2026-11-04 - Ward 3 NPA

for that. Uh, just kind of talk about it our first item on the agenda here is series So just kind of give you uh how that works. Um, just show a quick hand of everyone who actually is here as a resident As as you don't If you live in Ward 3, please sign the attendance Keep your hands No. >> I I got 13 people. So just for our bylaws to get elected we have seven slots. We have to get a majority vote. So I think majority of >> I'm not getting anything. >> majority of 14 is now eight. So >> Yeah, so where you have it plugged in so >> I'm going to have Jesse here >> It was working when I first did it. Yeah. >> going to oversee the elections here. So I guess we'll open the floor to do uh nomination. Sure? So I'd like Brooks. I'd like to nominate Thank you. Seconds? >> Second that. >> All right. All right, Brooks. Write this down. >> My name is Ben Smith. Unique that? I don't know. And I'd like to nominate Brooks Cummings. >> Is there a second? >> I'd like to nominate >> Okay, second? Second >> Second non-exact. >> Second for Ben? I'll second that. >> Thank you. >> Any other further nominations? We're traveling so >> Are you are you willing to serve for >> I am willing. >> [laughter] >> Further nominations from the floor. Okay. I'm unprepared. I didn't bring ballots. I just realized that. So uh >> We're something up then. >> Uh well we typically do the Check the ballot. I don't know if the bylaws do. We have to vote on each candidate individually. We don't allow slates, but I don't know that it's specified uh that it has to be secret ballot, so >> Marshall, would you read the list again of people >> Yeah, so the following people have been nominated uh and seconded Chris Haisley, Brooks Cummings, Trudy Richmond, Zack Cummings, Chris McGrath, and Charlie Messing. Six. Okay. What do we what do we got there in the bylaws tonight? I'm having flashbacks to middle school, you know, the picture above the clock that said, you know, failure to prepare is preparing to fail. [laughter] Full disclosure, I am partnered with a middle school English teacher, so you know, maybe that has something to do with it. Pardon? All right, so I guess we'll just go in the order. Uh we can't do the slate. We have to do individually. That I remember do remember, but um Yeah. Anybody all all board residents in favor of Brooks being part of the steering committee, raise your hand. All right. Excellent. All right. Ben. All in favor of Ben joining your steering committee. >> You. >> No, I'm not. No, no, no. >> Thank you, Brooks. >> I nominated Brooks. >> [laughter] >> Sorry about that. >> That's okay. >> Trudi, we're voting on Trudi, right? >> Yes. >> Okay. Yep. Okay. We're voting on Trudi now then. Brooks. Who's in favor of Brooks being in the steering committee? >> [laughter] >> 1 2 3 6 again. >> Well done, Brooks. How about Zach? All in favor of Zach. All right. See all the same hands again. And Charlie. All Then I'm elected as Chris McGrath. >> Oh. >> Ah, that's where I was wrong. How about Chris McGrath? >> Oh, yeah. >> Yeah. All right. Okay. >> So it's anonymous. [laughter] So being unanimous, sorry. Not quite anonymous all those hands. All right, so thank you for that, Jesse. So welcome everybody to the steering committee. We'll follow afterwards to figure out when we'll have our steering committee meeting. But before we roll into the development project, I just want to recognize our newly elected state representatives here from it looks like Chittenden 14 and 16. So We have item is a Franz >> Yes. >> from Chittenden 14 representing us in Montpelier. And then Trent Jerome Jeffrey Peterson from here in Chittenden 16. So give a round of applause for We appreciate you coming here and most likely next month we will probably invite you back to talk about your priorities for the upcoming legislative session in January. Uh, these are our newly elected state reps. You guys want to stand up and wave or something? >> Yeah, stand up and wave. >> You all stand up together. >> [clears throat] >> Hi, I'm Franz Oh. >> Congratulations again. Thanks for coming out. We'll have you back next month. We'll even put you on the agenda. So yeah, so without further ado, we're I think we're a little bit ahead of schedule here, which is not always common. Our next item on agenda is the Pine Street 22 Pine Street development project here. Uh that is the property immediately adjacent to the Transit Center, the former home of the Cathedral Cathedral Church. So we have a number of folks presenting on that. Jesse Robbins here from Freeman French Freeman is the with the architectural firm. He'll be leading. We'll also hear from Kyle here. Kyle Kyle Wilson. Excellent. And a couple of other additional presenters as well that I'll let you introduce there, Jesse. So without further ado, let's talk about the downtown redevelopment. >> Uh I guess I'll introduce myself first. Jesse Robbins. You met me during the exciting election Congratulations to the ND steering committee. I was actually once a resident of this ward this MBA board myself when it was a part of this ward. Third project around the corner and a few other big projects in Vermont and excited to be Uh so with that, Jesse's holding the clicker here. We'll go through the slides that we have. This project is 22 Pine, uh, as we're calling it. Uh, this is uh, a project we're very excited about. We've been working on it for a while. Um, and this is the context. So, as you can see on the screen, this is the project. Uh, what the building is uh, bordered on the west by St. Paul Street, um, the south by Cherry, um, the uh, the east on St. Paul Street, the south by Cherry, the west by Pine Street, and the north is Pearl Street. Um, you can see uh, with Jeff's help we rendered this showing things place. Uh, rendered things behind it. Um, we did. Uh, you can see also some plane uh, and Uh, we have a couple more renderings uh, from each of the corners. So, this is the southwest corner. So, this is Pine Street and Cherry Street. So, the main lobby as we're proposing it is on Pine Street. Uh, as um, as we're all aware, the uh, the GMT occupy St. Paul. Uh, and um, there are easements on Paul and Cherry. So, the access to this