2026-09-29 - City Council

00:00The City Council is the sole legislative body of the City of Framingham and is therefore responsible for passing city ordinances.

00:07The City Council is made up of 11 members who exercise the legislative powers of Framingham.

00:12Two of these members are known as councilors at large and nine members are known as district councilors.

00:16The City Council serves as a link between the citizens of Framingham and their municipal government.

00:21Councilors help constituents by connecting them to resources, services and city departments,

00:25and also serve as advocates for all Framingham residents.

00:29The following City Council coverage is brought to you by the government channel,

00:32a service of the City of Framingham. City Council meeting for September 29, 2026.

01:01We're using version two of our agenda which is posted in the public meeting portal which

01:05can be found on the website and it's published to iLegislate on today, Tuesday, 9/29.

01:11Per our rules, this is the fifth Tuesday of the month which allows the mayor and his administration

01:15to create the agenda for this evening's discussion. There is one piece of business

01:19with the traffic commission that would be considered to make up for an administrative

01:23error that we made in the office in terms of scheduling. So first I'll take a vote in the

01:29minutes of September 3rd. Some move. Second. Okay, all those in favor? I guess do we have

01:35email counselors? Yes. Council along? Yes. Councilman Allen? Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. Over nine three minutes, are you all set with those? Yes. Yes. Okay. I think Branium would.

01:52Okay, I don't see him, where is he? He said yeah, I heard him say yes, that's all Mr. Chair. Yeah, I guess to the

01:58minutes. Okay. Brandon, you're not visible for some reason, so even your blank screen, so

02:04you're gonna have to raise your hand or something if you want to be recognized.

02:08Okay, there's no public participation tonight because there's no one signed up or on the line.

02:16Action item, the only one we have is request of the traffic commission consideration of the

02:20recommended all-way stop control at Garanton Highway Streets and the left turn lane and

02:24Contituent Road at Beacon Street. Mr. Hayes? Good evening, Mr. Chair, Council. Thank you. I'm

02:30Matthew Hayes, Director of Traffic and Transportation for the city. Before you tonight are the two

02:36items passed by the traffic commission at last month's meeting. That includes the all-way stop

02:42at Grant and Howard and the left turn only lane on Contituent Road. Can you describe a little bit

02:50more why and exactly? So the left turn only lane on Contituent Road, that's been an issue for

02:58some time once they put in the left turn lane on Contituent Road east of Beacon Street.

03:08There was no merge lane that was provided to the west of Beacon Street on Contituent Road

03:12and the markings and the availability was for both lanes to move forward

03:19across Beacon Street allowing for no merge so that was that one correction. The all-way stop

03:25on Howard was a program that MassDOT provided. They hired a consultant. They looked at intersections

03:34throughout a number of municipalities and if intersections met certain criteria for crashes

03:40they would be looked at by these consultants. There were I think eight intersections in

03:46Framingham that met the requirements. Three were studied in depth and one was selected

03:54as an all-way stop controlled candidate which was this one. Just out of curiosity can you just say

04:01what the other two that were studied in depth were just so we kind of an idea what you know

04:04was chosen versus what wasn't. Salem End Road at Singletary where we did have that experimental

04:10all-way stop previously. We did look at that more in depth this time and again it still does not

04:16pass muster. The other was Edgel at Belknap. Again the the volumes are just extremely high

04:24for for both those roads as we know. Right Ms. Melch. Thank you. I fully support putting in

04:32the all-way stop at the intersection of Grant and Howard Street. It's a kind of a if you're

04:38coming down Grant to Howard the cars tend to park right up to the sign even though it is

04:44signed that you're not allowed to park like it's clearly signed you can't park there and they

04:50regularly park right up to there so you are kind of pulling out like it's kind of a blind

04:55intersection so very much would support creating a all-way stop there. I don't have a lot of

05:06comments about it but I mean I run through that way a lot so I'm familiar with this being in the

05:11intersection and what you said is right the problem is the car is all parked there you know

05:17block up the intersection so you come out of the grant there is no visibility. I guess it gives me

05:21a little bit of pause that we're going to stop traffic on a relatively busy street such as Howard

05:27to service a street that right there isn't that busy it's just I agree it's pretty dangerous.

05:32So the study did include what would if backups would be caused on the main road

05:38and the level of service will go from an A to a B on Howard which is completely acceptable and

05:46will go from a level of service F on Grant to a level of service B or C so it will certainly

05:55improve the efficiency of that intersection as well as the safety also as part of the all-way

05:59stop we the city will be installing a crosswalk across Howard there's no crosswalk there are no

06:06crosswalks on Howard between Concord and Bishop and there are sidewalks on both sides so that

06:11will be another installation and that will actually further push back the parking locations

06:18to also improve site distance even further. I would just say that you know I don't have a

06:28problem with it like I said but I think that seemed to have everywhere not just framing him

06:35everywhere there's a growing number of these stop signs in some regards they are they are

06:40good in other regards they make traffic you know go a little slower which is good but when they're

06:47caused I'm not saying that I'm not saying the case is here but I think every time you come

06:52here I know you hear this but like enforcement of those parking if we enforce that parking down

06:57there that we would have been able to clear out the intersection a little bit. So we we will be

07:02installing pavement markings which will make it a lot clearer where people are allowed and not

07:06allowed to park as well as signage for parking additional signage if it's not appropriate

07:11currently and again the all-way stop sign it's it's not just for the site visibility there are

07:19warrants now for all-way stop signs and this meets the warrants for crashes as well which

07:26is for angle crashes when in a year or five in 36 months. Okay thank you for that.

07:36Thank you Mr. Chairman. Thank you Mr. Hayes. About the other change that we're voting on I guess

07:42I'm a little puzzled why we're voting on it because it's a change that was made without any

07:46approval from the traffic commission the council any notice to the public I mean maybe it's a good

07:51move but I was asked about it by residents who were used to having it a certain way that was no

07:56just one day the there was repainting done help me understand kind of how it unfolded and

08:05I didn't think that was how the process was supposed to work. So the DPW and the traffic

08:12department have the ability to make changes prior to approval by a traffic commission

08:18or the city or the city council excuse me and this was one that in my mind posed a safety

08:27issue I know it's been there quite a while. You know how long? I believe the center left turn lane

08:34was installed in 2015. It's been a long time. It's been a long time and the traffic signal was

08:40installed in 2010 when the traffic signal was installed there was a single lane in each direction

08:48a single lane approach to that intersection in each direction when the center left turn

08:52lane was installed that second lane heading westbound on a chituit was added with no real thought

09:00of a merge on the west side of Beacon which should have been installed at that time but with

09:06the with the pocket there where the center lane left turn ends people anticipate that being a

09:13left turn pocket and so that's what we needed. So it used to be a double barrel though lane there

09:19it wasn't a single lane. There were it was always two it's a double barrel lane on each side of the

09:24yellow line there. That was from from what I looked from what I saw in aerial photos that was

09:31pre-2006 so it was before that signal was upgraded so the signal was always there too I mean right

09:39the signal was always there yes but it was upgraded in 2010. In 2010 there was a single

09:44lane in all directions and then in 2015 approximately the center line was put in

09:50so I think the double barrel was gone for for quite a while. I remember it too it's been a while.

09:55So I guess what I probably would have hoped to have happened is since it seemed to be

10:00because I looked in the 826 meeting minutes and or background material and hoped to see

10:06that oh there's a there's a really good reason here there's crash data there's something there's

10:11you know it there really was nothing there. So I was puzzled by its appearance on tonight's

10:18meeting which is somewhat unusual considering the tone of tonight's meeting is designed to be

10:22through the dialogue with the mayor this but I had it was on the 826 traffic commission meeting

10:28I emailed DPW on 8/11 saying hey this was done help me understand what did I what did I miss

10:34because the public never had the opportunity to weigh in I think what I and other members of the

10:38public probably would have said was well if we're looking at this intersection what probably would

10:42be best because everybody's been used to being able to advance forward and cross beacon without

10:49real issue but we could probably use some sort of sign about merging which may or may not have

10:54been there but maybe that would have been the thing instead we sort of wake up to a change

10:57and now we're being asked to vote on it but the decision's already been made I guess why

11:02come to the why have a traffic commission if they don't have the opportunity to weigh in

11:05and why haven't come to the council somewhat urgently you know more than a month after a

11:10change has been made without any notice for the public to weigh in uh the traffic commission did

11:16have a chance to weigh in if after you made the change after the lines were painted it was done

11:20so my question let me rephrase the question and I apologize for the interruption why have it go to

11:25the traffic commission for them to weigh in if the only opportunity for them to weigh in is after

11:29we have spent the money on repainting the street again according to the charter the DPW does have

11:36the ability to make changes when the need arises and safety issue is noted the safety issue was

11:43noted the change was made then it was properly brought to the traffic commission and now to

11:48this council I'm not questioning whether or not you have the ability my my concern is really

11:53about the best practice and if it's if the sudden safety concern without any supporting material

12:00illustrating the safety concern after it had been that way for years and years without incident it

12:05appears and without any notice to the public I have a hard time as a member of the public saying

12:11when when local or any level of government says basically we made the change because we're allowed

12:15to make the change we're in charge so we get to do this and that's why we did it I just don't

12:19think that's good practice and it's you know going back to the days of you know although those early

12:24charter commission meetings talking about traffic and transportation this is antithetical to the

12:29whole idea of having the public be able to weigh in on the quality of life issues that make

12:35you know that impact them on the way to to and from school every day it's just it's very

12:40disappointing I I wish this had been undertaken in a way that I think was what we strive to

12:46provide which is access to the public also any insight this is maybe an unfair question but

12:51as I was trying to research this matter I noticed that there are basically no minutes

12:56for the traffic commission um there are a couple here and there but there's there's really no

13:02record there um any insight as to why that is if it's an unfair question that's fair too um I can

13:09give you an opinion um in the charter the the minute taking authority the minute issuing

13:15authority is not the traffic commission we have taken it upon ourselves to issue our own minutes

13:20and issue and approve draft minutes and we do expect several more months to come out

13:27probably at our next meeting okay I understand that's great I appreciate that thank you miss

13:34log uh thank you mr chairman I put my hand down but I I do share your concerns I know that

13:44intersection well um and as someone I haven't driven lightly for obvious reasons but um you

13:54know installing more stop signs everywhere I'm I'm not a big fan of that I am a fan of

13:59public safety I just think I was kind of surprised where's the crash history on that because

14:06I don't know how that's going to help anything but I was surprised that the single terry

14:10salem end road didn't rise to a higher level than that intersection in my opinion so I mean but I

14:19share your same concerns that you voiced I kind of question this so that's all I have if I may

14:27the the single terry salem end road it did rise to the um the the warrants uh for crashes and

14:35for site visibility uh it's just that the for the all-way stop was not an appropriate measure to

14:43to correct that issue because of the volumes I guess I don't know I just like I said I work in

14:51newton and they have the four-way stops everywhere and I think personally it actually creates more

14:57problems than it solves but that's just my opinion on those type of stops and those type

15:01of intersections so um as a motorist it makes it more complicated to be stopping every five feet

15:11basically because in newton there's four-way stops everywhere so I just hope we're not going to

15:17institute that practice all over framing him because I don't think it's the greatest practice

15:23I think you know to the point of uh people illegally parking that's more of a problem

15:30probably but I don't know anyway I just share Councillor King's opinion on this

15:37so those are my comments anybody else no thank you Mr. Chair um um one question that I have um

15:52could you do the stand back first like um doing the parking arrangements on howard street

16:01as just as proposed um but doing it in the opposite direction doing all that first and seeing

16:11what kind of reaction um you know the motorists have um and seeing if that cuts down the

16:19accidents at that intersection do you know what I'm talking about um I think I do um so yeah put

16:26in try to control the parking issue and the site visibility before installing always stop sign

16:35correct um again it's um it is a possibility um if this council decides that you don't want to

16:50move forward with the always stop sign we can certainly look at the possibility of making that

16:55change well it's not that we don't want to do it but I think that it probably deserves another look

17:01after you've done the uh preparation I guess you want to call it so that that's what I would I mean

17:10I think it's a good idea I hadn't thought of that but I was kind of thinking of it but didn't

17:15articulate it like that when you said you were going to do that because you're going to do it

17:19anyway yeah I mean I'm not opposed to it like I said but if we could see like that first and

17:24see what happens to have you come back that might make some sense yeah you need a motion on that

17:31George Mr Mr Alexander made the motion seconded by Mr. Cannon okay just to not approve to stop

17:38sign at this point but try the traffic markings first for the discussion I'll just say that I

17:46I think we should put the stop signs in at that intersection I think it's a dangerous intersection

17:51as sort of um determined by the state in their assessment of all these eight intersections

17:59um I concur that it's an issue and I don't think that asking the police to do it more

18:07enforcement on parking there is going to solve the problem it like it periodically comes up they do

18:15enforcement and then a couple weeks later like it's back to the same thing we're talking about

18:19remarking it too like they're going to do so it's not just enforcement I agree with you on

18:23the enforcement but he's going to remark the intersection so people clear we're not to park

18:28and therefore open up a little bit I mean there's a sign there I I don't I'm not convinced that

18:35that's going to be you know um I don't think that remarking is going to make a substantive

18:41difference to people's parking habits there we're missing something who's winning we gain

18:53festivity okay so if if I may Mr. Chair um if we are putting the crosswalk in across Howard

19:06Street I wouldn't want that to see that it may require a RRFB the rapid flashing beacons based

19:17on the I don't know if this is the case whether it would require that and that would be a much

19:25higher cost than markings and and the stop signs that are being provided by the city by the state

19:31that was that's my only thing and I think it would be it would be a safer installation for

19:35pedestrians certainly or okay so the motion on the grand street stop oh Tracy I'm sorry

19:45I didn't see you got the I'm you though we're going to hear you thank you sorry um I'm always

19:56talking in my head so I forgot I was muted um so um my thing is my question is this or um first

20:05my comment is that it I'm surprised that uh the counselors that were talking about data so much

20:12because when it was the reorg it was trust our people trust the people to do the work that our

20:18employees to do the work so um you know and now we are we definitely want data which I like the

20:24data and stuff but what's good for the goose it's good for the gander I think it should go it

20:28should have gone that way like not let's just try it and see so with this the Howard and Grant um

20:36intersection right it's so tiny okay it's so tiny um and um well I definitely believe that you need

20:45um to get the sight lines better I think that would be provide the best the most safety

20:51first of all to start with that you're going to take back like um where people park right at

20:57the corners and you know over and to jump out and go do what they're going to do cross over to the

21:03mechanic shops or the other the you know whatever they're doing um and that is very dangerous

21:09because people have to pull out too far just to find out or guess whether a car is coming so um

21:16thank you for um I I assume you're going to um not allow people to park in that first space

21:23all the way like beyond the corner and whatnot but the four-way stop sign the only thing about

21:30it is it's almost it feels like it can't even fit there well right four-way in that place

21:36but like um a lot of times like with clock street and grant and you have a much wider space right

21:44it's good to have it but a lot of times people misread like or or choose to who whose turn is

21:52it to go next you know like that who's turn so some people want to ignore it so um but it does

21:59make people pause for a minute most people um but visually I don't where okay so you're

22:07going to have a stop sign at the end of grant like it you know um and then where's the one

22:16on howard street going to be placed so in the diagram that's on the um on the tv right now

22:26um the stop lines are in line with the curb line or the back of sidewalk for grant street

22:33yeah I just think there um I don't know if I think the stop sign at grant street people

22:44have to wait anyway I don't know people are zooming on howard street to get to that light

22:50going toward bishop you know um anyway and I you know you can try it um I don't think

23:02it's gonna go smoothly at all um I think this I think you're gonna get a lot of people still

23:07going like oh I have the right of way we have the right way you know this kind of thing during

23:12rush hour and that kind of thing I think it will help um you know at the grant street but people

23:18have to stop there anyway so they do stop there you can't just pull out of there it's more the

23:24people coming when you're coming down howard um I guess slowing them down and making them stop

23:30I don't know that they will um and obviously the parking that's good smock needs some parking but

23:36again not to block the corner intersections the sight lines so um the part the part the policy of

23:46you know you guys can do it okay but at the same time um like you say we're gonna it comes to us

23:55but it's already a done deal Tracy we appreciate we can't hear you very well at all anymore because

24:01I don't know if it's a problem here I think it might be okay well anyway um you know I will support

24:08but I don't know your back maybe it was on your end okay I you know but um like you know I am

24:19concerned about too many stop signs but there does need to be something I'm not sure the four way

24:26is going to be great there um okay but I guess you can start with that try it well the motion

24:36for now is not to do that the motion is to hold off for now on the stop sign and try the pavement

24:41markings first and then come back to discuss the stop sign there's going to be further

24:44discussion on that motion seeing none I will go to my list mr stephanini no sorry uh miss bryant

24:54I didn't hear did mr stephanini go yes I voted no okay um uh wait a minute so um to try pavement

25:05markings is that correct correct and was this the idea of Mr. Hayes or Mr. Alexander's motion

25:13Tracy um I mean I did hear make a motion but I wanted to know how so we're in the middle of a

25:20vote so I'm going to say no thank you myself yes Miss Liam Bruno yes Miss Long yes Mr. Ward

25:29no Miss Feeney no Mr. Cannon yes delexander yes Mr. Aliviani Miss Malek no six in favor

25:38five opposed it passes um is there a motion on the uh Kachisha Road second any further

25:46discussion on that uh with Miss Bryant um uh no okay myself yes Miss Liam Bruno yes Miss Long

25:58yes Mr. Ward this is to approve the recommendation yes yes yes Miss Feeney yes Mr. Cannon no

26:08Mr. Alexander yes Mr. Aliviani yes Miss Malek yes Mr. Stephanie yes um not in favor to oppose

26:17it's approved thank you appreciate your time tonight thank you for coming in tonight okay

26:26next is the um appointments referrals the appointment subcommittee uh number six

26:33SIFOC that's in error on there those that is not uh the mayor's appointments the SIFOC do not require

26:40council approval so that will be deleted uh unless there's any discussion I'll refer numbers

26:46three four five seven eight nine and ten to the uh appointment subcommittee yes uh can you

26:55can we take ten separately yes so therefore I'll replace I'll take three four five seven eight and

27:02nine for I'm sorry Mr. Chairman I apologize can you take five and ten separately yes I'll take

27:08three four seven eight nine three for the appointment subcommittee okay so next is number

27:15five Mr. Cannon just um Mr. I I don't know I'm sure I've met these folks in fact I was on the

27:22old finance committee with one of them I'm sure I have no objection but I was hoping the mayor

27:26could give some insight and perspective we've had a lot of discussion on uh this is for the

27:30keep tech school committee particularly on the the financing that's to come the price tag that

27:36will inevitably come have you had the opportunity to speak with these candidates and um what insight

27:42can you share that at least makes me feel better as a financial nudge uh in the community about um

27:49making sure that we have a voice that outsizes our power on the keep tech school committee as

27:54these decisions are made the answer is yes I did meet with the uh candidates for reappointment

28:01all candidates by the way I don't know what's going to make you happy I'm not going to even

28:06try to uh opine on that but we did meet with them we explained to them how important it is for them

28:15to pay attention to what's going on at the board meetings and how the impact's going to be on on

28:21the finances in the city of Framingham when that project moves ahead and um they indicated that

28:29they are very much aware of what's going on they're paying attention to it um they're the

28:35opinion that the school needs to be rebuilt or reconstructed um and I after discussing it with

28:43them I saw no reason why we shouldn't reappoint them and so I submit their names for reappointment

28:48I'll certainly move that we refer those to the finance committee where I'm sure the discussion

28:53will continue and I'm I'm sure we'll be on the same page there you mean the appointments

28:57what did I say finance I apologize yes thank you the the appointments yes thank you the

29:03appointment subcommittee second um it is probably also time concurrent with this to revisit the

29:09agreement that we have with the regional school district um I don't know that it would have a

29:16material impact um but I don't think we've done that since we've been a city and our voice on

29:22the committee even though we have most of the enrollment and by far most of the financial

29:26responsibility um we get out voted on everything um just by design of the agreement so I don't

29:35know if that's on your radar but it's probably time that we lean on the state a bit to to

29:40re-examine that so I think that there may be we don't usually do this and I don't think we should

29:47do it regularly I fully support the way we've done it overall but in this instance I think

29:53given the impact of the financial impact potential in the city and my issue is not

30:00so much the need for the new school I just don't know enough about that but I'm certainly willing

30:05to take that at face value for now my concern is there was just so little there's so little

30:11for lack of a better term cooperation like we simply asked them how to finance

30:17their feasibility study they wouldn't even do that to me that is bothersome in all in all

30:24fairness and for full disclosure the mayor was kind enough knowing my feelings about this to

30:31allow me to talk to some of these people too as part of the reappointment process

30:35I think we should have them in at our meeting when we appoint them even with the recommendation

30:41of the uh which I assume they'll get of the appointment subcommittee so I don't know

30:48you want a motion or that agreeable to you or your committee yeah I mean if that's um I think

30:54that would be it's come up um I know that this has come up and I do think that is the you know

31:02back even when you were on the appointment subcommittee because we knew this was coming

31:05with the school and I think that um I did speak with some of them as well um you know in the

31:12past and reiterated as well the importance um and I know that this board is you know we're the ones

31:20on the hook for you know the school um but the majority I should say so I'd be fine with that

31:28one motion for that Mr. Chairman so moved second all right so the motion let's incorporate one

31:34motion to our limit the voting here so the motion would be to have them come in and to refer them

31:39to the appointment subcommittee absolutely yes okay thank you Ms. Bryant um is the point of

31:45having them coming I'm a little concerned um because like you said it hasn't really been

31:50done with others um I'm in favor of being able to ask them questions but it it does seem like or

31:58it could be missed it could be construed that um we want them to come in so that we can determine

32:06whether um they they will be um like voting considering like in in in accord with what um

32:17the council would want them to and I don't think that that is um enough freedom I think

32:24that's a little bit too much um like your your nomination or your approval will of your

32:30nomination will rest on whether we think you agree with us or not I just think that we need

32:37to be careful about that well speaking for myself I just think it's a valuable conversation to have

32:42like we've had with other boards or major issues before those boards and the vote has already been

32:48taken so I mean it's that's really at least to pass votes I don't know how the future votes are

32:53going to go but you know I think that's what that's that's why we would do it I think is to

33:00have the important discussion people that were appointing that's just my opinion okay there's

33:08a motion on the table um to refer to appointment subcommittee have them come to the meeting they're

33:13appointed to that start with me myself yes Miss Lebrough yes Miss Long yes Mr. Ward yes Miss Feeney

33:23yes Mr. Cannon yes Delexandra yes Darvianni yes Miss Malik yes Mr. Estebanian and Miss Bryant

33:33yes okay okay and you also asked for number 10 Mr. Cannon uh yes Mr. Chairman this is the

33:42this is mostly just a courtesy uh to the mayor so he can announce which just so it doesn't go by

33:48in passing and then I may have a couple of questions okay uh you're that's fine that's

33:52good point new division head Mr. Mayor okay so Mr. Mayor your time it's agenda are we transitioning

34:02to my agenda okay all right okay good thank you as you know um this is one of those special

34:11Tuesdays uh that only happens a few times a year when there's a fifth Tuesday and rather than have

34:17a regular council meeting uh you've decided to devote that fifth Tuesday to the mayor uh for

34:24whatever the mayor wants to discuss and I've decided to uh try to give you an update to as

34:32many projects as we have time to discuss tonight I've got staff members here to supplement what

34:39I'm going to be adding to the discussion and be happy to answer any questions you might have

34:45and as you can see from the agenda the first one is discussion of a new director for DPW

