2026-10-07 - Assembly of Delegates

04:567th, 2026 at 4 p.m. I call this regular meeting of the Cape Cod Regional Government Assembly of

05:02Delegates to order. Clerk Fletcher, can you please read the opening statements?

05:10Yes, Madam Speaker. It's uh you said it's 403 on October 7th, 2026. The Cape

05:15Cod Regional Government Assembly of Delegates. Uh pursuant to chapter 2 of the Acts of 2025,

05:20this meeting of the Barnes County Assembly of Delegates will be conducted both in person and

05:24via remote means in accordance with applicable law. Members of the public may watch the meeting

05:28through live realtime broadcast at www.youtube.com/userback/marstable

05:33county. A public participation guide and meeting documents are available in advance at www.capecod.

05:38at capecod.gov. The county of Marsville does not discriminate in the administration of its

05:42programs or activities on the basis of race, color, religion, national origin, disability,

05:46age, sex, sexual orientation, gender identity, or other category protected by state and federal

05:50anti-discrimination laws and regulations. Reasonable accommodations for people with

05:53disabilities are available upon request. For more information or file complaint,

05:56please contact Justina March, Mars County ADA non-discrimination coordinator at jmarcape.gov,

06:03call 508-3756646 or visit www.capecod.com. capecot.gov. Members of the public may attend

06:09the meeting remotely and that information is also available on the website. Madam Speaker,

06:17next on the business calendar is opening ceremonies. I may have a moment of silence

06:21to remember our troops who have died in service to our country and civilian victims of war.

06:37Please stand for the pledge of allegiance.

06:42I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which

06:48it stands, one nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all. Thank you.

06:58Fletcher, can you please uh call the role for a quorum? Yes, Madam Speaker. Delegate

07:04Frederickson here. Deputy Speaker Fisel here. Delegate Fuller here. Delegate Gallagher here.

07:11Delegate Gasson here. Delegate Green here. Delegate Harter here. Delegate

07:17Kellian here. Delegate King here. Delegate McCelie here. Delegate Ali here. Dean Omen

07:23here. Delegate Samson here. Delegate Tai here. Speaker Warner here. Madam

07:29Speaker, that's uh everyone. 15 delegates representing all of the county's population.

07:40There is a quorum for the assembly for

07:41this meeting. Next on the calendar is the approval of journals and minutes.

07:46The clerks have distributed a draft of the journal and minutes for the assembly meeting

07:51of September 16th, 2026 to the members prior to this meeting. Are there any corrections?

08:02There being no corrections from delegates or the clerks, unless there are any objections,

08:07the journal and minutes are approved as submitted.

08:13Next on the business calendar, uh, no objection. The assembly has entered the

08:17committee of the whole. Next on the calendar is communications for members of the public

08:22and officers. Now we have the opportunity for public comment. Is anyone here from the

08:29public who wishes to speak on anything either on the calendar or in general?

08:37We don't speak. Okay. Um, please go ahead and and step forward to the microphone there. And let me

08:44uh just uh go ahead and uh and read this. Uh, when when recognized by the speaker,

08:51members of the public must state their name, their name, the town of residence. Under the

08:56Massachusetts open meeting law, the assembly is restricted in its ability to discuss topics

09:01not on the agenda, but subjects raised during public comment may be added to future agendas.

09:07Public comment period is not a time for debate or discussion with or amongst assembly members.

09:12All meeting attendees must refrain from commenting until recognized by the speaker and are encouraged

09:18to present their remarks in a civil and respectful manner. Please do not applaud or jer others

09:23comments. Each participant is allotted up to three minutes to comment once. The speaker may exercise

09:29their discretion to offer additional time to a commenter. Sta uh staff will um will time

09:36speakers and give an indication when there are 2 minutes, 1 minute, and 30 seconds remaining. I

09:40will recognize members of the public who are here in person first and then those who are in line,

09:45please come forward when I call your name. And you must be Jennifer. Yes. Okay. Um and

09:52your last name? Owens. Okay. Thank you. Uh go ahead. And where are you from? Falmouth.

10:02Hi. So, I live in Felmouth and I'm a member of the Felmouth Immigrants Rights Coalition in the

10:08Lucay Immigrant Statewide Network. Um, I know there were a lot of people here in a June or

10:15July meeting that spoke on behalf of ordinance number 11, but I'm here to speak again in in

10:20favor of the proposed ordinance 11. I believe we need to do everything we can to help protect our

10:26neighbors from ICE activities. ICE agents are in courouses every day in this state working to

10:32detain individuals. Some may believe that this isn't needed as the Protect Act was signed into

10:38law this summer. However, I think it's still important to reinforce the limits put in place

10:43by the Protect Act and to extend such guidelines to cover all properties under the control of the

10:49county government. This directly counters ICE rogue and unlawful practices which have been

10:55linked to dangerous incidents nationwide. We want to continue to limit opportunities for misconduct

11:01and ensure that judicial and county spaces remain neutral and safe. This ordinance is a

11:06necessary step to protect public safety, uphold constitutional rights, and ensure that county

11:12properties and institutions remain safe, neutral, and accessible to all. It prevents the misuse of

11:18county property for unlawful immigration enforcement, safeguards community trust,

11:24and aligns us with the strongest protections in the nation's against ICE abuses. This ordinance

11:30is not about shielding individuals from federal law, but about ensuring that our courts and public

11:35institutions serve justice without the threat of unlawful enforcement. Thank you for your time.

12:02Sorry. Thanks. Um, Dwight Dover,

12:08you're not going to speak. Okay. Thank you. Oh, okay. Jennifer was a designated speaker. I get

12:13it. Uh, is there anyone else who uh would like to speak to uh to the assembly at this point?

12:24No. Okay. Um I see no one who uh wants to speak further. So let's um move on to the communications

12:34from the regional commissioners administration and directors ad excuse me regional administrator

12:41Michael Dutton uh are here on is here on behalf of the executive branch to give a report on the

12:46most recent board of regional commissioners um meeting. Uh let's see. Go ahead. Thank you,

12:55Madam Speaker. Um and thank you for being here on a beautiful day. Um I do uh I only really want to

13:03report uh the uh uh agenda and the results of uh the commissioner's last meeting which was held in

13:10Mashby as part of their uh ongoing traveling road show. Um and really uh this meeting was slightly

13:18different than others in that uh the commissioners did not tackle uh significant issues. They just

13:24mostly wanted to hear from the uh select board and the and the town manager in MASHBY. Um I

13:30took the opportunity to uh give an exhaustive and and boring review of county services. So

13:38um I can replicate that anytime you want uh one of your meetings. Um, we also discussed a

13:44little bit about the uh work that we have done internally uh and the report that we produced

13:49regarding local aid and I think I've talked about that in this uh in this setting as well. Local

13:54aid as it relates to lottery revenues uh and the complete mismatch that the Cape uh receives back

14:01uh from from the lottery system um in terms of local aid, unrestricted government aid.

14:08Um, which I will uh use the opportunity to remind everybody, the county does not take

14:14uh have any uh local government aid. We do not get any uh uh unrestricted general government

14:20aid from the Commonwealth. Uh so we don't benefit from lottery sales uh directly. So that but the

14:27towns do and uh universally on the Cape uh we get about 5% of the revenues that we send up there.

14:36um if you are looking at pure state averages it should be somewhere more like 17 or 18%

14:42uh of what we send up there but uh that is not the case anyway I touched on that a little bit

14:48uh and and uh the meeting had some discussions about that and encouraged us to keep on going

14:55uh with our fight to try to get u a little more equity built into that uh formula the dispersement

15:01formula um we had a little bit of a discuss question on the Cape's carrying capacity or

15:09what we now labeled the Cape's carrying capacity and drinking water supply and that um that was

15:16a relatively um enlightening conversation. Uh we also talked a little bit about uh long-term needs

15:25with the wastewater systems on the Cape uh and the somewhat disjointed um approach that has been used

15:33uh not for any bad reason but the disjointed approach that's been used across the Cape uh in

15:39terms of uh how towns plan for nitrogen reduction and how they implement wastewater uh goals. um had

15:49uh little bit of a discussion on uh regional housing uh including attainable affordable

15:56uh projects as well as 4DB projects. Um talked a little bit about infrastructure improvements

16:04mostly as it pertained to wastewater uh and water infrastructure. Um and then um that was

16:12pretty much it. The commissioner's consent agenda included uh uh the acceptance of two grants. One

16:19is the youth homelessness program accepted 133 a little over $133,000 from the US Department of

16:27Housing and Urban Development. And uh we also received a HUD grant um for our home program

16:35uh which I've been involved with for quite some time. and that amounted to uh just a little bit

16:41under uh $450,000. So, uh those are both yearly amounts uh that we get uh from HUD uh for those

16:52two programs. So, and that is um that is about it, but happy to answer questions.

17:03Thank you, Madam Speaker. Uh are those grant amounts that you just announced

17:07uh com comparable to what we've been getting recent years? They are. They're pretty stable.

17:12Good. They are pretty stable. Knock on wood. Um we had a lot of concern with our HUD grants early on

17:18u a year a year year and a half ago and uh so far they have uh if if they

17:24have declined it's been minimal but uh fairly stable. Thank you. Yeah,

17:31Deputy Speaker uh Riselle. Thank you. Uh speaker, I'm I'm assuming that neither of

17:37those grants commit us to any specific uh employment of anyone on the uh beyond the

17:44term of the grant. Is that correct? Correct. Correct. Absolutely. Yman,

17:53go ahead. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Regarding the home program, it's it's been a great program,

17:58but it's been also been a very uh expensive program and and we've uh gladly taken it on

18:04and I will never underestimate the importance of it. But how are we doing with it overall? I

18:09know that that grant is significant, but costs tend to go up. So, if the grant stays level,

18:15I wonder how if we're running into a deficit program and there's any way to deal with that.

18:21Nope. Good question. Uh the home program grants um are have declined over probably the last 10

18:27years. Um having excuse me having said that the purpose of those grants tends to be to provide

18:36um funding for projects that uh are are almost almost can pencil out but not quite. And so uh

18:45that that uh home program is used to fund mostly those projects just just get them over the line.

18:51Um and in terms of um deficit spending, we don't we can't do that. Um which is good. Um but we we

19:00uh allocate uh a fixed amount to different projects uh that may come in and request

19:07funding. Um we've got a a committee made up of representatives from every town. In fact,

19:13I wasn't going to mention it, but Katie Halverson uh was appointed to the home consortium advisory

19:19council for a three-year term uh on behalf of Churro. So, um it's made up mostly of

19:25housing specialists around the Cape who make a recommendation about which projects uh to

19:31fund. Uh obviously the projects have to apply for that funding um and request it but but we

19:37don't go into a deficit um and we don't we can't overextend ourselves uh on that grant a grant fund

19:49speaker. Thank you, Madam Speaker. So, if that's the case and if the money declines,

19:56we don't go into deficit, does that basically mean that we do less, we can't fund as much

20:01in the way of projects. So, we just end up doing less effectively. Yes. We fund

20:06we fund either fund fewer projects or fund at a at a reduced rate than we would have prior.

20:22Sorry. Are there other questions from delegates?

20:27Uh, seeing none, thank you very much for that update. Thank you. And um I see that

20:33finance director and treasurer Cara Copa is here. And um it says is uh county is

20:41uh county accountant Deb Childs joining us too or no? Yes. Oh, okay. Ah, there you are. Um,

20:49and uh, they're going to deliver the fiscal year 2026 year-end recap.

20:57Good afternoon. Thank you so much. It's nice to see everyone in person. Um, and,

21:03um, let me just, um, uh, uh, upload the presentation for you and we'll be right with you.

21:36So, good afternoon again. Um, I'm joined here by um the county's um deputy finance director and

21:43um and county accountant. This is Deb Childs. And I'm pleased to introduce Deb to you. Um,

21:50and we're hoping that we'll be in tandem presenting to you moving forward. Um,

21:58so presenting to you the um the results of um the fiscal year 2026 um that would ended June 30th. Um

22:12let's see if I can get this to shut off. So, okay, there we go. Um the county sorry the the county um

22:26the county's presenting this in a little different way. Um thought we would change things um just you

22:33know to to see which is more preferable for um presentation standpoint. Would you like

22:38to see numbers? Would you like to see charts? We've got an agenda that's associated with this

22:43presentation. Um and it it runs from a snapshot to detailed about the general general fund,

22:50Cape Cod Commission, Dredge Enterprise Fund, other special purpose um um uh special revenue funds

22:59such as grants and so forth. Um we have an update on uh PAS and expenditures that have the county

23:08has incurred to date. We've got a look at deferred maintenance uh for some infrastructure and

23:14buildings. We've got some cash flow information to present to you and then certainly if you have

23:20questions for us, we'd be happy to answer those. So, at the end of the fiscal year, the county was

23:27managing just under $91 million um in cash over um 25 different um financial accounts, meaning bank

23:37accounts. Um those 25 bank accounts are reconciled on a monthly basis. Um and we're man we were also

23:45managing 96 funds. Um when I first came to the county about four years ago um there we

23:53were managing over 200 funds. And so we've paired that down significantly. We just have a different

24:00um uh the the deputy director and I just have a different way to manage these funds which uh

24:06makes a lot more sense to us I think um and is a lot more efficient. Um so um we we uh our interest

24:15rates have been agreeable as you may see in your own um personal um assets. Um and at the end of

24:23June we were anywhere on our money market accounts between just under uh 3.4% to um just under 3.9.