building, the main lobby will be on Pine Street. Um, you can see the building has different materiality. So, we've got a uh, brick uh, terracotta material. We've got a green colored terracotta material, and we've got a gray cement uh, cement board colored. You can see that the building has uh, three story step backs uh, along Pine Street and then steps up along Cherry Street. This is the corner on the south, the lobby corner. Uh, has the GMT along St. Paul, uh, has retail along Cherry. So, we see at the corner of >> This is the northeast corner of Carroll. Again, the building is recessed to the west towards the lake south town. It steps back One of the things we always talk about, we spend a lot of time working on And then the northwest corner is Carroll and Bryant Street. So again, the building on Carroll steps down to neighboring properties. by doing that. Further plan B to be in the form-based zoning, the building is built to the property line. The top three stories then are recessed back so >> which is required for the site plan that shows the main floor of house and the hall of right carry on the bottom and people these are building with the floor and hall carry of the hall floor plan that we have. Next floor is the floor plan as it is currently planned obviously still a work to do so next week building presents to also see you have the main residential on the site uh with service and access along the secondary pedestrian lobby uh trash is something that very important and building service uh second floor there's a on the site building you know so work to do third floor like what they're next to the floor plan looks to be very similar close the site uh the upper floors are >> Uh the uh it will likely be Uh this uh 16 We you see on Uh that uh >> Um in preparation that you have to fire from the that is limiting so that it to the so that look at that and then I just want to to reiterate uh concern that I have that we have a lot of >> Thank you very much. Thank you, Professor. Yeah, we've done we've done some shadow studies of the building just to make sure that the the sectional work and >> to build them and and provide them on site as part of the project. And yeah. >> Yeah. >> Yeah. >> I don't know what >> Uh the inclusionary bylaw dictates the level of The city adopts based on every year Uh but to to help with that. >> And as a side note, HUD also publishes a fair market rent study every year. Uh if you didn't know, just Google HUD fair market rents, you'll get that And you have accessible housing? >> Definitely. Yeah. >> Are they existing? >> So in uh But we're required to have 5% built as accessible and the rest all built as adaptable. So that would be the floor, I think. >> Using the Burlington ordinance as your guide or VLI? >> Using the the Burlington ordinance as our guide. But that that's the that's the floor, right? That's that's You know, I always say that code compliance is just barely not breaking the law. But so that's that's our floor. That's where we would have to start and everything adaptable. Um so it's the the HUD Fair Housing Act accessibility guidelines that set the accessibility standards within the apartments and everything up to the apartment door is ADA. >> Do you everybody think this is a beautiful building? >> Okay. Yeah, I think that that's a question of the old saying beauty is in the eye of the beholder and uh >> First line. >> I think there's a process through the design advisory board prior to getting to the space that I have to comply with so matter of perspective I guess. >> Brooks. >> Can we see the very first slide one more time? >> The aerial? >> The very the one with the rendering. >> Right in front of the building? >> Yeah. >> That's the parking lot behind the federal >> Um I doubt there's anything in the code for but the last time you presented the shadow study. So does Cherry Street get any daylight? >> Uh Yeah. >> For us. >> Um >> So both I mean because tower and both sides of Cherry Street. >> Yeah, there there's times during the year when it gets some daylight but that you know part of the um form based code with the step backs is to to bring the building back from the street and like we said we pushed it um back from the sidewalk as far as as as you know the the code allows to allow for more air and light but um it's a fairly wide it's a 66 foot right of way um plus a little bit more step back so >> And it's consistent with all the work going into the plan BTP >> Right yeah The that was a big consideration in the plan BTP process I went to all those volunteer sessions 50 years ago >> Question >> Um hi this is Councilor Sanchez Parkinson uh thank you so much for the presentation um I think many of us are excited to see something being developed there um but obviously have questions uh related to what that may look like um I have two questions one is um I'm wondering if you could speak more to any needs assessment that you might have um went through at the beginning uh as Councilor Grant mentioned earlier we have a number of units coming up here in the next year or so and I'm just wondering if the projects have thought um that far out in terms of what we'll be in need of our city um particularly these types of units >> Uh uh we have reviewed all the market studies that have been done we view the work that the city of Brighton has done on on the housing needs that are out there um we propose 25% studio 25% one bed and 50% two beds uh the two bedroom units are very adaptable because you can have one bath a bath and a half two bath you can have study associated with that so we're trying to work within units that offer flexibility and then meet the market that uh that that's here >> So are you saying like that's um based on what you learned is the need >> Uh I think uh the needs of the market the needs of the site the needs of the building all have to be considered to have a project that it works and we try to consider all >> Uh the other question, I mean, I think that it's very convenient that is um right near a bus station, central uh bus station. And so at our last MPA we actually or one of our last MPA meetings we had uh a focus discussion around public transportation and one of the um obviously