2026-10-08 - Budget & Public Employees Committee

Summary

  • Rasheen Aldridge chaired. The September 30 minutes were approved on a roll call of four ayes (Michael Browning moved, Daniela Velázquez seconded); Matthew Devoti did not vote and was excused at the end of the meeting.
  • The only bill heard was Board Bill 59, which would put a question on the April 6, 2027 ballot on reallocating the transit portion of the 2017 half-cent sales tax from the North-South MetroLink light rail alignment to a bus rapid transit line or other mass transit initiatives. Aldridge presented while Browning chaired. See Bus Rapid Transit Sales Tax Ballot Measure (BB 59).
  • Aldridge said the light rail plan would cover about 5.6 miles and 10 stations at an estimated $1.1 billion, against a longer BRT line with more stations at a lower estimated cost (figures as transcribed).
  • A Metro/Bi-State presenter said BB 59 adds no new taxes and that over $100 million is already reserved, and discussed federal Capital Investment Grant competition, noting many projects have shifted to BRT.
  • Citizens for Modern Transit and St. Louis Realtors supported the bill, citing a study in which homes near the most frequent bus routes appreciated 144% against 67% over six years.
  • Two committee members questioned whether "other mass transit initiatives" was too broad and could let later decisions move away from BRT without another vote; Aldridge acknowledged the language is broad.
  • Browning supported BRT but warned that public understanding is low and the measure could fail without education. Open houses were announced for October 19 and October 22, plus a virtual session on October 26.
  • Public speakers asked for an electric-bus amendment, for express-bus language, or for no vote that day so the community could revisit the language; one opposed the pivot away from light rail. No vote on BB 59 was taken at the meeting.
  • There were no resolutions or committee discussions, and one written testimony was placed in the committee's shared folder. The committee adjourned by voice vote.

Sources

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Transcript

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Transcript

05:05Good morning. This is the budget and

05:07public employees committee. Today is

05:10October 8th. It is 10:01. Madame clerk,

05:13please call the role.

05:15Alderwoman Sier,

05:18Vice Chair Brownie

05:20>> present.

05:24>> Alderwoman Velasquez

05:26>> present.

05:28>> Alderman Devote.

05:31>> Chair Aldrich,

05:32>> present.

05:34>> Four present. We have quorum.

05:37>> Thank you, Madam Clerk. With that, we

05:38have established a quorum. Next item on

05:40the agenda is approval of the minutes

05:42from Wednesday, September 30th, 2026.

05:44I'll take a motion for the approval of

05:46the minute.

05:47>> So moved.

05:48>> Second.

05:49>> It was moved by the alderman from the

05:51ninth, seconded by the alderwoman from

05:52the sixth. Madam clerk, please call the

05:54role.

05:55>> Alderwoman Sier

05:59>> I.

06:00>> Vice Chair Browning

06:01>> I.

06:02>> Alderwoman Velasquez

06:04>> I.

06:06>> Alderman Devote Dvote.

06:09>> Chair Aldrich

06:10>> I.

06:10>> Four I votes.

06:12>> Thank you Madam Clerk. With that, we

06:13have approved the minutes from September

06:1530th, 2026. The next item of the agenda

06:18is board bills for review, which board

06:20bill 59, which I will turn it over to

06:23Alderman Browning to chair the committee

06:27meeting while I go up and present the

06:28board bill.

06:31>> Thank you, Chair Aldridge. Um,

06:36you are recognized on board bill number

06:3959.

06:56Thank you, Alman Browning. Madam Clerk,

06:58would you read the summary of board bill

07:0059?

07:04Board bill number 59 introduced by

07:06Ottoman Rashene Aldrich and President

07:08Green, an ordinance calling and

07:11providing for the holding of an election

07:13in the city of St. Louis on April 6,

07:162027 for the purpose of submitting to

07:18the qualified voters of the city of St.

07:21Lewis a proposal to reallocate the

07:23portion of a 1/ half of 1% sales tax

07:27dedicated to North South Metro Link to

07:30bus rampant transit north south metro

07:34link or other mass transit initiatives

07:37as authorized by the governing body of

07:39the city of St. Louis and containing a

07:41cability clause.

07:44>> Thank you madam clerk and members of the

07:45budget committee. Um so board bill uh 59

07:49as I stated in the summary um is

07:51changing the language of a tax that was

07:54passed here in 2017

07:57um what this language is trying to do

07:59for board bill 59 is open up uh it a

08:02little bit to make it a little bit more

08:04flexible. So back in 2017 voters in the

08:07city of St. Louis approved Proposition 1

08:10which was a half cent sales tax that

08:13went to various items. uh one was

08:15transit, another one was neighborhood

08:17revitalization, workforce development,

08:20public safety and infrastructure. Um and

08:23in the transit part of the uh language

08:26uh that tax was collecting as the tax

08:29was collecting 60% of that tax went to

08:31transit, 10% went to neighborhood

08:33revitalization, uh 10% went to

08:35workforce, 10% to the public safety um

08:39area, as well as 10% to infrastructure.

08:41Um and as we've been hearing uh over the

08:44last few years uh that tax for the

08:47transit was supposed to be used for uh

08:49the north south metro link uh light

08:52rail. Um as we've over the last few

08:56years what we end up uh noticing is that

09:00uh light rail without having kind of

09:02friendly partners uh in our federal

09:05government and other agencies is just

09:07very costly. Um, so with also still

09:10trying to make sure that we uh listen to

09:13the voters and do what they asked by

09:16passing Proposition One to make sure

09:18that there is funding for transit. Um

09:21leaders kind of pivoted to a different

09:24model to make sure that there is still

09:26um accessible but also fast transit in

09:28the city of St. Louis, which is um

09:31potentially looking at how do we go from

09:33the light rail uh method to BRT. So

09:37board bill 59, what it does is it

09:39changed the language. And on board bill

09:41on page four of six is the language that

09:44would go to the ballot, which just opens

09:46up the language a little bit more to try

09:48to make it more flexible to allow bus

09:50rapid transit or any other transit uh

09:53incentives that would allow uh for the

09:56city of St. Louis um to go into an

09:59agreement to allow a different kind of

10:01method of um transit. Again, this would

10:05put this on the ballot uh in 2027. So,

10:08this went on the ballot in um 2017.

10:13And it's important that um instead of

10:16just shifting money around for uh going

10:19from light rail to BRT, I think one of

10:21the things that a lot of my colleagues

10:23here said uh in this budget committee,

10:25but just in general, is that people

10:27voted on this tax uh with the language

10:29that was in there for light rail. Um, I

10:32was one of the folks that also voted for

10:33it, uh, because it would been great to

10:36have light rail, but I think what we

10:38notice is just the the the cost of how

10:41much light rail will be. Um and at the

10:44end of the day, since voters did vote on

10:46this tax, um we want to make sure that

10:48voters voice are also part of

10:50potentially seeing opening up the

10:52language so that we can continue to have

10:54a different type of transit, but a in my

10:57opinion a still very massive uh rapid

11:00transit that would help people get from

11:02home to work or from their job to um to

11:06their house. But um we want to make sure

11:08that the people voices at the table. So,

11:10board bill 59 would uh if come out of

11:13committee and vote on the floor would

11:15allow voters to uh vote yes in the

11:18affirmative or no if they would like to

11:21um change the language a little bit. So

11:23again, that um right now if we do not uh

11:26change the language, we're in a kind of

11:28quagmire position in the city of St.

11:30Louis um because we are collecting funds

11:33for transit and the language is very um

11:37restrictive to the north south metro

11:39link um and what this would do is allow

11:43like I said a little bit more

11:44flexibility of what potential um transit

11:48could look like in the city of St.

11:49Louis. I do have some speakers here to

11:52uh also speak on this, but I do want to

11:55just mention um the the cost of pivoting

11:59from uh the light rail to uh potential

12:03pivoting to uh bus rapid transit. So, uh

12:06currently, if we were to do uh the light

12:09rail plan, it would roughly cover about

12:115.6 miles and that would be about 10

12:13stations and it's an estimated cost of

12:16$1.1 billion.

12:18uh if we were to adopt uh not only adopt

12:21this board bill and voters would vote

12:23yes in 2000 or next year in April um it

12:27would expand not just from 5.6 6 milesi,

12:30but it would basically double. Um, we're

12:32talking about a longer stretch of area

12:34where people can be able to get access

12:35to transit. Uh, 11.5 miles. We're

12:39talking about more stations. Um, 23

12:42stations that would be uh accessible for

12:44people. And my computer just died. And I

12:47think roughly it would cost about 20 223

12:51million.

12:55It would be uh more than half of 1.1

12:58billion. I could tell you that.

13:02Thank you. 300 uh potential 360 uh

13:05million. Uh but the point of that is is

13:08that uh pivoting to bus rapid transit uh

13:11allows a lot more um ability to capture

13:14more people to be able to travel across

13:16the city. We're talking about um more

13:19locations where people can be able to be

13:20picked up. And I would say um as we

13:24hopefully would look to expand on BRT um

13:28it's a lot easier to create um safe

13:32stations for people to have bus rapid

13:34transit uh compared to the light rail

13:36where that would be a little bit more of

13:38a massive lift of um installing the

13:41lines, digging through the ground. Um,

13:43so, uh, again, we want to make sure that

13:46we open up the language with this and

13:48allow voters to have an input on, I

13:50think, a plan that, um, may not be light

13:53rail, but is just as, um, flexible, but

13:56just as quick, uh, to be able to get

13:59people, um, throughout the city of St.

14:01Louis. And with that, Mr. Chair, if it's

14:03okay, I do have uh, Mr. Toby from Metro

14:06here that would like to present a

14:09slideshow uh, to the committee.

14:12Absolutely. Uh Mr. Roach, you're welcome

14:15to present at this time.

14:22>> Thank you, Alderman. Really appreciate

14:25the opportunity to come and talk about

14:27this project. So, there's a couple of

14:28concepts I'm going to talk about right

14:30off the bat. It is twice as long and

14:33half as much. So one of the things that

14:36we put together with a an alignment like

14:39this is we go for what essentially is

14:42federal funding CIG funding. Currently

14:45in the capital investment grant Q there

14:48are around 39 projects

14:5133 have shifted to this BRT alternative.

14:55And if I can go to the next slide

14:56please. And the reason for that is very

14:59clear. In 2017 uh 17 when the folks um

15:05uh voted for this uh original Metroink

15:08alignment uh we wanted to look at

15:11expanding transit on a north south basis

15:13and let me just tell you I I would love

15:15to expand Metroink has been very very

15:17successful for us but in looking what

15:20are our alternatives

15:22um sorry I'm waiting for my slide to

15:25advance um we want to look at what are

15:28things that are most efficient Remember,

15:30transit is about efficiency and

15:32certainly we didn't have an idea back in

15:342016 and 17 of what BRT what that BRT

15:39project meant. And in fact, one of the

15:42problems that we had when we were we

15:44were looking at the design of Metroink

15:47alignment is we weren't able to get to

15:49all corners of the city. I had several

15:52um neighborhood groups for instance in

15:54the Dutchtown area that was disappointed

15:56that we weren't going far enough.