24:34Uh we're managing one enterprise fund which is your dredge enterprise fund.

24:38We call it two operating budgets Cape Cod Commission and the general fund. Uh we have

24:44um seven trust and stabilization funds. OPED trust, which is your other postemployment

24:49benefits other than pension. So that's the group insurance that you're paying for your retirees.

24:56Um we have a trust fund that supports that that supports those costs moving into the future. And

25:02then stabilization funds, capital stabilization, revenue stabilization, emergency stabilization,

25:08a general stabilization. So and PAS stabilization. Um, we manage 10 capital funds and we're slowly

25:16pairing those down to two, one for the general fund and one for dredge enterprise fund. Um,

25:22and then we have numerous grants and special other special revenue funds. And those an

25:28example of what those other special revenue funds um could be is your um aqua fund program,

25:34which is your um title 5 um septic loan program. Highly popular program here

25:40at the county. There's three funds associated with that um operation.

25:49Just as an overall snapshot, um providing that to you here, this is uh revenue that's

25:55associated with all the funds that I mentioned um before. Um you'll see that the operating budget

26:02revenue finished um well over what was budgeted or estimated, if you will. Um it it had a strong um

26:11result for the county. Um and it really is driven by registry of deeds revenue in the large part. I

26:18mean we we were very successful in capitalizing on interest rates as well. Um but that was just

26:25under a million dollars that was collected whereas you know your registry of deeds revenue is is is

26:30far superior. Um, the Tredge Enterprise Fund had a incredible year revenue-wise. They took on some

26:39pretty big projects. Their revenue came in over $4 million. Um, and their expenditures were far

26:46below that. So, they're right now sitting on um retained earnings, we would call it,

26:52of just of just over $2 million. um our federal, state, and local grants. Some of our um grants

27:01are reimbursement basis and some of the funds we receive right up front. So for the reimbursement

27:07basis grants, we record what we call in finance and accounts receivable. So we build the funder,

27:16we just haven't received the money yet, right? Um and so that accounted for um the difference here

27:23between where your local federal and state grants are for your revenue versus what you'll see as

27:29expenses. Um our capital funds are pretty much the same way. Um we there I can't cite the ordinance,

27:39but there's no ordinance there. Two ordinances that were passed to support capital projects

27:44and the funding for capital projects. Um, and what we do in July is after the fiscal year is closed,

27:52we go back in and we say, how many of these capital projects that we spent funds on are

27:57being supported by capital stabilization fund, we document all of that information and make that

28:02transfer. But that transfer doesn't happen until the new fiscal year until we close out the prior

28:09this. So that um will show you is the difference here between what was what was revenue recorded

28:15in at fiscal year 26 versus the expenditures for capital which is coming up right here. Um so just

28:23as I had mentioned um you know we outpaced the budget on general fund revenue and that's largely

28:29because of um uh the registry of deeds revenue. um interest income was just under a million dollars.

28:40Cape Cod Commission finished under budget when uh with regard to revenues versus expenditures.

28:48Revenue for dredge as I had mentioned um really exceeded um where any expectations.

28:58So now moving on to expenditures for all funds. Um we have no expenditures for OPED trust fund.

29:04There's there's no authorization for us to expend any of those funds. Um stabilization

29:10fund we didn't have any authorizations in um FY26 to expend those funds. As I

29:19had mentioned we had a transfer um in FY27 that supported some of those capital project spends.

29:28Dredge Enterprise Fund came um under about a million dollars under where their budget

29:33was for expenditures. Cape Cod Commission, as I had mentioned before, um came well under where

29:41their budgeted expenditures. Um and and that's largely due to the methodology methodology in

29:49which they budget. Um they're budgeting for 100% of their staff members without regard

29:54to any grant funding. And so when the grant fundings are realized by Cape Cod Commission,

30:00those expenditures for that personnel and their fringe um are recorded against the grants.

30:09Um the other funds that are listed here, some of those other funds are um your septic loan as

30:15I had mentioned before. Um, and that's a robust program um um that um where we are um the county,

30:26excuse me, the county is um funding title 5 septic replacements or repairs for residents, homeowners

30:37um along the Cape that that file for applications for betterments. Um and so what the county does

30:43is it reimburse or it pays for the the general contractor, the engineer um for the homeowners

30:52and then in turn um collects those funds back from the homeowners various a series of up to 20 years

31:01um with low interest either zero, two or 4% interest. It's a significant program.

31:08It's gained wide success over the past few years. Um the original appropriation for um the borrowing

31:17for Mass Clean Water Trust of $13 million was fully expended by um the middle of July

31:26and then you've appropriated another $20 million. um 10 million of that has been authorized by the

31:32Mass Clean Water Trust and we're in the process of finalizing those documents. Um for federal,

31:40state, and local grants, as I had mentioned, um some of these grants are reimbursement based. So,

31:47um you'll see expenditures here at $13 million versus the revenue. I think the slide two slides

31:53before was at 11. We we had funding that was um what we call receivables or due to the county at

32:01the end of the fiscal year. Um our operating budget had positive results. Um we the county

32:10um had a budget of $30 million um and expenditures of 28. So it was $1.9 million that we call budget

32:20turnbacks. And that, you know, in itself is from, you know, prudent controls over

32:27expenses as well as capitalizing on grants. And then capital funds. We've got $40 million

32:35appropriated in capital funds. Um there's $4 million that was expended in FY26. Um,

32:45excuse me. And 2 million of that was coming in from capital stabilization to fund some of

32:50those projects. the other $2 million to fund those projects was largely from bond anticipation notes

32:58um which are short-term um notes that we look out to the barn market every year.

33:07So this is just a kind of a key takeaway or a snapshot of what I had just mentioned. Um

33:12certainly if you have particular questions with regard to this we can review those and I'm going

33:21to turn it over to Deb. Yeah. Give um Director Copelo a chance to rest her voice. Um this side

33:28of just just a moment once uh uh can we would like to go back to the slide before that before we move

33:34on. Um I think there's a couple of questions to that. Well, I just want to make sure we secure.

33:38Oh, okay. Everybody saw it. You're welcome. Okay. All set. Thank you. Okay. Thank you. This slide

33:45is just a graph representing the general fund revenue by source. Um where you can obviously

33:51see our largest um source of revenue as a registry of deeds that did perform very well last year and

33:56came in well above the anticipated budget. Um county tax assessments came in at 100% without

34:02any delay. Um which is what we collect from each of the um 15 communities. um facilities also had

34:09a positive which is um mainly attributed to the reimbursements from the states for the leasing

34:13of the buildings. I think that was all that I had to recognize on this slide and interest income of

34:20course that came in well above what was budgeted um due to the positive interest rates income.

34:27This slide is an overview of the expenditures that um director Copeler just gone over. Um that's by

34:33category. Um the fringe benefits, salaries, and operating expenses came in um slightly under their

34:41anticipated budget. Um whereas debt service and other funding uses were at the expected amount.

34:54And this slide is um a slide that's the spending by department. So you can see that

35:00most all departments were um under their budget um in expenditures that they were

35:06prudent in maintaining you know managing their resources to stay within their their budgets.

35:12Um debt service and interest obviously and the fringe benefits are are almost fully expended.

35:24Um this slide is an overview of the Cape Cod Commission. Um just again previewing

35:29that their expenses came in under their their budget. Um which director Copeler

35:33had explained is due to their methodology of um budgeting fully for their grant staff.

35:43This slide is an overview of the dredge expenditures first budget

35:48um which we noted they did have um several large projects. They did seven projects in seven out of

35:54the 15 towns within the county. Um they managed the weather and environmental restrictions well

35:59so that they were able to complete the projects in a timely manner and and bring in those revenues.

36:06and I'm going to turn it back over to Director Copala to go over the rest of the presentation.

36:11Okay, I think I have my voice back. So, I'm I'm sorry. I apologize. Um, I just wanted to give

36:17you an update on PAS remediation and the cost that the county has incurred to date. And this

36:22is whether it's through the settlement with um the town of Barnstable, the the capping project

36:28that was undertaken a few years ago um to like the remediation projects that are occurring right now.

36:38Um, so right now the county has spent just under or has either expended or promised to expend, if

36:47you will, what we call encumbered, um, just under $15 million. Um, and and just on the other side

36:55of the screen, I wanted to provide you, now this doesn't have anything to do, let me back up. This

36:59doesn't have anything to do with the liability is in the future. this is just what's occurred right

37:04now um or in the past. Um so I think that the the the future liability conversations are happening

37:15uh weekly or monthly or daily. Um and and I don't I don't know that you know originally I

37:24um when I had presented to the commissioners I you know had information that I thought was

37:29you know accurate and true and you know you could put your finger on it but I don't think that was

37:33true. So I I I don't I don't believe that that total liability number is known nor the extent

37:40of the liability and this really is just focused on the former fire trading site and no other site

37:48if there are any. But I wanted to also provide you with some positive information is that the county

37:55and through the assembly has set aside funds and authorized u funds to support a portion of that

38:02liability. And I think that's important for you to know and and I'm sure you already know that,

38:07but for the public to know as well. Um there's um there's projects that have already been

38:14secured or funding that's already been secured or applications that are pending. We have some

38:19um congressionarily directed spending that the county is currently in the process,

38:25active process of applying for those funds and that's $3 million um through ARPA. ARPA funded

38:33$4 million of the remediation cost. Um the general event operations have um also supported a number

38:41of um expenses with associated especially with any debt that's associated with PAS and um the

38:49settlement with the town of Barnstable. Um there's a PAS stabilization fund with $8 million um that's

38:57rounded. Um and that's really to thus far to support the ongoing operations and maintenance

39:04for PAS. And what that looks like right now is somewhere between $4 to $500,000 on an annual

39:11basis to support that measure. Um and then the county has um authorized borrowing, long-term

39:18debt borrowing um to support PAS already. and that's through a capital project appropriation.

39:28Um, in June of 2026, the board of regional commissioners um had a presentation uh with regard

39:36to countywide facilities and their condition assessment. Um, and there's a deferred maintenance

39:42uh conversation um that is occurring currently. Um and the the numbers um here are static, but

39:52they're not static. Um so, you know, the longer we wait to address some of these deferred maintenance

39:58items, um the larger that $78.6 million is going to become grow. Um, but of that some good news is

40:09that we've we've appropriated, remember I spoke about the $40 million in capital appropriations

40:15that we currently have on the books, $12 million of that is associated with this deferred

40:20maintenance. Um, so so we're, you know, 15% of the way there, um, at this point in time. And

40:33I wanted to talk a little about cash flow necessities. I brought this up last year.

40:40Um in the first two months of the fiscal year. Um in 2026, this and this is just an example of

40:472026. Um the county expended um $10 million. Large portion of that is Barnesville County Retirement

40:58Association. um their annual assessment that gets paid July 1st. A portion of that,

41:05as you may be aware, is is um funded through the state through the sheriff's office to support

41:13um the retirement assessment for the sheriffs that used to be part of the county that those funds

41:19don't come in till didn't come in in 2026 till November and December. Um, and so the county was

41:28required to fund those. Um, just so that you're aware of that, it was until November, the end

41:34of November before we caught up and we became, you know, kind of neutral in our cash flow. So,

41:40we have to make sure that we have adequate cash on hand to um to be able to support um

41:50expenditures and payments that need to be made to vendors and employees and things of that nature.

42:01So, just a synopsis here, excuse me. Um, we have the retirement assessment due July 1st.

42:10We have operating expenses for July and August. We have the, as I mentioned before, the sheriff's

42:19um, reimbursement and tax assessments for all 15 communities are not due until November 1st and

42:29May 1st. So, those are not able to help us in the first few months of the year.

42:39in 2027. This is just an example, excuse me, of um cash flow that happened in July and

42:46August of 2027. Um so there was $7 million that went out in July and $2 million that

42:53went out in August and $4 million that were realized that came in. Excuse me.

43:01Um so again this is just another example of why we need adequate cash flow on hand. Um when we move

43:10funds into stabilization funds, OPEM trust fund, things of that nature, those are separated from

43:16any cash flow that we can use. We can't utilize those funds whatsoever. If we have funds that are

43:22um um s uh specifically segregated um like the registry deeds has a separate fund

43:31um for what they call revenue stabilization um um which is not what we what the technical

43:39legal Commonwealth of Massachusetts it's just you know a little different anyway

43:44um we can't use those funds to support our operation right so we have to be mindful ful of

43:50of what funds we have available to us. Okay. So, we're happy to answer any questions that you have.

44:03Billarter, go ahead. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Um just out of curiosity, are we like paying a yearly

44:11um sum to a lawyer on that class action suit about PAS or um is that just being handled um

44:23without us? Cuz I know I'm in a class action suit and I have to send this stupid lawyer's money. So,

44:33uh good question. The answer is uh we currently

44:37uh do have special counsel involved in the PAS um you know you know on many different

44:44components of our PAS issue. We pay them on a just on an hourly basis. There's no

44:50um nothing other than that and we have not used them significantly at all over the past two years.

44:59Delegate Kian. Thank you Madam Speaker. Uh good afternoon, Director Kapola,

45:04the assistant director. Um child's along the PAS. Um so the the suit that we're enjoined in given

45:15the fact that we've just heard that those numbers continue to rise, how does that affect our suit?