one of the discussions has been around funding for public transportation. And so I'm assuming that that will be a resource to many of the potential residents in this in these units. Um so I'm wondering if you all have considered some sort of partnership, financial contribution um as sort of thinking about the future of our public transit um because um you know they're going through a number of financial challenges and how are how can we be proactive in thinking ahead of supporting um the expansion, the just service of GMT. I'm just curious to know if there's been any conversations in terms of potential future partnerships. >> Uh I think obviously the GMT's a really unique urban uh condition that's on the doorstep. I think residents living next to a bus station is a great uh potential synthesis. Uh having those residents use the services uh maybe we can help facilitate in terms of leasing or working with residents or what's included with when you move in. Uh and I think that's what we try to do is is obviously getting 400 plus people living downtown next to the bus transit station would be hopefully very possible for them. >> Uh yeah kind of to this point um I've lived in apartments in Burlington as part of like this package >> Yep I like that a lot. I think that gets into biking as well, car share, all of that becomes uh uh we we also have a property management company that we started that we run that would operate this so we develop and operate uh our project. So, um that was >> I think the transportation the TDM agreements with the city and cleared >> And after that we do technical review. And then we >> The planning planning commission paving >> We have not made any application for something The planning the planning commission um is involved in setting the for the allowed period of >> So the form based zoning requires a certain relationship to the front property line so now to the curve of the property line. What we tried to do early on is pull the building back as far as we can from that within the allowances of the form based zoning. So it's a little different on Cherry and Pearl than it is on the St. Paul because there's these there's the taking and the property line a little bit different there but we try to do as much of that as we can within the regulations and then we've got a courtyard inside of inside of the the block. And then as on some of the we're stepping back and getting more space. >> Uh yes yeah we'll almost certainly be doing some green roof as part of this storm water mitigation and also to provide you know that provide us. So um in addition to that we've been coordinating all along already because of our other work with the adjacent projects. So the Cherry Streets Street Street project is out to bid. That includes mature street trees. The first example of that Main Street is an example of that but the first example was St. Paul Street Find that goes into that but make sure there's plenty of good soil for those trees as >> I know we have a conversation on this to be city and as we are right now there are generally spaces but we're still in time by the high school teachers but that's not you said before so there is a lot of public debate that I have and and still being in the park >> Um what about uh >> Uh our whole Great for domestic hot water the electric and uh the technology >> And then you also This is also Uh Uh >> So my brother is Uh Well Yeah, I can talk a little bit about that. It's called destination and I think it's worth exploring because there will be some cost savings because what it does is simply tell the elevator where not to go and also moves if I want to go to floor eight, it says go to elevator C and everybody else reduces the number of of stops the elevator makes and the number of trips that lets you get more people more with less wait time. It might reduce the number of elevators we need. So there's a lot of disadvantage to that system. Certainly something to look at. We're implementing it in Burlington Square so that building will have just So definitely worth There are savings there. >> I'm just curious how many elevators >> Uh I think it is three. It could change. It could end up being All right. Uh that concludes the time allotted for this I think this is our maybe third or fourth development project that's been on our agenda in the past year. There's been a lot of similar questions here. There has been some conversation about having an FP and B really talks about what it really cost to build here in Burlington and how that factors into the full project. So that may be something you're seeing down the line in church so. Um friendly reminder if you have not signed the roving board for attendance, please do that. We use that for our and uh next item up is Parks Recreation and Waterfront uh what we were setting on the recently adopted open space plan and we're going to get first the latest calculation Second here uh Thank you again All right. My name is Dan Cahill. I'm the city land steward uh with the Burlington Parks Recreation Waterfront Department and we are here to talk to you all about everyday stewardship opportunities in Burlington. And uh uh you advance to the next slide. Um well yeah, let's do intros real quick. So yeah, Dan Cahill, I'm city land steward. I work with our conservation lands um our Burlington bike path corridor, our natural service trails, the community garden program. Um and I help steward our conservation legacy fund. I'm going to play a little bit about that um fund tonight. Um and I'll kick it over to Zoe. >> Hi, I'm Zoe Richards. Um and uh I direct Burlington Wildways Partnership, um which is a partnership between many of the public-facing landowners in the city of Burlington. So we have two park districts. We have Burlington Parks, Recreation Waterfront and the Regional Winooski Valley Park District, um Rock Point which owns um >> Becca. >> Hi, I'm Becca Daniel, the Community Garden and Parks Outreach Coordinator for BPRW. >> And I'm Nate Lanterii. I'm uh Ward 5 resident. Actually, I'm the Ward 5 NPA Steering Committee. Um so glad to be here and seeing this great turnout at Ward 3. Um but I'm also a member of the Parks Commission, current chair of the