2026-10-08 - Planning & Zoning (2)

00:02All right, good afternoon. Sorry we're a

00:04little late. Uh today is What is today?

00:06Thursday, October the

00:088th.

00:10That's right. Uh welcome to a special

00:12called planning and zoning committee

00:14discussion over data center legislation.

00:16I'm going to read the focus item for

00:17this meeting.

00:19But just to clarify, the Memphis City

00:20Council session from Tuesday is still in

00:23recess.

00:24And due to some things that we were

00:25brought up regarding the legislation,

00:27here we are. So, the focus item, this is

00:29all available to the public. We can

00:30provide you copies.

00:32But the intent of the meeting today, and

00:33we're planning to go until 4:00, if I

00:36believe.

00:37Right? 4:00?

00:39Um the focus, discuss the proposed data

00:41center legislation listed

00:43in our meeting materials. That's going

00:44to be all the ordinances that were held.

00:47Um and review the existing zoning

00:49framework with the Division of Planning

00:51Development. Of course, Attorney Wade is

00:52here as well. We're all looking for

00:54clarity.

00:55Um and that is why we held the items.

00:58But that is why we're here today.

01:00So, um I'm actually going to ask

01:02Councilwoman White to get us started. I

01:04know she had some questions from the

01:06meeting.

01:07And I believe we're going to start off

01:08just kind of looking into Taronda's uh

01:10ordinance. But one one more thing, as we

01:13work through this,

01:17please allow us or try to understand and

01:18follow as we go, okay? I'm going to

01:20refer ask everybody to refer to

01:24JB, Councilman Smiley's ordinance. His

01:27um Let me give you an example. His has a

01:29full moratorium, 18 months, right?

01:32Councilman Warden's ordinance

01:34had no moratorium. Council uh woman

01:38Logan's ordinance had no moratorium. And

01:40then my ordinance actually had an

01:42indefinite moratorium. So, as we go

01:44through and start talking about these

01:46things,

01:47we're trying to consolidate all of them,

01:49find the good stuff that we all agree

01:51on, and legislate and build out a piece

01:53of legislation. So, So, getting ready to

01:56watch us do this in public. And that's

01:58the intent. And this is the first of

02:01five scheduled hearings.

02:03And I believe we're going to send an

02:04email shortly that has future meeting

02:06days and times. All right. Thank you all

02:08for allowing me to say that.

02:09Councilwoman Wyatt.

02:12>> I just wanted to know um

02:14from Director Ragsdale, right now um in

02:17terms of permits and those things, are

02:20you able to give us what's like how many

02:22are pending

02:23right now or if there there are some

02:25pending permits or applications, things

02:27that are um before you all for review as

02:29it pertains to data centers?

02:32>> Yes, uh Brett Ragsdale with the division

02:33of planning development. So,

02:35currently I think you know, we're aware

02:36of the ones that are uh in existence.

02:38The original one that was the Electrolux

02:41plant on Paul R. Lowry, the two-lane

02:43road, um and then the one on Getwell,

02:47which is the uh old Fred's headquarters.

02:50Currently, those are the only ones that

02:52are in the uh

02:53the pipeline that we have permits for.

02:56Um

02:56there are no others that are that we're

02:59aware of that are pending. And I know

03:01that uh President McGowan had mentioned

03:02that you know, he had been contacted uh

03:04you know, MLGW has a supply of power, so

03:07I think that they um

03:09had like a a 6-month timeframe that he

03:11didn't see anything in anticipation. So,

03:14that's where we are with the current

03:16building permits

03:17um and the current data centers that are

03:20in operation.

03:21>> To clarify, for the two facilities that

03:23are already in operation, when you say

03:26building permits, are these permits

03:28regarding the any like expansions,

03:31changes to the building? What kind of

03:33permits are they?

03:35>> Uh yes, so the original buildings um

03:37have some alteration permits, and there

03:40is an expansion that I think is already

03:43um you know, public that was an

03:46expansion of the two-lane road. It's a

03:47300,000 square foot uh building. So,

03:51that's the only ones that currently

03:53in the pipeline or have been applied

03:55for.

03:57>> So, then question

03:59>> Okay, just to clarify. Um

04:01You got two of two lane,

04:03one uh Fred's,

04:06and what was the other one?

04:07>> Um the Paul Auerbach

04:09>> Paul Auerbach, that was the the first

04:10one.

04:11>> Yes.

04:11>> And a couple of them have completed

04:14facilities.

04:16Uh I think the Fred's is probably the

04:18one that's most in progress.

04:20Um so, these are the ones that he has

04:23received. Now, you don't have MLGW at

04:27the table. Basically, they have

04:30essentially, because electricity is the

04:32main driver of these things, they have

04:35to be assured that they going to get

04:37back. So, they go to them first. So, you

04:39need to be asking him what is on the

04:42horizon for you. He may not be able to

04:44tell you, or he may be able to tell you,

04:45but he told me there were

04:47maybe four three or four others that may

04:51be coming along, but they will be about

04:55four to five months out

04:58before they get to him.

04:59>> Okay. And for you, for the ones that

05:02you're talking about now, are these

05:03pending ones, or are you saying what we

05:04have had in the past?

05:06These are pending.

05:07>> There are some that are in review, but

05:09they're already public. So, they're the

05:11ones that we are aware of, yes.

05:12>> Okay. And so,

05:13>> are no new ones that that we've been

05:15contacted about that haven't been

05:17submitted or that are not public, yeah.

05:19>> So, those are under review, though.

05:20>> Yes.

05:21>> And so, there goes my question was going

05:22to be for Attorney Wade. You You kind of

05:24touched on it, and I know that President

05:26McGowan said that there would be about

05:28six months before anything went online

05:32with them.

05:34With the And the reason I'm asking this

05:35is to kind of level set for what it is

05:38that we're getting ready to do here. In

05:40terms of what we're trying to regulate,

05:43even if it's a a

05:46not a moratorium, whatever it

05:48What if Do you What if any impact would

05:51it have to the

05:53applications that are or permits that

05:55are currently

05:57in review?

05:58>> Um

06:00you know, I think you have to look

06:02carefully at the the vested rights

06:05statute. But typically this even under

06:09the wording of the

06:11Smiley moratorium, it wouldn't affect

06:13any projects that are in progress or

06:16already in existence.

06:19And I hadn't looked specifically at his

06:21language, but I think that was my

06:23understanding. So essentially what it

06:25does

06:27to be

06:29brutally honest about it, what it does

06:31is pretty much give

06:34XAI

06:37a monopoly for a while.

06:39>> Yeah, well, let me let me Nobody else

06:41can get into

06:42>> Well, let me interject Let me interject

06:43on that. And this is why I'm so glad

06:44we're all here. So we were about to vote

06:46on something yesterday

06:48and we're sitting here having this

06:49discussion, right? We needed to be

06:51understanding these things before we

06:53pass the legislation about something

06:55that's so important

06:57for all of us, not including or

06:59including foremost the people that live

07:02right next door to the one that's

07:03already here before we examined or had

07:06an opportunity to examine anything. So

07:08I'm so happy we're having this

07:09discussion.

07:10And Attorney Wade, I'm going to offer

07:12this. So from what I can see, I want to

07:14explain

07:16the differences from what I read in each

07:18ordinance. So JB's is a moratorium up to

07:2118 months.

07:23In the source notice, exact reporting

07:25and exit language require confirmation.

07:29Rhonda's is a 45-day analysis and 90-day

07:32UDC text, but there's no moratorium

07:34there, but there's that 45 and 90-day um

07:37uh

07:38you know, text in there for the

07:39analysis. Councilman Warren's has no

07:42moratorium.

07:44Uh

07:44>> [snorts]

07:44>> Espinosa's has a permanent moratorium,

07:48but allows companies to come and apply

07:51and go through the whole process

07:53until we do we lift the moratorium when

07:56we all agree on what the final approval

07:58looks like like all these little details

08:01that we're talking about. So, those are

08:02the

08:04the things that we currently

08:06those are the differences between the

08:08the four from what I can see and I just

08:09think

08:10>> I want to say something.

08:10>> That's what I can see, but I could be

08:11wrong.

08:12>> a high level, but getting into a

08:14granular level there

08:16>> Yeah.

08:17>> I think

08:18the non-moratorium ones

08:21fairly

08:22they have a lot of overlap. They try to

08:24accomplish the same thing.

08:25>> Mhm.

08:27>> When you got down to the last one from

08:29Logan, hers was

08:31mostly targeting

08:34zoning authority that we have and trying

08:37to develop some

08:40some things around that.

08:41>> Yeah, yeah.

08:42>> Uh so, that's kind of where where those

08:44are.

08:45Some of the other ones, the two from you

08:47and Warren,

08:49they do the same thing.

08:51Uh

08:53one yours is a whole lot more,

08:56you know,

08:59specific and intensive and

09:02whatever in terms of land use and it

09:04also says at the top subject to legal

09:07review to be consistent with what our

09:10code is.

09:11>> Right.

09:11>> And so, that's kind of where that one

09:13was.

09:14Jeff's was in the same

09:16same mode, except

09:19both of them go into a whole lot of

09:21insight about what data centers are, how

09:24much utilities they use, how much water

09:27they use, what kind of facilities they

09:29use, and a lot of that sometimes is is

09:32Brett will tell you is

09:34sometimes outside the scope of what we

09:36can do.

09:37From that standpoint.

09:38>> Yeah, yeah.

09:39>> So, you have to separate those things

09:40and that's kind of what

09:43I saw on the universe and that's why I

09:46came forward with what I thought was a

09:48start at

09:50doing something that would have an

09:53intensive review process before they

09:56could go forward. And I thought that's

09:58what everybody had a

10:00a universal agreement about, you know?

10:03So, I mean, we can we can disagree about

10:06the details of how that happens, but it

10:09seems to me that that's what you want.

10:11And I think you want you want that

10:13process to be in place because you don't

10:15want another XAI to just pop up

10:17overnight and you didn't know nothing

10:20about it and next thing you know,

10:21they're rolling and got turbines and got

10:23everything going, you know, and then you

10:26got to file lawsuits to stop them and

10:29you know, they move fast, dude. I'm

10:31telling you that.

10:32They move very fast.

10:34But, that's kind of what the what the

10:36lay of the land is. So.

10:37>> And yeah, all

10:38>> Well, I just wanted to just get one

10:39thing straight for the record cuz this

10:41has been something that's been confusing

10:42and this is not for my sake. I know the

10:44answer to it, but for the general

10:46public.

10:48In terms of anything that we pass for

10:51instance, the moratorium that's being

10:53proposed, that will not stop existing

10:56operations. Is that correct?

10:57>> That's correct.

10:58>> Okay.

11:00>> And and can I just say one other thing?

11:02>> Please.

11:02>> I think if we uh

11:06you know, you're you're a legislative

11:08body that primarily does

11:11land use.

11:14Do a lot of budgetary decisions, too.

11:16Uh there are a lot of things that go on

11:18with these specialized things as we

11:21learned from doing

11:22>> Move up a little with the mic.

11:23>> As as from what we learned doing the oil

11:26pipeline. Uh

11:28so, you know, you you look at it from a

11:29standpoint

11:31there's land,

11:33there's air,

11:35there's water.

11:37Okay? Um

11:39what am I missing?

11:42>> Electricity.

11:43>> Electricity.

11:45Uh

11:45it could be gas,

11:47uh natural gas. So, those things, if you

11:51if you look at them,

11:53natural gas, electricity,

11:56we don't have any authority to dictate

11:59that. And the state has has has provided

12:03>> and and TVA, right?

12:05>> correct.

12:05>> Hey, and for the record and for the

12:07record on the agenda at the next

12:09hearing,

12:11uh President McGowan uh is ready to come

12:14down here whenever to answer any and all

12:16questions that come out of this cuz I

12:18know we've already referenced MLGW

12:19twice, so we're doing it again.

12:21>> I would tell you that that he did give

12:23a pretty good synopsis of what the

12:26authority was when he came before, but

12:28at that time, I don't think everybody's

12:31attention was hyper-focused on what he

12:32was saying because he answered a whole

12:34lot of questions about it. So, then you

12:37get get to

12:38um

12:40you know, the air.

12:43You know, we don't really have a lot of

12:45authority over that. That's done done by

12:48>> TDEC.

12:48>> TDEC and and EPA.

12:50>> Health Department.

12:51>> And then you got water, which we've

12:53already

12:55uh adopted a well

12:57protection plan where you can't you

12:59can't drill wells around our existing

13:02MLGW wells to protect the aquifer. Now,

13:06we don't control the issuance of

13:09well permits. That's done by the county.

13:13Um

13:14then and then the last one is

13:18um

13:19so, water, air,

13:21utilities.

13:22So, what it boils down to the the the

13:25thing that's the most

13:27within your jurisdiction is the land

13:30aspect. And so, the various aspects that

13:33you have with that um

13:35that you want to make sure that these

13:37things are not cited near

13:41residential areas, schools, churches,

13:44environmentally protected areas,

13:46historic areas. And so, that's kind of a

13:49citing thing that that Rhonda was

13:52hyper-focused on and is still

13:53hyper-focused on.

13:55>> Yeah, feel it.

13:55>> From the moment From the moment she

13:57wakes up, that's what she thinks about,

13:58okay? And so, then the other thing is it

14:01has some impacts on our

14:05rights-of-way and on our stormwater and

14:09on our

14:10uh sewer. And so, to the extent that

14:14that happens

14:15>> Infrastructure.

14:15>> Infrastructure. There is

14:18there is a state law that allows us to

14:20mandate

14:22that that these providers

14:25compensate us for the cost, incremental

14:28cost that they the burden that they

14:31bring. But we can't impose a tax on

14:34them, but we can recover the incremental

14:36cost and say, "Look, you got to repave,

14:38you got to widen, you got to

14:40[clears throat] put sidewalks, you got

14:41to do all these things, you got to put

14:43signalization."

14:45You can require all of that and require

14:47them to pay for it if you go through a

14:49process where that is a a

14:53a condition of them getting a permit to

14:55go forward. That's why you want a review

14:59process because you can control

15:04You can control all those things, okay?

15:06>> It's a very formal committee.

15:07>> Yeah.

15:08>> Sorry, go ahead.

15:09>> So, so, I mean, essentially

15:11>> that's that's what I think if you have

15:15all of these proposals on the table,

15:17some of them are going to go outside the

15:19sphere that we control. And if we're

15:22going to be talking about what to do,

15:26we need to stay in our lane, in my

15:28opinion. Now, you're going to have

15:30people that want to talk about all these

15:31other things, but that is

15:35quite frankly

15:36>> we can control, I think is

15:37>> It's all about that's all political

15:39noise. That's not legislative noise, and

15:41that's what I want to make a

15:42distinction.

15:43>> All right, we've got council members in

15:44the queue. This is great. Councilwoman

15:46Logan, then Carlisle Walker Warren and

15:49the chairwoman. Go ahead.

15:50>> Thank you, chair.

15:51Um and thank you for that opening, um

15:53Ms. Holloway. I want to make sure that

15:56it's noted on record that

16:00we have a certain

16:01responsibility as a council. We have a

16:04certain jurisdiction and purview.

16:07And we're elected to ensure that we

16:10represent the constituents, represent

16:12our city, and our natural resources, and

16:14our land

16:16based on our purview. And the sooner we

16:19do that, the the more um

16:23the more energy and and time we put into

16:26that, it's going to be better for the

16:27constituents. And this thing about the

16:30moratorium, whether it's the moratorium,

16:33whether it's a year, whether it's 18

16:34months, whether it's tomorrow, whether

16:35it That is not the point because the

16:39point is saving our our natural

16:42resources. The point is protecting our

16:45our constituents, our citizens from

16:47harm, and making certain that we are

16:50acting in their best interest. So, to

16:54focus the attention on that is taking it

16:57off of the the main thing. We should

16:59keep the main thing the main thing. And

17:01we know everybody up here knows that our

17:03lane deals with zoning.

17:06And the reason why all of those people

17:08could come in our city and build without

17:10us knowing is because of the zoning.

