2026-10-15 - Personnel and Budget and Finance Committee

01:59Mhm.

03:54>> Mhm.

05:49>> Mhm.

14:39>> Members present, we have to my left

14:43Vice President

14:44uh Vice President Anna Levy and Council

14:47Rosalie Gonzalez. Counselor Franklin

14:49McGill is unable to join us at the

14:52moment and if he becomes available, he

14:54will be joining us through Zoom.

14:56Pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of 20

14:59of the acts of 2022, this meeting of the

15:01Personnel Committee is being conducted

15:03both in person and via remote

15:05participation.

15:07A reminder that person who persons who

15:09would like to listen or view this

15:10meeting while in progress may either

15:11attend here in the City Council Chamber

15:14or use any of our social media um and TV

15:18access um access channels.

15:22At this point, you please join me in the

15:24pledge?

15:27>> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

15:29United States of America, and to the

15:32republic for which it stands, one nation

15:35under God, indivisible, with liberty and

15:38justice for all.

15:42>> Councilors, can I have a motion to

15:44approve the minutes from our August

15:4627th, 2026

15:492026 meeting?

15:51>> So moved.

15:51>> Second.

15:52>> been made by by the Vice President,

15:54seconded by Councilor Gonzalez. Any

15:56discussion on the minutes? You do have a

15:58copy of it. Um We'll provide a copy of

16:02it.

16:05Seeing none, all those in favor say I.

16:08>> I.

16:08>> The eyes have it.

16:11First item under new business is item

16:13411-26,

16:15appointment of Belicia Lynette Perez as

16:19director of the office of planning of

16:21planning and development. It was put on

16:24the agenda by our personnel director,

16:26Carol Garcia. Director Garcia, you have

16:28the floor.

16:29>> Good evening, everyone.

16:30City Council members, Carol Garcia,

16:32personnel director,

16:34uh 200 Commerce St.

16:40Uh I'm in front of you today for the

16:42appointment of Ms. Belicia Lynette

16:43Perez.

16:44>> Belicia, that's how you spell it.

16:46Can we just say Lynette Perez? Would you

16:49>> [laughter]

16:49>> Yes, of course.

16:51Ms. Lynette Perez

16:53>> Thank you.

16:54>> to the position of OPD director.

16:57To give you some background, the city

16:59received six applications for this

17:01position. Each of the five committee

17:04members reviewed and scored the resumes

17:07using the same criteria

17:09uh based on the job description. We

17:11looked at education, planning,

17:13supervisory experience, knowledge of

17:16land use rules, and grant management. Of

17:19the six applicants, four participated in

17:23interviews. Each one was asked the same

17:26standard questions, and each committee

17:28member scored the answers independently.

17:31At the end of the process, the committee

17:33voted unanimously to recommend Ms.

17:36Betis.

17:38At the end of the interviews, Ms. Betis

17:41At the time of the interviews, excuse

17:42me, Ms. Betis had served as acting OPD

17:45director for about 79 days.

17:48She was evaluated on the same criteria

17:51and the same questions as every other

17:53candidate. The committee members spoke

17:55specifically about her leadership and

17:57super- and supervision of the

17:59department, and described it as

18:00exemplary and exactly what OPD needs

18:03right this moment. Ms. Betis also has

18:07grant management experience, including

18:09the East grant, and other grants she has

18:11handled in her role with the Lawrence

18:13Police Department.

18:15Today, we also have here, if you would

18:17like to hear from her, Ms. Sue Fink.

18:20She served on the search committee and

18:22has been with the OPD department for

18:24over two decades.

18:26She's available to speak to the

18:27committee's work and to the department's

18:29needs if the council would find that

18:31helpful.

18:32For those reasons, we're asking for the

18:34appointment of Ms. Lynette Betis,

18:37who is also here as well.

18:41>> Thank you, Director Garcia. Um

18:43Councilors, you do have any packet just

18:45to reiterate, um

18:49in accordance to city ordinance

18:5202.04.070,

18:56it does require that the city council

18:58receives the names and the

18:59qualifications of the other finalists

19:01for the position.

19:03I know that's [snorts] always a question

19:05uh that gets brought up. So, you do have

19:06that packet in your in your uh we do to

19:10those documents in your pockets.

19:13Um

19:15before we bring up Ms. Peraza, I was

19:18made aware that there are

19:20I maybe just one now, but there were a

19:23few individuals that would like to speak

19:27on behalf of this item and as

19:30chair of the committee, I do allow at

19:32the committee level for individuals to

19:34speak if they are here on an item. Uh so

19:37if there is anyone that would like to

19:39speak on

19:40the matter of 411-26,

19:43either in support or not, um this you do

19:46have the opportunity to do so.

19:49As we do have this item on the agenda.

20:07I'll state your name. I know you already

20:09know the name and address for the

20:10record.

20:11>> Hello. Uh good evening, counselors. My

20:14name is Charlenet Pasqual.

20:16Um my address for the record, 255 Essex

20:19Street.

20:21Uh

20:22thank you for the opportunity to speak

20:23on behalf of the department. Um

20:26I come before you as a city resident,

20:28also as a department uh head.

20:32Um I have seen uh growth and leadership

20:35on behalf of our acting director,

20:37Lynette Peraza, in the time that she has

20:39been here. Uh she's been able to

20:41strengthen um the divisions in the

20:43department. I've seen growth, I've seen

20:45change, and I'm here in support of her

20:47appointment. Um if you have any

20:49questions for me, I'm open to answering

20:51any questions, um but I definitely

20:54wanted to uh make it a point to make a

20:56statement today in favor of the

20:58appointment of Director Peraza in her

21:00capacity. I've seen

21:02just a a number of of um

21:06of things that she has able to bring

21:08leadership uh and strengthen, like I

21:10said, the Department Communications.

21:13Um she's been part um actively in all of

21:16the projects that um our department is

21:18hosting. And um

21:20I would like to just come before you as

21:24um as a dir- as the acting director of

21:26Community Development to say that she

21:27has definitely um

21:29made an impact coming into our

21:31department. Um well, we had a lot of

21:33challenges um for some time now, and

21:35we've seen in the short amount of time

21:38um some strength and some growth there.

21:40There's a lot to do, and there's a lot,

21:42you know, that we want to see happen. Um

21:46but I foresee that with the leadership

21:48she's already demonstrated in the 90

21:49days, that we will be strengthening uh

21:52furthermore our department.

21:55>> Thank you.

21:56Anybody else?

22:05>> Good evening.

22:06>> Good evening. Name and address for the

22:07record?

22:08>> Genie Aguilar, and I'm at 255 S 6th

22:10Street.

22:11And I'm here to support

22:13Ludette in her appointment, hopefully.

22:16Um she's definitely brought in a lot of

22:19structure and support and

22:21accountability, I feel, in the

22:22department that's been a little all over

22:24the place and in need of structure um

22:27for years now. So, I've been in the

22:29department several years,

22:30four or five, and this is the best thing

22:33that we've seen. She's made a lot of and

22:36um

22:37I think it's what's best for our

22:38department overall, because we are made

22:40up of multiple different departments.

22:42The leadership that she's shown us has

22:44been widespread and without a

22:46micromanagement aspect to it, without

22:49any political aspect to it. She's just

22:51come in and been a very strong leader

22:53and shown a lot of support for those of

22:55us that have been searching for that and

22:57in need of that, and brought in a lot of

23:01positivity and hope to some places that

23:04we felt were a little bit hopeless at

23:06times and we were really struggling to

23:08get our head above water and I feel like

23:11we're getting there and an appointment

23:13for her would be a win for all of us in

23:16that department. Um

23:18that is all. If you have any other

23:19questions.

23:23Anyone else?

23:27All right, seeing

23:30none, I do want to I do want to

23:32acknowledge um for those at home we do

23:34have various um

23:36employees here tonight

23:39from the department. So I'm assuming is

23:41it in support of of this uh of

23:45potential item that we have in front of

23:47us. So I do want to um

23:50recognize that it's not being shown

23:52on camera. But at this point I am going

23:55to bring up acting director Perez.

23:59Um so that we can hear from her

24:01and then we're going to open it up to

24:03the committee for questions and

24:05comments.

24:06Director, you have the floor.

24:08>> Good evening, Madam Chair. Good evening,

24:10Counselors.

24:12It is um

24:14an honor for me to be here today and

24:17thank you for

24:19um the support of our team uh my team. I

24:23really appreciate um

24:25them being here, taking their time to be

24:27here tonight and thank you for those

24:29words.

24:42Since July 7th,

24:44>> [clears throat]

24:44>> I have had the privilege

24:46of serving as the acting director for

24:49the Office of Planning and Development.

24:52And I come before you tonight

24:55with gratitude, strong sense of

24:57responsibility,

24:59and confidence in the work that I have

25:00begun within this department.

25:04As many of you know, I think a lot of

25:07of you know guys know me. Lawrence is

25:10more than the city that I work for.

25:14Lawrence is my home. It's where I

25:16decided to stay and

25:18raise my family. I care deeply for the

25:21people of Lawrence, for the

25:23neighborhoods, and for the future of our

25:24city.

25:27Throughout my career,

25:28I have learned that meaningful public

25:30service requires leadership,

25:33accountability,

25:35sound judgment,

25:37strong relationships, and the ability to

25:39turn ideas into action.

25:42And that is what I have done over the

25:44last 90 days.

25:45>> [clears throat]

25:47>> When I came to the department, I joined

25:50a group of talented professionals,

25:53major responsibilities, and important

25:56projects underway.

25:57I also found a

26:00staff that was anxious and divided

26:04because of the many transitions the

26:06department has gone through in the last

26:07few years.

26:10So, having someone else come in clearly

26:12gave them

26:14a sense of instability.

26:16I recognize the impact that repeated

26:19leadership transitions can have on

26:21employee morale, communication, and

26:24confidence.

26:25And tonight I want to thank my team once

26:27again for the patience that they've had

26:29with me,

26:30for the support, and for sharing their

26:32knowledge with me when I came in and I

26:35really didn't have

26:37many experience under my belt in this

26:40within the department.

26:43My first priority was to provide

26:45consistency,

26:46accessibility, and stability.

26:49Our office of planning and development

26:51is a multi-disciplinary department

26:54of dozens of employees

26:57including planning, business and

26:59economic development, community

27:01development, housing, the lead program,

27:05the mayor's health task force, and

27:07inspectional services.

27:10In 90 days, I have taken concrete steps

27:13to strength to strengthen our

27:15departments.

27:17I have made myself accessible to staff,

27:21listened to their concerns, improved

27:23communication across divisions,

27:25brought greater structure to meetings

27:27and follow-ups, and reinforced

27:29expectations and accountability.

27:32I have also prioritized

27:34staff development and opportunities for

27:37team building

27:39that promote healthy work workplace

27:41relationships,

27:42which was one of the biggest barriers we

27:44had within the department.

27:47These have been deliberate leadership

27:49decisions that I have made, not simple

27:51ideas just because.