45:20Is it constantly updated with new costs or is it just a percentage? So I I apologize. I should

45:28have explained a little further. So, we have um we have special counsel on board that uh deals with

45:35um any um I guess uh represents us as defendants. Uh we also have special counsel on board that's

45:45representing us in in several class action suits um against the manufacturers of PAS. Uh

45:52there hasn't been a whole lot of movement on the manufacturer uh class action suit. Um and that's

46:00primarily because their first um priority is uh just focused on drinking water. So that they've

46:08sort of addressed the class actions involved with drinking water first. Arguably you could say

46:13ours does, but in the eyes of of the class action world, we our our uh class action deals with soil

46:21basically. Um if there's a way to to make that uh differentiation. Um so on the defendant side our

46:30um we work with uh that attorney on an hourly basis. On the class action side we there's no

46:38ongoing yearly cost to that because the class action lawsuits the lawyers will benefit from

46:44whatever uh the final settlement is presuming it gets settled and doesn't go to court. So so

46:50I should have explained that a little more fully uh before. No I understand that. My my question

46:55really was when we started out 10 years ago on this, our costs were small and unknown and now

47:02they continue to grow. So the question is is that going to be calculated or calibrated in when we

47:08finally get to some type of a settlement? Do they look at what we spent or start out figure out what

47:13we started out? Uh so we keep we keep both of our both sets of attorneys fully apprised of whatever

47:19our expenditures are. Um we have done you know rough calculations about what our costs will be

47:25over the over the next 20 years. Um and they are they have asked for that information they they so

47:31they get that information. So presumably based on um based on their request for information from us

47:39uh their client uh presumably um our costs will be reflected in in whatever the filing

47:46is that that is done specifically on the class action case. So, thank you. And just one more

47:52question regarding uh the registry of deeds revenue which is considerably higher. Is do

47:58you know if that is a result of just the increased value of property being transacted or the volume?

48:08Uh yes. Um A and B. Um I think uh Dave Murphy who's the assistant uh register is is u much

48:21more capable of giving you sort of uh that answer than I am but I will say that it's probably a mix

48:26of both. It's probably uh escalating uh volume of sale wall sales although that's leveled off quite

48:33significantly and also the the increase in values. So the increase in values definitely has uh helped

48:40us uh over the past several years. This the reason I ask is if we can anticipate the continued growth

48:46that we've seen or again we've we've had a lot of record years over the last five or so and all

48:52of us think at some point it's got to come to an end but someday I tend to agree and I keep saying

48:58this is the year this is the year and it keeps getting and I will say you know it's it's you

49:02know it's difficult for us because on the one hand you know our revenues derive as you know as from a

49:08percentage of the sales uh on the cape and so you know, yes, we we have some significant uh revenues

49:15over the past several years. On the other hand, um that's an indication that the price of housing

49:21is is escalating beyond people's ability to pay. So, it's a it's certainly a double-edged sword

49:26and we recognize that. Uh Deputy Speaker Fisel. Yeah, thank you, Mr. Speaker. Um I would think

49:34first to comment on the the registry and sales with the mortgage rates going above seven. Um,

49:39all predictions are sales everywhere um in Massachusetts um are going to decline

49:45uh because of that. Um so I don't know if we'll see the same volume in the next fiscal year. I

49:51want to go back to the slide on cash flow though. That's where my questions are. Could you go back?

49:58Um no then um the next one I think. Yeah. Um there you reference resolution 2026-08.

50:08um proposing an automatic transfer. So I want to clarify this with you. Um words in the resolution

50:16say that um that to safeguard regional government surplus and ensure long-term fiscal discipline,

50:25the assembly recommends recommends the board of regional commissioners instruct the regional

50:32administrator to review the unreserved undesated general fund balance by September 15th of each

50:39fiscal year. To the extent this balance exceeds 15% of the operating budget, the target reserve

50:46threshold recommended by the finance director, which you have in your budget message for fiscal

50:5327, which you did in December of last year when you made a presentation to us. Those were your

50:59recommendation. The assembly recommends the board instruct the regional administrator to provide

51:05ordinances transferring the excess amount into one or more regional government stabilization funds.

51:11So there's nothing automatic. So their slice says it's automatic. Nothing automatic. That's number

51:17one. All right. Your slice says automatically. Doesn't automatically transfer. Number two,

51:22the 15% number was derived from you. And in fact, before we put this resolution together,

51:30we had comments and solicited comments for several weeks from the administration about

51:35that particular point. And the and what let me finish. What we received back was changing it I

51:42think from 10% to 15% and changing the date to September 15th. We didn't receive other

51:48comments that would suggest what your slide is now suggesting. Number three, if we do have a need,

51:57you don't have to borrow money. You simply ask for capital stabilization fund transfer. So funds go

52:04into capital stabilization. They also come out of capital stabilization. So you don't need to

52:11borrow money if for some reason there's some cash flow that you need. You could ask for a

52:17transfer out of the capital stabilization. So I'm puzzled by your slide in that presentation. What

52:23I really want is I want us to work together to come to some way of handling this cash flow so

52:31we do transfer what we don't need and on some kind of time schedule not indefinite time. So,

52:41uh, what I'm looking for is for a recommendation that you can make if 15% is not the right number,

52:49some other trigger that we should sit down and work out. But I want to clarify for the public

52:55and the rest of the assembly. We got this not out of thin air. We got this based upon what

53:02we saw that came from your office and also that we presented this resolution several weeks in advance

53:10and asked for your comments and we didn't get this comment you made on the slide at that time. So I'm

53:17a little puzzled why we're getting it now instead of when we could have put that into some form

53:22in the resolution. But most importantly, I want to see some kind of structure for how we handle

53:29this in a timely manner to put the money that we don't need into the undesated fund balance.

53:39Is there a question? I'm sorry. Yeah, there is a question. Why why is this slide here now and

53:45we have given you the opportunity to comment on the resolution and we took the 15% number

53:52right from your own documents. Why is that a problem now? Tell me why. Deputy Speaker,

53:58I did not comment. Well, you were given the opportunity was sent to your office. I'm sorry,

54:03but I I was not able to comment on the resolution at that point in time. So,

54:08those were not my comments. Okay. Well, we were sent to the administrator,

54:12which is what we have to do. We sent it to the administrator and he did comment. Okay. Now,

54:19the 15% still came from your own slides. You present it to us. It's in the budget book. So,

54:25explain for me why that is not correct in terms of cash flow. It's from your own budget book. I'm

54:33sorry. I'm sure that I'm I'm able to to provide you with an explanation today without having

54:41the document in front of me. But we do have a financial policy that we are in the process of

54:49updating accordingly according to what the cash needs our barnstable county and not necessarily

54:58uh a a a standard across other municipalities. Well, that's what we took it from the policy that

55:06you stated right in your budget book and in the slide you gave us last December. So if it's not

55:1315% then we should work on a different way of calculating it in a time schedule. But I just

55:20want to make it clear there's nothing in this resolution that operates automatically. Nothing

55:26operates automatically. So the word is misleading in your slide. It doesn't work automatically.

55:42Okay. Do we have any other um questions that delegates might like to bring forward? Uh

55:50anyone on the Oh, go ahead. Uh Dino, on a lighter note, um the u does the French Enterprise have a

56:03replacement fund? It always has, but it wasn't mentioned in your presentation today. Is there

56:07a pres is there a replacement fund for equipment? And what is that number? I think your question is

56:16there a replacement fund for equipment for the dredge equipment? We've always had as part of

56:20the budget a replacement um component there. there. As you may be aware, there have been

56:29a significant amount of grants that have come by way of the for the Dredge Enterprise Fund to

56:34support the purchase of equipment. Um, we have not budgeted for the replacement of that equipment in

56:40the operating budget of Dredge as of yet. We have we have supported um certainly the repair upkeep

56:48and maintenance of equipment um within Dredg's inventory but not for the replacement of Well,

56:56it seems to me that if you get we get almost $1.9 million. Is that what I what I read? Uh

57:02in in excess revenue and and dredges don't last forever. I thought in in the past I

57:07thought we've always had a a a specific um fund for the replacement of a dredge when it and when

57:14it will happen. So that's not I'm sorry I'm I'm not familiar with that process of the county.

57:23Perhaps it was a number of years ago. It was. Yeah. Well, I mean then my next question is why

57:29not? It's going to the reg is going the judge has a certain lifestyle a lifetime. What will we do

57:36when that dredge is no longer available? Will we just borrow the full amount to get a new one? I'm

57:42It seems to me that that is a component that's relevant to uh having a dredge at Priceland.

57:50Thank you. Yes. I I'd like to just um uh tag on to that is I think that the last time that the dredge

57:59uh had uh quite a few not maintenance things but replacements for things of equipment that either

58:06was out of date and on the verge of collapsing or that was no longer functioning in the way that

58:12it should. Um and it all hit at the same time. um which made it very clear that there was no kind of

58:20um uh process that had been put in place to not have that happen so that you could you could you

58:27know uh play it out over the the course of many years instead of having everything because it was

58:33substantial uh and it was a substantial amount of money. Um, so is is that what is uh Dean Omen

58:39is that what you're you're kind of concerned about is if it isn't a replacement that how

58:43are we looking at the dredges costs so that we don't because what happened is everything came

58:49due at the same time and if we don't factor that in uh going forward we're going to end up in the

58:55same place somewhere down the road which uh which would be a lot more money this time around. So,

59:02if if I may ask that question, Carol. Um, excuse me. I'll take that. Okay. Um, so, uh,

59:10short answer is yes, we do carry a line item in the budget. Um, but it's it it doesn't say

59:16dredge replacement. I think it says equipment, uh, repairs or parts, something along those lines. So,

59:23on a yearly basis, that may be all used up or that may not be touched significantly at all.

59:29And when that happens, those uh those excesses flow into unreserved uh fund balance for the

59:36dredge for the enterprise fund. Um one of the thing one of the things that we're working on now

59:42uh right across the county is uh is uh cap you know planning for capital retirements and and

59:50new purchases. Um traditionally that I don't believe was ever done significantly. Um but

59:56we have certainly dredges. We have probably too many automobiles. Um if you ask the assistant

1:00:02administrator, she'll tell you we have too many automobiles. Um uh because she's the one that has

1:00:08to make sure they're all insured. So that's why she says we have too many. Um but we've got a very

1:00:14significant amount of uh lab equipment over there. Very pricey lab equipment. Um and traditionally

1:00:20the county has had no real plan to replace those pieces of equipment. Um, do we uh do we fund a

1:00:28depreciation? No, we don't do that. Government doesn't doesn't really do that. Um, but what we

1:00:34can do is make sure that we've got a capital plan that's far enough out to start accounting for some

1:00:39of these retirements, equipment retirements that come up and and at least have a plan

1:00:44to replace those. That plan could be borrowing. That plan could be using capital stabilization.

1:00:50that plan could be uh any number of different options or or grant-f funded or spreading the cost

1:00:56uh among the 15 member towns. It depends depends what the capital is. Um but I think what you're

1:01:03saying and and what I've been saying is we need to have uh a capital replacement program

1:01:08in place so that we can in one place too uh so that we can easily reference um you know

1:01:17uh some kind of test equipment in the lab and we can say you know what this was purchased in 2020

1:01:24uh we know it has a useful life of 10 years and in 2030 we know that we need to to replace that

1:01:30and then have a plan for that. So, so that's uh in the works. Um that's as sounds like an easy

1:01:36lift because I make everything sound probably easier than it is, but uh that's a significant

1:01:42uh change in practice for the county. Also a very significant uh lift for for folks to

1:01:48really account uh for the equipment they have and get all the information in one place. So,

1:01:53that is that is in the works through the speaker. May I? Yes. Go ahead. The reason I asked about the

1:01:58dredge specifically, it's our only enterprise fund. So, it's supposed to be self- sustaining.

1:02:04And if it we don't have that, I think everything you said about the rest of I finished the rest of

1:02:10the uh the rest of the replacement costs are great for the entire county. Those are great. But since

1:02:15we have an enterprise fund, if we had that that in place, then that might affect how we charge by the

1:02:21by the job and by the specific part of the job. So I think that that's an important factor that I

1:02:27would like to at least explore with you and a more specific because it is our only enterprise fund

1:02:32and that's why I'm specifically asking about that. Thank you. Thank you. Uh get harder. Thank you,

1:02:40Madam Speaker. So the dredge is one of my passions and um we since I've been working on it, there's

1:02:48never been a different founder for maintenance or or equipment. It's always just been the enterprise

1:02:55fund. And like four years ago, I don't even think Michael was here when we did the first study

1:03:04um of dredge rates. And so we looked at what was coming. The codfish one was, you know,

1:03:12barely hanging on. So we raised the rates and we did that study um with the two companies. Anchor,

1:03:20one is Ankor QA, Anchor QA and the other one. And um and so we came up with three, remember we came

1:03:29up with three different um ways to fix it. Either just do them, you know, right at the top or the

1:03:37third one we decided not to do. So it was between do the do the upgrades gradually or do them all

1:03:44at once. We decided to do them all at once. Um so we raised the prices, raised the you know um gas,

1:03:54all that sort of stuff. And then last year I guess it was they decided no, we need to look at this

1:04:00again. Um and we had gotten a lot of money for grants. So, we've got new um we have a new dredge

1:04:10and um we got the codfish 2 now. Um so, the dredge is in in good shape, but um it it doesn't have its

1:04:22you know, the money would come from the enterprise fund. there was never a fund in it and um you know

1:04:31it it we would just they just doing it you know as it as they take it out of the enterprise if

1:04:38they need it. I don't I don't know. My question has been answered but not solved. Thank you.