34:53as you know uh Bob Lewis a long-time DPW director retired the end of June uh I appointed Mike

35:02Tesino the COO to be acting our interim DPW director during the period when we were looking

35:09for a new DPW director um and the day that Mike Tesino left the employment of the city

35:16I appointed um Steve Leone who was ahead of the water and sewer division to be interim director

35:23of DPW and have all the responsibilities required to be that person uh and as we continue to

35:32advertise and interview candidates for the role um and as a result of the

35:40process of looking for a candidate we um settled on Eric Johnson who has been a long-term

35:48employee of the department of public works most recently as the city engineer he's got over 20

35:54years of of experience working for a Framingham DPW he hasn't probably has more institutional

36:01knowledge about the city than anyone else working for the city and uh after interviewing him and

36:08discussing with him I was convinced that he was the best candidate and as a result um I've offered

36:17him the job he's accepted it subject to approval by the city council uh it's on your agenda tonight

36:24for a referral to the appointment subcommittee appointment subcommittee is meeting I believe

36:30October 1st um it'll be available for questioning then and then assuming that the appointment

36:37subcommittee votes favorably on Eric he'll be on the agenda for your appointment on October 6th

36:44and if he's successful he will become the permanent DPW director the next day uh he's

36:53agreed to that arrangement and at that point Mr. Leone will set step down as the interim DPW director

37:01Nick um I don't know how would you like to handle it I'm sorry what was the

37:11questions on each item or would you like to whatever do whatever you want or meeting how would you like to do it well

37:16I just would prefer to just continue on otherwise we're going to be here for three nights we're going

37:22to be here for three nights you won't want to wait for questions yeah okay so Mr. Chairman

37:28we have individual agenda items here I would suggest we process each agenda item that's what

37:36the rules and agenda is it's two segments but I mean there are two segments but I agree I think that's a little bit if we go to the end okay I get you're right okay so we're going to talk about the DPW director go ahead

37:49just briefly I think it might have been just an oversight there was no um real background material

37:55other than four sentences um in that appointment so there was no resume there was no if you've

38:02offered the job and he's accepted there's no compensation I it's why I suspect it's an

38:07oversight do you want to hold off until our next meeting to formally refer that with all the

38:11information that I'm sure you intended to include all that information has been submitted or will

38:15be submitted to the appointment subcommittee just like everybody else right but you're asking for

38:20the subcommittee you're asking for the referral tonight and the public who by the way never knew

38:24nor did the council that you appointed an interim DPW following an interim DPW director

38:30following the departure of the chief operating officer but you know that was never disclosed

38:36to the council it was never publicly disclosed to the public I had heard through the grapevine

38:42that Mr. Leone who I think did a great job and does a great job for the city was the acting director

38:47but it was sort of mentioned in happenstance after I asked you in this meeting and you said well

38:52we'll talk about that on the 29th you could have said well I've appointed this person you didn't

38:56so there there's a pattern now of not sharing things with the public that I'm concerned about

39:01so I'm giving you the benefit of the doubt that it was an oversight that you're not sharing with

39:05the council tonight what the offered compensation was for this job I suspect it's not the same as

39:12what the previous DPW director earned because the previous DPW director spent I think I don't know

39:17two or three decades running a public works department I can't say for sure if Mr. Johnson's

39:22experience is consistent with that because there's no background material other than

39:26four sentences most of which talk about volunteer experience in a different community

39:31and him being an invaluable asset to the city which I agree with but it's not good process

39:35and it's not good process through the lens of oh wait a minute he didn't even tell us that you

39:40appointed an interim director which I don't want another answer like well it's in the

39:46charter that we're allowed to do this so we did it it's just not good practice and it's not a

39:50level of transparency that I've gotten used to having from you so why did you decide not to

39:57share that with the public or the council mr. mayor well I was just following regular

40:05procedures when anybody that has to be approved by the city council we go through the appointment

40:11subcommittee submit all the information there the person is interviewed and then all that

40:16information is transmitted to the full council when the full council votes on it no mr. mayor

40:21what I'm asking why you kept it from the city council is why didn't you keep anything from

40:25the city council mr. mayor you appointed an interim director of a massive department within

40:32the city Steve Leone's resume no that's not no I just want to know that you made a decision

40:38I asked you in the last meeting what's the status on or two meetings ago what's the status of

40:43is there an interest the co-op had left you said I'll talk about that on the 29th I just don't

40:49understand why you decided instead it was transparent to the public and the council

40:53to appoint somebody in secret and not tell anybody about it at the very least it was

40:57embarrassing to me as someone that's worked with this gentleman for years that I didn't

41:01get to say congratulations and thank you for stepping up until it was sort of it had been

41:07asked a number of times in public and you hadn't answered that's the question I'm asking why did

41:11you not share the interim appointment with the council or the public what's been an oversight

41:19but let me just add to that issue because as a result of the confusion over that and the fact

41:27that it wasn't publicly announced at the time it happened I've had conversations with the HR

41:33director and from this point forward as a matter of fact she's already done this the other day

41:42every couple of weeks when she on boards new employees she's going to be sending out an email

41:47blast to everybody with a list of all new employees in their positions whether or not

41:55they require approval by the city council or not and we're hoping that provides a lot more

42:02transparency in the future for new hires I think that's great and that was a practice that we had

42:07had for a period of time it seemed to go away for a while I'm glad that you're returning to it

42:12like so if it was an oversight to provide Mr. Johnson's resume you didn't answer my question

42:20about compensation I would just feel better you know when there's a track record of consistency

42:25and transparency it's a lot easier to say okay it's an oversight we'll move forward but when

42:30there's a demonstrable pattern of not doing that it makes it far more uncomfortable to do that I

42:35don't want to nitpick all you know there are ZBA appointments we didn't nitpick I mean there are

42:39a lot of questions that we're probably not asking that we should but when you and I have this

42:44conversation in a public meeting and I ask about well what's going on with the COO what's going on

42:48with the DPW director and you say I'll get to that knowing full well that you had already

42:53appointed somebody it's unfair to the employee who's put in charge of this massive department

42:57but no one's I just I really question the judgment so I'll let the I'll leave my comments there but

43:04will we when will we have the compensation answer maybe you can share that now and the

43:09resume Mr. Chairman no Miss Bryant and Miss Logger next do you have anything else on that

43:15Miss Bryant okay thank you you're not going to tell the council what we're paying him

43:21do we need to know that probably I'll come back but I thought he was going to answer my question

43:25all right I don't think he should have to answer that taxpayer money all right all right all right

43:30this is Miss Bryant please okay so first of all I want to say mayor I could see why if you

43:38want to call it an oversight I I don't necessarily call it an oversight but I I I applaud you this is

43:45the smoothest transition it speaks very well of DPW and your process that we that we had

43:53this in place because they worked so well for so long and such a commitment from some of your top

43:59people in DPW that stayed and labored and and gave extra time and whatnot and a great role model

44:07for many people who had to overcome you know prejudices and things but they were so committed

44:15to their job now in terms of I don't feel like it was a secret you said you would you know you

44:22would give us the details on a 29th and you did and I think it's difficult I applaud you for

44:30getting the the piece with HR in place because you know to give more transparency which shows

44:37that you are trying to meet the request and comfort level of so many people the public and

44:46counselors and all that but at the same time I am more satisfied that you put the first priority

44:56on getting things in place okay and and then notifying and also the interim person probably

45:04really appreciated being able to get acclimated and just do the interim job you needed to do

45:12without a lot of added burden of having to respond to millions of people though he appreciates

45:21everyone while I do appreciate the detail that Councillor Cannon you know asked for and looks

45:28for again it it's very it's just the opposite of what we were asked to do with the re-org

45:37then the cry was oh let them do it let's just trust you know and this kind of thing but you

45:42really did I just think it it's a seamless transition and Bob would agree with that Bob

45:50Lewis would agree with that if he had been asked to make an appointment I believe he would have

45:54made the same appointment in his place and I think the DPW can remain rock solid it is a department

46:01that works super super well together and is very responsive to the public as well even though

46:08they've labored with less than a full crew for you know what is it coming up to like five years a

46:15decade I don't know but obviously your background mayor helped with that too but I and many other

46:23people feel like okay they kept things going they got it done we're not going to have a big upheaval

46:31and we have faith and trust in it and it just seems like things are working well and then you

46:36added this transparency piece to go forward to so kudos and we are excited and trusting DPW

46:47and this work and I'm happy of that I tend to be suspicious I ask a lot of questions you know that

46:53um and uh but I'm happy to not have to this time so thank you as long thank you Mr. Chairman first

47:04of all I want to make a correction to a previous speaker's comment Mr. Lewis was not a DPW director

47:11anywhere previously he did service an assistant deputy director uh assistant director elsewhere

47:18but he never was a DBW director if that's the criteria you think that we need to uh fulfill

47:27then we haven't done that ever no I just misspoke thank you for the correction okay

47:31I'm just correcting you because our no you're right I meant to say assistant thank you I apologize

47:36all right so I'm not done okay so excuse me I just asked that whether you were commenting

47:44otherwise they're just correcting them no I am so go ahead I just find this problematic because

47:50this is why no one wants to come to framing him if again have a Spanish Inquisition you know and

47:56I feel like I don't know why this particular position is being axed out or you know called out

48:04instead of any other positions that we've had this has been the the uh way we have processed

48:10appointments it goes to the appointment subcommittee all that information is disseminated to them then

48:15we bring it back to the council and granted yes it's a division head but Eric Johnson has been

48:22with this community 21 years I've worked with him closely as a chair of public works way back

48:28for 10 out of 11 years when we had town meeting I worked with him for the 12 and a half years I

48:33was on the planning board on the ZB I mean Eric has been de facto in fact acting as a

48:41as the director DPW in the absence of a DPW director and Billy Sedowitz who used to be the

48:48deputy director who is in water so we have many capable people that are long time employees in

48:55the public works department that work well and I just find that this type of dialogue publicly

49:03does not help anybody want to take a position in framing him and I think that the mayor has made

49:10a good choice I vouch for that a million percent all day long if you need something done Mr.

49:18Johnson has always been there at Don O'Keea what his capacity is he will help you with DPW

49:25water sewer whether it's rubbish trash collection water and sewer anything to do with DPW you can

49:33call Mr. Johnson and he'll respond to it and get it done so I can't think of one other person

49:40in that department especially with a shortage of employees in that department it's been downsizing

49:46cut down to almost a skeleton crew that has worked harder and has kept that department together

49:53and I'm just kind of appalled that you know the narrative in the public realm to disparage an

50:04employee that's what it sounds like and you know I apologize if that's if I'm wrong in that

50:09thinking but I think this is just out of line that's my opinion and again he's more than

50:16qualified I believe he's an MIT graduate I mean I can go through his whole resume for you because

50:21I work with him for so long but you know he's highly qualified as a civil engineer Mr. Stephanie

50:28thank you Mr. Chairman I would agree with Ms. Long thank the mayor for bringing this name forward

50:32and move that we refer this matter to the appointment subcommittee second so I just have

50:38one thing to say I think we're in a little bit of dangerous territory here because the city council

50:45does have an approval and oversight role in appointments so when when the name is brought

50:51forward be it this particular name or this particular job in this particular department

50:56because it is you know I don't think it's it's fair to say that no one should ask any questions

51:02about especially basic questions about compensation and resume those are fair questions for anybody

51:08taking it's not disparaging a public employee it's people know that that's the process in

51:14Framingham if you're going to become a division head and it doesn't mean because your name is

51:18put forward and someone asks a question as to how much you're being paid of what your resume

51:21is I mean I think in the past we've always got the resumes and I'm sure we'll get it this time

51:26but so I just think you know and one of the problems I think with hiring internal candidates

51:32is that if we know if you know them you like them you might hear questions like that it's

51:37disparaging when they're not so you know it's it's never an easy thing but let's not forget

51:43and the same thing you know miss Bryant you said twice now that we didn't do with reorganization

51:47we're doing it now in both these instances these are our charter roles our role is to vote

51:54on stop signs so therefore the ask for data about the stop sign makes sense because we're

51:59the decision maker we're not the decision maker in the other areas that you were talking about

52:03in the same here we're not really the decision maker the mayor's the decision maker

52:07but with the I don't even want to say approval authority but for a division head except in the

52:11fourth year of a term of the mayor not to be appointed requires a two-thirds vote of us

52:16against the appointment so I don't think we're really to this but we have a role in the process

52:21so I think this is a policy and process point of view for this council I'd like to uh let's

52:27let I don't want to get think that asking questions is is necessarily uh wrong okay so I'll take the

52:34vote starting with miss Liam Bruno does referral to the subcommittee yes as long yes Mr. Warden

52:45yes miss miss Feeney yes Mr. Cannon yes Mr. Alexander yes Miss Malek yes Mr. Stephanie

52:52Miss Bryant yes myself yes okay Mr. Mayor next 12 the um I want to give you an update on the

53:03the blue ribbon committee for the community pool we have reached out to all the different

53:12committees and commissions and everybody else that's supposed to provide a member for the

53:20committee we've got responses from all but four committees we're still waiting for four committees

53:27to submit their names and then once that's completed I will finish putting like together

53:35the list of the membership I will inform the council who's been selected and we'll start our

53:43first meeting and get this thing on the road just for your information the four committees that

53:49we're still waiting to hear from as a council on aging the disability commission the Framingham

53:55State University Board of Trustees and our legislative delegation next is the an update

54:03I'm sorry I don't have the name in front of me but Framingham State has submitted a name

54:11I'll forward it along to you okay thank you and thank you for doing that all I just want to say

54:18is thank you so much I've reached I've talked to those folks too and I'm glad to know that

54:22our lists are the same of who hasn't done an appointment yet and it's very exciting so thank

54:26you so much for for doing that date on the community senate project I'll look in his hands

54:34up oh sorry has there been any thought given to um thank you Mr. Chairman thank you Mr. Mayor

54:39on the funding mechanism are we putting money aside for this have we done any back of the

54:44envelope calculations and what we think a project like that is going to cost I asked as

54:49I know there's some big dollars spent on some other real property projects anything you can

54:54share with us on the pool issue with related relative to finances a couple years ago uh

55:02Saki and I reached out to the people who built the um facility on and route nine in Wellesley

55:09there's a couple of hockey rings there in a big big pool and we talked to them see if they might

55:15be interested in doing a public private partnership with the city and they crunched a bunch of numbers

55:21and um cost of a pool is very very expensive especially if it's an indoor pool with all the

55:27facilities you need and we're looking at well over 20 25 million dollars to just for the

55:34construction of it which doesn't even address the operation of it and um we've learned we learned

55:40from them that they're not necessarily money makers either for you to charge uh use fees

55:48and everything so it's a it's a big uh a big ticket item we do not have a source of funding

55:55for the building um we're going to go ahead and have the committee and see what the committee

56:00comes up with um I think the best way to do this is through a public private partnership and I'm

56:07hoping that some of the people on this committee may know people that would be willing to talk

56:14about a public private partnership so um you know we're wide open as to ideas and how we go ahead

56:22and do this um I'll tell you one thing I don't think I'm ready to recommend that the city floats

56:28a bond to build that building at this point in time we have too many other more uh higher

56:33priorities that we have to worry about but willing to spend the time with the committee

56:38and see what we come up with all right I appreciate that and I think there's consensus

56:42here that we all agree I mean you hear the stories that we've all heard from students

56:45that you know they're spending all this time in the bus in the morning to get to and from school

56:48and then they're spending all this time you know on these activities that are trying to get them

56:53you know the college credit and the credit on their applications and all of that so I'm glad

56:57I'm glad the administration is working to address that thank you Mr. Mayor thank you Mr. Chairman

57:01anything else in the pool miss Bryant um thank you Councilor Cannon um I was wondering those

57:11things too so um and Mayor I thank you for it's stating that it is very expensive and it is not

57:19really a money making proposition excuse me so um do we have any idea of like how that will fold

57:28into the budget and um and so is this is it possible that we may um not go forward with this

57:37for a while or are we going like you know full speed ahead and what's the timeline if we have

57:42any timeline yet excuse me no this we're starting with that with a fresh piece of paper um and see

57:53where it takes us I as I said I'm not prepared to recommend that the city um float bonds to

58:02build a new pool unless we have a very good uh participation from other people or in the

58:08private sector um we don't even have a site I mean that's another problem we've got to find

58:16a site if we want to build a pool so there's a lot of a lot of unanswered questions but I think

58:23it's worthwhile for this committee to begin that conversation and at least flush out what the

58:29issues are that we would have to resolve if we want to go ahead it's in someday in the future

58:35and build a pool so I think it'll be very useful for the information that this committee develops

58:41and maybe we'll be lucky enough that they come up with a solution we can actually build a pool

58:46for the community okay thank you next committee center the next item on the agenda is an update

58:54on the community center project as you know we and I'm going to ask in a minute I'm going to ask

59:02me and Todd to come to the microphone and discuss some of the details of it but as you know we've

59:10spent a substantial amount of federal aid that we've received from our congressional delegation

59:19to actually purchase the property and begin the renovations of the building and we've

59:27I established an advisor mayor's advisory committee number of years ago and people were

59:32working on that and they produced some very useful information but we got to the point where

59:40the money was slowing down uh we weren't able to complete what we wanted to complete it on

59:47the building I did not want to ask the city to flow bonds to complete the reconstruction

59:56of that building for community center because I

1:00:00I felt that there were, and I still feel that there's other more important priorities that we need to save our bonding authorization for.

1:00:09So what we've done is asked the committee to take a hiatus and step back for the time being on working on this project while we continue to search for funds.

1:00:24And Megan is going to talk about what we've done so far and what the future looks like for funding to continue this project.

1:00:34So, Megan?

1:00:36Sure. Thank you, Mayor. Thank you, councilors.

1:00:38Just an update on the numbers from a sort of 30,000 feet perspective where we are right now.

1:00:46We have spent approximately 12 million of our ARPA funding that was obligated for the community center.

1:00:54As the mayor mentioned, those funds were utilized in the purchase of the property, demolition of the convent building and also internal demolition of the community center itself where it was necessary.

1:01:07Also, asbestos abatement and some initial conceptual design with our architect who is under contract.

1:01:17And I'm currently working, we have a $3.15 million appropriation from Congress, a federal appropriation that I'm working on obligating right now.

1:01:30We have some hoops to jump through, just a normal federal hoops to jump through on that piece, so it will probably be a few months before it's obligated.

1:01:39We need to do an environmental review of the property that I'm working with Jim Paolini on.

1:01:44So we'll get that approved and get the money to where we can expend it.

1:01:48And it is specifically for upgrades and updates around physical accessibility for the building to prepare it for use.

1:01:56So that's where we currently are and we are hopeful for future federal funds as well and keeping an eye out for what's on the horizon.

1:02:06Nothing specific to report at this time, but working on it.

1:02:11So happy to answer any questions.

1:02:15Thank you, Mr. Chair.

1:02:18When do we decide that maybe this isn't feasible?

1:02:22You know, I mean, I was a big proponent for it, you know, I went to high school, I was on the board when we closed it, but it's staggering the cost.

1:02:29And now we're at a hiatus.

1:02:31We've got a building that's got windows, some doors and some different things.

1:02:36But how do we decide if the asset shouldn't be an asset any longer, we should sell it off and do something else with the money?

1:02:43Can we do that because we used opera money?

1:02:46That'd be the next question.

1:02:47That's not in the wheelhouse yet.

1:02:49That's a good question.

1:02:50We would have to do some research on that to see if you wanted to get rid of the asset, what we could do with it based on the fact that we used the opera money to buy it.

1:03:04But in terms of when you make that decision or if you want to make it, you can make that decision anytime.

1:03:12But the question is, what would you do with it if we didn't mothball it until we're ready to use it?

1:03:21No, I get it. But I originally was of the thought that I thought the dispatch center should go there.

1:03:27And I know some people thought it should go there. Some people didn't think it should go there.

1:03:30When I go by 188 Conker Street, I get Adjutant, okay?

1:03:33I look at it all apart.

1:03:35I remember the day the building was built.

1:03:37I was there.

1:03:38I just, you know, zoning, I know it's not on the report right now, but that building's four stories.

1:03:45Why don't we take advantage of our zoning and go up two more stories?

1:03:47We're in this building.

1:03:48We're grand for space.

1:03:49That building could have gone up two more stories.

1:03:51I know we had to secure the roof or all the stuff we're putting on the roof of the dispatch center.

1:03:55But I think, you know, we had talked about a blue ribbon committee way back when to look at our buildings.

1:04:00I appointed a committee because I got asked to at one time.

1:04:03And I don't think they only met once or twice and there's no minutes.

1:04:06And it just didn't go anywhere.

1:04:08But I think when you take a hard look at some different things,

1:04:11because you listen to the people out there, the keyboard warriors, we know 2028 is going to be really bad.

1:04:192027 is bad. Brian, every time he turns over a rock, there's another problem.

1:04:23And we just, we've got to take a hard look at some things and just, you know, buckle in.

1:04:29And with this federal government, it's only getting worse every day.

1:04:31You know, the uncertainty that we are living in is not good.

1:04:34I'll leave it at that.

1:04:39Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

1:04:40Thank you, Miss Todd.

1:04:41Mr. Mayor, the pause that you referenced, I was a bit of a nudge earlier when you,

1:04:48the council didn't know about your interim DPW appointment.

1:04:52Additionally, I would put this as kind of illustrative of the track record of not keeping the council informed

1:04:57because this email went out in your name to the committee.

1:05:02I think Mr. Edwards sent it, but the council wasn't included in it.

1:05:05Now, maybe that's another one of those oversights that you talked about.

1:05:08But when we hear from, when we ask questions, and this is a COO that's no longer here,

1:05:13I wouldn't say the discussion was entirely collaborative.

1:05:16It felt hostile at many times because there were, you know, difficult questions like,

1:05:21how are we going to get the money and what are we going to do with the building that really had never been defined fully.

1:05:27And I think the council takes or should take some responsibility for that because I think we thought initially,

1:05:33based on the early conversations, that ARPA dollars were going to cover the entire thing.

1:05:37And we relied on the experience of the previous COO and your assurances and a grand idea.

1:05:42And we probably didn't ask enough pointed questions before we said, let's do it.

1:05:47And here we are with something that we, I think, Councilor Adbyani raises a good point.

1:05:52And I'm a little worried that we don't know the answer to it because we used ARPA dollars

1:05:56and I don't know what the clawbacks are if we decide to dispose of that.

1:06:00I don't know if anybody else on the team knows the answer to that question,

1:06:02but I don't see us having a plan to, you know, use this building for its stated purpose.

1:06:08And I'm not entirely sure what the stated purpose was because whenever someone on the council asked,

1:06:13well, what are we going to do there?

1:06:14It was always sort of pointed towards, well, the committee, this wonderful group of 30 volunteers hadn't decided yet.

1:06:21I mean, that's not good municipal strategic planning.

1:06:23And I don't want to spend too much time dwelling on the past, but as we talk about new projects,

1:06:27I'm really hoping that we've learned from that.

1:06:30And I'm hopeful that maybe by the end of this meeting, we can find out what happens if we repurpose that asset

1:06:37or what we can do because that's a big price tag.

1:06:40I mean, there are a lot of sunk costs here.

1:06:43But the issue with not communicating with the council is really troubling

1:06:47because I don't have an issue with the substance of the email that was sent out to the committee,

1:06:52but we were all sent from various members of the committee, hey, you guys weren't included on this.

1:06:57What's going on?

1:06:58When we're learning about things through the grapevine or through, you know, volunteers,

1:07:03it makes me worry about what else we're not being told.

1:07:08So I'm hopeful that if I think the last couple of years have not been great in terms of communication,

1:07:13I'm hopeful that you'll be more proactive in sharing, maybe oversharing things that you don't.