17:13They're allowed to. They have the money

17:15to. They can come in because of the

17:17zoning

17:19and build where they want to build. We

17:20have to change that and that does not

17:23take 18 months. You can't take 18 months

17:25to do that and you don't intend to. We

17:27We did a 245-day

17:29I sponsored it moratorium

17:32uh in my first term on gas stations

17:34because they were there was a

17:36proliferation of them coming to our

17:37city, going in our every week we were

17:39dealing with gas stations coming here,

17:42gas station everybody was saying they're

17:43coming in black communities, black and

17:45brown communities and they were and if

17:47you look at the national charts and the

17:49data, there was only a certain amount

17:51that should have been there allowed to

17:52come but we didn't know any of that. We

17:54didn't have any guidance on that and

17:56once we did, we said hold let's pause

17:58and DPD under then John Zena said I

18:01asked him what is the highest and best

18:02use of this opportunity and he said

18:04downgrade the zonings, you'll protect

18:07your your communities overall. But if

18:09you start going one by one and this gas

18:11station, that gas station, you're going

18:12to miss something. So, the we started

18:15downgrading the zoning to protect our

18:19communities

18:20where they had where they could go by

18:22right and where we wanted them to go.

18:25The way to get to where we wanted them

18:26to go is to change the zoning and that's

18:28what we're going to have to do now or

18:29else talking about how much electricity

18:32they use has nothing to do with where

18:34they're located under our jurisdiction.

18:37That is Everybody has their own

18:39jurisdiction. We deal with zoning, we

18:41deal with permitting locations, special

18:43use requirements, setbacks, buffers,

18:45site development and mainly application

18:49requirements, land use and mainly our

18:50natural resources, our natural

18:52resources.

18:53Um TVA and MLGW which I think if you're

18:57really concerned about that, that is

19:00where you should go. You can go to TVA,

19:02MLGW, tell them what you want as it

19:04relates to your electric service, the

19:06system capacity, intercon-

19:08interconnection,

19:10utility infrastructure and applicable

19:13service requirements. If you're

19:14concerned about the environmental

19:16permits, the air quality, the

19:17wastewater, the water withdrawal,

19:19stormwater, and all of that, that is

19:21TDEC from the state, and then in in our

19:24jurisdiction, it's the Shelby County

19:26Health Department. We are dealing with

19:29everybody else's jurisdiction cuz we

19:32can't tell them to come here and talk to

19:33us. We can't make them come here. We

19:35can't make them do anything. It as your

19:38representatives, we can ask them to come

19:40and give you their part, but we can't

19:42make anybody do anything. If we had a

19:44year study, a 2-year study, they don't

19:46have to come. I mean, because that's

19:48their jurisdiction. So, I'll my what my

19:51um request is that as the body, we deal

19:54with the main things first. Let's get

19:56our zoning right. We don't have to take

19:583 years for that, a year. We don't have

20:01to take, you know, any time other than

20:03what it takes to do it. And we

20:06really require that it be done sooner

20:08than later. If we need to pause

20:10accepting permits during this time, that

20:13is fine, but it's to get to an end, not

20:15to just have a pause because that's a

20:17national conversation. We're not

20:18interested in that. We need to protect

20:20our resources and our land and our

20:22people. And we can do that in a very

20:24short term, and if we need to pause

20:26during that time, that's what we have to

20:27do to protect that because we were not

20:30We didn't already have that in place.

20:32That is what I have to say, and I feel

20:34that is what's necessary based on our

20:37jurisdiction and purpose.

20:40>> All right, thank you, Councilwoman.

20:42Um we've got Councilman Carli.

20:44>> Thank you, Chairman.

20:46All right. So, we have a very good

20:49framework for a lot of in-depth

20:51discussion, some new, some covering

20:53small stuff, older stuff, but bringing

20:55back up. I I guess for me is is it

20:57instead of just diving in, my question

21:00is is

21:00can we just reframe where we are? Like

21:03we're kind of starting the dialogue

21:04over, but we already kind of to where

21:05everybody's driving to, meaning like

21:06Director Ragsdale, in in the standard

21:08use permit or the special use permit

21:10vernacular in the general term, like

21:13it's a wide net based on a definition in

21:15the UDC that triggers a series of

21:17events, broadly speaking, yes?

21:20And in that series of events, it

21:22triggers both public hearings

21:24typically

21:25through the land use land use control

21:27board and then on to the Memphis City

21:28Council, yes?

21:30And as Attorney Wade said, it can be

21:31conditioned

21:32and I don't want to say

21:34customized every time. There has to be

21:36some sort of

21:38you know, precedents for it, right? Or

21:40else there is litigation. I guess my

21:42point is is that

21:44the stop all that can continue to be

21:47worked on is this special use permit. It

21:49is the fastest

21:51way to at least put from the city of

21:53Memphis's standpoint, outside of the

21:55outside of the power of the pen

21:58to put something some regulatory piece

22:01in place

22:02that would at least send it to public

22:04comment

22:06and to public hearing bodies for

22:08regulation.

22:10Is that fair?

22:11>> Yes, I would agree.

22:12>> All right. So, that answers the outcome

22:14we've talked about. So, that's one

22:15outcome. It's like, why are we talking

22:17about anything else? And again, I'm not

22:18trying to shut anybody down, but like

22:20we're we continue to like

22:22kind of like talk to the public and like

22:23explain out and it's it's like at some

22:24point we've got to start getting to the

22:26vote and I'm not trying to stop the

22:27process, but it's like we already know

22:28that one is planning and zoning and it's

22:30a special use permit

22:32and it's it's it can I guess you can add

22:34more conditions to it on the front end,

22:35but they're going to be added each and

22:36every time like a hotel does.

22:39Each and every time they are unique in

22:41their way.

22:42And then to Councilwoman Logan's point

22:44about looking at comprehensive zoning,

22:45like that's a parallel path.

22:47And then for the pause, like yeah, I

22:49mean, if you want to add, again, I've

22:50said this, if if you added a pause

22:52through the zoning regulation, then

22:53you're there.

22:54And so, like your pause is the length of

22:56however long it takes to go through the

22:57zoning period. Like where where is the

22:59complicated piece in this, guys? I'm I

23:01mean, I'm not trying to be like short,

23:02but like I'm lost cuz I'm maybe I came

23:04in late, but like it's not that

23:05complicated.

23:06>> Well, I think people are scared Well,

23:08excuse me.

23:08>> Yeah, no, go ahead, Carolyn.

23:09>> I think everything

23:10>> Then let's have a conversation. I I just

23:11don't I'm

23:12>> Absolutely. Look, I agree with

23:13everything you said, but I think other

23:15council members are hearing from

23:16constituents and I think

23:18that we're still learning the

23:19differences between the four pieces of

23:21legislation that people worked really

23:23hard on to try to do. And so, I think

23:25we're all kind of going

23:26>> But is is this a participation thing

23:28where it's like cuz they worked hard on

23:29it we need to hear it or if we know that

23:30they're not going to do it, why are we

23:31being disingenuous about it? And again,

23:33the moratorium like has been addressed.

23:35We know that we can't There's certain

23:36things that we can't do, and I'm just

23:38trying to get us back to the business of

23:39the city as fast as humanly possible.

23:41>> And so, that's that to

23:43Well,

23:44go ahead.

23:47>> Yeah, I'm not trying to get into it. I'm

23:48just trying to

23:50>> legislation.

24:01>> You can accomplish some of the things

24:03that the moratoriums sought to

24:05accomplish and some of the things that

24:07all the ordinances sought to accomplish.

24:09You can You know, we learned some things

24:12from from Mr. Muss's endeavor into our

24:15city. And we learned how they can bring

24:18their own utilities to the table. So,

24:21you know, I think we've been working,

24:23you know, with DPD. They've looked at

24:26the ordinance and we're going to work

24:27through it to try to try to get

24:28something that's really really good. But

24:31essentially,

24:33you can accomplish some of the same

24:34things by saying one, you have to have

24:39your electric

24:41consumption permit in place before you

24:45start. The problem

24:46>> Okay, wait. Pause there. So, do we say

24:48that now?

24:50>> You put that in as

24:51>> But do we say that now?

24:53>> In the ordinance that I did, that's in

24:55there. Okay? They have to demonstrate

24:57that.

24:57>> But

24:57>> I want to ask Councilman Carlisle, do

24:59you know whose ordinance has that in the

25:02text?

25:02>> Say that again, now.

25:03>> None of them.

25:04>> No. Yeah, I mean he does I mean and with

25:05all due respect like he he he doesn't.

25:07And so that's

25:08>> The one I drafted has it in there.

25:09>> That's exactly With all due respect, I

25:11don't have to know that.

25:12>> Okay, slow down.

25:12>> That's why I've got counsel.

25:13>> Let me finish. Let me finish.

25:14>> but we're Off the top of my head like

25:16you're about to pass a law.

25:17>> I'm not about to do anything. I'm making

25:19the law and I'm trying to get there.

25:20>> That's exactly right, but you want us to

25:21write

25:22>> Would you clarify what you said?

25:23>> due respect, we didn't hear you.

25:25>> to write the showtime is not my thing.

25:27>> Let me finish. So there there are a

25:29number of number of requirements

25:32that an applicant has to do. They have

25:35to provide a study that feasibility

25:38study. They have to provide a sound

25:40study. Uh they have to provide

25:44a buffer study. They have to provide a

25:46lot of different things that answers the

25:50fears of our community that that are

25:52being espoused in all of these various

25:54ordinances. So you you can but you do

25:57have to have some objectively attainable

26:01criteria because if you start going too

26:03subjective then they'll never get a

26:06permit and you're going to be sued by

26:09people that can kick our butts, okay? So

26:11I'm just telling you what we you have to

26:14do is have

26:15the non-discretionary criteria that if

26:18they cross off all of the boxes

26:21they get a permit. But if they do that

26:24they will assure you that they they're

26:26not going to be too close. They're going

26:28to pay all the costs of doing our roads

26:31and and infrastructure. They're going to

26:34show you that they're going to

26:36ameliorate any sound, dust, vibration.

26:38They're going to assure you that they're

26:40going to have electricity so that they

26:42won't go bringing turbines in. So I mean

26:45all those things we we we have built

26:48into the conditions and that's how you

26:50can do more than just tick off some

26:53zoning boxes. You can accomplish some of

26:56the other goals that you want to go go

26:58through through a a site review process.

27:01But, it can't be too discretionary. I'm

27:02just pointing that out to you.

27:04>> application process, right? Correct.

27:06Okay.

27:07Yeah.

27:08>> With new specifics that you've added.

27:10Yeah. Okay.

27:12Uh Councilwoman Walker. Oh, wait.

27:14Councilman Carlyle.

27:15>> Yeah, I mean, my I still poses a

27:17question. Like, again, we're going to

27:18this this thing's going to go for first

27:20reading today. It's going to come down

27:22to the like again, I'm happy and I've I

27:25I

27:25I'm sorry I haven't memorized every

27:26document. It's not to be disrespectful.

27:28It's because I've listened intently to

27:30each and every argument that has been

27:31made. And again, I'm just I'm not trying

27:34to disrespect the process. I think we

27:36can have these information sessions and

27:37they're important. But, sometimes I

27:39think they're what causes us to get down

27:41so far into the weeds that we again

27:42forget the very end what what the

27:43outcome was, which is where we felt like

27:45we got here. And all I'm saying is is

27:48outside of the process and these and

27:50these drafted drafted ordinances,

27:53the content is there. We've looked at

27:56most of the ones that members want to

27:57implement. Why don't we start

27:58implementing those? Like, and and again,

28:00there's six what? Three readings to

28:02continue to work on it. And if a new

28:04ordinance with a with a caption bill

28:05needs to go forward that's more broad,

28:08like that could start in the meeting

28:09today.

28:09>> That's what we're Yeah.

28:10>> Yeah, and and so, the point is is like

28:13why do we have to look at what's on the

28:14table now instead of just saying, "Hey,

28:16we've discussed this. These came out.

28:17There wasn't a lot of agreement then."

28:19>> And I think maybe you missed the opening

28:20statement. And that's what we're doing

28:23is we're talking about the existing

28:24ordinance and all the other ones so that

28:26we can build a consensus.

28:28It's just And maybe that that you

28:29actually did miss that. So,

28:31what what do you want?

28:33>> know, but here's the deal. Like, I you

28:34know, JB gave me grief for not being

28:36here. You know, I talk too much. I talk

28:38too little.

28:39Like, I'm here because I want to drive

28:41this to resolution because in the weeks

28:43preceding up to it, it seems like it's

28:45been a like difficult to do that. And

28:46it's not a direction that's you. It's

28:47like

28:48again, I want to do the work, but I

28:50don't have 5 days to give to this like

28:52in a row. I don't

28:53>> Let me Let me

28:54>> Like I I don't I like I don't have the

28:55amount of time

28:56>> Let me have a Let me have a Let me have

28:58a

28:59One at a time, council members. Let me

29:01have a friendly Let me have a friendly

29:03disagreement with my colleague. I mean,

29:05business

29:07goes in a straight path, and that's why

29:09we have data center out there right now

29:11that's been built.

29:12I mean, he don't have to answer to cuz

29:15this is what it's okay. You do. So, the

29:17process of making law is sometimes ugly.

29:21And but it it achieves a purpose. Now,

29:23and I understand I want to be as

29:24efficient as you do, but but I think I

29:27think we have a path an efficient path

29:30that's going forward to do our zoning.

29:32But

29:33at the end of the day, I think it is

29:36worthy

29:37for us to have a forum

29:40to inform the public about these things

29:42so that they all know that what what

29:45we're doing is on the right path. I

29:47mean, even I mean, I think it it is

29:49worthy because people have

29:51misconceptions about what's going on out

29:53there and what's happening and so on and

29:56so forth. And so, it's it's you know, we

29:59can be the beacon of saying we are an

30:01information source that gives you the

30:04real deal as we see it. You know what

30:05I'm saying? Now, that may have nothing

30:07to do with the path we're going on to

30:09get the zoning done, which we're going

30:10to do, okay?

30:12So, and that's going to be done through

30:14a technical

30:15>> Right.

30:15>> streamlined process. You're going to get

30:17your wish there.

30:18>> Perfect. And that's My wish is what I

30:19think the people want, which is

30:20regulation as soon as possible.

30:21>> But but they also want to hear from you

30:24about

30:24>> Understood.

30:25>> things are and what they are and what

30:27they

30:28are.

30:28>> I I just

30:29>> I want a clarification.

30:30>> to say real quick, I want to yield the

30:31floor. I just want to say

30:32>> Clarify what you're saying so I can I

30:33want to understand your I want to

30:35understand what you were saying. It's

30:36very simple. Is Are you saying a special

30:38use permit is the way to go to

30:42>> It is the simplest,

30:44fastest,

30:46and accomplishes the outcome

30:48to start. And by the way, no piece of

30:50legislation is perfect. It is It should

30:52be watched. It's going to change. I

30:55mean, I talked to somebody that sat in

30:57the room with the man for 30 minutes at

30:59a meeting and told me that the And this

31:00person I have a huge amount of respect

31:02for. Said, "That guy is thinking on a

31:04totally different plane."

31:06Like

31:07again, I say that to say that the world

31:09is evolving so rapidly, it's going to

31:10need to evolve.

31:12Like it's going to need time. But like

31:14this we want to make it so complex that

31:16we just continue to kind of beat the

31:17bush. And like what I really was saying

31:18is like I'm not against this process and

31:20I agree with everything you're both

31:21trying to do. But I often see this body

31:23explaining itself into a tizzy to the

31:25public, but not really to the public to

31:27the point where again we get to the

31:28point where we've talked so much we

31:29forgot what we were actually doing and I

31:30just don't want us to run down that

31:31road. I'm not dismissing this. I think

31:32it's a good process, but I'm just

31:34worried about that cuz I see it over and

31:36over again when we've kind of got to

31:38where we were and we just continue to

31:39explain ourselves. That's all.

31:41>> Attorney Wade, did you agree with that?

31:43Did you just say that you agree with

31:44that? But we need to continue the dis-

31:47the conversation. [clears throat]

31:49>> I think we have an ordinance

31:51uh first reading on consent and that's

31:54going to take a course, okay?

31:57In the meantime, there's a whole lot of

31:59misunderstanding about

32:01what we do and what these things do and

32:05I think we can be

32:07the people that digest information and

32:09and provide it to the public so they'll

32:11know what's going on.

32:13>> So, are you saying yes or no? Are you

32:14saying that that that

32:16>> They can go parallel paths.

32:18>> use permit is the way to go, but yet we

32:21should continue to have these hearings

32:23that

32:24um

32:25>> Inform the public.

32:25>> Chairman, but those are to inform the

32:26public. And like you said, those are two

32:28things that can happen at the same time.

32:30So, to get to the point to where we're

32:31protecting ourselves, what do we need to

32:33do? Point blank.

