none, um I think we should

3:02:26I think the plan is to go through each

3:02:27of these and then to do one motion at

3:02:29the end, right? Because then we can do

3:02:30public comment al together one time as

3:02:33well, unless I'm I'm seeing nothing

3:02:36different. Okay. All right. Well, with

3:02:38that, thank you so much for making time

3:02:41on this spur of the moment and answering

3:02:43our questions. and thank you for the

3:02:44work you do

3:02:45>> and and I'll be here in case there's any

3:02:47need to circle back. I just I am going

3:02:48to turn off my video, but I will be here

3:02:50until you guys make your motion.

3:02:51>> Yeah, that's perfect because at that

3:02:53time there could be. So, thank you so

3:02:55much.

3:02:55>> Thank you very much. Appreciate it.

3:02:57>> All right, so let's move on to the

3:02:59historic resources board. Welcome.

3:03:05>> No,

3:03:08>> I'm good. Thank you. Um so first I want

3:03:11to thank you all for um assigning you

3:03:15choosing new historic resources board

3:03:17members. It was a little shaky out

3:03:20there. Um they were drifting off and

3:03:23there were no replacements. Um and um

3:03:26we're really grateful and um and I'm

3:03:28anxious to work with our new members. I

3:03:30think we have a a nice variety of ages

3:03:34and um experience. So I think it'll be

3:03:36great. Um, so I I believe historic

3:03:40preservation is essential. Big surprise

3:03:42here, huh? Essential to maintaining our

3:03:44various cultural identities, teaching us

3:03:46valuable lessons from past mistakes, and

3:03:50supporting environmental and economic

3:03:52sustainability. And tonight, I want to

3:03:54touch on upgrading our inventory.

3:03:58um commencement of our awards program,

3:04:01request for voluntary category upgrades,

3:04:04historic category upgrades, um along

3:04:06with the Mills Act, and the need for

3:04:08incentives to preserve our historic

3:04:11fabric. Um PaloAlto, as I'm sure you

3:04:15guys know, it has a really rich and

3:04:17impressive history, immersed in

3:04:19education, defense, electronics. Um we

3:04:23live in a special place.

3:04:25Um and I think that um you know the most

3:04:28important thing for me is to build a

3:04:32solid base. Um and the um vast majority

3:04:36of our historic inventory

3:04:39was compiled in the late 1970s

3:04:42and perspect for perspective I I was

3:04:45still in my 20s then. Um it it's been a

3:04:49long time and um we're getting there

3:04:52slowly. Um, but it it's still primarily

3:04:55in its original form. And here it is.

3:04:59Typewriter.

3:05:00You guys seen one of those recently? Um,

3:05:03but you know, it's been scanned in its

3:05:05typewriter form. Um, but in addition to

3:05:09that, you know, we had an intern over

3:05:11the summer. Planning department was

3:05:13great and got us an intern and we have

3:05:15everything ready to roll. Um, and all we

3:05:20need is a little import input. But um

3:05:24currently online I don't know how many

3:05:26you guys have looked at our historic

3:05:28resources online really fascinating and

3:05:31you can scroll through the four sections

3:05:34the first of which is 300 pages if

3:05:36you're really want to get to that

3:05:38property that you're interested in but I

3:05:41have a feeling this is a detriment to

3:05:44many of our um community many in our

3:05:47community um and but thankfully over the

3:05:51years um staff and the community have

3:05:54had the past heritage website to refer

3:05:57to. It's not identical, but certainly it

3:06:00has been a lifesaver for preservation

3:06:04and I want to thank past heritage for

3:06:06stepping up.

3:06:08um staff secured a $10,500 grant for us

3:06:13and over the summer an intern got the

3:06:16inventory ready to update online and at

3:06:19this point as I've been told it's an

3:06:21exercise in copy and paste but along

3:06:24with that information I was also told

3:06:27that it probably wouldn't happen till

3:06:28early spring and

3:06:32it's in a queue for data entry and um I

3:06:36would like to make a plea for um a more

3:06:40expedient response. I think that having

3:06:43our inventory online would be a a small

3:06:46step towards alerting the community that

3:06:49and especially newcomers that we

3:06:51actually value our tangible cultural re

3:06:54heritage. Um I think it's hard to um

3:06:59sell something to the community that we

3:07:02as um a governing body are not putting

3:07:05out there as a serious thing. So I hope

3:07:09you will consider ways in which we can

3:07:13update our inventory online more

3:07:15expediently. I'd like to see it by

3:07:17Christmas, but you can consider that

3:07:20your Christmas gift to me if you can

3:07:21manage it. Um

3:07:25um this past year we the HRB did

3:07:27establish an awards program um and we

3:07:30plan to build on that for 2030. We'd

3:07:32like to do it every four five years. Um

3:07:35so keep an eye out and let us know what

3:07:37you think are great historic re resource

3:07:41projects happening in our community

3:07:43because it would be great to have your

3:07:45the community input. Um also this year

3:07:48we saw vi five voluntary category

3:07:50upgrade request both commercial and

3:07:53residential.

3:07:55At present um has five three excuse me

3:07:59three historic properties on Kipling

3:08:00that they're um doing accessibility

3:08:03upgrades and getting rehabilitated and

3:08:05um anticipation of TDR's transfer of

3:08:08development rights. So, shout out to

3:08:11Thorts for being a local strong

3:08:13preservationist.

3:08:15Um, and lastly, I'd make like to make a

3:08:18plea, another plea for um incentives.

3:08:24The Mills Act has been on hold in

3:08:26PaloAlto since I was previously on the

3:08:29historic resources board in 1997.

3:08:36Going back through previous discussions

3:08:39of the Mills Act in that year, I

3:08:42continue to believe, as I said at the

3:08:44time, that immediate development

3:08:45pressure and the need for rehabilitation

3:08:48are reasons for speedily deciding on a

3:08:51Mills Act.

3:08:56Hold on, five minutes. I thought it was

3:08:57going to be slow. Oh, sorry. Um

3:08:59furthermore, it may be that a um

3:09:03decision will be made to use the Mills

3:09:05Act only sparingly to encourage

3:09:07preservation where it would not

3:09:08otherwise occur. Um and we're asking you

3:09:12to put a pilot help us put a pilot

3:09:13program in place so we can test it out.

3:09:16And with that, I'll turn it over to

3:09:18questions.

3:09:19>> Great. Well, thank you very much. We

3:09:21appreciate it. Um,

3:09:26Council Member Bert,

3:09:27>> thank you. Um, so thanks for all the

3:09:30good work that you folks do. Um, one

3:09:32area that, um, is a a really important

3:09:37part of our community history and is

3:09:39also actually ties into our economic

3:09:44development efforts is the history of

3:09:47technology and technology companies in

3:09:49our community. And we have almost zero

3:09:53recognition other than the HP garage of

3:09:56where these uh companies were uh where

3:10:00their first offices were, whether it's

3:10:02Pinterest across the street or Facebook

3:10:05or Google or PayPal uh or a whole myriad

3:10:09of globally impacting uh companies. And

3:10:13when people come here uh from afar

3:10:17today, that is the most fascinating and

3:10:21uh gravitating

3:10:23uh thing about our community for many of

3:10:26those people. But we don't treat that as

3:10:29part of our official historic legacy. So

3:10:33is that is that something that the HRB

3:10:36has discussed at all or would be

3:10:39interested in?

3:10:40>> Interested? Yes.

3:10:42um not discussed. I think primarily

3:10:45because

3:10:47um we kind of put a 50-year limit on

3:10:51history and because we're historic

3:10:53resources board um and it and it is

3:10:58modern history. But I think for that

3:11:01reason, you know, I, you know, we've got

3:11:03a couple of plaques for, you know, the

3:11:0640s and the 50s, I think. But after

3:11:09that, I don't really think we do have

3:11:12anything, but I'm not really sure how

3:11:15that would fit into our mission. I I

3:11:17certainly think we as a board would be

3:11:19interested. And I think also

3:11:21um h having some younger members come

3:11:24in, I think that um that might be more

3:11:27exciting for them than uh you know the

3:11:291800s which I'm prefer I enjoy.

3:11:36>> Good. I I know that when we when we

3:11:38talked about what we now call our Palto

3:11:40Museum, when we were calling our history

3:11:42museum, one of the discussions was okay

3:11:44well how contemporary is that? and they

3:11:47said, "Well, it it comes right up to

3:11:49contemporary and in PaloAlto history

3:11:52might be as recently as recent as what

3:11:54happened last week."

3:11:56>> And I think maybe that's a good way for

3:11:58the board to approach it that we would

3:12:00love to partner. I'm speaking for two

3:12:02people that I've hardly met, but I think

3:12:06that um I can imagine that the board

3:12:09would like to pursue that maybe with the

3:12:11history museum that I think it might be

3:12:14better done as a joint venture. Um I I

3:12:19think people are sort of skittish, you

3:12:21know, about

3:12:22our our role in life.

3:12:25Um, so I think, you know, reaching

3:12:28spreading out into the current, um, day

3:12:31and age, I think that might be a little

3:12:33dangerous for us on some level, but but

3:12:36I also feel like, you know, if you don't

3:12:39speak up, it vanishes and you have a

3:12:41plaque.

3:12:42>> Yep. All right. Thanks,

3:12:45>> Council Member Lou.

3:12:47>> Thank you. Maybe just one general

3:12:50question. I don't know if this is to

3:12:51what extent this is for staff or uh

3:12:54Caroline. Um the work plan requ uh

3:12:58mentions under resources needed council

3:13:01direction in a few places.

3:13:05Uh and I'm particularly thinking about

3:13:08uh project goal 5 additional

3:13:10preservation incentives. Do you need any

3:13:12council direction or do you expect any

3:13:14council direction out of this venue?

3:13:19>> You mean today? Yes.

3:13:22>> Um I don't but um but I think the closer

3:13:27our relationship is with council, the

3:13:29better idea we as a board would have of

3:13:32what the community is looking for. Um I

3:13:36think that with two new board members

3:13:37out of our five member board, it's going

3:13:39to take us some time to reset and um

3:13:44develop a

3:13:46collective um action plan. Um but I

3:13:51think generally the more input the

3:13:53better. Um from my perspective we can

3:13:56ignore it. I mean I can ignore it but

3:13:58you know having the information and the

3:14:01way other people especially council feel

3:14:03about historic incentives is always a

3:14:06good idea for us. Um, and

3:14:10I I I actually, you know, like um I kind

3:14:14of wanted to recount for you guys what

3:14:17council the 1997 council said about

3:14:22historic preservation and their guidance

3:14:24on the Mills Act because for me, if we

3:14:28don't get any incentives in place,

3:14:32we're just going to keep losing things,

3:14:34you know, and you know, it's like you

3:14:35don't know what you got till it's gone,

3:14:37you and it's going to be gone and it'll

3:14:39be too late and you know we already see

3:14:41that you know not on a large scale

3:14:43hallelujah but you know piece by piece

3:14:46minute by minute we lose things so in

3:14:49coun in in particular the 1997 council

3:14:53com um com commented that three strict

3:14:56issues were paramount and this is

3:14:58regarding the mills act the significance

3:15:01of the property to the community the

3:15:03development pressure on the site and the

3:15:05need for rehabilitation

3:15:08And to address the funding reduction for

3:15:11the schools that would result from any

3:15:13mills act agreement, the 1997 council

3:15:16commented that the number of new mills

3:15:18acts would need to be limited and that

3:15:20each agreement must provide a major

3:15:23public benefit. And we feel really

3:15:26strongly that we need this incentive and

3:15:30we would like to try like just three

3:15:32properties and you know if we fail we

3:15:35fail. I got to say the squarehouse was

3:15:37not the total success, but it's still

3:15:39standing and it probably wouldn't have

3:15:41been otherwise. Um, so I think that

3:15:45the board would really appreciate it if

3:15:47council gave us the go-ahad to do a

3:15:50trial mills act um as a preservation

3:15:53incentive. And I think other incentives

3:15:56might include a small grant program for

3:16:00like storefronts or seismic or

3:16:02accessibility. Um, you know, if you've

3:16:05had a building for a really long time,

3:16:08you know, sometimes you're just not

3:16:12prices keep going up, you know, and

3:16:13maybe it's just sticker shock, but, you

3:16:17know, I think it becomes hard when

3:16:19you're paying for the accessibility

3:16:21upgrade that cost you half of what your

3:16:23building cost you 30 years ago whenever

3:16:26you bought it. So, I think incentives

3:16:29are really important for us for

3:16:32preservation and

3:16:35>> Oh, got it. Uh, I I saw staff light was

3:16:37on, so I'm also curious. Uh,

3:16:39>> okay.