15:58Remember you get if you think of that

16:01city neighborhood, it's very dense, very

16:03transit dependent. It it gives us very

16:06high modal splits. So it means that when

16:09we're able to make uh a pivot to green

16:12line, we're able to satisfy

16:15[clears throat] much more of the policy

16:16initiatives of the city. There we go.

16:18Very first slide. And you see this slide

16:21is is talking about that 11.5 miles. we

16:24can make it all the way out to the

16:26corridor all the way out to Goodfellow

16:29making it to the city county border. Uh

16:31that northern section is very key for

16:34us. For instance, as far as driving of

16:36wrership, we have a very high wrership

16:39that is known as a modal split in that

16:41area. And if we are looking indeed at at

16:44rebuilding parts of the city and

16:46supporting that, we want to do it uh

16:49with uh transit that makes sense, that

16:52that is effective, and that uh can

16:55compete for those federal funds. We can

16:57go to the next slide, please.

17:00As Alderman Aldridge uh mentioned, we're

17:03talking about 11.5 miles, 23 stations,

17:07uh ridership that is very robust and

17:10strong, and a large um uh delta as far

17:15as capital costs from 360 million to 590

17:19million. And that's a big delta. And and

17:21you may ask why. Can we go to the next

17:23slide, please? And that is because we

17:26have an opportunity for a full street

17:30solution. Sorry if we can go to the next

17:32slide.

17:35Very good. So let's look at this slide.

17:38A lot of what we have been showing or

17:40what we've been hearing in the public

17:42meetings is that the public didn't

17:44really understand what this product

17:46meant. And what we want to take the

17:48opportunity along with the board of

17:50aldermen and with the leaders uh

17:52president of the board and of course the

17:54mayor is look at these as an opportunity

17:57to rebuild large sections of the city

17:59with the amenities that are very very

18:02important. My team will tell you that

18:04one of the number one questions we get

18:06when we are out in the public in St.

18:08Louis is about trees and I think that's

18:11very relevant because folks want to

18:14understand how do these transit assets

18:17work into neighborhoods? How do they

18:20enhance the neighborhoods? Whether

18:22that's with streetscape, whether that is

18:24with lighting, whether that is with

18:27traffic amenities. And so as we were

18:30moving forward and looking at some uh

18:33these alternatives, BRT really started

18:35to make sense. If we can go to the next

18:37slide.

18:40So I'm sharing with you several street

18:42views of how we can change that. Looking

18:45at a bus only lane. A lot of these

18:48corridors are of course what are known

18:50as overt traffic or overimproved for

18:54what are the traffic loads of these uh

18:56corridors. We're seeing that for

18:58instance here on Natural Bridge. We have

19:00that in Jefferson Avenue. We have an

19:03opportunity here to really re-imagine

19:06sections of the city and think of

19:08putting a transit asset here that

19:11enhances for instance those tree lawns.

19:14You see opportunities for bike trails

19:16and pedestrian access. In other words,

19:19being sure that the fabric of

19:21transportation which includes those

19:23elements including uh pedestrian access

19:27etc have all kind of different

19:29alternatives. Next slide please.

19:35But one of the things that was

19:36definitely clear, for instance, when we

19:39came to the board of alderman in in a

19:41committee meetings is the inexactness or

19:46uh essentially uh the desire to be sure

19:49to go to the public and be sure that we

19:52were delivering a product that the

19:54public was interested in. There's no

19:56question in the board langu in the

19:58language of the original bill, it

20:00mentions Metroink specifically and

20:03Alderman Browning, I think you were one

20:05of the ones who who questioned very hard

20:07us about the exactness of that language

20:10and a pivot. One of the things that were

20:13advanced um by several of your

20:15colleagues and uh I believe uh Alderman

20:18Aldridge as well was we needed a little

20:21bit more exact language as far as the

20:24public was concerned to be sure that we

20:27were being accountable and transparent

20:29about the shift to the BRT product.

20:32Remember that original bill did not

20:34mention BRT. And so I don't want to I

20:39think it's reasonable to assume that

20:41what the leaders thought was yes, we

20:44have strong support of transit, but we

20:46needed to look at and be sure that the

20:48public would be in support of this shift

20:51in mode. So it's very reasonable for us

20:54to do this. I want to um emphasize that

20:57this board bill 59, there are no new

21:00taxes whatsoever. All of this money is

21:02being held by the city at the time.

21:04there is over $100 million of capital

21:08that is reserved for this expansion. It

21:10can only be used for that purpose. Um,

21:14and this board bill makes that very very

21:16clear. I also want to mention if we can

21:19move to the next slide

21:22and I'm throwing a lot of pictures at

21:23you, but one of the things when we went

21:25out in our polling is that it was very

21:27clear that the public did not have a

21:29good understanding of what this product

21:31is. What is BRT? What is bus rapid

21:34transit? Indeed, it provides what is

21:37that kind of very very frequent service

21:40that is half as much as light rail and

21:43something that we can move out. So it'

21:45be very very frequent service with

21:47stations, very similar to trains, but

21:51only using these vehicles with rubber

21:53tires. So we're seeing that kind of very

21:55very dense frequency essentially spine

21:58service that would be um giving us

22:01opportunities to do really enhanced

22:04development along these corridors and

22:06some of several of these corridors are

22:08very ripe for that and we have seen this

22:11shift in other areas of the country. We

22:14have seen this shift in Minneapolis, in

22:16San Jose, and in San Antonio where they

22:20have moved from light rail projects to

22:22BRT projects because of cost and because

22:26of the inflationary pressures. So, I

22:28just wanted to be sure to be very brief

22:30uh Alderman Aldridge and and be

22:33respectful of the committee's uh

22:35questions and be sure that we were being

22:37thorough in this. Thank you for your

22:40time and for the interaction with the

22:42public. And with that, I yield the

22:44floor.

22:47>> If it's okay with you, uh, Alman

22:49Bronner, before we go to questions from

22:50the committee, I have like two more

22:52expert speakers. Um, and then maybe go

22:55to questions.

22:56>> Absolutely. Go ahead and introduce your

22:58speakers.

22:58>> Thank you, Mr. uh, Chairman. Uh, next

23:00speaker I'd like to have come up is the

23:02president of CMT, Miss Kim.

23:13Good morning, chair and committee

23:14members. Thank you for having us here

23:16today as the regional transit advocacy.

23:19>> I'm sorry. Could you uh go ahead and

23:22state your name and who you are up to?

23:25>> Kim Cus, CEO of Citizens for Modern

23:27Transit. Good morning. As the regional

23:30transit advocacy organization, CMT is

23:34here today in support of moving forward

23:36board bill 59. This is not a new tax,

23:40but a tweaking of the language to allow

23:42the city to consider a largescale

23:45transit investment in this corridor.

23:48Some facts to consider, and Tolby

23:50touched on these as well as Alderman

23:52Aldrich. The pivot to BRT from light

23:56rail increases the footprint of this

23:58project from 5 miles to 11 and a half

24:02miles from 11 stations to 23 stations

24:06while opening up access to St. Louis

24:09County at Natural Bridge in Goodfellow.

24:13No largecale transit capital project

24:17would move forward without a significant

24:20federal investment in the amount of

24:23hundreds of millions of dollars in not

24:25only the city of St. Louis but this

24:27region. That would be a win. The 2017

24:31funding could serve as that local match.

24:35Without this funding and language tweak,

24:38there is no local source currently to

24:41move any project forward in this

24:43corridor.

24:44The Green Line BRT project is already in

24:48the project development phase for a

24:50federal capital investment grant. There

24:53are only 39 projects nationwide in

24:57project development.

24:5935 are BRT. only one remains as light

25:04rail. This technology is winning

25:07nationwide because of its lower cost to

25:11deliver premium service similar to light

25:14rail.

25:16CMT and the St. Louis Realators released

25:19a study early this past summer on the

25:22impact of high frequency transit

25:24investment on housing values. The

25:27findings showed that residential

25:29properties near higher frequency transit

25:33routes in the city of St. Louis

25:35experienced significantly stronger

25:39prices price appreciation than those

25:42near less frequent transit. Homes near

25:46the city's most frequent bus routes,

25:49including the Grand Line, saw price

25:51increases of 144%

25:55compared to 67%

25:57over a six-year time frame. We support

26:01moving this bill forward to give city

26:03voters the opportunity to weigh in on

26:06whether their tax dollars can be used to

26:09move transit investment forward in this

26:11corridor. Thank you for your time this

26:13morning.

26:15Thank you.

26:19>> And last, Mr. Chairman, I have Mr.

26:20Charlie from the St. Louis Realities,

26:26>> Mr. Hinderiter. You're recognized.

26:29>> Good morning, chair and members of the

26:30committee. I'm Charlie Hinderer, chief

26:32advocacy officer and director of

26:33commercial services at St. Louis

26:34Realtors. Thank you for the opportunity

26:36to speak in support of board bill 59.

26:39Talby and Kim have explained the transit

26:41investment opportunity. I want to take a

26:43minute to focus on what that opportunity

26:46means for housing, real estate, and the

26:48strength of our neighborhoods. In real

26:50estate, location matters. Part of what

26:52makes a location valuable is what people

26:53can reach from it. Schools, health,

26:56healthcare, jobs, groceries, and other

26:58daily needs. Frequent, reliable transit

27:01expands those connections. That's why

27:03St. Louis Realtors partnered with CMT on

27:07a housing study that was authored by the

27:09Center for Neighborhood Technology that

27:10Kim referenced. You can find a copy of

27:12that report on St. Louis Realtor's

27:13website or on CMT's website. The study

27:16examined nearly 10,000 residential sales

27:18in the city of St. Louis and found that

27:20price appreciation

27:22uh price appreciation for homes was

27:24significantly higher in areas with high

27:26frequency transit. It also reviewed what

27:29BRT did for home values and commercial

27:31property values across the country. In

27:34Eugene, Oregon, for example, residential

27:36sale prices near BRT rose 49% over four

27:40years compared to 25% for properties

27:42outside the BRT area. In Boston, for

27:45commercial property, those prices near

27:48BRT rose 84% compared to 21% outside of

27:51transit areas. The report also

27:53highlights Richmond, Virginia, where the

27:55introduction of BRT and accompanying

27:57transit changes expanded access to

27:59employment. Residents gained access on

28:02average to 2,000 additional jobs within

28:05a 1-hour transit trip. Transit is

28:07critical for economic mobility. For

28:10homeowners, stronger neighborhood demand

28:12can help build equity. For commercial

28:14property owners and businesses, better

28:16connections expand access to workers and

28:18customers. For households, reliable

28:20transit can broaden housing choices and

28:22reduce dependency on cars for every

28:25trip. The details matter. frequent

28:27transit service, safe pedestrian

28:29connections, and stations integrated

28:30into surrounding neighborhoods. We

28:32should pair transit investment with

28:34housing production, home repair, and

28:36preservation of affordable housing so

28:37existing residents can share in the

28:39benefits. Board Bill 59 creates a path

28:41toward an investment that connects

28:43people to opportunity and strengthens

28:45places where they live and work. Thank

28:47you.