1:04:46Any other questions?

1:04:51Seeing none,

1:04:55thank you very much for the updates and the uh additional information that we asked about. Um the

1:05:01assembly will now convene. Next on the calendar are reports of officers and committees. The first

1:05:10report is from Assembly Standing Committee on Public Services. Uh, Delegate Gesson, as chair

1:05:17of that committee, can you please give the report on the meeting of September 28th? Absolutely. Uh,

1:05:24the committee met to discuss proposed amendments to amendment 2026-11 uh with the goal of coming

1:05:33up with a consolidated amendment that we would be able to present to the full assembly today.

1:05:39uh and you know really have an in-depth conversation about what those amendments would be

1:05:46um and present a thoughtout uh report to the full assembly as to the proposed amendments. Um to that

1:05:53end I'll I'll briefly go over the the significant changes uh to the language of the ordinance that

1:06:00we considered. Um the first significant addition uh was to state in the first section that nothing

1:06:08in this ordinance shall require a county employee to physically impede a law enforcement officer. Uh

1:06:13that was added to section one authority. Um again I my understanding is all of you have a copy in

1:06:20front of you so I'm not going to go over minute change but the major ones I will go over. Um

1:06:27we um as much as possible removed explicit direction of the ordinance as to actions of

1:06:38county employees, whether it be the administrator or the more general term of county employee or no

1:06:45county employee shout, and instead use language uh that establish prohibitions or when we did want

1:06:55to direct an affirmative action, uh we directed the board of regional commissioners shall cause

1:07:02um rather than directing a county administrator or anyone else to do it. Uh we're doing this the

1:07:10point of the conversation was largely to avoid any concerns about the authority of the assembly and

1:07:16the authority um of the county commissioners as to direct county employees. Um really, you know,

1:07:23despite any any conrations you might hear, this follows um a from past assembly practice

1:07:31with other ordinances we've proposed and b this is the format that's used uh in Massachusetts

1:07:37general law in the federal uh code. Um when the legislature wants to establish a new program,

1:07:44uh they vest the executive with shall power uh to implement that program. and

1:07:52then the rest is up to the executive power um to implement accordingly. Um and then lastly,

1:07:58we got rid of any reference to um employ internal employee procedures or corrective actions

1:08:09uh as needed to ensure compliance with the ordinance. Thought process being there.

1:08:13uh we're really trusting our administrator and the commissioners to implement this proposal

1:08:18and use whatever tools that they need uh to do it and we didn't want to step on toes or cause

1:08:24additional confusion in uh creating separate unique to this ordinance and these policies

1:08:32uh proposals uh for employee directives. Um the committee took a vote uh a on adopting these

1:08:42amendments. Uh we unanimously voted to recommend that the full assembly adopt these amendments and

1:08:48then the committee voted to recommend the entire ordinance favorably as amended. Um

1:08:55and that went forward with a vote of 4 to one uh on the public services committee. Um, with that,

1:09:02that really concludes any substantive discussion that we had um during that conversation. I'll

1:09:08also emphasize a number of these amendments came together uh in response to concerns addressed by

1:09:15the administrator. Um, and then obviously once we actually start talking about this proposal,

1:09:20I'm I'm happy to talk in a little more length um about those concerns by the administrator

1:09:25and also the merits of the proposal. Uh but for now I'm I'm happy to answer through the speaker

1:09:30any questions about the amendments that we created in the meeting of the public services committee.

1:09:37Uh thank you very much. Um thank you for that complete report. And next on the calendar is

1:09:45the order of the day. Orders of the day. The only the only order for today is proposed

1:09:50ordinance 2026-11 ensuring community safety and lawful federal immigration enforcement.

1:09:58The full assembly voted at our last meeting to postpone consideration of this ordinance

1:10:02until this meeting. Delegate Guess chair of the public services committee. May I have a motion

1:10:08to adopt proposed ordinance 202611 ensuring community safety and lawful veter federal

1:10:14immigration enforcement? Uh, Madam Speaker, uh, I move that the assembly adopts said ordinance.

1:10:27Second,

1:10:47I'm sorry. Let me start that again. There's a motion with a second to adopt

1:10:50proposed ordinance 202611 ensuring community safety and lawful federal

1:10:55immigration enforcement. Is there any discussion on this motion? Okay. Uh

1:11:04delegate Gesson. Uh Madam Speaker, I move to amend

1:11:09uh ordinance 26-11 uh in accordance with the recommendations of the public services committee.

1:11:22and another. It's on the nature of a substitute, right? Yeah. Yeah. It's in

1:11:26the nature of a substitute. Yeah. Um Okay. Uh there is a motion with a second to substitute

1:11:33new language for proposed ordinance 202611. Is there any discussion on this motion?

1:11:43Delegate Gesson. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Uh I've already I think talked at length about uh

1:11:49what these amendments are that we're considering. Um really the purpose behind them. Um I think it

1:11:55was also an appropriate moment to address the concerns that the administrator uh sent to the

1:12:02assembly uh because that they did initially inform the amendments that we're currently

1:12:07discussing. Uh really the administrator pointed towards five uh areas of concern uh that he had

1:12:15with this proposal. Uh one was just confusion that might arise from there existing an executive order

1:12:21and existing an ordinance separate there from um and what you know employees might be confused. Um

1:12:28second the ordinance u assigned operational duties um and again I'm quoting as much as I can. um and

1:12:37the separations of powers issues in the charter of who's allowed to tell who what to do. Um third

1:12:43was a concern um about risking federal contracts uh by um within section 7 requiring that specific

1:12:56language be included in any contracts that the um county enters into. Um section four concern

1:13:04number four um was just confusion between overlap uh between the protect act uh courthouse property

1:13:13and county property. Uh and lastly was just commentary uh by the administrator as to you know

1:13:21how much space is non-public by the county. Uh the commissioner's point the administrator's point is

1:13:26very minimal space at the county is open to the public without restriction. Um, so I followed

1:13:33up with the administrator as I as I promised to in the public services committee to see if

1:13:38there was specific ordinance language uh that the administration would like to see um beyond what

1:13:45we're discussing right now. Um the and then really uh the administrator said when it comes to concern

1:13:51number one that's a matter of just clarifying the policies he sets out. There's no specific language

1:13:56that could be proposed. uh concern that concern number two. Um again, no specific language,

1:14:03just a concern he was raising um broadly. Um there was specific language proposed uh for the contract

1:14:12section which I will propose as a follow-on amendment um for discussion after we vote on this

1:14:18amendment. Um and then likewise um no additional language recommended. Um that's all I got. Oh,

1:14:26and uh I'm going to vote yes on this motion and I would encourage my colleagues to do the same.

1:14:35Uh thank you. Is there anyone else who would like to speak?

1:14:42Oh, thank you, Madam Speaker. So, just to clarify that this motion

1:14:48is to approve the amendments which were made in committee last week, but these

1:14:55um amendments don't address the admin the county administrator's memorandum of October 6th.

1:15:06Is that correct? Oh, go ahead. Uh delegate guessing. Uh delegate. So,

1:15:14the administrator raised all of these concerns prior to the committee meeting. So,

1:15:19a number of the amendments we did make uh were explicitly made to alleviate these

1:15:24concerns. Um I'm talking about clarifying that we're directing the commissioners,

1:15:29not the administrator. Um adding language um around um you know, no nothing in this

1:15:37ordinance shall require a county employee to physically impede a law enforcement officer. So,

1:15:40actually the amendments largely do address it. um just the com the administrator followed up

1:15:46reiterating his concerns broadly and did suggest an additional piece of language

1:15:51to be added to section 7 that I will introduce as a subsequent amended but the committee did

1:15:57discuss and a lot of these recommendations are informed by said administrators concern

1:16:06ahead the short the short answer to that is is no that the um amendments that we're voting on

1:16:14uh we're not addressing the letter which was which was sent on October 6 in that the letter

1:16:20of October 6 from the county administrator reflects concerns of the amended version which

1:16:25we have here today. Is that correct? And if we need clarification from the county administrator,

1:16:31he left. Okay. Oh, Danny, I I I can answer that. Uh but but having spoken to him prior

1:16:37to the meeting, that was that was the um the sense I got that this letter was addressing

1:16:42what was what came out of committee with the amendments included. Thank you.

1:16:49Um the and I will quote the administrator here in the email. Um no, the short answer is not no. The

1:16:55short answer is as I quote the administrator, I have attached an updated memo which mostly

1:17:00reiterates the points I made last week. So yes, clearly because this updated memo was

1:17:07written after the committee meeting, we quite literally did not address the updated memo,

1:17:13but the updated memo, and I quote, reiterates some of the points I made last week. So the substance

1:17:20of the memo was indeed addressed in the committee meeting. So the short answer is yes. Thank you.

1:17:31Thank you, Madam Speaker. Um yeah, I I went through the October 6th um memo and

1:17:41um his questions I mean we we addressed you know paragraph two um he said they're that

1:17:50we're telling you know we're we're um confusing the charter separation of legislature executive

1:17:59and administrative and we already fixed that and I I wrote where I was hoping he'd still be here

1:18:06for this discussion because I couldn't find any place in the amended version where that's still

1:18:12possible. And then um the other thing that he really seems upset about is the federal funding,

1:18:20but um I don't see why ours is any would be any more risky than what the commissioners did or

1:18:29what the governor did. We're just reiterating, you know, and putting in in ordinance form

1:18:37um everybody's desires. We're not, you know, I don't understand why our doing an ordinance is any

1:18:47worse than the commissioners setting out rules or the governor setting out rules. And to be honest,

1:18:55um, with this administration, we're probably not going to get any money anyway. I was amazed

1:19:01we got money. So, um, I I don't think that's a valid concern. Thank you. Uh,

1:19:08yes. Uh, go ahead, Deputy Commissioner Fisel. Thank you. Um, so I think two points. of one

1:19:16um this memorandum of October 6 from the administrator post the amendment version

1:19:24which came out of committee. I think the best I make of it is that um he doesn't think his

1:19:31concerns in his eyes have been fully addressed partially addressed. Now in the eyes of the

1:19:40committee members at least those who have spoken so far they think they have. So that's perhaps a

1:19:46difference of opinion between the administrator and our public service committee or certain

1:19:52members of the committee who've spoken so far. I have a parliamentary question. I understand that

1:19:58delegate is going to propose an amendment. I think I know what it's going to be on section 7. So,

1:20:06I just want to make sure that parliamentarily we're doing this the right way because the motion

1:20:12on the floor is to accept as a substitute for the original ordinance the amended ordinance. So,

1:20:20it takes as a whole all of those amendments in one fell swoop by our vote. Is it proper before

1:20:29or after we take that vote to make an amendment to one section of this amended version that's now on

1:20:36the floor? My understanding of the our rules and Robert's rules is you can go two degrees unless

1:20:42it's budget. And so I don't know what that means. What it means is you can amend an amendment,

1:20:49but you can't amend an amendment to an amendment. You can't go to a third degree. And so it would

1:20:53be cleaner to actually amend the substitute and then take a vote on it all as amended

1:21:00than to do this first and then that is what I and I think and I don't want to put words in

1:21:05his mouth but I think the de delegate was concerned that you couldn't you couldn't

1:21:09may have been concerned that you couldn't do it that way. I would but I but I think that

1:21:16it occurs to me that people may change their mind on whether to vote for the amendment or not based

1:21:20on what is going to Correct. So, so I think it would be then wouldn't it be in order for

1:21:27that amendment to come now onto the floor to amend seven? So, we have everything reversed. I believe

1:21:32so. Uh, delegate Gesson, go ahead. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Um, you know, completely unrelated

1:21:40to the conversation between the parliamentary and the deputy speaker right now. Um,

1:21:43I would like to make a motion that we amend uh the proposed amendment on the floor right now.

1:21:50And I'll share my screen for the language. Uh but essentially at the administrator's

1:21:56request to add the language after in section 7 where practicable add the language and not

1:22:03impermissible by federal uniform guidance and grant insuranceances. I'll share my screen.

1:22:17That was a motion.

1:23:01Go ahead. Uh, delegate Gesson. Does that have a second?

1:23:07Yep. As long as there a second. I'll speak to the the motion. Um essentially this section of our

1:23:15uh ordinance 26-11 instructs an affirmative action that uh not only will the county follow the the

1:23:23other requirements of ordinance 11 um but it will also make sure that contracts, licenses, leases,

1:23:32etc. that we go into also ensure requirement and u compliance with this um ordinance. Uh

1:23:42largely to my mind as a sponsor and author of this proposal, this speaks to what happens if

1:23:47we lease a parking lot property, etc. to um someone else and want to make sure that that

1:23:55property is now continues to remain in compliance uh with the ordinance. Um the question and the

1:24:02concern that the administrator raised is if we don't include the language that I just proposed

1:24:09um that we will risk putting like that there's literally federal guidance that says you can't add

1:24:17additional requirements of this nature to like the homes grant that we heard about today and so forth

1:24:25and to receive additional grants. Um, I don't think the intent of myself and and my co-sponsors

1:24:30on this proposal was to jeopardize that kind of funding by putting an explicit um requirement

1:24:38that those contracts be modified uh in accordance with uh this ordinance. Uh so this is the language

1:24:47largely that the administrator proposed and um I would like to see us move it forward so we don't

1:24:52jeopardize that funding. Uh, delegate. Uh, oh, no, excuse me. Deputy Speaker Fisel. Thank you,

1:25:00Madam Speaker. So, I I um I'm having a little trouble with your language. Uh, Mr. Gesson. Um,

1:25:06so why the word asurances? Grant asurances and not the word grant agreements to make it clear

1:25:15that any grant agreement that would prohibit any such clause would not be one where the county

1:25:23um would object to that. and it would not be in violation of this ordinance so that it's

1:25:29clear that we are not going to jeopardize federal grants by any contractual language. I don't know

1:25:34what the word assurance means here. I I took it from the administrator. Uh this was his requested

1:25:43language. Um if there's better language, I I totally trust the body to uh improve it. However,

1:25:49we won't be able to adopt a third order amendment if the parliamentarian was correct.