32:34>> Okay, so so technically

32:37the one thing that may be

32:40somewhat of a compromise

32:42is that I think the

32:44the zoning path needs to go forward.

32:47And

32:48probably you'd have a limited moratorium

32:52>> Yeah.

32:52>> until that is completed, okay? But it

32:55can't be it can't be the

32:59the moratorium can't be a barrier.

33:02>> Absolutely.

33:03>> That's the problem is that and that's

33:04what state law prevents. You can't have

33:08a moratorium that's a de facto

33:10prohibition against the activities. And

33:12so what we have

33:15it's always better legally

33:17if you're going to have a moratorium to

33:19have a process that's going that you're

33:22protecting while you go forward. If you

33:24don't have a process and you just got a

33:26pure per se

33:28I'm going to tell you something the

33:29courts ain't going to go for that.

33:31They're going to kick that to the curb

33:32in a minute cuz cuz they're going to

33:34say, "Well, you know, you've

33:35demonstrated

33:37that y'all can't make a decision."

33:40That's where it's going to be and it's

33:41just going to be a flat-out prohibition

33:43and that's not going to be accepted.

33:45>> So as our council, what are you saying?

33:47>> I'm saying that

33:49I mean I've already put on the table

33:51what I tried to do is marry everybody's

33:53thing together. Put the highlights of

33:56what you're trying to protect from. I

33:58mean put it in there so that we address

34:01it and consider it. This body through a

34:04special use or site plan review process

34:08>> Yeah.

34:09>> we evaluate all the things that the the

34:11community's complaining about and make

34:13sure it don't happen again.

34:15>> Right.

34:15>> And then make a decision if they check

34:18the boxes, we let people go and we

34:20decide where they go. Okay, so to me you

34:23got ultimate control.

34:25You don't need a moratorium if you got

34:27that control. They got to go through you

34:30before anything. And as I think that's

34:32what the people have elected you for.

34:34>> Absolutely.

34:34>> So, I mean we can't

34:35>> same time we can do the hearings for

34:37education. Educate the public, ask

34:39questions. Because the questions and the

34:41things that we're having a hearing on

34:43are not things that's under our

34:44jurisdiction anyways, but we are

34:46>> But but I I would tell you that it's

34:48unfortunate

34:50>> unfortunate that we got to the point

34:52where we're reacting rather than being

34:54proactive.

34:55>> Right. Yeah.

34:56>> And had we been the beacon of

34:58information on the front end, we

35:00probably could have avoided a lot of the

35:02contentiousness that we have now against

35:04us and everybody.

35:06>> And I think it look I want to interject.

35:07I mean, we all watched on TV and heard

35:09of the announcement just like everybody

35:11else. And I think people tend to forget

35:12that. So, that's I'm excited that we're

35:14having these hearings. I understand

35:16where Councilman Carlisle's coming from

35:18because I wish we had all this done

35:19yesterday, you know?

35:21>> Yeah.

35:21>> But uh that's the intent of these

35:23hearings is exactly that, right? So, for

35:25example, on Tuesday, October 29th, we've

35:28got

35:29community environmental protections,

35:30noise, water, air quality, neighborhood

35:32infrastructure.

35:33Presentations, discussions with MLGW,

35:35TVA, health department, CDEC. Anything

35:38else we y'all can, you know, we want to

35:40put in here.

35:41>> Let me say one more thing.

35:42One thing I omitted

35:43>> We're also going to be able to say what

35:44we control and what we don't control.

35:46>> What I want to talk about that issue.

35:48>> Yeah, go ahead.

35:48>> That's one thing I did omit.

35:50Um

35:52the one thing that is not

35:55controlled by any other agency

35:59is

36:00sound.

36:02Uh

36:03>> It's what?

36:04>> Noise. Noise and sound. That's strictly

36:07within your purview.

36:08>> us. We control that.

36:09>> Yeah, and we don't have right now our

36:12own our ordinances only address

36:16noise related to automobiles. It doesn't

36:19address noise related I mean, it says

36:23that the city can construct but if

36:25certain hours.

36:27Private can construct within certain

36:29hours, but it doesn't talk about the

36:30operation of these facilities where they

36:32create

36:34obnoxious sound, we have no ordinances

36:38for that and we need to address that.

36:40>> Well, I have an electric car, so you

36:42know, I don't make too much sound. So,

36:43I'm sorry.

36:44>> Will they be Will they be doing that?

36:45Will DPD Will they be making I mean,

36:49that recommendation?

36:50>> no, no. Part of

36:52the conditions is that they have to have

36:55a sound remediation plan that we

36:57evaluate.

36:58>> years.

36:59>> That's Yes, correct. That would be

37:01That would be in the review process.

37:03>> Okay.

37:04>> So, so we have the authority under state

37:06law to regulate that. So, you can do it

37:09indirectly by making sure that they have

37:12an adequate sound remediation plan.

37:15>> Their Their adequate may not be our

37:16adequate. We need a ordinance to

37:18determine our adequate.

37:19>> Yeah, we do that. So, they'll have some

37:21objective criteria that they can follow.

37:23>> So, that's on the that's on the agenda

37:25to dive into next time.

37:27>> Okay.

37:28>> Is that You see what I'm saying? Like,

37:29we're going to We're going to tighten

37:30that up.

37:31>> You got it. Thank you. Thank you.

37:32>> Yes, and I'm sorry. I keep interjecting.

37:33Councilwoman Walker's in the queue next.

37:37I keep interjecting, too.

37:38>> No, this is good.

37:39>> Yeah. All right, so Councilwoman Logan's

37:41good. We're going to go to Councilwoman

37:42Walker. And we're going to keep doing

37:43this for another 2 hours and 15 minutes.

37:46So, if we move fast, there's a lot of

37:47people in the queue. Go ahead.

37:49>> Councilwoman Walker.

37:50>> Thank you, Mr. Chair. So, I am glad that

37:53we are doing this today. I feel that it

37:55is overdue. And although I was I have

37:59been in support of the moratorium for

38:01the past three meetings,

38:04um I just want to go on record and say

38:07I feel that this process has been rushed

38:11and we should have been doing something

38:13like this

38:14months ago. And that's not to throw

38:16anybody under the bus and I hope it's

38:19okay for me to say it cuz I'm saying it,

38:20but

38:21um

38:24Mr. Raggsdale, you came before us. I was

38:27at home with my arm in a sling, but um

38:31Councilwoman Cooper Sutton asked you to

38:33come here and talk about zoning as it

38:37relates to data centers. You did a

38:38presentation. It was a great

38:40presentation as to how you how you all

38:43would go about structuring

38:45this. Um

38:47everyone wasn't here to hear it. I did

38:50go back and watch it a couple of times.

38:52Then I had a meeting with you

38:55to go over cuz I wanted to be clear cuz

38:57I do believe along with um Councilwoman

39:00Logan and some of the other colleagues

39:02that the most important thing to this is

39:04the zoning. You can't do anything

39:05without a parcel.

39:08You just can't do anything without a

39:09parcel. And as we move through this,

39:13I think that we should have consulted

39:16the experts first

39:18and then drafted the moratorium.

39:21The reason why I hadn't been bugging

39:23folks about a moratorium

39:26is I was waiting on you. I thought we

39:28were waiting on you before we would move

39:31forward.

39:32And the first and the second time that

39:34you came, you said you would have

39:36something for us mid to late October,

39:38and here we are

39:40to be presented to the city

39:42and the county.

39:44Um as it relates to the information and

39:48citizens being informed, I along with

39:51President McGowan and Chief Madden, we

39:54did do an information session.

39:57And that was in summer of '24, and

40:00looking back, we probably should have

40:03done that every other month or every 2

40:05months cuz what happened after that was

40:07all these

40:08meetings and gaslighting and

40:11misinformation

40:13being shared, and

40:15here we are today. So, with respect to

40:17the information

40:19and closing the information gap, that's

40:22going to be covered, a lot of this

40:24information, if not it's going to be

40:26covered in the environmental education

40:29piece that's inside of the community

40:32benefits ordinance. So, I want to

40:35inform some and remind others

40:38of that

40:39today.

40:41I got in the queue when

40:44Councilwoman White was talking

40:47about

40:49how soon others could come on board and

40:51the timeline and all of that. So,

40:54if this is only if this is not going to

40:57apply those who are already here, but

40:59those who are coming up. So, are you

41:01saying, Attorney Wait, that this would

41:03apply to those who are currently in the

41:06queue when President McGowan was saying

41:08that there others coming, but it

41:10wouldn't be for at least 6 months. So,

41:12is this going to apply to them or at

41:15what point in the process

41:18with a for an entity would this apply

41:20to?

41:24>> So, because they can't go forward

41:27without a commitment to have electric

41:30power,

41:31uh there's some built-in delay. But,

41:34once they have that permit and then they

41:37start buying property, locating, and

41:40doing things, then it would have it

41:41apply to them. So, that's why we need to

41:43have the zoning in place to require all

41:46of these different reviews before that

41:49happens.

41:50>> So, you're saying upon acquiring a

41:52parcel?

41:53>> Not necessarily that, but when you ask

41:56for a permit and you start spending

41:58money pursuant to the permit and there's

42:00no process for review before you get

42:02that permit, then you're vested.

42:05>> Okay, thank you. And then, about the

42:08sound and the noise, so there's is

42:10opportunity So, anything that

42:13the any way that we would address the

42:14sound and the noise would it be inside

42:17of this what we're working on or that

42:19would be something additional outside

42:21supplemental to?

42:23>> We we technically I mean

42:26police right now they enforce

42:29sound disturbances.

42:31>> [snorts]

42:31>> I mean probably not as much as they

42:33should when you know people have these

42:36uh

42:38What do they call it?

42:38>> Would it fall under a nuisance?

42:40>> No, yeah it could be a nuisance and that

42:42therefore I mean when these they have

42:44these parties at these short-term rental

42:47things they make noise all night long

42:49and then the police come and say you're

42:50violating a noise ordinance and I'm

42:52going

42:53what noise ordinance? So, you have to do

42:55it set you have to do a noise ordinance

42:58and you have to

43:00require specialized

43:02noise remediation when these things come

43:05online because they make a lot of noise

43:06and they have to insulate their

43:08properties and do whatever.

43:10>> Okay, thank you. I yield the floor.

43:13>> All right. Uh Councilman Councilman

43:16Warren.

43:22Hey, actually for the record we've got

43:24Councilwoman Cooper-Sutton, Councilman

43:26Warren, Councilwoman White, Councilwoman

43:28Logan, Councilman Canales is here.

43:32Madam Chair Sweringen-Washington,

43:33Councilwoman Walker, Councilman Ford.

43:35We've got the full body here.

43:36Councilwoman Smiley, Councilwoman

43:38Easter-Thomas, Councilman Carlisle.

43:39>> Who is missing?

43:40>> Oh, I'm so sorry. We're missing

43:41Councilwoman Green.

43:43So, everybody to Councilwoman Green. All

43:45right, Councilwoman Warren, go ahead for

43:46>> Thank you. You know, one of the things

43:48that I was hoping we were going to do is

43:50to get this information out about what

43:53Allen had done with all our ordinances.

43:56And I just want to make sure that the

43:57public understands that what we're doing

44:00is if within three readings

44:03that his ordinance law will be in place.

44:07Okay? And that allows us to have the

44:11DPD,

44:13you know,

44:14regulation of those. Is that correct,

44:16Alan? When

44:17So, when we read that,

44:19so we're talking about

44:224 weeks from now.

44:23We potentially are going to have

44:25ordinances that can control what we

44:28legally can control based out of all of

44:30our other ordinances. Is that correct?

44:32>> That's correct.

44:33>> Okay. So, just for people who are

44:35looking for a moratorium,

44:37what we're telling you is we can have

44:39regulations in place in 4 weeks. And

44:42that's what we think we need to be able

44:44to pull off. Now, here's the thing that

44:46I want us to be able to come think about

44:48while we're here, and I want us to be

44:50creative about it. And some of the

44:53things that uh Councilwoman Bednarz

44:55brought up about community benefit

44:57agencies, some of the things that the

44:59assessor brought up about how we can tax

45:02differently for use and the amount of

45:05money that comes through a facility, uh

45:08I mean, there are things that I think

45:10that we legally can do or other places

45:12do that we're going to need to ask the

45:14state for help for.

45:16So, we you know, what I would like us to

45:18do is to see can we write some enabling

45:21legislation

45:23that we know is not necessarily legal at

45:25this point and make it clear that that's

45:28what we're doing to allow, you know, our

45:31leaders and business community to take

45:33that to Nashville and see if we can get

45:35laws that are passed that allow us to

45:38take money from these facilities and

45:41then put it into this community benefit

45:43agency where we can spend money on

45:45roads, we can spend money on

45:47communities, we can spend money on

45:49programs and parks. And essentially, if

45:52we do this in such a way that the we can

45:56get permission from the state, we can

45:58actually dramatically increase the

46:00amount of money that we have coming in.

46:02That's enabling legislation. I'd like,

46:05you know, Allen to comment about, you

46:07know,

46:08how we do that and how we can bring it

46:11up. And I think that should be separate

46:13from getting our regulations in place

46:16and, you know, have it to where this is

46:18under control. So, I'm a firm believer

46:21that if we can have this done in 4

46:23weeks, all that we can do legally,

46:27then that's what we should do.

46:29Okay, and that doesn't require a

46:31moratorium to have 4 weeks

46:34regulation. I'm worried that a

46:37moratorium will send a message to people

46:40who want to put these facilities here

46:43that we don't want them and they have

46:46other places they can go. We don't need

46:49to take

46:50potential income away from our city and

46:54make people think we don't want them to

46:55come here. So, I'm I'm worried about

46:58that. Uh and I'd like to hear my

47:00colleagues' comments on it. Thank you.

47:02>> Thank you, thank you, Councilman Warren.

47:05>> To your point, Dr. Warren,

47:07You said he wanted to hear his his

47:09colleagues' comments.

47:09>> He he did, but he also asked

47:12and [laughter] I want to say something,

47:13too. I promise. Attorney Wade, I felt

47:15like he directed a question towards you.

47:19>> Yeah, I mean, he's talked to me about

47:22some approaches to have

47:24I think it's on.

47:25>> It is.

47:26>> Uh

47:27he directed some uh

47:30I mean, I've talked to

47:32Councilman Warren about

47:34the community benefit piece, which is

47:36obviously outside our purview at this

47:38point. Uh there are a number of

47:41different models that may be able to be

47:44used.

47:45Um

47:46but you would have to have state

47:49uh approval to pursue them. You know, we

47:52do have some models for how our airport

47:54was developed through an authority.

47:57Those may

48:00Some people may have some reticence

48:03about them the way they're taking those

48:05over at the state level, but

48:07but I think we have some strong

48:09leadership

48:10uh business leadership here that would

48:12try to keep that from happening. So So I

48:14would you know, I'd have to think

48:16through it, but I'm hyper-focused on

48:18getting this other thing

48:19>> Councilman, did you say you thought

48:20there was business leadership that did

48:22not want that to happen?

48:23>> I said that would try to protect it.

48:26Yeah.

48:27>> We would protect the legislation if we

48:28sent it to Nashville and try to get it

48:30through.

48:31>> I

48:31let me let me offer this, Councilman

48:33Warren.

48:34And I say this humbly, on this calendar

48:37the fourth meeting is community

48:38benefits.

48:40So if you want to champion this, I know

48:43and and and here here's what I just let

48:44me let me finish real quick.

48:47Uh

48:48JB's moratorium ordinance.

48:50Um capital fund and benefit concepts,

48:52operative fiscal terms. He had some

48:54stuff He had language in there.

48:56Confirmed fund contributions did not

48:57assume a binding half percent

48:59obligation.

49:00Uh none of that is in Logan's, none of

49:02that was in yours, Councilman Warren,

49:04and that's cool. I'm just saying that

49:05factually

49:07Spinosas had a contractual 5% growth

49:09dividend with discretionary public So

49:12these This is warrant This warrants a

49:14day to me, and that gives you a week is

49:17what I have on here, a week and a half,

49:19to get to work, please, to have an

49:21in-depth conversation on that. I would

49:23like for us to please I want us all to

49:25speak. I'm not trying to control what

49:26anybody's saying, but today's about

49:29the ordinance language and really

49:31planning and zoning stuff, if that makes

49:33sense. So as we talk about it, I'm not

49:36trying to control what anybody's saying,

49:37but that's something we can definitely

49:38dig into

49:40you know, in two more or three more

49:41meetings. So I didn't mean to cut you

49:42off. Do you have anything else you want

49:43to

49:44comment on? I don't know. There's a lot,

49:45Councilman.