28:49>> Thank you.

28:52>> All right. And uh open up for any

28:54questions, Mr. Chairman.

28:56Uh absolutely. So we'll start uh online.

29:05>> Thank you, Vice Chairman. Um thank you

29:09for bringing this legislation forward.

29:10Alderman Aldridge. Um I think my uh key

29:14question is in the board bill language.

29:18It says

29:21the shall the portion of the tax revenue

29:24currently allocated to a north south

29:26metro link be allocated instead for a

29:28north south metro link line a bus rapid

29:31transit line or other mass mass transit

29:34initiatives. How is the city defining

29:37other mass transit initiatives? Um, I

29:41know my constitu constituents feel very

29:43strongly about making sure that we check

29:45in with them before we pivot the

29:47direction of the project and I'm

29:48concerned that that language is so broad

29:50that it would essentially allow the city

29:52to decide upon any mass transit

29:54initiative without checking in with the

29:56voters and getting their approval.

29:58>> Thank you, Alderwoman. Good question. I

30:00have Mr. uh Scott Oggovie here who has

30:03been part of uh these transit

30:04conversations who can kind of help

30:07answer that.

30:12Um hello alder woman. Uh my name is

30:14Scott Oggov. Um I work for the city's

30:16planning and urban design agency. So the

30:20um intent of the language,

30:22>> Mr. Oggov, could you please speak into

30:24the mic? Thank you.

30:29Um, the intent of the language in the

30:31board bill, as you know, of course, the

30:342017 language ended up being too narrow

30:38to deliver on the project that, you

30:41know, both the city and voters wanted.

30:44And the intent of the language is to

30:46make sure that in the future we can

30:49deliver valuable transit improvements

30:52for St. Louis residents and for transit

30:55riders using um this this tax revenue.

30:59Now, of course, the project today that

31:03we are working on um and that we are

31:06advancing as quickly as possible is this

31:08green line bus rapid transit project,

31:10which is a a still a very substantial

31:13transit expansion and a big capital

31:15project. However, you know, someday we

31:19will pay that project off and we will

31:21still have this source of revenue and we

31:24want to make sure that there's enough

31:27flexibility to do the next project with

31:31um with this revenue. Now, we today we

31:35don't know what that next project is.

31:38You know, we could imagine what it could

31:40be. everything from bus service

31:42enhancements on other corridors to metro

31:45link enhancements

31:47um you know to to maybe some ideas that

31:51you know we haven't come up with yet but

31:53regardless of what it is there there

31:56would be multiple public processes in

31:59order to allocate that funding it'll

32:01stay in that transit category very much

32:04in the same way that the existing sales

32:07taxes that fund um metransit operations

32:11always stay in that transit category,

32:13but they are allocated each year by the

32:15board of alderman. There will be a

32:18public process for that funding in the

32:20f. It'll involve the economic

32:23development sales tax board. It'll

32:25involve the board of alderman making

32:27those allocations and it'll involve as

32:30the board of estimate and aortionment.

32:32And if it's a really substantial capital

32:35project, it could potentially involve

32:37East West Gateway approval um as well.

32:41So,

32:41>> hey, I can understand what you're

32:43naming, but my question is, does this

32:45language allow the city to pivot to

32:47other mass transit options without a

32:49public vote? All the entities you named,

32:51ENA and the board of alderman, that's

32:53not what my question is around. My

32:54question is does that language that is

32:57going to the voters mean that it is

32:58possible that the city would be able to

33:00approve another mass transit initiative

33:03without the approval of voters the

33:04electorate?

33:06>> Is is your question specifically about a

33:09big capital project in relationship to

33:12green line bus rapid transit? My

33:15question is, does the other mass transit

33:19language does that allow the scope that

33:21the city is able to do without going

33:23back in front of voters? Does that allow

33:26is that limited to the north south like

33:28corridor? This this metro bus rapid

33:30transit we're talking about or could it

33:32allow for another pivot beyond what

33:34voters are voting on? Because like you

33:36said, well, you know, the last time we

33:38put this on the ballot, it was narrow

33:40and we had to pivot. Um I you know I

33:42would say my constituents don't view the

33:45narrowness of the language as a negative

33:47thing because for them it's like okay

33:48well that means that the city wants to

33:50do a different project. The city has to

33:52come back and ask for our approval as

33:54opposed to you know elected officials or

33:56other entities being able to make their

33:58own decision. They would have to come

33:59back in front of us. And so what

34:01happened is once we wanted to you know

34:03pivot away from um the railway we have

34:06to come back and ask folders around bus

34:08rapid transit because the language was

34:09narrow. This language seems a lot

34:11broader to me and a lot more vague, and

34:13I'm concerned that it would allow for

34:15the city to pivot to another mass

34:17transit project beyond bus rapid transit

34:20without needing to seek the approval of

34:22voters.

34:24>> The only the only project that the city

34:27and the region the only big capital

34:29project that the city and the region are

34:31pursuing right now is green line bus

34:34rapid transit. That is the only thing on

34:38the menu today. Um it's a it's a very

34:42robust and substantial project and it

34:46would be still several years before we

34:48could break ground on that project. Um

34:51getting FDA approval, getting that

34:53federal funding and then it'll be, you

34:56know, several years of paying for that

34:58project. So there's there's not going to

35:00be any revenue.

35:03>> That's not my question. Say what we're

35:04discussing today. My question is, does

35:07the language in this ballot initiative,

35:09does it allow for the city to pivot to

35:12another project, I'm not talking about

35:13today. I understand what we're

35:14discussing today. Does it allow for the

35:17city to pivot to another mass transit

35:19project without seeking voter approval?

35:21I know what we're discussing today. I

35:23know we're discussing BRT. I understand

35:25that it's going to take time to build

35:26this out and get all the initial

35:27funding. That's not my question. My

35:29question is, does the language on this

35:31ballot initiative that we're putting to

35:32voters, if it is passed and approved,

35:35would it mean that the city would have

35:36the possibility to pivot to a in a

35:39different direction for mass transit um

35:42without seeking voter approval?

35:44>> Um, so I don't know if I'm the person

35:46who can definitively answer that

35:48question. I think um Alderman Aldridge,

35:50would you like to

35:53>> Thank you. I mean, I think that the

35:55simple question is yes, the way that the

35:58language in here would probably allow um

36:01for other transit options, but I think

36:03what Scott made very clear is right now

36:05the city is only focused on um BRT. And

36:08even um if this would get passed by the

36:10voters of the city of St. Louis and and

36:13uh the next year ballot, I think like

36:14Scott said, there's just going to be so

36:16much work that has to go into trying to

36:18get BRT still across the finish line. I

36:20think right now in the current fund um

36:22that it's been the sales tax has been

36:24collecting there's probably roughly 118

36:28um uh is that number right 118 million

36:30that's in there. Um so there's still a

36:32lot of work that needs to be done to one

36:34ensure that uh that the capital is is

36:37growing and that other partners are tied

36:39in. But I think in the simple language

36:42um yes it would probably allow uh for

36:45the city to move forward in a different

36:47direction. And I would say also that's

36:48why we as older people um that have

36:52committees such as PIU public

36:53infrastructure once we hear these things

36:55and I know we all work very well with

36:57our planning and agency design um

37:00alderwoman um and if something like that

37:03were to arise hopefully if we still hear

37:05but even the next generation um if it is

37:07a mass transit that the city would want

37:09to move forward in I'm sure that would

37:11not go um not be heard in the news and

37:14an opportunity where um we as leaders

37:17could intervene into that.

37:20>> Understood. Thank you. Um I just I don't

37:25you know I'm very supportive of BRT and

37:27so if we desire to ask the voters to

37:28approve a BRT I'm okay. But I don't know

37:31that I can support language that is as

37:34vague as any other mass transit project

37:37without unless there's going to be like

37:39an addendum that says like that specific

37:41mass transit project will have to be put

37:44in front of voters as well. Um, you

37:46know, just a real time example is

37:48obviously we were talking about railway.

37:50Um, we got to a new administration and

37:53both federally and locally and now we're

37:55pivoting to BRT and we have to come back

37:57and ask the voters. But that was an

37:59important in my opinion was an important

38:00check and balance to make sure that, you

38:02know, a new administration could not

38:04just ask uh for you know could not just

38:07make the uni unilateral decision that we

38:09want to pivot to railway but that we're

38:11all required to come back to voters. So,

38:13you know, I am in support of this and if

38:15we're able to narrow the scope to bus

38:16rapid transit or add language that says,

38:19you know, if we pivot to a mass transit,

38:21a different mass transit project, it

38:23would come back into the voters, I would

38:24be happy to support it. But I don't

38:27right now it's just too broad. And I

38:29know for my residents, it is just not

38:32changing this without going back in

38:34front of voters specifically is a no-go

38:36for them.

38:37>> And I totally hear you. Um, I think why

38:39we're in the quagmire that we in now is

38:42because of trying to be so um detailed

38:46and the reality is transit is constantly

38:49changing and evolving. And you know, I

38:51think the language of why we we worked

38:54with the experts uh in um that does

38:58transit and and work with Metro and work

39:00with the uh to just put that other mass

39:03of transit uh language in there because

39:05we don't know what it's going to be in

39:0710 and 15 years. And I definitely agree

39:09with you that voters voice um should be

39:11at the table. Uh but you know if this

39:14does not uh pass and I know me and

39:16you've had uh quite long conversations

39:19about the support of BRT so that is not

39:21a question. I know you support BRT you

39:23know say this don't pass um in uh in

39:27April then we are stuck with the

39:29language that's of the light rail right

39:31and then we're just stuck with just

39:33collecting funds and then no transit is

39:35happening. Um, so instead of having to

39:37keep coming back and kind of being these

39:39quagmire, I think the point of kind of

39:42adding that other mass transitive

39:44initiatives, which I could tell you now

39:46talking with the mayor's office and

39:47other folks like it is BRT. Um, I think

39:50that's the most efficient method right

39:52now is the most like cost-saving method.

39:54It's uh we've seen other cities do it. I

39:57think Mr. Toby talked about it as well

39:58as other cities just in our own state

40:01like Kansas City has BRT and the

40:03economic income that has come from that

40:05has been a huge boom. Um but there's no

40:08other uh kind of mass u transit

40:12initiatives out there at the moment. Uh

40:14but the challenge is if we continue to

40:16make it very detailed, it's kind of like

40:18a plus and minus, right? if you get too

40:19detailed, we're kind of almost locked in

40:22um and have to keep coming back to

40:24through the board of aldermen and

40:25through voters, which not against um but

40:28it also makes it where we're not sure

40:30how we move funds that we are currently

40:33taxing residents into just sitting in

40:34the account at times like what we

40:36currently are sitting in at the moment.