1:07:17There was a time when that happened, but I can't fathom any other time in our history

1:07:24where an interim division head would be appointed, for example, and the council wouldn't know about it,

1:07:30or when our biggest non-public works related construction project would be put on pause

1:07:38and your co-equal branch of government would not be formally informed of it.

1:07:43That's really troubling to me.

1:07:47I am hopeful that you have more of a -- what comes next there?

1:07:53I've been hearing the same numbers, and thank you, Ms. Todd, for all the work.

1:07:56There was an event that we had -- I wasn't there,

1:08:00but I remember seeing the photo holding a big check, I think, in front of the former Marian High School.

1:08:05What were those dollars? Have those been spent?

1:08:09And what is our total lifetime -- this is my question for the mayor.

1:08:12The total lifetime dollars on the project spent so far?

1:08:23The cardboard check you're referring to is what the grant she just described that she's working on.

1:08:29She was talking about a grant that -- I'm sorry, and I don't want to --

1:08:33I thought she was talking about a grant that hadn't been -- that hadn't come to fruition yet.

1:08:37It hasn't.

1:08:38I mean, just because she gave us a -- Congressman Clark gave us a cardboard check

1:08:43doesn't mean that the money was put in the bank the next day.

1:08:46But didn't we learn -- didn't we learn from this before?

1:08:51You celebrate -- it might have been the Spicer administration.

1:08:55There was an earmark for $5 million for something,

1:08:58and we were all excited it was in a report, and we found out it wasn't even there.

1:09:03So the photo that you guys took -- I don't know that the people in the photo knew that.

1:09:08That $3 million wasn't there, Mr. Mayor. We don't have that money?

1:09:13We're working on getting it.

1:09:15We took the picture of the check.

1:09:17Help me understand what exactly -- what it is now.

1:09:21The event you're talking about was an announcement by Congresswoman Clark

1:09:27that she had secured funding an amount of, I think it was $3 million for the community center.

1:09:36And she came to Framingham to help celebrate the fact that Congress authorized that money.

1:09:42But once the money is authorized by Congress, it has to go through a number of steps.

1:09:47There's different federal departments that oversee the distribution of that money,

1:09:52and we have to meet all their requirements before they'll release the money.

1:09:57Even though it's been earmarked for that project, we don't get it right away.

1:10:02We have to go through a bunch of hoops like she just described to get the money.

1:10:07That's just the one federal grant.

1:10:10That's all -- every state grant we get, we have to do that.

1:10:14I get that, and I'll leave it here, and we can move on.

1:10:17Let's maybe agree in this room that we'll only celebrate money that we actually have and can spend.

1:10:23Because everything is hypothetical until we have it, and we end up celebrating things that right now we don't even have.

1:10:29So that was a photo, and I appreciate all the work that's been done.

1:10:32I understand the grant process, but forgive me for being naive enough to think that when we took a picture of the giant check, we actually had the dough.

1:10:39That's all I have, Mr. Chairman. Thank you.

1:10:41>> Ms. Feeny.

1:10:43>> Thank you, Mr. Chair.

1:10:44First off, thank you, Megan, for all your work on this and for explaining it, and the journey you have to go through with the state and the federal government to get money.

1:10:52Mr. Mayor, thank you so much for the update on this.

1:10:57You know, I am still a supporter of a community center as much as I am of a pool because I believe we need to invest in our community.

1:11:04And I understand that they have big numbers that go with that.

1:11:08So just a couple of questions about moving forward, right?

1:11:12How will you evaluate whether or not the project continues after, you know, it's been put on ice for a little bit?

1:11:20>> I'm depending on getting additional grants, and I'm also hopeful at some point in time we'll be able to get some private participation and move ahead that way.

1:11:36What I'm not confident about doing is asking the taxpayers of Framingham to put up additional money, or any money.

1:11:44We haven't spent any Framingham taxpayer money yet on that building, and I don't foresee doing that until our financial situation improves.

1:11:54So two things I'd like to do going forward is continue to seek out grants. Hopefully what's going on in Washington will change and become more favorable to returning to grant programs that we used to see.

1:12:14And also, we'll continue to look for opportunities to partner with private organizations or private companies to try and free up some money to help with the future work there.

1:12:28>> And I appreciate, you know, the issue with taxpayers and the situation we're in.

1:12:34I get that.

1:12:35So between -- because I think the letter that went out that we saw from the advisory commission, there was an April deadline.

1:12:46So is there going to be any work on a strategic plan for the center between -- in the next couple of months while the issue of money kind of -- you know, we see what happens with the federal government.

1:12:59Because it seems to me -- so, you know, we had a survey that was done. 851 people took the survey.

1:13:07And I want to thank again Susan Petroni for giving me all that raw data.

1:13:11And if you look at it -- and I compiled a report, and if people haven't seen it, I'm more than happy to recirculate it.

1:13:19It was -- if you looked at what the people were saying, they actually gave you -- and you was the city -- a strategic plan of what they were looking for.

1:13:30Has that been utilized in any way, the feedback that we're getting from the survey?

1:13:36What are we going to do about planning for this?

1:13:40Because it seems that, at least in my experience dealing with asking for sponsorships, fundraising, et cetera, by having a clear plan and mission, I think will help us go a long way.

1:13:52And I don't get the sense that the advisory commission was able to do that.

1:13:56Part of the problem is that we've been operating on funds that are -- come with a restriction on it.

1:14:07And like Megan just pointed out, this $3 million is restricted to being used for accessibility.

1:14:17So that kind of drives what we can do and can't do with these grants that we get.

1:14:22So it'd be nice to have a plan, and I agree there should be an overall plan of how we -- what we want to end up with.

1:14:30But the way we get there could be lots of curves and bumps in the road, depending on what we can use these grants for.

1:14:39And unless we get some large grants or participation, that's not restricted.

1:14:48It's less restricted, and we can use it for broader use.

1:14:52So it's nice to have the plan to use that as a guide to where we want to end up.

1:14:59But we still have to go by the guidelines that come with the grants that we were able to secure.

1:15:07One more thing.

1:15:08I would say that the strategic plan is not just nice to have, but it can help you identify what the grants are that you're looking for, too, right?

1:15:16And so I would encourage the administration to look at that plan.

1:15:21It might make your life a lot easier when Megan is looking at grants and what she's doing.

1:15:26My last question is, how will -- so we're not doing any work for the next couple of months.

1:15:33How is the city going to ensure that the building does not become a victim or an ice -- of blight or an eyesore?

1:15:39Or what are we doing to just maintain that building?

1:15:42It's fully secured.

1:15:43Okay.

1:15:44You can see the way the doors are boarded up.

1:15:46There's very little opportunity to get inside the building.

1:15:51The water is turned off.

1:15:53There's no electricity in the building.

1:15:55So we don't have to worry about pipes freezing or anything like that.

1:16:00And the building is fully secured.

1:16:02So we got a new roof on it.

1:16:04I don't know if you mentioned the roof as part of one of the grants we got.

1:16:08So we're not worried about water infiltration.

1:16:11It's brand-new windows.

1:16:13Everything's closed up tight.

1:16:16So we're not concerned about that.

1:16:18Thank you very much, Mr. Mayor.

1:16:19I look forward to more of this conversation about the community center.

1:16:22I think, you know, I will still hold and believe that there is potential here.

1:16:26Thank you.

1:16:27Goodness Bryant, then Ms. Long, then Mr. Stephanie.

1:16:29Okay.

1:16:31Thank you.

1:16:32And thank you, Mayor.

1:16:35Again, I think that, you know, your explanation has been spot on.

1:16:40And, you know, I don't agree with anyone all the time.

1:16:43But in this case, I do.

1:16:45I think Marion was -- is a part of -- Marion High School is a great part of Framingham history.

1:16:52It was there for so long.

1:16:55The work was great there.

1:16:57And so to repurpose it cannot be a short work.

1:17:03And although we're living in the age of impatience,

1:17:06we know that that can just create a lot of disorganization.

1:17:11And while I do like the questions that Councilor Cannon asked at the same time,

1:17:16I will not agree to not celebrate right now because I think that celebrating what

1:17:24Congresswoman Clark achieved is a way of saying thank you and showing the appreciation

1:17:33and also helping to fuel and encourage others to also help with these projects.

1:17:40And when I -- when it was first brought up, and maybe I haven't heard a lot of late

1:17:49about it, but it was all -- we were given a vision of just preliminary of what might

1:17:56go there, community center or centers, swimming or whatever.

1:18:02A lot was on the table, but all of them were purposes that would help our community,

1:18:08the youth especially or whatever.

1:18:11And -- but Councilor Adebayani saying, you know, maybe we have to rethink.

1:18:16We may have to.

1:18:17The best buildings and planning of projects that lasted and that stood the test of time,

1:18:25the people who put it together will tell you -- and I know the mayor knows this --

1:18:30that, you know, there's a lot -- there's years there's planning.

1:18:34There is preparation, sometimes years of one, years of the other, years of putting

1:18:39the bricks in place, years of getting funding.

1:18:42If it's going to be something great enough and long-lasting enough for the purposes

1:18:48that we all want to do and to last, what we want it for, then we have to know that

1:18:55it's worth to doing it and doing it right.

1:18:58And so, yes, we have to be patient.

1:19:01Yes, we do need to hear.

1:19:04You know, we don't want it to just fall by the wayside in terms of the planning

1:19:08and the purposing and the looking.

1:19:10But I caution us not to expect too much too soon, right?

1:19:15We want something that is going to do the job and be as vital to our community.

1:19:20Well, I don't know if it could be as vital as Marion High School was,

1:19:23but to be vital to our community that would at least not bring shame on the good

1:19:30work that Marion High School did for our community.

1:19:34Ms. Long.

1:19:36Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

1:19:37So I've just had a couple questions more about the actual cost of this building

1:19:41at this point and what we anticipate on paying and what the actual grants are

1:19:46that are being applied, whether they are state, federal,

1:19:50and what the names of those grants are.

1:19:52I actually am a asset manager, capital asset manager,

1:19:56and do a lot of the grant writing.

1:19:58And I'm just curious what the grants are.

1:20:00What the ARPA funds are.

1:20:02My question on that is how much did we get?

1:20:04I can't remember what we got for ARPA

1:20:06and has that already been expended because we all know

1:20:09or should know that those funds have to be expended by 1231-26.

1:20:16So those are kind of my questions.

1:20:18And I share Councilor Ottobee on these concerns at this point,

1:20:22and especially with our finances and framing him,

1:20:25if it doesn't serve us better to sell off the building

1:20:28and come up with a different plan,

1:20:30and what the schedule of values on this building is

1:20:33and what the expected end cost is.

1:20:37Because as you know, inflation is growing.

1:20:39It's not shrinking.

1:20:41Cost of labor, cost of materials.

1:20:45And does it serve us well to have a building that's just sitting there

1:20:48that is going to keep being a money pit, basically?

1:20:53Or is it service better to sell the building off

1:20:56and come up with a different plan?

1:20:58So those are kind of my comments and questions for information.

1:21:01Okay, well--

1:21:04Through you to the Mayor.

1:21:05I'm sorry, I thought Megan--

1:21:11Oh, I'm sorry, Megan.

1:21:14That's okay.

1:21:15Sorry about that.

1:21:16Not a problem.

1:21:17So the $12 million approximately that I mentioned was ARPA funding.

1:21:22The additional grant that I mentioned, the $3.15 million,

1:21:26was Congressional Community Project funding,

1:21:31and that was an appropriation that was championed

1:21:35through Congress by Congresswoman Clark.

1:21:37And at this point, we're working on obligating that grant,

1:21:40but it started out as community project funding,

1:21:43and it's now managed through HUD,

1:21:46Housing and Urban Development, Economic Development Wing.

1:21:50So that's who we're working with on that.

1:21:53Yeah, I figured that when you said environmental review,

1:21:55I knew it had to be HUD.

1:21:59So what's the actual cost of this building overall?

1:22:03I mean, I saw Dimio was working on the project, correct?

1:22:06Dimio's at the school, the old dam for the people.

1:22:11Oh, all right.

1:22:12So where are we at with funding?

1:22:14That's my question.

1:22:15And what do we anticipate spending on this?

1:22:20Well, they said we don't probably have any funding,

1:22:22so that's what the discussion was before.

1:22:25Right, but what's the estimated cost to renovate this building

1:22:29and repurpose it for what we want?

1:22:31Is that feasible?

1:22:33That was Mr. Audubiani's question.

1:22:35That's my question.

1:22:37Is this really feasible at this point,

1:22:39or should we have a different plan?

1:22:41Mr. Chair?

1:22:43Well, go ahead.

1:22:44Just to follow.

1:22:46I think Mr. Paolini, I know he's not available tonight,

1:22:49but he had come in at one time and shared some numbers with us,

1:22:52and he said it could go from one end to the other.

1:22:54So maybe you could put this on at night,

1:22:56and we could have a discussion about it,

1:22:57because it's something that we should be looking at

1:22:59and working with the administration

1:23:01to try to figure out a plan one way or another.

1:23:03It's going to be a lot of money.

1:23:05Right, a ton of money.

1:23:06Well, yeah, so this is the problem.

1:23:09You can get out a project, and you can think,

1:23:12oh, this is going to be a $10 million project,

1:23:15because I do this all day long,

1:23:17and something I'll put out for a couple million dollars.

1:23:20Guess what?

1:23:21It ends up being three or four million dollars,

1:23:23and it drags on, especially when you're involved.

1:23:26I hate to say it, but state and federal governments,

1:23:30a lot of these projects take forever to get done,

1:23:32especially on the state side.

1:23:34So I'm just concerned about inflation,

1:23:37about this building sitting there,

1:23:39and how long it's going to take to renovate it,

1:23:41or repurpose it, and what the actual estimated,

1:23:45I'd like to see a schedule of value on this building,

1:23:48which gives you every single component,

1:23:53what it's going to cost, what the estimated timeline,

1:23:56and the labor, and the materials,

1:23:58and if I could get that through the project manager,

1:24:04whoever, to see where we're actually at with this.

1:24:07And I think Councilor Artiviani's point is a good one,

1:24:10that maybe we need to bring this in

1:24:12and have a bigger discussion about it,

1:24:14because I think it's going to be a lot more money

1:24:16than you think it's going to be.

1:24:17- Mr. Stephanie.

1:24:19- Thank you, Mr. Chairman,

1:24:21and thank you, Ms. Todd and Ms. Petroni,

1:24:25for the work on this thus far.

1:24:27I think that the survey I thought was very insightful.

1:24:32I actually, while I'm disappointed that we're in park,

1:24:37I'm glad we are in park.

1:24:39I think your move on this is smart.

1:24:41It may be hard to wait because we're impatient people,

1:24:45and we'd like to see something that I think makes a difference,

1:24:48but I think the vision is worth waiting for.

1:24:50And I think I'm hopeful that maybe some of the governmental funding

1:24:54that you seek will become available in the near future,

1:24:58and if it doesn't, then we have to revisit,

1:25:00I think what Mr. Artiviani and others looked at,

1:25:02but I think the vision is a good one.

1:25:04And I think the opportunity,

1:25:05it could be a game changer for our youth in Framingham,

1:25:08as was the Latino Youth Center when we had it for a few years,

1:25:13and the boys and girls on the YMCA.

1:25:15They're very much game changers for kids,

1:25:19and we have to wait.

1:25:23I don't know that we have much of a choice

1:25:26if we want to maintain the vision,

1:25:28and I think it's worth being patient,

1:25:30and I appreciate your patience,

1:25:33and I know you're getting a lot of incoming

1:25:35because none of us have patience,

1:25:37and I know I'm usually the one who has no patience,

1:25:39but I appreciate your vision on this,

1:25:41and I think that it's worth fighting for,

1:25:43and it's worth waiting for,

1:25:45and hopefully we get some additional funds

1:25:48that help make that work.

1:25:51Okay, Mr. Alexander.

1:25:54Guys, this is a very lengthy agenda,

1:25:56just so everybody knows, so...

1:25:58I'll make a quick clock, why not?

1:25:59I know, it's gonna be, I mean, we have a long way to go,

1:26:01and everybody wants to talk on every subject, so...

1:26:04My question is, Mr. Chair,

1:26:07is that how long do you anticipate, like,

1:26:11how long do you anticipate, or I should say,

1:26:16the materials or whatever that's wrapped up the building

1:26:21to keep it secure and safe and all that,

1:26:25how long, what's the shelf life of that?

1:26:28Say, like, a year or so, or more?

1:26:31It's in the windows, it's all tight.

1:26:33Those are all permanent improvements,

1:26:37those aren't temporary improvements.

1:26:40Okay, Mr. Cannon, you already spoke,

1:26:43you already spoke about this,

1:26:45but it's not necessarily okay.

1:26:47I'm just stunned that we're concluding this discussion,

1:26:50Mr. Mayor, without some sort of price tag.

1:26:53I thought the first thing,

1:26:54there's no background material on this,

1:26:56it's one of our biggest projects,

1:26:58do we really not know, we're talking about vision,

1:27:01but if we don't have a number to at least shoot for,

1:27:04or if we do this, it's gonna cost around,

1:27:06I mean, and as far as the bigger meeting,

1:27:11there's some sort of price tag here, 'cause I feel awfully silly

1:27:14that we spent 15 million bucks on something

1:27:16without knowing or at least having a sense

1:27:18of what the total cost was going to be.

1:27:20You know, you talk about no background material being provided.

1:27:24That wasn't the purpose of this meeting.

1:27:26This meeting was not meant for any votes to be taken

1:27:31or any kind of direction.

1:27:34We weren't asking for votes or any specific action.

1:27:38This was meant to be an update on these projects,

1:27:42and that's what we're giving you, an update.

1:27:45You're asking for specific information

1:27:48that we don't presently have,

1:27:50and we'd have to put it all together,

1:27:52and we're willing to do that,

1:27:54but the plan was not to provide

1:27:56that kind of detail at tonight's meeting,

1:27:59because based on the length of the agenda,

1:28:01I wanted to give you as much updates as possible

1:28:06on all the different projects we're working on,

1:28:08and it would have been impossible

1:28:10to give you background material on this stuff,

1:28:13because these are moving targets,

1:28:16and these projects keep moving ahead,

1:28:19and when we're ready to ask you to take a vote

1:28:22on something or make an appropriation,

1:28:25we'll give you all that background material

1:28:27and all the information you need to make a decision,

1:28:30but that wasn't the purpose of tonight's meeting.

1:28:33Well, of course, excuse me, I'll just leave the comment here,

1:28:36but it was, Mr. Mayor.

1:28:38Time and time again, we've been asking,

1:28:41what are we anticipating this costing,

1:28:43and in terms of no taxpayer dollars being used for this,

1:28:46well, that's incorrect as well.

1:28:47We could have spent a significant number

1:28:49of these dollars for the pool project

1:28:51that in your initial pitch to the city council included,

1:28:54was part of the community center project.

1:28:56It was about a year and a half

1:28:58before it became public knowledge

1:29:00that a pool wasn't going to be part

1:29:02of this community center project,

1:29:04but if nothing else,

1:29:05I don't need fancy background material or anything,

1:29:07as much as we've talked about having this meeting,

1:29:09you still can't tell us what we think

1:29:11the total cost of the project will be.

1:29:13That's alarming.

1:29:14Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

1:29:15Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

1:29:16Ms. Bryant, you really want to go

1:29:17for round two here too on this?

1:29:19I can't hear you.

1:29:23I said just one sentence,

1:29:26which my sentence is that,

1:29:28how can they give us a number for the total project,

1:29:32even a projection when it hasn't been decided

1:29:35what the project is going to be?

1:29:37That hasn't been landed on,

1:29:39and perhaps we do need to bring in the committee

1:29:42at some point,

1:29:43maybe give them a month to meet,

1:29:45but then have the committee for this project

1:29:48come before us and engage with them.

1:29:51Thank you.

1:29:53Updates on the Saxophone intersection project.

1:29:57Okay.

1:29:58As you know,

1:29:59we're working on the design and redesign

1:30:02of that intersection,

1:30:03and the design got to about 85 percent,

1:30:08and when we came up with the new design ideas

1:30:14for improving that intersection

1:30:17by getting that house on the corner of Danforth

1:30:21and Elm Street and Concord Street,

1:30:25we focused on getting that done

1:30:29because we knew that was going to enable us

1:30:32to come up with a much better, more efficient plan,

1:30:35and that's what we've been working on.

1:30:38We've been discussing, as you know,

1:30:41the owner of the Saxonville Mills

1:30:43had purchased that building

1:30:46and has since had it torn down.

1:30:50She is interested in acquiring the old pump station

1:30:55on Watson Place,

1:30:57and we're in the process now of negotiating

1:31:03an agreement that will provide for the transfer

1:31:07of that vacant piece of land now,

1:31:10the corner of Danforth Street,

1:31:12to the city in exchange for the transfer

1:31:16of the ownership of the pump station

1:31:20to the owner of Saxonville Mills.

1:31:23In the meantime,

1:31:25she's allowed the city

1:31:28to let the design engineer onto that property

1:31:34so they can do some more survey work

1:31:36and complete the design of that intersection

1:31:39which would include using that piece of property

1:31:42as part of the redesign of that intersection.

1:31:46We're working on that agreement

1:31:48for the transfer of ownership of the properties.

1:31:52I expect that to be ready to bring before the city council

1:31:56within the next month or so

1:31:59so we can begin discussing that so we can move ahead.

1:32:02As you know, the money for the construction

1:32:06of that was included in your approval

1:32:09of the fiscal 27 capital project.

1:32:12So that is ready to go once the design is finished

1:32:16and we can finalize the exchange

1:32:21of the ownership of those properties.

1:32:23- Mr. Ward.

1:32:26- Thank you, Chair, and thank you, Mr. Mayor.

1:32:30Apologies for not being there in person.

1:32:32I have a cold I'm fighting through.

1:32:35Appreciate this update and hearing where we stand

1:32:40with the project and glad to hear we're close,

1:32:42hopefully within a month of the formal acquisition

1:32:45hopefully of that property on the corner there.

1:32:48At what point will the public have a chance

1:32:51to see the new updated designs

1:32:53and have a chance to weigh in?

1:32:54I know that's been an important part of the process

1:32:56up till now and what does the timeline

1:33:01or potential dates look like for public engagement?

1:33:03- We're hoping to have a public hearing sometime

1:33:06around the first of the year or shortly thereafter.

1:33:09- For the new design for the intersection or for the--

1:33:15- Well, for the entire project including the design

1:33:20for the intersection, yes.

1:33:22- Okay, okay, so there'll be formal plans

1:33:25for the public to review at that point?

1:33:27- Yes.

1:33:28- Okay, okay, thank you.

1:33:31- Anything else, Chair?

1:33:34- I'm glad to hear this because this is one

1:33:37of the intersections that we probably,

1:33:39as a city, hear the most about.

1:33:42You know, and it's been going back years

1:33:44and I know that, you know, a lot of people,

1:33:46and every time there's an accident, it starts it up again.

1:33:49And, you know, it just takes one car coming up, conquered.

1:33:52I mean, we all know pretty much we've all been through it.

1:33:56And I do know that, you know, people have been waiting

1:33:59and I know that, you know, everything takes time

1:34:01and I appreciate that the deal was Charlotte.

1:34:05I think that a partnership there was something

1:34:07that was talked about and I'm glad to see

1:34:11that she's been so open to working with the city

1:34:15because it is really a community kind

1:34:18of a solution, a problem, and it's a good solution

1:34:21to this very big problem that we've had, you know,

1:34:27for the, you know, I went to that school

1:34:30and we used to cut down Danforth,

1:34:32I'm not gonna tell you how many years ago,

1:34:34but it hasn't changed.