49:46>> Uh no, I mean I I think that it's it is

49:49back to Councilman Carlisle's point is

49:52where do want to be?

49:53Okay, what do we want to have in place?

49:56We want

49:57less pollution, water protected. We want

50:00these facilities that are bringing us

50:02income, we want them to be able to come

50:04here safely.

50:06Okay, right now, you know, everyone that

50:09that idea that the community has bought

50:11or been sold is that somehow if we pass

50:14a moratorium,

50:16all the construction is going to stop on

50:17Colossus 2.

50:18>> we we got it.

50:19>> There's going to be no more air

50:20pollution, that everything's going to be

50:22fine, but that's not going to happen

50:24with the moratorium.

50:25>> to be done.

50:26>> There's nothing all that does is do

50:28potentially damage our ability to get

50:31income into our city that we need. So,

50:34if in 4 weeks we can do everything

50:37possible based on what our legal ability

50:40is right now. And I believe anybody who

50:43knows that's going to be Alan Wade, and

50:45that's what he's telling us.

50:45>> We're doing it. Yeah, we're doing the

50:46work. We're doing the work right now.

50:48>> else it's so to do anything else, to

50:51pacify people who are out there with

50:54incorrect information, and are doing

50:56things for political purposes so they

50:58can win campaigns. You know, I mean, I

51:00this

51:01in my mind, you know, we have to be the

51:03grown-ups in the room. We have to be the

51:06grown-ups in the room.

51:07>> about to push mute. Thank you. All

51:08right, Councilwoman Walker.

51:10>> So, I'd like to think that I'm one of

51:11the grown-ups in the room.

51:13>> you are.

51:13>> [laughter]

51:14>> And um

51:16So, let's I just want to take a minute

51:18or two and talk about this thing about

51:22they're going elsewhere. Elsewhere

51:24where? Cuz whatever else they go, there

51:27will be a process.

51:29There will be a process.

51:31These entities are not going anywhere

51:34and just post up.

51:37So, to me that comes across like a

51:40threat. And then,

51:43we never get names of these entities, we

51:46never get names or locations or people.

51:48We we never So, this area for me in this

51:52whole process has always been

51:54questionable cuz we never get the who,

51:57the what,

51:59the when. And back to what he was

52:00saying, and I touched on it, and Doug

52:02explained it more than once,

52:05there are individuals

52:08there are entities in a queue.

52:11And they're waiting, they're going

52:12through a process to come online with

52:15us. And that won't happen until next

52:18year. So, if anyone comes after that,

52:21it's going to be after that. So, when

52:23you say you're going elsewhere, you

52:26could be in the queue here waiting on us

52:28to get this situated. Cuz if you go, and

52:32I'm repeating myself,

52:34if you go anywhere else, you're still

52:37going to have to participate in the

52:38process. So, I just find it concerning

52:41that that keeps being thrown at us,

52:44"Well, they're going to go elsewhere."

52:45Elsewhere where? Where is there no

52:48process to do this?

52:50>> Councilwoman

52:51>> Councilwoman uh Attorney Way.

52:53>> Um

52:55so, the process now for electric power

52:59in the Tennessee Valley is

53:02TVA and the local distributor.

53:05You go south in the Mississippi, you're

53:08dealing with

53:09all the things we talked about when we

53:11were talking about doing power

53:12generation. You have a private uh

53:16provider, and you have to And that's

53:19what's what happened in Virginia. You

53:20have a multitude of providers, and

53:22that's how it they get

53:25favored treatment.

53:26>> But with respect to Mississippi

53:29and the lawsuit, would they be offering

53:31people a buyout if they didn't think

53:33they were going to win the lawsuit?

53:35>> No.

53:37>> I yield the floor.

53:38>> I'm I'm not disagreeing. I'm just saying

53:42>> All right, we got uh Madam

53:44>> I'll follow

53:48All right, Madam Chair.

53:51>> Thank you.

53:54With our special use permit, I'm

53:56wondering if we can put something in

53:57place. You had said that we have about

53:59four or five data centers that will be

54:00coming in the next what, four or five

54:02months?

54:02>> Yes.

54:03>> How is it that we can put something in

54:05place so that we're notified prior to

54:07them going to MLGW? Because now MLGW is

54:12telling us what's coming.

54:14>> Oh.

54:15>> Is there any way that we can put a

54:16restriction that they're coming to us?

54:18For instance, if you're getting a permit

54:19with the city of Memphis, we receive

54:22notification of who's applied for the

54:23permit, where it will be, how many

54:25people going to be there, however.

54:27>> Oh, abso- absolutely. I mean, but I

54:28think they don't come to us until they

54:31have an agreement to get power.

54:34So, they go to the power source before

54:37they come to us.

54:39That's just the way they operate. Now,

54:42if they start trying to

54:44file in and get permits to start doing

54:47that before,

54:49then that we have to have a process in

54:51place to stop that. And that's what this

54:54ordinance is trying to do. They would

54:56have to identify in the application who

54:57they are, where they're going, what

54:59they're going to do.

55:00>> That would be part of the application

55:02process.

55:02>> Yes, and they'd have to identify their

55:04megawatt requirements and that they have

55:07adequate contracts to get the power

55:10>> Okay.

55:11>> before they can go forward.

55:12>> Okay, sounds good. Okay.

55:15>> All right.

55:15Is that something that we

55:18can change, should change,

55:21add to the UDC, to the ordinance that's

55:24before us

55:25for first reading today?

55:26>> cannot control who goes to TVA and go

55:30who goes to MLGW. That's

55:32up to them. Now, you may be able to ask

55:35them to notify you who they are uh they

55:38get here, but it's like the chicken and

55:40the egg. They the horse

55:43is is going to MLGW to to drink water

55:46first before they start bringing the

55:48cart here. Okay, that's

55:50that's the

55:52the hierarchy.

55:53>> Okay.

55:55Can you confirm that for us the next

55:56meeting?

55:57>> Sure.

55:58>> All right.

56:01Yeah, right. Um well, that's what

56:03happened last time. The comment was we

56:05still needed be notified again. We're

56:07not trying to serve as a block

56:09on growth and good things.

56:11>> helps us to know what's coming. You

56:13know, what I'm saying?

56:13>> and this is all unprecedented stuff. So,

56:15maybe we could look into that.

56:19Of course not. Yeah, yeah. Yeah.

56:22Hey, and I want to do this real quick

56:24and I want to cuz I want to ask you

56:25this.

56:26So, on my ordinance

56:28there's a

56:29a moratorium that was indefinite. So,

56:31just by acclamation, this is actually

56:33for the record, I want to make my

56:35ordinance expire on December 31st, 2026.

56:41>> That's reasonable.

56:42>> So, that's done.

56:43>> That could be tied into

56:47the moratorium could be built baked into

56:49the um

56:51the land use ordinance that's going

56:53through on first reading.

56:54>> So, I had a

56:54>> Or separately, I don't care. I mean

56:56>> Yeah, yeah. So, just So, now So, now for

56:57the record, that's on the individual one

56:59that I did. But, let's hypothetically

57:01walk through it.

57:03It was a moratorium that you were still

57:05allowed to do everything. The only thing

57:07it was a moratorium on was final

57:09approval.

57:10So, that means that a business could

57:12come to us,

57:14a potential data center, go through all

57:15the processes.

57:17>> Yeah, the problem is that you don't have

57:19the processes.

57:20>> That's right. So, that's

57:21>> So, So, what you you know, I mean it

57:23would it gets kind of messy because

57:26one thing you want you could do

57:28is say, "We we're pursuing this land use

57:32process

57:33and we want the moratorium to last until

57:36it is adopted. If what you're saying is

57:38you want to give businesses the ability

57:41to opt in and say, "I agree to be bound

57:44by that before it's enacted." But that's

57:47gets messed up. Okay, I mean I tried to

57:49think through it.

57:50>> So I think all you want to do is just to

57:52protect the legislative process that's

57:55started. And for as long as that's

57:57necessary, and then once that's

57:59necessary, there's a moratorium drops

58:01off the table.

58:02>> Yeah, and also what

58:03>> to keep that keeps anybody from sneaking

58:06in

58:06>> Sneaking in, yeah.

58:08Yeah, okay.

58:10>> I mean I think we're all on the same

58:12page that

58:14we don't want what happened to happen

58:16again.

58:16>> That's right.

58:17>> just might to disagree on the degree and

58:20approach, but I think you got to have

58:22something in place

58:24that gives you control, and that's

58:27what I tried to provide to you.

58:29>> Well, and I humbly see that as a

58:30compromise because, you know, doing that

58:33and putting that timeline on it, we

58:34already have essentially a moratorium

58:36that's 45 days or 90 days while the

58:38process is going, but it also protects

58:39us from somebody sneaking in under the

58:41old rules.

58:43And then once we get the process done,

58:44it could be 4 weeks.

58:46Yeah, and then we're done once it's

58:47done.

58:48>> Yeah, one thing I mean I don't think

58:50vested rights are tied to ownership of

58:52property.

58:54But remember some property I mean

58:57used to be that you go buy a property

58:59and then

59:01for billboards

59:02then you're grandfathered.

59:04>> Yeah.

59:04>> So what you you don't want people having

59:06that argument. So that's what a

59:08moratorium would do is prevent that from

59:10happening while you pursue. And I think

59:12it's always advisable to have a

59:15legislative process in place ongoing

59:19that you're protecting because the

59:21courts will think anything else is just

59:24a unilateral moratorium is

59:27a de facto prohibition against the use

59:30that you're talking about.

59:31>> Councilwoman Easter Thomas, she asked me

59:34when she was in the queue about 45

59:35minutes ago. So, I can ask Councilwoman

59:37Easter Thomas.

59:40Just say comma.

59:41>> Yeah, I always got lots of notes. Uh

59:43thank you, chair.

59:44Um

59:45I just have a few questions. And I guess

59:48they can all be uh geared towards

59:51Attorney White. Um and some of these

59:53have started to be talked about, but

59:55since we're in the the thick of the

59:57sausage making, I figured it it would

59:58help me with the thinking.

1:00:00Um so, thank you to staff who did the

1:00:03comparison and summaries though, also.

1:00:06Uh what's the proposed and intended time

1:00:08frame of the ordinances

1:00:105985 and 86? I heard Espinosa say um end

1:00:14of the year.

1:00:16But, is there like an intended time

1:00:17frame for uh ordinance 5986?

1:00:22>> Uh that depends on the body. I mean,

1:00:25>> Well, I guess I guess they might be to

1:00:27make more of the

1:00:28>> of those two

1:00:30had decided to table them while this

1:00:34other thing goes through, I think that's

1:00:35what they

1:00:36>> just to clarify for the public, anybody

1:00:38watching, is Councilman Warren's.

1:00:41Um and then uh there was a I didn't see

1:00:43a number on Councilwoman Logan's.

1:00:45Um if that's what you're asking and then

1:00:47>> On the report, we only had three.

1:00:51Ordinances.

1:00:52>> That So, that may not If you've got

1:00:53numbers on what

1:00:55>> 5982,

1:00:56which is a substitute ordinance, that's

1:00:58the moratorium.

1:00:595985

1:01:01>> Nine.

1:01:02>> And then 5986.

1:01:04>> Four.

1:01:05>> So, which one we missing?

1:01:06>> Ron, the one that was presented to us

1:01:08just Tuesday.

1:01:09>> What number is it?

1:01:10>> I don't know that it's been assigned a

1:01:11number.

1:01:12>> yet.

1:01:12>> Okay. But, that's not the resolution

1:01:14mentioned. That's

1:01:15The resolution is Cooper Sutton's,

1:01:17right?

1:01:17>> Yes.

1:01:18>> Correct.

1:01:19>> Okay. So, are we not considering Logan's

1:01:22Logan's ordinance?

1:01:27Which is

1:01:305982?

1:01:31>> It is the unnumbered one that we

1:01:33received Tuesday that

1:01:35the

1:01:38>> 5987

1:01:38>> that Wade comprehensive

1:01:40>> comprehensive. That's the 5987.

1:01:42>> So, 5987.

1:01:44>> Okay.

1:01:50>> Right. It doesn't

1:01:51matter what the meaning is.

1:01:52>> Yeah. Yeah.

1:01:55>> We'll get you a number.

1:01:56>> Yeah.

1:01:56>> Mr. Chairman

1:01:57>> I'll get you a number.

1:01:58>> Mr. Chairman, do you mind cleaning up

1:01:59the record?

1:02:00Would you mind Mr. Chairman, do you mind

1:02:02cleaning this cleaning this up?

1:02:03>> Yeah. Yeah. I'm I'm about to. I'm sorry.

1:02:05I was I was listening to everything

1:02:06yeah, exactly. All right. So, for the

1:02:08public where you're watching us do this

1:02:10in real time, she didn't have an

1:02:11ordinance number assigned to hers yet

1:02:13because we recessed

1:02:15in the magical way that we did 2 days

1:02:16ago. And so, here we are and we're

1:02:18talking about a record her ordinance

1:02:21without a number and we just found out

1:02:22we all did it in real time that it's 598

1:02:25>> Hers hers will be 5988.

1:02:28>> Hers will be 5988.

1:02:29>> And it will be first reading

1:02:33>> on consent.

1:02:35>> Okay. And it's first reading on consent.

1:02:36>> And then y'all can decide to hold them

1:02:38and do whatever you want.

1:02:39>> Yeah.

1:02:40>> Okay. So, back to the question. I'm

1:02:42still in the queue.

1:02:44>> Yeah. Yeah. She

1:02:44>> Oh, let's not get Come on.

1:02:46>> Yeah.

1:02:47>> 5985

1:02:50>> You have you have

1:02:51>> It's four ordinances and one resolution.

1:02:53>> You have Logan's in your packet.

1:02:56>> Yeah.

1:02:5712258285868788.

1:02:59So, five

1:03:02ordinances and a resolution.

1:03:04>> in the in the resolution and from what

1:03:06Attorney Wade just said, the resolution

1:03:08has been bundled into No? Okay.

1:03:12Okay. Never mind. So, the resolution

1:03:13stands alone.

1:03:14All right.

1:03:18>> Okay.

1:03:20Back to that helps the question there.

1:03:22Well, the first question. So, what is

1:03:24the proposed and intended time frame? I

1:03:26guess this is towards the makers of

1:03:27these ordinances for y'all's ordinances.

1:03:31>> Yeah, so I'll start. Mine was after

1:03:33third reading approval everything would

1:03:35go. But, once, you know, JB, Councilman

1:03:39Smalley had his

1:03:41mine was introduced, Warren's was

1:03:42introduced, now Logan's. So, we're

1:03:44holding them.

1:03:45>> No, I'm sorry.

1:03:47Time frame is in for how long it would

1:03:49take of what you put in the ordinance to

1:03:52actually become

1:03:54law and regulation.

1:03:56>> Yeah, she

1:03:58Yeah, go ahead.

1:03:59Okay.

1:03:59>> So, like the moratorium is clear, 18

1:04:01months. But, what's the time frame for

1:04:02every all of them?

1:04:03>> the other two So, I had a moratorium in

1:04:05mine, indefinite.

1:04:07>> That's my next question.

1:04:09>> So, the other all of the others are

1:04:12creating a framework.

1:04:14>> Mhm.

1:04:14>> They require some additional action by

1:04:17this body to breathe life into the

1:04:19framework.

1:04:19>> Mhm.

1:04:20>> So, they don't have a deadline at this

1:04:22point.

1:04:23>> Okay.

1:04:24>> They just trigger us to

1:04:26do something in the future.

1:04:28>> Okay.

1:04:29Thank you. Uh Attorney Wyatt.

1:04:32>> No, you would just send the report

1:04:34reporting on the ordinances.

1:04:36Yours has 90 days

1:04:37>> report.

1:04:42>> Yes, so Councilwoman Logan is saying

1:04:44that within hers that we mentioned this

1:04:46earlier, hers had a 45-day analysis

1:04:48period and then a 90-day

1:04:51final period

1:04:53to where it's done, right?

1:04:55>> But, we would still have to vote on it

1:04:56as a body.

1:04:58>> Correct.

1:04:58>> Okay.

1:05:00>> So, whatever it is, correct.

1:05:02>> Okay.

1:05:03So, to clarify,

1:05:06in those five ordinances,

1:05:09all of them include a moratorium.

1:05:14>> No.