27:54I believe that employees do their best

27:57when they feel respected and supported.

28:00The progress that we have made towards

28:01stability matters,

28:03and this should be sustained.

28:06I also want to speak directly about my

28:08experience in being in the positions in

28:10this position.

28:12My qualific- My qualifications are

28:14rooted in years of public service,

28:17program administration, leadership, and

28:20community engagement.

28:22Throughout my career, I have gained

28:23experience in grant writing,

28:26grant reporting, grant managing, program

28:29development, budget management,

28:33overseeing simply um public

28:36publicly funded initiatives, building

28:39partnerships, and ensuring that

28:41resources reach the people and

28:43communities that are they are intended

28:45to serve.

28:47I understand that securing funding is

28:49not only the is not only the beginning,

28:52but it is important that we monitor them

28:55and that we meet um requirements that uh

28:59responsibilities that come with that.

29:02As director, I have put that experience

29:05to work.

29:06I have taken the an active role in

29:08reviewing departmental budgets, grant

29:11allocations,

29:13funding obligations, contracts,

29:15reviewing scopes of services,

29:18and reviewing the request for proposals.

29:22I have asked many questions.

29:24I have brought the right people to the

29:25table,

29:27and I worked across departments to

29:29address issues that can delay projects

29:31or put resources at risk.

29:34I'm not waiting for problems to reach my

29:36desk. I identify them and I try to solve

29:40them as soon as I can.

29:43I also bring experience working with

29:45elected officials, municipal

29:46departments, nonprofit organizations,

29:50outside agencies, community

29:52stakeholders.

29:55I believe that successful development

29:56requires effective communication,

29:58negotiation, and the ability to bring

30:01people together,

30:02and that I have done for years.

30:05My experience has prepared me to manage

30:08people, programs, budgets, partnerships,

30:12and complex responsibilities while

30:13maintaining a clear focus on

30:16accountability and results.

30:18I bring not only understanding of what

30:20this position requires, but practical

30:23experience

30:24performing many of those

30:26responsibilities throughout my career

30:28and directly within the department's

30:30while um my time there.

30:33Planning and development cannot function

30:35in isolation.

30:37So, during my 90 days,

30:40I have strengthened coordination with

30:42inspectional services, the treasurer's

30:45office, the city attorney's office, the

30:47assessor's office,

30:49procurement, and other municipal

30:51departments.

30:54I have reestablished

30:56bi-weekly coordination meetings

30:58concerning city-owned properties and

31:00development opportunities.

31:02>> [clears throat]

31:04>> Rather than allowing issues to remain in

31:06separate departments, I have brought the

31:08appropriate people together to identify

31:10the obstacles, clarify the

31:12responsibilities,

31:14track follow-up, and keep projects

31:16moving forward.

31:18This is uh the kind of

31:20hands-on that we need on a um in a

31:23department like planning and

31:24development.

31:26I have also made it a priority to attend

31:29planning board meetings and zoning board

31:31um meetings. Being present have allowed

31:35me to understand proposed developments,

31:38zoning issues, housing and

31:40infrastructure needs, and the decisions

31:43shaping our neighborhoods.

31:46It also helps me coordinate our

31:48professional planning staff and other

31:50and and other things that go on in our

31:53department.

31:55I am especially excited about some of

31:56the projects that will transform

32:00the city of Lawrence in the near future.

32:02We just received $425,000

32:06for the Burlington Triangle,

32:08which is a beautiful project project

32:11that we will be bringing um

32:14that will bring opportunity for

32:16neighborhood revitalization

32:18and safer

32:19and more welcoming public space

32:22in

32:23the Berlin in the on Bennington Street.

32:27I look forward to this development and

32:29this project will ensure

32:32I look forward to this development and

32:34making

32:35sure that this project, um,

32:37will be

32:40an investment for our community and for

32:42that district.

32:44We are working on the construct

32:46reconstruction of Pemberton Way.

32:49This is an important of infrastructure

32:52project that requires thoughtful

32:53planning, coordination, and attention to

32:56the funding. We're still looking for

32:58some funding, Sue, right?

33:00But we will. We will we will have it.

33:02And, um, this will be

33:06uh, give us uh, a new outlook at the

33:09entrance of our new City Hall and we

33:11will make sure that we are following

33:13protocols and that, um,

33:16it is it will be ADA compliant finally.

33:20The Tower Hill Waterfront Park is

33:22something that really excites me. It's

33:25one of the first walk-throughs that I

33:26have done

33:28with This is in partnership with

33:29Groundwork Lawrence and this will offer

33:32an opportunity to reconnect families

33:35with the waterfront and create beautiful

33:37public spaces for generations to come.

33:42And I am very proud and excited to be

33:44part of the initial piece of this

33:46project.

33:47These are investments in our

33:48neighborhoods and in our future.

33:51OPD is working hard on many projects

33:54that will This is just some that I am

33:55naming here, but we are working hard on

33:58many projects that will improve the

34:00quality of life of our residents. These

34:03include safe streets, overall critical

34:05crossings, safe routes to school. We

34:08have many, many,

34:10um, projects that we are working on

34:12through,

34:14uh, um, the Mariner project that in

34:17in collaboration and partnership with

34:19Lawrence Community Works. So, each of

34:21these projects,

34:23um,

34:23requires continuity, collaboration, and

34:26responsible oversight, which we do at,

34:30um, our office.

34:34I also want to make sure that we

34:36continue expanding affordable housing

34:39through our um,

34:42first-time home buyers program and

34:44initiatives that we have

34:46in our department so that we can build

34:49We know that housing is a problem in our

34:52community and just thinking of ways that

34:56we can develop these programs and help

34:58our community is really exciting for me.

35:01I have had the also had the opportunity

35:03to sit on the economic development

35:05master plan steering committee with the

35:08Merrimack Valley Planning Commission

35:10helping shape long-term visions for

35:12Lawrence. Um, we have also been

35:15exploring partnerships with different

35:18agencies such as Spectrum Health to

35:20strengthen resource

35:22um, [snorts] resources addressing

35:23substance abuse and we are working We

35:26have also, um, partnered with the Essex

35:29Art Center to advance in being, um,

35:33in being the cultural district for our

35:36area. We want to be

35:38We want Lawrence to be on the map and we

35:40have, um,

35:43hoping that the state will designate

35:45Lawrence as the cultural district

35:47through the Essex Art Center.

35:50I have also made professional

35:51development a priority.

35:54During my 90 days, I have completed

35:56HUD-related trainings. I have done home

35:59investment partnership programs

36:02and community development the CDBG uh,

36:05trainings.

36:06Uh, we recently took I recently took a

36:08short training on um, Baba, which is one

36:12of the programs that we have, which is

36:14Build America Buy America

36:16to better [clears throat]

36:18understand where our our funding comes

36:20from.

36:23I have completed

36:25the 3-day expanding capital assets in

36:28the Latino community training through

36:30the National Community Development

36:32Association.

36:34And I have also participated We just

36:36went to the um

36:39CDBG uh to the National Community

36:42Development

36:45conference fall conference. We just went

36:47there last week.

36:49So, I respect and rely also on the

36:51expertise expertise of other

36:53professional staff that work in within

36:55the department. Our planners,

36:58inspectors, program administrators, our

37:00finance officers, the division leaders,

37:04and I will we will continue um

37:07I will continue expanding my knowledge

37:09through them through the through their

37:12expertise.

37:14Leadership is not about claiming to know

37:16everything. So, I rely on them. I rely

37:19on my team for a lot of the work that

37:21needs to be done in our office. I ask a

37:23lot of questions.

37:25It is about having the initiative to

37:28learn, the judgment, and seek expertise

37:30when needed, and the responsibility to

37:32make informed decisions.

37:35My vision for the Office of Planning and

37:37Development is for it to become a hub

37:40of development for the city and

37:43the hub of opportunities for the city of

37:45Lawrence.

37:46I envision that this department

37:49is where ideas become action, where

37:52residents, small business owners,

37:54developers receive clear guidance,

37:57where the city departments work through

38:00together, and where employees feel

38:02valued and supported.

38:04I want a department that is responsive,

38:06transparent, accountable, and prepared

38:09for to offer opportunities to our

38:12residents.

38:14I bring proven leadership, grant writing

38:16expertise, and program management

38:18experience, financial oversight,

38:21municipal knowledge, strong community

38:23relationships,

38:25and a record of bringing people together

38:28to get difficult work done.

38:31I have demonstrated that

38:33that I can step into complex department,

38:36establish priorities, earn the trust,

38:39make decisions, and lead both with

38:41compassion and accountability.

38:45In the last 90 days, I have not simply

38:47observed the departments. I have led it,

38:50and I have done it with grace.

38:53I have worked with I have worked to

38:55rebuild confidence, strengthen

38:57relationships, create more consistent

38:59communication, and improve coordination

39:01of services.

39:03>> [snorts]

39:05>> And keep significant initiatives going.

39:08I support my staff when they come to me

39:10with questions, with concerns. I try to

39:12be available and to make sure that I

39:17give the right answer. And when I don't

39:19have the right answer, I go to the

39:21experts.

39:23I have taken ownership of the

39:25responsibility to lead while respecting

39:29and drawing upon the expertise of my the

39:31professionals around me.

39:34I'm not standing here today just simply

39:36to ask for to be appointed and to tell

39:39you what I hope to accomplish.

39:41I am standing here to let you know that

39:43the last 90 days have been challenging,

39:48but it have it has definitely been worth

39:49it for me. I have demonstrated what I

39:52can do. I have asked what I don't know

39:54how to to what I don't know how to do.

39:57And I have a clear understanding of the

39:59responsibilities that come with this

40:00position.

40:02And the vision of what can happen and

40:04what this department can become.

40:06I believe in Lawrence. I believe in the

40:08office of planning and development. And

40:11I believe in the talent and dedication

40:13of each and every one of our of our

40:16staff. And I believe that together we

40:18can continue not only to move the

40:20department forward, but to move the city

40:22forward, which is really what this

40:24department is designed to do.

40:26My foundation has been established, my

40:29work has begun, and I am ready to

40:32continue leading it if you allow me to.

40:40>> Thank you, um acting director Perez.

40:44Before we Before I open it up, I do have

40:47two emails um that I should have read

40:49earlier.

40:50As um my committee members know, I do

40:53read also emails into the record uh that

40:56I receive for committee meetings. So,

40:58let me just

41:00read these two

41:02um

41:05"Hello Ms. Infante, I'm writing to urge

41:07the committee to carefully review the

41:09proposed appointment of Lynette Perez as

41:12director of the Office of Planning and

41:14Development Planning and Development and

41:16not to recommend her unless her

41:17qualifications meet the required the

41:20requirements for the position.

41:22The job posting for this role calls for

41:24for

41:25substantial experience in municipal

41:27planning, including assessing land use

41:29proposals, ensuring zoning compliance,

41:32guiding long-range planning, securing

41:35grants, and developing policy recommend-

41:38recommendations. I am concerned that Ms.