1:25:59Well, I I guess that if it's not permissible, I'm I'm surprised he he used the word asurances. I

1:26:05wish he were here to assure us. Um that that was what he um intended. Um another way to

1:26:11cover it would have been to say asurances or agreements. So you cover both bases.

1:26:18Uh yes, Delegate Killian. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Um just point of clarification on

1:26:23this section. So this would apply to appears any contractor operating on county property.

1:26:29So would that mean that any contractor subcontractor would have to be made aware

1:26:37of all the provisions of this ordinance and we be expected to um provide what's required or

1:26:45not required and show proof that that individual has complied with the parts of this ordinance.

1:27:00Go ahead, delegate Gesson. Um, yes to but that that's also not an unusual thing, right? Like

1:27:09um there are numerous laws that govern us every day, whether it's not bringing a handgun into a

1:27:14courthouse or um you know, not trespassing or not drinking and driving. Um and we all comply

1:27:22with those laws on a day-to-day basis. All this says is that uh we're creating new rules

1:27:28such as don't share uh Cape Cotter's personal information with federal officials. So when the

1:27:38administrator adopts this proposal, let's say we contract with Microsoft um to hold our data

1:27:47uh for Aquafund applicants, we're going to include in that contract, you're not going to voluntarily

1:27:52also turn this over to federal officials without our permission. Right? Like you know, because we

1:27:58adopt this in an ordinance, um there's varying degrees of implementation here. We're not going

1:28:03to make everybody take a driver's exam to make sure they understood ordinance 26-11. But we will

1:28:09make sure that we write contracts at the county level that are in the spirit of this ordinance,

1:28:14which I think is is very sensible and and that's why I think this is an important section of it.

1:28:19However, the intent of this section is not to jeopardize grants um that we get from the

1:28:24federal government. So, I think the amendment to this section is very sensible. Thank you,

1:28:31Delegate Killian. Thank you, Madam Speaker. I I'd say this is a significant difference between

1:28:37expecting a contractor not to violate law by driving drunk or anything else and expecting

1:28:43that individual not to cooperate with a federal law enforcement agent, which is not illegal. So,

1:28:48I'd say there is a significant difference here. And you're expecting them not to cooperate in

1:28:52some way, shape, or form. Again, that's open to interpretation. if he speaks to the person

1:28:57and gives him directions to where the front office is, is he violating the provisions of

1:29:01this ordinance? Those are the questions that I would think would have to be answered before we

1:29:05could get to that level. Thank you, Delegate Ali. Delegate Killian, I I I disagree. I I don't think

1:29:14anything here directs an employee of Robert B. Hour who's working on our property or somebody

1:29:20out at Microsoft. This the the the purpose of this amendment is is directed to the language of

1:29:27contracts, leases, licenses, and use agreements. We are not in any way putting ourselves in the

1:29:32position of saying what individuals who come here to work on the property would be able to do. It's

1:29:37in the contract that their employer signs, but I I don't think that's a real concern.

1:29:45Just reading the language here, it just says that the county department shall ensure that vendors

1:29:50and contractors operating on county property comply with applicable provisions. So yes,

1:29:56they're going to be responsible for being able to apply these provisions as they work here.

1:30:00So not saying they're and again if that's the language that you want and that's your

1:30:04expectation. I'm just curious as to how we're going to enforce this and and how we're going

1:30:10to ensure that people that coming on the property are aware of all this particular

1:30:14provision. You're talking about a guy who might be mowing the grass. He's he's got to be aware

1:30:18that these provisions exist and he must abide by them. That's what the language says here. That's

1:30:22how I read it. I I think we're we're beginning to go around a little bit here. So I I uh I um

1:30:34we'll have one more comment from um restrict comments from who? What?

1:30:54Yeah, we we we've we've had a number of people already speak twice to this

1:30:58issue. Uh and we've had a couple of new people weigh in now. Uh at this point,

1:31:02if there's somebody who hasn't spoken who would like to add anything to this conversation,

1:31:08um otherwise, I think we should move on.

1:31:14Delegate Fuller, I don't speak often, but I do have something to say on this. This whole

1:31:21conversation has morphed away from the original intent of all of this. The original intent was we

1:31:28didn't want certain law enforcement on parks, but then it became tied to money. You know,

1:31:35we're we're going to lose a grant if we allow this, so we're going to lose this. We're either

1:31:39going to vote we're going to support as a um delegation to we don't want this kind

1:31:46of enforcement on our property and not tie it to the money. If we have to tie it to the money, then

1:31:53we're not really making a sound decision. Thank you. Thank you, Delegate Fuller. Anyone else?

1:32:06We've already kind of uh Okay. So, she has he has knocked on. What's that? She is.

1:32:14Okay. Delegate harder. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Um I completely disagree with

1:32:22Delegate Killian. It says all county contracts, leases, licenses, and use

1:32:30agreements where practicable. It's not saying the employees of the people we're contracting with

1:32:41um need to know this. That's we're not telling employees to do anything. We're working with the

1:32:47people we hire. But put that aside. Um, I there have been really bad things that have happened,

1:33:03but honestly, if we want to take this whole section out, as as Delegate Fuller said,

1:33:11we could take it out because the most important thing is not letting ICE pull their

1:33:22violate certain civil rights on county property. Thank you. Okay. Thank you very much, Delegate

1:33:31Harter. Uh yes, go ahead. Uh ah yes, Delegate King. I called a question on the amendment. Oh,

1:33:40okay. Um my a second. I need a second on that. Second. My understanding is we need to treat this

1:33:50separately and vote on section seven contracts and then we go to the other amendments. You

1:34:01got to vote on motion to call. So what which do you hold? Going to vote up to call the question

1:34:06first debate on this and call. I apologize. Did I get it wrong? Did you tell me anyway? All right,

1:34:13let's call the question on and just just so we're if you mind just so we're clear, it's calling the

1:34:19question on this particular amendment and we got to take a vote on that first. Just for future

1:34:24reference of this conversation, I don't know if you guys all know if your if your purpose is to

1:34:30call the question, you might actually make it go slower because you you are opening up people being

1:34:35able to debate calling the question when they might be when they might be out of time to debate

1:34:39the particular question. So, we can do this now. I just want to like as we as we No, that is not

1:34:45accurate. Our our rules allow up to 15 minutes to debate to call the question. So, I'm saying just

1:34:50keep that in mind when we do this again at any other point tonight. Question. No. And that's why

1:34:56I'm saying that's why I'm pointing out something in our rules just so you know. But but you would

1:35:01you like a a roll call on this to call this the question on this particular motion? Yes. It's

1:35:08that really. Okay. Delegate Frederickson. No. Okay. Uh, delegate Fryel. No. Delegate Fuller.

1:35:23Yes. Delegate Gallagher. Yes. Delegate Gasson. Yes. Delegate Green. Delegate Green. Delegate

1:35:34Harter. Yes. Delegate Killian. No delegate king. Yes. Delegate mccelie. No. Delegate. Yes. Dele

1:35:45Doman. No. Delegate Samson. Yes. Delegate Tai. Yes. Speaker Warner. No. All right. So,

1:36:00the motion the motion to call a question fails. You're still on debate on this original thing,

1:36:05but I would like to remind people on every particular question, which this is, everybody

1:36:10has five minutes twice. I think we're almost exhausted on this particular question anyway. Yes.

1:36:20Yes, you. Okay. So, just to be clear because we're all getting a little confused here and I

1:36:25am included in that. Um, we're now debating this. Let me make some. Okay. We're now debating this

1:36:33section. All right. So, I know because we didn't call the question. Okay. And if someone wanted

1:36:40to change anything right now on this section, you're saying that would be a thirdderee change

1:36:46and therefore it's not permissible. And if you wanted to change this section, you have to wait

1:36:51till the entire amendment is adopted. Then after adop adoption, move to amend this section. Is

1:36:58that what you're telling us? I don't think so. I think really I think if you really because you're

1:37:03getting to third degree I think if you wanted to do this you would vote this one down and then make

1:37:08another one that's different and it would still be second degree. It's like it's you could still have

1:37:12sequential amendments, but we are we are we are starting to get well that that that's that's my

1:37:18answer. That's why because I was just wondering because I thought Delegate Harter was intending

1:37:22but maybe I'm wrong to suggest that there's an amendment to delete this section entirely from

1:37:29the ordinance. Why I think it would be fine if we did, but it's not a it wasn't a motion. Okay.

1:37:39Delegate um Frederickson, please. Good evening. Um I make a motion to eliminate section seven.

1:37:50Well, might I There's a motion with a second on the floor. You got to deal

1:37:56with this particular especially through the second agree. This is what's on the floor.

1:37:59So unless somebody withdraws your second, withdraws the motion, you have to deal with

1:38:03this particular motion and take a vote on it first before you before you do anything else.

1:38:10You go. In other words, you have to defeat this motion. The motion. Point of order. Yeah. Who

1:38:21asked that question? I guess. Oh. Oh, Dan. Go ahead. Delegate. No. I I I know. Point of

1:38:27order. Uh I know and respect the rule that every delegate gets to speak twice on anything. Um,

1:38:31I know I I've spoken more than twice, but at least one of those was specifically to answer a question

1:38:39um posed by another delegate at the speaker's request, not on my view on this proposal. Uh,

1:38:45would it be in order for me to raise my hand and speak again?

1:38:52Yes.

1:38:58Did you eat? Perfect. Um, here's my argument. A, to adopt this and B,

1:39:06to keep section seven and move on to the merits of this proposal. If you support ordinance 26-11,

1:39:14this is a sensible section to support it. If you oppose ordinance 26-11 and you don't want to

1:39:20see this section, that is your view on ordinance 26-11. This any ordinance section can be read in

1:39:28absurd to absurdity. You can read anything to mean anything if you really want to stretch the meaning

1:39:34of words. What this ordinance section 7 says is county departments shall ensure that vendors and

1:39:41contractors operating on county property comply with applicable provisions herein. Sure. If you

1:39:49want to read it to absurdity, you can say this means we're telling somebody who's mowing the lawn

1:39:53that they have to um write a regulation because it says that the executive branch must write a

1:39:59regulation. What it actually means, what anyone implementing this at the administrator's office,

1:40:05what anyone reading this in a courtroom would interpret it to mean is if we hire

1:40:09a security guard who's a contractor, they will comply with the applicable provision,

1:40:16the provision of this ordinance that applies to them, which means not to allow people into

1:40:21non-public areas of the courthouse. Right? This is a very sensible provision that exists here to

1:40:28make sure we are doing things in accordance with the intent of this ordinance. Not beyond it, not

1:40:35smaller than it. We are saying we are using words like we're practicable um and with applicable

1:40:42provisions so that our administrator can have the leeway that he needs to write regulations,

1:40:49create policy and allow his departments to create policy for their employees and to allow

1:40:55their employees to write contracts that make sense where applicable and where practicable

1:41:01with the provisions of the ordinance we're passing today. So again, I I will caution us here because

1:41:08this is a long ordinance and we can dive into any one clause of it and read it to absurdity

1:41:13that if you support ordinance 26-11, this has nothing to do with funding. This has nothing

1:41:19to do with money. This is simply a provision that makes sure that there isn't a glaring loophole in

1:41:26this ordinance when it comes to contractors. And I would encourage delegates to approach this with

1:41:34u the good faith understanding of why any section was included here. If you have questions,

1:41:39we're always happy to answer them. But I promise none of these sections were written, intended,

1:41:43or mean anything that is necessarily and clearly absurd. Um, so again, for delegates that support

1:41:49the provisions of this ordinance, I would encourage you to vote yes on this amendment

1:41:54because our administrator asked us to so that there isn't unintended con consequences. And then

1:41:59I would encourage us to not touch section section 7, adopt the amended ordinance, and then discuss

1:42:07the merits of the ordinance itself in good faith. Thank you very much. That's all I have. Okay. Uh,

1:42:18I think we should call it. Do you want to roll call on this amendment?

1:42:25Roll call for this for for this particular amendment. Delegate Frederickson.

1:42:36Yes.

1:42:40Yes. Yes. Yes.

1:42:48Clerk, I think your mic is off, but it's a yes for me. All right. Delegate Gson, thank you. Delegate

1:42:53Green. Delegate Harder. Yes. Delegate Kellian, no. Delegate King, no. Delegate McCali, yes.

1:43:03Delegate Ali, yes. Dean Nomomen, yes. Delegate Samson, yes. Delegate Tai delegate Thai deleg uh

1:43:14speaker Warner yes it's 11 representing 85.64% 64% of the county's population. Madam Speaker,

1:43:20so now I believe we're back to the substitute language as amended by that amendment.