1:05:14>> Mine

1:05:15>> Mine

1:05:15>> Okay. So, out of those five,

1:05:18which ones include a moratorium? Because

1:05:21earlier in discussion, more than two

1:05:24talked about a pause.

1:05:26So, which ordinances actually have a

1:05:27moratorium in them?

1:05:28>> body putting a pause in, not

1:05:32integral to their proposals. Now,

1:05:35Smanozza has it integral in his

1:05:37proposal. It wasn't in Warren's. And you

1:05:39say you had a

1:05:41brief pause in Logan's. Um

1:05:44>> So, it was just

1:05:45>> So, it was

1:05:45>> So, so three of them have a moratorium.

1:05:48>> No. No.

1:05:49>> Okay. So, let's explain the difference

1:05:51in a pause and a moratorium then.

1:05:53>> Yeah. Yeah. A moratorium, well, they're

1:05:55about the same.

1:05:57>> So, three of them got a moratorium.

1:05:59>> Yeah. I mean, including

1:06:01>> Now, we're back to three.

1:06:02>> [clears throat]

1:06:02>> He has a moratorium.

1:06:03>> So, five minus eight two is moratorium.

1:06:05>> have a moratorium.

1:06:06>> We had I had a named moratorium that

1:06:09lasted

1:06:09>> There's two others other than his. So,

1:06:11there's three.

1:06:12>> So, three ordinances have a moratorium.

1:06:14>> Yes.

1:06:14>> Hers did not use the word moratorium. It

1:06:16just said 45 days.

1:06:18>> But she mean but it's a moratorium.

1:06:20>> Essentially.

1:06:21It's the same thing.

1:06:23>> Okay. Just making sure.

1:06:25Um I just want to make sure cuz I'm sure

1:06:28these are the same questions we might

1:06:30have going on. But especially if we have

1:06:33five different ones,

1:06:35it makes sense to see which ones to

1:06:36actually look at that are saying the

1:06:38same thing. So, does yours way that you

1:06:41put together comprehensive, does that

1:06:42have a moratorium or a pause in it?

1:06:45>> No, it does not. It has

1:06:48It's just a legislative process to go

1:06:50through three readings and then it'll be

1:06:51fine.

1:06:52Now,

1:06:53>> Okay.

1:06:53>> what what we were talking about is do we

1:06:55want to

1:06:57introduce

1:06:59a limited moratorium while that one is

1:07:01in place. You can amend the one that I

1:07:03have to put it in there, but it's not in

1:07:05there.

1:07:06>> Okay.

1:07:07Okay.

1:07:08>> And I want to move to amend it to that

1:07:10one now, but I'm going to wait.

1:07:12>> [laughter]

1:07:13[snorts]

1:07:13>> Okay.

1:07:14>> Because well, in all honesty, as we work

1:07:15through this, I think everybody's seeing

1:07:17what we all agree with, and so I feel

1:07:18like yours is leading the way. So, I

1:07:20just wanted to

1:07:21>> Cuz three out of three out of five

1:07:23sound like a majority.

1:07:26Um so, another question.

1:07:30Is So, for the UDC update

1:07:34and this is 5986.

1:07:37So, [snorts] is this saying that the

1:07:39zoning regulation will be included in

1:07:41the UDC update, or will it have to be

1:07:43added later?

1:07:46And I guess that might be for Wade and

1:07:48Rex.

1:07:49>> Okay, what's what'll what'll happen with

1:07:52I I think it's 5987

1:07:54as

1:07:55is the ordinance.

1:07:56>> 5987 is yours.

1:07:58>> Yes.

1:07:59That's the zoning ordinance.

1:08:00>> Okay.

1:08:01>> That will

1:08:02mean the UDC is being updated. It'll be

1:08:05codified through the UDC process, but it

1:08:08will go into effect upon adoption.

1:08:11>> Separate from the UDC update.

1:08:12>> Yes.

1:08:13>> Okay, but codified into the actual UDC.

1:08:16>> Yes.

1:08:17>> Okay.

1:08:21Can you

1:08:23um

1:08:25And this is asking

1:08:28different questions about the

1:08:29particulars of the separate ordinances

1:08:32to you, Attorney Wade.

1:08:34Can you tell us for ordinance 5982,

1:08:38which is the original moratorium by

1:08:40Smiling, what is legally risky

1:08:44about it, and

1:08:47with it, does the exit clause not help

1:08:50the legal risk,

1:08:51if there is any?

1:08:53>> Okay, so when we um

1:08:56did the oil pipeline,

1:08:58um [snorts]

1:09:00Representative Vaughn of Caryville

1:09:04had introduced a bill to stop us from

1:09:07regulating it.

1:09:08And we worked with him and had him carve

1:09:12out

1:09:13a limitation

1:09:15uh that we could

1:09:17pursue. And what he said was that you

1:09:21can have a moratorium as long as it is

1:09:25reasonable in time

1:09:26and it's not a de facto prohibition

1:09:29against infra- industrial infrastructure

1:09:32being uh implemented in

1:09:35a municipality.

1:09:37Otherwise, you're limited. And also,

1:09:40when you do your regulation, you're

1:09:42limited to land use, siting,

1:09:45uh

1:09:46right-of-way protection,

1:09:49uh things of that nature. You can also

1:09:52uh enforce

1:09:55natural resources provided they are

1:09:57approved by TDEC and all of the

1:10:00regulatory

1:10:01You don't have the authority to stop it,

1:10:03but you have the authority to implement

1:10:05it once those permits

1:10:07are issued. And so, there's a limited

1:10:10basis, and that's what the ordinance

1:10:12that I did tried to stay intact with

1:10:14that.

1:10:15>> Okay. So,

1:10:18So, the original one

1:10:19>> The legal risk you ask about

1:10:21>> Mhm.

1:10:21>> is there is a specific provision that it

1:10:24has to be reasonable in time.

1:10:26>> Do they give Who says reasonable to

1:10:28judge?

1:10:29>> Everything a judge.

1:10:29>> Yes. A judge. [laughter]

1:10:30>> A judge decides what's reasonable.

1:10:32>> And so, you know, that's where you have

1:10:35industry pushing back and you have us

1:10:38pushing back.

1:10:38>> Mhm.

1:10:39>> Uh

1:10:40>> In your opinion, do you think that

1:10:43reasonable

1:10:44reasonability gets helped by the exit

1:10:47clause?

1:10:48Or that's still up to judge

1:10:50determination when we cross if we have

1:10:52to cross there?

1:10:53>> You still have to evaluate the

1:10:55reasonableness of you using the exit

1:10:58clause. And it's all going to be an

1:11:01inquiry of whether that's a pretext or

1:11:03pretense to validate the ordinance.

1:11:06So, my opinion is that you use

1:11:10a moratorium will be

1:11:13generally deemed to be per se if you are

1:11:16legitimately pursuing a legislative

1:11:19action that you can pursue.

1:11:21One of the things about the

1:11:24the moratorium

1:11:25is that it requires you to do things

1:11:28that you don't have the authority to do

1:11:30and you're going to study things that

1:11:32you don't have the authority to do,

1:11:33which will lengthen the time that you

1:11:36legitimately should. And I understand we

1:11:38disagree on that, but that's

1:11:40>> But this is what the legal things may

1:11:42say.

1:11:42>> That's what you would be fighting about

1:11:43in court.

1:11:45>> Okay.

1:11:48Okay.

1:11:49Thank you.

1:11:51Um

1:11:51next question.

1:11:53Outside of the original

1:11:55uh ordinance 5982, the other four are

1:11:59community benefits language

1:12:02included [snorts]

1:12:03in these? And I guess this goes to the

1:12:05the makers of the sponsor ones.

1:12:06>> Two of the other three are.

1:12:08>> Okay, which which ones have community

1:12:10benefits?

1:12:10>> Warren have community benefit language

1:12:13in them.

1:12:13>> Bonilla and Warren?

1:12:14>> Yeah, Logan's does not. Logan's

1:12:17specifically

1:12:18eschewed going down that road

1:12:21cuz she thought it was outside our

1:12:22purview.

1:12:23>> Mine does too, right?

1:12:25>> Okay.

1:12:25>> Yours has it in the moratorium has you

1:12:28studying it. It doesn't have you

1:12:29implement it.

1:12:30>> So, I anticipate you saying it was

1:12:31illegal.

1:12:32>> Okay.

1:12:34All right.

1:12:34>> And if you want me to give you the basis

1:12:36upon which we have no authority, I'd be

1:12:38glad to do that.

1:12:38>> Nah, not not right now. Not right now,

1:12:41attorney Wait.

1:12:48>> I said that you intentionally avoided

1:12:51putting community benefit provisions in

1:12:54your ordinance that you were pure zoning

1:12:57ordinance.

1:13:01Yes.

1:13:06>> All right, turn away. Um I'm still on

1:13:08the queue. Uh so, for I know for these

1:13:10zoning and impairment regulations, um

1:13:13this is a question

1:13:15possible.

1:13:16Um not trying to get in trouble here,

1:13:18but if we're doing zoning and impairment

1:13:20regulations, and if we are considering

1:13:23making data centers special use cuz

1:13:25that's what they would be.

1:13:28I know that we cannot

1:13:30grandfather in

1:13:33places, companies, entities that are

1:13:36already present.

1:13:37>> Un-grandfather.

1:13:39>> We un-grandfather.

1:13:41>> Yeah, we can't change their vested

1:13:43rights. That's what That's what you're

1:13:44saying.

1:13:45>> Um yeah. I hate that term uh

1:13:48also, but I couldn't think of another

1:13:49term, but

1:13:51I hate it.

1:13:51Um so, we can't un-grandfather them in.

1:13:55And it applies to expansions, but not

1:13:57current.

1:13:59Is there something that can go in

1:14:00special use permits that are

1:14:03time-based renewals of zoning and

1:14:06permits within special use? Has that

1:14:09been done before? Is there a precedence

1:14:10on it?

1:14:11>> Let me Let me give you the overview. Uh

1:14:14I mean, this is a land use

1:14:16thing. So, essentially

1:14:18>> questions.

1:14:18>> Essentially, people have zoning.

1:14:21And they have the right

1:14:23to be industrial zone.

1:14:25>> Mhm.

1:14:26>> What we have done is overlay on that a

1:14:29process

1:14:31by which we will allow their sites to go

1:14:34in those zones, okay? We cannot prohibit

1:14:37them

1:14:38without interfering with their property

1:14:41rights.

1:14:42>> True.

1:14:43>> Okay, so what happens, this has been

1:14:45done and is being done in

1:14:48Collierville, Germantown, all throughout

1:14:50the jurisdiction, that you can attach

1:14:54legitimate

1:14:55conditions and restrictions on the use,

1:14:58but you cannot prohibit the use. So,

1:15:01that's why we put land, you know,

1:15:04site plan review and conditional review

1:15:06permits. Now, what the conditional

1:15:08review permits addresses

1:15:11is where you bring these obnoxious uses

1:15:13like wind turbines, I mean, gas

1:15:15turbines.

1:15:16You have to have actual permit where we

1:15:19can be discretionary. The other you you

1:15:21can't be discretionary. So, so you're

1:15:24asking

1:15:25can we put time limits?

1:15:27No.

1:15:28>> Time-based renewals?

1:15:30>> No, we can't.

1:15:31>> Can't do like every 2 years you have to

1:15:32renew your permit?

1:15:34>> No, ma'am.

1:15:34>> What about

1:15:35um

1:15:36continuous operation? Like if they stop

1:15:39for a certain amount of time

1:15:41is there something that

1:15:43Oh, you stop for 30 days, 60 days, 90

1:15:46days. Now, you have to re- go through

1:15:48this process that we put in and your

1:15:50ungrandfathered status doesn't help you

1:15:52in this.

1:15:53>> end up you end up affecting property

1:15:55rights when you start putting time

1:15:57limits on their right to use the

1:15:58property.

1:15:59What you do is you put reasonable

1:16:01restrictions and conditions on their

1:16:03use. And they last in perpetuity until

1:16:08they are gone. And that one additional

1:16:10thing that we've

1:16:11>> What considers gone?

1:16:12>> Until they just I mean

1:16:14as as she pointed out

1:16:17the technology changes and they may go,

1:16:19"Hell, we don't need this crap anymore.

1:16:20We're just going to leave, you know."

1:16:22So, what you put in as a condition

1:16:25is that you have to have a cessation or

1:16:28reclamation plan where they have to have

1:16:30obligation to take it out once they

1:16:33don't want it anymore.

1:16:34>> And this cessation plan would apply to

1:16:36everyone, not just those who are after

1:16:38the time period of when the zoning it in

1:16:40place.

1:16:40>> That's correct. Once you get a

1:16:43Once you go through our process, your

1:16:45special use permit is going to require

1:16:48you to agree that you will remove these

1:16:52properties this equipment once it's

1:16:55obsolete or you don't want it anymore.

1:16:57Which is something that we don't have in

1:16:59a lot of places.

1:17:00>> Okay.

1:17:01>> I got one question.

1:17:02>> Uh can I use my time for his one

1:17:03question? And I got one last question.

1:17:05>> in the same vein. Just on that same

1:17:06thing about about Is it Is it what about

1:17:10transfer of beneficial ownership?

1:17:14It's like we treat hotels or a sign

1:17:17where they're where they're basically

1:17:18non-conforming where they become

1:17:19grandfathered in or whatever. If I

1:17:21transfer my ownership in the hotel, I

1:17:22still have to come back and get

1:17:23reapproved, right?

1:17:24>> I mean, this this is going to run with

1:17:27the land.

1:17:28And it's going to bind anybody that gets

1:17:30it.

1:17:36>> Okay.

1:17:37Uh last question, Sheriff. Any of these

1:17:39five ordinances is a resolution.

1:17:41Can the state preempt or override any of

1:17:44these?

1:17:45>> Yes.

1:17:46Um

1:17:49Well, I think

1:17:51they're going to have a harder time

1:17:52preempting the zoning.

1:17:55That's been specifically permitted.

1:17:58Uh it's specifically permitted for every

1:18:01jurisdiction in the state of Tennessee.

1:18:03And so, where you start

1:18:04>> And which one is it? 5986?

1:18:07>> 7 87

1:18:08>> Yes.

1:18:09>> The one you you did?

1:18:10>> Yeah.

1:18:11>> That's the only one that probably could

1:18:12withstand

1:18:14>> Um

1:18:15>> Is it because it doesn't mention a

1:18:16moratorium or because it just

1:18:18specifically does zoning for special

1:18:20use?

1:18:20>> It's the And And Logan's, too. They

1:18:22specifically deal with with zoning only.

1:18:26>> Yeah, we got a lot of other stuff.

1:18:27>> Which is an inherent inherent It's

1:18:30almost an inherent right to our police

1:18:32power.

1:18:33So, it's been in time immemorial since

1:18:351923. And I doubt that any jurisdiction

1:18:38in Tennessee has to come going to allow

1:18:40them to take it away from them.

1:18:42>> The expansion part is more

1:18:43>> Okay.

1:18:44I have no question for now, chair. Thank

1:18:46you.

1:18:48>> All right. We

1:18:50I hadn't gotten it for you yet, but I

1:18:51assume it'll be 5988.

1:18:56>> All right. So, we've got

1:18:58an hour and 3 minutes left. We've got 1

1:19:022 3 4 5 council members in the queue.

1:19:06I'm loving it.

1:19:07We're legislating today.

1:19:09Councilwoman Cooper-Sutton.

1:19:12>> Thank you. Thank you, chair.

1:19:14My main and my biggest concern is

1:19:16zoning, and I want to know how quick can

1:19:18we how fast, because this is very

1:19:21critical, can we get these out of the

1:19:23neighborhoods

1:19:24of 38109,

1:19:2638113,

1:19:2838127,

1:19:3038107, and 38109.

1:19:33I know zoning is where we have our

1:19:35legislation power.

1:19:37I

1:19:38I mean, it's just so much with these

1:19:40numbers that are going on, but I want to

1:19:42focus on how are we going to maneuver

1:19:45and get these out of our black,

1:19:47predominantly black, high

1:19:50industrial

1:19:52out of these black communities and near

1:19:53our from our schools. How fast,

1:19:56how soon can we start working on this

1:19:58part?

1:20:00>> Um

1:20:01unfortunately, that's

1:20:03over our purview.

1:20:05Uh unless

1:20:07you want to use condemnation and buy

1:20:09these facilities back.

1:20:11Which would be beyond the financial

1:20:15capacity of the state of Tennessee,

1:20:17quite frankly.

1:20:21>> So, we're just

1:20:22in the zoning part, we're just going to

1:20:25>> The whole thing about the moratorium is

1:20:26to prevent this from happening again.