3:16:40>> If there's an update from Assistant

3:16:42Director Armor.

3:16:43>> Thank you, Council Member. Uh, what I

3:16:46would add is the note that you were

3:16:48pointing to was under the resources

3:16:50needed category. So the historic

3:16:53resources board has some great ideas of

3:16:56work that could be done in their

3:16:59purview. Um but and they actually have

3:17:02made progress in um subgroups doing

3:17:06their own research on some of these

3:17:08topics. But um occasionally we have

3:17:11topics on here that they are interested

3:17:13in including in the work plan that we

3:17:16don't currently have resourced in terms

3:17:18of staff or budget. And so we include

3:17:21them here as things that they're

3:17:22interested in and that they can do

3:17:24research on, but we don't necessarily

3:17:26have staff time um allocated for it. So

3:17:29that's what that is reflecting.

3:17:31>> Okay. Uh personally, I'd be interested

3:17:33at some point to explore greater

3:17:35incentives for historic preservation.

3:17:37I'd be uh

3:17:40uh

3:17:42interested in sort of seeing a spectrum

3:17:43of options. I think TDRs are something

3:17:47that

3:17:49from what I gather have mostly worked

3:17:51downtown and so maybe could be

3:17:53considered selectively and thoughtfully

3:17:55in certain places or uh uh just expanded

3:17:59in some way.

3:18:01The other thing I wanted to

3:18:05uh briefly touch on was just a plus one

3:18:08to council member Bert's point. I think

3:18:10we have a lot of history from the

3:18:12Grateful Dead to important sports

3:18:14figures to uh sort of founding figures

3:18:17in Paul Alto and uh I would love to have

3:18:20some sort of

3:18:22if not building level historic

3:18:24preservation like a more formal plaque

3:18:28or recognition program for something

3:18:30like that. So, uh

3:18:34uh yeah, I'll just plus one that. Um,

3:18:38and yeah, those are my comments and

3:18:40questions.

3:18:42>> Okay. Uh, Council Member Li Hson, I'm

3:18:44just going to say that I've noticed that

3:18:45this with our new system of of the the

3:18:49putting on lights. When I put mine on

3:18:51and then I speak to call in someone

3:18:53else, I go off. So, [laughter]

3:18:55I just bear with me. I'm going to just

3:18:57not use my little button going forward

3:18:58and

3:19:00uh put myself in at some time. But right

3:19:02now, Council Member Lith, please go

3:19:04ahead. Thank you, mayor, and thank you,

3:19:06Miss Willis, for your service and your

3:19:08delightful presentation this evening. I

3:19:11also want to second council member

3:19:13Bert's point on appreciating the

3:19:15historical nature of the companies

3:19:17founded here as well as council member

3:19:19Lou's point about the artists and the

3:19:21athletes and leaders in other uh

3:19:23industries um who may turn out to be

3:19:27figures we consider worth um recognizing

3:19:32under the banner of historically

3:19:34significant. Um, you know, I, as you all

3:19:37know, whether something will turn out to

3:19:38be historic isn't just about its age.

3:19:41It's about its import or its impact. Um,

3:19:46so I would be very excited if the HRB

3:19:48were to develop and recommend an effort

3:19:50to recognize companies, individuals

3:19:52that, you know, may be still present

3:19:55doing their thing,

3:19:58um, but whose impact we can predict

3:20:00might turn out to be historic by the

3:20:02standard definition, decades hence. I

3:20:04think we would benefit from doing that

3:20:05pre-work. Um, we would essentially be

3:20:09laying down the foundation that would

3:20:11allow them to be recognized years.

3:20:12Hence, some of the companies we think of

3:20:14as world changing today might not be

3:20:16around in 50 years, but we will look

3:20:19back and say, "Wow, they they may not

3:20:21exist anymore, but they really changed

3:20:23and shaped the trajectory of who knows

3:20:25what." And people ought to know that it

3:20:27began here. And so, in some ways, we

3:20:29save them. I think you I live near the

3:20:31Wabionis park and school and we weren't

3:20:33able to save Wannab Wannabion's home. Um

3:20:38there's a wall of it that's now in the

3:20:40in the new Palo Alto Museum, but imagine

3:20:42if somebody then had had the foresight

3:20:45to say, you know, this woman is a I was

3:20:49about to say a term I shouldn't say in

3:20:51Chambers. um you know was really kicked

3:20:54some serious you know what and was a was

3:20:56a founder and a pioneer and um different

3:21:00and unique and so on. It would be

3:21:01wonderful if that track record or that

3:21:03um the ability to preserve her legacy

3:21:06had been sort of laid down as it was

3:21:08going. I I think with the benefit of

3:21:10hindsight in our modern era we could be

3:21:12much better at that than our forebears

3:21:14were. So I just wanted to plus to that

3:21:17concept that developed on the deis. As

3:21:20you said, if you don't speak up, it

3:21:21vanishes and I think this is an

3:21:23opportunity for us to speak up now about

3:21:25things we may regret not having done so

3:21:27later. Thank you.

3:21:30>> Well, we were ready to lie down in front

3:21:32of that Woni's house, but you know, they

3:21:35held out and they took it down. And you

3:21:38bring up a good point. If we'd had any

3:21:41kind of demolition protection at that

3:21:43point, which we still don't have. I hate

3:21:45to say that out loud, that house would

3:21:48still be standing.

3:21:49So what I hear from you is that we need

3:21:53to commit occasionally. Not every every

3:21:56building, not every even very you know

3:22:00intensely historic building, but

3:22:02occasionally we need to commit and say

3:22:05this building is worth keeping and we

3:22:08are willing to

3:22:11lay down the law and say no, no

3:22:14demolition.

3:22:15And that's a hard one.

3:22:19Uh we only have a minute left but I'm

3:22:22going to ask um kind [clears throat] of

3:22:24a follow-up question. I'm going to shift

3:22:26to a follow-up question which is you

3:22:29know we we generally when we look at how

3:22:31the board is described on the website

3:22:34and you know look at the about the

3:22:36commission here it's very much on um

3:22:38projects and buildings and properties.

3:22:40Um so when we broaden out to some of

3:22:43these things um that are more cultural

3:22:45and figures and and and such. How do you

3:22:49see when I think about all how do you

3:22:51see your relationship with the PaloAlto

3:22:53museum because they specifically don't

3:22:55want to be the history museum right as

3:22:57the Palo Alto Museum but many of the

3:22:58types of things I've heard on the deis I

3:23:01think are the things they're trying to

3:23:02do to capture what makes Palo Alto Palo

3:23:05Alto. What's the interplay there

3:23:09if any?

3:23:12>> Not great.

3:23:14Um,

3:23:16I have reached out to I reached out to

3:23:19them when I joined the historic rejoined

3:23:21the historic board resources board

3:23:23again. But I think at that point and

3:23:25it's it's been what 5 years a while.

3:23:28It's been a while. Um, Rich Green was

3:23:30very protective and um and did not was

3:23:34not interested in input from the

3:23:36historic resources board. At least that

3:23:39was my impression. Um, and um and I do

3:23:44think that they will be good partners,

3:23:46but I think they've had such a rocky

3:23:49start that I I don't really challenge

3:23:53them on how they've, you know, related

3:23:55to us at this point. Um, and I I do

3:23:59think, you know, that

3:24:03we will become a team at some point, but

3:24:05it's not there yet.

3:24:07>> Gotcha. Okay. Well, it'll be interesting

3:24:09to hear from you next year. Some things

3:24:11are beginning to sort out.

3:24:13>> Much better next year. We'll have an

3:24:14inventory online. We'll have a mills

3:24:17act. I'm so excited to come back.

3:24:19>> All right. Well, thank you so much for

3:24:21coming tonight. We're we're

3:24:22appreciative.

3:24:23>> Thank you.

3:24:24>> Is there a public comment on this?

3:24:26>> Okay. in there to begin. They said they

3:24:29were going to do.

3:24:30>> All right. So, next we have the planning

3:24:32and transportation commission

3:24:35who is representing that. We have chair

3:24:38Ba Chang and um staff at the first

3:24:41level.

3:24:44>> Good evening everyone. Good evening,

3:24:47mayor, vice mayor, and council. All

3:24:49right. So,

3:24:51I want to right now we've got nine

3:24:54project goals for our new work plan. And

3:24:56the big picture is that we had nine last

3:24:58year. Two of them dropped off because we

3:25:01finished them. So, they were the uh

3:25:03retail ordinance update. Hooray. And

3:25:06also the bike ped uh transportation plan

3:25:09and another huray for that. Um, and then

3:25:11there's two new ones that the planning

3:25:13commission decided to add on which are

3:25:17the comp uh comp plan updates of

3:25:20starting that process because the

3:25:22current comp plan uh is slated to go

3:25:25through 2030, but it's a it could

3:25:28potentially be a long process and so we

3:25:30need to kick off that planning process

3:25:33for how we're going to update the comp

3:25:34plan. And then um the second bucket is

3:25:38um to improve the PTC process and to

3:25:42look at scope of the PTC. Um so I'll

3:25:46just quickly touch on that item because

3:25:48it's a new one. And um there's the PTC's

3:25:53had an appetite for how we speed things

3:25:56up and minimize reviews that come to the

3:25:59PC and then also need to come to

3:26:00council. Um

3:26:03uh and so there were some thoughts about

3:26:06how uh when we when a few of our

3:26:08commissioners went to Southern

3:26:09California to a planning commission

3:26:11conference um they identified that in

3:26:14many other cities the planning

3:26:16commission is a decision-making body. So

3:26:19there may be room for some subset of

3:26:21decisions to be effectively made by the

3:26:25planning commission. One of the ideas

3:26:26that has been raised for example is if

3:26:29there's a 70 decision could that

3:26:32possibly be something that could start

3:26:33on consent for example. So these are

3:26:35just some of the ideas that have been

3:26:37tossed around and so this agenda or

3:26:40sorry this goal is meant to explore

3:26:43those types of ideas. Um secondly

3:26:47there's some a bucket of things that I

3:26:48would stick under communications. Um, so

3:26:54for example, we have interest in having

3:26:56a city council liaison for our meetings

3:26:58and we know that our meetings are very

3:27:00long. So we're not necessarily asking

3:27:02for a council member to come and sit in

3:27:04on them, but it would be often it would

3:27:06be helpful if there's somebody who sort

3:27:08of is design the designated person that

3:27:11the PTC could email with questions

3:27:14because sometimes there's questions

3:27:15about well what exactly went on with

3:27:17that item. we can see it in um we can

3:27:20see it in the minutes and we can watch a

3:27:22video but sometimes there's just a

3:27:24little bit more context that would be

3:27:25helpful. Um and then there's also

3:27:28communication for example how do we get

3:27:30our public comments in a timely manner

3:27:33there. Um and then finally there's a

3:27:37questions about how technology might be

3:27:38able to make us more efficient.

3:27:41Um so that's kind of that item that the

3:27:44PTC decided to assign itself. Uh in

3:27:47terms of the other goals, many of them

3:27:50are the same things that we do year on

3:27:51year on year. So for example, uh

3:27:54implement the housing element, implement

3:27:56state laws, implement the comp plan, um

3:28:00changes to title 18. These are all

3:28:02things that the planning commission has

3:28:04to review. Um, and then

3:28:08one thing that we're particularly

3:28:09excited about is parking programs. So,

3:28:11that's actually going to come to us in

3:28:14two weeks and we'll hear about some

3:28:16updates and we've seen some of those

3:28:17updates in our garages already. Um, and

3:28:21that is about it. So, oh, I guess I

3:28:24should mention to you all the projects

3:28:26that we do see that are not goal

3:28:28specific but important to all the work

3:28:31that we do. So this year we actually I

3:28:35feel like saw fewer projects than we

3:28:37have historically because of a lot of

3:28:38the streamline review processes that

3:28:40have been put in both intentionally on

3:28:42our part um with the housing element and

3:28:45also as a result of implementing state

3:28:46law. Um but we've reviewed tenative maps

3:28:50and uh did some site and design reviews

3:28:54and some planned communities or PHZ

3:28:57projects. So notably things like 70 in

3:28:59Cena, uh 3606 El Camino Rial, 2100 Gang

3:29:04Road, 3150 El Camino Rail, and that's

3:29:06the fish market project. So it's several

3:29:09hundred project uh several hundred units

3:29:11of housing uh encompassed in all of

3:29:13that. And then in terms of PCs, Palatoto

3:29:17Commons, 366 Elamino Royale, 660

3:29:20University, and 70 in SEMA. So hopefully

3:29:23that gives you some idea of what we've

3:29:24been up to and I'm happy to answer

3:29:26questions.