1:34:36It was a nightmare then and a handful of years later,

1:34:41it's a nightmare again.

1:34:43So I do appreciate that you guys have put this forward

1:34:48and I do think that, you know, I know it's gonna take time

1:34:51and I understand that people, they want it fixed now.

1:34:54And thank you for listening.

1:34:56And if people could just have patience because I can see this,

1:35:00you know, into fruition is gonna be a really good thing.

1:35:04But unfortunately, you know, like everything here,

1:35:06like we've seen, it's always timing

1:35:08and it's always takes more time than we would like.

1:35:13So thanks on that.

1:35:15Okay. Next, Framingham, sorry, Pearl Street Garage.

1:35:22Okay. So as you know, we've been talking

1:35:26and the EDC has been before the council

1:35:29with their plans for their development plans

1:35:34and their priority project is taking control

1:35:38of the Pearl Street Garage and working with developers

1:35:42to work on that area of the downtown.

1:35:45And we're making a lot of progress in doing research

1:35:48on the title of the parking garage

1:35:51and doing all the paperwork necessary to bring to the council

1:35:56to enable the council to make a decision

1:35:58on whether or not to transfer ownership

1:36:01of the Pearl Street Garage to the EDC.

1:36:05We're hoping to have that, the preliminary stuff,

1:36:08preliminary paperwork on that for your meeting on October 6th.

1:36:12I know City Solicitor has been working closely

1:36:16with the EDC's attorney who's been doing title research

1:36:21and other documents to help facilitate this transfer

1:36:25and we're getting closer.

1:36:27And then it'll be up, once that happens,

1:36:30it'll be up to the EDC to take it to the next step

1:36:33where they get together with developers

1:36:39and decide how to best reuse that garage

1:36:43to facilitate new development in that area.

1:36:50So, Stephanie.

1:36:51Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

1:36:52Just briefly, I think that's spectacular.

1:36:55The ability of this garage to generate close to a million dollars a year

1:37:00in new tax revenue in a very short term

1:37:02and also deal with some serious economic activity

1:37:07that backside of downtown I think is great.

1:37:12I think this has long been thought about

1:37:16and I think hopefully we can get it done in short order.

1:37:20This could make a big difference, a big difference.

1:37:26Just briefly, I'll echo the comments.

1:37:27I think that's great.

1:37:28It's long overdue.

1:37:29I'm delighted that there's some action there.

1:37:31I'm hoping that it's a microcosm of things to come

1:37:33that's a really sharp group of people on the EDC

1:37:35that you've appointed.

1:37:37And I think, however, the council can help move some things along

1:37:39will be great to look at other communities

1:37:41that have harnessed the power of that type of organization.

1:37:44Great things have happened.

1:37:45So, however we can help.

1:37:47Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

1:37:48Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

1:37:49Real short and sweet.

1:37:50That's great news.

1:37:51And maybe the community sent us something to make a look at, too.

1:37:54There's a lot of buildings and a lot of property

1:37:56that the EDC or the FEDC now is whatever it's called,

1:38:00could do maybe one discourse.

1:38:02So, thought I'd throw it out there.

1:38:03Ms. Bryant?

1:38:04I was thinking the same thing about the EDC

1:38:07and the Marion Building, but also, obviously,

1:38:11you know, the Pearl Street Garage, I'm happy.

1:38:14And I would like for us to have on the agenda

1:38:20maybe an update from EDC so that we can't ask questions

1:38:25and some questions, too, about, like, you know,

1:38:28about the specific plans, timelines,

1:38:31or where they're at with that

1:38:33and just ask the most specific questions.

1:38:38Okay, anybody else?

1:38:42Okay, and Rick?

1:38:44Okay.

1:38:45So, as you know, we're renovating the building

1:38:48at 188 Concord Street.

1:38:50We're making a lot of progress.

1:38:52Mr. Poehling is not here tonight,

1:38:54and not available tonight to give you detailed updates.

1:38:57But we're looking to finish that renovation

1:39:04and have the Board of Health move back in

1:39:07by the end of this calendar year.

1:39:10And then it'll be available to start being outfitted

1:39:14with new equipment for the emergency dispatch.

1:39:18And the goal is to have that operational

1:39:23on or about July 1st of 2027.

1:39:28We did -- as you know, it's being funded.

1:39:31The initial work and the fit-up of the building

1:39:36has been being funded by the 911 Commission,

1:39:41the state grant money.

1:39:43And we ran into a couple of hiccups

1:39:48with the grant application for this fiscal year.

1:39:54The initial amount awarded to us

1:39:57was a lot less than what the grant amount was

1:40:00that we applied for.

1:40:03And we were concerned for a while

1:40:06that we weren't going to get enough money

1:40:08to keep the project on time

1:40:11and meet the July 1st goal of opening the center.

1:40:17But we've had a number of meetings with the state.

1:40:20Representative Spilka's -- Senator Spilka's office

1:40:23has been involved.

1:40:25And as recently as this afternoon,

1:40:28I received a letter from the state 911 Commission

1:40:33saying that they have been able to resolve

1:40:36some of their funding issues,

1:40:38and they've committed to getting us the money

1:40:42that will be needed to get this place open

1:40:45on July 1st of 2027.

1:40:49So that was really good news today.

1:40:52We're moving ahead.

1:40:54And Brian, I think you were going to add

1:40:59a few details to what I just said.

1:41:02Based on the information we got late this afternoon,

1:41:08we're very optimistic that this will move ahead

1:41:12without any slowdown at this point in time.

1:41:17Sure.

1:41:18Through you, Mr. Chair,

1:41:19just to follow up to what the mayor has discussed

1:41:22regarding MREC.

1:41:23So for this year to be able to open on July 1st,

1:41:27the REC had requested just under $6 million

1:41:31to be able to get fully staffed

1:41:33in operational training and everything necessary

1:41:36to be able to open the doors on July 1st

1:41:38and make the transition.

1:41:40The original award was for $1.7 million,

1:41:42which was substantially less than we needed.

1:41:45As the mayor indicated, we had multiple meetings.

1:41:47We met directly with the E911 board members

1:41:50of the legislative delegation.

1:41:52We're either there or sent representatives.

1:41:54There was a full commitment to help find additional funding

1:41:58to make sure that we could meet that timeline.

1:42:02MREC submitted a reduced grant request

1:42:07identifying only the most urgent critical funding necessary

1:42:11to ensure that it could open on July 1st.

1:42:14That additional funding was--

1:42:16the total funding was $3.7 million,

1:42:18which would have required approximately just over $2 million

1:42:21in additional award to be able to open for July 1st.

1:42:24The mayor has referenced a letter that we did receive,

1:42:29which does reference approximately additional $1.5 million in funding.

1:42:33I have not had a chance to go back and reconcile it

1:42:35against the updated reduced request for the bare minimum

1:42:39to be able to open on July 1st,

1:42:41but it gets us much closer to the amount necessary.

1:42:44And I know that there's a commitment from both the E911

1:42:47and everyone involved on Beacon Hill to ensure

1:42:50that we find a way to fund the necessary amounts

1:42:53to be able to open the facility on July 1st.

1:42:57I'm happy to try to answer any questions that the council may have.

1:43:02So how are we going to train all these people?

1:43:03Do they work for us now?

1:43:05I mean, we're going to use the same people, right?

1:43:08They will be going--

1:43:11that is a question we do have a meeting on Thursday,

1:43:14which I think that question will come up

1:43:16because I have had some questions about how this is exactly going to work,

1:43:19but the anticipation is they would start hiring individuals

1:43:23in beginning in either December, late December into January,

1:43:26and then the training plan would be developed

1:43:30and those individuals would be trained.

1:43:32I don't know what the expectation is.

1:43:35I obviously came in somewhat late to the development of this project,

1:43:38so I am still trying to get into speed on what the expectation is,

1:43:42transition from employees.

1:43:44That's been a question of mine, is how are we going to work all of that?

1:43:47But the expectation is they would be hiring the staff necessary

1:43:50to open on the 1st of July and be training from, say, January through June 30th

1:43:55and then the cutover.

1:43:57So we're going to hire people six months before we open full-time?

1:44:01That's an open question that I'm still trying to get answered.

1:44:05Is the expectation that they're full-time?

1:44:07I think with that funding, I don't believe that it would be full-time at that point.

1:44:10I think it would be part-time on a training basis for them.

1:44:15But don't we already have most of the staff we need?

1:44:18Because each town has dispatches, right? And we have dispatches.

1:44:23So how many new people do we like hiring?

1:44:26I understand there's a new entity hiring there,

1:44:29but isn't it really a transfer and, therefore, when the training?

1:44:33Granted, I know it's going to be a little different with the regional aspect of it,

1:44:35but wouldn't it be relatively seamless?

1:44:40Is it really starting a whole new operation?

1:44:42Excuse me.

1:44:44Through you, Mr. Chair, so one would expect it would be relatively seamless.

1:44:48I know that they're going to go through a hiring process

1:44:51and one would hope that employees in all the communities would be the first choice.

1:44:55I can't speak to what their full plan is on how to do that,

1:44:59but that is a question, as I mentioned, that is open in my mind,

1:45:02that still needs to be addressed and discussed,

1:45:04and what that transition plan ultimately does look like.

1:45:07I'd be interested at some point in hearing from the director or whatever,

1:45:12because I've tried to follow this a little bit through their minutes and things like that,

1:45:15and I do have some questions.

1:45:17I recognize it's not a Framingham, even though it's our building,

1:45:21it's not a Framingham operation.

1:45:23It's a regional, you know, it's a separate entity who's operating it,

1:45:26so it's nothing to -- and, you know, we're only a one-third member of it.

1:45:31So -- but to that end, are they leasing the building from us, or how does that work?

1:45:36There is a lease that our city solicitor has drafted and sent to the rec to review,

1:45:44and that is currently in process,

1:45:47and ultimately will go through the executive board for approval,

1:45:50and ultimately will receive payments.

1:45:53I don't recall off the top of my head what that exact lease number looks like,

1:45:57but we are leasing that space to them.

1:45:59So it would be a fair market rent, though, right?

1:46:01It would have to be, yes.

1:46:05Thank you.

1:46:06Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

1:46:07Thanks for the update.

1:46:08What is the process that we're undertaking to recruit new member towns?

1:46:14I was kind of surprised to read that it looks like Marlboro,

1:46:17their finance committee, has authorized their mayor to enter into an agreement

1:46:20with the Holbrook Regional Dispatch Center,

1:46:23which I think services 15 communities,

1:46:26Holbrook much further away than our cozy next-door neighbors here in Framingham.

1:46:31Were you surprised to read that?

1:46:33I don't know if you can shed any light on that.

1:46:35Yeah, I didn't know that until I read it on, I guess, Unfiltered.

1:46:40Is that where it was?

1:46:41No, it was in the -- I don't know where you read it.

1:46:43It was somewhere on --

1:46:44The email that I forwarded to you earlier this week was from the community advocate.

1:46:48Okay, wherever it came from.

1:46:50Community advocate.

1:46:51I was not aware of that,

1:46:53and so I reached out to the mayor's office in Marlboro to find out whether it was true or not,

1:47:00and what process they went through.

1:47:03And I was told that it goes back in time to the previous mayor of Marlboro

1:47:08who was looking at regionalizing it,

1:47:10and they originally approached the Neshoba Valley Regional Emergency Dispatch

1:47:17and made inquiries about joining that, and I think they were rebuffed.

1:47:22And the Neshoba Valley said, "No, we don't want you as a member."

1:47:26Or words to that effect.

1:47:28So they -- apparently they looked around,

1:47:32and they found out about the Holbrook wreck.

1:47:37From all my indications, ours, they never approached Framingham or Natick or Whalen.

1:47:46And I think they did a lot of their research before we were even regionalized.

1:47:52We were just talking about it.

1:47:54And I think they were -- the bottom line was that they were anxious to join something

1:47:59that was already established because they felt that they were looking at --

1:48:04spending a lot of money on replacing outdated equipment,

1:48:07and they wanted to join a group that was already established

1:48:11so they didn't have to worry about startups like what we're going through.

1:48:16And that's most of the information I was able to get.

1:48:20So they went ahead, and they're still in the process of doing local approval

1:48:28of joining the Holbrook one.

1:48:30They haven't done it yet.

1:48:32They're working on paperwork.

1:48:34And the city council in Marlboro has not yet voted to go ahead with that.

1:48:40They're still working through that.

1:48:43But every indication is that they want to join something that's already established

1:48:47and up and running.

1:48:49But just one follow-up question.

1:48:51Can we perhaps revisit everybody that maybe we've talked to or thought we talked to?

1:48:57Because what I'm -- what I was sort of hoping to hear from you, Mr. Mayor,

1:49:00is, oh, yeah, of course, they're our next-door neighbor.

1:49:02They were one of the first calls that we made when we started talking about this.

1:49:05And here are their concerns.

1:49:08In looking back at the history in Marlboro, it looks like there were a lot of people

1:49:11in the community that -- no, no, no, no one knows our community better than we do.

1:49:14And I get that.

1:49:15So I thought it was just they didn't want to do it.

1:49:17And it's been going back and forth for years.

1:49:19I stopped looking back in 2022.

1:49:21That's how, you know, how far back I went.

1:49:23But it's been contentious.

1:49:25It doesn't sound like we've had any fresh conversation since the new mayor had been --

1:49:30and he's not even that new.

1:49:31He was just reelected -- was put in office since this had sort of, you know, come to fruition.

1:49:38I just would have thought we had had an ongoing dialogue with our next-door neighbor

1:49:41so we could have understood what concerns they have and maybe overcome them proactively.

1:49:47I mean, to be one of a handful of communities next door that we already serve in mutual aid

1:49:52versus, yeah, they're in business, but it's 40 miles away, 15 communities.

1:49:57It just -- it almost feels like we just didn't engage them in meaningful conversation.

1:50:02So I want to ask you to comment further, but maybe we could revisit everybody

1:50:07that we've talked to early in the process and just know that we're here

1:50:11and we'd love to work with them.

1:50:12Thank you.

1:50:13Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

1:50:14>> Okay.

1:50:16I'm going to go next to item number 17.

1:50:26>> Thank you.

1:50:27Through you, Mr. Chair.

1:50:28So we just wanted to give you a brief update of where we're at, how we're envisioning the process.

1:50:34The mayor and I have talked extensively over the last few -- the last couple weeks, the last few days.

1:50:39So with capital improvement, I think I've been very clear to the council and through the budget,

1:50:44one of the focuses really on the prior approved executability within the appropriations that already exist.

1:50:52All of the departments have submitted all of their capital internally.

1:50:56They're aggregating it into something that's easily readable and looking at it.

1:51:02We are starting the meetings with the departments for us to get an understanding of what their project requests are,

1:51:08comparing that to the prior outlooks or future to see what changes have been made to it, if any.

1:51:14I'm hoping there's minimal changes and that there was not a lot of things that needed to be added

1:51:19because we, for whatever reason, didn't include it in previous year.

1:51:23We're also looking at executability for fiscal 28 recommendation.

1:51:28That is with a goal to meet with the departments in the next week, 10 days,

1:51:34meet with the mayor and have the report that the mayor and we're obligated to submit to the city council by the November 1st deadline

1:51:44with all the required elements, including a five-year plan, the understanding,

1:51:48and how we may propose to ultimately finance it.

1:51:52I don't think on November 1st we'll have a perfect picture of how the financing would be,

1:51:57but we will have a picture of understanding what we think we would be able to do.

1:52:01Again, my goal in the first year of going through this process is really looking at executability on projects

1:52:09and making sure that we can deliver them within what we are looking for approval

1:52:14and in a time frame that allows us to execute and move on and continue to work on the plan and be able to do that.

1:52:21So that's where capital stands at this point.

1:52:24Mr. Chair, do you want me to stop and take questions on capital

1:52:27or do you want me to talk about operating budget as well and take them all together?

1:52:30Let's do them all together.

1:52:31Okay. Thank you.

1:52:34Operating one subject, that's why.

1:52:36Okay. I just wanted to make sure. Thank you, Mr. Chair.

1:52:39So operating budget instructions have gone out.

1:52:41Munis has been rolled and all the division heads are starting to work on it.

1:52:46Internally, my staff has been doing a deep dive to try to look at growth rates and revenue, growth rates and expenditures,

1:52:53all in line with -- I do realize there was a budget proviso that asked me about 20 days ago to have something that is in process and working on it.

1:53:02It's a really large lift.

1:53:05The intent is the charter requires -- I believe it's 180 days prior to the end of the fiscal year that we have this meeting.

1:53:13The intent is to meet the provisions of the charter with a -- as part of the budget proviso,

1:53:19a first quarter review of where the general fund ended up in terms of revenue expenses

1:53:25and to do a runout analysis for the remaining nine months.

1:53:29Couple that with a initial projection of where we think revenues for fiscal 28 are going to look,

1:53:36what they're going to look like, what we would have available,

1:53:39along with where we think the rollover expenditures are going to be, coupled with 29 and 30 included into that so we have a three-year look out.

1:53:48Along with a very preliminary recommendation to start the discussion of how we can get to what I think we all agree on

1:53:58is the elimination of approximately $10 million in free cash out of the budget.

1:54:03What does that look like?

1:54:04How does that structure look like?

1:54:06And we have had discussions with both the school administration and informal discussions with a couple people,

1:54:15a couple members of the school committee letting them know that we certainly envision this is going to be a very difficult year again,

1:54:22most likely maybe even a little bit more difficult than 27 was.

1:54:26But my intent is to deliver that as required in the charter so we can start that discussion with all of the committees and the boards that are called out in the charter.

1:54:34As a beginning initial point with the plan as of right now,

1:54:39and I've directed all of my staff that we will be meeting the March deadline for 120 days prior to be able to start this process.

1:54:46So there is a lot of work going on inside finance that we're working towards,

1:54:51and that is kind of the update and I'm happy to answer questions about all of that if there are any.

1:54:57Questions?

1:54:59Thank you, Mr. Chairman. And for anybody who wants to know, bottom of the second, 1-0 Yankees.

1:55:12They do score it, so I wasn't giving a grimace at you. I was looking at the score, so I'm sorry.

1:55:24I have a couple of comments.

1:55:27First of all, the timelines in the provisos are just to give us a sense of where we are,

1:55:32and I appreciate that you're working on that and we're moving forward.

1:55:35I have a couple of suggestions that I'm sure you're working on, but you didn't articulate it, so I just want to make sure we're on the same page.

1:55:42The five-year capital plan, I hope, anticipates and looks at the OPEB liability and what that means,

1:55:50because as we know, it takes a year to design a project, and then it takes a year to construct it,

1:55:56and we can use our ban financing in that time period, which means we're paying interest only in that period,

1:56:03which means our bulk of our costs for some projects could be two, three, four years out.

1:56:09So it may -- I know we always get into trouble when we look at capital in the face of a difficult fiscal year, operating-wise,

1:56:20but it may very well be that we can be more aggressive in dealing with some of our capital needs

1:56:25because of that light at the end of the tunnel as part of it.

1:56:28And I think to the extent that you're doing planning with those dollars today means we can start to look at

1:56:34what do we need to get it shovel-ready?

1:56:36What do we need to begin the process so that we're looking at ultimately where the cost is?

1:56:44Because that could be very, very significant.

1:56:47And I know you mentioned that during the budget process, but you didn't mention it here.

1:56:52And I just want to make sure that's an active part of it because I think you can be more aggressive

1:56:57in some of the more difficult projects trying to put them forward.

1:57:01The second comment I would make is relative to the operating budget.

1:57:05I know you're looking at three years, but for the reasons I just stated,

1:57:08it may be worth looking at it as a five-year plan because there may be some benefit to looking at

1:57:15and giving some hope and understanding in what the light is at the end of the tunnel,

1:57:19so we're all under the same page.

1:57:21And I know during the process I pushed you to look at free cash elimination and the more aggressive.

1:57:29But given that piece, it may be worth looking at them both in a five-year cycle,

1:57:34which gives you some flexibility.

1:57:36And I'd be curious as to what Mr. King thinks about that.

1:57:39Everyone, but I think that could be a long-range plan here.

1:57:47It could give everybody a lot of comfort.

1:57:49It could give us all a sense of a plan.

1:57:51And then we don't have to go through this on an annual basis of figuring out,

1:57:56you know, what our conflicts are.

1:57:58We're in a much, much better position.

1:58:00So that's my two cents on that.

1:58:06Anybody else?

1:58:07Thank you.

1:58:09Next is Economic Development and Zoning Updates from the Director of Community Development and Planning.

1:58:16Good evening.

1:58:20Marion, if you can help me, thank you.

1:58:25Tonight I just want to give an update on some of that economic development activity

1:58:30that we're going to be seeing in the next year.

1:58:32The first project is 63 and 75 Fountain Street,

1:58:36which the Planning Board spent over a year getting that approved

1:58:41through a special permit process.

1:58:43Right now we're faced with a new project.

1:58:45They just submitted for a totally new project.

1:58:48So we will be going through the permitting process for this project.

1:58:52It's now a 275-unit residential development.

1:58:56They've removed the daycare.

1:58:59We're going to relocate a adult daycare and a child daycare at 63 Fountain Street.

1:59:06That's no longer the plan.

1:59:08However, they are proposing to construct a restaurant,

1:59:12which we're happy about, which would eventually tie into the Chris Wallace Trail.

1:59:16But that project will be coming before the Planning Board in the next couple of months.

1:59:21180 Franklin Street, that project, they just started a demolition on that project.

1:59:26That project is a $20 million project.

1:59:30And this project is designed, it is a rental unit project.

1:59:35However, it's designed with a townhouse development.

1:59:39I know Councilor Leora went to several of our meetings.

1:59:42We're very happy with this design, but that construction has started.

1:59:46I'm just going to go rapid fire here.

1:59:48173 and 179 Union Ave, that project's out of the ground.

1:59:54Again, that's a 46-unit project right down the street here, $20 million project.

2:00:00And that project is moving forward.

2:00:051060 Grove Street, this is the Agrihood Baiting Brook doing extremely well.

2:00:11In fact, just learned that over half of the units have already been sold and

2:00:16they've also pre-sold a lot of these units.

2:00:19And this project is really turning into a great project and

2:00:23we're happy that this project is actually gonna be completed on time.

2:00:28They have started the affordable housing aspect of this project.

2:00:32Turning the mansion into seven units of affordable housing.

2:00:36There'll be actually ten units in that building, seven of which will be affordable.

2:00:43Pearl Street, Pearl Street Garage is a mixed use and this project is completed.

2:00:48They're going through their certificate of occupancy process right now on the first

2:00:53floor is Daniel's Table is the kitchen as well as a social service program

2:00:58that they're gonna be offering and happy to take the city council when

2:01:03time is right to give you guys a tour.

2:01:06I was able to take the mayor through that building and it was very well done.

2:01:10Very happy the way that project came out and this is gonna build off

2:01:14the work that we've been talking about the Pearl Street garage.

2:01:17And this is gonna help further economic development activity in that quadrant.

2:01:2240 Hollis Street, this is a mixed use revitalization project.

2:01:26This project is currently under construction.

2:01:29Where this has a historic preservation component to it that they're gonna maintain

2:01:34some of the historic features of the outside of the building and

2:01:37this project is moving forward.

2:01:40The projects that I did not include is 380 Waverly Street.

2:01:43That's the old chicken bone site.

2:01:46As you can see that final floor, the final floor has been finally framed.

2:01:53And you'll see that project in completion and probably in another year.

2:01:57That project will be completed.

2:01:59There's an affordable housing component to that project as well as 3,000 square feet

2:02:04of retail.

2:02:06Last time I appeared before the city council,

2:02:09there was questions about the Sierra project.

2:02:13And I have some good news in that Sierra has now decided to tear down the building

2:02:20and build a brand new grocery store with affordable housing,

2:02:24approximately 40 units, and to start all over.