1:20:29It's prospective, not retroactive, okay?

1:20:32>> I I under- I understand that, but they

1:20:34need to be out of our communities.

1:20:36>> That's

1:20:37a That's a discussion beyond my pay

1:20:40grade.

1:20:40>> Okay.

1:20:42Well, as long as we can get this done

1:20:43quickly.

1:20:45With the permitting part, that's what we

1:20:46have control over, right? Okay. And so

1:20:49we we can pause the permitting part?

1:20:54>> You mean I I mean

1:20:55>> we can we can we can regulate we can

1:20:58have eyes on the permitting part of it.

1:21:00>> Absolutely. It's got to come back

1:21:01through you.

1:21:02With a whole book

1:21:05of

1:21:06information.

1:21:06>> will still be in these industrial

1:21:09places. Is that's what you're saying?

1:21:11>> Well, we're looking at that now. That's

1:21:13part of the process. You're going to

1:21:15have that all evaluated when you have a

1:21:17final ordinance.

1:21:18>> That's what we're doing here together

1:21:20over the next

1:21:21four weeks.

1:21:21>> That we're going to go into all of that,

1:21:23trust me.

1:21:24>> Hey.

1:21:28I'm trying to find the source of that

1:21:30annoying sound, sorry. First time that's

1:21:32ever happened. All right, Council

1:21:35Councilwoman White.

1:21:42>> So, I wanted to find out so so I think

1:21:44we're

1:21:46two things.

1:21:47One,

1:21:48now look at the camera when I say this

1:21:50and I hope that you all play it. Because

1:21:53even some of my colleagues on this body

1:21:55has made it as if we have delayed or

1:21:58attempted to delay a moratorium and I

1:22:01hope that after this working session

1:22:02that people realize that we have more in

1:22:05common than we did differences. And had

1:22:08that moratorium gone forward on Tuesday,

1:22:11it likely would have failed simply

1:22:13because we didn't take the time and do

1:22:15what we're doing right now.

1:22:18But back to this, my question is

1:22:21if we take the one we have from Allen,

1:22:24which looks like it encompasses I've

1:22:27looked through all of these.

1:22:29It looks like it encompasses pretty much

1:22:31Councilwoman Logan's,

1:22:34Councilman Warren's, and Councilman

1:22:36Espinosa's attempted to just go ahead

1:22:39and directly regulate a lot of other

1:22:41things.

1:22:43If we do the pause right now, my

1:22:46question is, and I don't know if this is

1:22:48a Ragsdale question or an attorney Wade

1:22:51question,

1:22:52the particular permits that are in the

1:22:54queue right now for the expansion in

1:22:57those things.

1:23:00And it's kind of what I was asking

1:23:01earlier, but I don't know what stage

1:23:03those are in.

1:23:07Is there a way to pause all extensions,

1:23:11expansions, or anything until we're able

1:23:14to get the actual regulations in place?

1:23:17I understand we can pause any that come

1:23:19in, but I'm talking about the ones that

1:23:21are now pending but have not been

1:23:23approved.

1:23:25>> Uh no, if they're in permit process, if

1:23:28they've already been submitted, then

1:23:30these regulations would not and Alan can

1:23:32uh

1:23:33confirm that. But yeah, if they're

1:23:35already in process, then this would not

1:23:37regulate them.

1:23:42>> Yeah, the um

1:23:44you know, there's there's a there's a

1:23:46lot of

1:23:47Supreme Court Tennessee Supreme Court

1:23:49precedent about once you make

1:23:51substantial investment in a property,

1:23:54then

1:23:55the courts are not going to let you stop

1:23:56them.

1:23:57So, I think that the premise that we've

1:23:59all been operating on is whatever we got

1:24:02on the table now is going to be

1:24:04prospective as to any new facilities.

1:24:07That's a safe assumption that I think

1:24:09you can make.

1:24:10>> If you want to go to war, we can go to

1:24:13war, okay? I mean, that's kind of where

1:24:15we are.

1:24:15>> That'd be wasting taxpayers' dollars.

1:24:18We don't have any money right now.

1:24:20>> I'm good. Yeah, thank you. Thank you,

1:24:22Councilwoman. Are

1:24:23White.

1:24:23>> No, I just have one.

1:24:25I just have one more.

1:24:26>> I do that too, councilwoman

1:24:27Cooper-Smith.

1:24:28>> And so, for the

1:24:30for the going forward with what we have

1:24:32here,

1:24:35would we need to do a separate

1:24:37resolution for

1:24:41the pause in like how would it need to

1:24:43work in terms of the the necessary

1:24:46pause that needs to happen?

1:24:48Would we be able to amend?

1:24:51>> Yes.

1:24:52So, so

1:24:53>> Okay, let me let me say. There's two

1:24:55There's two ways. There's two ways,

1:24:56okay? We've done resolutions

1:25:00I mean, we've done moratorium by

1:25:03resolution when it's tied to a pending

1:25:06matter that's going through the process.

1:25:08You could amend 58

1:25:115987

1:25:13to add that there would be a moratorium

1:25:16until this one is effective.

1:25:18That's what you could do. You could

1:25:20amend it. I could change it.

1:25:23That could could happen. Or you could

1:25:25have a stand-alone ordinance if you want

1:25:27to go ordinance, but that would that

1:25:29would be defeating the purpose because

1:25:30it would take a longer for that to be

1:25:33effective before the actual ordinance

1:25:35was adopted.

1:25:37So, I mean, one or two things: a

1:25:39resolution or amending 5987.

1:25:44>> Okay, so we could amend the 59821

1:25:49to include

1:25:52for the Is that what you were saying?

1:25:54>> You're talking about the

1:25:56So, let's just say the his his the new

1:25:58one. And then let's just toss the

1:26:00numbers out. And I don't know what that

1:26:01sound is.

1:26:02>> You would amend that one.

1:26:03>> Okay, 59 I'm sorry, I didn't have 59.

1:26:05>> 5982 is the moratorium.

1:26:07>> I didn't know we had a number for that.

1:26:07>> 18-month moratorium.

1:26:095987

1:26:15All right, Council

1:26:17woman Logan.

1:26:22>> Um the 5987,

1:26:25where I talked about and this is the

1:26:27question and I did talk to you about the

1:26:28industrial. And I want since you're

1:26:30here, I want to ask you, you know the

1:26:32spot where the gas station it want to

1:26:34come in District 1 that is is it was

1:26:36industrial at um Fraser Raleigh and old

1:26:41Allen and it said I and I was like, why

1:26:43is this I right here in this in this in

1:26:46this residential area? And since this

1:26:48process has started, there are number of

1:26:50those

1:26:51in the city.

1:26:54So, if we go blanket industrial,

1:26:57will that cover

1:27:00I mean, how is that going to fare

1:27:02>> You you're not you're not going blanket

1:27:03industrial.

1:27:04>> Okay.

1:27:05>> You have two categories of industrial

1:27:07now, light and heavy.

1:27:09Cuz the first

1:27:12you're going to go

1:27:14you're going to go primarily heavy for

1:27:16large data center hyperscale because

1:27:19they are massive.

1:27:21>> Right.

1:27:22>> Uh

1:27:22the other ones, if you have under 10,

1:27:24that may be a school, that may be a

1:27:26barn, or that may be whatever.

1:27:29>> Medical center.

1:27:30>> Yeah, I mean, they don't have

1:27:33strong electrical needs. They don't

1:27:35generate the same noxious

1:27:37things. So, we we we're just talking

1:27:40generally now because we're going to do

1:27:42a deep dive into those. And and DPD has

1:27:46given us the maps.

1:27:48They're about 12 to 15 large industrial

1:27:51areas that we need to look at. And then

1:27:54you can also talk about how you do

1:27:56buffering and setbacks and things of

1:27:58that nature to protect residential

1:28:00neighbors.

1:28:01>> And

1:28:01>> I told you,

1:28:02>> Right.

1:28:02>> I will get with you and we will be

1:28:04involved in that process actively.

1:28:07>> And that's

1:28:07>> part of 5987 because you have to have an

1:28:10industrial zone that they are allowed to

1:28:13go in and then after they are allowed to

1:28:16go there you do all of the

1:28:18>> the other stuff.

1:28:18>> the review.

1:28:19>> Okay. All right.

1:28:21Thank you.

1:28:21>> And we'll talk about that Monday,

1:28:24October 19th.

1:28:26Yeah.

1:28:27I'm looking at you, man.

1:28:28All right. Uh Councilwoman Smiley.

1:28:32Councilwoman Smiley.

1:28:37I didn't actually have many questions,

1:28:38Ally.

1:28:39>> You ain't got no no nose?

1:28:44>> I didn't actually have many questions,

1:28:45Ally.

1:28:47Um

1:28:48All right. Just just a couple questions

1:28:50for me.

1:28:51Um

1:28:54If we would if I would, you know, look

1:28:56at 5982, the temporary moratorium

1:28:59ordinance, and I say I scratch out

1:29:01everything that you say is prohibitive

1:29:04or or

1:29:06has some question questionable legality.

1:29:09I leave Here's the pause. Here's the

1:29:11exit framework. And there's there's some

1:29:13ordinances that are already are in the

1:29:15pipeline.

1:29:16I think one of the things that we're

1:29:18leaving out of this is is the community

1:29:20has said two things consistently. One

1:29:23thing

1:29:24that the community has said consistently

1:29:26is what about the new data centers that

1:29:28are coming? Pause those. I don't think

1:29:31anyone in the community is going to push

1:29:33back. And I don't think we legally could

1:29:35push back against those um

1:29:37data centers that are legally vested.

1:29:39So, I think there's an opportunity here

1:29:42for us to give

1:29:45give uh

1:29:48respect and validity to the concerns of

1:29:50the community, but also recognizing our

1:29:53job as a legislative body to implement

1:29:56laws governing those entities that are

1:29:58here right now. I think Councilwoman

1:30:01Logan's proposal goes further

1:30:04um with respect to section four of the

1:30:06moratorium, which is almost identical to

1:30:08Councilwoman Logan's proposal

1:30:10as it relates to here's the information

1:30:13we want the division of planning and

1:30:14development to do.

1:30:16Uh what what I'm the the question here

1:30:18is is it possible if I scratch all the

1:30:20other stuff out, the study committee,

1:30:21all these other things and say here's

1:30:23the pause

1:30:24the exit framework is

1:30:27until the passage of

1:30:28passage and implementation of

1:30:31whether it's your

1:30:335987

1:30:35>> Yeah, 5987.

1:30:37Sorry, whatever. 5987

1:30:39>> Okay. Okay. So that

1:30:41Hold on. Hold on. I'm not I'm not done.

1:30:42So so you say yes.

1:30:45I don't think you can ask questions down

1:30:46there.

1:30:47Uh I would go down there and ask

1:30:48questions.

1:30:49>> DJ Wade, if you'll get that mic closer

1:30:51to you.

1:30:51>> sit beside you in a minute. Um I'm going

1:30:53to come sit beside you in a minute. So

1:30:54then my next question my next question

1:30:57for you is more so

1:31:00Well, I guess it's going to be ultimate

1:31:02ultimate question for the body, but I'm

1:31:03going to direct it to you because I

1:31:05think it's easier when we have a

1:31:06conversation.

1:31:08Um my next question for you is when we

1:31:11when we look at, you know,

1:31:14I won't say it that way. I will say it

1:31:16this way.

1:31:18Okay. So we know the path we just talked

1:31:20about is feasible. Scratch everything

1:31:21out and say this is effective until the

1:31:24passage of 5987.

1:31:26But is there is there

1:31:30anything that you anticipate cuz you

1:31:32know, this body listens listens to you

1:31:35is almost is abso as it is absolute Oh

1:31:37lord. We do. We do.

1:31:40I've been on this body seven years. What

1:31:42I'm trying to figure out is is there a

1:31:43way that we can say okay, we're

1:31:45implementing laws now to govern those

1:31:47entities that have

1:31:49vested rights, but is there a way if the

1:31:52moratorium goes forward

1:31:55that we can um

1:31:56have the temporary pause specifically

1:31:58applies to those entities that are or

1:32:00vested because it I'm going to tell you

1:32:02what my

1:32:04In the pi- so, not vested.

1:32:07>> Really, hey Mike, please Allen.

1:32:09Allen, microphone, microphone, please.

1:32:10Yeah.

1:32:12>> would do pending 5987. They would not be

1:32:15allowed to do anything until 5987 to

1:32:18>> So, I got the I got the There's two

1:32:19questions I'm asking. So, we're on the

1:32:21same page when it comes to what happens

1:32:23if I amend the moratorium until the

1:32:25passage of 5987. My my question

1:32:28specifically is the other concern of the

1:32:30community, which is

1:32:32what about

1:32:33um the new data centers that have do not

1:32:35have vested rights to come into the

1:32:37community. I think what I've been

1:32:38hearing consistently, cuz I've done

1:32:41countless meetings about this. What I've

1:32:43been hearing consistently is

1:32:45what about the other data centers? I

1:32:46think

1:32:48what the community is saying is the new

1:32:50data centers are concerning for them.

1:32:53How about we we pause when it comes to

1:32:55the new data centers,

1:32:57do some more research to determine how

1:32:59we feel about it. And I, you know,

1:33:02even when I have a difference of opinion

1:33:04with the members of this body, I'm able

1:33:05to have a very cordial conversation with

1:33:07them. I think there has to be a way for

1:33:10us to bring the experts in the room,

1:33:13respectfully.

1:33:15No one on this body is a scientist.

1:33:18Respectfully, no one on this body is an

1:33:21engineer by trade.

1:33:23We we have

1:33:25a skill set. We are people that are

1:33:28professional, and we have have a general

1:33:30use we have a general understanding of

1:33:32what the community is asking us to do,

1:33:34those of us who have been engaged that

1:33:36way.

1:33:37But I just don't I just don't believe

1:33:39that moving ahead when we talk about uh

1:33:43the temporary moratorium,

1:33:46that we should just say, "Hey, we're

1:33:47going to pass these laws, and these laws

1:33:49are sufficient to address the new the

1:33:51new data centers that are coming." I

1:33:52just think we have to we have to find a

1:33:54way to to pass laws to govern the ones

1:33:57that are here.

1:33:58But also slow down when you talk about

1:34:00the new data citizens that are coming

1:34:01in. Is there a way to do that?

1:34:02>> Okay, so let's talk about

1:34:03>> I'm talking about we already got the

1:34:04ones

1:34:05>> Let's talk about the category you just

1:34:06mentioned. So, these are people who have

1:34:09not

1:34:10applied to come.

1:34:11>> Yes.

1:34:12>> Okay. And and so, beyond

1:34:16regulating

1:34:18what happens when they apply,

1:34:21what

1:34:22kind of factors do you want us to look

1:34:25at beyond that in terms of

1:34:28I mean

1:34:29>> I'm ready.

1:34:29>> electric

1:34:30>> We're almost there. We're almost there.

1:34:31We're almost there.

1:34:32>> I mean, I'm just saying, what other

1:34:33things But that's a whole separate

1:34:35moratorium to me.

1:34:37>> Uh-uh, it's the language is there. Cuz

1:34:39>> But what are we going to do? We're going

1:34:40to study something that's not within our

1:34:42purview?

1:34:43>> No, it is within our purview, Attorney

1:34:44Wait.

1:34:45So, we talk about what's what's in and

1:34:48in and not in our purview, but it is

1:34:50within our purview. We can

1:34:52>> real quick, point of clarification for

1:34:53everybody, Councilman Hey, but if you

1:34:55don't mind yet, can

1:34:56>> talking to you. I wasn't talking

1:34:57>> Right, no, but I'm asking you to explain

1:34:58just a little bit to the body cuz I

1:34:59think people are trying to understand.

1:35:00>> Oh, okay. Me and Allen are on our own

1:35:02little world.

1:35:02>> Yeah, yeah, yeah.

1:35:03>> I apologize.

1:35:04>> Got it.

1:35:05>> We're in our own little world. All

1:35:06right.

1:35:07So, the first thing that Attorney Wait

1:35:09and I discussed is

1:35:12what happens if I amend the or anybody I

1:35:16mean, it don't have to be me. Like I'm

1:35:18This is not my ordinance. This is the

1:35:20ordinance I thought the people asked me

1:35:21to do. Um and

1:35:23So,

1:35:25the first thing is what happens if I

1:35:26amend it to take out any

1:35:28language that potentially be

1:35:30wouldn't pass what we believe to be the

1:35:33legal scrutiny legal muster. We remove

1:35:35that language and then if you if you

1:35:36read the moratorium, and I really hope

1:35:38you read it, the moratorium there at the

1:35:40very end of it is something that says

1:35:41duration. Then is there something that

1:35:43says exit framework.