41:41that Ms. Perez's education and relevant

41:43experience have not been shown

41:45to satisfy those requirements. Please

41:48request and publicly review her resume,

41:50credentials, and experience against the

41:52stated qualifications before making a

41:54recommendation. I'm also concerned about

41:56the appearance of political favoritism.

41:58Ms. Perez has been described as a

42:01personal friend and close political ally

42:03to Mayor DePena and as his 2021 campaign

42:06manager. The connection should not

42:09should not substitute for transparent

42:12merit-based assessment of her

42:14qualifications. I respectfully ask the

42:16committee to apply the city's applicable

42:19charter provisions and hiring standards,

42:21consider qualified candidates fairly,

42:24and explain how the selected candidate

42:26meets the rules the rules requirements.

42:28Thank you for your consideration.

42:30Sincerely, Sara Perez, 17 McKinley Ave.

42:33And then, the last one I have is a

42:38letter of recommendation.

42:41Um

42:42sorry, this is Sanita a little small

42:44here.

42:46Dear Councilor President and members of

42:48the City Council, I'm writing to express

42:50my support for Lynette Perez and to

42:52recommend her for a considering for

42:54consideration as permanent director of

42:56the Office of Planning Development.

42:58During her time serving as acting

43:00director, Lynette has demonstrated

43:02leadership, professionalism, and a

43:04genuine commitment to learning and

43:06understanding the department's

43:07responsibilities, operations, and

43:09priorities. She has approached this role

43:12with dedication and open mind and a

43:14willingness to grow into the many

43:16responsibilities that come with the

43:18leadership position.

43:20As we as we know, stepping into a new

43:22role involves learning

43:24learning new processes, gaining a deeper

43:26understanding of the department's work,

43:28and putting that knowledge into

43:29practice. Lynette has continued to build

43:31her understanding of the apartment

43:33department while working alongside staff

43:36and colleagues towards shared goals. Her

43:38willingness to learn, listen, and

43:40collaborate reflects an understanding

43:42that strong leadership is built not only

43:44on experience, but also on teamwork,

43:45communication, and a commitment to

43:47continuous improvement.

43:49The Office of Planning and Development

43:51plays an important role in shaping the

43:52future of our city. As public servants,

43:55we share responsibility to work

43:56together, support one another, and make

43:58decisions that contribute to the

44:00progress, growth, and well-being of

44:02Lawrence and its residents. I believe

44:04that maintaining a collaborative

44:05approach and shared commitment to public

44:07service is essential to the department's

44:09continued success.

44:12I appreciate Lanette's efforts and

44:14leadership as she demonstrated during

44:16her time as acting director. Every

44:18leadership Excuse me, [clears throat]

44:20every leadership journey

44:22includes opportunities to learn, adapt,

44:24and strengthen one's knowledge and

44:25knowledge and skills. What matters is

44:27the willingness to embrace those

44:28opportunities, work collabora-

44:30collaboratively, and remain focused on

44:32the needs of the communities we serve.

44:34For these reasons, I am I am pleased to

44:36express my support for Lanette Perez's

44:39Perez's consideration for the permanent

44:41director position. I believe her

44:43dedication, continued professional

44:45development, and willingness to work as

44:46part of a team can contribute positively

44:49to the department and its mission. I

44:51look forward to seeing the Office of

44:52Planning and Development continue to

44:54grow and move forward through

44:56collaboration, shared responsibility,

44:58and a collective commitment to serving

44:59the residents of Lawrence.

45:02Thank you for your time and

45:02consideration. Claudia Hoyles, project

45:05off- project officer two from the Office

45:09of Economic Development.

45:12So, I apologize. I always read the

45:14emails into

45:16um

45:17into the record. I guess there's another

45:19email.

45:21Um

45:23Dear councilors, I'm writing to ask you

45:25to please reconsider confirming Lanette

45:28Perez as a director of planning of

45:30Office of Planning and Development. Once

45:32again, we have a candidate who may be

45:34willing and able to learn, but that is

45:36not the same as having the

45:37qualifications and experience needed for

45:39such important position. As a city, we

45:41need to do better. Was this position

45:44publicly advertised? How many people

45:46applied? Did the committee have the

45:47opportunity to review other qualified

45:49candidates? These are simple questions,

45:52but they matter.

45:53The people of Lawrence deserve

45:55transparency and a fair hiring process,

45:57especially when it comes to the

45:58positions that have direct impact on the

46:00future of our city. A vote to confirm

46:02without addressing these concerns sends

46:04the wrong message. It tells residents

46:06that qualifications and proper hiring

46:08practices are not a priority and that

46:10the administration can continue doing

46:11things the same way without being held

46:13accountable.

46:14As a former city councilor, I believe we

46:16have we have a responsibility to ask

46:19questions, demand transparency, and make

46:22decisions based on what is best for

46:23Lawrence, not simply approve a candidate

46:26because the administration puts their

46:27name forward.

46:28I [snorts] respectfully urge you to vote

46:30no and insist on a fair transparent

46:32process. Lawrence deserves better and it

46:34starts with the decisions we make it we

46:36make today. Thank you for your time and

46:38consideration. Wendel Luzzo, former City

46:40Councilor, District B.

46:42Thank you. And to answer that quickly,

46:44it was posted twice and we do have those

46:45records for the public. We do have those

46:48records. Thank you to the HR department

46:50for

46:51for

46:52providing us with that.

46:54Um

46:56Okay, so now thank you so much for your

46:58thoughtful and

47:00introduction. Um I think that might have

47:03been the

47:04one of the most prepared that I've heard

47:07yet. So I I appreciate that

47:10listening to that. Councilors, I'm going

47:12to open it up now for questions and

47:14comments for Acting Director Perez. Um

47:19So does anyone have a question or

47:20comment?

47:28>> I do, Madam Chair.

47:29>> Councilor Gonzalez.

47:31>> Yes.

47:32Um

47:34Besides everything that you said, um

47:38what is your vision for the department?

47:42>> Like I said, I think that the

47:44the Department of the Office of Planning

47:47and Development is the hub for the city.

47:50It is where people go get information

47:54when they want to

47:57build or when they want information.

48:00There's programs that we have, the

48:02mayor's health task force runs many

48:04programs within our department. The

48:10economic development and business

48:13business and economic development our

48:14business

48:16we have a responsibility with our small

48:18business owners in the city. So I just

48:21want to continue to welcome the

48:23community. I think that our department

48:27is where the city develops, where the

48:29city grows with

48:32with all the

48:33with all the different funding that we

48:36have with all the different

48:37opportunities that we get. I think that

48:40this is where

48:42our city develops and we just continue

48:45to I think that the vision that we all

48:47have to have for this office is for the

48:49development of the city.

48:51And this is where where it begins.

48:55Thank you.

48:57Thank you. Any other questions or

48:59comments?

49:01Uh uh Council Vice President

49:03Your mic is off.

49:06Your mic is off.

49:09Thank you, Madam Chair.

49:11Through you. I will

49:14How can I explain this? This

49:17I had a

49:19a couple of questions. Well, people have

49:20been calling and asking about uh really

49:24your

49:25qualifications.

49:27Okay.

49:28Regarding

49:29the college that you went and saying

49:33um that at one point was a college then

49:37became university. And one thing that I

49:40would like to see is uh

49:43is your

49:45transcript or not just the the diploma

49:48because diploma can be anywhere, but I

49:51would like to see like the transcript

49:53of your

49:54career. So,

49:56um

49:58and beside I can see in here

50:02that [snorts]

50:03you don't have practically none of the

50:06qualification requested

50:08um

50:12for the job.

50:14That's one of the thing that I This is

50:17the second thing.

50:18So, I know that you've been in for the

50:21last three three months, no, right now?

50:24>> Mhm.

50:25>> And

50:29the community development is one of the

50:32most important departments that we have

50:36in the city. Most of the money that we

50:39need there This is a lot of employee,

50:43many different things that has to be

50:44done through there.

50:46So, this is the second thing. But, I

50:49would like to also

50:51What is the most

50:53important issue

50:56facing right now that's office of the

51:00planning?

51:01>> Um so, to answer your question,

51:03Councilor Lobby, I will gladly um

51:07provide HR with my transcripts. I don't

51:10have a problem with that. I did go to

51:12Greenville College and in about 6 years

51:15ago, they became Greenville University.

51:19So, that is why there is a difference in

51:21between um

51:24within the name of the school. So, I can

51:26I will gladly provide that. I don't have

51:29a problem with that. Um and I don't

51:31stand here tonight pretending or acting

51:34to be a planner because I'm not. I I

51:37have never said that I have the

51:38experience of what

51:41of a of a planner. However,

51:44the position doesn't call for that.

51:47The position calls for leadership, for

51:49grant managing, for um

51:53expertises on on on staff, on all these

51:58other qualifications that I do have,

52:00that I have demonstrated throughout my

52:02career, with making connections with

52:04communities,

52:06making connections with

52:09stakeholders.

52:11That is what really the position is for.

52:14Within this department, we have people

52:17with expertise. We have a land use

52:20planner. We have a comprehensive

52:22planner. We have a director of planning.

52:25We have a director of business and

52:27economic development. We have an off uh

52:29director of community development. So,

52:34we I am the umbrella, the the off the

52:38the director of planning and development

52:40is the umbrella where all these other

52:43talents are under.

52:45Which and they just it's requiring the

52:48leadership, and those are skills that I

52:51do bring to the table.

52:53And one of the

52:55um

52:56one of the biggest challenges that I

52:58have found in

53:00the office of

53:03of planning and development is

53:05um

53:06I think that we got over the hurdle of

53:08the of the staff where there was so many

53:11conflicts between staff, but working

53:14with developers is hard.

53:17They come, they present a plan, they

53:19think that um

53:22sometimes they I would say they feel a

53:25little entitled.

53:28And I have had to meet with the director

53:33of ISD. I've had to meet with the

53:36building commissioner, um just to review

53:39things and

53:40because I think that historically things

53:43have

53:44been done um a certain way and when they

53:48find a new vision

53:51um maybe a woman that may also have to

53:55do a lot with it

53:57they they challenge that and I have um

54:00I've had to be very stern when it comes

54:03to that um counselors.

54:07>> Miss Paredes um

54:10Here are the qualification the minimum

54:12qualification for the position of

54:14director of the office of planning and

54:16development shall be a master degree in

54:19urban and regional planning preferred

54:22well it's preferred

54:23and a minimum of five year experience as

54:26a municipal planning with one or the

54:28three year of supervisory experience

54:31or any equivalent combination or

54:33education and experience in about about

54:36what a valid

54:37the Massachusetts driver license I will

54:40not make it any question.

54:41>> So when you look at the substitutions

54:44and you look at my qualifications

54:46I can I can attest to that. I have a lot

54:50of leadership skills, managerial skills

54:53um

54:55grant writing skills doing you know I

54:59Oh I'm sorry.

55:00Okay. So

55:02um I do have the substitutions and I

55:05have done my research um counselors.