40:37But I I get where you come from.

40:40>> No, and I understand too that you you

40:41know, obviously there's interest in

40:43having some flexibility and the the

40:45ability to pivot. I just think that

40:46because transit is ever changing and

40:49because this is something that voters

40:50voted on to approve, I personally don't

40:52think that the city should be able to

40:54unilaterally decide to change

40:55directions. Um because I think there's

40:58also, you know, just knowing how the

40:59city works, there's also a possibility

41:00that, you know, the mayor's office or

41:02the executive branch of government might

41:04decide to move in a specific direction.

41:06There's not necessarily any guarantee

41:07that it's even going to come back to the

41:09board of ultimates. even my ability to

41:11advocate for what my constituents are

41:13looking for. And so I do think it's

41:14important to have the ability to pivot,

41:16but I think it's important that we pivot

41:17with our voters and that, you know, if

41:19we stand behind something and we think

41:20it's a good idea, then we should have

41:22the confidence to put it in front of

41:23them and let them, you know, make that

41:25decision. I think opening it too

41:27broadly, especially, you know, to be

41:29honest in this particularly political

41:30moment, I have a lot of residents who

41:32are still upset about the fact that

41:33we're pivoting away from railway and

41:36they look at it as a good thing that we

41:37have to come back and put it back on the

41:39ballot and ask for their permission um

41:41so that we couldn't just make that

41:42decision. But I think because it is a

41:44ever changing industry, you know, I

41:46think there's a way to balance both the

41:47need for us to have flexibility to

41:49implement whatever transit opportunities

41:51come available, but also make sure that

41:53our voters and our residents are part of

41:55that conversation that we do so with

41:56their approval, especially because it is

41:58such massive investment and has such an

42:00impact on our neighborhoods both

42:02economically and and socially. Um, so if

42:04there's any opportunity to talk about an

42:06amendment, um, I'm happy to, you know,

42:08discuss an amendment or mirroring the

42:10scope, but I I just I know like this I

42:13think this as it is is just too broad

42:14and I I can't guarantee to my

42:16constituents that we will come back in

42:17front of them before pivoting in a

42:19different direction.

42:20>> Yes. You know, uh um we can definitely

42:23talk before perfection to figure out uh

42:26if that's uh what that could look like.

42:29>> Thank you.

42:33Alderwoman Velasquez.

42:36>> Thank you, Alderman Browning. I I do

42:38share uh the same similar concerns to

42:41what Alderwoman Sier said. I I do I

42:43support BRT. Um I've been in cities

42:45obviously that you've talked about even

42:47cities abroad where BRT is a major

42:48success. Um, and I and I do think, you

42:52know, we wouldn't be here trying to put

42:53it before the voters if

42:57if changing it wasn't important, but

43:00also if um we didn't need to take it

43:02back. So my my concern too is if it is

43:05too broad, right, and we do have the

43:07flexibility to change it, you know, we

43:10can leave ourselves in a situation like

43:12we are in right now that um we all want

43:15to say this project happens and then

43:17public sentiment changes and then

43:19nothing happens. So, I do think um you

43:23know either we need to I would prefer to

43:26have an amendment probably out today or

43:29you know I don't know how you feel about

43:31um moving the bill, Alderman Aldrich. I

43:33mean I definitely support it. Um but I

43:36do think that that's a really big

43:39um it's a really big gap between what we

43:42want to happen with what could happen if

43:43we keep it overly broad.

43:47Do you have some thought process,

43:48Alderwoman, for an amendment today?

43:52>> Um, well, we

43:54I think figuring out how to narrow it.

43:57[clears throat] Fortunately, both

43:57Alderman Sier and I have the South

43:59Granted meeting, which I will need to um

44:02you know, try and do both at this time

44:04and we talked about that before. Um, so

44:07I can't create specific language in the

44:10next few minutes, but I'd be happy to

44:11talk to you and work, you know, work

44:13with um, folks on the committee who feel

44:15the same way because I I absolutely

44:17agree that BRT is important and uh,

44:20that, you know, we need to uh, have

44:22better transportation for um, our

44:25residents.

44:29>> Do you have any other questions,

44:30Alderwoman?

44:32>> I don't at this time.

44:34>> All right. Thank you. Um,

44:37Alderman Devote is not uh here today, so

44:40I'll jump into my questions. Um,

44:45I'm I'm hearing a little bit of a a lack

44:47of trust right now. And I I can

44:50understand that lack of trust uh because

44:53it does feel and I'm not saying it is,

44:55but it does feel like a little bit of a

44:57bait and switch and that we told people

44:59we were going for a light rail line uh

45:02and then we are moving over to a bus

45:05rapid transit line. Like my colleagues,

45:07I am very much in favor of bus rapid

45:09transit. I've written it in other

45:11cities. It is a superior method of

45:14travel. It is a great way to get around.

45:17It is far cheaper to install, goes far

45:21farther, and it uh serves more people.

45:25Uh I am a big believer in expanding

45:28transit in our city because I think the

45:31most equitable thing we can do for the

45:32people of our city is to make it

45:34optional to own a car. And I think that

45:38this proposal makes a lot of sense. I am

45:41supportive of the proposal. And if it

45:43was on the ballot in April, I would be

45:45yes. Uh, but I'm a little concerned that

45:49the public doesn't have a good

45:52understanding of BRT, and I'm not sure

45:55that I would be in the majority if I was

45:57voting yes uh, in April. So, I was

45:59wondering if you could speak a little to

46:00the campaign that will be associated

46:02with this and uh who will be running

46:05that campaign and what it's going to

46:06look like and how we're going to make

46:08sure we have a majority so that we don't

46:10end up um as you stated, if if this does

46:13not pass, we will have no transit and

46:16that is not in anyone's interest. So, uh

46:18what is that campaign going to look like

46:20for the April 2027 ballot?

46:23>> Yes, I'll speak on it and then maybe

46:25some others can that has been doing some

46:27polling can talk about it. one I would

46:29say um I I I gotta give credit to uh the

46:34um the team that's been going out.

46:35They've been holding um regular meetings

46:39uh around this conversation where you're

46:40talking about public engagement. I think

46:42just at least I can't speak for

46:44everybody's ward um but I I think I've

46:46seen the flyers where they've been north

46:48south um they held two just in my ward

46:51alone at the Polish uh the Polish

46:54heritage uh center um and they have been

46:57in other communities talking about um

47:00what BRT looks like. I think you know

47:03just like um at the board when we pass

47:07ballot initiatives if it's been

47:08proposition V or your proposition

47:11alderman for the department of

47:13transportation I think if uh it's also

47:15going to be a pundant it's going to be

47:18on it's going to be on us as alders also

47:20to get the word out that uh we also

47:24inform our colleagues uh our our

47:26residents about what BRT is um be able

47:31to bring those experts to our town

47:34halls, our neighborhood meetings um for

47:37other folks that may not have been to

47:39those uh general public meetings to also

47:41uh hear from uh the BRT team of what BRT

47:45looks like. So, I think it's going to be

47:47a a a level of us as elected officials

47:51also stepping up as we do with other

47:53ballot initiatives that we have passed

47:55from this board of aldermen and went out

47:57if it was like meu and allwoman de

47:59yellow and we did the whole like sesame

48:01street tour on the the charter amendment

48:03changes going to ward by ward educating

48:06folks what's on the ballot. But I will

48:08let uh I don't know if maybe Charlie

48:11would be the best person to speak about

48:12the ongoing work of uh folks that they

48:15have been engaging with to make sure we

48:17get the word out on this as well.

48:21>> I think it'll be a tag team like we do

48:23at the board. It'll be Charlie and then

48:24Miss Kim also.

48:30>> Good morning again.

48:32So, uh, Citizens for Modern Transit's

48:34board will actually be looking at an

48:37education proposal next week with

48:39regards to bus rapid transit. As many of

48:42you well know, Citizens for Modern

48:44Transit was founded to bring light rail

48:46to St. Louis. So, this has been our

48:48focus for decades, but we know that

48:51times have changed. The environment that

48:53we're operating in has changed and light

48:56rail may not be the choice anymore

48:58across the country. And so we think it's

49:01really important that we take this

49:03opportunity and lay the groundwork not

49:05only in the city but the region itself

49:08on the importance of looking at bus

49:10rapid transit as a new technology m that

49:14could be a significant win for this

49:16region. So the board will actually be

49:18taking that up next week a potential

49:21education campaign on bus rapid transit

49:24and its impacts and the winds that we've

49:26seen across the country.

49:30And alderman at Staintless Realtors, we

49:32share your concerns. Um, we did some

49:34polling and what we found is that

49:36understanding of BRT is low and that

49:38education can increase support, but we

49:41really need to make sure that we're

49:42getting the word out about what BRT is

49:45because people here haven't been able to

49:47visualize it. They don't understand it.

49:49And when they better understand it,

49:50support increases. But I want to make a

49:53warning to the board that and I'm I'm

49:55very glad to hear Alderman Aldridge say

49:56this is that without this board support

49:58of getting the word out to the community

50:00of what this is, this measure may well

50:03fail in April. So I'm very excited to

50:05hear uh Alderman Aldridge uh say that

50:07hopefully some members of this board

50:08will be out doing the good work, too.

50:11>> So I think the the logical next question

50:14is what if it does fail? What what

50:16happens in that situation?

50:24Good question, Alderman. If it does

50:25fail, we will be uh back here trying to

50:29figure out what we do with it, which I

50:31think, you know, kind of a little bit

50:33goes um to I think why the the language

50:36is a little um vague, but if it does

50:38fail, the money will continue to be

50:40collected. Again, I think what folks

50:41said is it's not an additional new tax.

50:44Um, this is something that people voted

50:46on in 17 and as we see that like transit

50:50is evolving and so much things is uh

50:53changing and you never know who's going

50:54to be in the federal government. Some

50:56folks are not transit friendly. You

50:58know, I think we can all uh wish maybe

51:02in a year and a few months that the

51:05federal landscape looks a little

51:07different. Um, but maybe it don't. Um

51:09and maybe we still don't have people who

51:11are friendly when it comes to um just

51:13words like green, you know, and and

51:16transit. So, if it does fail, um we

51:19would still be collecting funds and the

51:22ability to have a different method of

51:25transit would still be in limbo.

51:28>> Thank you for that. Um I'm I'm glad you

51:30mentioned that the federal landscape. I

51:32think it's important part of this

51:33conversation. uh if I've heard people

51:37from the public, I'm not necessarily

51:39saying I agree, but I've heard people uh

51:41from the public talking about, well, we

51:43should just wait a few years. Uh we're

51:45almost guaranteed to get a different

51:47federal administration, which I don't

51:49agree that we're guaranteed, but I think

51:51we, you know, there might be a

51:52possibility that there's a friendlier

51:54incumbent in the future that might be

51:56willing to fund light rail line. Um,

52:02can you speak to the likelihood of that?