3:29:28Great. Well, [clears throat] thank you

3:29:29very much. Um, just one thing you uh you

3:29:32mentioned, I mean, we have a lot of

3:29:33former planning commissioners up here,

3:29:35but for those who weren't, I was

3:29:36surprised during the recent uh board and

3:29:39commissions uh chair check-in with the

3:29:41vice mayor and me to learn, I mean, it's

3:29:44like of course once you hear it, whereas

3:29:46we get the public comment comes straight

3:29:48into our email boxes. That doesn't isn't

3:29:50necessarily the case for the commission

3:29:52because if you don't have a paloto.gov

3:29:54of address and so there's a whole step

3:29:56there of making sure you get it in a

3:29:58timely way which given what you do makes

3:30:01sense. So

3:30:01>> and it's quite labor intensive also for

3:30:03staff to have to do that because they're

3:30:05compiling all the emails redacting

3:30:07private information and putting it into

3:30:09a PDF for us

3:30:11>> which is hard for us to search hard for

3:30:14us to respond to people. So yeah

3:30:16>> yeah it's not just a throwaway little

3:30:18thing. It's actually hard to do but um

3:30:21something that would be important to do.

3:30:23So, yeah. Yes. All right. Council member

3:30:26Bert.

3:30:28>> Thank you. So, uh my question is really

3:30:30probably more directed to staff, but

3:30:32it's about something that uh we've been

3:30:34discussing [snorts] and that is um this

3:30:37is the planning and transportation

3:30:39commission. And um back when

3:30:42transportation was added to the planning

3:30:45commission in the late 90s, it was not

3:30:48conceived of that. It was alternately

3:30:50the planning commission and the

3:30:52transportation commission. It was more

3:30:54to look at the integration of those two

3:30:56functions and make sure that we're we're

3:30:59looking at them uh in a related way. Um,

3:31:04so does does staff need clearer

3:31:09direction from the council to really

3:31:12move forward more on assuring that

3:31:16particularly either area plans, major

3:31:18projects uh that uh are uh planning

3:31:24projects but have a significant

3:31:26transportation component that the

3:31:28transportation department is engaged and

3:31:32present. uh and part of that integrated

3:31:35discussion for the planning commission.

3:31:42>> Thank you for that question. I would I

3:31:44would say that we actually do make a a

3:31:46strong effort to make sure that we have

3:31:50uh representation from any of the

3:31:52departments that are deeply involved in

3:31:54the review of projects. Um and we do

3:31:57have a number of plans a San Antonio

3:31:59road area plan in particular that is

3:32:01very deeply both about the land use and

3:32:04about the transportation and have um

3:32:08staff from both departments deeply

3:32:10involved. Well, I think we're aware of

3:32:12some major projects where there was not

3:32:16representation from the planning, the

3:32:18transportation department. And so,

3:32:20hearing that from you, that's not very

3:32:22reassuring to me to just tell me that

3:32:25no, no, no, there's not a problem that's

3:32:26already solved when we're pretty aware

3:32:28there is has been a problem. So, I will

3:32:31acknowledge I can think of at least one

3:32:33project um within the last year where um

3:32:36there ended up being significant

3:32:38concerns about the interaction with the

3:32:43safe routes to schools and and

3:32:44transportation. And because of the

3:32:48character of the application, the

3:32:50component that was being reviewed by the

3:32:52planning and transportation commission,

3:32:55um, we didn't anticipate the need for

3:32:57transportation staff at that that point.

3:33:00Um, and I do think that we have learned,

3:33:02we work to learn from those experiences.

3:33:05>> Okay. Thank you. I think I might also

3:33:08add that in addition to those uh

3:33:12development specific uh examples, we

3:33:14have uh an upcoming item that somewhat

3:33:18tackles the issue from a different

3:33:20perspective which is the relative role

3:33:22of payback the pedestrian and bicycle

3:33:24advisory uh committee uh as it relates

3:33:28to PTC and transportation issues. So,

3:33:32uh, I think as we address that issue,

3:33:34it'll also provide an opportunity to

3:33:36take a broader perspective on on what

3:33:38are the topics that that are coming to

3:33:40each of these commissions. And I I'll

3:33:42just say that, you know, with the 20%

3:33:45growth in housing that we're planning

3:33:47for, that is transformative, not only

3:33:50from a planning standpoint, but that is

3:33:52going to have major transportation

3:33:54impacts. So if anything that the need

3:33:58for integrating those two functions is

3:34:01greater than ever. Thank you

3:34:05>> council member Rectal.

3:34:06>> Okay.

3:34:07>> Yeah. Thank you.

3:34:09I'm very interested in project golden

3:34:11nine. The one that uh is trying to

3:34:13shrink the time it takes to run things

3:34:15through PTC. I'm sorry. Run things

3:34:17through PTC. Includes the techn

3:34:20potential of technology including but

3:34:22not limited to technology use. So what

3:34:25portion of the duration are you trying

3:34:27to shrink? Is it before it gets to the

3:34:29PTC? Is it the turnaround? Is it on the

3:34:32way to council? What what do we

3:34:35anticipate?

3:34:35>> I think in terms of technology, there's

3:34:38things like receiving public comments at

3:34:41the same time, right? As as the public

3:34:43comments arrive in the inbox. That's one

3:34:45element of technology. But things for AI

3:34:48as we often have to go back to the last

3:34:51time a project was discussed at council

3:34:54or at um PTC itself or at ARB or

3:34:58somewhere else. We think that AI could

3:35:00be very helpful in terms of providing

3:35:02summaries for us and save staff time and

3:35:06commissioner time for that. It's and

3:35:09it's particularly important now that we

3:35:11have summary minutes only um that don't

3:35:15give all the context because oftentimes

3:35:17in a commission it's this discussion

3:35:20leading up to the motion that's actually

3:35:22the most valuable thing rather than the

3:35:24motion itself. Um and so that's where we

3:35:27think that it could

3:35:29help both in terms of staff time

3:35:31preparing packets but also in terms of

3:35:33reducing churn or making sure that we

3:35:36understand the issues that were actually

3:35:39discussed and that every subsequent body

3:35:41understands. Um so that's kind of what

3:35:45we were thinking

3:35:46>> and right now we can do that in

3:35:48parallel. Do we just not have the staff

3:35:50to do that in parallel?

3:35:52Is this a cost savings or is it schedule

3:35:54savings? If we can automate,

3:35:57>> if I could ask for clarification of

3:35:59which part of

3:36:01>> talking about when you're second time

3:36:03around and you're summarizing what

3:36:05happened last time, if you could shrink

3:36:08that down and and make that happen

3:36:09faster, that could have that could help

3:36:11your schedule. But that only helps your

3:36:14schedule if it's serial. If you have

3:36:16three people working in parallel now

3:36:20having one of them work less doesn't

3:36:22change the total schedule.

3:36:25>> Correct.

3:36:26>> Yeah. So, uh the ability to shorten the

3:36:30time only helps you if it's doing

3:36:32serial. So, do we anticipate that this

3:36:34is going to be a schedule savings or

3:36:36just more of a cost savings?

3:36:39>> It isn't something that staff has has

3:36:41looked into in terms of what the details

3:36:43are, what the capacity are. Um, we

3:36:46continue as it is one of the objectives

3:36:48of the the city council looking for

3:36:51timesaving and efficiency opportunities.

3:36:56>> These ideas are not fully fleshed out in

3:36:58any way. It's just things that we

3:37:00thought might potentially improve our

3:37:02process.

3:37:03>> Yeah. No, I think it's really good to

3:37:04think about this because if you don't

3:37:06think about it, you keep on doing the

3:37:07same mistakes over and over again. So,

3:37:09okay. Thank you,

3:37:11>> Council Lou.

3:37:13>> Thank you. Uh,

3:37:16I appreciate that the bike pet plan uh

3:37:19is sort of done or at least hit that

3:37:22first milestone of actually getting

3:37:24approved. I'm curious, do we think there

3:37:27are opportunities or adjustments we

3:37:28could or should still make to make bike

3:37:31ped safety and accessibility more

3:37:34explicit? Because uh I appreciate some

3:37:38of it will be captured in area plans,

3:37:39but it's not super explicit right now.

3:37:41And I would love for the PTC in general

3:37:43to make progress on vision zero uh every

3:37:46year. Um so how do we think about this

3:37:49and

3:37:50>> well I think that we have brought some

3:37:52of this up um you know both when the

3:37:55safe streets for all plan as well as the

3:37:58bike ped plan were at the commission. We

3:38:01asked staff if these efforts have been

3:38:05funded and so they said that needs to

3:38:07come back to council. So in terms of

3:38:09making progress on the actual priorities

3:38:11that are outlined in both of these

3:38:13plans, it would require council action

3:38:15for those specific things to happen.

3:38:17However, I think there is kind of like

3:38:20overall process improvements that can be

3:38:22made. And again not fleshed out but I

3:38:25have heard commissioners talk in the

3:38:27past about okay so when a project comes

3:38:29through the planning department there's

3:38:31a certain checklist that has to be

3:38:34checked and part of that might be to

3:38:37consult against safe routs to school for

3:38:39example or consult against certain other

3:38:41things. So there there could be um in

3:38:44that checklist a point at which ex you

3:38:47know we explicitly have to or staff has

3:38:50to explicitly

3:38:52invest investigate uh traffic safety.

3:38:57Okay.

3:38:59>> I could add as well um at the planning

3:39:02and transportation commission's last

3:39:04meeting, they had two different

3:39:05transportation safety related items that

3:39:08they discussed and made recommendations

3:39:11on. The um improvements on Bryant Street

3:39:15and the South PaloAlto. So they're um

3:39:19they continue to then support and review

3:39:21and provide input and recommendations on

3:39:24the projects that came out of that plan

3:39:26>> and other plans.

3:39:28>> And to the extent that we've already

3:39:29funded things like quick build and

3:39:30daylighting and additional staff and

3:39:32planning additional projects and things

3:39:34like that that's just going to come but

3:39:36is not explicitly in the work plan and I

3:39:38guess we're okay with that.

3:39:40We would love for it to be more

3:39:42explicitly in the work plan, but I think

3:39:44again maybe the point that council

3:39:46member Burke mentioned, I think there

3:39:48might need to be a little bit more

3:39:49integration. Um, you know, we have two

3:39:53different departments and it there just

3:39:56might need to be a little bit more

3:39:58integration.

3:39:59>> Okay.

3:40:01One thought I' or one open thought that

3:40:03I'd appreciate some feedback on on the

3:40:06topic of how to keep things moving. I

3:40:07think this agreement between the council

3:40:09and PTC is going to happen and totally

3:40:11expected and totally reasonable. But

3:40:13there are cases like the Crescent Park

3:40:15traffic caling project or ADU condoation

3:40:18where there's

3:40:21some delay before it gets council or

3:40:23maybe some like back and forth. So how

3:40:24do you do you have any thoughts on how

3:40:27we can sort of pull that faster and work

3:40:30through disagreements faster and things

3:40:31like that? I don't know that those the

3:40:34delay is ever caused by disagreement

3:40:37that I think it's due to if I understand

3:40:39correctly and assistant director Armory

3:40:41you can help me um speak about this but

3:40:44it's about staff time and when they have

3:40:49the resources to be able to have

3:40:51completed something and then bring it to

3:40:53the next stage. So

3:40:56like if there's a gap in,

3:40:58>> you know, between the time that PTC

3:41:00heard the

3:41:01>> Crescent Park traffic coming for

3:41:03example, and then the time it goes to

3:41:04council, there's quite a long gap. I

3:41:06think staff was working on things during

3:41:08that time.

3:41:09>> Okay.

3:41:09>> It wasn't because our decision was

3:41:11different from city councils.

3:41:14There was in that particular instance

3:41:16there was actually I think some

3:41:19communication confusion actually

3:41:22um in which staff said there was

3:41:24unanimous approval of something for

3:41:27which there wasn't and that you know it

3:41:29just got jammed up that way.

3:41:30>> Yeah. But there's also just time in

3:41:33between say PTC and staff uh and council

3:41:37and I don't have a lot of visibility

3:41:40into what that is but I do know that

3:41:42staff's working during that time.

3:41:44>> Right. And I mean I think council did

3:41:48approve what was pretty similar to what

3:41:51PTC saw and also requested to come back

3:41:53to PTC. But uh totally understand maybe

3:41:56that's something that uh we talk more

3:41:59offline about or we figure out with

3:42:01staff

3:42:04and yeah

3:42:06>> council member Lowing.