Parks Commission. Um and I'm really here just as a member of the public of Burlington who is really set about um bringing public energy into uh public realm. So happy to share uh stage with these dear folks and give this information to you all today. >> So we're going to talk about a variety of different opportunities and this uh you guys are the third NPA we've been to and we're trying to go to all the >> So I mentioned this plan. Um I'm going to kick it to Zoe to give a little bit more background on the open space plan and our nature based climate solutions plan. Um these things are just really important documents for Burlington that guide us on really critical things happening right now. >> Yeah, so one of the things that um I just wanted to make a plug for and let you know that um we've worked on this city is um the idea that in order for us to be a resilient city um that a lot of our So as we have our aspirations to grow as a city and should grow as a city in So putting together Um I also thank um you know, I think one of the most encouraging things is that um, you can actually do stuff and really see a difference. So if you start planting native plants, you can generate a lot of pollinators. Those pollinators bird populations, bird populations disperse seeds which grow trees all by themselves. So um, there are a lot of these like really really beneficial things. And for example, like my favorite nature based climate solution. Um, nature based climate solutions are really really cost effective, much more cost effective than many of our built environment types of solution. >> Uh, so I mentioned the Conservation Legacy Fund. Um, that is a fund that was created by uh, the referendum item on the 2005 So the voters passed um, with pretty unanimous support. I think it was somewhere in the 80% that passed uh, to create a dedicated fund for conservation. So that helps us buy lands and serve them when they're available and appropriate to use that the city wants. The city and the community want of course. Um, kind of think maybe something in Ward 3 I Ward 2 Integrated Arts and I think that's Ward 2 the Archbald Neighborhood Garden um, that process with um, David Artis that was that was a property that from using nurse association. They thought one day they might build a community room there and they decided to want to do that. And >> Yeah. >> This year >> One day So end of >> Um, so I thought this would just be a fun map to share cuz um it highlights some of the things that this new open space plan have done and also um anybody have without looking at the legend and cheating do anybody have a sense of what all the green dots are on the map? These are the all the green dots are the sites of former ash trees. Um, and then the green light street trees. Yeah, the lightest green color Right, so in our natural areas there's so many ash trees. Many have been I guess standing dead. Just noticed some of the black ash trees farms don't look like So they think like 90% of the population of fall to the Um, but anyhow these are all of our street trees that have been removed um that were infected or what what's the correct word for national or national infested right. So all of the trees that were infested have to be removed. Um, the light green is our core natural areas as acknowledged in new open space plan except the angles which is in the south end by Champlain School is a So one of the cool things about this iteration of the open space plan the scientists that work here >> Very good. >> Yeah. >> And the laptop one there Well, set that straight. I had to volunteer at Um, hey. Uh, you may be How come our kids get But after doing that a couple times, >> You can find >> Maybe there's a little bit of optimism today after there was also yesterday, but feeling like there's a lot of situations that are larger than our heads, feeling powerless Feeling that we might not be able to do that But So that's a real More people Then But not a way to Something where Yeah, totally. So So the first one that we were working on So that You know, that was one of How can we do that in a way that was cognizant of what city resources were available? >> was kind of how it started over. From there I started working more closely with the Parks and Rec team and kind of got it on each other's radar of like hey there's there's community interest. Let us know when there's a good fit for a project that could be supported by volunteers. So from there we last week last Wednesday we hosted a tree planting at Park where from actually bike park project So staff identified that identified yeah we would be like we can do it. It'll be a long time for our smaller staff to do 200 trees but if we had fun people you know many many hands make light work and we went over budget. We got more than 30 and we planted 200 trees that night. And so and that was what we were able to do was by having that long grant of like okay what what do you need? How can we get So next two Sundays the next two Sundays we have two neighborhood stewardship These are in the South End where I live. So from all of this our work five neighborhood planning assembly steering committee passed a resolution two months ago now to make this priority for them. So from that you know bringing additional South End neighbors to the fold we identified these two sites that has some kind of existing need that volunteers could do. So next Sunday we have a park playground and landscaping cleanup. This is something that that that playground is actually in process of um to uh the perfect in in place. Um but you know, trees and not trees per se, but greenery that's growing in around the you know, someone will eventually have to remove it to make the next prediction happen. And that could either be um a choice or it could be supported by again the many So that's the first one. That's Sunday. And great. The following week Anglesea Brook which is uh it's it's a great natural space. So it's one that if you're just going to get in mention um and it also runs right along the side of where there's one site in particular that um just has the remnants of like some folks who um were staying there and unfortunately it's it's sensitive so as the