52:04And I think this ties into another

52:05question about if this doesn't proceed

52:10and uh if this doesn't succeed passing

52:13the ballot in April. Um, there's been a

52:16significant amount of work that's been

52:18put into designing a BRT line at this

52:21time.

52:22uh we are in a phase of design uh that

52:26will soon move to a phase of engineering

52:28that I think this money needs to be

52:30available for and so there could be not

52:34just significant delays if this doesn't

52:36pass in April but it could really

52:40disrupt the entire uh effort so far to

52:44uh design and build this uh BRT. So,

52:49can can you speak a little to why we

52:52should just not wait for a light rail

52:55line in a possible future uh

52:59administration that would be transit

53:00friendly?

53:01>> Yeah, I would touch on it and maybe I

53:03know uh maybe Mr. Toby or Scott can also

53:06speak on as they've been part of the

53:07design phase. But, you know, I would be

53:10the first to say um you know, I I love

53:12the idea of the light rail line. You

53:14know, um with it running down I with it

53:18running down Natural Bridge, I think in

53:20an area and with this BRT, what I love

53:22about even more BRT is is expanded down

53:25Natural Bridge. But we're talking about

53:27areas that um typically don't have

53:29access to transportation, right? from

53:31Natural Bridge, the light rail line was

53:33supposed to, I think, go down like

53:34Jefferson. I'm lucky enough between the

53:36light rail line and BRT, it runs

53:39through, uh, the 14th ward. Um, but, you

53:42know, uh, with the light rail line, um,

53:44I did support that initiative. Um,

53:47however, I think one of the things that,

53:49uh, Mr. Tolby talked about is just the

53:51the cost of the light rail line. Um, you

53:54know, we're talking 1.1 billion. You

53:56know, I'm sure when we voted on this in

53:582017, you know, precoid, construction

54:01was at a different cost, equipment was

54:03at a different cost. But I think one of

54:05the things that like you mentioned, if

54:07we don't do anything now, then there's

54:09been um conversations about the the

54:13design going out already, conversations

54:15about uh once this get passed in 2000 or

54:19next month, I keep saying 2027, but or

54:22or next year. um folks are already at

54:24the table um and partners are already at

54:27the table ready to start to make uh the

54:30the conversations of getting BRT set up

54:33uh through the engineering process. And

54:35if we uh don't vote this in April and we

54:38halt uh again, we don't know where we

54:42will be in the city of St. Louis of what

54:44transit can be um or what the

54:48opportunities uh for a a massive level

54:51transit is. Um I think what's very clear

54:54is we do not um have the the funding to

54:58do light rail. Um that is just not an

55:01option um because of how expensive it

55:04is, the the tax that comes in. Um it is

55:07collecting some, but we will need a

55:10federal partner to also help out with

55:12the light rail. Um and you know with

55:15having BRT again, it's it's the ability

55:17to be able to touch a lot more people.

55:19But if we were to delay this, uh, it

55:22would really put the city in St. Louis.

55:24And I feel like the word I've been using

55:25in this committee hearing all day has

55:27been like quagmire, but it really would

55:29put us in a pickle of trying to figure

55:31out, uh, you know, how do we move

55:33forward with providing citizens that

55:36need it the most? Um, I know we all

55:39drive cars in here, but I'm telling you

55:40now, there are folks that are right now

55:43out waiting on the bus. Um, and with

55:46this BRT line, you know, they their

55:49their wait time now is a lot longer. The

55:52wait time with BRT would be a lot

55:53quicker. Um, and I know a lot of times

55:56when we're talking about these type of

55:57conversations, we also need to think

55:59about like the people it's going to

56:00impact. So, we're putting people that

56:02would be able to use this BRT line to be

56:04able to get back and forth to work or

56:06get back and forth to a family house.

56:08Uh, kind of in a pickle of not knowing

56:10what will be next. Um, I don't know if

56:13Mr. Scott or Mr. Toby, want to also

56:15touch on a little bit?

56:20>> Thank you. Thank you, Alderman. I

56:21appreciate the question. If if you don't

56:23mind, I'm going to also talk on a

56:25parallel issue about going indeed to the

56:27public and being sure that these are

56:29properly vetted. And really that is in

56:32the idea of flexibility and competition.

56:34After all, we are competing for these

56:36federal funds against a San Jose,

56:39Indianapolis, etc. and advancing a

56:42project like this is very key. But part

56:45of the quality of the competition is I

56:47have to demonstrate to the Federal

56:49Transit Administration that we have

56:51properly vetted and come to the local

56:54elected governing bodies and move this

56:57project forward. You notice we have the

56:592026 LPA, so locally preferred

57:02alternative. Indeed, the very reason why

57:04we are here today is that this

57:06government body asked us to or were to

57:09be detailed and be very cognizant of the

57:13transparency that we owe to the public.

57:15It is embedded within part of the

57:18process. It is why my teams are out

57:20there right now having holding public

57:23meetings and taking those comments in.

57:25We and when we put a quality project

57:28together, it is very very important. And

57:31then with the timing associated with

57:33this, we need to get in the game. Uh we

57:36are seeing other uh cities that are

57:38moving forward and getting federal

57:40projects getting federal projects

57:42advanced and we need to be ready for it

57:44when that opportunity comes. And my job

57:47is to uh advance these projects into

57:50Washington DC and let them compete and

57:54fulfill the obligation that we have to

57:56those voters of 2017 that we get a

57:59project done. We're trying to be

58:01flexible. We're trying to be sure that

58:03we are going out to the public and

58:05asking the questions and we're going to

58:06continue to do that and that is

58:08literally embedded into the competitive

58:10process. Thank you, sir.

58:12>> I appreciate it. If you could just stay

58:13up there, I I have some follow-up

58:14questions. So, you've mentioned the

58:16competitive process and I was uh

58:19fortunate enough to be able to take the

58:22uh BRT tour that was offered a couple

58:24weeks ago. I mentioned that earlier. Um

58:27we heard a lot of great information on

58:29that. One of the things I heard though

58:31that troubled me a little bit is that

58:33this going for a capital improvement

58:35grant uh that this current

58:37administration has only funded a single

58:40capital improvement grant so far. Is

58:42that correct?

58:43>> That is factually correct. So if 33 out

58:46of 39 projects are transitioning or

58:49going for BRT

58:51and only one in the entire country has

58:54been funded so far by this

58:55administration,

58:57this does feel a little bit like a long

59:00shot uh in that even if we pass this

59:03today, if we get it to the ballot, if it

59:05passes at the ballot in April, we're

59:07still in a very very competitive

59:10environment for federal funding for this

59:12project.

59:14We are, that is factually correct.

59:16However, we have been able to garner

59:18significant federal funding. That's my

59:20job constantly. Uh we garnered a $292

59:25million federal grant for the light rail

59:28for the replacement of our of our

59:30vehicles. We have an ongoing and

59:32decadesl long uh relationship with our

59:35partners at Federal Transit

59:36Administration. And we do weather

59:38through changes in administration. It's

59:41a very very key and important critique.

59:44It is factual and that is true. Um and

59:47so we will always advance those ideas.

59:51One of the things that we're trying to

59:52do is be sure that we are shifting the

59:54affordability and the economics

59:56associated with projects like this when

59:59we can show the financial wherewithal

1:00:01for instance that we have the taxing

1:00:04capacity to support a project of this

1:00:06size and scope. That was really a key

1:00:09decision point. As simple as the light

1:00:11rail project is, we I could not look at

1:00:15uh for instance this uh body. I could

1:00:17not look citizens in the eye and say

1:00:20that light rail was affordable under

1:00:22where the tax was. It simply was not.

1:00:26The math did not work, Alderman

1:00:27Browning. It it just didn't. I wish it

1:00:29did. Um but we have to advance and be

1:00:32sure that we are being ethical in our

1:00:34considerations of what are the realistic

1:00:38cost constraints. That is also a

1:00:40calculation that will advance up to our

1:00:42federal partners. We will see changes in

1:00:45administration and we will sh see those

1:00:47shades as it moves through.

1:00:49>> Thank you. I think you're making sense.

1:00:52It it it

1:00:54makes sense to have a transition to BRT.

1:00:57I don't disagree with that at all and I

1:00:59don't think any anyone really disagrees

1:01:01with that after hearing the facts. Um,

1:01:03another thing I heard on that tour is

1:01:05that in Minneapolis when they did BRT

1:01:07the highend of installing that was about

1:01:1050 million per mile whereas light rail

1:01:13would have been 150 to 250 million per

1:01:16mile. There's just no comparison between

1:01:19the cost between those two projects. And

1:01:21we would love to be able to provide that

1:01:24transit for people because when we took

1:01:26that tour and I was looking out the

1:01:28window of the uh the green uh ebus that

1:01:31we were riding, which was very nice,

1:01:33very quiet, very fun to ride. Um I'll

1:01:35I'll add that these BRT buses are going

1:01:38to be just as nice, if not nicer. Uh but

1:01:41when I was looking out the window, I I

1:01:44saw a real need for transit and I heard

1:01:47on the tour uh another important fact

1:01:49that approximately 20% of residents on

1:01:52the natural bridge corridor do not own a

1:01:54car. And I come back to that point I

1:01:56made that the most equitable thing we

1:01:57could do for people is to make

1:02:00>> the mass transit might be there.

1:02:02>> Yeah.

1:02:03>> Sorry. Could you

1:02:04>> And the thing is there's there's no

1:02:06prioritization. Could you uh if you're

1:02:08online, can you mute yourself?

1:02:10>> Thank you. Um

1:02:13>> sorry, we're getting some technical

1:02:15difficult

1:02:32to to be able to do. Uh I want to pivot

1:02:36a little bit to ask you about frequency

1:02:39uh because we've talked about ridership

1:02:41and and the usefulness of this line to

1:02:44people who will be using it. Uh what is

1:02:47the estimated frequency of the BRT line?

1:02:52>> This would be a very what was what is

1:02:54known as a high frequency BRT. That's

1:02:57the rapid part of that. So it would be

1:03:00between 10 and 25 minutes. We even uh

1:03:05and that would have to do with the

1:03:07length of the corridor, what are the

1:03:09ridership estimates, the cost. So we

1:03:12would like to provide essentially what

1:03:15is light rail like service, the density

1:03:18of service in time um and have a

1:03:21corridor that works that way. And then

1:03:24as far as transit is concerned, we would

1:03:26use that as essentially the spine of the

1:03:28corridor and then feed bus lines into

1:03:31these stations that creates a web and

1:03:34interconnectivity that is very key to

1:03:37regions like St. Louis, which is also a

1:03:40very key piece to to remember. One of

1:03:44the biggest corridors that we need some

1:03:46transit help in is that north south

1:03:48corridor. I would remind uh Alderman

1:03:51Browning and the public that our number

1:03:53one bus line right now is the number 70

1:03:55Grand. It is that north south route. We

1:03:58do have uh battery electric uh buses on

1:04:02that round 60footers. It is still our

1:04:04number one ridership. So what that tells

1:04:07us is that there is an embedded need for

1:04:10transit services. And Alderman Browning,

1:04:13if I may, just one very quick statistic

1:04:15really good. Um we have done a recent

1:04:18survey of our existing customers and u

1:04:23nearly 84% of them when they ask where

1:04:26are they taking transit today they say

1:04:28they are going to work. Of those

1:04:31customers 74%

1:04:34report making annual income of under

1:04:37$60,000.