55:08There are not many

55:11urban planners um

55:13certifications in the state of

55:15Massachusetts. There's only a few

55:18I can't remember the number but um there

55:21not many urban planners in the in the

55:24state of Massachusetts that are

55:25certified.

55:28>> [snorts]

55:31>> Okay so

55:34can you

55:37can you tell me the time that you work

55:39and with your team you say that So, you

55:41know when your team coming to you, you

55:43speak with them and say you don't know

55:46any other questions, so

55:49uh

55:51and they differed on any opinions, so

55:54what do you do?

55:56>> [snorts]

55:57>> We all do what's best in the best

56:00interest of whatever is being presented.

56:02I think that um

56:05based on whatever is happening at the

56:09time we have to make decisions on what

56:11is in the best interest of, let's say,

56:15if it is

56:16someone that is bringing a project, is

56:19this project beneficial to us? Is this

56:22project beneficial to our community, to

56:25the neighborhood? So, we all sometimes

56:27have to agree to disagree, but it is it

56:30is it is a something that is beneficial

56:34within our for the community, I think

56:37that we have we find common grounds. We

56:40find common grounds on how to

56:43on how to work together. The

56:46many occasions I've had many people,

56:49many staff come into my office with

56:53with issues, with things that are

56:54happening, that things um may be

56:58bothering them or may be

57:00uh you know, be

57:02because we're we all think differently.

57:05We all have different perspectives on

57:06things, but when we come together in a

57:09common ground to the benefit of our

57:12community, we all

57:14sometimes agree to disagree.

57:18>> Have you had a situation where did you

57:21have to communicate a different a

57:23difficult decision to the group?

57:26And how they act and react and how do

57:29you respond to them?

57:32>> Um yeah. I think that anyone in a

57:36leadership position has

57:38has had to communicate

57:41bad news at some point. Um,

57:44but I think that when you do things with

57:46grace and with passion and you can put

57:49and you can be empathetic and you can

57:51put yourself in the other person's shoes

57:53before

57:55before saying things and just think,

57:57"How would I react? How would I manage

58:00that? How would I be able to be okay

58:04with that?" So, I think that

58:06communication skills is base is one of

58:09the most important things of this

58:11position because you do need to

58:13communicate negative things all the

58:15time.

58:17>> So, what about

58:20give me an example of a time that you

58:22faced an ethical challenge or conflict

58:24of interest.

58:28>> Um,

58:31an ethical challenge.

58:35I will disclose.

58:38Um,

58:42my son works in this department and I'm

58:44pretty sure that's where you're going.

58:47I made sure that when I was appointed to

58:49the position, I contacted the state's

58:52ethics committee. I let them know that I

58:55had been temporarily appointed to this

58:58department, that my son had worked there

59:012 years prior to me to me being

59:03appointed, and I made that disclosure. I

59:07also asked uh I brought it to the city

59:10clerk once they gave me

59:12a an answer.

59:14So, I think that being open and

59:17transparent, Councilor Levy, is the way

59:20that you handle ethic ethical challenges

59:23and where conflict of interest may be an

59:26issue.

59:27I did receive I think it is I did

59:29provide it to HR. I gave it to the

59:34um so that they could put in my folder

59:36because they did give me an answer over

59:38the phone and then I asked them to send

59:40it in writing when they said it was not

59:43a conflict as long as I was disclosing

59:46it. So, I did sign that conflict of

59:48interest form and within

59:50the clerk's office and I did disclose it

59:52to the state ethics commission.

59:55>> Can we Maria, can we make I don't see I

59:57don't see that the clerk

59:59um

1:00:00uh provided that. Can we make a note to

1:00:02send correspondence to the city clerk to

1:00:04ensure that we that we have it as part

1:00:06of the

1:00:07as the uh

1:00:09Do you have it with you?

1:00:10>> Yes, I just received it on my desk this

1:00:11morning.

1:00:12>> No, that's that's fine. Um

1:00:13>> provide copies now.

1:00:15>> That is the email, but I also provided a

1:00:17signed conflict of interest form to the

1:00:19city clerk's office.

1:00:20>> So, let's just make sure um uh

1:00:23Director Garcia, if you can just also

1:00:24work with with the city clerk tomorrow

1:00:26to make sure that

1:00:28um that's provided to the council.

1:00:30>> And also uh

1:00:31yes, through you Marilinda, also to

1:00:33provide uh the transcript and

1:00:39any information regarding um

1:00:42>> [snorts]

1:00:42>> the qualifications.

1:00:45Marilinda.

1:00:48For now, I'm done.

1:00:49>> Yeah, okay.

1:00:50Thank you. I I um

1:00:53I do have some questions, but now that

1:00:54you brought in this the the transcripts

1:00:57and and diploma up, I do have a question

1:01:00for Director Garcia. Do we have a unif-

1:01:04a unified uniform um process just across

1:01:08the board for the city of Lawrence to

1:01:10check transcripts or diplomas anything

1:01:12like that?

1:01:14>> No, we do not. Right now, we're actually

1:01:16working with um with Tyler Munis system

1:01:19in order to implement our onboarding a

1:01:21new onboarding system.

1:01:22>> Okay.

1:01:23>> Um so we are working on that so that we

1:01:25can streamline it.

1:01:26>> Okay, thank you.

1:01:27Um my first question for you um acting

1:01:30director, you've already answered

1:01:33quite a bit, but I wanted to ask it

1:01:35anyways in case there is anything that

1:01:37you need to add, but it it does go back

1:01:39to the qualifications

1:01:41um associated with this position.

1:01:45I wanted to ask you why you.

1:01:49Um because sometimes

1:01:53there are things that we may not know.

1:01:55Um

1:01:57like I mentioned, you have been

1:01:59answering a little bit, but is there

1:02:01anything else you want to add as to why

1:02:04should the city council give you the

1:02:06opportunity to be confirmed?

1:02:09>> I think that what I bring to the table

1:02:11is what the department needed at this

1:02:15point in

1:02:17at at this point in time. If you hear

1:02:19from the staff,

1:02:21there was a lot of um

1:02:24I think it would be an almost unfair

1:02:27to onboard someone who doesn't know the

1:02:30staff at this point because this

1:02:32department has gone through so many

1:02:33transitions. But when it comes to me, I

1:02:36bring leadership I bring my leadership

1:02:39skills. I bring my the knowledge. I

1:02:42bring the compassion and the and the

1:02:44passion that I have for this city.

1:02:47I have a lot of experience that can

1:02:49substitute the the qualifications that

1:02:53are written on that on that job

1:02:55requirement. I have grant writing

1:02:58experience. I have um

1:03:02experience managing budgets. I have

1:03:05experience managing

1:03:07staff, managing people, and I do it with

1:03:11with grace. I also think that I bring um

1:03:15at this point, I bring unity within

1:03:20within the city, within the department.

1:03:22I know that earlier it was mentioned

1:03:25that I may have political

1:03:29um, connections, but I am an independent

1:03:32person.

1:03:33I am I stand alone. I stand in in my

1:03:38grounds, in what I believe.

1:03:41And right now what I believe is that the

1:03:44office of planning and development has

1:03:48is doing well. Projects are moving

1:03:51forward. Relationships are being built.

1:03:55Um,

1:03:56things are being managed properly.

1:03:59Funding is there and it's available. And

1:04:02we need someone that has a clear vision

1:04:05for the city.

1:04:07That has a vision of what responsible

1:04:10development looks feel like, what

1:04:13community connections look like, of what

1:04:17leadership looks like, of what it is to

1:04:20be able to

1:04:22agree to disagree even when you are

1:04:26close to a person. That when you are

1:04:29presented something and you say, "I

1:04:31don't think that this is appropriate at

1:04:34this time."

1:04:35And I have been able to do that because

1:04:39when I

1:04:40look at things, I am not thinking of my

1:04:44friendship with people. I am thinking of

1:04:46what it is

1:04:48that the city of Lawrence needs.

1:04:51So, when you ask me, "Why me?"

1:04:54Because I have

1:04:57the leadership skills. Because I have

1:04:59the the wanting to be there. Because I

1:05:02have the respect of the staff. Because I

1:05:05have the respect of

1:05:07the community. I have throughout the

1:05:11last few months, I have been able to to

1:05:14understand how much respect I have from

1:05:17the community of Lawrence, from city

1:05:19councils, from

1:05:22people that work for the city, for

1:05:23directors within this within this

1:05:26building that have that are standing

1:05:29here sitting here today saying, I

1:05:31support you. Not because you

1:05:36have don't have a background in

1:05:39planning, but because you have what we

1:05:41need at this time.

1:05:44So, that is

1:05:45um

1:05:46why I think I should That is why I stand

1:05:49here today.

1:05:51>> Thank you. And you touched upon my

1:05:53second question for you and it was it's

1:05:56regard in regarding to the political

1:05:59connections. Um

1:06:02I can't be remiss to bring, you know, to

1:06:04bring this up. It's been brought up to

1:06:06me as a counselor multiple times. And I

1:06:09appreciate your some of your answer.

1:06:12Um well, we've gotten so far, I should

1:06:14say not some. What we have received so

1:06:16far

1:06:17in terms of your independent thinking

1:06:19and etc., but

1:06:21there are moments

1:06:23where there will be pressure. I have had

1:06:25individuals in front of me

1:06:28in this

1:06:29during these

1:06:31personnel committee meetings and at city

1:06:33council stating that they are willing to

1:06:37put their foot down when that political

1:06:39pressure occurs. And then come to find

1:06:42out

1:06:43when it hits the fan that they do the

1:06:45complete opposite, which I have called

1:06:48out multiple times.

1:06:50So,

1:06:51what will you actually do if that

1:06:54pressure comes to you

1:06:56as if you were if you are permanently

1:06:59placed as the director? How would you

1:07:01handle those situations?

1:07:03>> And I can honestly tell you I've been

1:07:04put in those situations within these

1:07:07last 3 months. Not once, more um

1:07:10several times. And like I said,

1:07:14you stand your ground,

1:07:16I stand mine.

1:07:17Um I have

1:07:20gone

1:07:22to people and I have said, "There are

1:07:25ordinances that need to be followed.

1:07:28There are protocols and procedures that

1:07:30need to be followed." And

1:07:33I have been in that position, counselor

1:07:35um Madam Chair. I have been in a

1:07:37position where I've had to

1:07:41um say, "You know, this is what needs to

1:07:43happen." And

1:07:46it just needs to happen because it's the

1:07:47way that things need to be done.

1:07:50I think that I mentioned this, and I

1:07:53think I've done said it before. I think

1:07:56that historically, and it is a

1:07:57challenge. It is a challenge because

1:08:00people are used to doing things a

1:08:02certain way, and when someone is It is

1:08:05human nature, we're resistant to change.

1:08:08And when someone sees someone as

1:08:11strong-headed as I am, they see me as an

1:08:14obstacle. They see me as

1:08:18like we would say in Spanish, la

1:08:19piedrecita en el zapato.