3:42:08>> Uh thanks very much. Obviously you can

3:42:10see from the comments that number nine

3:42:12was a good ad. Glad that you guys put

3:42:14that in there. Uh, one of the items that

3:42:16you brought up is something I was going

3:42:17to bring up, so it's on the table, which

3:42:19is the thought of having some of the

3:42:22unanimous decisions made by PTC come

3:42:25automatically to us on the consent

3:42:27calendar. Um, I started that discussion

3:42:29about six years ago talking to a couple

3:42:31of former council members here and it's

3:42:33still on the table. So, maybe it is a

3:42:35good idea. um we might decide that

3:42:38there's certain kind of things that we

3:42:40would want you to do or not do or we

3:42:42might say take bring it all on consent

3:42:45because we could take it off anyway. Um

3:42:47clearly there are some that are going to

3:42:48be you know big issues in the community

3:42:50that we we will want to talk about. So

3:42:53we can figure that process out. But do

3:42:55you feel like that's what the most of

3:42:58the commissioners are feeling right now?

3:42:59That

3:43:00>> I think the commission does wonder, you

3:43:02know, if there's something that 70 why

3:43:05it would get turned around um if we've

3:43:08spent all the time evaluating it, you

3:43:11know, something that's very clearly not

3:43:13controversial to the commission.

3:43:15>> Yeah. And your and your comments there

3:43:17that it would be a reduced load on

3:43:18council is very appealing to all seven

3:43:20of us, I'm sure. So uh if there's a way

3:43:22we could do that and still you know do

3:43:24the people's business in the right way I

3:43:25I'm very receptive to that. So um

3:43:30similarly with the idea of having some

3:43:32sort of a a liaison that's more of an

3:43:35information conduit not necessarily

3:43:37sitting at two meetings a month for four

3:43:40hours each. Um that doesn't seem like a

3:43:43big ask. It's just it is another

3:43:45responsibility for another council

3:43:47member.

3:43:47Um, but I I also I think that's really

3:43:52>> I mean the situation right now is that

3:43:54it happens informally. In other words,

3:43:56certain commissioners know certain

3:43:58council members better than other ones

3:44:00do. And so we're using those informal

3:44:02relationships to communicate. But there

3:44:04are some commissioners who don't really

3:44:05know any of the council members well.

3:44:07And if somebody is specified, I think

3:44:09it'll make it easier for that th you

3:44:11know those relationships to form and

3:44:14also for communication to happen.

3:44:17Okay. Thanks,

3:44:21>> Council Member Rectal.

3:44:22>> A quick followup. How do we choose

3:44:24what's on consent? Like when I was on

3:44:25parks in Iraq, if it was 70, a park

3:44:28improvement ordinance would go straight

3:44:30to consent. And if it was not 70, then

3:44:33it would actually show up.

3:44:36Uh is that just a commission by

3:44:38commission or is that

3:44:38>> Well, I had actually not heard or don't

3:44:40remember that protocol. Um sounds like a

3:44:43good one. Yeah,

3:44:44>> perhaps this one we can uh uh use as a

3:44:46as a baseline and vary from there.

3:44:49>> It was a long time ago, so maybe things

3:44:51have changed, but I I agree. I thought

3:44:53it was a good idea. Okay.

3:44:58>> All right. Well, thank you very much.

3:45:00Appreciate you coming tonight.

3:45:02>> All right. And I think we're on to our

3:45:04final uh commission for the evening. Uh

3:45:07the Utilities Advisory Commission.

3:45:11>> Good evening, everyone. Um, I apologize

3:45:13that I am not able to make it in person,

3:45:15but I'm grateful for the opportunity to

3:45:18come here and um, share the UAC work

3:45:21plan. Um, my name is Megan M. I'm the

3:45:24chair of the utilities advisory

3:45:25commission this year and I'm here to

3:45:28introduce the UAC's work plan for fiscal

3:45:30year 2027.

3:45:32I will start out by just saying that the

3:45:34UAC um, sits in a difficult position.

3:45:37the in the issues that sit in front of

3:45:40us are both technically complex and they

3:45:42carry real consequences for the city.

3:45:46We'll be reviewing reserve policies,

3:45:48capital financing policies, um a gas

3:45:51transition study, grid modernization,

3:45:53communitywide electrification, etc.,

3:45:56etc. U we also have wrestled with our

3:45:59position as an advisory body. Um, we

3:46:02understand that our role is to answer

3:46:04the policy questions that are in front

3:46:06of the city and to give you

3:46:07recommendations that you can act on. Um,

3:46:10oversight of staff and day-to-day

3:46:12utility operations rest with the um

3:46:16director of the utilities and and the

3:46:17city manager. Um, and so we try to

3:46:20preserve our work and and focus that

3:46:22more on the policy side um rather than

3:46:25on on day-to-day activities. Uh the

3:46:28final thing I will note is that our work

3:46:30plan is long. Um and as you may may

3:46:32notice um it's numbered in a um less

3:46:35than logical manner. Uh those numbers

3:46:38reflect only the order in which we uh

3:46:41considered them as a um committee and do

3:46:45not uh represent any sort of

3:46:48prioritization. Um instead we have tried

3:46:52to um after the fact organize them for

3:46:56easier ingestion and and also uh

3:47:00differentiate them um by utility. Um so

3:47:03as I walk through it, it would be

3:47:05helpful to hear where council most

3:47:07values our input um so that we can focus

3:47:10our time most substantially there. Um

3:47:13I'll start briefly with the items that

3:47:15cut across five utilities um because

3:47:17those are really the core of our work um

3:47:20year in and year out. Uh we will as

3:47:23usual recommend um FY uh 2020 uh 8 rate

3:47:28changes for each utility um with

3:47:30affordability as a priority and we'll

3:47:32advise on a new cost of service study

3:47:35for water. Uh the rate recommendations

3:47:38um depend on reserve policies and using

3:47:41the Baker Tilly's assessment um we will

3:47:44recommend reserve levels that preserve

3:47:47the city's access to credit markets

3:47:48while keeping rates affordable. We will

3:47:51also recommend uh the FY 2028 and 5-year

3:47:56capital improvement plans. Uh the main

3:47:58questions there are how quickly to pace

3:48:01projects um and how much to finance debt

3:48:04uh with debt versus um you know using

3:48:07our current uh reserves. Uh that's

3:48:10particularly uh of importance in the

3:48:13electric uh utility and in the

3:48:15wastewater uh utilities. Um two other

3:48:19crosscutting items uh connect directly

3:48:21to council's climate goals. Um we will

3:48:24advise um on funding strategies for the

3:48:28um SCAP uh sustainability and climate

3:48:30action plan um including revisions to

3:48:33the um carbon neutral and cabin invest

3:48:36spending resolutions. Um and we will

3:48:38recommend reliability, resiliency and

3:48:40emergency preparedness goals for local

3:48:43water and power along with metrics uh

3:48:46that might be useful in tracking them um

3:48:48as well as in communicating uh their

3:48:51impact across the city. Uh throughout

3:48:53the year, we will also bring you

3:48:55recommended um positions on local state

3:48:59uh local state and federal uh

3:49:01legislation and review consumer uh

3:49:04survey results and any new um engagement

3:49:07efforts uh such as electrification

3:49:11uh efficacy um etc. Uh the electric

3:49:17utility um is where you'll notice kind

3:49:20of the bulk of our activity this year. U

3:49:24part of that is uh really understanding

3:49:27where and how our loads are going to

3:49:29grow um in the future that relates to

3:49:33conversations that council has had

3:49:34related to data centers. Um alongside

3:49:38that, we will have conversations about

3:49:40whether there's value in having um an

3:49:42expanded E7 rate uh as well as

3:49:45opportunities to uh continue to roll out

3:49:49um time of use uh rates across the city

3:49:52in a broader way. Uh for fiber, we're

3:49:54going to be evaluating the performance

3:49:56of the fiber the premises pilot um and

3:50:00really understanding the financial model

3:50:01there. Um and for gas, we will be

3:50:04reviewing progress um on the the whole

3:50:07range of legal, regulatory, economic and

3:50:11operational questions um associated with

3:50:13either gas system transitioning or or

3:50:16decommissioning. Um for water, there's

3:50:20an upcoming joint study session, so

3:50:22we'll have an opportunity to dig in

3:50:24quite a bit more there. But um more

3:50:27broadly we'll be recommending council

3:50:29position on um actions related to SFPU

3:50:33water policy and kind of the list goes

3:50:36on. Um I want to be conscious of time

3:50:39but um do mention that I you know this

3:50:43is a lot of work before us and um

3:50:46several of those items are not uh you

3:50:50know they they have to occur annually um

3:50:52they're not optional. Um so those will

3:50:54certainly take priority but beyond that

3:50:56we would value your guidance. Uh and if

3:50:59there are any items on which you

3:51:00especially need analysis um we will

3:51:04definitely make sure that those um are

3:51:06prioritized before other optional items.

3:51:08Thank you and happy to take questions.

3:51:12>> Thank you very much. Uh we appreciate it

3:51:14and yeah there's such a wide portfolio

3:51:17you have here uh of highly technical

3:51:19things. We really appreciate your

3:51:21support because we are the only city

3:51:23council that has to set rates and so uh

3:51:26having that support is key. Um

3:51:31so I'm I'm going to uh skip that uh the

3:51:34the harder more technical part uh for

3:51:37the moment as often usually I'm

3:51:38interacting with you on that. Um on the

3:51:41last one here um review customer survey

3:51:44results, communication methods and new

3:51:47initiatives for the year. Do you feel

3:51:50that as a commission you are getting um

3:51:54the feedback from the community that's

3:51:57uh sufficient and to to help you in your

3:52:00task of advising us or um you know what

3:52:02what's good about it? What else might we

3:52:04do uh that might help you more?

3:52:07>> Yeah, I think that's a great question.

3:52:09Um the customer survey results uh that

3:52:13are conducted um are part of an

3:52:16oversampling of um our community in

3:52:20particular relative to um what I

3:52:23understand to be kind of a baseline

3:52:25assessment of utilities across the

3:52:27board. Uh Terry can help me out if I'm

3:52:31misspeaking in any way. U but I I do

3:52:34think that we also rely heavily on uh

3:52:39the commissioners themselves uh as of

3:52:42earpieces for the community um as well

3:52:45as public comment. So would continue to

3:52:48encourage u direct participation um in

3:52:53in public comment. uh we we do process a

3:52:57lot of that uh particularly offline but

3:53:00uh really pay attention to that as a as

3:53:03a committee. Uh and I would say that

3:53:06things that council hears um we don't

3:53:10always get brought back to us very

3:53:14directly. And so if there is uh an

3:53:17opportunity to um help us again

3:53:21prioritize what it is that we're working

3:53:23on, um that could be a particularly

3:53:25valuable way to to do that.

3:53:30>> Yeah, thank you. It would be interesting

3:53:32to kind of noodle through how how best

3:53:35to get that information through to you.

3:53:38Um

3:53:41and in terms of the um the fiber utility

3:53:44uh or it talks about um

3:53:47review the pilot results and the KPIs to

3:53:50recommend next steps. Um,

3:53:54can you I know you mentioned that a

3:53:55little bit in your comments, but in

3:53:57terms of um timeline and expectations

3:53:59for how far through that you can get

3:54:01this year, how would you describe that?

3:54:06>> The

3:54:07intent is for the phase one pilot um to

3:54:12be complete and fully analyzed this year

3:54:16so that we can advise on this next

3:54:20phase. I would say that there is debate

3:54:24over the scope and value of the pilot

3:54:28itself. Um both the

3:54:32location of the pilot. um whether that

3:54:35pilot was intended only to demonstrate

3:54:37technical capacity versus um financial

3:54:41viability um is you know very much um an

3:54:47an ongoing source of discussion by the

3:54:50uh UAC. So I, you know, I I don't expect

3:54:53this to be um a simple item to get

3:54:56through and I frankly expect there to be

3:55:00um a lot of back and forth um both

3:55:04within the committee and then ultimately

3:55:06uh hopefully that discussion informing

3:55:08your own decision um as council.

3:55:13>> Got it. Yeah, thank you. That's that's

3:55:14very helpful. Um yeah, no interesting.

3:55:17I'm sure that you know the pilot as a

3:55:20sample space and what all you can draw

3:55:22from that or not would be a component of

3:55:24uh trying to sort out how how much it

3:55:27helps us. Yeah.