1:43:34If I if I do you mind if I Yes. So go ahead. Originally you had a motion to adopt the

1:43:41ordinance as it was proposed by everybody. Then there was substitute language as recommended by

1:43:46the public services committee for that original proposed amendment. That was an amendment that

1:43:52was requested by the administrator to that substitute. So now you're back to the package

1:43:56of amendments that public services recommended as it's been amended as the administrator requested.

1:44:05So now we're back to that the amendment itself. So we're going to do a roll call. We can Yeah.

1:44:13Let's do unless unless anybody wants a discussion. Yeah. Yeah. Well, just so just so I might because

1:44:20we don't we don't do this all the time. Oh, sorry. Just so I might because we don't do this all the

1:44:24time. Our debate rules say now that this now that this question is going on, everybody's got if they

1:44:30want to take it twice for five minutes to talk about this question. So just just so we know,

1:44:36delegate Kad, just a point of order. So we can make amendments now to what's before us. Correct.

1:44:42Okay. So absolutely correct. So given the comments of uh item four of the uh county administrator,

1:44:48I would recommend we we strike section six uh from this agreement because if you read that there are

1:44:53some serious concerns about conflict with law and and with the courts and I'm not sure we can create

1:45:00language to assuage the county administrator as to um being able to make that remedy.

1:45:10Any other? Uh, yes. Go ahead, Delegate Samson. With all due respect,

1:45:17um, I would suggest that we leave section six in. Um, the language that is in here is

1:45:25is consistent with the governor's uh, original executive order. It's also in compliance with

1:45:33the Supreme Massachusetts Supreme Court case of Lond versus Commonwealth and it gives guidance to

1:45:41uh public officials of what they should and should not do which is specifically what the

1:45:48governor recommended other agent other public agencies do as a result of her executive order.

1:45:56So we're we're supporting the governor's executive order. We're also supporting the commissioner's

1:46:03adoption of that executive order. So I believe that the whole package as written and specifically

1:46:12including this where we do have a courthouse here that this this language is important. Thank you.

1:46:24Killian ju just to follow up on that. I understand that part of it. However,

1:46:27um the the administrator specifically calls out the fact that some of these spaces are are

1:46:32split up and there might be confusion about what spaces we are uh what spaces uh are applicable.

1:46:39Uh as it sits currently some county employees are within court buildings and behind court assigned

1:46:44security while section 6B attempts to delineate county space from court space. Effectively,

1:46:49it is all court space beyond court security. and he's concerned that enough confusion exists to

1:46:54confuse both county and court staff as to where ICE may have access and where it would not. So

1:47:00unfortunately that concern is is valid and it's not addressed in here nor addressed obviously by

1:47:05the state's uh laws. So we can either try and clear that up and delineate those faces and

1:47:11identify them or we should simply strike it from the from the entire ordinance.

1:47:18Uh, delegate uh, Gethin. Well, I'll say thankfully, you know, we we considered

1:47:24this concern when we drafted the ordinance. Uh, and that's why the ordinance explicitly says to

1:47:30the extent permitted by law and consistent with the operations of the court in section

1:47:35A. And in section B, it says, "Nothing in this section shall be construed to interfere with the

1:47:42judicial branch or to expand access beyond that permitted to members of the general public. We're

1:47:47using limiting language here to ensure that we are not getting into the courthouse's way. We

1:47:52are also acknowledging and aware of the fact that any state law, as our attorneys have said to us,

1:47:58supersedes any county ordinance. So, if there is any conflict there, the state law rules. There's

1:48:04no need for further dispute on that. Um, and I and again, I'll say I commend our administrator

1:48:11for being cautious, for pointing out possible issues and concerns that might arise. Um, and I'm

1:48:17confident as we discussed thoroughly at the public services committee, that by using language such as

1:48:23to the extent permitted by law and consistent with the operations of the core as well as shall not be

1:48:28construed to interfere with the judicial branch, we have given the administrator sufficient leeway

1:48:35to draft his implementation of this ordinance in a way that makes sense for our unique relationship

1:48:43with the courts here in Barnstable County. Um, I would also say this is this is really the heart

1:48:49of the ordinance in a lot of ways uh when it comes to uh forbidding federal immigration enforcement

1:48:57on county property, including courouses here in Cape Cod. Um, and I would als say if if you if

1:49:02you support this proposal, I would encourage you to retain section six. Thank you very much. Uh,

1:49:09yes. Uh, Deputy Speaker Fisel. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Um I I read and reread and reread

1:49:16um the administrator's comment on an article on section six and I don't agree with it. Um

1:49:22I don't see the confusion he's suggesting. Um and I think section 6 as drafted doesn't create

1:49:30that confusion. I think that if there is any possibility of some other law superseding this,

1:49:35it makes that clear. So I I think it's clear in section six that if it's county controlled,

1:49:41it's it's subject to this ordinance. Um, and so I I think the interpretation by

1:49:46uh the uh delegates who have spoken before, Mr. Gesson and and and Mr. Samson, I agree with

1:49:51that interpretation. I don't see the problem. Uh, Delegate Frederickson. No, not yet. Okay,

1:50:01Madam Speaker, um the more I' I've been thinking about this uh in in respect to delegate killer,

1:50:09um I think section section six is the heart of the issue and and I'm speaking right now as a law

1:50:18enforcement professional that if our employees are going to get in trouble, that's where it's

1:50:24going to occur. Okay. And the the Supreme Court has been very very clear that we cannot take

1:50:32action in nonjud judicial warrants for any for any misdemeanor that that a federal misdemeanor

1:50:41we can't touch. Okay. If they come out and say and and this is the confusion where the public is

1:50:48confused as well. If they have an arrest warrant, a criminal warrant, we can help them. Okay? And we

1:50:56will help them. But but what the Supreme Court is saying, do not get involved in some administrative

1:51:04warrant that was assigned by the supervisor in some office. All right? And and that's where

1:51:12police officers are going to get in trouble. The police officers need the guidance in section six.

1:51:19Thank you. I'm passionate about this. Thank you. Thank you very much, Delegate Samson. Anyone else?

1:51:31Go ahead.

1:51:35I'm concerned about uh the memo that the administrator wrote and I look at article the part

1:51:42number two of this about ordin uh the ordinance assigns operational duties. uh how have you

1:51:48addressed that in your amended version and because he believes uh that the duties belong to the

1:51:56county administrator and the county commissioners to administer um that's their function according

1:52:01to the charter. So how does this not violate what they're doing and violate the charter as well?

1:52:10Thank you. Uh do we have guess

1:52:18Go ahead, Delegate Gusen. Sure. Uh, if it's okay, uh, with the speaker,

1:52:22I'll also share my screen because I I thought this question might come up. So,

1:52:26I I drafted something briefly uh to show as well as tell. Is that okay?

1:52:34Yes. Thank you. Um, so, um, the executive power. All right. We'll we'll first talk about the

1:52:45ordinance uh and the amendments therein. Um we've got this ordinance. So um we did hear

1:52:55the administrator loud and clear when he came to our meeting and spoke about this concern.

1:53:00um numerous amendments that we made here. Uh specifically looking at um let me scroll to it

1:53:13section 8 uh section 9 sorry implementation and enforcement. We shifted our language where it

1:53:20originally said the county administrator shall um and county departments shall

1:53:27um and county administrator this and that. We shifted that language in my opinion out of an

1:53:33overabundance of caution to say the board of regional commissioners consistent with

1:53:38its authority under the Barnesville County Home Rule Charter shall and the board the board of

1:53:43regional commissioners acting through the county administrator as appropriate may establish. Right.

1:53:48So what we did effectively is we shifted the conversation uh and and the mandate created by

1:53:54the ordinance from the administrator to the board of commissioners acting through their

1:53:59appropriate body. Um this has been a common point of friction that the the board has raised. Um and

1:54:06a these amendments were made to alleviate that concern. But I will also talk about the fact that

1:54:12there's this charter concern. Um, as much as we want to think that we're unique here, we've got

1:54:17a charter with three branches of government, like really any other institution in the United States,

1:54:23uh, and one thing that the charter does in section 3-2 is it vests the executive powers

1:54:28of Barnesville County Regional Government shall be vested in solely in the board of regional

1:54:33commissioners and may be exercised when directly whether directly by the board or through several

1:54:38regional etc., etc. The executive powers of the county are vested in the board of

1:54:42commissioners. The board of commissioners shall cause this charter, the laws, and I emphasize

1:54:48the ordinances and orders to be enforced. Right? That is the role of county commissioners. It's

1:54:54the way it's written in the similar different language, but similar in the Massachusetts state

1:54:59constitution. That's the way it's done in the federal level. You vest power in the executive

1:55:03branch. And then in the in the federal power, they shall take care that the laws be executed.

1:55:09here the board of regional commissioners shall cause that the ordinances be enforced.

1:55:14So under these regimes at the federal level and at the state level there are numerous examples of the

1:55:21legislative body writing legislation similar to this such as you know when you establish

1:55:27ROTC programs the the Congress said the president shall cause to be established um when we um fill

1:55:38election we when there's laws to fill elections when their vacancies occur uh the legislation says

1:55:44the governor shall cause precepts to be issued etc etc. There are numerous countless examples because

1:55:51this is really one of the most common ways that legislation is implemented is by the legislative

1:55:58body empowering with language that includes the word shall for the executive branch whether it's

1:56:04the governor or the president or in our case the board commissioners to cause their effect. Um,

1:56:09so all that to say, while I appreciate the administrator's abundance of caution in a

1:56:16separation of powers concern, this falls well, we already adjusted our ordinance to be even more

1:56:24cautious by addressing the commissioners and not the administrator. And secondly,

1:56:30um, this is the way things were done. This is the way laws are written. And this I don't see there

1:56:36being a concern um as to separation of powers uh when it comes to the implementation of this

1:56:41ordinance because frankly there is no other way for us to exercise our legislative authority to

1:56:47draft enforceable ordinances. Thank you very much. Uh thank you delegate Gesson. Um you

1:56:55need a break to fix this up. We're we're we're trying to address a blinking side of the phone

1:57:01here that hits some people. Does is everybody's blinking or How come How come mine? Mine isn't.

1:57:13Oh, okay. Okay. So, one, too. Is there anyone else who would like to speak to this? Oh,

1:57:25we we if you don't mind, m we're talking about

1:57:29um delegate Killian's motion to remove section six from the substitute language.

1:57:56test thing. All right. Good.

1:58:01Everybody test this. Okay. So, thank you, Ian. Thank you very much. We're we're all

1:58:07back in in sync here. Uh is there anyone else who would like to speak to this which

1:58:12is the six the section six, right? And so would you like a vote a vote on this,

1:58:20Madam Speaker? No. I Yes, I should take a vote on this. Would you

1:58:29I I believe a yes vote would be to remove section six from the substitute language

1:58:35and a no vote would be to keep it in the substitute language.

1:58:41Point of order. I mean, I don't remember a motion being made or a second. Well,

1:58:46there's at this point there's definitely a motion that was made and you've moved f far

1:58:49enough through this discussion that actually doesn't matter if there's a second being made.

1:58:53Don't test me on this. I I've been we've been through this before, right? Like like if somebody

1:58:58if somebody in the beginning said there's no second, then discussion would have been halted.

1:59:02But you've moved far enough now that it doesn't matter that there's no second. Delegate Killian

1:59:09saying is been through this one before. The fact that there's no second at this point

1:59:14does not matter. You don't even have to record seconds in the minutes. So,

1:59:18the point of a second is to prevent any individual member from wasting

1:59:21everybody's time when nobody else wants to do it. We're past that.

1:59:34I appreciate the motion by uh Mr. Killian. Um I think it's a vast improvement from the first

1:59:43version that was put out. Um, and I think it that was a major issue when I brought it up two weeks

1:59:49ago, the separation of powers, and I think that section addressed it. So, I think we're I think

1:59:57we're okay with it for with that section. That's all we're speaking about right now, that section,

2:00:01right? Just a point of order. It's section section six that we're talking about. I know

2:00:07Delegate McKelie mentioned uh item two, but I was actually referring to item four in section six.

2:00:19Okay. So, our So, would you like a roll call on this? Yes. What is this? This

2:00:26would be whether to remove section six from the substitute language or leave it in. So,

2:00:30yes means remove. Yes means remove. No means leave it in. Okay. Delegate Frederickson.

2:00:40No. Leaves it in. No.

2:00:45Deputy Speaker Fry. No. Delegate Fuller. No. Delegate Gallagher. No. Delegate Gassin. No.

2:00:53Delegate Green. Delegate Harter. No. Delegate Killian. Yes. Delegate King.

2:00:58No. Delegate McKelie. No. Delegate Omali. No. Dean Omen. No. Delegate Samson. No.

2:01:06Delegate tie. Speaker Warner. No. Madam Speaker, that's 12 against representing

2:01:1188.52% of the county's population. We're back to the substitute language.

2:01:24Okay. Is there any more discussion on the substitute language?