1:08:21And I am that for a lot of people, but I

1:08:24do not I can

1:08:26um I can say that I am not

1:08:30easily intimidated.

1:08:32I am not easily manipulated. And I do

1:08:35stand my ground, and when I

1:08:37like I said before, if it is something

1:08:39that is in the best interest of the

1:08:41city,

1:08:42that is the way that it needs to happen.

1:08:46>> You sound like me for a second.

1:08:49So, I I definitely understand that being

1:08:51similar as a councilor. Um

1:08:54Acting Director Perez, so I have three

1:08:57additional questions to ask you that I I

1:08:59thought I came a little early today that

1:09:01I thought of earlier. You touched upon

1:09:04one of them

1:09:05um quickly earlier and it's working with

1:09:08developers.

1:09:09Uh so, my first question to you is what

1:09:12do you believe makes a good project

1:09:16a good investment for this for the city

1:09:18and how would you determine whether it

1:09:21benefits the community overall?

1:09:24>> Well, I think that we need to look at

1:09:26where the projects projects are

1:09:27happening. Is it

1:09:30appropriate for that neighborhood? Is it

1:09:32appropriate for for that time in the

1:09:35neighborhood? Um I think that we need to

1:09:38look at what the benefit is from I know

1:09:42that when we look at different projects

1:09:45and we're reading, there is a question

1:09:46that is very clearly stated, what is the

1:09:49benefit to the community? So, I think

1:09:52that is that is what we are always

1:09:56looking for. What is the benefit to the

1:09:58community?

1:10:00And when it comes to developers,

1:10:02counselors, I can tell you that that is

1:10:04one of the it is a challenge. It is a

1:10:07challenge because

1:10:09developers come

1:10:12with a beautiful project.

1:10:15But

1:10:17are they following

1:10:19all the procedures? Are they following

1:10:22what the the

1:10:24the zoning and the planning um have they

1:10:26gone to before the planning and the

1:10:28zoning? You would be surprised

1:10:30um how many projects

1:10:32happen and that

1:10:33uh

1:10:34doesn't always happen in the in the

1:10:35order that it should be happening and I

1:10:38have I've had to

1:10:41um I've had my challenges. I'm going to

1:10:43share

1:10:45one particular

1:10:47instance that I had with a developer.

1:10:50They called me because they wanted um

1:10:53their project was denied at the at the

1:10:56planning board.

1:10:58They wanted their letter of their

1:11:01decision letter.

1:11:03And it was denied because it wasn't

1:11:05appropriately presented to the zoning

1:11:09board or to the planning board on time.

1:11:12And this person was angry and they

1:11:14called me and they were yelling at me on

1:11:16the phone and they were

1:11:18said, you know, I am here to make sure

1:11:22that these procedures are being

1:11:23followed.

1:11:24And I am willing to work with you and

1:11:26any other person that comes to to this

1:11:29department. However,

1:11:32>> [snorts]

1:11:33>> I treat people with respect and I expect

1:11:35the same. So, when you can come down,

1:11:37you can call me back and I hung up.

1:11:40Because I'm not going to allow someone

1:11:42to disrespect me in in that manner. So,

1:11:45the next day I did get um

1:11:48a call of apologizing and and I

1:11:51understand and then we were able to talk

1:11:53about what his needs were. And we were

1:11:55as as our as an office able to provide

1:11:59him the letter that he needed and I told

1:12:01um

1:12:02the the land user that he could that

1:12:05they should send the letter and all

1:12:07that. But it it's things like this that

1:12:10are challenges in the department when it

1:12:12comes to projects in the community.

1:12:16Thank you.

1:12:17My

1:12:18final two questions um and I am

1:12:21the reason why I'm asking these

1:12:23questions is because during my time I

1:12:24through two terms as a councilor we

1:12:26we've have dealt with with this. And two

1:12:29of them have been directly have directly

1:12:32benefited my my district. Um but I am

1:12:35aware

1:12:37it's been 90 days so you might may have

1:12:39not crossed this bridge yet. So, if you

1:12:41haven't, I just ask that you try to

1:12:44answer to the best of of your ability.

1:12:46Um and if you don't know, I would

1:12:48appreciate I I don't have an answer

1:12:49right now and and I'll you know, I'll

1:12:51gladly accept that as well.

1:12:53Um but

1:12:55this is pertaining to the TIF.

1:12:57Um

1:12:58as as you are aware, prior we have

1:13:02um granted TIF tax incentives to two uh

1:13:06businesses in my own district and, you

1:13:08know, across the city, but two in my

1:13:09district have been the Healthrich

1:13:11Brothers and Unitax.

1:13:13Um so, regarding the TIF,

1:13:17if confirmed as as a director, what

1:13:20factors would you consider when deciding

1:13:23whether a development project should

1:13:25receive a TIF tax incentive?

1:13:28>> I think that one of the first things

1:13:30that we need to take in consideration is

1:13:33the way the projects are presented. Is

1:13:35it beneficial to the community, to your

1:13:37district?

1:13:39Um

1:13:40I think and I and I did this with

1:13:43another project that was presented for

1:13:46another district. I think that the city

1:13:48I sent it to the city council and I

1:13:50said, "You know, this is happening in

1:13:51your district. I would like you to take

1:13:53a look at this and give me your

1:13:56feedback." I think that is also

1:13:58important. But when when doing these

1:14:00things, I think that we need to take in

1:14:02consideration

1:14:04is it beneficial for the neighborhood?

1:14:05Is it beneficial at the time?

1:14:08What is it that they bring that

1:14:10development brings to the neighborhood?

1:14:12And also, are they following

1:14:16procedures? Are they following the

1:14:18ordinances? Are they following the

1:14:20protocols that need to be followed? Have

1:14:22they been to the appropriate boards?

1:14:24Have they been to the appropriate

1:14:26departments? Have they talked to the

1:14:29neighborhoods? Have they talked to the

1:14:31business owners in that neighborhood? I

1:14:32think those are the things that need to

1:14:34be taken in consideration.

1:14:36>> Thank you. And a follow-up to that is

1:14:40a lot of the times the city council

1:14:42requires these businesses to have a X

1:14:46amount of job job creation with x amount

1:14:50of preferably preferably

1:14:53of residents from Lawrence.

1:14:56So,

1:14:57if appointed, how would you evaluate the

1:15:00number

1:15:02and quality of jobs a TIF project would

1:15:06create? That's the first part. And the

1:15:08second is how would you ensure the

1:15:11developer or business

1:15:13follows through with those requirements

1:15:16or commitments to the city?

1:15:17>> I think that

1:15:20people need to be held accountable.

1:15:21Projects need to be held accountable.

1:15:23Developers need to be held accountable.

1:15:25And when we

1:15:27I was recently met with an attorney of

1:15:31a developer who is bring wants to bring

1:15:33a business to the city and that was one

1:15:35of my first questions. How many Lawrence

1:15:37residents will you employ?

1:15:40How many Lawrence residents will have

1:15:44not only an employment but an employment

1:15:46with benefits? I asked these questions.

1:15:49So, I think it's accountability and I

1:15:52also think that to be able to monitor

1:15:55these things, that is why we have our

1:15:58division of business and economic

1:16:01development. They need to be connected.

1:16:04They need to say, "Okay, so I'm sitting

1:16:06with this new

1:16:07company that is coming to the city. They

1:16:09say they have 10 jobs. When they open, I

1:16:13want our department to be part of maybe

1:16:16the hiring of the hiring interviews of

1:16:19what it is, you know, I think that

1:16:21making the connections with the

1:16:22departments is what is important. That

1:16:24is why I stated earlier that that is why

1:16:29I believe the office of of planning and

1:16:32development should be the hub for the

1:16:34city because this is where the city

1:16:36makes connections with businesses, with

1:16:39residents, with developers, with you

1:16:42know, with that that is why we need to

1:16:45be

1:16:46that why that is why this

1:16:48department is

1:16:51I say like the blood

1:16:54that runs through through all through

1:16:56the city because this is where this is

1:16:58where all these

1:16:59great opportunities happen.

1:17:02>> Thank you.

1:17:03Um

1:17:04I'm going to leave you with this thought

1:17:05cuz I think it's something that you can

1:17:07actually start working on now as an

1:17:09acting director.

1:17:11Uh but the companies that we do

1:17:14a a war tips are required to report that

1:17:17back to the planning and uh and the

1:17:20office of planning and development. And

1:17:22to my knowledge, that has not been the

1:17:24case. They have not been doing that.

1:17:26Um so that's probably something I don't

1:17:27know who is running the business uh

1:17:30economic the

1:17:32uh area now, but

1:17:35I think it's something to look at and

1:17:36it's important that to ensure to your

1:17:38point accountability that they are um

1:17:43they are

1:17:44um

1:17:45doing what what they said that they were

1:17:47going to provide the city.

1:17:48>> This will become one of my priorities.

1:17:50>> Yeah.

1:17:51Uh thank you.

1:17:53Any other comments or questions for

1:17:55acting director of Perez?

1:18:01Seeing none, I will entertain a motion.

1:18:03>> Motion to send up to full council as a

1:18:05favorable recommendation.

1:18:07>> Motion has been made. Is there a second?

1:18:13The chair will second the motion.

1:18:17Any additional discussion?

1:18:21Seeing none,

1:18:23all those in favor say I. I.

1:18:26Uh Madam Clerk, can you please call the

1:18:27roll?

1:18:30>> Councilmember Harris?

1:18:31>> Yes.

1:18:33>> Councilmember Vice Chair Ana Levy?

1:18:36>> No.

1:18:38>> And

1:18:39>> Chair,

1:18:40Stephanie Infante?

1:18:41>> Yes.

1:18:42>> Motion carry?

1:18:43>> Motion carries.

1:18:44Acting Director Perez, we will see you

1:18:46next week at the full council. That

1:18:48would be the final round.

1:18:50And please be prepared for additional

1:18:52questioning by the rest of the council.

1:18:54>> Thank you.

1:18:55>> Thank you.

1:18:58Last item on the new business we have is

1:19:00item 414 415

1:19:03>> 15

1:19:04>> -26, creation of ordinance assistant

1:19:07director of personnel ordinance number

1:19:0902.48.050.

1:19:13It was brought to us by

1:19:15the city attorney attorney Huyen, who we

1:19:17do have online and we also have our

1:19:20personnel director here tonight.

1:19:22Attorney Huyen, I'm going to pass it on

1:19:24to the

1:19:26um HR director as she's here in person

1:19:29and then I'll have you jump in as you

1:19:32see fit.

1:19:33Director Garcia, you have the floor.

1:19:35>> Good evening again. Carol Garcia,

1:19:36personnel director, 200 Common Street.

1:19:40Thank you for giving me the opportunity

1:19:42to speak to this

1:19:44again.

1:19:44>> Yes, I am on.

1:19:46>> This mic doesn't like me much.

1:19:48>> Well, they all they all they all so like

1:19:51>> Our core personnel department is a team

1:19:53of three, including myself.