3:55:28>> Well, and I think also, you know, as as

3:55:31mayor and and council, the the purpose

3:55:34of um launching a fiber to the premises

3:55:38utility um has not always been

3:55:42completely clear to the UAC. Um you

3:55:46might want to operate a fiber utility um

3:55:50and particularly a fiber to the premises

3:55:52utility for many different reasons. And

3:55:56understanding why um we are launching

3:56:00this would help us um evaluate both the

3:56:05the KPIs that we should be prioritizing

3:56:07as well as um whether we are meeting the

3:56:10goals,

3:56:12>> right? And it's a little bit of a

3:56:13chicken and egg too because depending on

3:56:15what you learn or why might change. So

3:56:17anyway, that's very very helpful. Um

3:56:20colleagues, any other questions for uh

3:56:25chair matter?

3:56:28I think we're worn out. Um

3:56:32I guess not. So uh thank you very much.

3:56:34Appreciate you uh joining us this

3:56:36evening. And uh I guess we'll we'll wrap

3:56:39up this one as well. So,

3:56:43those are all of the commissions that we

3:56:45have. Um, so before we uh go to any

3:56:49motions that modify it, let's uh let's

3:56:52go to public comment on this item. Uh,

3:56:55Madame Clerk,

3:56:58we have three requests to speak and our

3:57:00first speaker is Henry E.

3:57:03Very good.

3:57:09I would first like to suggest that

3:57:12there's a disconnect when the public

3:57:14comments are separated from the initial

3:57:16discussion of the item and it would be

3:57:18better for the public if they could hear

3:57:21the public comments together with the

3:57:24item. Uh the

3:57:27city manager tells me that he is the one

3:57:29responsible for that disconnected

3:57:31agenda. I leave that to you to draw

3:57:33conclusions as to his uh capabilities.

3:57:37Maybe it's his part of his job to

3:57:38obscure. In that case, he's doing a good

3:57:40job. But if it's to make things

3:57:42connected, it's not a good way. Now,

3:57:46where to start? Well, nobody's asked me,

3:57:49Henry, why were you going to Brazil?

3:57:53Well, I'm not going to answer because

3:57:56that would take time.

3:57:58So, instead, I want to go directly to

3:58:00the historic commission who's very

3:58:03concerned about buildings. Buildings.

3:58:08But the more important thing than

3:58:10buildings are people. The people who

3:58:14develop those technological ideas and

3:58:17realize them and preserving their

3:58:21memories.

3:58:23So I realized that while she was

3:58:26talking,

3:58:29I'm an historical artifact.

3:58:32I was an entrepreneur here in the 70s. I

3:58:37came out here to develop solar photoics

3:58:40technology, a company called Consumers

3:58:43Solar Electric Power that partnered with

3:58:46the photoics research institute at

3:58:49Stanford. That institute no longer

3:58:51exists. Although I happened to run into

3:58:54a former uh person from it at a meeting

3:58:57of the D school uh some couple of years

3:59:00ago and we went out to uh uh that

3:59:03classic uh venture capitalist uh hangout

3:59:06in uh in Menllo Park to remiss.

3:59:09Okay. So what was I doing this past

3:59:12week? the the project the previous

3:59:15project was to uh develop third

3:59:18generation photoics

3:59:20vacuum deposition on a substrate that

3:59:23hadn't been done with photoics but it's

3:59:25a well-known technology

3:59:27but silicon silicon is inherently

3:59:29polluting technology

3:59:32we didn't worry about that at that time

3:59:34but now we're worried about it what was

3:59:36I doing last week I was working on a new

3:59:40startup and more than a startup a plan

3:59:43to bring

3:59:45resources together from Brazil, Russia,

3:59:49China, and the new Confederacy. That's

3:59:52what I call California, Michigan, and

3:59:55New York. Because our national

3:59:57government is opposed to renewable

3:59:59energy. And depending on how the

4:00:01election turns out in the next few days

4:00:03in Brazil, Brazil may be opposed to it.

4:00:07So my ch I was charged with raising

4:00:09funds. Uh and so it's the usual kind of

4:00:12>> your time is up.

4:00:13>> Okay, I leave you with that.

4:00:15>> Our next speaker is Martin B.

4:00:17>> Hope it intrigues you. They ask me

4:00:19further.

4:00:29>> Thank you, Mayor and Council. Um picking

4:00:32up on um um um council member Bert's

4:00:36comment about when visitors come uh to

4:00:39to Palo Alto. So during my I do um

4:00:42historic walking tours professorville

4:00:44downtown and uh one of the things that I

4:00:47find my uh European friends are pretty

4:00:51amazed about is um we go past the homes

4:00:55of um the founders and CEOs of Google,

4:01:00Apple, Yahoo, HP, Facebook, Barry. I

4:01:03mean they're they're right here. So

4:01:05they're they're kind of amazed that

4:01:06they're all right here. Um and the other

4:01:08thing that I talk about during these um

4:01:10uh tours is that we talk about historic

4:01:13regulations

4:01:15and my comment is any regulation that

4:01:19four out of seven council members uh

4:01:21make into enacted into law uh the

4:01:24regulations are based on cultural value.

4:01:27So if it's a cultural value then it

4:01:29becomes an ordinance. If it's not a

4:01:30cultural value then it won't be. So um

4:01:34so how does a cultural value become

4:01:38strong enough so that it becomes a so it

4:01:41becomes into a regulation and one

4:01:43example is uh one thing I promoted when

4:01:47I was president of past was that how do

4:01:50we bring the idea of historic

4:01:52preservation into the stu into schools

4:01:55because the schools represent this the

4:01:58owners of the the future owners of

4:02:00historic buildings. So if it becomes

4:02:02part of their ethic that historic

4:02:04preservation is a cultural value um they

4:02:07become eventually voters and then also

4:02:10property owners. So that's how I think

4:02:12the um if there's some way uh children

4:02:15can be introduced the idea of historic

4:02:17value that they become the next property

4:02:19owners. Um uh Chair Willis talked about

4:02:23the Mills Act. I'm certainly in favor of

4:02:25having Mills Act as a de e economic

4:02:28incentive. But one reason past councils

4:02:30have not endorsed that is because if

4:02:33there's a property tax that can be

4:02:35reduced by 90% then the school lobby

4:02:38gets involved. So I think in Redwood

4:02:40City, San Francisco, they have the Mills

4:02:41Act where council members or a council

4:02:45can decide instead of a 90% reduction in

4:02:48taxes, make it I mean 5%, you know, so

4:02:51it's just so that it's not a such a big

4:02:53ticket item. Um but I mean I mean

4:02:56$10,000 goes toward historic president

4:02:59anyway. So just modify it. So that could

4:03:01be a way to to do it. So um going back

4:03:05to the idea as uh young students get

4:03:09involved in history and I don't know if

4:03:11if the uh schools are teaching that

4:03:13perhaps the vice mayor would have more

4:03:15information about if what's the value of

4:03:17historic um history in in the school

4:03:20systems right now. But when those

4:03:22students if they start um thinking about

4:03:24the idea of the value of historic stuff

4:03:26well as they get older they became

4:03:29voters and they also may become

4:03:31homeowners which means they become tax

4:03:33which means they become taxpayers. So I

4:03:36think that's a good way to follow the

4:03:37money. Thank you.

4:03:38>> Our next speaker is Jean B.

4:03:43>> Jean B. Moving to our next speaker

4:03:45Raymond G.

4:03:51Uh good evening and um if I do speak off

4:03:53topic, please stop me because I don't

4:03:55know if I'm going be on topic or not. Um

4:03:56I want to address the uh what I've heard

4:03:59today from the residing commission

4:04:01chairs of our board of commissions. um

4:04:04specifically the planning and

4:04:05transportation commission. Um as I was

4:04:08listening to commissioner speaks um

4:04:11several things to me

4:04:14stood out which was there seemed to be a

4:04:17problem in the streamlining process from

4:04:19the planning commission standpoint and

4:04:21the problem has been there um since

4:04:24we've had this the current planning

4:04:25commissioner and they they didn't seem

4:04:28or there wasn't a need or desire to fix

4:04:30a problem when they were there. Um, for

4:04:34me as a city resident, I kind of lose

4:04:37faith in in a system that has people in

4:04:39leadership that acknowledges there's a

4:04:41problem and are not and is not

4:04:43addressing the problem when they're in a

4:04:45position to do so, but yet are drafting

4:04:47policies and making recommendations on a

4:04:50on a on a platform that is inherently

4:04:53flawed.

4:04:55Um,

4:04:56we are we want a city that is running

4:04:59efficiency efficiently. We want a city

4:05:01that is using its wealth appropriately

4:05:03and we want we want a city that is using

4:05:05its prestige precisely so that way every

4:05:07resident in Palato is um represented and

4:05:10taken care of. But when you are sitting

4:05:13on a commission and are the lead and you

4:05:15acknowledge there are flaws in the

4:05:17commissions and things need to be fixed

4:05:18but you are in position to fix them and

4:05:21you don't. Um I think as a resident I am

4:05:24concerned with that position as our

4:05:26commission chairs. I think we need our

4:05:29commission chairs when they have a

4:05:30problem that could be fixed and should

4:05:32be fixed. Um they should take the

4:05:34initiative as being the chairpersons the

4:05:36leader in our commission to fix a

4:05:38problem so that way the city council

4:05:39don't have to worry about it. There's a

4:05:41reason why we appoint people in these

4:05:43positions. It's for them to make sure

4:05:44that when it gets to city council all

4:05:46the problems have been ironed out and we

4:05:48can trust that the decision process that

4:05:50is being made to get to us is the right

4:05:52one. Um it is my opinion that the

4:05:55chairperson Chang is um did not do that

4:05:58in this process and she is so much

4:06:00acknowledged and did so in front of us

4:06:02and everybody else. She's acknowledged

4:06:03that there's a problem that there's a

4:06:05discourse between planning and

4:06:07transportation and it does need to be

4:06:09fixed. My question would be to her was

4:06:11why didn't you fix it when you were

4:06:12there?

4:06:14Um she she gave a statement to the city

4:06:16council while wearing a campaign badge

4:06:19of her running for city council and that

4:06:22is an endorsement of what we will get

4:06:24when she gets there which will be a city

4:06:26council member who will see a problem

4:06:28who and they won't fix it when it's

4:06:30addressed.

4:06:32Um, we need an effective city council,

4:06:35whether it's me or somebody else, but we

4:06:37need a city council that represents

4:06:39everybody effectively and won't see a

4:06:42problem and just bypass it as if it's

4:06:44nothing and do nothing to correct it. We

4:06:46need oversight and oversight starts

4:06:48within us first. Thank you.

4:06:51>> Our next speaker is Aram J.

4:06:56>> Okay. So, what stood out for me, what

4:06:59stood out for me tonight is that it's

4:07:02outrageous

4:07:03that Breina Chang came up with a button

4:07:08saying Bina Chang for city council.

4:07:10Okay? And that at least at least four of

4:07:16her supporters are on the city council

4:07:18openly endorsing her for city council.

4:07:21And at least three of those four,

4:07:24Keith Rectal, Ed Lowing, and Pat Bert,

4:07:28asked extraordinarily softball

4:07:30questions. It's like she got free time

4:07:33to campaign and to look good in response

4:07:36to setup softball questions. And I think

4:07:39it's outrageous. You all should have

4:07:41called her

4:07:43after the election. Now, you might want

4:07:46to speak with your city attorney, who I

4:07:48have confidence in. and I met him

4:07:49tonight and we chatted whether you have

4:07:52now put us in a position where each of

4:07:54the other candidates should now be given

4:07:58equal time to present for four or five

4:08:01minutes before the city council.

4:08:03Absolutely outrageous that you've done

4:08:04this. You knew what you were doing. You

4:08:07could have easily put it over her talk

4:08:10until after the election. Why didn't you

4:08:12do that? I'm hopeful that uh Raymond

4:08:15Goins and Henry Henry E and all the

4:08:19other candidates uh for city council

4:08:22that except for you know come on Ed

4:08:25Lowing. I don't I don't see that. I mean

4:08:27he he blasted one of the other

4:08:30candidates uh in his latest uh thing.

4:08:33Clearly an attempt to to to uh support

4:08:37Brea. This is just absolutely

4:08:40unconscionable. I don't know if the

4:08:42press is going to pick up on it, but

4:08:44certainly, Madame Mayor, I know that

4:08:47you're a fair-minded person. Um, and

4:08:49you're running for election, too. Uh,

4:08:52you're not supporting her openly. I

4:08:53don't know what you're who you're

4:08:55supporting uh for that pos uh

4:08:58[clears throat] for that fifth third

4:08:59position. But the point is, you all

4:09:02should have thought about this. This was

4:09:04not unconscious. This was a setup. It

4:09:07was all done to give her a little bit of

4:09:10extra time.