1:04:38So what that tells you is from a public

1:04:41policy standpoint the absolute

1:04:43compelling need to be sure to serve the

1:04:46regular working people of St. Louis. It

1:04:49is very very important that we take that

1:04:52into consideration when you're advancing

1:04:54policy like that and I'm very

1:04:56appreciative of you bringing up that

1:04:57point. Yeah, I think that and that's why

1:05:01I I bring up frequency because I think

1:05:03the ability to serve people um I I have

1:05:07to be honest 15 to 25 minute frequency

1:05:11if it's on theif if it's on the 25

1:05:13minute that's not a useful transit

1:05:16>> if I miss the 25 minute line you know

1:05:19just barely by a minute which has

1:05:20happened to me before when I've taken

1:05:22transit right you see the train pulling

1:05:24bus pulling up but you're you're 40 feet

1:05:26away and you your hands are full. You're

1:05:28not going to run to catch it. Like that

1:05:31happens. Now you're waiting another 25

1:05:34minutes for that wine to show up. Now

1:05:35you're late to work. And so if you're

1:05:38using it to to go to work and really

1:05:42what I've encountered when I ride

1:05:43transit in other cities that I visit,

1:05:46the frequency is huge. The fact that I

1:05:49can go out and wait and it'll be less

1:05:51than 10 minutes before the next bus

1:05:53arrives. You know, that's why people use

1:05:56it. if it's going to be longer, they're

1:05:58going to call a cab or they're going to

1:06:00find another way to to go out and do

1:06:02that that trip. Uh so I think the

1:06:06emphasis on frequency has to be there.

1:06:09Um

1:06:11the wording of this uh proposition that

1:06:14we're going to put to the ballot, we've

1:06:16already discussed it a little bit that

1:06:18there's this wording of uh or other mass

1:06:20transit initiatives.

1:06:22Uh there was a little bit of

1:06:24acknowledgement that if we have enough

1:06:26money to build out the line uh from this

1:06:30tax and of course the CIG uh the capital

1:06:33improvement grant that um once the line

1:06:36is built, this money will then be used

1:06:39from the tax to help the operations of

1:06:42the current line or uh perhaps expand uh

1:06:47that service to maybe create other lines

1:06:50or other types of ways to improve that

1:06:53access. Um, can you speak a little to

1:06:58what you're looking at from what we get

1:07:00from the current economic development

1:07:01tax? Would that be able to help

1:07:04supplement the budget to ensure that

1:07:07that frequency is there that the service

1:07:10is as you know um I think what I heard

1:07:12on the tour was gold standard uh that

1:07:15this would be a gold standard BRT wine.

1:07:18uh that it would include I think we uh

1:07:20said today uh that we're looking at a um

1:07:25let's see what the term was that was

1:07:27used full street solution.

1:07:30>> Yes sir.

1:07:30>> Uh so that wording in that uh that

1:07:35ballot proposal

1:07:37other mass transit initiatives uh and I

1:07:40I'll also note that that it continues to

1:07:43include the line of upgrade the city's

1:07:45infrastructure. So this money can go to

1:07:48a variety of things that would help

1:07:50build out this line, make sure we have

1:07:52not just good stations, but also good

1:07:55access to those stations, including

1:07:57improving the sidewalks and the

1:07:58crossings at those stations. Uh knowing

1:08:01especially because um

1:08:04one of the places you're most likely to

1:08:06get hit by a car right now is in

1:08:08proximity to a bus station. It's mostly

1:08:10because they're located on very busy

1:08:11lines. It's not the bus's fault. It's

1:08:13the the fact that it's on a big road

1:08:15that's hard to cross. So,

1:08:18can you speak a little bit to what

1:08:21bystate and what Metro is looking at for

1:08:25the operating costs of this uh line and

1:08:28whether the economic development tax

1:08:29will be able to provide uh that quality

1:08:33gold level of service

1:08:36within our application for CIG capital

1:08:39investment grant program. uh we will

1:08:43enter uh what is the funding program and

1:08:46and we have an option of going to small

1:08:48starts or uh or or uh stream starts as

1:08:53the legislation is advancing right now

1:08:56to fund these kind of programs and

1:08:59within that application is very detailed

1:09:01um process that we have to prove to the

1:09:04federal government that can run it from

1:09:06an operating standpoint. But we have to

1:09:09show within our financials that the city

1:09:12and indeed metroransit has the financial

1:09:15strength to be sure that the frequency

1:09:18and those issues can be maintained not

1:09:21just for a year but for five 10 and for

1:09:24a long-term uh frequency. A key uh

1:09:28review factor from the FTA staff is to

1:09:32be sure that we are not cannibalizing

1:09:34other transit service in order to afford

1:09:37this service. That is a big no no in the

1:09:40application. You have to be able to

1:09:42prove financially and be sure that you

1:09:45can move forward on that in a very

1:09:49important and measured way that will

1:09:52contribute to the scoring the viability

1:09:54of the strong financial scoring of a

1:09:57project like this. And it is related

1:09:59even to the fundamental fact that I have

1:10:02to come in front of this board and pass

1:10:04my annual operating budget and be sure

1:10:07that we go through those review criteria

1:10:10as far as where our bus lines are going

1:10:12and so on that we are indeed accessible

1:10:14and answerable to the what are the

1:10:16public's wishes. And I appreciate you

1:10:18bringing that up too because I know that

1:10:20Alder one Sonier uh the the alder one

1:10:23from the seventh was asking about if

1:10:27things would have to be brought back in

1:10:28front of voters and while the answer to

1:10:31that was somewhat not really. Uh there

1:10:35is going to be a requirement that they

1:10:38have to come back in front of this body

1:10:40uh in order to authorize additional

1:10:42funding for this BRT project. So this is

1:10:45not the last time we'll see you, Mr.

1:10:46Roach. uh you'll be back here talking to

1:10:48us throughout this process as we release

1:10:51funding for each stage of this project

1:10:53is my understanding and so there will be

1:10:55plenty of opportunities for us to make

1:10:57sure this is happening correctly and

1:10:59that the money is going towards what our

1:11:01voters expect and at the end of the day

1:11:03that is our job as representatives to

1:11:05really bring the concerns of uh the

1:11:09public forward um which is why I'm going

1:11:12to come back to how I open this that

1:11:14there is in my find a distinct lack of

1:11:18trust right now in our transit systems

1:11:21in bystate and metro. I've spoken to

1:11:24residents of my ward who have told me

1:11:25how they struggle now to get where

1:11:27they're going because of bus routes that

1:11:29have been changed to be less frequent or

1:11:31even canceled altogether. Uh we have a

1:11:35single car pilot on the Metroink right

1:11:38now that I'm not joking I think nobody

1:11:41wants. Uh, I think there is a real lack

1:11:45of trust that we are headed in the right

1:11:47direction when it comes to our public

1:11:49transit systems in St. Louis. And in

1:11:52order to pass this at the ballot in

1:11:54April, we need that trust to be built up

1:11:57and for people to see that we're trying

1:11:58to bring them a better product because I

1:12:00do believe that. I do believe that's our

1:12:03goal. And you know, the changing world

1:12:07that we're in requires us to pivot and

1:12:10find better solutions. And BRT is not a

1:12:13new thing, but it is a newly popular

1:12:15thing cities because a lot of cities are

1:12:17finding that it very effectively serves

1:12:19their transit needs. And so we would be

1:12:22competing with our peer cities if we

1:12:24were able to be able to do this. Uh but

1:12:26my main concern is that I want to make

1:12:28sure we are able to do it and that we

1:12:30don't put ourselves in a position where

1:12:33uh this city stands in its own way,

1:12:36which we're very good at doing

1:12:37sometimes. Uh stands in its own way and

1:12:40doesn't pass this in April or and puts

1:12:43us in a quagmire that is going to be

1:12:45difficult to climb out of. Uh so uh I

1:12:48think we have some work to do, but uh I

1:12:51really appreciate just the conversation

1:12:53today. I think it's been a really really

1:12:55educational one and I hope that we can

1:12:57continue to share more details with the

1:12:58public. Uh, of note I want to uh promote

1:13:04uh two open houses that you're you have

1:13:07coming up or would you like to do that?

1:13:08Would you like to share it? Monday,

1:13:11October 19th, uh at Rung for Women, uh

1:13:14that is, uh 2717 Sydney Street, uh 5 to

1:13:197 p.m. there'll be an open house uh on

1:13:21this Green Line BRT. And then Thursday,

1:13:24October 22nd at the Polish Heritage

1:13:27Center at 1413 North 20th Street, again,

1:13:305 to 7 p.m. So, encourage people to come

1:13:33out, learn more about this system. Uh, I

1:13:36really do think that once you get to

1:13:38know BRT, you you'll love it. Uh, I know

1:13:41that I've really enjoyed uh the times

1:13:43that I've ridden it and find it to be

1:13:45superior to regular buses and a good

1:13:49alternative to light rail. Uh, but uh,

1:13:52Monday, October 19th and Thursday,

1:13:54October 22nd, 5 to 7 p.m. Two

1:13:56opportunities to come out and learn more

1:13:58about this. and I know you're going to

1:13:59continue to engage the public over the

1:14:01next several months along with uh

1:14:03Citizens for Modern Transit and the St.

1:14:05Louis Realtors and everybody else. We

1:14:07really want to continue to to do this

1:14:09push. So, uh I'll turn this back over to

1:14:13Alderman Aldridge to uh close if there's

1:14:16no other information that anyone would

1:14:18like to share.

1:14:19>> Uh do we want to do any uh public

1:14:20testimony, Mr. Chair?

1:14:21>> That's a great point, Al. Um I I got so

1:14:25caught up in my questions. Uh I would

1:14:27love to have some uh testimony from the

1:14:29public. So Madame Clerk, is anyone

1:14:30signed up to testify today?

1:14:33>> Yes. Yes, we have

1:14:37four people so far and it looks like

1:14:39some are coming in as I speak.

1:14:42>> All right.

1:14:45>> And those are four that are online and

1:14:47then we have one that's in person.

1:14:49>> Let's start with in person and then

1:14:50we'll go online.

1:14:56and please introduce yourself and uh

1:14:58what ward you're in and uh proceed. You

1:15:00have to

1:15:00>> Thank you. My name is Gwendeland Cox.

1:15:02I'm from W 10. And before I forget, I

1:15:04want to talk about the gentleman that

1:15:06talked about the um the BRT and um real

1:15:10estate, you know, and it it runs down

1:15:13Natural Bridge and um I don't know if he

1:15:15knows 12 schools are subject to be

1:15:17closed on the city's north side. Most of

1:15:19them on the north of Grand uh 12 uh

1:15:23eight of those schools on the city's

1:15:24north side. So, we lost population. We

1:15:27have over 5,000 vacant lots. We haven't

1:15:29had any economic development on the

1:15:30north side in the last 60 years. But if

1:15:33the BRT can bring it more power to it,

1:15:36Aldrich says that he doesn't know where

1:15:38this is going in the next 10 years.