1:19:56We're fortunate to also have a benefits

1:19:58coordinator, who while not formally part

1:20:00of the personnel office, falls under my

1:20:03supervision and provides valued support.

1:20:06But her role is benefits and that's

1:20:09where her focus appropriately stays.

1:20:12So when it comes to the day-to-day work

1:20:14for running this department, it is three

1:20:17of us.

1:20:18And of those three, I am the only one

1:20:21with the authority and the position to

1:20:23sit in union negotiations,

1:20:26represent the city in grievance

1:20:27meetings, negotiate those grievances,

1:20:30participate in reasonable accommodation

1:20:32discussions,

1:20:33and make the kinds of decisions that

1:20:35carry real weight in the city.

1:20:38That executive function falls solely on

1:20:41me.

1:20:43There There is no one to send in my

1:20:46place.

1:20:48We serve approximately 594

1:20:51active employees as of our last payroll

1:20:54across more than more than 10

1:20:56departments

1:20:57and more than 10 unions.

1:21:00The Society for Human Resource

1:21:01Management recommends a 1.5

1:21:05to 1.7 HR professionals for every 100

1:21:08employees.

1:21:10The math on that, and I'm not very good

1:21:12at math,

1:21:13but for the workforce of our size, that

1:21:17standard suggests a minimum of nine

1:21:19dedicated HR staff.

1:21:22We have three.

1:21:25On any given day, we're juggling

1:21:27grievances, union meetings, FMLA

1:21:30processing, workers compensation claims,

1:21:33reasonable accommodation requests and

1:21:35approvals, the coordination of our newly

1:21:39uh quarterly citywide training

1:21:42programs. All at once, just to name a

1:21:45few.

1:21:46And that is just to name a name a few,

1:21:49excuse me.

1:21:50To say that the workload is a lot is an

1:21:51understatement.

1:21:53When I am unavailable, whether I am

1:21:55attending other personnel matters across

1:21:58the building or simply out of the office

1:22:01in another building,

1:22:02things don't stop coming in.

1:22:05They wait.

1:22:08Communities like Springfield and Methuen

1:22:10have recognized this challenge and have

1:22:13invested in the in their HR teams

1:22:15accordingly.

1:22:16We're simply asking for the same. We're

1:22:18asking for one position to help us to do

1:22:21right by the 594

1:22:24people who show up every day to serve

1:22:26>> [snorts]

1:22:26>> the residents

1:22:28of Lawrence. Thank you.

1:22:34>> Thank you. Attorney Hooton, is there

1:22:35anything that you would like to add?

1:22:43Attorney Hooton?

1:22:58Attorney Hooton?

1:23:02No, he's he's on.

1:23:13>> I'm muted.

1:23:14>> Oh.

1:23:21Oh.

1:23:22He is currently calling me on my phone.

1:23:25>> [laughter]

1:23:25>> Yeah, it's it's I don't have the

1:23:27authority. It says it's

1:23:29to unmute him for from this end.

1:23:33>> His computer won't unmute.

1:23:36>> It has to be from the back end cuz I

1:23:38don't even have the authority either to

1:23:40do it.

1:23:41>> See that?

1:23:45>> Can we put him on Does he have anything

1:23:46to add? Can we put him on speaker next

1:23:48to the mic?

1:23:48>> you on speaker. Now, hopefully it works.

1:23:50I'm going to put you on speaker.

1:23:54>> Um

1:23:54I sorry about that. For some reason my

1:23:56computer won't unmute. I'll go on

1:23:58another device in a minute.

1:24:00Um no, I have nothing to add. I think

1:24:02it's an important position. We do have a

1:24:04small HR department. And as as we know,

1:24:08I mean, sometimes

1:24:10Carol's in

1:24:11um negotiations with the union you know,

1:24:14for a day, 2 days, 3 days. We need

1:24:16someone else. They I know the mayor

1:24:19would like every department to have an

1:24:21assistant. Um uh because what he

1:24:24basically is saying is when she goes on

1:24:26vacation or the the department head goes

1:24:28on vacation, there's no one else to take

1:24:30over.

1:24:31So, that's all they really have to

1:24:34>> [cough]

1:24:36>> Thank you, attorney attorney Holden.

1:24:39Council, is any questions or comments

1:24:41regarding the item?

1:24:44Council Council Vice President Levy.

1:24:46>> Uh

1:24:46I was here.

1:24:48>> So, right now you don't have a

1:24:50a personal assistant.

1:24:51>> I do not have an assistant. I have a

1:24:53confidential secretary and a personnel

1:24:56aid.

1:24:57>> Okay.

1:24:57>> All of which do not have executive

1:24:59authority. So, while I'm in meetings

1:25:00with the mayor, I'm negotiating with the

1:25:02unions,

1:25:03um or any sort of the like, any type

1:25:06meeting, let's say a reasonable

1:25:07combination, which have have become um

1:25:11quite extensive um

1:25:13uh uh processes with the interactive

1:25:15processes in order for us to be um

1:25:17compliant with ADA requirements.

1:25:20It becomes a lot. I was out for maybe 2

1:25:24weeks. It was

1:25:26it was just about 2 weeks. I had just

1:25:28about 246 emails to come back to. Again,

1:25:33no one could touch No one has access to

1:25:35my emails, just so that we're clear.

1:25:37But, no one can actually get the work

1:25:39done. So, those were 200 and 242 46

1:25:43emails that had to get unattended. That

1:25:46were unattended, essentially.

1:25:49>> So,

1:25:50neither during the time you cannot

1:25:52assign somebody to take care.

1:25:58>> A confidential secretary doesn't have

1:25:59the executive authority. She helps as

1:26:01much as possible. Um

1:26:03my personnel aid uh um doesn't really

1:26:06handle confidential information, other

1:26:09than applications and so on and so

1:26:10forth, and is front of office, let's

1:26:12say. She answers the the um the door,

1:26:15she answers the uh the the phone, and so

1:26:17on and so forth. But, my confidential

1:26:19secretary is exactly what is in the

1:26:21name. It's a secretary. She doesn't have

1:26:24the necessary um authority in order to

1:26:26take over a lot of the things that I

1:26:28have to I have to do. So, she while she

1:26:31sits with me in reasonable combinations,

1:26:34for example,

1:26:35um grievance meetings and so on and so

1:26:37forth, and she helps me take my notes,

1:26:39she doesn't have the authority to go to

1:26:41the mayor's office and try to negotiate

1:26:43that um that grievance, for example.

1:26:45That solely rests on me.

1:26:49>> Thank you.

1:26:52Looking uh

1:26:53I know uh

1:26:54Tony Horn's trying to be admitted again.

1:26:59Um I'm looking at the language here, and

1:27:02I'm not seeing anything

1:27:05about a city council confirmation.

1:27:08Majority of the assistant directors do

1:27:11have to come through the city council um

1:27:13for a confirmation vote.

1:27:16And this is something that I would like

1:27:17to see for this position as well.

1:27:20Um I do see that

1:27:23description approved by the city council

1:27:25maintain

1:27:26um

1:27:27but at least for me for me to be

1:27:29comfortable to

1:27:31vote

1:27:32in favor of this, I would like to see a

1:27:35clause stating that the confirmation

1:27:37would have to go through the city

1:27:38council.

1:27:39With obviously the the the

1:27:43with the mayor's um

1:27:46uh signature.

1:27:48Um

1:27:50but yeah, that's the only thing I'm

1:27:52going to add to this.

1:27:59>> I will run that up the the pipeline.

1:28:01>> Thank you.

1:28:05>> Any other questions or comments?

1:28:08I don't have any. Do you

1:28:09>> I don't have any, either.

1:28:10>> No.

1:28:11All right, at this point I will

1:28:12entertain a motion.

1:28:15>> Motion to table.

1:28:17>> Motion to table. Is there a second?

1:28:19>> Second.

1:28:20>> Properly seconded. All those in favor

1:28:22say I.

1:28:23>> I.

1:28:24>> I. The I's have it.

1:28:26Thank you. And once we Once you have

1:28:28that, just send it right back so you can

1:28:30untable and and continue.

1:28:31>> It's been in front of you since before

1:28:32June.

1:28:35>> Thank you.

1:28:36>> Thank you.

1:28:37>> All right, counselors. Um that is it for

1:28:40tonight. Can I have a motion to adjourn?

1:28:43>> Motion to adjourn.

1:28:44>> Second.

1:28:45>> [laughter]

1:28:45>> Motion has been made. Properly seconded.

1:28:47All those in favor say I. I. The I's

1:28:50have it. Thank you so much.

1:34:27>> Good evening and welcome to the Budget

1:34:28and Finance Committee

1:34:30meeting. It is Thursday, October 15,

1:34:332026. It is now 7:32 p.m.

1:34:36Voting members present. To my left, we

1:34:39have the vice chair of the committee,

1:34:40Councilwoman Vivian Marmol. To my right,

1:34:43we have Council President Giovanni

1:34:44Rodriguez and Councilman Mark LaPlant.

1:34:47Pursuant to chapter 20 of the acts of

1:34:492022, this meeting of the Budget and

1:34:51Finance Committee is being conducted

1:34:53both in person and via remote

1:34:54participation.

1:34:56A reminder that persons who would like

1:34:57to listen or view this meeting while in

1:34:59progress may either attend

1:35:01here in the City Council Chamber

1:35:03or may follow along through our

1:35:05Facebook, YouTube, or channel or

1:35:07government TV government access TV

1:35:10channels. At this point, can you please

1:35:12join me in the pledge?

1:35:14>> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

1:35:16United States of America and to the

1:35:18republic for which it stands,

1:35:20one nation

1:35:21under God, indivisible, with liberty and

1:35:24justice for all.

1:35:25>> All.

1:35:31>> Councillors,

1:35:32can I have a motion to approve the

1:35:34minutes from our

1:35:36September 22, 2026 meeting? So moved.

1:35:39>> Second.

1:35:40>> Motion has been made by Councilwoman

1:35:42Marmol, seconded by Council President.

1:35:43Any discussion on the minutes?

1:35:46Seeing none, all those in favor say I.

1:35:49>> I.

1:35:49>> I.

1:35:50>> The eyes have it.

1:35:52First item is item 40526

1:35:56authorization to expend $300

1:35:59as a gift from the estate of Constance

1:36:02M. Cataldi.

1:36:04And we have here Chief Delaney to to

1:36:09address this item. Chief, you have the

1:36:11floor.

1:36:18>> Good evening, Madam Chair and

1:36:20counselors.

1:36:22Patrick Lanigan, Chief of the Fire

1:36:23Department, 65 Lowell [snorts] Street.

1:36:29So, I'm here tonight to

1:36:31hopefully accept $300 that was donated

1:36:34to the Fire Department.