4:09:11uh to speak and to basically campaign

4:09:14and she put that button on there. That's

4:09:16that's really outrageous. She was

4:09:18supposed to be put over until after

4:09:22November 3rd and you all know that. And

4:09:24now somebody needs to remedy it.

4:09:27Somebody needs to remedy it. You all are

4:09:30trying to stack the deck. uh at least

4:09:33four of you

4:09:35because you want all four

4:09:39right-wing supremacists on the council,

4:09:41all preservationists, okay, to stack the

4:09:44to stack the deck. Uh so we don't have a

4:09:47a a diverse council with diverse points

4:09:50of view. Outrageous stacking the deck.

4:09:53How do you feel about that? Candidates,

4:09:56please ask for equal time. Thank you.

4:09:59And that concludes public comment on

4:10:01action item 10.

4:10:02>> All right. Thank you. Um, so the staff

4:10:05recommendation is uh for approval of

4:10:08these uh various uh commission 2027 work

4:10:12plans. So I would entertain a motion and

4:10:14if you have amendments or things that

4:10:16you would like to see changed, now would

4:10:17be the time.

4:10:22Although I didn't hear a lot about

4:10:24change during our talk.

4:10:29Oh, I'm sorry.

4:10:32Oh, you turned on your mic. So, that's

4:10:34okay. So, here's the thing. When you

4:10:36turn on your mic, the number goes away.

4:10:38>> So, I didn't realize that was But please

4:10:40go ahead. You are first. Council member

4:10:42Lowing.

4:10:45>> I move the staff motion.

4:10:48>> Thank you.

4:10:49>> Second.

4:10:50>> Thank you. All right. Is there any

4:10:51further discussion? Council member Bert.

4:10:54Yeah, I want to return to this issue of

4:10:58uh transportation department um

4:11:01engagement on the PTC. I I realize here

4:11:04we have the director of planning, the

4:11:06assistant director of planning here at

4:11:07this meeting and no one from

4:11:09transportation here to my knowledge. And

4:11:12despite the reassurances we received, I

4:11:14think we still have a problem. I'm glad

4:11:16to hear that there's some recognition of

4:11:18it, but um I think that um the u the

4:11:23ongoing problem has been greater than

4:11:26was characterized. Um but it's not

4:11:29technically part of the PTC work plan to

4:11:33make that happen. It's really direction

4:11:35to staff to make sure they support the

4:11:37PTC with transportation. So I'm a little

4:11:41at a loss on how to incorporate that in

4:11:44the motion tonight. and city manager, do

4:11:47you have any uh feedback?

4:11:52>> Well, again, uh responding a bit on the

4:11:54fly here, but I do uh agree with you

4:11:57that it seems somewhat separate from the

4:11:59issue that is in front of the council

4:12:02this evening. So perhaps we could take

4:12:04that as a referral to address this issue

4:12:06separately uh back with the council.

4:12:09>> I'm good with that. Thank you.

4:12:13>> All right. Thank you. Seeing no further

4:12:16requests to speak, um, let's call the

4:12:19roll.

4:12:22Oh, wait. We don't do that. We just push

4:12:24our buttons. Okay, let's vote.

4:12:26[laughter]

4:12:28It takes some getting used to.

4:12:33>> Green button.

4:12:34>> There's two green buttons. Got it.

4:12:38There's a red button over here. It's got

4:12:54motion carries.

4:12:57>> All right. Thank you very much. We're

4:12:58we're getting the hang of our new tech

4:13:01here. Um so anyway, thank you to all of

4:13:03the uh board and commission uh chairs

4:13:06who uh were with us tonight and to staff

4:13:08to help us get through those work plans.

4:13:10Uh we will close that item.

4:13:13All right. Moving on to our uh last uh

4:13:17item of the evening. Action item 11,

4:13:20consideration of city council positions

4:13:21on state and local measures.

4:13:26Deputy city manager Cotton Gains. Looks

4:13:28like you are up. Welcome.

4:13:31Good evening. Thank you. Shantel Cotton

4:13:33Gains, deputy city manager. Today I'm

4:13:35joined with Miss Christine Prior, our

4:13:36assistant city clerk, and she'll be

4:13:38making the presentation.

4:13:41Good evening. I do also want to note

4:13:43that Carly Shelby, the deputy director

4:13:45of towns and public affairs is on Zoom

4:13:47as well. Next slide, please.

4:13:52So, as background on this item, the city

4:13:54council council regularly hears this

4:13:56type of item in election years. The

4:13:59staff will bring forward the different

4:14:02state, local, and regional ballot

4:14:05measures that will be presented to

4:14:07PaloAlto voters. The purpose of the item

4:14:10is twofold. It is intended to provide

4:14:12information for Palo Alton to consider

4:14:15when voting and uh vote by mail ballots

4:14:18actually just started getting mailed out

4:14:20today. So, they should be arriving in

4:14:21people's mailboxes any day. The second

4:14:24purpose of the item is to provide an

4:14:26opportunity for city council to discuss

4:14:27the ballot measures and take positions

4:14:30if they so choose.

4:14:32And our staff recommendations on the

4:14:34ballot measures are based on the 2026

4:14:38legislative guidelines which city

4:14:40council adopts every January

4:14:43and previous city council action. Next

4:14:46slide please.

4:14:50So this year there are 14 statewide

4:14:53ballot measures. I will not go through

4:14:55all of them in the interest of time, but

4:14:58um Townsen,

4:15:00who are the city's uh legislative

4:15:02consultants and advocates, did prepare

4:15:06prepare a memo uh detailing each of the

4:15:08ballot measures with a summary of

4:15:10possible impacts. That's located on

4:15:12packet page 80. And in addition, um,

4:15:16just some additional context, there were

4:15:19negotiations that significantly reshaped

4:15:21the ballot. In addition to the 14

4:15:23statewide measures that made it on the

4:15:25ballot, there were six that were

4:15:27withdrawn and one measure that missed

4:15:29the signature of verification deadline.

4:15:32Next,

4:15:35staff is recommending positions on three

4:15:39propositions.

4:15:41They are Proposition 1 um which

4:15:44authorizes bonds for housing

4:15:45affordability programs,

4:15:48Proposition 37 which creates loan

4:15:51programs for middle inome buyers of

4:15:53qualified new homes and proposition 43

4:15:57which limits voters ability to raise

4:15:59revenues for government local government

4:16:02services.

4:16:03So on the right hand of the slide you

4:16:05can um see where we have drawn out the

4:16:08relevant guideline for each of these

4:16:10positions. In addition uh I do want to

4:16:13note that the human relations commission

4:16:15recommended the city council support

4:16:17proposition one. This happened at a

4:16:19special um HRC meeting that happened

4:16:22after the agenda packet for this item

4:16:25had been published.

4:16:27And um one other note we want to make on

4:16:30proposition 37 is that while we do

4:16:33recommend a support position based on

4:16:35the guidelines um it is possible that

4:16:39this measure would have a limited impact

4:16:40in PaloAlto just given the relative home

4:16:44prices in PaloAlto versus what the

4:16:46initiative would allow.

4:16:49Um

4:16:51and

4:16:54that's next slide please.

4:16:59Shifting to regional and local me

4:17:01measure local measures. There are two

4:17:03this election year. The one regional

4:17:05measure measure is the regional transit

4:17:08measure. Um city council has already

4:17:11voted to endorse this measure. They did

4:17:13that you all did that um this past

4:17:16March. And then the second measure is

4:17:19the um measure J the local measure for

4:17:22the POW community safety and services.

4:17:26And um the acquisition of innovation was

4:17:30a city council priority and city council

4:17:32voted to place this on the ballot. So we

4:17:34have that as a support position. Next,

4:17:37please.

4:17:39So to wrap up, our recommendation is um

4:17:43for the city council to review and

4:17:45discuss the ballot measures and consider

4:17:47formal positions if they so choose. And

4:17:50that concludes my presentation.

4:17:54>> All right. Well, thank you very much. Um

4:17:56so as I understand it, we are um staff

4:18:00has made the recommendations on these

4:18:02certain um propositions and measures,

4:18:04but we can take additional positions as

4:18:07the council so chooses.

4:18:08>> Correct.

4:18:08>> Right. Okay. Um I'll just kick us off

4:18:12and just say briefly that um I uh

4:18:15support the recommendations that are

4:18:17made. Um I think the uh two housing

4:18:19measures one and 37 are good. Uh I think

4:18:24uh that we absolutely should oppose the

4:18:27uh limitation on uh the uh voters's

4:18:30ability to raise the revenues for our

4:18:32local government services of Prop 43. Um

4:18:37and uh like I said, regional transit

4:18:39measure we already support and uh

4:18:41measure J I think we have individually

4:18:43endorsed. So I assume that collectively

4:18:45we will. Um but I would love to hear any

4:18:47counter views from anybody. Um what I

4:18:51wanted to do is to say is to is to add

4:18:53just a couple. I mean there's infinite

4:18:55one. Well, there's not infinite but

4:18:56there's many possibilities. Um, you

4:18:59know, I see the signs for Prop 4 and was

4:19:01at the rally this weekend that Nancy Nef

4:19:04and others and Trent and others

4:19:05organized and we and assembly member

4:19:07Alex Lee who had uh u prompted uh

4:19:11Proposition 4 was there and spoke as

4:19:13were quite a few other um uh state

4:19:16legislators. And you know, that one just

4:19:18to me makes sense because it doesn't

4:19:20require us to do anything with respect

4:19:22to public funding, but it unties our

4:19:25hands and lets us make our own choice.

4:19:27And if we want to have some kind of

4:19:30program like that, we can't right now.

4:19:33And that doesn't seem right. And there's

4:19:35a whole lot more reasons we'll probably

4:19:37hear about during public comment. But I

4:19:38would suggest that we add a support

4:19:40position for Proposition 4 to repeal the

4:19:44prohibition against public funding of

4:19:46election campaigns. Um and then also um

4:19:51for Proposition 45 that modifies

4:19:54environmental review for certain

4:19:55projects. Um, you know, as I've read

4:19:58more and learned more about this and

4:20:00discovered it really isn't about

4:20:02housing, uh, it is, um, something that

4:20:05really will just hurt our environmental

4:20:08um, uh, quality and, uh, you know,

4:20:10whether it's air quality, water quality,

4:20:12and others. And, uh, I would advocate

4:20:15for and oppose position there. I'm not

4:20:17going to say more because I suspect

4:20:18there's not a lot um, of concern about

4:20:22these. So, I will stop and if there is,

4:20:24we can address it further.

4:20:27colleagues, any do any of you have any

4:20:30thoughts or comments before we turn to

4:20:32public comment?

4:20:34Council member Bert.

4:20:36>> Um, well, is this supposed to be our

4:20:39question period or comments or what?

4:20:41>> Whatever you would like.

4:20:42>> Okay. Um, so first I agree on uh both

4:20:48Prop 4 and um um on Prop 45 that we

4:20:55would um support Prop 4 and uh oppose

4:21:02Prop 45. I think those do have

4:21:05potentially significant bearing um on

4:21:08our community. I but there are other uh

4:21:12amu propositions that um we are not uh

4:21:17staff didn't recommend a position on

4:21:19that I I am interested in um

4:21:23even for instance prop two that's an

4:21:26indirect impact on us but when we have

4:21:29boom and bust periods in our state and

4:21:32the state goes into a bus period because

4:21:34they were not allowed to have an

4:21:37adequate rainy day fund it hits us hard

4:21:40and it hits all cities hard and counties

4:21:43particular and so um I'm inclined to

4:21:47support that um because it does have a

4:21:51bearing on our community um and then um

4:21:57on

4:22:00Prop 37 and I appreciate that uh the

4:22:04direct impact on housing in our

4:22:06community may be uh fairly low, but our

4:22:12workforce of both our city staff and

4:22:16others who work in our community would

4:22:19be favorably impacted even from their

4:22:21commutes. Uh and I I think that this is

4:22:25a real crisis. It's not only, you know,

4:22:28it's not just the cost of housing that

4:22:30is such um uh a a difficult um problem

4:22:36that we have in our region. Um, but it

4:22:39is the barrier to home ownership as

4:22:42well. And if we continue to evolve into

4:22:45a region where fewer and fewer people

4:22:48and only the most elite can own uh their

4:22:51own homes, uh that is a real uh uh

4:22:56undermining of our social and economical

4:23:00economic balance. Um

4:23:03and um

4:23:06and then I the prop 39

4:23:10um I was surprised that we we are not

4:23:14listing that as an oppose and that

4:23:17really goes back to something that I

4:23:20realized some of these propositions may

4:23:23cause us to think about what we ought to

4:23:25have in our legislative guidelines that

4:23:27we don't currently have and to what

4:23:30extent just like on um Prop 4. To what

4:23:34extent do we believe that um that

4:23:38maximizing voter participation

4:23:41and democratizing elections is an

4:23:44important value for our community and

4:23:47and opposing 39

4:23:50um uh would be part of of fulfilling

4:23:53that. Um and then lastly on

4:24:00Oh, no. we got Prop 43 is covered. So

4:24:02that those were my areas that I'd

4:24:04encourage colleagues to um uh consider

4:24:08us taking positions on. Thank you.