2:02:28The issues regarding that project, regarding the building code and

2:02:32bringing that building up to code didn't make financial sense.

2:02:36So they want to start basically from ground zero.

2:02:39So we start with the $6 million project and now we move into a $20 million project.

2:02:45And I've heard someone say patience, that's what we have to have.

2:02:48We just received our 108 loan certification, just got approved and

2:02:53that's something we applied for two years ago.

2:02:56So you got to have patience unfortunately in this business and

2:02:59those funds will go see the proceeds.

2:03:01So happy to hear about this project.

2:03:03They're very excited, they have an architect on board.

2:03:06They have council on board and they're going to move full steam ahead.

2:03:13Next are zoning changes and I don't want to get into the weeds here.

2:03:17I know Councilor Long loves this stuff, but changes to chapter 40A.

2:03:23A lot of changes are being done to chapter 40A basically to promote affordable housing.

2:03:28And before, and just to give you an example, what does that mean?

2:03:32Before if someone wanted to go before the zoning board of appeals and

2:03:37needed a variance or what have you for a house lot.

2:03:40We've changed a lot to make that easier for boards to make a decision.

2:03:44So no longer do you have to make a finding of hardship.

2:03:47If it relates to affordable housing and the board is comfortable with this plan,

2:03:52they can approve those plans.

2:03:54You're going to see a lot more changes that are coming down the road.

2:03:57I think single family housing is being discussed.

2:04:00I know there's a ballot question.

2:04:02But this state, it's all about affordable housing and not just this state.

2:04:06Other states across the country are eliminating single family housing.

2:04:10And this is an important matter.

2:04:12I've met with the building commissioner and the city solicitor, but

2:04:16we need to make changes to our bylaw so it basically mirrors the state law.

2:04:22So those are changes that we'd like to bring in the next couple of months.

2:04:26And it's going to take time to make those changes and

2:04:29actually go through our zoning bylaw to make those happen.

2:04:33Just another example to give you stats.

2:04:35If you remember we, the state passed the accessory dwelling unit bylaw, right?

2:04:40And if you remember, we also worked for months finally getting an approved

2:04:44accessory dwelling unit bylaw.

2:04:46Well, only two projects have been approved under our bylaw.

2:04:51Over 22 projects have been approved under the state law.

2:04:56Which that goes to tell you something that the state wanted to make it easier in order to create affordable housing.

2:05:01So I wanted to give you those stats.

2:05:03So we've had 22 units under the new state law which was just enacted.

2:05:08Actually being able to use that.

2:05:12Next project is the Waverly Street corridor and this project, if you can go to the map,

2:05:21starts from the Naticktown line and goes to Bishop Street.

2:05:26And we've created a corridor that would allow housing at a scale, at a neighborhood scale.

2:05:33Three stories, if you're 100 feet back from the roadway, you can go to four stories.

2:05:37There's a mandatory parking requirement of 1.25 units, 1.25 spaces per unit, I'm sorry.

2:05:46>> 1.3.

2:05:47>> I'm sorry, 1.3, 1.25 is in our current mixture, sorry, thank you for that correction.

2:05:521.3 spaces per unit, but what we're seeing more and more is in Framingham,

2:06:00and we've approved several projects, is 733 Waverly Street.

2:06:04We had a project that had to go before the zoning board of appeals to in order to receive a variance.

2:06:10And we have a project that wants to actually build condos, ownership units along Waverly Street.

2:06:15So that project was approved, it still has to come back to the planning board for site plan approval.

2:06:19But we're seeing more and more of these neighborhood scale smaller,

2:06:24mixed use developments that are actually at a neighborhood scale and it's something that we should promote.

2:06:29And I know Councillor Stephanie and also Councillor Bryant support this in that it's to scale.

2:06:37And what we've been hearing is that some of these larger multi-family housing units that loom over neighborhoods was a concern.

2:06:44This would help direct that and actually plan for it versus having someone come in project by project.

2:06:50So we start from the native town line, we go to Bishop Street, skip over the CB District.

2:06:56CB District obviously is the district that was approved by the state, part of our MBTA certification.

2:07:03Skip that section and then we go from basically downtown to Winter Street.

2:07:08Create this corridor, create these rules and regulations to allow this type of development to go forward.

2:07:15So that's something the planning board is working with the neighborhood and it's something that we'd like to see go forward.

2:07:22I know we've been talking about the Waverly Street overlay district for years, but it's something that we think we can get that accomplished.

2:07:29And then lastly is, and if we can show the map, I want to talk about the Golden Triangle.

2:07:39And this is Batman on a snowmobile and it's also a reindeer laying down.

2:07:48However, this is a Golden Triangle that was enacted back in 1992, 93.

2:07:55I was actually the town engineer at the time in Natick, but

2:07:58it was the triangle that both communities worked together to create zoning and control.

2:08:03Route 9 was dealing with a lot of traffic and both communities came together and they created these regulations and laws.

2:08:09In order to control growth.

2:08:11So that's the Golden Triangle and what I've discovered is the Golden Triangle is nowhere in both towns and

2:08:17zoning describes the district themselves by meets and bounds.

2:08:22It's just an area, it's just a map.

2:08:24The reason why I'm bringing this up is that TJX, if you go to the next slide please.

2:08:34TJX has just acquired several parcels in that district in the Golden Triangle.

2:08:42And as you can see, if you can scroll up a little bit more so you can see the total square feet.

2:08:47They have over a million square feet of space in Framingham.

2:08:51Framingham has been their home, they love this home, they love this community, and they want to expand.

2:08:57They just purchased 3 and 5 Spine Street for 25 million.

2:09:01They put over $12 million into number 5 Spine Street.

2:09:06They also have plans to put additional funds into 3 Spine Street.

2:09:10They would like to expand, they would like to expand in the Golden Triangle area.

2:09:15What they need is, they need floor area relief.

2:09:18And so what we'd like to do is create a special district called the Corporate Headquarters District

2:09:24to allow them to expand, but to expand in that we would create what's called,

2:09:30they call it institutional zoning in Boston, but allow this business to go out,

2:09:34acquire properties, negotiate, and have them actually, we're kind of turning it upside down.

2:09:40Let them go out and create the need that they have and meet with these different property owners.

2:09:47They have actually been working on a campus plan, taking advantage of the Catitua rail trail,

2:09:53making connections, and they appreciate the mayor's work and the council's work and

2:09:59making improvements along that trail is very important for their employees.

2:10:03When the employees came back to work, they didn't want to come back to an office park.

2:10:07They want to come back to a campus, and TJX wants to take care of their employees.

2:10:12This year, they're celebrating their 50 year anniversary, and

2:10:16then next year is actually their 40 year of being TJX Corp.

2:10:20They broke off from Zier Corp in 1987.

2:10:24So again, very important, very important partner and neighbor that we have.

2:10:28We're lucky that we have them here in Framingham, and I'm working with their real estate division,

2:10:34as well as their council, to try to put forward zoning to allow them to expand.

2:10:39So that's a very important goal that we'd like to get accomplished in the next couple of months.

2:10:44And again, it's going to require the zoning needed so that to allow them to expand.

2:10:52And of course, everything that is allowed under here would be required by a special permit.

2:10:58So there would be control.

2:11:00I'm here tonight, this is just a presentation, but

2:11:02I can answer any development questions you guys may have.

2:11:06I know there was a question at the last meeting regarding opportunity zones.

2:11:10I think Councilor Madam Feeney had questions regarding the opportunity zones.

2:11:15An application was sent into the state, and we're waiting to hear back on opportunity zones.

2:11:21And we're working right now with Jax Abbey.

2:11:25Jax Abbey would like to expand, and I'm working with that business right now to help them expand in their current location.

2:11:33Thank you, Mr. Chairman, and thank you, Mr. Sarkeesian, for the presentation.

2:11:42That's good information, good to see things are moving forward.

2:11:45And I was actually going to ask you about Sierra, but you gave us that information.

2:11:50Regarding Waverly Street, we've already drafted zoning regulations for Waverly Street.

2:11:56It's actually good that you have the corridor.

2:12:00So the Planning and Zoning Subcommittee met on that last night, and we discussed it as a preliminary starting point.

2:12:08So I hope we don't have duplication of efforts here, because that is the function of planning and zoning.

2:12:15So again, the other thing is on the Golden Triangle, that plan goes back to about 10 years ago when that came to fruition.

2:12:27So it's good to see that's moving forward.

2:12:30And for those who don't know, as Mr. Sarkeesian stated, TJX is probably one of our biggest taxpayers in Framingham.

2:12:38And it's good to see that they continue to expand in Framingham and work with their Shoppers World and Golden Triangle plan.

2:12:49Because that plan that he showed you is what I sat through many of those meetings when I was the chair of the Planning Board way back when.

2:12:58And it's good, again, to see that come into fruition, a lot of these things moving forward.

2:13:03So I would just urge Mr. Sarkeesian, if you come to our meetings or the Planning Board, whoever, because we already have drafted.

2:13:13Pretty much what you've articulated on Waverly Street is what I've drafted into the provisions for zoning for that corridor.

2:13:23Because that's what I've heard from everybody on that side of town, is that they don't want tall buildings.

2:13:30They want more residential mixed-use type of development that fits into that corridor, exactly where you have outlined.

2:13:40So thank you for that.

2:13:41Okay, Mr. Aviani, then Mr. Cannon.

2:13:46Thank you for that presentation.

2:13:48I know how important housing is.

2:13:50But when we talk about economic development, 40 Hall Street, you know, Daniel's Table, you know, I was, we got it to it.

2:13:57We were all invited yesterday.

2:13:58We all were invited.

2:13:59We got it toward Daniel's Table.

2:14:01They were supposed to have some type of opening.

2:14:03They served lunch and the whole nine yards.

2:14:05And it's spectacular.

2:14:06It's absolutely spectacular what David and Alicia's wife envisioned and how it's turned out today.

2:14:14And with the help of Mr. Zamuto and that project and a lot of generous donors, it's absolutely magnificent.

2:14:19We met the new Assistant Executive Director yesterday.

2:14:22I want to say it's Damia or Mother Samia Doar.

2:14:27And it was very enlightening.

2:14:29But economic development, it's not just housing, okay?

2:14:32You know, the building down on Hall Street that's $20 million, we got vacant storefronts.

2:14:38Happy to hear about Ciabra.

2:14:39That's great news.

2:14:41You know, we brushed over the state.

2:14:43But we didn't change the zoning to make the variance requirement less restrictive.

2:14:49The state did that.

2:14:50You said that we kind of like we did.

2:14:52We did not.

2:14:54Question seven is a game changer.

2:14:57And also there's one called In God's Backyard, that's churches, synagogues.

2:15:03And what that's going to allow is a committee.

2:15:05And it's already gotten through all these committees.

2:15:07If you're a four-acre apostle with the frontage and you give the city 25% affordable,

2:15:13you can build 200 units on that four acres.

2:15:15So imagine if somebody had 20 or 30 acres and started cutting up four-acre apostles

2:15:19and did 200 units in every four acres.

2:15:21We're going to have thousands of apartments, thousands, okay?

2:15:25And that's what's coming.

2:15:26And nobody wants to admit what's coming.

2:15:27But it's coming, especially with this administration.

2:15:30The ADUs, we thoughtfully came up with a process for ADUs

2:15:34attached to the building above a garage, maybe in someone's lower level.

2:15:38In my district, I had somebody call me, a longtime constituent, couldn't believe what they saw.

2:15:44And that's the state.

2:15:45That's not Framingham, Massachusetts that did that.

2:15:47There's an ADU in their front lawn.

2:15:49It's not even the same color as the house.

2:15:51It's a 900-square-foot building plopped in the very front yard.

2:15:54And it's a game changer.

2:15:56And you're going to see those all over Framingham.

2:15:58Now, beauty's in the eye of the beholder.

2:16:00But I got to tell you, I don't think I'd want that plopped in the front of my house.

2:16:04It's just me.

2:16:05But everybody's got to do what they got to do.

2:16:07This ADU thing, you know, we had a contentious problem on Miller Avenue,

2:16:11Council Staff, and any Councilor Bryan.

2:16:13And those folks were working on this Miller app project.

2:16:15The house ended up being, I think, and we were told 7,000 feet.

2:16:18It's more like on Zillow, 4,000.

2:16:20But now they're re-habitizing this on Zillow and on MLS.

2:16:23Not buying this house with a built-in attached ADU for a million and a half dollars

2:16:28on Miller Avenue, I'll add.

2:16:30And it's across from the water, not on the water.

2:16:32Now they're advertising one unit for a million fifty exclusive of the ADU.

2:16:38Now, I didn't think you could sell off the ADUs.

2:16:41But then I've done a little research and reached out to some people.

2:16:43You know, you can actually conduit, is what I'm told.

2:16:46And I think Fred Braes made an opinion on this.

2:16:49You can conduit, the dirt's owned by, let's say, Miller Ave Homeowners Association.

2:16:56They sell off this for a million fifty.

2:16:58Now they got another 100 square foot ADU that they're going to sell off.

2:17:01I never thought that was what the intention was.

2:17:03And I've talked to people on the Planning and Zoning Subcommittee.

2:17:05We talked about it last night.

2:17:07And that's a concern if that's what can be done.

2:17:11I got a couple more notes here.

2:17:12The Waverly Street Project, you know, I stayed away from that because we were in a butter.

2:17:15But I have concerns when you approve 46 units and you only have 1.2 parking spaces per unit.

2:17:22And I don't care they have to go back to planning board and all these other places.

2:17:25That equates to like 50, 40, it's like 50 something spaces for 46 units.

2:17:31Those neighbors are going to go ballistic, okay?

2:17:32That's what's coming.

2:17:33You need, you know, six unit building we got approved.

2:17:37One per bedroom, 12 parking spaces, 12 bedrooms.

2:17:40That's a more realistic number.

2:17:42I know people don't want to hear it.

2:17:43But, you know, when you have a condo that's a one bedroom or two bedroom condo,

2:17:48I don't care where it is.

2:17:49And brand new, it's going to be 600,000.

2:17:51Some people might think that's affordable.

2:17:52Some people might not think it's affordable.

2:17:54But if you think only one person is going to live in that building or that unit, you're crazy.

2:17:57All right?

2:17:57They're going to be two or three people.

2:17:58They're all going to have cars.

2:17:59They're going to need a place to park.

2:18:01So I got concerns about this 1.25 per parking spot.

2:18:04You know, there's a number, but I don't know what it is.

2:18:06But that's something I think you need to look at.

2:18:07Excuse me, Phil.

2:18:09It's 1.25 in our current CB district.

2:18:12However, the new proposal is 1.3.

2:18:14No, it's 1.3.

2:18:15Okay.

2:18:16But 46 times 1.25, the project you referenced on Waverly Street

2:18:20is 57 and a half parking spots for 46 units.

2:18:2346 times 2 is 92.

2:18:24So if that project has only been approved, it has not gone back before the plan.

2:18:28No, I'm not going back.

2:18:29But these are just my notes from the thing.

2:18:31And I'm thrilled with what you're doing.

2:18:32But I think we need, the TGX is a game changer.

2:18:35We need more economic development on the commercial side.

2:18:39Because we all know our commercial tax rate is much higher.

2:18:41We've listened to our new CFO.

2:18:43We've listened to the mayor.

2:18:44We sat up here.

2:18:45We got lambasted over the schools, you know, looking for $15 million

2:18:48when we had $9 million in new revenue.

2:18:50We need to find new revenue.

2:18:51And housing doesn't equate to revenue, extra money.

2:18:56Okay.

2:18:58I respectfully disagree.

2:19:00Okay.

2:19:00Well, I'm going to respectfully disagree because Baiting Brook, those, I'm sorry.

2:19:05That's an over 55 community.

2:19:07Right.

2:19:07Those are the exception to the rule.

2:19:08All right.

2:19:09But also, you, Millwood.

2:19:11But now they all want their trash picked up.

2:19:12And they all want more things.

2:19:13So let's, let's call it what it is.

2:19:15So we'll leave it at that.

2:19:16But all good things happening.

2:19:18But Phil, there's going to come a day that we're going to need kids too.

2:19:21We need.

2:19:21Right.

2:19:22I didn't say we don't need kids.

2:19:23I'm just saying, but now they're going to say that you said I said I don't like kids.

2:19:26I got a kid.

2:19:27I love talking about this.

2:19:28This is a particular item.

2:19:29I'm done.

2:19:30Thanks.

2:19:30Sorry.

2:19:30Thank you.

2:19:31Ms. Brian.

2:19:34Thank you.

2:19:36Though, never mind.

2:19:37Just anyway.

2:19:38So, yeah, I like the simplicity of how it's very clear to understand the Waverly Street corridor

2:19:48and what the purpose is and what it will do.

2:19:52And the main thing is, again, keeping the height at a level that keeps the character

2:20:02and whatever beauty there is, it'll help enhance as opposed to the eyesore making

2:20:09more things out of out of not consistent and just becoming eyesores.

2:20:15Now the buildings with with the 1.3 or whatever we end up having parking.

2:20:23Is that off street parking?

2:20:26No, it has to be the parking for the residential has to be on the site.

2:20:33But the retail component or the commercial component on the first floor

2:20:37does not have a parking requirement.

2:20:40Okay, so the apartments will be on site and then the retail can be on the street or on site?

2:20:51Correct.

2:20:52Okay, on the street.

2:20:53Okay, so that's with that.

2:20:57And I just think I think that was a good working good base.

2:21:01Now, the I would say to the changes in the zoning bylaws,

2:21:06as changing hours to match the state.

2:21:09I think we need to consider not changing hours to match the state,

2:21:13as long as we are aware, our planning board and whatnot is aware of the state regulations

2:21:21and when we have to comply.

2:21:22But I also would say that this there's a lot of we can't do anything about it all the time.

2:21:29But I just want to remind people that this is the United States of America.

2:21:34Our democratic system gives the people the power to fight for change, right,

2:21:41not just at the local level in terms of voting at city level.

2:21:45But I think we have to encourage people to make concerted efforts effort at the state level.

2:21:52So that what they're doing gets pushed back in a kind of becomes a little more consistent,

2:22:02a little more give and take with our zoning bylaws to not just give in so easily.

2:22:09We I think that the people need to need to encourage and we ourselves as a council

2:22:16and the councils everywhere, towns and cities need to push for some input, push for the state

2:22:26to include, you know, the input, not just run roughshod over the work of our bylaws and whatnot

2:22:36and what what the different places where people are living have to do.

2:22:41Now, Hollis Street, I wanted to ask, it said this project includes

2:22:49constructing an addition to the fourth floor.

2:22:52What is the addition to the fourth floor?

2:22:54You can go up to four stories if the setback is over 100 feet from the street.

2:23:03So we would allow up to four stories.

2:23:05And the reason for that is because you're further away from the roadway.

2:23:09Is it that far away because it's pretty crowded in, right?

2:23:13Like it's like wall to wall to the other business structures next to it, isn't it?

2:23:18Or am I wrong?

2:23:19Well, it depends on where the where the 100 feet falls.

2:23:23But the concept is that the further you away from the street,

2:23:29we would allow you to go one more story.

2:23:31Now, we could put it further safeguards in that if you bought a residential property,

2:23:38you know, then, you know, your height limit could be limited to three.

2:23:42That's something that that's a very good point.

2:23:45Councilor Bryant, it's something that we can discuss when we have our public hearing

2:23:50and we can make amendments, you know, therefore, so.

2:23:53Okay.

2:23:54And then on the Franklin Street, 180 Franklin Street,

2:23:59it's six story multifamily residential.

2:24:02Can you remind me what exactly where is it going to be?

2:24:06Is it's not next to it's it's right. It's right. It's right next to the hospital.

2:24:15I don't know if you know where the hospital dumps.

2:24:17There's no on Franklin Street that open parking lot.

2:24:20It's right.

2:24:20Yes, the open parking lot.

2:24:22Oh, it's next to the open parking lot.

2:24:24I thought it might be I'm sorry, across from Tommy's taxi.

2:24:28Yeah, so okay, then that's fine.

2:24:30Okay, that that is fine there.

2:24:34And and 68 located below grade.

2:24:37I really liked that with the parking spaces there.

2:24:42The Union Avenue building, I will, you know, that I saw it.

2:24:47I looked at it and all that now the Pearl Street mixed use development.

2:24:52I guess my only question is so there's you know, there's a large parking lot, right?

2:25:00That the garage and the old the post office and churches,

2:25:07you know, they all have part of that the parking lot, right?

2:25:13Spaces or whatever.

2:25:14I know my church owns a big portion of that.

2:25:18And then there's parking for behind the post office and in front and all like that.

2:25:24So that parking lot that will still be as it is like, or how is it connected

2:25:34to the Pearl Street garage project?

2:25:39If I can answer that question.

2:25:41Yes.

2:25:42So the project across the street from the open parking lot across from the army and church

2:25:47that project is having difficulty constructing right now construction costs believe it or not,

2:25:53the numbers are almost $400,000 a unit.

2:25:56That's what it costs to build these multifamily projects right now.

2:26:00And then you get into interest rates where they are.

2:26:03And so they're having difficulty getting that project out of the ground.

2:26:07However, that whole Pearl Street quadrant,

2:26:09when it's turned over to the economic development committee,

2:26:14you know, looking to repurpose basically the garage or sell parking spaces from the garage.

2:26:19What that does is it enables the developer not have to build what they call podium construction.

2:26:24Now they can build construction.

2:26:26They can go slab on grade, build a housing.

2:26:29The parking garage is already built.

2:26:31So that asset that we have is going to now perform, be a performing asset.

2:26:36Right now we have basically almost an empty garage, not you being utilized at all.

2:26:41So that's what that will open up and it will allow them to negotiate,

2:26:45you know, better plans.

2:26:47And of course, all those plans that do get approved that EDC

2:26:50is working on has to come back to the city for a special permit.

2:26:54So it's not like they get a free, you know, they get a free pass.

2:26:57They still have to go through the review process.

2:27:00But that's what that does.

2:27:02Council of Ryan is it allows a developer to basically build a housing

2:27:06without having to build podium construction, which is very costly.

2:27:10Okay, great.

2:27:12And I just want to say the, um, the, uh, can we try to wrap it up

2:27:15just because a few other people have hands here.

2:27:18Yes.

2:27:18The goal, um, the golden triangle EA.

2:27:21And, um, I just want to say, I definitely agree with, um,

2:27:25console out of the, and I think it's been said before we've said it,

2:27:28we do need more commercial revenue too.

2:27:30Um, it's, it's more solid for towns.

2:27:34You have to have, um, a strong base there.

2:27:37I think that's a proven factor, whatever, and not just go just housing.

2:27:43But I think that, um, the ED, what, what is their new name?

2:27:46EDIC or it's longer than that now, but they are, um, working on that.

2:27:53So that would be great.

2:27:54And I just want to say the ways Zia Corp, TJX transitioned

2:27:59from Zia Corp into bigger and better.

2:28:01That is a good model for, um, you know, for stable, stable growth

2:28:08and, um, increased, um, assets and benefits and just prosperity.

2:28:13So I'm glad for all that.

2:28:15And thank you so much for this presentation.

2:28:17Thank you, Mr. Cannon and Mr. Stephanie.

2:28:19Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

2:28:20Thanks for the update, Sarkey and all the work.

2:28:22I agree, economic development more than housing.

2:28:24We talk about that.

2:28:25I know you're working on a number of things.

2:28:26I'm really blown away by the ADU number 22.

2:28:31You know, it is amazing to me that these things get to the legislature

2:28:34and they seem to pass almost unanimously.

2:28:37I know they will say that it's over the, the governor's office will say

2:28:41that's for affordable housing, but, you know, I think Councilor Adebayani is right.