1:15:40Which brings me to some questions that I

1:15:42don't hear. When you have public

1:15:43engagement, you say you got 84% of that,

1:15:4664% of the public engagement wants this.

1:15:49Is it 84% of the 52 people that I saw at

1:15:52the uh Polish Center when you all

1:15:55decided to use this route? Because I

1:15:57think it's we need to start questioning

1:16:00when you talk about public engagement.

1:16:02How many people are really being

1:16:04engaged? I don't think it's a lot. And

1:16:07I'm not talking about what I really want

1:16:08to talk about because I'm looking at the

1:16:10long-term operational costs. I would

1:16:13like to know. I didn't hear anything

1:16:15about the hund00 million dollars that

1:16:17you all occurred since 2017. You know, I

1:16:20wonder is there any justification for

1:16:22this investment? Has there really been a

1:16:25study? Because when I come down north

1:16:27and the natural bridge, I don't see all

1:16:29these people and we don't understand why

1:16:31you would spend so much money when you

1:16:33you know, maybe you can use the money

1:16:35for something else. I see a young man

1:16:37here that's uh little handicapping.

1:16:39Maybe we can use it on uh the uh caller

1:16:43ride. Maybe we can use it. That's can be

1:16:45an option. We can do something like

1:16:47that. But um we just need to have um

1:16:52more engagement and really we need to

1:16:56you know please don't come and give us a

1:16:58presentation and start showing us

1:17:00different uh BRTs and San Francisco like

1:17:03you mentioned the other day and s San

1:17:06Francisco has like 850,000

1:17:08people and a lot of those people

1:17:10somewhat like New York who don't drive.

1:17:13uh a lot and so they do need a BRT and

1:17:16I'm not against it but I just think that

1:17:18the transportation system should give uh

1:17:21us get us from one place to another

1:17:24without taking three and four trans uh

1:17:26uh transfers. I watched the Grand Bus

1:17:30runs every 15 minutes. You talking about

1:17:3220 25, you know, it's 28 bus stops on

1:17:36that route where you all planning to run

1:17:38this thing. So I don't think it's

1:17:40needed. I think we need some more

1:17:42discussion and really find out where we

1:17:45can what we can do to fix the current

1:17:49system. Like you said, Mr. Brownie, we

1:17:52need to get those children on Grand who

1:17:55has to ride the bus connected to the

1:17:59buses that get them on school on time.

1:18:01I've been watching and that Cass bus is

1:18:04not meeting that GR grand bus. those

1:18:06students are being 20 minutes late

1:18:08walking six blocks down to Vashan. And

1:18:11so we need to, you know, make sure that

1:18:14we get people to the art museum and

1:18:17without getting off the bus three and

1:18:19four times to downtown or where they

1:18:21want to go from point A to point B

1:18:23before we start spending money on a BRT.

1:18:26Thank you.

1:18:34>> Thank you. Now, the rest of the speakers

1:18:36are all online. Did you want to swear

1:18:38them in?

1:18:41>> Yes. Thank you. Um, if you are going to

1:18:43be testifying online, if you could

1:18:45please turn your camera on, raise your

1:18:47right hand.

1:18:55Okay, that's everyone. If you could

1:18:57raise your right hand. Do you tell the

1:18:58truth, the whole truth, and nothing but

1:19:00the truth?

1:19:02>> Yes, I do. Yes.

1:19:06>> Thank you all. Uh, Madame Clerk, please

1:19:08proceed.

1:19:09>> First, we have I believe it's Elise

1:19:11Schaefer. Could you state your ward that

1:19:14you're in?

1:19:16>> Good morning. Thank you, Madam Clerk.

1:19:18I'm Elise Schaefer. I'm a resident of

1:19:19the sixth ward and I'm policy manager

1:19:21for Missouri Coalition for the

1:19:22Environment. Uh for the last two years,

1:19:25MCE has been working with community

1:19:26members, city government, and other

1:19:28nonprofits to develop policy

1:19:30recommendations around the topic of

1:19:32extreme urban [clears throat] heat. The

1:19:34number of 100° days in St. Louis is

1:19:36expected to double in my lifetime, and

1:19:39heat's already the deadliest weather

1:19:41event in the country. So, I'm here to

1:19:43urge St. Louis to act swiftly, both to

1:19:45stop making it hotter and to help St.

1:19:47Louis and survive as dangerous

1:19:49temperatures become more frequent.

1:19:51According to the city's most recent

1:19:53sustainability and climate plan,

1:19:55transportation accounts for over 20% of

1:19:58St. Louis's greenhouse gas emissions,

1:20:00which is one of the major causes of the

1:20:02urban heat island effect. While this is

1:20:05largely due to the number of individual

1:20:06cars on the road, any buses running on

1:20:09diesel will also contribute to climate

1:20:11change and to the urban heat island

1:20:13effect. We encourage this committee to

1:20:15consider a requirement that all projects

1:20:17funded by this bill be fossil fuel-f

1:20:19free and that the bus rapid transit line

1:20:21be electric. As written, board bill 59

1:20:24is a great step towards taking cars off

1:20:26the road by improving frequency and

1:20:28reliability of mass transit in the city.

1:20:30I want to share with you some numbers

1:20:32from a survey we conducted last summer

1:20:33of over 300 city residents. 67% of

1:20:37respondents said that St. Louis's public

1:20:39transit system was not convenient. 73%

1:20:42said buses and trains don't run

1:20:44frequently enough. However, 70% said

1:20:47they would use transit more frequently

1:20:49if service was more frequently. And an

1:20:51astounding 78% said they would use

1:20:54transit more often if service was more

1:20:56convenient. The will to use public

1:20:58transit in our city exists. The

1:21:00infrastructure does not. MCE is a result

1:21:04of anything the city can do to decrease

1:21:06carbon emissions, including improving

1:21:07public transportation. We strongly

1:21:09encourage the committee to pass this

1:21:11bill with an amendment to require fossil

1:21:13fuel free sources of energy. Thank you

1:21:16so much for your time um and for

1:21:18considering this bill.

1:21:21>> Thank you.

1:21:22>> Thank you, Miss Schaefer. Next, we have

1:21:23Melinda Long.

1:21:26>> Uh yes. Hi. Good morning. Good morning.

1:21:29Uh the reason why I have some

1:21:32>> Long sorry, could you state what uh ward

1:21:34you live in?

1:21:36>> Oh, yes. The 11th ward. Yes. The reason

1:21:39why I have some concerns regarding this

1:21:41bill and I'm asking this the panel here

1:21:45to not only comply with your guidelines

1:21:48of meeting and conversion with the

1:21:50community but at the same time use this

1:21:52opportunity to you can pull this bill

1:21:55and make some amendments to the bill. I

1:21:58am quite concerned with the fact that it

1:22:00does say uh rapid BRT transit and other

1:22:05mass mass transit initiatives. Mass

1:22:10transit initiative is too vague. It can

1:22:13include railing, a rail system, water

1:22:16system. Don't ask don't ask me how

1:22:18people could be traveling underwater

1:22:20underground. And it even can be include

1:22:23an aerial system like in the days of the

1:22:26Jetsons and we remember we know that

1:22:29because what the citizens what the all

1:22:32the men on the panel had stated a lack

1:22:34of trust. Our lack of trust is not in

1:22:37Metro. No sir, we're not mad at Toby

1:22:40Roach or or any other person who wants

1:22:42to be who wants to improve the transit

1:22:45because that's their job. Our lack of

1:22:48trust and all sincerity is with you the

1:22:51board of altimate. When we have board

1:22:54when we have alderman who vote for

1:22:56things and pass bills and approve things

1:23:00like the data center and other and the

1:23:04and other businesses without really

1:23:06conversing with the residents and doing

1:23:08what people who voted for you to to do.

1:23:13That's who we have no trust in. Now, but

1:23:15going back to the wording of this board

1:23:18bill, Ordinance 59, it should say we're

1:23:22asking Aldridge, who he knows that I

1:23:25personally have a favoritism toward him.

1:23:28He knows I'm asking if you can add the

1:23:32express buses because that is what the

1:23:35city with its population right now can

1:23:38only handle. When you submit another

1:23:41application, which you may try to do to

1:23:44the Federal Transit Administration, they

1:23:46will again, you know, Mr. Roach, they

1:23:49will again and look at the population

1:23:52that we have in this community

1:23:56along with the the time period it has

1:23:58taken already to accumulate this $100

1:24:02million. And how on earth will you be

1:24:06able to support a massive transit

1:24:08system? you will not be able to do that.

1:24:11So, I'm asking

1:24:13for Aldridge because Aldridge, you're is

1:24:16you introduced the bill, you have the

1:24:19author authority to pull it, not ask for

1:24:22an amendment, but just change the

1:24:24wording. You don't have to add an

1:24:25amendment on on the back of it at the

1:24:28end of it, but change that one paragraph

1:24:31in there, that one statement in there to

1:24:33include

1:24:34express buses. And then at the in the

1:24:37future, what will happen more than

1:24:39likely with that when the Federal

1:24:42Transit Administration looks at it and

1:24:45of course maybe Toby Roach doesn't want

1:24:47you to put that in there because the the

1:24:49when the FTA will look at that

1:24:52application, they're going to conclude,

1:24:54oh well that community, they don't have

1:24:56enough to support a BRT. Well, they

1:24:59definitely did not have enough people to

1:25:00support the light rail, but maybe let's

1:25:03consider the express buses. We could

1:25:06fund that, the express buses. And of

1:25:09course, when the fe when the f the

1:25:11federal the trade ad FTA decides, okay,

1:25:14if we fund them for the express buses in

1:25:17year 2026 27, we're not going to come

1:25:20back to any application from St. Louis

1:25:23city for the next two or three decades

1:25:25until

1:25:27they have

1:25:29an increase in population of at least

1:25:32four times as many persons that we have

1:25:35now. But going going back to so a

1:25:39>> long that is your time.

1:25:41>> Thank you. Thank you.

1:25:44>> Thank you.

1:25:46Next we have Mrs. Alexander.

1:25:52Hi, good morning.

1:25:55>> Can you please state your ward?

1:25:58>> Yes,

1:26:00Mr. and Mrs. Alexander and we live in

1:26:03ward 11.

1:26:08>> Thank you. Please proceed.