season strengthens and becomes So um just bringing people in to say like hey what can we do and also So if you want some more information you can scan that QR code there um or look on volunteer more information. But really why I want to share this is that I'm just a member of the and you know, I do have the ability to um know who the right people in the park are to do this. But really anybody can and if there are community interests, concerns that exist for this neighborhood but um it's worth trying to get on the track. Um and um if you support doing that happy to help um but it's also a lot of I think that that is all I have. But then we'll open it up for >> Um I [laughter] I thought about this long term. But I do think I think it's really really important that we do a good job of things like We have so many Um, and so as well as that >> Yeah. Uh Yeah. >> Um If anybody wants a packet, I have a handful of packets here if you're interested in the program. I'll share you. >> program I think it could be really exciting to do >> Here you go. Thank you. >> Oh, uh joining us? >> Yeah. >> Hi everyone. Uh my name's Jessica Kirby. Um I am the senior director at the monitor for criminal justice reform. Um and we have been kind of trying to make our rounds to various groups, community groups, and all the MPAs and sort of update people on where things stand with the OPC and um update people on some of the like key findings from the service assessment that we completed about the OPC um and as part of our guidelines and our contract we were tasked with partnering on the community service assessment that was looking at you know viability of OPC in Burlington and Northern OPC in Burlington so >> years you know, how uh both that you know uh but we really um um and those that are um kind of are very likely to get um was um you know simplified um um um that um and so but um maybe um so um and >> Um human services. >> Yeah. >> So it's services that we are currently providing. It's um and a lot of these are things that are um very hard to come by for this population, not things that are being offered at a lot of other places or really any other places for a lot of these. Um like walking case management, you know, I know I have a personal lived experience. I'm from this community and I know a lot of people >> how it exists, all the things that are you know >> That was an online survey So It wasn't actually just that it wasn't actually >> It it was there was a partnership and a contract with an independent organization that does a lot of research and evaluation for state and federal governments and they you know were partnering with the city independently doing that survey of community members and surveying >> It also you know And that My apologies Um so there was a lot of Um and then So a lot of And >> so thanks um and then here all the responses such as so a lot of um another one also um and then um is what they say and these are those a lot of um and part of how many parts um what I for that is that um um um and of >> And then this is the And well the wider version It would be important And survey And third party with the survey or ask respondents which highest you know So that's basically like So Well and you know >> So, I mean that actually surprised me. I knew it would be like, you know, not 17,000, but I really expected that it would be like a hundred or something. And so to hear that is just really encouraging of how much this will, um, you know, how how safe this is to do. You know, no one's died two times at you know, just out of an abundance of caution and those people were fine. Um, and it just really tells us, you know, this can be as as we know. We have the tools that we need to be able to safely respond to overdose uh in almost all cases and that this really will reduce, um, you know, Um, Um, I I like this is kind of our wrap up. These are our last two. Just so we can just, you know, what we just say, you know, that yeah, maybe go to the next one. >> Yeah, let's go to the next. >> Yeah. So like, you know, as a wrap-up, just some important things to notice that, you know, substance use disorders are chronic relapsing condition that and many people are going through drugs in our community, and this is a lot of what we're seeing and hearing about publicly. Those are people that are really suffering and at risk of dying every day from various causes in our community, and we people are really really going through the cracks and not having This is a way of trying to meet the needs of some of the hardest to reach people, so the people that are most at risk of dying, people that are most sick with various, you know, ailments and really really need options that are lower barrier that work for them and connect them to, you know, many services that they need and help them stay safe and stay alive. So it is very well documented that it would be safe to prevent overdose deaths, save lives, and connect people to life-saving services like our community medical care. You know, another important point that we need to remember is that we're not as human beings at risk involved in the drug supply that we have no control over. You know, so when we see ebbs and flows with overdose death rates, we have to remember that the thing that impacts that most, you know, it's really easy to say, yay, we had such a reduction in overdose death rates, but we have to remember that the supply can and does change all the time. And so it's it's not something that we can just guarantee is going to keep going in a reduction. Yes, having treatment, the low barrier, all of the other things, our PN access, and all of that that we need to do, but the drug supply is probably the thing that >> So um you know So um So a lot of people >> Just curious so in the planning It was not an approved use anywhere else so it's been planning to vote on that shortly. And the next one and then So you know I'm not an expert on planning um you know there are there are but I do know that there are a lot of things that aren't approved uses you know what I mean like there's not every single thing they've been you know social services this kind of thing like you know there's not an approved use for for many