4:24:12>> Thank you. And I I agree with you on

4:24:13opposing 39. I I just want to clarify

4:24:16just to make sure I got it right. Uh

4:24:18because I'm 37. So are you supporting

4:24:20the staff recommendation of supporting

4:24:22or was it So I think they already

4:24:26>> Oh, I I was mistaken. I didn't realize

4:24:29that I hadn't cross referenced. So, I I

4:24:32do support the staff position.

4:24:34>> Great. Okay. Thank you. Just wanted to

4:24:35clarify that.

4:24:38>> Anybody else before we go to public

4:24:39comment?

4:24:43>> Okay. Uh let's go ahead and go to public

4:24:45comment.

4:24:50We have four requests to speak. Our

4:24:52first speaker is Henry E.

4:25:03So,

4:25:05as one might reasonably infer, the uh

4:25:08number soup is designed to confuse. And

4:25:12it's hard to tell anymore when a yes is

4:25:14a no and the and the no is a yes when

4:25:17you look at the multiplicity of uh of

4:25:19propositions designed to be counter

4:25:22tools against each other. So the whole

4:25:25process designed to make sure that

4:25:27nothing happens basically.

4:25:30Okay. So within that context I happened

4:25:33to be uh at the friends I'm being

4:25:36considered from membership of friends

4:25:38and I was at the meeting to discuss just

4:25:40this very topic

4:25:42and the friends are a serious

4:25:44intellectual group and after going

4:25:46through this all

4:25:48they decided not to do anything but to

4:25:52have more discussion but they couldn't

4:25:54even decide when to set the next

4:25:55discussion. Well, that's friends. It's a

4:25:58wonderful group. I got to it from uh a

4:26:01skyam congregation where Rectal and I

4:26:05are both members. How did I get there? I

4:26:08got there because well,

4:26:11I made a prayer for peace. The rabbi

4:26:13asked me to say the prayer for peace for

4:26:15Israel. I said the prayer for Israel and

4:26:18I interjected a prayer for Palestine.

4:26:21May the two peoples live together in

4:26:23peace. And I spoke to you in the council

4:26:25about this. I asked each one of you

4:26:27individually to support a ceasefire. I

4:26:30meant absolute silence. And so I thought

4:26:32then where is the group in which you

4:26:35come up and speak from your heart and

4:26:37that is friends. So that's how I got to

4:26:39friends and from friends to Moravians a

4:26:42black church and from Moravians to

4:26:44Panvida Hispanic church. And so I am now

4:26:47religiously musical after deliberately

4:26:50avoiding religion for more than a half

4:26:53century.

4:26:54>> Could you kindly get to a ballot

4:26:55measure?

4:26:56>> The ballot measure.

4:26:57>> Oh, public funding for elections should

4:27:01be supported. California is the only

4:27:03state where it's disallowed completely.

4:27:06Now, this goes just so far as to say we

4:27:09we take away the disallow, but it

4:27:11doesn't go forward to institute it. So,

4:27:14it's totally inadequate. We must have a

4:27:17proposition that institutes it and

4:27:20eliminates private funding of elections.

4:27:23Citizens United should be eliminated.

4:27:26Instead, it's there as a fundamental

4:27:29basis of our law. Now, and on the other

4:27:32hand, I like Citizens United because

4:27:34I've sued Elon Musk and Tesla for

4:27:37polluting Matadero Creek. Their law firm

4:27:39is saying, "Henry, you're not an

4:27:42attorney. You must have an attorney to

4:27:45represent. I am standing on Citizens

4:27:48United. If Citizens United says

4:27:51corporations can give money to

4:27:53elections, then they have to be

4:27:54responsible as citizens. And so I'm

4:27:57demuring their demura. And you know what

4:27:59happened at the last uh hearing?

4:28:02The judge read off a long list numbers

4:28:05and letters

4:28:06>> which demount is saying I'm recusing

4:28:09myself.

4:28:09>> Your time is up.

4:28:10>> And I said, why yourself? Our

4:28:18next speaker is Raymond G.

4:28:26I'm also a chemist and we won't talk

4:28:27about that now either.

4:28:30Mr. guns.

4:28:40I like I support them saying uh a yes on

4:28:44four for obvious reasons as our current

4:28:46candidate race which I'm a candidate.

4:28:48The two front runners have um are buying

4:28:51a seat. They the one have raised almost

4:28:53$200,000. The other one almost raised

4:28:56$100,000,

4:28:57right? And it's um they're raising money

4:29:00astronomical numbers

4:29:02and here I am the loans candidate that

4:29:05comes from marginiz community. I'm

4:29:06saying I'm financially uh not in the

4:29:09same level they are and there the seats

4:29:12being bought and I'm being outspent um

4:29:15by 10 to one. But if I had this program

4:29:18available to me, I think the eyes were

4:29:20shift gives me a better opportunity and

4:29:23the candidate that's more equipped to

4:29:25get more visibility would be the best

4:29:27candidate to get the uh to fill the seat

4:29:29here on city council. Not only does my

4:29:31candidate and that my fellow candidates

4:29:34have raised almost $200,000, one of my

4:29:36candidates has teamed up with another

4:29:38candidate who's being endorsed and and

4:29:40is running and endorsing her. Well, who

4:29:42also has raised a significant amount of

4:29:44money. So they by his endorsement that's

4:29:47a treasure chest of two against one of

4:29:50economic wealth against somebody from

4:29:51poverty. Um the system is built to have

4:29:53equality and equity. But if we have a

4:29:55system built on equality and equity that

4:29:57means our election should be fair and

4:29:59equal to and not be both not be sold to

4:30:01the highest bidder.

4:30:03Um, all I ask is for um an equal

4:30:07opportunity

4:30:08and allow me to run and and

4:30:12campaign on the basis of my merits and

4:30:14what I am what I can bring to the city

4:30:15council. Not on what I could out raise

4:30:17out fund raise and whose friends have

4:30:19the deeper pockets. I tell a lot of

4:30:21people my friends don't have deep

4:30:22pockets. My friends are in struggle. All

4:30:24my friends are marginalized and all my

4:30:26friends are community based. They don't

4:30:28have the money to give for for campaigns

4:30:30like this and they don't have the money

4:30:31to compete with people that are

4:30:33extremely wealthy. If Pala wants

4:30:36representation of everybody, then

4:30:37everyone should have a fair election and

4:30:38how much money you raise and who your

4:30:40friends are and their economic status

4:30:42should depend or or tailor what the

4:30:44election should be.

4:30:46Um I also support and saying Prop 40. I

4:30:49think that is a a current situation that

4:30:52locally we could get because we have 19

4:30:54billionaires here in Palo Alto. We have

4:30:56a we have a a business by the name of

4:30:59Planter that last I checked was worth

4:31:01$419 billion.

4:31:03That tax and the tax revenue that they

4:31:06we could receive from that those

4:31:08companies could change Palo Alto's

4:31:10future significantly. The care project

4:31:13wouldn't be funded by taxpayers. It

4:31:15would be funded by Planteer. The

4:31:17taxpayers should be allowed to keep the

4:31:19money they required for it. The

4:31:20companies that make the money should pay

4:31:22and take care of the city in which they

4:31:24created their wealth off of. If we're

4:31:26we're first scared of the billionaires

4:31:27leaving, we are California. We made

4:31:29them. They didn't make us. We're called

4:31:31the Gon state for a reason.

4:31:33Let's not forget what California still

4:31:35buy and who we are as a state.

4:31:38We could create new billionaires.

4:31:39>> Your time is up.

4:31:40>> How can the staff of students anyways?

4:31:42>> Our next speaker is Ken H.

4:31:46>> Yes. Good evening. Um Ken Horwitz.

4:31:51I've been living in Palo Alto since 1982

4:31:54and followed all the elections over the

4:31:57years and nothing to me has been more

4:31:59important than what's going to happen

4:32:01with the Cubly site. And so

4:32:06I'm here to support Measure J and I

4:32:08really appreciate you all for taking

4:32:10your own individual time and going out

4:32:13and campaigning for Measure J. Um it is

4:32:17really important to our citizens that we

4:32:20have a community center

4:32:24um that we can be proud of that can

4:32:27support um recreation

4:32:31um

4:32:32education, arts, and community services.

4:32:36So, I'm excited you released the um

4:32:40transparency that's been asked for by

4:32:42the local newspaper and [clears throat]

4:32:46um I hope Palo Altoons and and the

4:32:49thousands of endorsers that have already

4:32:52signed up will will vote yes uh on in

4:32:56November. Thank you.

4:32:59>> Our next speaker is Remy T.

4:33:04>> Hello. Good evening, honorable city

4:33:06council. Um, I urge you to support uh

4:33:10measure uh proposition 4. This is really

4:33:13important and uh because uh there's so

4:33:17much big money in politics. I mean, this

4:33:19is the amount of uh campaign

4:33:21contributions and even schoolboard

4:33:24elections, local city council elections

4:33:26in the hundreds of thousands and in some

4:33:28cities it tops millions, billions of

4:33:31dollars. And um I mean these uh campaign

4:33:35contributions by you know big money

4:33:38interest I mean they're basically a

4:33:39bribe. You know there's a quid pro call.

4:33:42If somebody gives you a million dollar

4:33:43check you know they're going to come

4:33:45back and say you know ask you to support

4:33:48all of the things that they're wanting

4:33:51and not what may be in the best interest

4:33:53of the community. So what uh Prop 4

4:33:56allows is is uh people to raise small

4:34:00money donations and um that will be

4:34:03matched by by um public funding and it's

4:34:09up to entirely up to each city you know

4:34:12and county to decide how they want to

4:34:14fund it. So there's total freedom and

4:34:16local control on it. So it's really

4:34:18really well written measure in that

4:34:21respect. So again, you know, I support

4:34:25prop for it's really, you know, the

4:34:26heart of our democracy that um people

4:34:30that are, you know, common folk can

4:34:33actually run for positions and, you

4:34:35know, not be outspent by

4:34:38billionaires and millionaires who are

4:34:40running for these positions. And uh New

4:34:43York City, there's a great example of uh

4:34:45Mandami. he was able to um with public

4:34:49funding he was able to beat the Cuomo. I

4:34:52grew up in New York and the Cuomo name

4:34:54is you know huge name you know they're

4:34:58lifelong politicians they take money

4:35:00from big oil the Rockefellers and and

4:35:04they're very corrupt. I mean, uh, I

4:35:06think, uh, Cuomo was indicted and yet he

4:35:09still, you know, owed all this money

4:35:12and, uh, Manami is doing a really great

4:35:14job in in New York getting that city

4:35:17turned around. It's a tough job, you

4:35:20know, can do being mayor of Oakland, for

4:35:23example. You know, a lot of lot of

4:35:24issues and, you know, and they're

4:35:26finally, you know, getting around to

4:35:28turn that around. So again, you know,

4:35:31thank you for supporting this and I also

4:35:33uh concur with the gentleman um uh two

4:35:37gentleman's before that I think the city

4:35:39should support Prop 40, which is the the

4:35:41billionaires tax and oppose Prop 41 and

4:35:4542 which are in general disenously put

4:35:48on by the billionaires to undermine Prop

4:35:5140. Um this state is what the fifth

4:35:55wealthiest

4:35:56um economy in the the world. Yet you

4:35:59know we have people that can't afford

4:36:01health care, can't afford housing, and

4:36:04my kids are priced out of the bay. Your

4:36:06>> time is up.

4:36:06>> And uh so again, you know, please

4:36:08support Prop 40 as well. Thank you.

4:36:11>> Our next speaker is Nancy N.

4:36:16>> Good evening. Thank you for listening.

4:36:18Um I'm Nancy Nef. I've been working on

4:36:22public funding of elections for 20 years

4:36:24as a volunteer and that's not what I

4:36:26came up here to talk about uh because

4:36:28I'm pretty confident that people will

4:36:30support it. But I'm talking about Prop

4:36:3237 because the legal women voters

4:36:34opposes it. And I can just read read you

4:36:38some of the uh

4:36:41oh shoot I lost the page.