2:01:31Delegate Kellian. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Just one question to the the folks who are

2:01:35uh proponents of this given the fact that we have the protect Act which was passed

2:01:40subsequent to the originally proposing this and that the commissioners have uh put in at least

2:01:45two executive orders to cover this. What exactly does this ordinance do and who specifically would

2:01:53it apply to that they don't already have current protections from? specifically. I I because I've

2:02:00looked through the the law and I've looked through what the commissioners have done and I've looked

2:02:05at this and it just seems like we're trying to drill down into some weeds that I don't know

2:02:10where they're growing from. So, I'm just curious as to what circumstance would arise now where they

2:02:18came to the county and even with the protect Act and the commissioner's executive orders,

2:02:24they would have been in trouble if not for this ordinance. Can someone just explain to me what

2:02:30cracks we have filled between the state law and the executive action by the commissioners that we

2:02:38have spent countless hours mulling over and have gotten to this point. We're finally ready to vote

2:02:44and that we the problems that we have solved and I would appreciate some a specific instance where

2:02:50that is helpful. I see delegate Ali and I was hopeful because I know he explains things so well.

2:03:00Delegate Ali, go ahead. I think one of the key differences is that executive orders are

2:03:06of very questionable duration and frankly of substance. Um this would this would substitute

2:03:12in fact a law that passed by the the legislative body. I think that's that's the the essence of

2:03:18it right there. An executive order is as we see a piece of paper drafted by the executive

2:03:25um without a whole lot of basis. Uh there's no charter there's no charter reference to such

2:03:30by such things and the the very next board of commissioners could very easily just choose to

2:03:35ignore it. So the the what the the the substance of what we're doing here is incorporating this

2:03:41into the law of Cape Cod regional government. Thank you, Delegate Omali. Delegate harder. Oh,

2:03:50uh, just a moment. Uh, Delegate Killian would like to respond to that. Delegate harder. So,

2:03:55given that argument, I I certainly understand it. Um, even if we pass this ordinance,

2:04:01we are telling the executive branch how to enforce it, what's to prevent them from enforcing in any

2:04:07way they see fit or not enforcing it because they are ultimately the ones responsible for it. So,

2:04:12I that's my point. I understand the difference between executive action and an ordinance,

2:04:16but we're basically looking at the same thing in in ter practical matters. What

2:04:21actions we are creating or what protections we are creating specifically which further

2:04:27enhance what is done by the state law and what is done by the county commissioners.

2:04:37I don't know that I've got the answer to that one, but wait administrator as an employee. Hold

2:04:43on. Delegate Harter is next and then we'll come back to you, Delegate Ali. Go ahead. Uh, thanks

2:04:50to thanks to uh, Deputy Speaker Fisel who asked this at the meeting. Um, first of all, we're not,

2:04:58if you read it, there is no um there is nothing describing enforcement. Um, we're not telling

2:05:06them how to enforce it. Um, we leave that up to the executive branch and the administration. Um,

2:05:13but the reason we need the ordinance is to make it an official act of county government. That's

2:05:23what we do. We write ordinances that set the laws. So we need the ordinance to make it official. And

2:05:32the other reason we need this is because it's not just to um sort of set guidance on how to

2:05:44handle this situation that we find ourselves in. But I think if you read um in every section, it

2:05:52clearly says to me in different language that our main goal with this is to protect our employees.

2:06:02That we don't want our employees to feel like they have to do something like, you know, it

2:06:11says don't go up and physically stop them. I mean, I think I think that this ordinance both stands

2:06:19up for what we believe what many of us believe in, but it also to me is a way of the assembly

2:06:27of delegates saying basically to the staff of the county, don't worry, we've got your back.

2:06:37Thank you, Delegate Harter. Uh, what about uh delegate was who which I okay uh delegate guess go

2:06:46ahead. No, I I think um in terms of the concrete question that the dog from Sandwich asked,

2:06:53uh there's numerous provisions in this ordinance that were not included in the executive order

2:06:58um which include not sharing personal information um and guidance on personal information and

2:07:06private information of individuals who use county services. Um, two is reporting requirements

2:07:13uh to ensure you know if a situation happens or someone does get snatched out of a courthouse

2:07:18um through immigration enforcement uh and the family doesn't know where that person ended up

2:07:23or there are subsequent legal proceedings, the county is going to make information

2:07:27available that's public and in in the spirit of transparency. Uh those are two provisions off the

2:07:32top of my head that were not necessarily codified in the executive order. Um, and lastly, I I think

2:07:37there's a lot of merit to writing laws and passing ordinances uh despite executive power. You know,

2:07:45the argument that just because something might not be enforced, why bother passing it um doesn't

2:07:53strike me as necessarily, you know, all executive power is vested in the board of commissioners,

2:08:00right? Even when we want to transfer money from pot A to pot B, the commissioners or

2:08:05the executive branch still needs to be the one that actually transfers the money from bank A,

2:08:10bank B. If if our logic is um the executive branch could just ignore it, so why bother? Well,

2:08:17that that's true of anything. Why are we passing any ordinances if if we don't have any executive

2:08:21power to then go in and enforce them? Um I think we pass ordinances because they're the right thing

2:08:27to do. Um, we are seeing individuals in our community who are concerned, who are afraid,

2:08:34and the ordinance is the strongest tool that we have in our county government in order to ensure

2:08:41that individuals in our community are protected from immigration enforcement that they're afraid

2:08:46of. It does so through five different tools. Um, by prohibiting the use of administrative warrants

2:08:52as sufficient to enter non-public areas of county property. It does so by protecting the personal

2:08:58information of uh individuals who use county services so that if you apply for the Aqua Fund,

2:09:04you're not worried that your tax returns are then going to be handed over to immigration enforcement

2:09:09um when the law doesn't require that to be done. It creates reporting requirements. It it prohibits

2:09:15the use of county property to be staging areas for immigration enforcement. I think these are

2:09:20all meritw worthy and necessary um protections for members of our community and the ordinances

2:09:29are go beyond just an executive order. That's merely an executive branch's commitment to doing

2:09:34this which really lacks any enforcibility beyond the executive branch's desire to stick to that

2:09:40commitment. Whereas an ordinance puts that in county law. It's the strongest tool we have and

2:09:45I think there's an incredible amount in America moving forward with it today. And I believe anyone

2:09:50who believes these kind of protections should exist should support this ordinance because all

2:09:55it does is bolster the responsibilities and the protections created by the state and the

2:10:01executive branch of Marx County. Thank you. Thank you, Delegate Gesson. Is there uh yes, go ahead.

2:10:11So, I guess my question is, can this ordinance stop anyone from getting

2:10:17arrested by ICE in a courtroom or a courthouse? It cannot.

2:10:25So, I mean, I just feel like we're duplicating what's already been done. The state has a has the

2:10:31um their new law in place, the Protect Act. The county has a uh has an executive order

2:10:38that's already in place. and being done. To my knowledge, after talking to the administrator,

2:10:42no one's been snatched from any of our courtrooms or courouses or property. Uh,

2:10:48and I I think it's redundant and I think it's I don't know if we're really serving the best

2:10:56interest of the community by keep duplicating things that are already in place. That's just my

2:11:01opinion and I respect everyone else's opinion, but that's how I feel at this moment. So,

2:11:10I I support that. And and the other thing I want to say is we got to be

2:11:15careful with these ordinances. When you go when you go down this road,

2:11:20you're managing the the the you you got to let the the the operational the the the

2:11:29people that are running the thing run the run the organization. We can't micromanage

2:11:33them. And that is what we're doing here. We are micromanaging organization. That's not our job.

2:11:44Thank you, Madam Speaker. Uh we are very lucky that ICE has not been as active in

2:11:50Barnesville County as it has in many other places. Uh there was however an

2:11:55ICE arrest in the Orleans courthouse. Uh it was either last spring or the spring before

2:12:00that and the poor Hyannis resident was held in ICE detention. not allowed to appear in

2:12:06court for the charges that he was meant to face. Ultimately, those charges were dropped

2:12:11uh because of the non-ooperation of ICE with the legal authorities. I ICE operates outside

2:12:18the law without regard for the law. And you can make any argument, what's the point of

2:12:24passing another law that they're only going to disregard? I'm sorry. That's what we do.

2:12:29We pass laws. It's up to the people who enforce them. they'll take on that responsibility. That's

2:12:35not our responsibility. We want to put the law in place. I will support this ordinance.

2:12:43Uh thank you. Yes. Go ahead. Uh thank you. Um, regarding your issue of um, you know,

2:12:53passing a law, there's 351 police departments, municipal police departments in this state. Every

2:13:03single one of them has their own policy on how to do a certain thing or and and sometimes our

2:13:11policies will be different to address something in that particular community. That's why it's very

2:13:18legitimate for us to have for our county to have this ordinance similar to a policy. Okay, that

2:13:27explains how we want our people to handle it when they come across this type of a situation. So,

2:13:36um this this contains many of the things that this that is in the executive order. Um, however,

2:13:44when the governor signed her executive order, she specifically recommended that other other

2:13:52government entities pass their own guidelines for their particular conditions and that's what this

2:14:01does. So, we're we're really we're doing what the governor recommended we do as a individual

2:14:09government entity. Deputy Speaker Fisel. Yes, I be brief. Um, so if the executive orders of the

2:14:16governor were sufficient, why did the legislature pass the protect Act? So they passed the Protect

2:14:21Act which basically in many ways codified the executive orders. Why? Because it has the force

2:14:27of law and the executive orders did not argue. That's why they did it similar here. Thank you,

2:14:34Delegate Killian. Yeah. Just I think you made the argument for us that the protect Act is in place

2:14:39and that governs those 351 police departments. It it does in terms of cooperating with ICE.

2:14:46They cannot cooperate with ICE. And so that is what we're talking about. And so is has been

2:14:51made here. This does not really address that. We can't prevent ICE from coming on the property in

2:14:57any way, shape or form. So we have the protect Act and we have the executive order which address all

2:15:03these issues. And so you can put this ordinance in place, but it's not I don't think it's going

2:15:08to change operationally change anything is how the county operates right now. And as I said,

2:15:13I've asked that question where what cracks are falling between that we're going to fill with

2:15:17this ordinance and it really hasn't been answered because I think everything has been covered and

2:15:21this is just trying to layer something on top of it. Uh thank you everyone. I I would like

2:15:27to at this point uh uh ask deputy ask uh clerk uh Fletcher to uh to call. So this is on the

2:15:34amendment and not the full ordinance because we still have one more step to back out of this. So

2:15:39this would be a roll call on just the amendments that the public services committee Yes. No,

2:15:45I'm I've been keep excuse me. I've been keeping track. We took two mo two votes. One was to change

2:15:51the language of section 7. The other one was on delegate Killian's motion to remove six. We're

2:15:56literally still on the amendments themselves. I know that everybody's been debating the main

2:16:00question, but hopefully that'll mean that we don't have to debate the main question.

2:16:04You'd like a roll call on the amendments, Madam Speaker? Delegate Frederickson, on the amendments.

2:16:09This these are on the these are on the amendments that came out of public services. No, we already

2:16:13did that. This is on the amendments that came out of public services. That whole package. Yes. Yes.

2:16:22On the main question. Yes. Yes. All right. Delegate. Deputy Speaker Fisel. This is

2:16:31a motion to accept the amendment. Yes. Yes. Deleia Fuller. Yes. Deleia

2:16:37Gallagher. Yes. Delia Gassen. Yes. Delia Green. Delearter. Yes. Delia Killian. No.

2:16:46Delia King. Yes. Delia McCelie. Yes. Deal. Yes. Dean Omen. Yes. Delegate Samson. Yes,

2:16:55dele speaker Warner. Yes. So now the amendments as we've amended them today based on the the the

2:17:05regional administrator's requests. So now this is the language that's before the assembly,

2:17:10not the original proposed ordinance. We've got a

2:17:13motion and a second on the floor. Hopefully a lot of the debate No,

2:17:17I won't editorialize, but it sounded like we were debating the main question for a while.

2:17:24All right. Are there any questions on the final last vote, which is the main question? Go ahead,

2:17:31Delegate Gesson. Thank you, Madam Speaker. Uh,

2:17:34and I appreciate the conversation that we've had thus far this assembly. Um,

2:17:38we can't hear you well. Can't hear you. Can you hear me now? My my mic's on. I think it's You're

2:17:46just a little far from the mic. The volume. Can you hear me now? Might be a volume thing up there.

2:18:02Let me know. Hello.

2:18:08Let me know if I'm good to go. You're good. Uh I appreciate all the discussion. Uh and

2:18:14and I can let folks have a conversation. I can appreciate a conversation about whether or not

2:18:20we should establish these protections. Um I'm a firm believer that we we should. Um but I will say

2:18:28I would appreciate delegates um if you think we don't need these protections. I get that and vote

2:18:35no. But this ordinance serves a very definitive purpose. I have already laid out on a number

2:18:45of occasions um what this ordinance covers that neither the protect Act nor the executive orders

2:18:51do. Protecting personal information, addressing county property that the Protect Act does not.

2:18:59Staging areas on county property that the Protect Act does not. And as Delegate Samson has stated

2:19:04on numerous occasions to good merit, the Protect Act actually directs municipalities and agencies

2:19:11and therefore our county to establish its own policies. These are those policies. So this is not

2:19:18redundant. This is a solid piece of legislation that serves a very specific purpose, a purpose

2:19:24that is not indifferent, that is different than anything that's been implemented thus far. Um, and

2:19:30now on the merits of it, there to my understanding was ICE as recently as today in front of the

2:19:37Falmouth courthouse participating in immigration enforcement activity. There are numerous people in

2:19:44our community, a community that is really fueled largely because of its lack of affordability and

2:19:50its seasonal nature by an immigrant population that we are so lucky to have in our community.