of the things like recovery centers that have its own >> Apparently not >> But I don't think they have to but that that it's that's in front of the planning um >> I don't think they do >> Yes it I think I think there is I don't think all I'm saying is that I don't think it's a have to thing but I think it is there is a planning thing >> Yes the planning commission has been reviewing and just reviewed um Um number eight will be reviewed once again um of what those parameters would would look like ideally um >> So purchases buildings they almost always like Um so we're not So it's not a So Yeah um and so Yeah Yeah Yeah Yeah Um I don't have a around and more downtown area um that's like So we basically been very open to we've been very open to like looking at it because we know it's not like there's like 500 buildings that are like hey and that's the other thing that's hard when we get into we talk about So so they don't sites are available in the first place that um will want to balance um you know community you got and also um we're we're going to be able to stand by we're hoping that um hopefully you know confident that this um causes impact so it happens with this has to be successful in order for it to have so we're trying to balance that. >> Is is there any conversation around I know there's a lot of of new conversation involved on >> Um Yeah um Um I have not heard Yeah And I was I was Yeah I I I would know we're over here. >> Um we are also doing uh the pilot is conducting so we basically did another pilot or another I'm going to do a neighborhood um study for before and after implementation to see the vote to the space how it impacts it and then um we are doing definitely a lot of you know lots of different perspectives as well as um they they're to so we're really I don't know where Yeah So >> Um so >> So now we're about 27. We have a couple of purchases so squarely you know falls under the falls into you know criteria for opioid settlement dollars and we don't often have dollars that are specifically targeted for overdose you know it's you know we're hoping that this is going to be an effective thing and just like any kind of new thing that you're trying there is somewhat of a leap of faith and proof that this is effective and then we hope that we're going to be able to show that this is a very valuable use of opioid settlement funds ongoing. So that is one of the things that we're also exploring you know already right now. We're exploring you know other funds you know like looking at other grants you know national grants there are a lot of people that support this and we're working with um uh on point and Patrick Weber Avenue on the other OBCs and in in in the United States to you know they're being very open and want to see this happen too and so we're exploring with them you know other ways and they're both funded through the 700 dollars as well and so that's you know a norm and a very you know actual valuable use of the good 700 dollars so you know all nonprofits are kind of in a place where they have to get new money appropriated every year pretty much all of our services right now that are being that are for people in the opioid use disorder are being funded through 700 dollars you know so lots of the recoveries the recovery residences or centers you know it's it's going towards a variety of things that are to benefit so >> yeah I just had to just where we're also really hoping that this is a cost saving there's a lot of a lot of people there's a cost to the world they're not funded they're not funded by us and but there also are >> Yeah. >> Um so I welcome trying reviewing the shot Now I don't usually now that I encounter people doing those on on my property like I go out of my store and wherever and they're like welcome to using that >> You know and our theater and um people who are uh also the same you know and what are we working for you know pet services you know so these are people who are typically poor that are frequenting many and when we open like a new shelter usually people you know are feeling the same you know what I mean and it is the same population you know so I just think it's important like to note and also I hear you I nobody wants people to be using their and that is part of what we're really trying to put an impact and want to see reduced. Couple things one is that there is going to be an evaluation which we're really lucky we do new things on the time and we don't have an evaluation like a evaluation to look at has this caused harm have in in the immediate neighborhood which is one of the biggest things I'm really looking at um has this you know made things better they're going to be looking at EMS calls and are they reduced and uh crime in the area and police calls and um and syringe litter in the area and so it is going to be progressive with that and it will inform whether or not so yes and we're really lucky for that and we don't typically have that but our legislature put in separate funding from some of the funds again to be able to look at that because we needed that people would be interested in that um I think the >> It's just safe people like You know like >> Like immediately and that's going to be So >> Yeah sure you know >> And reinforce a couple of things that you've been saying um how long you've been operating on Bank Street? >> Um uh four and a half years. >> Okay thank you and so a lot of people don't know that because you have done a really good job of managing your program um and working with people to understand what they need to do in order to have access to the program. And I think that's really important because when we have activity that moves around our city due to the ongoing issues with the downsizing of the hotel motel program without a plan every time it happens we are directly affected which is why we have not been able to get on top of it. People feel oh we've done all this stuff well no no one's ever been fully funded one. Um everybody's got a shortage of resources and um housing being like the biggest one. So uh I I really appreciate that and I I just want to remind people because it's a very difficult choice. There is a fear in the community. And it varies from