4:36:45Well, I'll just tell you um illegal

4:36:48women voters opposes because people will

4:36:51be helped with their down payment, but

4:36:53they won't have any help after that and

4:36:55they won't know before they go into it

4:36:57what the interest rate is going to be,

4:36:59what their monthly payments are going to

4:37:00be. So, they they can get into the home

4:37:03and then they can't afford to keep it to

4:37:05keep the payments up. Um that's that's

4:37:08the essential part. I think there are

4:37:11other parts, but they said it wasn't

4:37:13well written. there were things that

4:37:14were left um undetermined anyway. So I

4:37:19say no and 37 following the league women

4:37:21voters. Thank you.

4:37:24>> Our next speaker is Aram J.

4:37:33>> Okay. So Raymond Goins, great job

4:37:36tonight. Um, on this last uh thing, you

4:37:39were very extraordinarily articulate and

4:37:42uh I would go with you on on uh the uh

4:37:46supporting the uh Prop 4. I hope I have

4:37:50that right, that it's a it's a yes to to

4:37:53limit funding uh so that we everybody

4:37:56isn't running against uh folks like

4:37:59yourself that don't have to run against

4:38:00millionaires and we have some equality

4:38:03there. I'm also for the billionaire tax

4:38:07um for sure. And it sounds like I'm 437

4:38:12after listening to the last speaker

4:38:14who's opposed to it because it sounds

4:38:16very paternalistic to suggest that we

4:38:19give money for people to get in uh to

4:38:22their first housing uh you know down

4:38:25payment, but then they're not bright

4:38:26enough and intelligent enough to be able

4:38:28to figure out what the mortgage that

4:38:30they can handle at the same time. So

4:38:32that makes no sense to me. So I think we

4:38:34would support 37, we would support 40,

4:38:37we would support four. And I'm also

4:38:40asking that that we have legislation

4:38:44with the the group that lobbies for us

4:38:47to ban tasers in PaloAlto and of course

4:38:51vicious vile police canines. Okay, so

4:38:54that's a couple of other things. And

4:38:56then uh unlike the city council, and I

4:39:00think we can all say this really out

4:39:02loud, let's just say no

4:39:05to Prop J. Okay, let's just say no to

4:39:09Prop J because for for one thing,

4:39:11there's no guarantee, as you know, it's

4:39:13a regressive tax. So the the uh the

4:39:16renters in PaloAlto is going to pay a

4:39:18much greater percentage than the owners

4:39:20of property. It's it's regressive in

4:39:23that regard. It's easy for somebody like

4:39:25myself that owns a house uh to be able

4:39:28to pay that, but not for somebody that's

4:39:30a renter. Okay? And not and not only

4:39:33that, but the way this the statute is

4:39:36written, of course, that the and by the

4:39:38way, you know, even Dave Price, who I

4:39:41consider the quitessential

4:39:43um woke virtual uh virtual signaling

4:39:47journalist, he's a woke son of a

4:39:49if you ask me. But uh I have to agree

4:39:52with him on uh no on Prop J. You waited

4:39:57too long. I didn't even hear the news

4:39:59yet today uh what the appraisal came out

4:40:02for. And secondly, it's written in a way

4:40:05that the money can go and be spent and

4:40:07thrown into the general fund and never

4:40:09uh required to do that. And it doesn't

4:40:11have a sunshine date. So let's all say

4:40:14it again loud. Come on, folks.

4:40:16[laughter] Say it with me. No. No. No.

4:40:20on Prop J. No, no, no. On Prop J. Let's

4:40:24get some other source of money that

4:40:26doesn't make a regressive tax that we

4:40:29can pay for that fund. As I talked

4:40:31about, Julie, you can talk to Zuckerberg

4:40:34about funding it.

4:40:36>> Your time is up.

4:40:38And that concludes public comment on

4:40:39action item 11.

4:40:44>> Okay,

4:40:47colleagues, any further comments?

4:40:48Council member Lowing.

4:40:50>> Uh, I concur with the original

4:40:52statements that you made as well as the

4:40:55additions that U. Council member Bert

4:40:57made. So together, I'd be happy to make

4:41:00that as a motion.

4:41:03>> Feel free. I sent such a motion to Mah.

4:41:06If you make it, I'll second it.

4:41:08>> So, do you want to

4:41:10So, expressly what? Just make sure we're

4:41:12on the same page. Uh, they had prop one,

4:41:14we added prop two, Pat added prop two, I

4:41:16added prop four, they had prop 37, one

4:41:20of us added 39, they had 43, I added 45,

4:41:24and then measure J. Does that sound

4:41:26right?

4:41:29You can put on the SC. Why don't you go

4:41:31ahead and put it on the screen and uh,

4:41:34you have it wrong. Everybody, please

4:41:37back check. uh measure RTM should be on

4:41:41the list if you didn't mention it

4:41:44>> because I thought we already took the

4:41:45position on that so I specifically

4:41:47excluded it.

4:41:50>> Yes. So to confirm the council did take

4:41:52a support motion for that. It came up

4:41:53during our discussion of the legislative

4:41:55guidelines in January and the council uh

4:41:57affirmed support for that in March.

4:42:00>> Wow.

4:42:02Um

4:42:04yeah. So

4:42:08yeah, because I let me get back over my

4:42:11notes.

4:42:14So the

4:42:19>> 43 opposed.

4:42:21>> Yes. So I I proposed adding a support

4:42:23for four and an oppose for 45. And

4:42:27council member Bert uh proposed adding a

4:42:31support for two and an oppose for 39.

4:42:35We originally had the staff proposals of

4:42:39support for one

4:42:4337 opposed 39

4:42:46and

4:42:48>> opposed 43

4:42:51>> and opposed 43. I think it was both.

4:42:54>> I think that's a complete list.

4:42:56>> Yeah. Now I would actually

4:43:01be curious um to hear any discussion

4:43:03about 37. Uh there are

4:43:09uh groups that um I respect who are

4:43:13supporting it but I am you know it it

4:43:16concerns me a bit that the league is

4:43:18opposed to it. So I don't know if anyone

4:43:20has any additional thoughts they want to

4:43:22put on about uh Prop 37. I could live

4:43:27with taking no position there. Um I

4:43:29don't I'm not prepared to oppose it, but

4:43:31I'm curious if others have thought. So,

4:43:33Council Member Rectal.

4:43:34>> Yeah. So, 37 does not fix the rate

4:43:36today, but the person who's buying the

4:43:39house will know the rate before they

4:43:41sign the contract. So, they know whether

4:43:42they can afford it or not. So, I think

4:43:45some funding, even if uh even if it

4:43:49isn't perfect, some funding is better

4:43:50than no funding. We can't guarantee that

4:43:52that's going to be a a super low rate

4:43:54for them, but it's what the market will

4:43:57bear at the time.

4:43:59>> Council member Lou,

4:44:01>> I'm fine with a yes on 37. I think it is

4:44:04a complicated proposition with uh

4:44:08potentially negative second order

4:44:09effects. uh if it's useful for anyone. I

4:44:13think the California Yimi is neutral on

4:44:16it because while it does support housing

4:44:19affordability, it subsidizes the demand.

4:44:22So, a lot of that subsidy is actually

4:44:25eaten away by higher housing prices and

4:44:28it also uh uh only applies to new

4:44:32housing. And predominantly

4:44:36there are not very many condos actually

4:44:38being constructed due to condo liability

4:44:40purposes, law purposes. And uh therefore

4:44:44it's expected that more of the impact

4:44:46will be dedicated towards

4:44:49potentially single family home

4:44:51subdivisions andor town homes. So

4:44:53there's potentially some second order

4:44:54environmental impact. So, while the net

4:44:58affordability improvements are real,

4:45:00there is nuance and there are downsides

4:45:03and um uh I would be happy with anything

4:45:06between a yes or a neutral. Um

4:45:11uh

4:45:14uh so yeah, I'll just put that out there

4:45:15uh since there's an invitation for

4:45:17discussion. Um, thinking loud though,

4:45:20actually,

4:45:22I'm I could also lean neutral just

4:45:24because we I I want our message to be

4:45:28focused on um well, Measure J and RTM

4:45:33and

4:45:35there are lots of other things that I

4:45:36think we could or I would want to take a

4:45:39side on, but to some extent taking less

4:45:41sides on things that are potentially

4:45:43confusing or controversial is also good

4:45:45to some extent if we want our

4:45:48measure J and RTM f uh message should be

4:45:51more focused. Um so as you can tell it's

4:45:55getting late. Uh I don't have a

4:45:58particularly strong opinion but uh would

4:46:00lean neutral.

4:46:02>> Okay. I take away from that that George

4:46:04sorry Council Member Lou leans neutral.

4:46:06Okay. Thank you. Um [clears throat]

4:46:09C Vice Mayor Stone.

4:46:12>> Thank you, Madam Mayor. Yeah, I'm in

4:46:14support of of Prop 37. And I I agree

4:46:16with Council Member Rectal's argument. I

4:46:17think we should trust future potential

4:46:20homeowners to be able to make those

4:46:21decisions on on on their own. And I do

4:46:25think at least my I I like the I like

4:46:28the recognition within the proposition

4:46:31of um recognizing there would be higher

4:46:34thresholds for more um high income

4:46:37counties. So we know ours will be on

4:46:40that upper end. So, I think this can be

4:46:42helping us address some of the the

4:46:44missing middle housing that we've been

4:46:47really struggling with and giving an

4:46:48opportunity for people to um enter the

4:46:51market. And I think with with our

4:46:54increased focus on on new housing

4:46:56development, I think we're going to see

4:46:57a lot of new housing within that 1 to$

4:47:001.5 million range that um that that Prop

4:47:0437 really uh targets. So, I think it's a

4:47:07I think it's one that fits well within

4:47:09our our some of our housing goals.

4:47:13>> Council member Bert.

4:47:15>> Yeah, I continue to support 37 um not

4:47:19only for the reasons that were stated um

4:47:23but you know the the argument that

4:47:25because it doesn't solve the totality of

4:47:27a problem, therefore it's not good

4:47:29because it solves a portion of the

4:47:31problem. I don't buy that argument. Um

4:47:34and um and as far as the number of

4:47:38condos, if folks who have followed, we

4:47:40nearly had uh very important uh

4:47:43legislation that got uh didn't quite get

4:47:46through in this cycle to uh address the

4:47:50bottlenecks on condos and it's

4:47:52anticipated that something will happen

4:47:55in the next legislative cycle which this

4:47:58would affect. And then the fact that

4:48:01there are pros and cons. There are for

4:48:03Prop 45 and a number of these. Question

4:48:06is in the net. Do we think it's

4:48:08important? Not whether there's any pro

4:48:10or con to an argument. So I I don't

4:48:13agree with those arguments and we'll

4:48:15continue to support 37.

4:48:18>> Council member Lithcott HS. Thank you,

4:48:19Mayor. Uh I agree with this motion and

4:48:22just wanted to double check that whether

4:48:25it wouldn't be prudent to also reiterate

4:48:28our support for RTM. I would hate for

4:48:30anybody to get a hold of the motion and

4:48:31think somehow we overlooked it or uh you

4:48:36know failed to address it. So could we

4:48:38possibly add you know to reiterate our

4:48:41support if we need to say that we've

4:48:43already done it for RTM? I'd be in favor

4:48:45of adding it if we could.

4:48:46>> That's fine.

4:48:47>> They're all nodding. That's

4:48:48>> fine with me.

4:48:49>> The maker's fine with it. I'm fine with

4:48:51it. So whatever language uh maybe staff

4:48:55wants to add there. I mean, we could

4:48:57either just

4:48:59>> I don't know. Do

4:49:01>> we retake the position or we just want

4:49:02to know

4:49:03>> reiterate support for and

4:49:05>> confirm support for affirm support for

4:49:08>> Yes. Okay.

4:49:11All right. Well, that I appreciate the

4:49:13discussion. Thank you for that. Um

4:49:17I'm fine with this motion as is and I

4:49:21don't see any further I can't even say

4:49:23lights anymore. Any further requests to

4:49:24speak? Um so I think we are ready to

4:49:28vote.

4:49:32Oh

4:50:04motion carry 70.

4:50:07>> All right. Thank you and thanks to

4:50:09everyone who helped us get through this

4:50:11action item. Um that is our last uh

4:50:15action item given that uh the closed

4:50:17session has been removed from the agenda

4:50:20and so that just leaves virtual public

4:50:23comment um for matters not on the

4:50:26agenda. So for those on Zoom

4:50:30>> we have no hands raised on Zoom.

4:50:32>> Okay. Then the last thing to do is to

4:50:35thank everyone and adjourn.