1:35:46And in part of the exit framework, we we

1:35:49remove everything except for one

1:35:51provision that says this moratorium will

1:35:54be in effect until the passage of 5987.

1:35:59Attorney Way said he would agree with

1:36:01that.

1:36:02That's where we are. Now we're talking

1:36:03about something different. Where we are

1:36:05now is, okay,

1:36:08trying to find a way for this body to do

1:36:11our job, which is pass laws that governs

1:36:13those entities that are here and

1:36:16currently operating in the community. I

1:36:18wholeheartedly

1:36:20believe that we need to do that.

1:36:21>> Thank you. That just clicked with

1:36:22Attorney Way.

1:36:23>> So

1:36:24now I thought you

1:36:26so I wholeheartedly believe that is the

1:36:28job of this body.

1:36:30And I hate it took us this long cuz

1:36:32respectfully we've had a very long time

1:36:35to to to do this.

1:36:37Like many of us have been doing work,

1:36:39but we all should have been doing this

1:36:41work, too. That's one thing. And then

1:36:43I'm then back to the last part. Here's

1:36:45the last Here's Here's the last part.

1:36:47Here's the last part. Here's the last

1:36:49part.

1:36:50The last part that that I'm trying to

1:36:51figure out if there's a way to do it

1:36:54is we talked about those entities that

1:36:56have vested rights, those entities

1:36:57currently operate. We need to do that.

1:36:59But what about slowing down the other

1:37:03entities? And you And And the the

1:37:05language you use

1:37:07is it must be reasonable in time and

1:37:12What was the other part of it?

1:37:13Reasonable in time and

1:37:15>> and not a not a pro se barrier to

1:37:18>> and not a pro se barrier. So if we can I

1:37:20think

1:37:21there's language that we can fashion

1:37:24that can do just that. And And it's not

1:37:26And it's it's limited and it's

1:37:27reasonable in time

1:37:29because you said we must be doing work.

1:37:32And then your next question is

1:37:34during that time what are we studying?

1:37:36We study whatever that is legally

1:37:38permissible under law.

1:37:39We have When we talk about land use, we

1:37:42can study the

1:37:43the particular areas in which they go.

1:37:44There is

1:37:46There's a community There's a community

1:37:48in northern Virginia that has 200 data

1:37:51centers.

1:37:51>> Loudoun County.

1:37:52>> Yeah, Loudoun County.

1:37:53>> See, you

1:37:54I like people who read. There's There's

1:37:56a community in northern Virginia that

1:37:58has 200 data centers. And if we And we

1:38:00talk about what we haven't done, they've

1:38:02done it all. But in a when when they

1:38:04start getting hyper-scaled data centers

1:38:06in their community, guess what their

1:38:08community did? Their community put a

1:38:10temporary pause in to figure out so they

1:38:13can bring the experts in the room.

1:38:15I think we have to

1:38:18pass laws to deal with the vested the

1:38:19entities that have vested rights, but we

1:38:21also have to slow it down when it comes

1:38:23to the newer entities so we can learn

1:38:25more about this industry.

1:38:27I think that's what we should be doing.

1:38:29And I don't know I Listen, I'm just one

1:38:31lawyer reading the law, doing the

1:38:33research on research with help of staff,

1:38:36trying to figure out a way for us to get

1:38:38this done. I think we can do it all.

1:38:39>> a Can I ask you a question?

1:38:40>> ahead. Attorney White.

1:38:42>> Thank you, Councilman.

1:38:43>> I mean, I didn't

1:38:44I didn't ignore your ordinance, trust

1:38:47me.

1:38:48And um

1:38:50And what I tried to do is build in

1:38:53criteria

1:38:54in the review process

1:38:57that addresses all of the

1:38:59obnoxious things that you were trying to

1:39:01pause to study, okay? Which means that

1:39:04we have these industries come forward

1:39:06and tell us

1:39:07what's the what's your air quality study

1:39:10going to be? What's your noise

1:39:11mitigation going to be?

1:39:13You know, you can't bring in external

1:39:16power sources unless we agree. So, we

1:39:20we're going to They're going to slow

1:39:21down. They're going to have to go

1:39:22through a laborious process that's going

1:39:24to address all of that. And

1:39:27you know, to go back to Loudoun County,

1:39:30Virginia's

1:39:31General Assembly or legislative body,

1:39:34they had a legislative study committee.

1:39:37They did reports on land air quality,

1:39:40land use, water use, electric use, the

1:39:43whole nine yards. I got the

1:39:46I got all that here, but but I'm just

1:39:48telling you

1:39:49they're in a different paradigm than us.

1:39:51>> Let me bring it home, boy.

1:39:52>> And since we talk about we're going to

1:39:54say that Northern Virginia is different

1:39:57than us.

1:39:58So, we we spent a lot of time talking

1:39:59about Tennessee reasonableness. There's

1:40:02been multiple communities in this state

1:40:05that passed moratoriums

1:40:08and there there has not been any

1:40:11challenges to the extent that we're

1:40:13talking about as it relates to their

1:40:16moratoriums. I'm trying to figure out we

1:40:18the language moratorium concerns people

1:40:20because they they talk about us being

1:40:22sued.

1:40:24We get sued just by sitting in this

1:40:25body. I think myself, Jerry Green, and

1:40:28whoever the chair of the council was at

1:40:29the time, we've all been sued. Just

1:40:31because you're sued doesn't mean it's

1:40:34what we're doing actions of this body is

1:40:35really

1:40:36>> let me address your concern. I mean, I

1:40:38think those moratoriums went into effect

1:40:40before March of 19 uh 2026.

1:40:45What?

1:40:47>> McMinnville passed one. Nashville passed

1:40:50one.

1:40:51These these ordinances went in recently.

1:40:54I mean, these moratoriums

1:40:55>> Yeah, they have they have data centers

1:40:57pending there.

1:40:59Uh

1:40:59but I I mean since they passed the law

1:41:02talking about you can't

1:41:05increase the utility burden. Uh I put it

1:41:09in your packet.

1:41:10>> Cuz I'm trying to see if it's if in

1:41:11terms of the moratoriums that were

1:41:12passed, I'm almost I believe that the

1:41:14moratoriums came into place after that

1:41:16law was passed.

1:41:19So, I

1:41:20uh turn away. We can have this

1:41:21conversation offline cuz I feel like

1:41:23we're we're having the conversation

1:41:25>> Yeah, I mean, I think that's that's a

1:41:26I mean, that's

1:41:28a thing you want to pursue and we can

1:41:30talk about that, but I I think we don't

1:41:32need to confuse the two.

1:41:34>> I don't I don't want to confuse the two,

1:41:35so

1:41:36>> It was May 2026.

1:41:38>> Yeah, some of the more times came in

1:41:39after that.

1:41:41>> I don't know anything about it. I hadn't

1:41:42studied it.

1:41:43>> Okay, so so it matter it matters. It's

1:41:45not hey, whatever. It matters because

1:41:49when we when we

1:41:50Councilwoman White said, and you know, I

1:41:53give her credit when credit is due.

1:41:55Councilwoman White said

1:41:57that we have to take the time to make

1:41:58sure we get this right. If we're going

1:42:00to do working sessions,

1:42:03I don't think we should be so flippant

1:42:05in the way that we navigate this moment

1:42:08in this space.

1:42:10If if it's truly a concern for this body

1:42:12to get it right,

1:42:14we shouldn't just be talking about the

1:42:15laws that govern the invested the the

1:42:17those entities that have vested rights.

1:42:19We should also be talking about the when

1:42:22President McGowan was sitting in the

1:42:23seat, President McGowan said we we had

1:42:25at least 10 other entities that came and

1:42:27talked about

1:42:29um

1:42:29coming to Memphis. That is them coming

1:42:31to Memphis. And we know that number is

1:42:32probably increased by the day.

1:42:35But

1:42:36if we are concerned about the water, the

1:42:38air, energy burden, the noise, the

1:42:40traffic, property values uh decreasing,

1:42:44we I think we have to slow it down so

1:42:47that we can do the studies. Like, you

1:42:48know, Councilwoman Cooper-Suggs

1:42:50mentioned in her comments uh past

1:42:52Tuesday about the fact that she put on

1:42:53her shoes and she said Mr. Redwing saw

1:42:55outside

1:42:57uh dealing with the traffic. Like,

1:42:58traffic is a concern. There's studies

1:43:00that we have to do. And that's within

1:43:02our purview.

1:43:04I'm just I'm I'm done, really. I'm done.

1:43:25So, if you So, everything you

1:43:30So so we're on the same page when it

1:43:32comes to the ability of this body to to

1:43:35to monitor these areas.

1:43:37I guess my plea is not to Attorney Wade,

1:43:40my plea is to this body about the

1:43:42importance of slowing down when it comes

1:43:45to allowing all these entities to come

1:43:48into our community.

1:43:49We keep talking, and you know,

1:43:50Councilwoman Logan has a brief pause in

1:43:52in hers.

1:43:54But, what's to stop, you know, the the

1:43:56communities that have been overly

1:43:57burdened with data centers

1:44:00until unless we have a site plan right

1:44:02away

1:44:03to stop them from going to 38109, to

1:44:05stop them from going to 38116. Those

1:44:07people have legitimate concerns.

1:44:10>> Let me ask

1:44:10>> And the beautiful thing I'm I'm I'm

1:44:11promise I'm almost done. The beautiful

1:44:13thing about

1:44:15in in the midst of all the chaos this

1:44:17past Tuesday, if we pause for a moment

1:44:20and see what can we get out of this? The

1:44:22beautiful thing

1:44:24the people who showed up articulating

1:44:27their concerns rightly or wrongly, but

1:44:29they articulated their concerns, and we

1:44:30listened. And look, it wasn't just

1:44:34people who live in those areas, it was

1:44:36people from all across our community,

1:44:38every single zip code, from every single

1:44:40district saying this concerns them.

1:44:43If we're going to get it right, it

1:44:45shouldn't just be we're only concerned

1:44:46with these these data centers here cuz

1:44:48they're here all they're here and

1:44:49they're operating without respect for

1:44:51our community. We need to be talking

1:44:53about what about the new new data

1:44:56centers that are coming in? Will they be

1:44:57polluting and dragging our community?

1:44:59Would that you know, I'm have the queue.

1:45:00I'm going to go sit back in my hole.

1:45:02>> So, thank you, Councilman. Uh let me ask

1:45:05uh Brett this.

1:45:07Um and Attorney Wade,

1:45:08so tomorrow, if a data center wanted to

1:45:12come to Memphis, could they build and

1:45:14start like the way it did last time and

1:45:16just go right next to a neighborhood?

1:45:21>> If we are pursuing 5987 and we have a

1:45:25a moratorium that says it will prevent

1:45:28that until we adopt it. No.

1:45:30>> Okay.

1:45:32>> No.

1:45:33>> Okay.

1:45:33So, we're pursuing 5987.

1:45:37Which is That's right. Hold on. So, real

1:45:40quick, the question was we still have to

1:45:41vote on it. So, 5987 is what was what

1:45:44was presented to us as going for first

1:45:46reading

1:45:47tonight, right?

1:45:48>> Correct.

1:45:49>> Once first reading, the gavel was banged

1:45:51this afternoon,

1:45:52that can't happen again?

1:45:54>> If we have a moratorium until it is

1:45:57adopted to it, no, it cannot happen.

1:45:59>> Okay. So, and I made a

1:46:02an acclamation. So, I made an

1:46:03acclamation on my my ordinance

1:46:07that's one of the one that's being held

1:46:09to where there's a moratorium till

1:46:10December 31st, 2026.

1:46:13So, we would have to add

1:46:15an amendment to 5987.

1:46:18Okay. That's all I'm just throwing that

1:46:20out there. All right. Okay. Okay. Um

1:46:23Council Well, and that's and thank you.

1:46:26Yeah, that's what we're here to to

1:46:27figure out together. So, anyways.

1:46:31This is good.

1:46:31>> and and I would say

1:46:33if you're going to fight a war,

1:46:35you use all the bullets you got.

1:46:38>> Yeah. Well, and I like

1:46:39>> 5987 is a bullet, okay? And then all

1:46:41these other things, the studies and

1:46:43whatever, they're bullets, too.

1:46:45>> Yeah.

1:46:46>> So, I mean, that's that's all I got.

1:46:48>> Um and it puts a timeline on us to do

1:46:50our work, is what I humbly think. But,

1:46:53am I talking out loud? We have an hour

1:46:55and 5 minutes left. We've got four

1:46:57council members in the queue. We've got

1:46:59Councilman Warren-Carlisle,

1:47:01Councilwoman Walker, then Councilwoman

1:47:03Logan. So, Councilman Warren.

1:47:05>> Thank you, Mr. Chair.

1:47:07So, I just want us to try to remember

1:47:11where we're trying to get to and what

1:47:13we've got. So, what Allen just said, if

1:47:16we're considering legislation,

1:47:18okay, that already has,

1:47:21you know, uh the ability to pause

1:47:24anything coming through

1:47:27then

1:47:28we're we're we're protected. Is that

1:47:29correct, Allen?

1:47:30>> Yes.

1:47:31>> Okay. And right now

1:47:33not only are we considering your

1:47:35legislation but we've got two others

1:47:38that are in there that are on pause now

1:47:40that we've been looking at that have

1:47:42more terms, Councilman Smiley's and

1:47:44Councilman Spinosus. So, we're already

1:47:46protected because we're still

1:47:48considering those legislations. Is that

1:47:50>> Correct.

1:47:51>> Okay. So, no one can come in and put a

1:47:52data center in while we're considering

1:47:55those things.

1:47:56When we do your legislation, let's say

1:47:59we pass that in 2 weeks.

1:48:02Okay?

1:48:03Is there anything more that we can do

1:48:06to actually prevent data centers from

1:48:09coming here legitimately? Councilman

1:48:12Smiley was uh

1:48:14acting or thinking or trying to figure

1:48:17out how we could block data centers cuz

1:48:19that's what this is about. People are

1:48:22scared of AI. They don't want data

1:48:24centers. They don't want the things that

1:48:25come with them.

1:48:27All we can do is

1:48:29regulate where those things go, like the

1:48:31noise and other stuff. And we're looking

1:48:34at trying your puts them in heavy

1:48:36industrial zones.

1:48:38Does yours put them away from the

1:48:39schools?

1:48:40>> We will We will look at the zone.

1:48:43We will look at the zones and put

1:48:46uh them away from residential schools,

1:48:49natural resources, historical areas.

1:48:51Make sure that we have enough setbacks

1:48:55and buffers to make

1:48:56>> So, we So, passing your legislation does

1:48:59that, right?

1:49:00>> Real quick. Just to clarify.

1:49:01It's our legislation.

1:49:05>> Passing the one you brought, the

1:49:06combination legislation.

1:49:08>> Absolutely. Okay, to answer your

1:49:09question

1:49:10if

1:49:11the only way you could keep data centers

1:49:14from coming here is to enact a

1:49:16prohibition, which state law prohibits

1:49:19you from doing.

1:49:20>> So, we do not have

1:49:21>> Absolute prohibition is the only way you

1:49:22can stop them.

1:49:23>> Okay, and we have no legal authority to

1:49:26do that. Is that correct?

1:49:28>> That's correct.

1:49:28>> Okay, so what's going on is our

1:49:31community has been fooled into thinking

1:49:33somehow No, no, AJB.

1:49:37I didn't say your name.

1:49:41I I think I think we're

1:49:42>> had a great We've had a great

1:49:44>> right track. We need to stay on

1:49:46track.

1:49:46>> Yeah, listen. I

1:49:47>> I'll give you Hey, Councilman, I'mma let

1:49:49you I'mma Councilman Wynn, but let's

1:49:50keep other Councilman I mean, come on.

1:49:53We got you. We got you.

1:49:57All right, we'll talk about this when we

1:49:58when we wrap it up. Come on.

1:50:00>> If I misspoke, Councilman Finely, could

1:50:02you tell me how I misspoke, sir?

1:50:04>> No. Okay.

1:50:07And I'm counting on you you too. Yeah.

1:50:09All right, thank you.

1:50:13He's trying to ban data centers.

1:50:15>> I'm not trying to ban data centers. I

1:50:17said I think we need to pause and figure

1:50:19it out. I'm not trying to ban anything.