2:19:56an immigrant population that is rightfully terrified of immigration enforcement that has

2:20:03been capricious, that has been vicious, that has been violent, and immigration enforcement that is

2:20:10also nondiscriminated between criminals and anyone else they can round up. There have been people

2:20:17that have committed no crimes with valid cases for asylum that are currently sitting in concentration

2:20:23camps in El Salvador. If you witnessed a crime in Barnstable County and you might have even

2:20:29been on TPS status a month ago, but that got taken away from you by the federal government,

2:20:35are you going to show up to a courthouse in front of which there was ICE enforcement yesterday? All

2:20:43under the understanding of, oh, no, it's okay. The Barnesville County Commissioners signed an

2:20:47executive order. I feel perfectly safe now. Right. I also don't think that this ordinance

2:20:52will necessarily alleviate every single concern out there, but it is the most strong protection

2:21:00we have the power to make. And that's a protection that's absolutely necessary in this day and age in

2:21:06our community. So, if you don't think we need to establish that protection, that is a position and

2:21:11you can vote on that position. But this ordinance creates substantive protections. Substantive

2:21:17protections that would have protected my father when he came to the United States as a refugee

2:21:21from the Soviet Union. Did not have citizenship because he was stripped of Soviet citizenship when

2:21:27he left and was a refugee in the United States for nearly eight years before he became a citizen.

2:21:35If the current federal immigration policies were in place when my father was here,

2:21:39there's a high likelihood that I never would have been born here because my father would currently

2:21:44be sitting in a third country detention in a concentration camp in Central America or in the

2:21:51subsaharan Africa. That is the current federal policy. And so rightfully there are people in

2:21:58our communities who are terrified. And it is our responsibility as representatives of our

2:22:0515 communities to create protections that will make people in that kind of position. A position

2:22:12that nobody in this room by the grace of God has to find themselves in so that those people can be

2:22:19protected because we have the power to do it. There is a need for it. And I would implore my

2:22:25the delegates in this committee not to get hung up on technicalities when we have the

2:22:30ability and we've been discussing the ability for over eight months now to protect people in

2:22:36our communities. So please I implore you support the main motion and protect Cape Coders regardless

2:22:44of of citizenship status because that keeps all of us safer here on Cape Cod. Thank you.

2:22:55Oh, Delegate Frederickson, thank you for the time. Um, first of all, um, for those that

2:23:03came to public comment and the couple that were here tonight, I appreciate what you have to say,

2:23:09you're good people and have a heart and are concerned for any number of people. So,

2:23:15I appreciate that and I I listen and I can tell you from experience u after watching the processes

2:23:24that come in place um that it's difficult for our legal law enforcement officers as well as ICE who

2:23:34are charged with um enforcing the immigration laws whether there's civil enforcement which has been

2:23:41in effect since 2003 and uh the judicial warrant which which are in uh guided by US code. Um I can

2:23:50tell you my first year as a police officer Christmas Eve um I had to go to a domestic

2:23:57violence house. Um a man had uh hit his wife in front of his two kids. Um they're about six and

2:24:07five years old. Uh I had to do what I had to do at that time and separate the family and

2:24:18I watched those kids look at me.

2:24:24It still haunts me. So I have implored my officers to always respect people and understand their

2:24:36actions, whether they're official or not, mean something and they need to do it right.

2:24:43If there's any message at all to our uh immigration enforcement, they are law enforcement

2:24:49and I support them when they're doing things right and are having respect for people. They they have

2:24:54a job to do and I expect them to do it right. Um this ordinance um probably is unnecessary,

2:25:06but it's here. It doesn't really say much that isn't already in law. It's covered by federal law,

2:25:11US code. It's covered by state ordinance. It's covered by case law. Um, everything is already

2:25:18the ingredients are already there in so many different places that it's really not necessary.

2:25:24This could have been handled with a policy months ago, but yet it's here and exactly, you know,

2:25:31and I'm not saying it's necessarily a bad thing, but it doesn't cover a whole lot. It doesn't

2:25:38uh judicial warrants, that's that's covered. Civil ICE enforcement, they're the only ones that can

2:25:45do it. That is legal, but we are uh following the Protect Act, which the state passed. So,

2:25:53it covers a lot of what we already have. Public records are covered. Remember, the only ones

2:25:59in the state that aren't covered by public records law are our legislature and governor.

2:26:04So, uh, but we are, our employees are, and I appreciate the fact that two weeks ago when I,

2:26:11uh, mentioned that we need to do work on this, and you did. You did, and it's better. I appreciate

2:26:18that. Um, so I don't really see the necessity, but I don't want to get in the way of the good

2:26:26people feel it's important. The reality is this isn't going to make any difference at all. It's

2:26:31not going to make much difference. it will maybe signal to some people that hey the county gets

2:26:36a bad most of the people uh whether they're citizens are immigrants or illegal immigrants

2:26:42they don't know the difference between county property state property and town property matter

2:26:47of fact just this week someone asked thought that the courts were owned by the by the town

2:26:51um but they're not they don't know it's it's going to be a piece of paper that's put away maybe we

2:26:56use some some political advantage and maybe some of those people will feel better and that's not a

2:27:01bad thing cuz That is what we did with community policing. We couldn't solve crimes. We can't stop

2:27:07breakins. We can't stop robberies, but we can make people feel better about where they live.

2:27:12And I don't want any stretch imagination think that I don't support our law enforcement officers

2:27:17and they need to do it right. So, I wanted that that to be clear because Mr. guessing,

2:27:25I appreciate your efforts on this, but I want to make sure that this is done for the right

2:27:31reasons and not for making a uh for political reasons because we spent a lot of time over the

2:27:40last several months and year on other things that have shown up in other other u places. But um I

2:27:50appreciate the efforts of everybody. Um and let me just look. I made a bunch of different notes

2:28:02and and and I think this is a good time to pause. The time's up and we appreciate your your comments

2:28:08and uh if there's anyone else any other delegates who wish to weigh in on the main question. Oh,

2:28:16there we are. Delegate Killian. Thank you, Madam Speaker. I just want to thank Delegate

2:28:20Frederickson for his comments and I I echo some of the same sentiments in terms of the

2:28:25super superfluousness of this uh ordinance. But I also want to thank him because if it wasn't

2:28:31for him trying to make changes to it at our last meeting, we would have voted on something that

2:28:35isn't nearly as good as what we have now. There have been improvements made to it, although I I

2:28:41don't think it's necessary. It's a better piece of legislation than we had here two weeks ago.

2:28:46So I I thank him for for taking the grief from the deputy speaker for those late amendments, but it

2:28:51it all wor it all worked out in the end. U so u I appreciate it. Thank you. Uh Deputy Speaker Freso,

2:28:58just I just want to u I gave grief about process not substance and if you remember I permitted us

2:29:07to delay and postpone for the purpose of allowing those amendments to be made. So

2:29:13um I was not scolding anyone. Thank you. Your thin's a little Your skin's a little off thin

2:29:18there, deputy. Uh I I describ Yeah. Okay. Go ahead, delegate. Mr. Fryel, I've been punched,

2:29:30kicked, shot at, uh called every name in the book. I have no offense whatsoever.

2:29:41Okay, so I think we're

2:29:45Well, I got five minutes. Might as well take it. Um, I'm not going to take it. But I do I

2:29:51just want I I remember back uh when we had a large group of people here for public comment

2:29:57and there was a lot of sentiment about what's happening in our country. I mean,

2:30:01I and I sympathize with that deeply cuz I have family. I know people who've had situations happen

2:30:10as many of you know um that could be affected by by this. I have to ask myself the question,

2:30:18how does this help us in the long run? And you know, like the at Fmouth Courthouse the other day,

2:30:24maybe some some staging going out at Fmouth Courthouse. Would would this ordinance have

2:30:28stopped that? And I wish that I wish that we had an ordinance that would stop people being

2:30:34snatched from courtrooms because that deprivives someone justice in their day in court. Wish we had

2:30:39that. But we're not doing that. We're doing some things that I think are important that I respect

2:30:44that the delegation is putting forth. But as I read, as I listen to other learned people,

2:30:50including the town administrator, when he writes something like, "I am concerned that

2:30:56this ordinance requires due uh analyzation by staff to figure out the potential conflicts

2:31:02uh and the obligations may cause uh confusion about the document and government enforcement."

2:31:08That raises a red flag to me that something's still not right in how this is being presented.

2:31:14And I know you've done a good job. I know that you I I appreciate the amendments. I voted for

2:31:18the amendments because I I appreciate that they were done and they were thought through. Uh but

2:31:25I still have questions about this piece of legislation. I believe the Protect Act is

2:31:29helping us. I believe that the executive order and as you mentioned about other ordinances and

2:31:34government regulations and policies that are out there, all this is to me a little overkill,

2:31:38but I understand why it's overkill because people are afraid and people are hurting and we want to

2:31:43address that the best we can. And I also support law enforcement. I think that's an important

2:31:47aspect to say here that we got a lot of good folks that are in law enforcement in our local

2:31:52communities uh as well as our state and federal government. People want to do the right thing and

2:31:56when people do the right wrong thing, they should be held accountable before the laws of the land

2:32:01and be brought forth to justice. That's how I feel about that. So, thank you for letting me speak.

2:32:10Go ahead, uh Delegate Gesson. Thank you, Madam Speaker. I I do have to disagree with the idea

2:32:17that this ordinance doesn't do anything, right? The question was posed uh does it stop uh someone

2:32:24from getting snatched from the courtroom? Um, it was the explicit d the explicit directive

2:32:32and policy of federal immigration enforcement to prioritize targeting people in nonpublic areas of

2:32:42courouses so that they could quote unquote avoid publicity and avoid disturbing court proceedings

2:32:51while they detain people. This ordinance says if the law enforcement individual does not have a

2:32:59judicial warrant in order to enter that non-public area in order to detain that person, they will not

2:33:07be permitted in that non-public area. That is what this ordinance is seeking to address. That

2:33:15is seeking what this ordinance does. And that is right there an individual who would not have been

2:33:22detained in a non-public area of the courthouse unless there was a judicial warrant present. It

2:33:29forbids the staging on county property. Right now law enforcement, federal immigration law

2:33:34enforcement, there is no the protect Act does not prevent them from staging on county property. Our

2:33:40attorney spoke to that. This ordinance provides that protection. right now, neither under the

2:33:45Protect Act nor under the executive order, is the personal data and information, which is honestly

2:33:53probably the number one risk that immigrants have when they interact with the county when it comes

2:33:59to immigration enforcement. Nothing in either of those policies protects the sharing of personal

2:34:06information and data as in your tax returns, your immigration status, your home address, your work,

2:34:13where you might be easily picked up. None of that information that people provide voluntarily to

2:34:19the county is protected unless we pass this ordinance. So again, while I appreciate that

2:34:26folks can disagree whether or not we need these protections, I take umbrage and I disagree with

2:34:35the contention of the argument that anyone here would support these protections if only they

2:34:42had teeth. But because these protections quote unquote don't do anything and don't stop anything,

2:34:48they won't vote for them. If you do not believe that these protections should be instituted,

2:34:54then you have every right as a representative of your community to vote against it. But these

2:34:58protections will protect people and will prevent people from fearing interacting with county

2:35:06government because they carry the weight of an ordinance and because the legislative powers

2:35:12of the assembly and then the executive powers of the Mars County will ensure that that data that

2:35:19enforcement and those non-public areas will not be permitted for immigration enforcement. Thank you.

2:35:31Okay. Thank you, delegate Kesson. Um,

2:35:35we want to roll call a meeting question. I see no one further who wants to speak.

2:35:42Um, so the question is on adopting proposed ordinance 202611 ensuring community safety and

2:35:51lawful federal immigration enforcement as amended. Clerk Fletcher, can you please call the RO?

2:36:03Is that the correct wording? Oh, you what is it? Changed. Oh, that's right. So, I my apologies.

2:36:11I don't think we clocked that in the script, but So, it's we changed it to an ordinance regarding

2:36:15county interaction with federal immigration enforcement. Thank you. Catch. So, so so what

2:36:20is that? This is this is the new title. But in artifact, it wouldn't have been the new title if

2:36:25you hadn't passed the amendment. We hadn't listed it the way we listed it. So, sorry about that.

2:36:33We're good. This is We're good. Okay. We're good. Okay. Yes. As a man as a mandate. So, you'd like

2:36:38a roll call, Madam Speaker? Yes, please. All right. Delegate Frederickson. Yes. Uh Deputy

2:36:44Speaker Freso. Yes. Uh Delegate Fuller, yes. Delegate Gallagher. Yes. Delegate Kassen. Yes.

2:36:53Delegate Green. Delegate Harter. Yes. Delegate Kellian. No. Delegate King. No. Delegate Mckelby.

2:37:00No. Delegate Ali. Yes. Domen. Yes. Delegate Samson. Yes. Delegates. Tai. Speaker Warner. Yes.

2:37:09That is I have it at 10 delegates representing 79.07% of the county's population. Let's meet.

2:37:19passes.

2:37:23Sorry. Sorry. Next on the calendar is new business. Clerk Fletcher, do you have something?

2:37:33I might have a long time ago. I don't think I have anything new. Okay. Are there any announcements?

2:37:41Okay. Are there any uh Oh, the assembly has considered all the items on the calendar. Is

2:37:46there any further business from delegates? No. Since there is no further business,

2:37:53the meeting is adjourned. Good job every

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