person to community depending on their lived experience. And what people's lived experience and perception are are important to them with regards to how they feel about um safety. So the the fear of certain activity occurring, I just want to put out the reminder that it's that it's here. It's already happening. It's the the fear of something new. It it's here. We have people openly using in the streets. People say things that they wonder about their children. Children will use No, if a child wanders into the OPC, they're going to have a conversation with a professional about the choices that they're making in their lives. >> Yeah. >> Um also we have children who are seeing a lot of things that we don't want them to see at their young ages. We have drug dealers that are trying to recruit our children. So we've got to do something new. We have to keep trying new strategies because what was happening before hasn't been working. Um the last thing I'll say is that being able to have people inside somewhere is really important. I know there's some talks with some people would like to consider a mobile unit, but I a mobile unit would be better than nothing, but um a building I think would be better especially if we could also have uh added bathrooms, showers available for people, uh a place where some of the local barbers who do free haircuts can come in, um a clothing closet. It there would be opportunity to supply other things and to provide a sense of community because the further and the longer people are from community the harder it is to get them back in and I do believe that some of the things that um we really need to be thinking. Uh there were some um OPCs that closed in Canada and the data was clear because they didn't have sufficient recovery uh services available. All the activity came back almost immediately. The overdoses, the public use, the syringe litter. So it it showed it was almost like the community got too comfortable and they said oh we don't need this anymore. So these are things I think we need to continue um to think about. The city maintains a page with all the updates um and if we get past the vetting process as you said and it's viable then the public engagement starts to to measure the feeling of the public about the location. Thank you very much for being here. >> Yes. So very new to Vermont, very new to especially OPC. Uh these offices probably places I've lived I've never heard this product before so um forgive my neglect misunderstanding but trying to understand it. I would be very curious to understand uh what sort of studies have been done for it >> Yeah. Um a couple things. One, we're going to have lots of data on all that, you know, and and one thing that I think and people that, you know, don't know a lot about this that's helpful for people to um understand when they kind of envision what this looks like, it's not like a place where you walk in and people are using drugs. You know, it's like there is one space that's for that that people would like identify to a receptionist like, hey, I'm here today. I'd like to use, you know, the consumption space and then also I'm hoping I can see a medical provider for this other thing I put on, something like that, you know. So it's not something that's done, you know, where everyone is seeing that that that comes into the site. So that's one thing that's important. laundry there, definitely extra bathrooms for sure. We're doing that. Um you know, um getting snacks and food and um you know, having a sense of community and meeting with a case manager to see where they're at on the housing list and all these things. It's very likely that more people are coming for those types of community needs than are actually coming for the safe consumption services. Um it's it's an important component and people will certainly come every day for that, but it's also like a community hub for services and and and and healthcare. Um so, you know, all of that's a a really a net gain for what we really need and really can. Um but um >> Yes. >> Which is getting cut in 2027 drastically even with the election yesterday forgive me even with the election yesterday what they cut is law for 2027. So we've got to figure out a way to get the points so. >> part of it I think is that the beds just simply don't exist for treatment and the other thing that I've heard is that uh I think most folks understand that going into a treatment after actively using for a period of time that it's not something that's going to be solved in two weeks so making sure that the funding first we got to deal with the access we got to increase the number of beds we've got to get access and then how the funding to get people through the whole program because you know putting them back on the street after a halfway house That's my parting thought on that and I think we'll segue into the counselor Yeah I I was going to say some of the things that you just said uh this in a way is another argument for the OPC because Vermont is there was a recovery uh forum a few like two weeks ago three weeks ago and one of the things that was brought up was the fact that if people need to go into recovery and they could get to New Hampshire they would be better off in New Hampshire that had hundreds more beds than we do and also would keep people longer uh because fentanyl anything that's associated with fentanyl is has higher um numbers of relapse amounts of relapsing and it's harder to kick um New Hampshire and Maine hundreds more beds uh for not only recovery but for mental health Vermont had like does 25 and we're cutting cutting some of them so we are really bad space and until we can get into a better space with offering recovery on demand I mean people want to force people to recover >> That's what I always say >> and they don't even understand that we don't have recovery on demand and that is a huge huge problem um I so we need something right we need something in the meantime that we can that can be set up faster with these opioid settlement funds then the recovery beds especially recovery beds uh for people who are on Medicaid and don't have access to insurance. Because that is a very very significant problem. On point, if