1:50:21I'm not I'm not I'm not an enemy of

1:50:24growth. What I am is I'm hearing people

1:50:26say a certain thing, and what I want to

1:50:30accomplish is give the pause so we can

1:50:32figure it out.

1:50:34That's all. But, I'm out. Thank you.

1:50:37>> All right, hey, real quick. You're

1:50:39You're You're muted real quick. Hold on,

1:50:40I just want to say this. Councilman

1:50:42Warren, you're I want you to reply to

1:50:44him. I want you to reply to him, and

1:50:45just y'all keep it cool. We're going to

1:50:46keep going after this, okay? Thank you.

1:50:50So, what I was trying to say is part of

1:50:52what you said was our community wants to

1:50:55ban data centers. Okay, I didn't say you

1:50:58said that. I said that's That's That's

1:51:01what's out there is people don't want

1:51:02them. And And okay, so that was the

1:51:05point I was making. And we do not have

1:51:07the ability to do that. And they A lot

1:51:11of people seem to think we do. It's not

1:51:14within our purview. So, if we can't do

1:51:16something legally, okay, and we've got

1:51:19people out there trying to get the

1:51:21community to think we can,

1:51:23that's a bad thing.

1:51:25>> Got you. Thank you.

1:51:25>> Okay, now I'm still

1:51:26Thank you.

1:51:28I'm still going. I mean, Councilman

1:51:30Smiley spoke for 20 minutes and I spoke

1:51:33for 3 minutes so far. I've been

1:51:34interrupted twice.

1:51:35>> we've had direct questions. Thank you.

1:51:37All right, we've got Councilman

1:51:38Carlisle.

1:51:39>> Oh, I'm I'm done.

1:51:41>> Okay.

1:51:42Do you have a question

1:51:44regarding legislation?

1:51:46>> That I was talking to you our attorney

1:51:48about that.

1:51:49>> Okay, go ahead.

1:51:50>> Okay, so and I'll bring it back again.

1:51:53If we're unable to ban data centers,

1:51:56what is the quickest way we can regulate

1:51:58data centers? Is that the pass the

1:52:00ordinance that you brought that combined

1:52:02the legal things we can do as a council?

1:52:06Can you use the mic, sir?

1:52:09Okay, so I want us to hear that because,

1:52:12you know, you know, we're still in the

1:52:14idea that somehow

1:52:16if we do this moratorium,

1:52:19that's going to do something other than

1:52:21this. So, we should just do what will

1:52:24get us there more quickly. Thank you,

1:52:26Mr.

1:52:26>> Very Thank you for explaining that. All

1:52:28right, Council, we've got Councilman

1:52:30Carlisle then we've got Councilwoman

1:52:32Walker and Logan. Carlisle.

1:52:33>> Thank you, Mr. Chairman. Can we step

1:52:35back to vested rights? Uh because I

1:52:37think that's a key point that I want to

1:52:38understand a little bit more. Like I

1:52:40understand at a layman's level when

1:52:42we're going through zoning applications,

1:52:44like if I'm going to change zoning on

1:52:45the underlying

1:52:47rights, like the actual property rights,

1:52:49right? Like I'm getting those rights

1:52:50vested to me. But if I'm buying land

1:52:52that's already zoned industrial,

1:52:54are we

1:52:55Is it still the same vesting rights

1:52:57because I'm going I'm going through the

1:52:58permitting process? Where's the nuance

1:53:00there for me?

1:53:01>> Okay, so

1:53:02>> does that when does it

1:53:02>> Okay, let me break it down for you, bro.

1:53:04>> Yeah. So, what happens

1:53:06if somebody buys property

1:53:10and they start to initiate a data center

1:53:15and there's no process in place for it

1:53:18to be reviewed

1:53:20then

1:53:21they are allowed to go forward the same

1:53:24way Musk did

1:53:26without review.

1:53:29So, if they buy the property when we

1:53:32have a review process in place they may

1:53:35be industrial but they don't have they

1:53:37have to go through the review process

1:53:39that we put in place. That's why it's

1:53:41important for us to put the review

1:53:43process now and then have a moratorium

1:53:46until we do that and then they have to

1:53:49go through you before they're allowed to

1:53:51go forward.

1:53:51>> the trigger in and of itself is the

1:53:53application under the current rights

1:53:55even even other than if it was zoned

1:53:57something else cuz then they'd have to

1:53:58go through that, yeah.

1:53:59>> Yeah.

1:53:59>> All right. So, so this this goes back to

1:54:01the question of like like the the

1:54:03economic environment, right? And the

1:54:04question of like will you apply? I got

1:54:06the question downstairs like would you

1:54:07apply in rush? And and I think the the

1:54:09question is is

1:54:10it depends. Like it goes back to like

1:54:12what the administration

1:54:14will do too, right? Like so, under Mayor

1:54:16Strickland

1:54:17um

1:54:18things were under review for quite some

1:54:20time.

1:54:22I I just don't know that process nuanced

1:54:25enough and what I'm really getting at is

1:54:26is like who would enter the process

1:54:28other than

1:54:29like who would want to enter a process

1:54:31in which you don't know what the ground

1:54:32rules are?

1:54:33Right? Like you're a business and you're

1:54:35going to enter a process in which the

1:54:36rules could change. Now, I know they

1:54:37will if they're vested under today's but

1:54:39like

1:54:40the amount of available real estate in

1:54:42order to do that and the process that

1:54:44would need to go through to vest the

1:54:45rights under the current rules like I

1:54:46guess I'm just trying to process out

1:54:48loud what the probability of that

1:54:50occurring would be.

1:54:53And you pretty much know who all those

1:54:54players are and then my point is is like

1:54:55no one's going to be to apply once we

1:54:57pass this moratorium or if even if there

1:54:59weren't a moratorium because they don't

1:55:00know what the rules of the road are. It

1:55:02could be that they're required to build

1:55:03a greywater facility. It's like that's

1:55:05$60 million 80 or $150 million hit. I

1:55:06guess my point is

1:55:08in any business you want economic

1:55:09certainty at the end of the road. And

1:55:11when that doesn't exist, you're not

1:55:12going to go and put your best foot

1:55:13forward. And I would just say that I'm

1:55:15not saying that to talk cuz I'm doing

1:55:16more talking. I just want that to be a

1:55:17known consideration as you were

1:55:19processing as we go through this, right?

1:55:22So, I I just want to understand that

1:55:23timing. I think that's that's helpful.

1:55:25Thank you. Thank you, Chairman.

1:55:27>> Great question.

1:55:30Attorney Wade, do you got an answer for

1:55:31that one?

1:55:31>> [laughter]

1:55:35>> I mean, it's a

1:55:36it's a wide open country.

1:55:38And there are a lot of other places they

1:55:40can go. So, you know, that's the way

1:55:41that works.

1:55:42>> All right.

1:55:44Great point, Councilwoman Carlisle. I

1:55:45mean, all right, we've got Councilwoman

1:55:47Walker.

1:55:52>> Attorney Wade and anyone who wants to

1:55:54respond, um

1:55:57with everything that we're considering

1:55:58today, which is the best path

1:56:02to

1:56:05renewable energy?

1:56:06Because I know that there are some

1:56:07things that are not

1:56:09>> me let me ask you a question.

1:56:10Uh and I thought I'd mentioned this

1:56:13the other day.

1:56:13>> Okay, can you mention the other day?

1:56:14>> So, one thing,

1:56:16um

1:56:17when these uh data centers

1:56:21if they can't get all of the megawatts

1:56:24that they need from TVA or MLGW,

1:56:28they have the right to bring their own

1:56:31power.

1:56:33And the one thing we can do through the

1:56:36uh conditional use permit

1:56:39is deny them if they bring turbines with

1:56:46gas power.

1:56:48You can prefer

1:56:51green energy.

1:56:53So, that's how you have the ability to

1:56:55leverage where you are.

1:56:58>> And that is that would be that would fit

1:57:01best in

1:57:03yours or whose or or

1:57:05>> That's in mine.

1:57:06>> That can Okay.

1:57:07>> So, that's already in 598.

1:57:09>> Seven.

1:57:09>> Seven.

1:57:10>> Yes.

1:57:10>> Okay.

1:57:11Cuz that was what you

1:57:12>> You're the gatekeeper on what power they

1:57:14bring.

1:57:15And so, you can say, "Look, we're going

1:57:17to prohibit gas-powered turbines."

1:57:21You can say we are we will prefer wind

1:57:24turbines. We'll prefer all of the other

1:57:26green energy

1:57:28They also bring uh the batteries. So,

1:57:31you can also, I mean, regulate those as

1:57:34well, but you have a say in whether you

1:57:37will allow those to happen. Otherwise,

1:57:39they can bring whatever they want, and

1:57:41that's what happened down in too late.

1:57:43>> Okay, and finally, so what I'm thinking

1:57:45in terms of percentages, you know, um or

1:57:48maybe even on a sliding scale by in so

1:57:51many years you're 35% renewable or

1:57:53starting out you need to be at least 20%

1:57:5620% renewable.

1:57:58So, I'm thinking along those lines, but

1:58:01it doesn't necessarily have to be that.

1:58:03>> No, that that's um that's like

1:58:06your authority is to

1:58:08prove or dis- disapprove

1:58:11what they put on the table. You

1:58:12encourage them to do the other. It's

1:58:14like we approve MLGW's

1:58:17contract. We don't have the authority to

1:58:20tell them what's in it. We just have the

1:58:22authority to say, "No."

1:58:24Okay, so when you say, "No," they're

1:58:26going to scramble to try to do what you

1:58:28want. That's the leverage that you have.

1:58:30And then you can start talking about the

1:58:32scales and other things that you want.

1:58:35>> Okay, thank you. And one more thing, um

1:58:37to the media, can you all do a story on

1:58:40renewable energy for data centers? Um

1:58:43there's a lot of things that you all

1:58:44have not been reporting on as it relates

1:58:47to this, and there's tons of

1:58:51information out there. There are many,

1:58:53many data centers across the US that are

1:58:56operating using renewable energy. Some

1:58:59of them 100% as well as internationally.

1:59:03And finally,

1:59:05China has a data center that is

1:59:07completely underwater. Thank you. I

1:59:10yield the floor.

1:59:11>> We've got one more. Thank you,

1:59:12Councilwoman. We've got one more council

1:59:13member in the queue, Councilwoman Logan.

1:59:15And then then we'll

1:59:17wrap it up. Councilwoman Logan.

1:59:23>> Thank you. Um I wanted to say

1:59:26um

1:59:28even though the data centers currently

1:59:31are

1:59:32mostly out south, this is really about

1:59:34this process about the entire city

1:59:36because there are other areas

1:59:40in our city that are vulnerable.

1:59:42So, you know, because it started in the

1:59:45south part of the city,

1:59:47it caused me as a legislator to look at

1:59:50my district, to look at the people that

1:59:53I I answer to and what's important to

1:59:55them as well.

1:59:57And the same things that are important

1:59:58to those that live in your district,

2:00:01Councilwoman Walker, are important to

2:00:04people that live in my district. And so,

2:00:06looking at this holistically is not the

2:00:09south or the north or where. It's the

2:00:11city of Memphis. This came into our

2:00:13city, went directly into a space

2:00:17that because of the zoning and was able

2:00:19to do this by a school, by churches, you

2:00:21know, irregardless of traffic. And and

2:00:24that impacts all of our areas. It could

2:00:26happen anywhere. And my concern was that

2:00:30and and and I think all of our concern,

2:00:33of course those that already impacted

2:00:35are what do we do now?

2:00:37But my concern was how do we protect the

2:00:39rest of the city? And that's why, you

2:00:42know, in talking to Attorney Wade, all

2:00:44of us are concerned, but some of us have

2:00:46slightly different advantage point.

2:00:49We're all concerned about each other,

2:00:51but we want the best for everybody,

2:00:53including ourselves, because we all live

2:00:55here. And so, making certain that we

2:00:56have the protections in place currently

2:00:59to eliminate that or mitigate that from

2:01:02happening anywhere else right now is

2:01:04important to the rest of the city. And

2:01:07then, what do we

2:01:08while we're saying, what do we do what

2:01:10to what's already happened, but I don't

2:01:12want to leave the rest of our city

2:01:14vulnerable knowing that that could

2:01:16happen at any place when we have the

2:01:18power to stop it now

2:01:20and then go back to the UDC upgrade and

2:01:25all of those other things. So, I would

2:01:27like for my colleagues to understand

2:01:29that as well. That's just as important

2:01:31to safeguard the rest of the city as it

2:01:33is for us for all of us to to determine

2:01:36what do we do to help the mess that

2:01:38we're in in that location. And the part

2:01:42that Pearl was mentioning about the the

2:01:44fallen lands, and I think we're all

2:01:46concerned about if they're going to be

2:01:48here, how do we get funds from them

2:01:50that's going to or how do we receive the

2:01:53the the funds that could come from them

2:01:56to help the city the community they're

2:01:58in and all of the community. So, all of

2:02:01this is important to everyone, but

2:02:03colleagues, please remember that we all

2:02:05have a slightly um

2:02:08different or added vantage point as well

2:02:11so or a perspective as well. So, I just

2:02:14wanted to make sure we

2:02:16as a body know that we are a body and

2:02:18when one speaks, they like today at the

2:02:21press conference, it said, "Memphis City

2:02:22Council." It didn't say Carlisle, it

2:02:25didn't say Logan or Espinosa, it said,

2:02:28"Memphis City Council's having a press

2:02:29conference." When it when it went viral,

2:02:32it said, "Memphis City Council." It

2:02:33didn't say, you know, particularly any

2:02:36person, so we move as a body, we vote as

2:02:39a body, and we have to make certain that

2:02:41we're considering it at these matters as

2:02:44from that vantage point. And our

2:02:46constituents are looking at us to be the

2:02:49solid, professional,

2:02:52democratic, um,

2:02:54body that we are. And that's what we all

2:02:57ran for and wanted to be elected for.

2:02:59So, I just want to put that there before

2:03:01we even go downstairs or go have another

2:03:04meeting. We have a responsibility.

2:03:06>> Thank you. All right, so with that,

2:03:09here's the plan. And we're going to have

2:03:10another meeting as a body, uh, hopefully

2:03:13again on Monday, October the 19th.

2:03:17Uh, the agenda is community environment

2:03:19protection, noise, water, air quality,

2:03:21neighborhood infrastructure impacts,

2:03:23MLGW, TVA, health department, Edge, and

2:03:26other relevant industry experts.

2:03:28Thursday, October 22nd, community voices

2:03:30public engagement.

2:03:32Uh, Tuesday, October 27th, community

2:03:35benefits and economic growth. And then

2:03:37address any outstanding items. So, if

2:03:38council members have questions,

2:03:40amendments they want to make, obviously

2:03:42we'll make them today, but that's the

2:03:44agenda. The times on those are 1:00 to

2:03:463:00. We got this done in 2 hours and 12

2:03:48minutes. Um, so we will be downstairs to

2:03:53reconvene and come out of recess for the

2:03:55full council meeting at 4:00 p.m.

2:03:59And Councilwoman Swearingen Washington

2:04:01wants to make a comment.

2:04:05Madam Chair.

2:04:08>> Thank you. Thank you so much.

2:04:10Councilwoman Logan, that was a great

2:04:12segue into, um,

2:04:14a reminder before we go downstairs. We

2:04:17have an expectation for our

2:04:20constituents and community members that

2:04:22are coming into the meetings, but we

2:04:24also have, uh,

2:04:26expectation of our council members and

2:04:28there is a decorum in council members.

2:04:31So, we want to make sure that we're

2:04:32talking one at a time,

2:04:34waiting until we're recognized by the

2:04:36chair,

2:04:37that we're not making personal

2:04:39statements towards each other

2:04:41and just to continue to work as a unit,

2:04:43as one body so that we can get the

2:04:45business of the city done. For your

2:04:48convenience, you have just been provided

2:04:51a reminder of our decorum in council

2:04:54meetings

2:04:55and make sure that we are familiar so

2:04:57that we will be respectful to each

2:04:59other, that we will model excellence

2:05:02and continue to have a high standard,

2:05:04which is the expectation not only of

2:05:07each other, but of what our constituents

2:05:09have of us.

2:05:11Thank you. I yield.

2:05:12>> Thank you, Madam Chair, and thank you

2:05:13everybody for being here today.

2:05:15All right, this meeting's adjourned.

2:05:18>> I turn away.

2:05:19I want to talk to you for a second.