2:28:46I think you can condominiumize those properties and there are really no restrictions.

2:28:50So what Framingham did years ago was very thoughtful, probably too restrictive,

2:28:55but it was very, very precise.

2:28:57And part of the goals that were articulated by the community was to make sure we didn't have this

2:29:01uncontrolled rollout of these, you know, basically many apartments, apartment businesses.

2:29:08So this kind of flies in the face of that.

2:29:10I hope we have some influence in the state because that's a lot in a very short amount of time.

2:29:16And there really are very little, little controls and you can market them for,

2:29:20you know, there's no limit on rent or anything like that.

2:29:24Question seven, people need to learn about that.

2:29:26Thanks for mentioning that.

2:29:27I will tell you, I'm very, I've been tough on the mayor tonight with some pointed questions,

2:29:34but I've been very impressed with something that you and he have been working on.

2:29:36You mentioned Hendler Family Brewing Company, formerly Jack's Abbey.

2:29:39They're much bigger now and they have a lot of businesses.

2:29:42And for a while, I didn't think it was a great relationship.

2:29:44I don't think Framingham having nothing to do with them was an easy place to do business.

2:29:49And that's a reputation that we cultivated over many years, but there was a celebration

2:29:54of their 15th anniversary as Jack's Abbey about a month ago.

2:29:57And when we were there, the mayor led a discussion proactively with the owners

2:30:02and the conversation was really, okay, what's next?

2:30:04What can we do to make it easier for you to grow?

2:30:07I don't want to put words in your mouth, but what can we make it easier?

2:30:11How can we make it easier for Framingham?

2:30:14How can Framingham make it easier for you to continue to grow and thrive

2:30:18in our community?

2:30:19And we never get the opportunity to have conversations like that.

2:30:22And they threw out a bunch of ideas, most of which when you have the mayor

2:30:26and members of the council and other folks that were there, pretty reasonable low-hanging fruit.

2:30:31And I've been watching sort of from the sidelines and I've been really impressed,

2:30:35Sarkey and Mr. Mayor, with the action steps that have taken place since that meeting.

2:30:41Because I think in a lot of communities and maybe Framingham of the past,

2:30:44it would have just been, oh, okay, great.

2:30:45Those are great ideas.

2:30:46But the action steps that came in immediately following have been really encouraging.

2:30:51And I know you're working on them.

2:30:53And I know there's some great stuff to happen.

2:30:55And I think it's work like that that changes the reputation that took us years and years

2:31:01and years to cultivate that no one in this room had anything to do with.

2:31:04And really show that Framingham can make things happen quickly and nimbly.

2:31:09So I'm really pleased by that.

2:31:10And when you talk about things like TJX and what they're doing,

2:31:13and they've been a great corporate citizen and a great partner for us,

2:31:17I feel really good about, you know, their asks are reasonable.

2:31:20And I feel really good about how we can make them happen.

2:31:23So that's really, really encouraging.

2:31:26And I'll leave it there.

2:31:27It's a longer conversation.

2:31:28But I thank you for the update.

2:31:30Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

2:31:31Mr. Stephanie.

2:31:32Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

2:31:33It's worth emphasizing the point I think that Mr. Artiviani made about commercial.

2:31:37I share Mr. Cannon's comments about Jack's Abbey.

2:31:40I think that's been a good dialogue.

2:31:42I don't think we're there yet.

2:31:43But I appreciate the effort that's gone on.

2:31:45The corporate master planning I think is a game changer in Boston

2:31:49and a couple of other communities.

2:31:52It can be here too for headquarters.

2:31:56I want to focus really on three quick things.

2:31:58The first is ADUs.

2:32:01You said something to me the other day,

2:32:03sorry, that I think is worth repeating,

2:32:04which is that the ADU units count against our 40B count.

2:32:10But we have about a 0.5% positive on that.

2:32:15That works out to be about 140 units.

2:32:17So you start doing 22 units.

2:32:20You're starting to chip away at that.

2:32:22I think, Mr. Mayor, you may want to incorporate

2:32:25or think about whether or not we encourage our legislative leadership

2:32:29to look at the unintended consequences of ADUs

2:32:32and whether or not we can find a way for that not to be counted against our 40B.

2:32:38Because if we fall below 50% and 40B,

2:32:42every 10%, everything we're talking about,

2:32:47you think question seven is a problem?

2:32:50Question seven opens up in every neighborhood,

2:32:52in every aspect of where we are,

2:32:54and it becomes a significant problem.

2:32:56So we need to find a solution to that before those 140 units fall away.

2:33:01And at a pace of 24 ADUs, that pace is coming.

2:33:05The condos of ADUs, I've looked into that as well.

2:33:09Other communities are finding it to be illegal.

2:33:12So we need to, Mr. Mayor, talk with the city solicitor

2:33:16and the building commissioner and reevaluate that.

2:33:21Because if we're condoizing ADUs, we're not turning them into ADUs.

2:33:24We're turning them into separate units that are owned separately.

2:33:27And that's not what the law intended.

2:33:29So if that's the case, we need to get to our legislators about that.

2:33:33But that's not the way other communities and other solicitors are interpreting this.

2:33:37And I think this is critical, we need to hear back on this like quickly.

2:33:41Because if not, we need to think about either home rule legislation

2:33:45or what we do to deal with that.

2:33:47Those two things could be game changers in a negative way in our community.

2:33:53Lastly, or two more things, sorry.

2:33:55The forced sale units at these, the council has pushed hard to get forced sale units,

2:34:00and we have a bunch of them.

2:34:02I'd appreciate, Mr. Sargi, anything you can do to help create visibility

2:34:06on the postings of those locally.

2:34:07So local families have a chance to those affordable units that are for sale.

2:34:12They're great units in each of these projects.

2:34:15There are only a few of them.

2:34:16We should maximize visibility around those so that we're getting folks

2:34:21that are involved, local municipal official, municipal employees,

2:34:27police officers, firefighters, whatever.

2:34:29They make too much money, all of that.

2:34:34I thought the qualification was like one time.

2:34:36What's the number, Sargi?

2:34:37A single is $94,000 a year at 80%, because we're based on Boston Metro.

2:34:44Right, so you're a new firefighter, a new police officer.

2:34:46You're under that.

2:34:47No, right.

2:34:49Well, you're talking about people that are first-time home buyers.

2:34:52The last issue is I want to thank you for the last literally four years

2:34:58working with Councilor Bryant and myself and the neighborhood groups.

2:35:01We will be submitting a proposal this week,

2:35:05a petition signed by neighbors for a Waverly Street overlay.

2:35:10It's not inconsistent with the thinking.

2:35:13But the neighbors and the groups have formally spent four years

2:35:18thinking through all of the details.

2:35:20Those details can't be lost in our planning process.

2:35:23And we have to have some level of respect for what neighborhoods think and feel

2:35:29relative to what is important for them.

2:35:32And it will get tweaked throughout the process and we'll deal with it.

2:35:36But the voices of the neighborhoods and the work

2:35:38that has gone into that over the last four years,

2:35:41through lots and lots of very large neighborhood and community meetings,

2:35:45has to get some high level of respect.

2:35:49And that's all I have.

2:35:50Thank you.

2:35:54So I also have a problem with the ADUs as well.

2:35:58And I had also spoken with, we brought this up

2:36:01in our planning and zoning meeting last night,

2:36:03because we had had people reach out to us about this

2:36:07and some of the other changes that are coming.

2:36:09And regardless of what people may think, we do have a housing shortage.

2:36:15And I know the state have been trying to find a way

2:36:19because apparently the cities aren't getting it done.

2:36:22So the state's stepping in and they're like,

2:36:24if you guys can't get your acts together with housing

2:36:28and infrastructure schools, whatever, we're going to step in.

2:36:33And it's been very clear that this is coming.

2:36:35And even if question seven doesn't pass, which I see no opposition at all,

2:36:41I have not seen one thing against this question.

2:36:45And even if it does fail, I know the state will find a way to get this zoning.

2:36:54And we have to be prepared for it.

2:36:57And I think that the points that were brought up about the ADUs are concerning,

2:37:02because when we did put this ADU law together in Framingham,

2:37:06we were kind of at the cutting edge.

2:37:08And I remember it was about a family with a disabled kid or an elderly parent,

2:37:15and it was a way to create housing for them.

2:37:19And then even if you wanted to have a rental,

2:37:22it was a way to get housing.

2:37:26And the unintended consequences were never three years later

2:37:31where you were finding out they were being condoed and individually sold

2:37:36with no guidelines with any of these housing laws that we have now.

2:37:42And it's those unintended consequences that we're going to be seeing this

2:37:46as this transpires and it is going to happen.

2:37:53And I do agree with John with his comments about finding a way to,

2:38:00either the home rule charter or to be proactive on this.

2:38:04Because this is something that we are going to see unintended consequences.

2:38:08And the last, I mean, I agree with many of the comments that were said here.

2:38:13And I do appreciate, Saki, all your work with this.

2:38:16And I like a lot of these progressive moving forward.

2:38:22I think it's great with the Spine Street.

2:38:25T.J. Maxx is absolutely, I love that they have Framingham as their home base

2:38:31and that they want to expand and that we're here to work with them.

2:38:37And I think it's great.

2:38:38But to the neighborhood points that had come up with some of these buildings,

2:38:45one of the other things that we hear,

2:38:47and I know that some of my other colleagues hear it as well,

2:38:50is the overflow parking when a building gets allowed

2:38:54or our apartments, you know, 30 apartments over here.

2:38:57And they have, you know, they don't have enough parking.

2:39:00So they park out all over the streets.

2:39:02They block the neighbors.

2:39:04All the side streets are clogged up and down with overflow parking

2:39:09from a lot of these condo, you know, apartment buildings.

2:39:13And we hear it.

2:39:14And again, it's one of those unintended consequences

2:39:18that we can't do anything about after the fact.

2:39:20So I think we really have to, you know, we talk a good game.

2:39:23And I know that we try to do the right thing.

2:39:26But at the early stages with the planning board,

2:39:28is when we have to make sure that we have reasonable parking.

2:39:32And, you know, this one point, you know, we know it's never going to happen

2:39:36because if it's a $600,000 two bedroom condo,

2:39:40you're not going to have one person living in there as a rule.

2:39:43We see people, you get a couple and then they take a friend in.

2:39:47And now you have three adults in a two bedroom with one parking space.

2:39:52So a 1.3 or whatever.

2:39:55It's just that the math doesn't really math.

2:39:57So I think the planning stages are when you can actually make these changes

2:40:03and make sure that we are protecting our neighborhoods.

2:40:05So I do want to thank you guys though for all the hard work.

2:40:08And that's just my thoughts.

2:40:11Thank you.

2:40:12Ms. Feeney.

2:40:13Thank you, Mr. Chair.

2:40:14Just really quick.

2:40:16And thank you for everyone who's still with us.

2:40:17I think this has been a great meeting.

2:40:20What I would like to see somewhere down the line

2:40:24is more of an update about the small businesses that have grown in Framingham.

2:40:29You and I this morning were at the Knobscott Pet Hospital in the new apartments there.

2:40:35And I think that's just wonderful.

2:40:37We have the brass tap.

2:40:38There's a card store that's going in.

2:40:40And the neighborhood's very excited for Cape Cod coffee.

2:40:44I'm not a coffee drinker and I'm still excited for it.

2:40:47So we talk about economic development and the business commercial side.

2:40:52I think there is a very good story that we can talk a little bit more

2:40:57about these small businesses that are moving in.

2:40:59But how are we attracting them?

2:41:00How are we supporting them?

2:41:02And basically, how does Framingham market itself to attracting more of these businesses?

2:41:07I would love and appreciate an update about that at some future meeting.

2:41:11Not immediately.

2:41:13And the last question is, is my favorite, has Pleasant Street been evaluated yet?

2:41:18Yes, I was hoping you'd ask that.

2:41:19Even though it's not on the agenda.

2:41:21Yes, we received the appraisal.

2:41:25Obviously, that's executive session number.

2:41:30And I plan on going before back to CPC and putting a plan together.

2:41:36Great.

2:41:37I appreciate it.

2:41:38And thank you.

2:41:40All right.

2:41:42I just have a very brief comment about the ADUs.

2:41:44I agree with what Mr. Viviani was saying.

2:41:47I've had a couple of you call me about those things,

2:41:49actually, that came up in the neighborhood.

2:41:51And the concern I have is what has been echoed here.

2:41:55Is that the legislature passes these laws with very little fanfare publicly,

2:42:01or at least not local recognition of it.

2:42:03And then all of a sudden, we're dealing with the problems with it.

2:42:06First of all, it was the MBTA zoning.

2:42:09It's the major thing they passed.

2:42:11And then we have to deal with it.

2:42:13And people down here yell at us about it,

2:42:16which I understand people's frustration too.

2:42:18But I mean, that's what happened.

2:42:20And I think people are going to be yelling at us again,

2:42:23because the one I think you were talking about,

2:42:25I think I know up in your neighborhood.

2:42:28I mean, that is crazy looking.

2:42:31And then there's another one that someone had called me about

2:42:34that people are very upset.

2:42:36I mean, it looks OK, but it's still not--

2:42:39and I've seen a couple that are pretty good.

2:42:42So I mean, it can work.

2:42:43But I don't think people understand what's coming with ADUs.

2:42:48They are going to be everywhere once people find--

2:42:50and if you can condimize them, that's crazy.

2:42:53I mean, I agree.

2:42:54It doesn't seem to make sense that you could do that,

2:42:56because it seems to be just contrary to what the purpose of them is.

2:43:01But anyways, so I think we need to keep an eye on that.

2:43:04And I think we need to keep an eye on the upcoming legislative changes,

2:43:07because if all these changes go through,

2:43:09I mean, it's going to be a lot different than people like.

2:43:14And it's just interesting.

2:43:18Ms. Long, do you still want to speak?

2:43:21Yes, I do, actually.

2:43:25I had a correction on something, and I just had one other comment.

2:43:29So as far as the comment that we don't have to comply with state law

2:43:34and re-codifying zoning, yes, we do.

2:43:37So we can't supersede state or conflict with state law,

2:43:41so we have to re-codify all these changes.

2:43:44And to your point, Mr. Chairman, House Bill, Senate Bill 3178,

2:43:51which is in the House of Representatives, it's a Senate bill in the House of Representatives.

2:43:56This is to allow two families and duplexes in single family,

2:44:00which would virtually eradicate single family districts.

2:44:04And to everybody's point that has made this point earlier,

2:44:08between the changes to the ZBA, which it goes back a few months.

2:44:12We already discussed that a while ago on planning and zoning.

2:44:16And then all these other changes that are coming down the pike,

2:44:20starting with MBTA, small house ordinance, ADUs, remove single family districts.

2:44:28You can build a house on a 5,000 square foot lot if that question seven goes through.

2:44:36Removing God's backyard.

2:44:39All these zoning chains are intended to create more housing,

2:44:44but they're trying to eradicate local control.

2:44:47And I've been talking about this for over a year or two years or three years.

2:44:51And they're coming to get your special permit.

2:44:53So if you think they're going to stop at this, the more they get NIMBY,

2:44:57the more they're going to find creative solutions to local control being removed,

2:45:02because that's what's been going on.

2:45:04And if you remember back in 2020, MBTA zoning, what a crisis we had over that.

2:45:10That's just the beginning.

2:45:11And that's the tip of the iceberg.

2:45:13So I do work for the state and I do work with the HLC.

2:45:17And I get the regular, you know, all the notifications.

2:45:20I'm also on a planners.

2:45:22I have all kinds of notifications again on what's coming down the pipe.

2:45:26So this is not going to be the end of it.

2:45:29If question seven does not pass, trust me, they will find another way to get around that.

2:45:34And you will see special permits going away because the language in question

2:45:38seven removes discretionary ability to do anything on a project.

2:45:45So it actually dumps the language down to Dover amendment.

2:45:48And we all know how much we love the Dover amendment.

2:45:51So that's what's coming.

2:45:53And those are my other comments on this.

2:45:55And one last thing I would like to see more commercial at, you know,

2:46:00emphasis on commercial development and less on residential,

2:46:04because I think we're going to get flooded with residential one way or another.

2:46:08And if you haven't driven around Metro West or in the Boston area,

2:46:11take around around Newton and Brookline and see what they're building.

2:46:15So if you think that Miller Abb is bad, just look at what Newton's doing,

2:46:18because they're doing that and on steroids in every single neighborhood tear downs.

2:46:24And those buildings are going up everywhere bigger than that.

2:46:27They're all black, they're all gray, and they're all flat roof.

2:46:31And there's no such thing as discretionary permits coming down the road.

2:46:35So just sending out the warning.

2:46:38So we have one member of the public who would like to speak on this.

2:46:42Go ahead, Ms. Craighead.

2:46:45Yes, actually, what I was going to say has kind of been changed.

2:46:47It was addressed by Sarkey and Mary Kate about the house, but I did on Pleasant Street.

2:46:54But I just didn't really want to say, I mean, we need housing, you know?

2:46:59And I don't know why people are so worried about condos.

2:47:02I mean, so, you know, they're not a bugaboo.

2:47:05So far, I've never had one show up my house trick-or-treating as a ghost.

2:47:09You know, I mean, I'm a real estate attorney.

2:47:12Having a condo doesn't change the basic structure of the property.

2:47:18And I just came back from Denver, where I will tell you that my neighborhood is so overrun.

2:47:25They call out there, they call it popping the top.

2:47:28There are beautiful, amazing houses out there on 5,000 square foot lots, 8,000 square foot lots.

2:47:36And they focus on common area spaces.

2:47:39You know, they focus on parks.

2:47:41They focus on making their streets, you know, safe.

2:47:45You know, we need housing.

2:47:47And I'm really tired of people talking about local control, you know, and worrying about,

2:47:55you know, condos, which aren't going to change anything.

2:48:00We need to work with our neighbors.

2:48:02We need to work with our community.

2:48:04We—and by that, I mean, you know, the whole Metro West area, because this is ridiculous.

2:48:13You know, we have plenty of space, and we need housing.

2:48:17You know, people of—including myself.

2:48:20I moved in here.

2:48:21My house is now worked three or four times what I paid for it 30 years ago.

2:48:26We need housing.

2:48:28We need to house our neighbors.

2:48:31We need to house the people coming in.

2:48:33We need to invite families.

2:48:35And we need to—more importantly is, like, how about if we work with the state about

2:48:41infrastructure?

2:48:42Because we can cab the housing if we have the infrastructure.

2:48:46Thank you.

2:48:49Okay.

2:48:52Ms. Bryan, is your hand up again?

2:48:55It is. I just wanted to state that I did not mean to imply that we don't have to comply

2:49:02with the state bylaws, and we don't have to codify with that.

2:49:07The point I was making is that I think that I'm trying to call people to arms to let us

2:49:15address the state at the state level first so that we don't have to have them—so that

2:49:20they will stop being so aggressive in superseding the bylaws that we have in place.

2:49:28Okay.

2:49:29Thank you.

2:49:30Thank you, Mr. Sakizin.

2:49:32So, Mr. Mayor, we have three more presentations.

2:49:36I mean, we still have an hour and 10 minutes if you really want to use it all.

2:49:40But I don't know how far we're going to get along.

2:49:43So do you want to try to get all three in?

2:49:44I'm just asking whether—or you want to—I understand.

2:49:49That's why I didn't want them not to sit.

2:49:50If we were going to—we might not be able to get to them all, is all I'm saying.

2:49:54Okay.

2:49:58You're next.

2:50:02Next.

2:50:03Sorry.

2:50:04I want to talk about Coach Sakizin.

2:50:09I'm sorry.

2:50:10I'm sorry.

2:50:10I missed a hand.

2:50:11I'm sorry.

2:50:12I apologize.

2:50:13I missed a hand.

2:50:14I don't know if it was the last time.

2:50:15Don't go anywhere yet, Mr. Sakizin.

2:50:20I'm sorry.

2:50:20I missed a hand.

2:50:22Elaine Murphy.

2:50:24Go ahead.

2:50:25Just really quickly, I'm really glad I tuned in tonight, and all of the comments have been

2:50:30really helpful.

2:50:32I just wanted to ask General—kind of a housekeeping question.

2:50:36When I'm looking at the screen, I can't see the counselor's names.

2:50:41So if you could set the zooming up a little bit differently next time we have a meeting,

2:50:44that would be great.

2:50:45Okay.

2:50:47Thank you.

2:50:47Appreciate it.

2:50:48Thank you, Mr. Sakizin.

2:50:50No, there's nobody else.

2:50:55All right.

2:50:57What's that?

2:50:58Yeah, well, there's no one else, so.

2:51:02Mr. Mayor.

2:51:04We're moving on to, I guess, number nine.

2:51:09ADA self-evaluation.

2:51:11Yeah, 19.

2:51:1219.

2:51:13Okay.

2:51:14Whatever.

2:51:20Great agenda.

2:51:22Okay.

2:51:22Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

2:51:23Thank you, Councillors.

2:51:24We'll try to be quick.

2:51:26Just quick introductions.

2:51:28I'm Megan Todd.

2:51:29I'm the Grants Manager for the City, and I have been involved—I've been lucky to

2:51:33be involved in the ADA self-evaluation and transition plan through seeking the funding

2:51:38and partnering with David Crea on the grant application, as well as selecting the vendor

2:51:44through a competitive bid, along with David and Jim Paolini.

2:51:47So Dave introduced himself.

2:51:49Hello.

2:51:51My name is David Crea.

2:51:52I'm the ADA Coordinator, and I knew when I first took the position of ADA Coordinator

2:51:58that the ADA transition plan was going to be the top goal.

2:52:02And I really realized that at my second day on my job, I had a meeting with the

2:52:06Disability Commission, and I was asked when I was going to get that done.

2:52:10So positive forward.

2:52:13So some of the things that we worked on, we assisted with the MOD Grant application

2:52:18process as part of the subject matter expert and selection of the vendor.

2:52:23Once the vendor was selected, I worked closely with surveyors to provide specifics about

2:52:31municipalities' own buildings and serving as a liaison between the city and the staff of the IHCD.

2:52:39And IHCD stands for the Institute of Human-Centered Design.

2:52:43Coming up soon, I would say in the next month or so, we'll be able to schedule them to

2:52:48come in and present their final work themselves.

2:52:52So just a tiny bit of background about the MOD Municipal Improvement Grant,

2:52:56the Mass Office on Disability annually offers this grant program.

2:53:01This is the first grant the city of Framingham has been awarded

2:53:05by MOD since the Pearl Street ramp at the library.

2:53:11I think that was around 2022, possibly.

2:53:13It was before my time with the city.

2:53:16So we were lucky to have a great partnership with MOD through this grant process.

2:53:20They knew full well that we were going to be coming to them to fully fund our

2:53:25self-evaluation and transition plan.

2:53:27It's been a while in the making, and they were very happy to see us be prepared to do that.

2:53:33We were also lucky that through our competitive bid process,

2:53:38we received the full amount of the grant for $250,000,

2:53:43but we were able to select IHCD, which came in with a proposal at $220,000,

2:53:48and do everything we needed and were hoping for and have been wonderful to work with,

2:53:54and that means more funding is available for future cycles that hopefully we'll have access to.

2:54:00So I'm going to hand it over to Dave quickly just to run through what

2:54:03our vendor did on the ground in Framingham and what they were able to accomplish.

2:54:08Thank you.

2:54:10They did access survey on every municipality-owned building as well as every school building.

2:54:15This included police and fire, parking lots, GIS, survey of streets, sidewalks and curb cuts.

2:54:23We also asked when they were doing the sidewalks and curb cuts,

2:54:26we requested folks pay attention on the sidewalks and curb cuts

2:54:29within a quarter mile of the schools and public facilities.