you like Google on point New York City, there'll be a lot of stuff in addition to what Bella can send you. And they were in they opened two and two areas that were really really struggling with the drug crisis in that area. Regarding crime, the last thing I'll say is yeah, we have crime that is driven by the drug crisis, absolutely. Will that go away? I I don't know. We need more changes in the legislature. We have very bad laws around shoplifting. They were changed, but it's there are definitely individuals that are Yeah, they are a lot of them. >> Thank you. Thank you for for coming in. This will forever be an This will be an ongoing conversation But I know we're over time, so I'll just quickly mention a couple of things. There has been a number of public forums related to property tax fairness. Our goal is to have a also within brainstorming the proposal with the community. And that will go to council in December for consideration to potentially put on the ballot. We also have a couple of charter changes that are being discussed including something related to non-citizen voters and related to the structure of our government and appointments. So for those of you who might be interested in charter changes. And then the last thing I'll mention is giving all of these conversations we've been having related to the challenges and crisis I've been thinking about how to support youth and we are going discussing that with the racial equity inclusion belonging committee along with counselor Grant as well. So just so you're thinking we are very much thinking about how do we prevent some of these types of crisis that we're we're scared to see. Counselor Grant do you want to update on the chief and public safety? >> Yes oh >> Oh and for counselor Grant there's been I think you know that the mayor sent up an update about the chief as well. >> Yes uh so we're getting very close to having a new chief of police. If you do not receive the mayor's emails I highly encourage you to sign up for them but if you email Laura or myself we can send you the announcement with the background of the new chief the vote will be on Monday. Um I want to say that of he was one of four candidates that were sent to us [snorts] the interview committee. I thought all four candidates were excellent. For [snorts] myself I was really looking for someone with expertise to work with a department that was in distress and our department is in distress. Um he definitely fit the bill he had some time in Newburgh and if you look up Newburgh New York it is a very very hard town. That department was in distress that department New York State has a form of accreditation for their police departments that department is not accredited that department had lost a significant number of staff. Um, and so to make a long story short, listening to the experience that he had, how he brought back that department, listening to other experiences that he's had in his roughly 20 25 year career, um, starting as a a you know, quote unquote beat cop, working his way all the way up. Um, the experience of working in a community that was diverse, that was something that was very important. Um, experience, understanding, training, in a lot of other things. Um, so his name along with two others, uh, the committee recommended three of the four to be interviewed by the come to Burlington, be interviewed by the mayor and additional um, stakeholder groups. So that was part of like the the public process and involvement. Um, I I want to measure expectations. Uh, changes that we need aren't going to happen overnight, but the fact that we would have a permanent chief, I think if everyone knew that, oh, we're going to have Chief Burke for for five more years, right? Officers would would step up and say, yeah, I'm going to apply to that department. I think not knowing you would become in and be leading that department is one of the reasons why we don't even have people from, you know, Burlington, uh, applying to the position. So having stability is going to be really, really important and we will also have Chief Burke for a few months so we have a really excellent opportunity to have that overlap. Um, this is a guy who believes in community policing and I think he's going to put himself out there the same which Burke has. I think that's something our our that we really care about. Um, our committee of policing had previously gone down to zero and that was one of the major complaints in the community, not having that presence, not having um responses. Uh so and I think that I think from the get-go there'll be an excellent working relationship with the mayor. The mayor has a great relationship with Chief Burke, did not have as much with the the previous police which interfered with moving forward with certain things. Um so I'm just looking forward to that that stability and um looking forward to the city meeting him and welcoming him. And I do want to also say that part of the process was the initial uh background uh check that was done by IACP, the International Association of the Chiefs of Police. They were the organization that the city used to help us in this search to find qualifying candidates that meet the needs of our city. Um and then per uh the state of Vermont guidelines, there was uh another thorough background uh background check done in addition to a lie detector test. So for police chiefs there's this extra uh layer on. So any questions please uh send them our way. Um it is yeah it's just one more step forward. Gets sort of being Great. We have a bunch of other things but we're out of time. The the the uh the conversation on youth which is really really um excellent. I think I'll put it in a front porch forum post so people can be linked to the meeting because it is something that we really need to think about. We continue to have issues with uh youth 12 to 17. That's really an area that we don't have activities You need them to do but they would like to do. Thank you. >> Anybody have an item for the forum? I think a forum should be put at the beginning of the meeting in the future. So if we could consider that. Thank you. >> Uh yeah, briefly. 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