1:36:36This this really this item speaks

1:36:39volumes about the caliber of people, men

1:36:42and women, that we have in the Alarm and

1:36:44Fire Department. So, Constance Constance

1:36:48Cataldi, Connie as her friends called

1:36:51her. She lived at

1:36:5212 West Kenneth Street. And I spoke to

1:36:56her daughter her daughter today, Sharon

1:36:58Walls, and she passed away

1:37:02about a month or so a month or two ago,

1:37:0410 days before her 99th birthday. As she

1:37:07was getting a little bit older, her four

1:37:10adult son

1:37:11children lived one lived in Plaistow, so

1:37:14they weren't really very accessible. And

1:37:17um

1:37:18to her statement that the Alarm and Fire

1:37:21Department she relied on an awful lot.

1:37:24I I do remember her house, 12 West

1:37:27Kenneth, and we we went there from time

1:37:29to time

1:37:31um

1:37:32as she needed some help either getting

1:37:34up some she was sick a couple times.

1:37:37Even I guess we went there a couple

1:37:38times to help her with her smoke

1:37:41detectors or whatever else that she had.

1:37:44So, she said she according to her family

1:37:48that she heavily depended on

1:37:50Lawrence Fire Department and and she was

1:37:53always um

1:37:55so appreciative of of our service. And I

1:37:59guess um

1:38:00to Sharon's statement she came a couple

1:38:02times and she said you know she always

1:38:05felt like oh there's the fire department

1:38:07there again like I'm sorry you guys had

1:38:09to come and she said that the

1:38:11firefighters were always so gracious and

1:38:15that truly enjoyed you know helping and

1:38:18helping out the community. So again this

1:38:21$300 that I'm coming here before you was

1:38:24given to us in her estate. She wanted it

1:38:27particularly for our ladder four house.

1:38:30Um I did speak to the captain of the

1:38:33house and said what you know how what do

1:38:35you think we should spend this on and um

1:38:38I kind of came up with an idea of maybe

1:38:40getting a plaque

1:38:41for her

1:38:43um in remembrance of her and probably

1:38:45use it now for some flowers and then

1:38:48again into the spring for some flowers.

1:38:51I'm open to suggestions but I think

1:38:54something like that something to

1:38:57remember her by and maybe some flowers

1:39:00in the in the fall and some more flowers

1:39:02in the spring and then with her plaque

1:39:05there every time we get some flowers

1:39:08maybe a little saying on it and

1:39:11it'd be remembrance of Constance uh

1:39:14Connie Cataldi 12 West Kenneth Street.

1:39:20>> Thank you. Um just before I'm trying to

1:39:22visualize

1:39:24the whole thing and I'm

1:39:27my question is where will you plant the

1:39:28flowers? This letter from

1:39:32her daughter was addressed to for ladder

1:39:35four. So where at ladder four would you

1:39:38>> most of our firehouses we you know those

1:39:41are our homes that's where we live. We

1:39:43we decorate. So, if you if you remember,

1:39:46you go by ladder four, there's usually

1:39:48some big giant flower boxes in between

1:39:52the doors.

1:39:53>> That's right. Yep. Yep. Yep.

1:39:54>> So, I was thinking maybe a plaque over

1:39:56there on that.

1:39:58A lot of times really

1:40:01a lot of times members of our

1:40:02department, you know, pay their own

1:40:04money and and get some flowers or bring

1:40:07some in, take it upon themselves. Again,

1:40:09these these it's our home. We like it to

1:40:12look good. If there's any money in the

1:40:15in the budget, we try to put some aside.

1:40:18If it gets late in the year, usually

1:40:20during the spring, we don't have it.

1:40:22Some of our members step up and and do

1:40:26it themselves.

1:40:28>> Thank you. Yes, I was first

1:40:30forgot about that part. I was I was

1:40:32thinking of the concrete like right in

1:40:34front of

1:40:34>> Yeah, I think all all our stations

1:40:36pretty much we have we try to put some

1:40:38flowers. They try to make it look look

1:40:41nice to the for the neighborhood.

1:40:44>> And in this letter, which I think

1:40:46it's pretty cool to even read this as a

1:40:49counselor.

1:40:51>> Yeah.

1:40:51>> The last part encloses a check in the

1:40:53amount of $300, which is your share of

1:40:57the estate assets in accordance with the

1:41:00terms of the will. She wrote this in her

1:41:03will, which is amazing and um

1:41:07>> They get a copy of that letter and and

1:41:09her check.

1:41:11>> Yeah, the only thing is

1:41:13yep.

1:41:14Counselors, any other questions or

1:41:16comments?

1:41:17>> I only have one comment.

1:41:18>> Councilor Marble.

1:41:20>> Um

1:41:22how you choose to spend these funds, I I

1:41:25don't have an issue with it even if it's

1:41:27to feed the officers cuz I know how food

1:41:30is expensive um during their stay.

1:41:33Um

1:41:34my only question and I'm not sure who it

1:41:37should be directed to

1:41:38um is gaining an understanding in terms

1:41:42of is there a limit when it comes to

1:41:45accepting money

1:41:47outside of

1:41:49outside of like the city

1:41:52appropriating funds to go towards your

1:41:55department. So any outside funds such as

1:41:58this donation. I'm just curious

1:42:01do we have anything that tells us that

1:42:03there's a limit? I hope

1:42:05>> I hope there's no limit. We would take

1:42:07donations. We could always use the help.

1:42:09I know that I believe it's $60. If it's

1:42:1350 or $60 somebody gives us a gift, I

1:42:16have to come here before you to accept

1:42:18it and we're trying to do the the right

1:42:22thing here by

1:42:24it's over $60. So we want to do the

1:42:26right thing and come in front of the

1:42:28council and and get

1:42:30approved to to spend it.

1:42:32>> Mhm.

1:42:33Yeah, so yeah, that was my only comment

1:42:35is just making sure that we're dotting

1:42:37our eyes and crossing our tees and again

1:42:40based on the needs of what ladder four

1:42:42[snorts]

1:42:43is, I feel like you guys

1:42:46especially you would be able to make

1:42:48that determination as to what would be

1:42:51fitting.

1:42:52>> Yeah, I'll talk to the members of ladder

1:42:53four and see if I just want it

1:42:56something to be appropriate and I

1:42:58thought it would be nice to be something

1:43:00that remembered her and a plaque with a

1:43:03little saying it would would go a long

1:43:05way cuz I think it would stay there for

1:43:06a while and the family was very you know

1:43:10gracious to that and they were taken

1:43:12back a little bit and

1:43:14they they appreciated it. And my first

1:43:17step obviously was I know the rule but I

1:43:20also asked attorney Hooton just to make

1:43:23sure like okay

1:43:25you know, what do we have to do? I know

1:43:27I have to go in front of the council. Is

1:43:28there anything else?

1:43:30>> All right. Thank you so much Chief.

1:43:31>> Sure.

1:43:32>> You're most welcome.

1:43:33>> Any other questions?

1:43:35>> Any other questions or comments?

1:43:37>> I'd like to make a quick comment.

1:43:38>> Councilor Lapointe.

1:43:38>> a heavy agenda, so uh

1:43:40I'm amazed by this, to be honest with

1:43:42you. I

1:43:44I know $300

1:43:46in the scheme of a $400 budget is not a

1:43:49lot.

1:43:50But, the idea

1:43:52that your department made such an impact

1:43:55to a resident that they wanted they pay

1:43:58their taxes. This is they're about to

1:44:01give government in addition to the taxes

1:44:04they paid an additional $300

1:44:07because of the goodwill that was

1:44:09generated by the men and women of your

1:44:12department. That to me is extraordinary.

1:44:15I I don't recall ever hearing or seeing

1:44:18that as long as I've been sitting here

1:44:20that we've had something like that. So,

1:44:22I don't want this moment to pass

1:44:24without just acknowledging that a little

1:44:26more deeply that this is extraordinary.

1:44:29It's It's It's

1:44:31It's not a lot of money, but it doesn't

1:44:32have to be. They went through this

1:44:34process. So, anyway, just that's and I

1:44:36think you're going to be fine with $300.

1:44:38I think because you're here before the

1:44:39council it's a public thing. It's not

1:44:42It's money coming in. It's now open to

1:44:44everybody to know. It's fully

1:44:46transparent. I'm sure the city attorney

1:44:48will say something if I don't think he

1:44:49will that this is not unlawful, but but

1:44:52that's to me is the issue. I mean, that

1:44:54to me that's amazing.

1:44:55>> Councilor, I agree. We were taken back a

1:44:58little bit and according to her family

1:44:59which I I called, she didn't really have

1:45:02much money. And so, this this is a big

1:45:05deal. Um The Lawrence Fire Department

1:45:08has a lot of traditions. One of the

1:45:11traditions that we hold close is the way

1:45:14that we we treat the public.

1:45:17And this shows here that that Constance

1:45:20Cataldi really you know, appreciated our

1:45:24service, the way that she was treated by

1:45:27the Lawrence firefighters.

1:45:29>> Good job.

1:45:32>> Uh Council President.

1:45:34>> Thank you, Madam Chair. I just want to,

1:45:37you know, express my uh

1:45:41my happiness about the situation.

1:45:44And the reason why is because

1:45:48a couple of things. We show in the

1:45:50public that we here to serve with

1:45:52quality and the quality of service that

1:45:54the department of serve

1:45:56the public it's it's it's it's it's

1:45:58speaking by itself.

1:46:00And the second thing is that

1:46:04sometimes it's not about what you give

1:46:08or the amount of dollars that you give

1:46:10is the the amount of dollars that you

1:46:12have and then give out of that.

1:46:15Which basically tells us that

1:46:18a lot of people are happy with your

1:46:20service.

1:46:22And also it tells it tells us that uh

1:46:26uh

1:46:27there is this this should be a a

1:46:30example

1:46:31uh to a lot of other departments when it

1:46:34comes to

1:46:35you know, serving the public.

1:46:37An appreciation letter is highly

1:46:39appreciated.

1:46:40A check is highly appreciated. But in a

1:46:43way that uh this come up through her

1:46:46will

1:46:47is something very special.

1:46:50So

1:46:52definitely something that we should look

1:46:53into

1:46:55when it comes to

1:46:57presenting this to the community

1:46:59because it was uh it's something that is

1:47:02might might look small but it is big in

1:47:05the sense.

1:47:07Also our second point is that

1:47:11we need to tell the public that

1:47:13yes, it is

1:47:15it is possible to donate to a specific

1:47:17department that you have

1:47:19appreciation to.

1:47:21Uh

1:47:22and it could be

1:47:24something like this or something that

1:47:26you feel like

1:47:28uh can make an impact.

1:47:30>> Yes.

1:47:30>> Uh in in uh the process how I haven't

1:47:33seen much

1:47:35of donation coming to the city from uh

1:47:38from private citizens.

1:47:40From business I have seen a few.

1:47:42Uh most of them to the to the fire fire

1:47:45department.

1:47:47Um and also

1:47:49I believe like 16 years ago

1:47:52or maybe like 11 year 10 years ago we

1:47:54have we received some trash cans

1:47:57from one uh

1:47:59one hotel I believe it was that

1:48:02uh it was distributed throughout the

1:48:04city and they're still around.

1:48:06So it is it is something that we

1:48:08definitely appreciate

1:48:10and uh we're happy about.