2:54:33Surveys of the staff, disability commissioners, and counseling on aging members.

2:54:38They also reviewed digital and web accessibility.

2:54:45They reviewed the policies, procedures, and activities for ADA compliance.

2:54:52I was able to accompany them, the team, for the beginning of most of the survey days,

2:55:00introducing them to staff, answering questions, and they had about the buildings in access.

2:55:06As you can see from the draft, the IACD team was very thorough and you'll be able to see that.

2:55:14Yeah, so we just wanted to offer a glimpse of what you will see in totality when you receive

2:55:19the full self-evaluation and transition plan.

2:55:22It's going to be a lot to take in.

2:55:25So we wanted to give you a little glimpse, but we will receive one of these self-evaluation

2:55:31pieces for every single building Framingham owns, including every school building.

2:55:37It gives background on the building.

2:55:38It prioritizes key accessibility issues for every building and with pictures,

2:55:46gives us a table and cost estimates of everything that they assessed that

2:55:54needs to be addressed as far as ADA or state compliance.

2:56:00And I would just welcome you to look at this when you receive the final report and when IACD's

2:56:07team does come to present to council, this is a long-term planning tool.

2:56:12It's really going to highlight for the city what we need to incorporate moving into future

2:56:17capital planning cycles and what we can be looking for grants to fund.

2:56:21And already, I just received a final confirmation and contracting information

2:56:28for a $100,000 grant from the state legislature

2:56:35to address accessibility needs for the city.

2:56:37So we'll be able to get started right away and hit the ground running.

2:56:40So there's an idea of what's coming and where we are with this process.

2:56:46Well, thank you so much.

2:56:47I guess George is gone.

2:56:49So here I am.

2:56:51Thank you guys both for that.

2:56:54Anybody, any questions?

2:56:55Councillor? May I take Pini? Thank you very much, Councillor Janet Limbruno.

2:57:01What do I say?

2:57:02I'm like, I'm not used to this up here.

2:57:04It's a lot of stress and pressure.

2:57:07Thank you both for being here, especially at the late hour.

2:57:10Just a few questions so that I can just kind of grasp.

2:57:15This sounds fabulous.

2:57:19Is it just buildings and structures?

2:57:22Or is it also looking at, say, you know, making our meetings more accessible?

2:57:28One of the things like that I wrote to earlier this year,

2:57:32I wrote to some of my colleagues about how we can have our language

2:57:37meetings in translating to languages, but also for sign language,

2:57:40which as we know, the school committee does.

2:57:43So is that something we would look for in the recommendations in this plan?

2:57:48Yes.

2:57:48So this was a very comprehensive self-evaluation.

2:57:52We wanted to give you a look at what you're going to receive for buildings,

2:57:54but they also assessed our digital footprint, our website accessibility,

2:58:00our policies, procedures and activities citywide.

2:58:05And there's a part of the report will be specifically on that as well.

2:58:10So and they did look at parking lots.

2:58:13They studied GIS to look at the sidewalks and curb cuts

2:58:16and access throughout the city from that perspective.

2:58:20So it really is very comprehensive.

2:58:23It's beyond just physical accessibility.

2:58:25It's more than that.

2:58:27And we did specifically during this process,

2:58:30we had we'd started having some conversations around closed captioning

2:58:33and sign language interpretation for meetings.

2:58:36So they knew that conversation was happening.

2:58:39So it might fold into their report as well,

2:58:41because we definitely had those conversations when it was happening at the time.

2:58:46So, yeah, you can look for a pretty wide array.

2:58:49It's really in depth.

2:58:51They cover everything about access, everything.

2:58:53Great. I look forward to it.

2:58:55Just picture City Hall and what how much time we spent here alone.

2:58:58Oh, you know, it's an old building.

2:59:00I can imagine.

2:59:01Well, I think you both I look forward to reading it.

2:59:03And especially, I think we really need to move quickly

2:59:07on more about accessibility with these meetings.

2:59:09So thank you very much.

2:59:11I appreciate it.

2:59:12Thank you.

2:59:14And you put some else online.

2:59:19So Mike's next and then I was going to raise my own hands.

2:59:24Thank you, Mr. Chairman.

2:59:30Thank you both.

2:59:31This has been you both inherited a really complicated situation in the city

2:59:35and a really complicated relationship that the community had had

2:59:39for a number of years with our commitment to accessibility.

2:59:42I think we were best in class for a number of years.

2:59:45And I would pay a great compliment for that work

2:59:50due to the legacy of the sister of the woman to my left here.

2:59:54And for a long time, it was transformational for our community.

2:59:58We lost our way.

3:00:00point following her passing and I think the closest thing that could have happened for us to regain

3:00:04the traction and the commitment that we had was the the collaboration uh that the mayor put together

3:00:10with the two of you David coming on board Dr Todd with the work that you do um and certainly your

3:00:15experience on the disability commission when you when you you know one of the myriad hats uh that

3:00:20you wear um because it a lot of communities when they talk about the things like the transition

3:00:25plan which has been the law of the land for 37 years thereabouts um it's like how do we find

3:00:31compliance how do we check the box how do we meet the minimum threshold and how you have restored

3:00:36our conversation and framing him to being meaningfully accessible how can we best serve

3:00:41our community the things that we're not thinking about and talking about and for a while we went

3:00:46back I felt to well you don't need to do this if you're not doing this and if you go over this

3:00:50you have to do this now we're talking about the thoughtful planning again and it makes such an

3:00:55incredible difference to so many members of the community and I'm just grateful for the work and

3:01:01we didn't celebrate that um that grant that you got that the MoD grant we didn't have a great

3:01:06relationship with MoD for a while the mass office and disability you've restored that

3:01:10the interest of the lateness of the hour I will keep my comments there uh but the council I'm

3:01:15sure speaking for my colleagues which I don't usually do was eager to help in the continued

3:01:18partnership that you have for all members of our community thank you thank you Mr. Chairman

3:01:23thank you I also everything Mike said um and I am thinking of my sister and I just

3:01:31I sent you guys the photo so on Karen's list so Karen had a list Karen always had a list so she

3:01:38started the disability commission it's a short story and I know most of you already know it but

3:01:42she was just a girl that couldn't get in places and she went to Cameron Middle School and they

3:01:49couldn't get to classes so my mom asked if she could use the um elevator and the principal said

3:01:55it was a burden and burdensome and you can't so she ended up falling down the stairs she never

3:02:00walked again she was born with um she got it at two jra juvenile rheumatoid arthritis

3:02:06and what did my parents do you know did they sue the school no did they you know make a fuss no

3:02:11they just carried on and my dad joined the school committee and Karen a few years later

3:02:17joined started this disability commission and every time a window shot or a door she always

3:02:23found a way to get in and now they named the after she passed away they did name the um

3:02:30Cameron Middle School auditorium in her name so it was really nice and one of the other

3:02:36things on her list she had a whole list she's got 20 things after she passed away we found this

3:02:41list and it's on two like spiral notebooks and number two on the list i sent it to you is the

3:02:48self-eval plan and that was in 2005 so a lot of things were on this list loin arena village hall

3:02:55which she couldn't get married at because she couldn't get upstairs they named the village

3:03:01hall ballroom after her because of all her work and it was never about her it was always about

3:03:06when she wasn't here who was going to be able to carry on what she started and she was just a girl

3:03:11that wanted to get into a place that she couldn't get into so to have you guys carry this on and

3:03:18it takes a lot of years and i know the mayor you've done a lot you know but it's never enough

3:03:22and it's never it's always takes so long to get anything done and you know it just it took Karen

3:03:28forever but what did she do she waited she was patient and she carried this list around with

3:03:33her and when you look at the list now almost everything's done so the self-eval and it says

3:03:38self-eval 2005 and it was Karen's list that she had and she would be pleased and uh we're just

3:03:46happy to see that her legacy that really is not about her it was never about her it was always

3:03:51about the people that didn't have the voice to get in and thank you guys for having the voice

3:03:56and for the disability commission to keep you know finding a window when it keeps getting shot

3:04:02and i just want to thank everybody for the work on this and carry on good things ahead thank you

3:04:09thank you all right anything else on this item don't see anything i'm sorry miss prion

3:04:21just to quickly say that also there are so many more people that either have a disability or need

3:04:30these services need these these changes to be made so thank you on behalf of the seen and the

3:04:39unseen people that have disabilities or need these services but they're not usually recognized

3:04:50by the general public but they can avail themselves of the work you do now anyway thank you take a

3:05:00motion to continue after ten o'clock i'll move second okay all those in favor of miss malek yes

3:05:08yes yes yes there's treats up there mr correa yes yes just long yes miss bryant yes it's ten

3:05:21in favor zero pause uh three mr chair so tonight in discussion with the mayor we thought it would

3:05:54be a good time to just give a an overview of a high level not getting into exact means and methods

3:06:01and how we prepare for cyber security given the fact that there were two recent incidents one in

3:06:06spring field that caused a lot of disruption in the school and one in a smaller community in um

3:06:13out towards woster and Sutton so we thought it would be a good idea with us we have uh carly

3:06:19mellow the tech services director who will kind of take us through a high level discussion on

3:06:23what we're doing how we're preparing without getting again into the exact means and methods

3:06:29of doing it but recognizing that it's an important and critical um subject for the operation of the

3:06:35backbone of the computer systems that we maintain and then we have Justin Avara with us who is a um

3:06:41works in technology services who's been doing a lot of work on ai as everybody knows it's

3:06:46dominating a lot of the conversations municipalities have been kind of struggling to figure out how to

3:06:51implement it and really the underpinning of implementation um and a lot of what we've

3:06:55learned is really a roll out of a policy that makes sense and allows us to um use it in a

3:07:02meaningful way for efficiencies and for work um that we do so i will turn it over to carly first

3:07:08and then justin and if the council has any questions we're all here and happy to answer

3:07:12them so carly good evening thanks for having us in um so high level cyber security preparedness

3:07:20is what i'm going to address um it all begins with end-user end-user training and phishing

3:07:26tests which we do on a monthly basis right so um we call them human firewalls so our employees

3:07:31are the first you know line of defense emails come in phishing spam um so employee training

3:07:39is one of our or you know we stress it a lot because we want them to be the first um the

3:07:45first stopping point um we have something called data loss prevention software and what this does

3:07:51is it watches the network um and it reports on any abnormal and that could include mass

3:07:57deleting files it could include excessive accessing devices that you know a normal user

3:08:02wouldn't access um multiple login attempts using the the wrong password and and locking users um

3:08:10we have something called edr which is endpoint detection and response this is most commonly known

3:08:14as anti-virus so this monitors all incoming and outgoing traffic on all network devices

3:08:22the next line is uh line of defense is idps which is intrusion detection and prevention systems

3:08:28so this combined with firewalls um this provides advanced layered network security by screening

3:08:34traffic coming in and out of our network um and it it inspects the packets of information as it

3:08:39comes in and out um to look for those abnormalities um staff resources is is huge in cyber security

3:08:49our city employees in the technology department are continuously monitoring network activity

3:08:54reacting to um to threats ensuring that our devices are up to date and patched um we have

3:09:00security partners that provide 24 by 7 monitoring um and response and all critical network resources

3:09:09we do have an comprehensive incident response plan that we worked on last year and we continue to

3:09:17collaborate with school technology because you know they're dealing with the same issues that

3:09:20we're dealing with um so we we talk to the school director multiple times a month about what we're

3:09:27doing what they're doing and you know the areas that we can collaborate on um and on top of all

3:09:32the traditional security threats now there's ai threats right so these agents that are just

3:09:38you know spamming networks and just looking for for ways in um it's it's an ever-changing um

3:09:45environment landscape and it's one that you know we do our best to to prepare on you know on every

3:09:53level um that's kind of a high level you know obviously we can't go into details because

3:10:00in a public forum that's kind of against cyber security so that kind of leads to the ai discussion

3:10:06which brian led into um so we we do have a draft ai policy that we're we're very close to rolling

3:10:13out and what it will do is kind of put guardrails um so for enterprise level ai there's two pricing

3:10:21models there's the licensed model and then there's the consumption model um subscription based and

3:10:28usage based so we are implementing microsoft 365 and with that rollout it includes um co-pilot chat

3:10:37at no cost so we're we're planning on rolling that out as our enterprise-wide um ai tool for now

3:10:46because there's no there's no additional cost so some of the benefits include the no additional

3:10:51cost we have more control over data governance and access and security controls and then as we

3:10:59continue to learn the use case and we work with our users on the ai guidelines and policies

3:11:05we can discuss adding other ai tools that are more specific to um to you know to a user's

3:11:12requirements whether it's you know analyzing large data sets um that's just one example of

3:11:18you know a specific ai model now i'm going to pass it over to justin um justin is my newest

3:11:24employee he's been here since january um he came to us from the private sector and he is a software

3:11:30developer by trade so he has been instrumental in a lot of the new developments that we've had

3:11:35including um the you know transparency portal um so we're very lucky to have him and he is

3:11:41going to address some of the the ai information hi well that's way too close well sorry thank you

3:11:49thank you yeah sorry sorry i don't speak i'm a software developer by trade we stay in the

3:11:54basement so um yes i've done software development for almost a decade um so large language models

3:12:02or ai as they're known is are very different so i want to go through kind of what traditional

3:12:07software is which we call deterministic so at 10 p.m at night if you want to think back to your

3:12:13high school algebra okay give you i know if you have a function that adds two numbers together

3:12:19you'll always get the same output given the same input that's called deterministic so most software

3:12:24consumer grade software is deterministic and most things we do are deterministic you press the gas

3:12:29on your car you don't expect it to break and vice versa um large language models or ai as

3:12:36they're commonly known are basically big statistics models under the hood they're what's called

3:12:40probabilistic so you could give it the same input and you might get the same output you may not it

3:12:46may make things up which is called the hallucination and the to the colloquial term so there are things

3:12:54that traditional software is very bad at that ai is large language models are very good at for

3:12:59example if you take a picture of a tree and you say what kind of tree is this it's probably going

3:13:04to give you the right answer i did that in my house traditional software is very bad at that

3:13:08because these statistical models are good at pattern recognition they can look at sort of

3:13:13the leaves and compare it to the data it's been trained on and give you with the good enough

3:13:18confidence interval what it thinks is the right answer so anytime there's a new and shiny hammer

3:13:25everything looks like a nail so figuring out what the right use case for this is compared

3:13:29to traditional software is is going to be part of the challenge and that's part of development

3:13:33of the policy um and let's see security controls um there's also you may have read in the news

3:13:46there's another side of ai which is called agentic or agents ai which would be autonomous

3:13:51so these are things that they tell the dude they tell or they ask them to do things and instead

3:13:57of it being confined to like a chat window where it just returns data back to you it actually goes

3:14:01out and does things like it tries to hack the federal government which i think happened fairly

3:14:07recently that kind of stuff i i can't speak to exactly what the policy is my recommendation

3:14:12is we don't allow that here we would want to focus more on just the sort of data um the chat

3:14:18side of it for now and figure out is the utility being balanced against the risk um because we

3:14:23don't want something like that running wild internally um and then there's user education

3:14:31for it so with traditional search and as as you've probably noticed with going to google they give

3:14:36you ai overviews now whereas before google was a was a website aggregator now it's sort of

3:14:43scanning the entirety of what it's trained on in the internet to give you an overview of what it

3:14:48thinks it wants you to be the answer of or it thinks is the answer to your query um because

3:14:55of the nature that it's a probability model sometimes it will give you completely incorrect

3:14:59information very confidently which are hallucinations so compared to traditional

3:15:04search it's kind of like the old wikipedia adage where they tell kids in school don't

3:15:09believe everything read on wikipedia because anyone can edit it you got to go to the primary

3:15:12sources so there's a balance there too and there's going to be a lot of user training

3:15:16most users are not used to working with statistics models they're used to working

3:15:21with deterministic software once i prove it works it will always work and i can trust it

3:15:26this stuff's a little bit different and requires a little bit of a different view uh so that's it

3:15:33that's what i got okay are there any questions here this feeling thank you mr chair thank you

3:15:42both again being here at ten um so i i use ai i have a fair amount of experience with it um my

3:15:51dad is also a retired software engineer so i could speak the language a little bit so yeah i all

3:15:55know about deterministic um but just a couple of questions uh about how the city is using ai right

3:16:03now are we using ai and how is it being used in the city right now so we don't restrict right now

3:16:12um when we roll out microsoft 365 is when we're going to kind of discuss with our users we know

3:16:20ai is in use um the users that we've talked to about it generally use the chat right help me

3:16:25rewrite this email so that you know a non-tech person can understand it help me rewrite this

3:16:30policy um so that it's it's you know it's better it's fancier so the way that we know

3:16:38our users are using ai is in that way they're using the chat feature um they're using it you

3:16:44know for some um data analysis um that that's all we know right now that they're using it for

3:16:53and there's there's no one that's come to us and said we need a larger ai model to do xyz

3:16:59do you have an inventory of all the tools that are used like is chat gpt more used overclock

3:17:08gemini what are we we're actually building that now right so as we're part of the guidelines that

3:17:12we're we're creating we are building that inventory because we want to know what users

3:17:17are using before we um discuss not taking them away but limiting limiting access to them um

3:17:25so i'm glad to hear that you're working on a policy are you have you been looking at other

3:17:29policies from other municipalities my understanding is boston is like the gold standard um we have

3:17:35reached out to a number of communities and i i've kind of culled some of those um policies together

3:17:41and used some of their best practice and their language and actually the state is a is a great

3:17:46resource too for for policies yeah and so again i'm just reading off my own questions here um but

3:17:53what what guardrails do you think you'll have in this policy to prevent staff from

3:17:58inputting non-public you know constituent data the personnel files all the sensitive things

3:18:04that government has so that goes along with the training right and our microsoft 365 environment

3:18:10is in the government cloud um so we are um a closed environment so that what we'll be using

3:18:18through um through copilot will not be used to train other um other ai model sorry my brain's

3:18:26not brainy right now it's okay it's 10 18 um i could talk about this all night but uh

3:18:34how are you evaluating ai features that are bundled in existing municipal software like i

3:18:39know open gov i mean has all sorts of fun things that you can do what's that what does that look

3:18:45like so right we actually just formed a steering committee so it's the steering committee that

3:18:50we're hoping will look at new features new software to determine whether we utilize them

3:18:56or don't utilize them um again end user training is going to be critical in the proper use of this

3:19:03because generally speaking ai is not turned on by default in any application

3:19:07sure you have to you know you have to approve that um so we want to work on educating our

3:19:12users before we turn on the ai features um and just my last question is is there any conversation

3:19:22about a strict like how strategically the city could use ai moving forward besides making our

3:19:28emails sound good yes because we know how powerful it is but you know it goes hand in hand with

3:19:33security is we want to enable our users to use ai to help them you know be more productive

3:19:39employees with the understanding that there has to be guardrails and you know what they can and

3:19:44cannot use ai for and including you know um language that if they do a use ai to generate

3:19:53information there they have to note that it's ai generated um so that's all going to be addressed in

3:19:59the guidelines and policy that that we yeah i guess you know i i think because it opens up

3:20:05so much possibility so i was more looking at maybe you know how dpw could be using ai with

3:20:12you know analysis analysis with road conditions or all the things that dpw does i mean and you

3:20:19know what uh procurement can do like you know there's just so much potential so i didn't know

3:20:24if we had already thought through some potential ideas um moving forward so we're starting to have

3:20:30those conversations now with our departments um we're doing a very slow um thoughtful approach

3:20:37to rolling out you know city-wide ai use um so we're having those conversations um yeah and i

3:20:48guess my last thing was i hope that we put also uh we state very clearly that a employees are

3:20:56responsible for double checking their work when it comes to that and be um you know that we have

3:21:04a public transparent a registry or whatever um that says the materials and what we're doing

3:21:12and that you know that these generative algorithms are being used in the city so that people are

3:21:17aware about data um and you know if anything i could do as a counselor in this conversation i'd

3:21:23be very interested as well but so thank you very much thank you too thank you mr chairman thank you

3:21:28both for all the work and the latest of the hour i i was hoping to hear some tonight about a couple

3:21:34of the things that councilor fini had referenced things like well dpw is currently employing it to

3:21:41analyze water main breaks over the last x years and identify that in the nine months leading up

3:21:47to a unexpected break we saw this sign which was noted and just sort of assembling i see a lot of

3:21:53opportunity for our unit for municipalities to look back at history to be proactive on some

3:21:58things in the future that ultimately hope hopefully save some money i'm not hearing a

3:22:03lot of that now so we may be a little bit more um behind than i had uh thought i have a lot of

3:22:10concerns about some of the things that you kind of touched on um somewhat casually if our users

3:22:17in the service to the public are using tools various ai clients to write constituent emails

3:22:25respond to internal i mean it is just so easy for someone to fall in love with whatever you're

3:22:31being fed back in those ai models say it was such confidence and i've seen it too i mean i can spot

3:22:37usually uh something that's been written with ai and if one little tiny thing is wrong you know

3:22:43you're you're way way off and so often you know no one's double checking that i mean maybe you can

3:22:49push back and claud will politely tell you you know you were right to push back on that but once

3:22:54you've become so reliant on it bad things happen so i really i'm glad to hear there's a steering

3:23:00committee tell me more about that who's on it what's the model for it being transparent to

3:23:04the public under you know at the end of the day we're a public entity and service to the community

3:23:09so um tell me more about this steering committee so that was today was our inaugural meeting and

3:23:18it's we're learning as we go we don't have a a set charter yet we have a draft charter

3:23:23um that that's all i have like it it's it's brand new um the departments have provided

3:23:32uh one member at least one member from each department to just kind of start get it started

3:23:37and figure out um the best way that it will service the city so who is on it and when is

3:23:43their next meeting i would love to attend um and i'm sure the public would love to tune in

3:23:48we have not decided when the next meeting is yet um and there were about 15 members from different

3:23:55departments that attended today okay um i'd loved if you could share with us exactly who's

3:24:02on it what the agenda was i'm sure there were minutes taken the more public the municipality

3:24:07can be whenever ai is the subject matter will save us a lot of um distrust i hope in the future

3:24:15if we're hoping that this is just going to be a quiet conference room with internal staff and

3:24:19we're not going to be open to the public transparent i would not have known that this

3:24:24existed had you not mentioned it tonight i don't know if it's published elsewhere if it was in a

3:24:28newsletter if it was in i mean we should be communicating with the public on this is because

3:24:32the public wants to know what what how is our how is my community using ai or thinking about ai

3:24:38so let me just clarify it's not an ai steering committee it is what's the name of it it's it's

3:24:44the technology steering technology steering committee it was a recommendation of the

3:24:49technology audit that we had done um about a year ago that they recommended a technology steering

3:24:54committee to discuss city-wide technology it's not just for ai okay it's just a topic that will

3:25:00be discussed but it's not just designated for ai so who from the city council is in attendance today

3:25:07no one again we just started we just had the first meeting today and um i wasn't we hadn't

3:25:14really determined if it was in internal and externally it's just city departments at this

3:25:18point was the um at the police department the public information office it's a different title

3:25:24over there but was that individual in attendance um i don't know who that is there's um or even the

3:25:31pio um i'm hopeful i'm just trying to get a sense of who this can't be an isolated dialogue

3:25:38because that's the problem that we have now our technology we have this in the in the the website

3:25:43right now if you if you work for the city and you use laser fish it's a really good comprehensive

3:25:49system but we've been to you know interiorly focused that's not a word but it's 1025 um uh

3:25:58so the more it's just interesting that's why i'm trying to get a sense of who is at this meeting

3:26:02um because someone from the council should be there that's elected by the public i would

3:26:08imagine this public information officer is an important person to have in the room probably