1:26:10>> Thank you. Good morning, budget and

1:26:13public employees committee. First, we

1:26:16would like to invite you to join us on

1:26:18the first Monday of November, which is

1:26:21November 2nd, 2026,

1:26:26to hear the community's concerns

1:26:28regarding the bus rapid transit at the

1:26:31Jeff Vanderel meeting on Zoom. At this

1:26:34meeting, we would like to also invite

1:26:38Mr. Toby Roach and his team

1:26:41at Bystate Metro and others

1:26:45Next, everyone knows how hard our city

1:26:48communities work to inform the city

1:26:52bystate Metro and even the East West

1:26:54Gateway Council of Governments that the

1:26:57Metroink Green Line Rail, the light

1:27:00rail, was too expensive for $1.1 billion

1:27:03for only 5.6 miles and more so how it is

1:27:08unsafe to run a train in front of our

1:27:11homes.

1:27:12Furthermore, the wrership would be very,

1:27:15very low.

1:27:17But now, the Metro Link light rail train

1:27:19is back in this ballot language to keep

1:27:22the door open to spend our tax dollars

1:27:25on it. Anyway,

1:27:27lastly, to to also inform you that the

1:27:30community's request to add express

1:27:32buses, as Miss Long was stating, we

1:27:36wanted to add that to the language of

1:27:38board bill 59, but it was denied.

1:27:41The community's proposal shows that this

1:27:4311.5

1:27:45bus rapid transit for the cost of $360

1:27:48million to $590 million has 23 stations

1:27:54from Marramac and Jefferson to

1:27:56Goodfellow and Natural Bridge.

1:28:00Stopping at Goodfellow and Natural

1:28:01Bridge does not serve St. Louis region.

1:28:05Looking at the map, 23 stops is not

1:28:08rapid and it will not have the wrership

1:28:11to support it. There are BRT lines in

1:28:14the United States with persistently low

1:28:17ridership. Our community's proposal

1:28:21strengthens current service and adds

1:28:25express buses to move people

1:28:27efficiently.

1:28:29Time and time again, our voices are shut

1:28:31out.

1:28:33To vote on board Bill 59 today would be

1:28:35highly disingenuous because Metro

1:28:38decided to pivot to bus rapid transit

1:28:41without meaningful community input.

1:28:45Without community input is very

1:28:48important. They made the shift first

1:28:51then they tried to backfill it

1:28:53with public support after the case.

1:28:57Public input was only allowed for the

1:29:01route and the designs of the stations

1:29:03and perhaps other things. But we want to

1:29:06know why we the people are always left

1:29:08out of these highle decisions when we

1:29:11are the ones most impacted by all of

1:29:13this. So Alderman Aldridge and committee

1:29:16we are asking you to not vote on this

1:29:18today but allow our community to meet

1:29:21with you to revisit this board bill

1:29:24language. Alderman Aldridge, you know,

1:29:26we have expressed this multiple times

1:29:29how important it is to work directly

1:29:32with the residents and the community who

1:29:34will be most affected. Thank you.

1:29:40>> Thank you. Next, we have Zach B.

1:29:45Did you state your award?

1:29:48>> Yes. I am one of uh Alder Son's

1:29:52constituents in uh seven and so I wanted

1:29:55to just take some time here today first

1:29:58of all thank you guys for taking the

1:29:59time to hear us out because as a common

1:30:01thread is in what you've been hearing um

1:30:04we don't really trust you guys to listen

1:30:05to our opinions

1:30:07um like over the past year you've really

1:30:10kind of shown that you are willing to

1:30:13make decisions without talking to

1:30:14constituents so I appreciate this

1:30:16opportunity to voice that uh first of

1:30:19all I'm going to repeat what uh

1:30:21represent or what Alder Sier said uh

1:30:23this will not be getting a yes vote from

1:30:25me in its current form by no means uh is

1:30:29intentionally vague it seems which kind

1:30:32of leaves the fund open to be pillaged

1:30:35for whatever can be deemed transit which

1:30:38is just not beneficial for everybody or

1:30:41anybody really. Um, I understand the

1:30:43cost concerns, uh, but the best time to

1:30:46build trains in the city of St. Louis

1:30:48was 50 years ago, 70 years ago, 90 years

1:30:51ago, and the second best time to do that

1:30:52is now. It's not an easy investment, but

1:30:56it is a provably better investment than

1:30:58buses. There's a reason why every major

1:31:00city, its spine is built around its rail

1:31:03system and not its bus system. uh every

1:31:06single benefit that you want to tout

1:31:08about bus rapid transit is [snorts] done

1:31:11better and in a greater volume with

1:31:14light rail and that's that's just look

1:31:18around all the cities that you visited

1:31:19like I I lived in Chicago previously

1:31:22before coming here I moved to where I

1:31:24lived because I was going to be on the

1:31:27green line light rail line that was a

1:31:30big impact for me um just coming over to

1:31:35a couple of other points. Um,

1:31:39I think something [snorts] to note,

1:31:41especially when we're talking about how

1:31:43the city is losing population and we're

1:31:45starting to have money problems, is that

1:31:46like buses are not what attract people

1:31:48to move here. But, you know, what does

1:31:50people attract people to move here is

1:31:52light rail. It is one of the things that

1:31:53brings people to every major city in the

1:31:55country. And yes, we are still in a a

1:31:57budding point where we could do more and

1:31:59do better and we are still growing. But

1:32:02a a core function to that could be and

1:32:05should be light rail. We can reach

1:32:07people. It is an affront that a casino

1:32:10in Illinois has better access to

1:32:12downtown by light rail than I do as a

1:32:15resident of this city. That is just

1:32:18something that's unacceptable. Um and in

1:32:21terms of profitability, I'm I'm so

1:32:23sorry. It's really hard to hear you guys

1:32:24complain about money when you hand out

1:32:26tax abatements like candy to all to your

1:32:28land developer friends.

1:32:30It's really hard to hear that and say

1:32:32that you don't have the money while

1:32:34you're writing 20-year tax abatements.

1:32:36And has Green Street paid their taxes

1:32:38yet on the armory? Have they done that?

1:32:42I think there's just there is too much

1:32:44intentional obfuscation and too much

1:32:47focus on short-term wins at long-term

1:32:50sacrifices for this to be any kind of

1:32:53reasonable discussion. This never should

1:32:55have come to the table in the first

1:32:56place, not in its current form. Uh I

1:32:58know for certain I won't be voting for

1:33:00it. Um and I appreciate the opportunity

1:33:03to let y'all know my opinion. Thank you.

1:33:07>> Thank you.

1:33:08>> Thank you. That will be all.

1:33:12With that, Alderman Aldridge, you are

1:33:14recognized to close.

1:33:22And while you get up there, I I want to

1:33:23mention I also forgot to mention there's

1:33:25also going to be a virtual open house on

1:33:27Monday, October 26th. Um, you can

1:33:30pre-register uh on a link that uh is

1:33:33provided on, I'm sure, the BioState

1:33:36website as well as their social media.

1:33:38Um, so there's three opportunities

1:33:40coming up here in the next couple weeks

1:33:42to learn more about BRT. And with that,

1:33:46Alderman Aldridge.

1:33:49>> Thank you, Alderman Browning, for uh

1:33:51stating those uh public uh houses that

1:33:54will be coming up. I think those uh will

1:33:57be important uh for people to be able to

1:33:59show up to also directly hear from the

1:34:02representatives uh that has been working

1:34:04on this BRT language. Uh, I do want to

1:34:06say one thing I love about our

1:34:08committees is I'll take a a note out of

1:34:11Clark Clark Hubbert's words. Committee

1:34:14is where the like the work happens,

1:34:15right? Um, so today I think we heard a

1:34:19lot of uh good information from uh

1:34:22people that have been working on the BRT

1:34:24uh process, even from uh the city as

1:34:27well as residents and even um some of

1:34:29our colleagues uh that may want to see

1:34:32uh some tweaks to uh the language. Um

1:34:35I'm always somebody who's willing to uh

1:34:38work with folks to try to get it across

1:34:40the finish line. Um so I think there's a

1:34:42little bit more work that uh if not work

1:34:45at least conversations. I know before

1:34:47this hearing I did talk with uh all my

1:34:50colleagues about it. I know now there's

1:34:52a concern about the language which

1:34:54definitely willing to um have that

1:34:57conversation. Um, I think at the end of

1:34:59the day, um, you know, it's it's a

1:35:02little tricky of,

1:35:05you know, how detailed and how like not

1:35:07detailed you get with it because I think

1:35:09right now what we see is that, um, the

1:35:11first go round we almost maybe too

1:35:13detailed where now we have to come back

1:35:15and ask voters uh, to shift potentially

1:35:17to BRT or other uh, mass transit. So,

1:35:20uh, I do think it's important with

1:35:22hearing some concerns that we hold the

1:35:24bill today. Uh, get partners, uh, at the

1:35:28table and community at the table and

1:35:30also

1:35:40board um, this goes to the voters. And I

1:35:43want to be very clear, this isn't a bill

1:35:45that's being passed that voters are not

1:35:47weighing in on. Once this bill is

1:35:49passed, the whole point of this

1:35:50legislation is to allow voters to have

1:35:53their input on the change of the

1:35:55language because right now it is very

1:35:57tight where we can't do uh the rail

1:35:59line. So, um, I want to thank all the

1:36:02folks that was here today that spoke on

1:36:03it and all the folks that's been working

1:36:05hard on this piece of legislation and

1:36:07also I want to thank, uh, the community

1:36:08for coming out and the next time we have

1:36:12a hearing on it, uh, like always, we'll

1:36:14make sure that the meeting is several

1:36:15days out. So, if people want to come

1:36:17testify that they can come testify, but

1:36:20today I'll, uh, hold Bill 59 in the

1:36:23budget and public employees committee.

1:36:26>> Thank you, Alderman. uh as I hand the

1:36:29chairmanship back to you, I'll just say

1:36:31that I do encourage people to go to the

1:36:32open houses. There are opportunities for

1:36:34you to talk to these leaders and share

1:36:37your thoughts about it. So whether it's

1:36:39that the buses should be electric, uh

1:36:42which I totally agree with, you know, or

1:36:45uh that you would love to see express

1:36:47buses instead. These are the places to

1:36:49have those conversations and uh we

1:36:51really encourage you to utilize these

1:36:53opportunities. uh we're going out in the

1:36:56public uh to hear from you. So, I plan

1:36:58on attending at least one of these uh

1:37:00because I want to make sure that I'm

1:37:02also hearing from people and uh I look

1:37:04forward to seeing you all there.

1:37:07Thank you, vice chair, for holding it

1:37:09down. Um with that, we will move to the

1:37:12next item. Uh we do not have any

1:37:14resolutions for review as well as no

1:37:16committee discussions.

1:37:18Um uh any written testimony, Madam

1:37:21Clerk? Yes, we have one that's in the

1:37:23drive and it's um in the Google Drive

1:37:25for your review.

1:37:26>> Thank you, Madam Clerk. Uh we any

1:37:28announcements from any committee

1:37:29members?

1:37:31I will uh move that we excuse the

1:37:33alderman from the 5th. And with that,

1:37:35I'll take a motion to

1:37:39second. Moved by the alderman from the

1:37:419th, seconded by the alderman of the

1:37:4314th that we adjourn. All in favor? I.

1:37:45Any opposed?

1:37:47Motion carries.