3:26:12the citizen's participation officer the diversity equity i mean were any of these folks there today

3:26:20yep there was a number of people so the the division heads were asked to provide at least

3:26:25one person per department to come to the first meeting so that we could discuss how this steering

3:26:32committee is going to to work moving forward so there was probably one person from most departments

3:26:38that came not every department was there bless god bless you what departments chose not to

3:26:45participate today just out of curiosity um i don't know i'd have to go back and look at the we took

3:26:51on attendance i don't know at the top of my head is anybody that i've mentioned tonight not been

3:26:56what was not there this is really important i'm not trying to be difficult i just

3:27:00we have where we have had the most difficult with technology is in service to the public

3:27:05so i want to make sure the folks that are coming to the meeting are that we're going out of our

3:27:09way to include the people that have the most public interaction as part of their jobs so

3:27:14that's why i was the public information officer for example no she was not there the citizen

3:27:19participation officer was there was the pio invited um she was not the member of the mayor's

3:27:27staff that was so let's make sure give some thought into the i'll leave it here mr chairman

3:27:31but let's give some thought to some of the comments anytime technology comes up um every

3:27:36budget cycle every year someone sometimes it's me sometimes it's somebody else sometimes it's

3:27:40multiple people talk about how can we use technology better in service to the public um and

3:27:47i think we've fallen where we have not done as good of a job as we can is by having it just be

3:27:54an internally focused discussion so the more folks that we're talking to that deal with the

3:27:59public not one but you know that's going to be really important we're going to miss the mark

3:28:04otherwise and there's plenty of data in our history to point to that so i would love a

3:28:08follow-up in the coming days who was at the meeting what the minutes were what was the

3:28:12what the goals are i'd love to learn more about that because it sounds like you're addressing a

3:28:16lot of the things which is great a lot of the things that come up in our finance meetings and

3:28:20throughout the year um if that's the case i think that's terrific i just love to learn more about

3:28:24it mostly so i can say thank you this is exactly what we've been talking about fair enough thank

3:28:29you very much thank you mr chairman you want to say something i just want to follow up with

3:28:33one comment through you mr chair i mean having had a technology steering committee in my prior

3:28:37communities one of the prime focus is it's a vetting solution for because every department

3:28:43comes up with new software that they want to use and i certainly counselor cannon understand

3:28:47your points about the interface with the public the one of the prime charges of the technology

3:28:53steering committee really is for it's the location for a department that thinks they

3:28:58need a new piece of software to go through and it goes to a technology steering committee to

3:29:03determine the utility of whether it's a single department that needs it or whether there's more

3:29:07utility in service to the public and to internal customers itself so it's really um i don't

3:29:14envision a scenario where that is solely focused and i it's always typically they've started and

3:29:20morphed over the time but their typical focus is on the inventory of software that's used

3:29:25the utility it's used in and requests for new software typically are always filtered through

3:29:30in a discussion through there and i as as carly did mention um the citizen participation

3:29:35officer was there there was at least two members from health department um dpw had representatives

3:29:40the clerk's office had representatives i was there so there was a good representative there was

3:29:46and it may not have fit in everybody's schedule but the email did ask for every department to at

3:29:50least have one person available to be on this committee and represent their department through

3:29:55this process i appreciate that one quick follow-up mr chairman the um a couple things that have

3:30:00happened today and i'm delighted that we talked a lot about end user training because i think

3:30:04that's important it sounds like we learned a lot from the very painful rollout of the

3:30:08permitting software which there was basically here it is and very little training now aside

3:30:13from that being frustrating in the building what it did to the residents of the community who have

3:30:17to do business in that building was completely avoidable had there been a more thoughtful

3:30:21training process i'm not going to spend any more time talking on that because i think we've learned

3:30:25from it and we're addressing it and we've moved on um the only other thing is uh yesterday

3:30:31Councillor Adebayani referred to an event that um uh was at Daniel's table and a reminder was sent

3:30:37from them to say hey don't forget we're you know this is going on today i've been squawking to you

3:30:42and meetings that we've had about how do we filter things we block a lot of things as spam

3:30:48from community organizations on you know with good intention but we don't you know so the

3:30:54email that they sent was blocked and i'm only bringing this up because we talk i talk you and

3:30:59i talk about this all the time it was they they sent it at 10 o'clock this morning as a hey

3:31:04don't forget it's today it's 12 to 2 whatever it was our system finally thankfully we're looking

3:31:10at it now because for a while it wouldn't have been unblocked but it made it look like the

3:31:14organization didn't send it until three o'clock this afternoon if we include the folks whose

3:31:19primary responsibility is communicating with the publics why hire up on the PIO um if we're

3:31:25bringing those people into the discussion so much of this we can learn proactively and get out of

3:31:30our own way so i'm really intrigued and pleased with a lot of what i'm hearing i hope we're on

3:31:34the right track but i i see us being at risk and that's why i i'd like to learn more about

3:31:40what this committee is what they're doing and make sure that you know we're at least saying

3:31:44thank you if if what we've talked about year after year is actually happening and i'm i'm

3:31:48hopeful that it is thank you miss brian thank you um chair i i want to say that um i love uh

3:31:58counsel can it's enthusiasm and commitment to it but um also the idea and um but there are layers

3:32:07um to this and in an it department i mean it's a science the technology is a science they do

3:32:15absolutely have to uh work internally first to evaluate to test to see um to um test it all out

3:32:25first um it's not a committee at first they get some input because like they said their departments

3:32:32that they see a product they think you know we want to use it um as brian said um and they they

3:32:38have they they have to bring it to it who has to evaluate how will it interface with our systems

3:32:45what could be the potential dangers is this system viable is you know all it's a lot right

3:32:51because you can't afford to have a lot of missteps because it will affect a lot about what's going on

3:32:58information what we send out you know um something could take down the system which is very would be

3:33:05very bad for us but they always have to do a lot of um testing and with ai coming so fast and

3:33:12everything and not just that a lot of technology keeping up with it a lot of hacking um preventing

3:33:18that there's a lot to be done internally a lot of work that is professional that is specific

3:33:25um just like you know any other area a scientific area but then um i like that you did point out

3:33:32the next level then is um where most it departments um it's not the strongest suit

3:33:41is the area of um like getting input and and training right um if they're they're guarding

3:33:50the castle they're guarding then you know the systems and the data and keeping those functional

3:33:56and all that um and even that it's so intra intricate that it is very difficult right um

3:34:03there are so many steps to it it's it's like a constant 24/7 vigilance on that and then with this

3:34:11new technology too and whatnot they're there and they have to do the internal checks and

3:34:18evaluations and things first but also we do need um i like the uh we need people from all the

3:34:26diverse areas to um help them which usually they do pull in from departments but also would be good

3:34:35from for some of the public to help get their input and then test how they can communicate

3:34:41and and how does this function for the average user and what what we're going to be receiving

3:34:48and the p o p i o p i o officer and all that yeah absolutely she she needs it a lot she uses

3:34:55it a lot so that will that should come but again it's not it shouldn't be a fast roll out because

3:35:03every time it there has been a fast roll out with technology not just this city but all the time

3:35:09they're trying to meet a deadline right that the the company or the organization is set

3:35:14um it there it just it always it never works as well as seamlessly and it's never as safe

3:35:22as when they you know make sure all the ducks are in a row and then um they have the next level

3:35:28is the kind of committee you're talking about with all the people and all the testing and how is it

3:35:35how is it to work with that and getting all that feedback and then adjusting that um but so um i

3:35:42think so far so good but um yeah we're excited and um there's a lot to do and um thank you

3:35:50mr sifanita miss malloc okay miss malloc thank you um thank you both for being here i don't

3:36:01know if this is a question for you or who it's for but um some of our boards and committees are

3:36:07using ai for their transcript and for their meeting minutes and my concern is two-fold one

3:36:14is that um it's unregulated so i don't know which software different boards are using um and the so

3:36:25there's no policy guiding that which is maybe a different policy than how city staff are using it

3:36:32in their work um and then the second is an equity issue some boards have taken the initiative

3:36:40to you know implement this and others haven't and are struggling maybe to get their minutes done

3:36:47or not um but so you know i wouldn't think that the equity piece is necessarily the it department's

3:36:55um job maybe more the citizen participation officer in terms of all the boards and

3:37:01committees having the same resources but the sort of unregulated component to it so

3:37:07um i don't know if that's anything that anybody can speak on or if i'm just

3:37:10kind of flagging this as something that is currently inequitable and unregulated so

3:37:23thank you for bringing to our attention i'll work with the cpo um and maybe we'll have those

3:37:28conversations with the boards to find out who is using ai what they're using and have a separate

3:37:34policy um separate ai policy for boards and commissions and minute creation um so we will

3:37:40have that conversation anyone else thank you next yeah best for last right thank you well good evening

3:38:18um i believe sorry it is 10 40 um jesse edwards diversity equity inclusion officer for the city

3:38:27and i'm just going to share with you um several diversity equity and inclusion

3:38:31initiatives that are currently underway through the mayor's office uh in response to findings

3:38:36from the recommendations from the equity audit the dei office has initiated four major efforts

3:38:41the city-wide department equity plan the supplier diversity initiative the hispanic latino

3:38:47heritage month honors program and a continuation of the lunch and learn workshop series first the

3:38:55department equity plan equitable practice practice involves revolve recognizing that people

3:39:01and communities have different needs and intentionally adjusting policies practice

3:39:07programs resources and services to promote fair access opportunity and outcomes over the course

3:39:15of the summer i had an opportunity to meet with 10 city departments to identify meaningful

3:39:20ambitious equity goals that are relevant to the work they perform in the communities that they

3:39:26serve the intent is not to create a one-size-fits-all approach to equity each department has different

3:39:34responsibilities serves different populations that may encounter different barriers therefore

3:39:40each department's equity goals should reflect its specific responsibilities and the needs of the

3:39:46residents or employees it serves i have asked each department uh you can see the departments

3:39:53that i'm working with on the screen i've asked each department to identify two to three equity

3:39:59goals develop specific action steps for achieving these goals establish realistic timelines

3:40:05determine how progress and success will be measured and identify how the diversity equity

3:40:11and inclusion office can support the department's work these plans are intended to move departments

3:40:17beyond simply identifying goals they provide a structure for taking action measuring progress

3:40:24and demonstrating improvements in service delivery and access i am continuing to work

3:40:30with two different departments all departments have submitted their goals there are two left

3:40:34once all department plans have been completed they'll be posted on the city's website

3:40:40and ultimately the purpose of the citywide equity plan is to make equity a part of everyday

3:40:45business in the city of government not to separate initiatives but an integral part

3:40:53of how we plan make decisions and provide services allocate resources and measure

3:40:58our effectiveness also the supplier diversity initiative the supplier diversity uh oh okay

3:41:07research has documented long-standing barriers that minority-owned small-owned and historically

3:41:12underrepresented businesses may face when competing for government contracts at the city

3:41:18state and local level these barriers may include limited access to capital credit and bonding

3:41:24complex bidding and certification requirements limited access to procurement networks and

3:41:30decision makers insufficient awareness of contracting opportunities and contract size

3:41:36or prior experience and requirements that place smaller businesses at a disadvantage

3:41:41the equity audit found that the city of that the city of Framingham does not currently collect

3:41:47demographic information about its potential potential and selected vendors as a result

3:41:53the audit cannot determine whether businesses from all segments of the community have equitable

3:41:59access to and participation in the city's procurement and contact and contracting

3:42:05opportunities what we do know is that Framingham is home to more than 2200 businesses of varying

3:42:12sizes although we do not currently have a comprehensive comprehensive information about

3:42:18the demographic composition of these businesses we can as a city take good faith steps to ensure

3:42:26that every qualified business has access to information about city contracting opportunities

3:42:30and understands how participate how to participate in the procurement process

3:42:34with that goal in mind i am working with the finance and procurement office to develop a

3:42:39supplier diversity initiative it's important to clarify that this initiative does what this

3:42:45initiative does and does not do it does not guarantee contracts or automatically award

3:42:50preference to a business because it is minority owned small large or locally owned i am working

3:42:57with councilor feeny on a she's i know that she's working on a by Framingham ordinance and

3:43:05we are working together a matter of fact we have a meeting next week to talk about how these two

3:43:10programs can can complement each other all city contracts will continue to still be awarded

3:43:17through an open and competitive process consistent with applicable procurement laws

3:43:23i think it's important just to repeat that again i'm sorry i know it's it's getting late

3:43:29but this program does not guarantee contracts automatically or word preference based on

3:43:35whether they are minority owned small owned or a large locally owned business the initiative is

3:43:42intended to ensure that businesses have equitable access to information outreach and technical

3:43:47guidance and opportunities to compete phase one of this initiative is to establish baseline data

3:43:53this involves inviting current city vendors to voluntary provide demographic and business

3:43:58ownership information also develop a clear understanding of the composition of Framingham

3:44:03business of the Framingham business community there's currently no data that exists that

3:44:11i've been able to find that can identify what types of businesses whether they are small

3:44:17minority owned women owned veteran owned businesses in the city of Framingham so i'm

3:44:23trying to work with um hopefully asking Framingham State University i know they have a

3:44:29business program that could hopefully do that that research we also want to add vendor and

3:44:36vendor information form to the procurement portal that will allow potential vendors

3:44:41to select and identify themselves as minority owned women owned veteran owned disability

3:44:46owned lgbtqia plus owned or locally owned small businesses providing this information again would

3:44:54not guarantee a contract again that would be illegal instead it would help city establish

3:44:59a baseline for understanding which businesses are participating in city contracting which

3:45:03businesses are receiving contracts which businesses may be underrepresented what barriers may be and

3:45:09what barriers sorry it's late what barriers may be preventing participation and what outreach and

3:45:16education or technical assistance may be helpful i'm going to move on to the hispanic latino

3:45:24heritage month honors the city of Framingham through formal programming recognizes black

3:45:30history month women's history month juneteenth indigenous people's day pride in the signing of

3:45:38the ada law and veterans day i'm happy to announce that this year we'll also be recognizing hispanic

3:45:44latino heritage month which is september 15th to october 15th on october 14th at 530 in evans

3:45:52hall we'll be recognizing 10 local individuals who have made an impact in the city of Framingham

3:45:58nominations are now closed and judging has been done i know who the the winners or who is being

3:46:05selected we had an open process and we've had i had input from the community in terms of who

3:46:15was being selected those who participated in this process was kevin lopez from hoops and homework

3:46:21state representative priscilla susa jenna lee tejeda from human resources richard pomales

3:46:29from the police department ricardo robles from the school committee and renon pinero city of

3:46:37Framingham webmaster i will work with the pio tomorrow on a press release for those names

3:46:44of the winners i welcome you to join us as we celebrate the culture recognize our hispanic and

3:46:50latino brothers and sisters for the community for the contributions to the city of Framingham

3:46:55the event will be emceed by telemundo news reporter ivana jelowski and feature food from

3:47:02saxonville burrito lastly the city of Framingham will continue our lunch and learn workshop series

3:47:08starting sometime in the spring 2027 i've had an opportunity to get feedback from the

3:47:15over 120 employees that participated in the lunch and learn workshop

3:47:20workshops over the past year it provided me with a lot of feedback in terms of

3:47:27day days that the the training was offered and possible other topics to to be discussed

3:47:34and that is all i have for report okay any questions mr stephanie thank you mr chairman

3:47:41um thank you for that report and the update i appreciate the celebration of the diversity in

3:47:47our community i had a question really around this topic for the mayor um a few days after

3:47:57we declined to ban the use of municipal property by ice september 24th uh seven ice vehicles use

3:48:05the pearl street garage as their staging area they blocked off an area um and used it 49

3:48:12communities have taken advantage of the new safe communities act to enact something to limit

3:48:19access to that um i don't need to tell you our schools are down more than a thousand kids our

3:48:26downtown businesses are down 40 percent um have you considered uh issuing an executive order to

3:48:34to address this the use of city property by uh these folks in the absence of of action by

3:48:43the council short answer is no um the the governor's uh policy on ice using state property

3:48:56only applies to state property so that doesn't apply to the pearl street garage because correct

3:49:03and um in the absence of the city council taking any action i don't think i have the

3:49:10authority to do what you're suggesting and i'm not quite sure how it would be enforced anyway

3:49:17i mean it would be mainly symbolic other than uh actual being able to be enforced so i'm not

3:49:26quite sure what you're expecting uh or you're suggesting i do in other communities ice has

3:49:32respected the orders of the local community um you know if you can get us more information on that

3:49:39we'll take a look at it and i'll review that with the city solicitor we'll see what we can do

3:49:44thank you how's that good yes i uh just to piggyback on council stephanin he uh was talking about i

3:49:53got a couple phone calls so i drove down and i probably scared people away when i was driving

3:49:58around in the big black SUV but um you know it's got the lissell college sticker on it for my

3:50:04daughter it's got a kfp bump thing on it but it doesn't work but yeah so yeah pro so this is what

3:50:10i got when i inquired about it says just an FYI if i heard message correctly if ice is at the

3:50:15pearl street lot this is not covered by as you said the protect act um as it is not state-owned

3:50:21lot or a designated sensitive area also correct me if i'm wrong the proposed ordinance was sent

3:50:25back to rules and ordinance so there's nothing that the city side that prohibits this as well

3:50:29there is currently ice activity in the city and we the frame police department recently sent out

3:50:34training advisory to all offices on the new state law and how we can and can't interact with ice um and then

3:50:40it was yes the weather's crazy hope you're having a good week but um it's troublesome because um

3:50:46you know you go down wably street i've actually witnessed it a couple times i think some of our

3:50:50other councils have as well you know autobrite had a um a customer videotape two people getting

3:50:56arrested he was he was in his waiting room patrick the owner and one of his customers was

3:51:01videotaping three guys in trouble in a white van with ladders and it's just they're being targeted

3:51:05and it's it's uh it's a scary time uh for everybody and especially um what's going on and you know and

3:51:12i'll piggyback on what we heard we heard a story here you know one council said they can't get the

3:51:17croc out of their head i can't get the croc out of my head you know i got a young daughter but

3:51:20she's not young but she's young to me and um it breaks my heart what these families are going

3:51:25through so i think it's something we need to be more proactive on and do something sooner rather

3:51:29than later because um that pearl street garage was really eye-opening and i had a woman in my

3:51:35district she's reached out to me three times i've reached out three times and there's really

3:51:38nothing we can do until we do something and i think it's us that has to do it not the mayor

3:51:43that's just my opinion yeah thank you mr chairman thank you mr edwards um for being here at the

3:51:50time that it is and and for your work um i'm puzzled that because it's come up every time

3:51:55you've presented there was no mention of accessibility persons with disabilities

3:52:00anything like that in your report and the lateness of the hour doesn't give us the

3:52:04opportunity to speak more about that but to me it's telling that a community of our size and

3:52:08diversity after it coming up every time um this topic has surfaced on an agenda still doesn't

3:52:15come up still doesn't raise to um you know this this kind of presentation um i don't know what to

3:52:21read into it but i'm hopeful at an earlier time we can have you back and have a more meaningful

3:52:25discussion about that you mentioned that there are um goals that you're waiting for you've received

3:52:31some but not all of them when when did you ask for them when did when did i i'm just trying to

3:52:36get the timeline together this was delivered i think the date was february 2025 the audit

3:52:42correct so um i worked with all the departments pretty much over the summer and i asked that all

3:52:49the goals be returned to my office um september september 1st so yeah i have most but i i don't

3:52:58have two but i guess if we were if we paid 50 grand for this audit and it was delivered in

3:53:03february why did we wait until the summer to ask department heads for goals and can we post it

3:53:10sounds like you have all but two we're waiting to have all of them before posting them let's

3:53:13just post whatever we have um but i'm having trouble with the timeline you mentioned the

3:53:19supplier diversity thing i i don't know how i feel about a program like that it's all about the

3:53:24details because it's you know if it's not done just the right way that it becomes very discriminatory

3:53:30absolutely but it was mentioned in i think three cfo's ago in the in the memo to the council in

3:53:382020 almost three years ago um among the reasons that we were going to do this audit and we're

3:53:44still talking about it as something that is you know we're thinking about doing where where are

3:53:50we with that i mean are we collecting the the demography data now yeah we're well into um there

3:53:57were four recommendations from the equity audit um right but we just when we knew and i'm i'm just

3:54:05in the interest of time forgive the interruption this one we knew before about the audit because

3:54:09it was a stated goal of the audit it was in the memo one of the things we want to do is this so

3:54:14i thought we why were we waiting even for the audit to to do that and at least a year ago i

3:54:21mean i i recognized that some time ago we recognized we weren't collecting certain demographic data but

3:54:27the former c o o had told us about a year ago that we that the software allowed us to do that

3:54:35so we've we've had a lot of time has has gone by and i'm just having trouble understanding the

3:54:40timeline um but most overarching is the the lack of information on on our commitment to

3:54:47persons with disabilities mr chairman it may be helpful due to the latest of the hour and the

3:54:51importance of the topic that we have a follow-up visit and um mr edwards perhaps can have a more

3:54:57thorough presentation on some of the issues that have come up tonight and in previous discussions

3:55:01and not be racing a clock that we have a hard out in about four minutes anybody else okay okay

3:55:11tracy you have literally four minutes okay i won't even take that long but um so i i i i do feel

3:55:21like that um uh there is added um stringency in the questioning of um the dei officer um all the

3:55:33time um the equity audit all these things right um it the things are moving but these are things

3:55:43that you know you're engaging employees everyone and you need to get honest feedback and these

3:55:50things or whatever so i don't but the ad you um you keep bringing up the disability portion

3:55:57but we have a strong we have the ada um stuff going forward we just had a great report on all

3:56:04of that okay so i wouldn't say that um that um the disability the disability is being ignored under

3:56:12dei but you don't need to do uh double time the the work this is another front but adi is the

3:56:21front line for disability issues and then dei can back that up but they would take the acue

3:56:28from um the ada committee all of that right um anyway so it's there but obviously i would

3:56:37i'm first going to be dealing with the ada committee um i i don't think there's a need to

3:56:42try to um like make it one against the other or disparage that because they will allow the ada

3:56:51they're not going to compete with it but just support um it and i think it's natural for people

3:56:56with disabilities um the ada is more directly um you know uh involved and they don't that's

3:57:03their single focus so um anybody with a disability would go there first and they would uh bring

3:57:11their concerns there first now on the other issues um in terms of the time frame people

3:57:18who work in departments employees and things like that in departments themselves um one of

3:57:24the things that just it's like people they have the good intentions but it's difficult

3:57:32and annoying to have to do this other stuff that isn't like the direct work that you do right

3:57:39because you it takes time away from the direct work and we have departments that are working with

3:57:45um understaffed at this point too i mean that's always the case anywhere in any organization

3:57:51there's always something there's always other work to do to move things forward but then

3:57:56these are other things that need to be done to keep the the organization or the company healthy

3:58:01right the dei things and that kind of stuff it's like we're evaluating our organization our

3:58:08departments all of this to try to be stronger more unified that kind of thing but individually

3:58:14departments are know that they're responsible for their main work first so um any of these

3:58:21organizations like any of these departments like dei they recognize that they have they have to

3:58:28wait a little bit um be gentle with it to get more cooperation and a bigger sampling of what

3:58:36you know what's really going on to get more more truth um more data but it takes longer because

3:58:43it's not the primary focus of any department now the data collection and all that every just things

3:58:50just do not um nothing moves as quickly as you picture it right um on paper there's always stuff

3:58:59that comes up stuff that interferes or whatever um i was satisfied okay miss brian that is going

3:59:05to do i'm done okay yes you are done because it's a move we adjourned second okay all those in

3:59:13favor miss alak yes yes just try it this long yes yes yes yes what i'm gonna say hook them