1:48:12So thank you, Chief.

1:48:13>> Okay. Thank you, counselor.

1:48:16>> So

1:48:17>> Um

1:48:18>> Thank you. At this point I will

1:48:19entertain

1:48:20>> a motion.

1:48:20>> I was about to do that. I didn't want to

1:48:21cut you off in case you had anything to

1:48:23add. Uh motion to send item 405-26 to

1:48:27the full council with a favorable

1:48:29recommendation.

1:48:30>> Second.

1:48:30>> Motion has been made properly seconded.

1:48:32Any additional questions or comments?

1:48:35Seeing none, all those in favor say I.

1:48:37>> I.

1:48:37>> The eyes have it. Chief, can you

1:48:39approach quick

1:48:41before we can use

1:48:43>> Yes.

1:48:45>> this this document

1:48:48I have to

1:48:48cross that out.

1:48:50So can we make sure that this

1:48:51information is not part of sensitive

1:48:55you know, things information.

1:48:57So

1:48:58>> [snorts]

1:48:58>> You have yours. Yeah, so this video

1:49:01So I crossed it out on mine, but

1:49:04>> I'll make sure that mine is taken care

1:49:06of.

1:49:06>> Yeah, so make sure that I leave

1:49:09with Irene that she

1:49:10>> Okay.

1:49:11>> I'll call the person in

1:49:12>> Appreciate it and I pray you.

1:49:15>> Thank you.

1:49:15>> Um all right. Next item is item 406-26,

1:49:19authorization to expend $70,000 from the

1:49:22Cataldo

1:49:24Ambulance Services for Lawrence Fire

1:49:26Department's EMS Coordinator salary.

1:49:31And we have Fire Chief Delaney here to

1:49:33speak on this matter. Chief, you have

1:49:35the floor.

1:49:36>> Um, again, good evening, um, Madam

1:49:39Chair, Council.

1:49:41So,

1:49:42there was an addendum to a contract.

1:49:44Lawrence General Hospital has an

1:49:46existing contract for years with with

1:49:49the city to provide BLS and ALS, um,

1:49:52service to to our community. Um, when I

1:49:56first started to taking over when I was

1:49:58acting, I believe that it just got

1:50:01recertified.

1:50:03Then when they decided to what was kind

1:50:05of sub sub it out, we believe, um,

1:50:09believe that they were kind of breaking

1:50:11the contract, that they were opened it

1:50:13up. And I I, you know, really saw the

1:50:16opportunity that the fire department in

1:50:19the city of Lawrence really did not

1:50:21receive too many benefits of any

1:50:23benefits from Lawrence General Hospital,

1:50:27um, with the contract. It's really a no

1:50:29money contract. Years ago we used to

1:50:32have a contract with Patriot, and they

1:50:34were able to supply us with some of our

1:50:37needs, some of our gloves, some of our

1:50:39other stuff. Um, that stuff gets very

1:50:43expensive.

1:50:44So,

1:50:46during negotiations, during during this

1:50:48contract, there was a couple different

1:50:50ambulances, they got down to two of

1:50:52them, and, um, we really opened up a

1:50:55couple things that that the fire

1:50:57department thought that it would be

1:50:59beneficial to the city of Lawrence and

1:51:01to the fire department if the private

1:51:04ambulance who comes into our community

1:51:06and is able to to make some money,

1:51:09possibly,

1:51:10um, that they, you know, give back and

1:51:13and help us out a little bit. So, this

1:51:16addendum that you have to the contract

1:51:18is a lot of this stuff is already in

1:51:20place. So, what we were able to

1:51:21negotiate with them was EMT training

1:51:25seats.

1:51:26EMT Getting your EMT could be very

1:51:28expensive. I know Northern Essex done a

1:51:31couple free classes, but they're

1:51:33they're not doing as much. So, every

1:51:35year they're going to give us four

1:51:37seats. We put them out by seniority. Our

1:51:39senior senior members have the chance to

1:51:42go become EMTs. EMTs are

1:51:46even in negotiations, I was a supporter

1:51:48of, you know, bringing up the EMT train

1:51:51the statement because it is a lot higher

1:51:54level of service and EMT to a first

1:51:57responder.

1:51:58I as the chief, I I would like everybody

1:52:01to be EMTs and hopefully we're working

1:52:04in in that direction. But, all of our

1:52:06people are medically trained. Portable

1:52:09oxygen cylinders support. Now, they give

1:52:12us all our portable oxygen. It's at the

1:52:14central. We don't have to go by the

1:52:16hospital. They supply us with all our

1:52:18oxygen. Medical equipment exchange. This

1:52:21is very big. If you use a bag valve or

1:52:25something like that that comes off our

1:52:27equipment, this medical equipment is

1:52:29given getting very expensive. And they

1:52:32have agreed to do a one-for-one. So, if

1:52:35if you use some sort of our equipment,

1:52:39we are able right there on site to

1:52:41change it out with the ambulance. If

1:52:43it's a tough call, they got to go quick.

1:52:45We're able to go to one of their

1:52:46headquarters and

1:52:49our engines, our ladders are able to get

1:52:51some equipment.

1:52:53I'm going to skip number four. That's

1:52:54what I'm here for. I'll go quick.

1:52:56Quarterly medical education program. We

1:52:59already started that. They they coming

1:53:02in

1:53:03all four groups that they're going to

1:53:06train on something that we think that

1:53:08would be mutual beneficial.

1:53:10Um last time I believe was um

1:53:14was ambulance familiarization because

1:53:17they have some new ambulance, some new

1:53:18equipment. This time they're coming in

1:53:20in next in November, they're coming in

1:53:23um doing a birthing class to us. It's

1:53:27It's a class, believe it's a call,

1:53:29believe it or not, that we frequently go

1:53:32on in the city is um

1:53:34you know, the the labor, woman in labor.

1:53:37That's a a frequent call we go on and

1:53:40we, you know, want our members to be

1:53:42confident in that skill and they're

1:53:45coming in

1:53:46to do that. CPI recertification

1:53:49training, they're coming in they're

1:53:51going to CPI we have to do every year.

1:53:53We usually have to pay somebody. They've

1:53:55agreed to come in and and do that for

1:53:57free. Online EMS training, that should

1:54:01actually save us a little bit of money

1:54:03also, where we have to come have come in

1:54:06and do a 20-hour class. There's

1:54:09something online that they bought us all

1:54:11a membership for. So, we have 31 EMTs.

1:54:15We have a couple in the training right

1:54:17now, but um we part of the contract we

1:54:20have to reimburse them for the cost of

1:54:22their training. So, part of this they've

1:54:25given us a subscription. We're now I'm

1:54:28an EMT, I could I could take this

1:54:30subscription and I could go in and

1:54:33recertify um

1:54:35get my certification, redo it. It's It's

1:54:3940 hours every 2 years broken up to 10

1:54:42individual 10 other ones and then 20 of

1:54:45an an all class. So, then it goes back

1:54:48to the addendum here is the EMS

1:54:51coordinator funding. So, this part they

1:54:54again they're giving us money. They're

1:54:55giving us $70,000 towards a position.

1:54:58It's about 2/3 of the position and it

1:55:01was something that we think is very much

1:55:04needed in the Lawrence Fire Department.

1:55:06We think it's going to it's going to

1:55:08help us an an awful lot. It's you know,

1:55:12you could take that role, and really you

1:55:15could make it a whole division. It could

1:55:17be it could be an officer and two

1:55:19firefighters. There's there's a lot to

1:55:21do when it comes to the medical side of

1:55:23our job.

1:55:24Um I just counted our calls. 12 out of

1:55:28our last 20 calls since 10:00 last night

1:55:30were medicals. 50% of our overall calls

1:55:34are medicals.

1:55:35Um we we are an old-fashioned

1:55:38firefighting

1:55:40uh

1:55:41a firefighting group, but we do a lot of

1:55:44medicals. Medicals is 50% of what we do.

1:55:47So, one of the things I did um there's a

1:55:5037-page

1:55:52EMS coordinator a framework. It cuts

1:55:55down to some of the some of the duties,

1:55:58some of the the vision that we see. We

1:56:01kind of like to say like this is new for

1:56:03us. We're we're kind of building the

1:56:05plane as we're flying it, and um we but

1:56:08we think it's going to be very good. So,

1:56:10this person's duties will be um partly

1:56:14to see what the contract is, but when

1:56:17you get into the EMS world, it is really

1:56:22it's really in-depth. There's a lot to

1:56:24do. There's a lot of equipment, and

1:56:27there's there's just a lot. I When I go

1:56:29to the

1:56:31Essex County fire chiefs um meetings,

1:56:34most of the the communities, you know,

1:56:36they have ambulances um close with the

1:56:39Andover fire chief, the Methuen fire

1:56:41chief, and I'm able to ask them some

1:56:44questions, and they both um

1:56:46run ambulances. Again, we're we're

1:56:48dealing with the private service here,

1:56:51and um we want to make sure that we're,

1:56:55you know, communicating and getting the

1:56:57most out of them for the citizens of our

1:57:00community.

1:57:05>> Thank you. Counselors, any questions or

1:57:07comments? Counselor Planck.

1:57:09>> Yeah, there's a lot There's a lot to

1:57:10unpack here.

1:57:12There's a lot.

1:57:14Um

1:57:16Let me just start with We'll go with the

1:57:18basics.

1:57:19Is this position ordinanced?

1:57:21EMS coordinator position?

1:57:23>> Is it ordinanced?

1:57:24>> Yeah. You're We're funding it, but you

1:57:26were looking This is You said, I think,

1:57:272/3 or a portion of majority of a of a

1:57:30position in EMS coordinator. So, the

1:57:33question is, is there an EMS coordinator

1:57:36position in our ordinances?

1:57:38>> I'm not To tell you the truth,

1:57:40counselor, I'm not sure. We did have an

1:57:41EMS coordinator years ago and in the

1:57:44department, so I'm not sure if it's it's

1:57:47it's still on on the books.

1:57:49>> So, uh step one,

1:57:52>> We're going to have to figure that out.

1:57:54>> Step one, you there needs to be an

1:57:57ordinance position, and if it's a

1:57:59ordinance, but it hasn't been filled for

1:58:01the last, I think, 6 months, I think

1:58:03it's the time frame off my memory.

1:58:05>> 6 months?

1:58:06>> 6 months. Then, it has to be refreshed,

1:58:08reauthorized. So, I mean, that's the

1:58:10That's like step one. So,

1:58:13Could I Could I answer that?

1:58:15>> So, the way that we're looking at this

1:58:17is really it's it's it is a new

1:58:19position, but it falls in line with our

1:58:21other positions. This is going to be a

1:58:24a uh in the training division. So, all

1:58:28of our all of our administrators, all of

1:58:30our fire prevention personnel are

1:58:33training, they fall under one category.

1:58:36So, this would probably find fall under

1:58:39our training division, but these are

1:58:42just some of the duties that they're

1:58:44going to have as the EMS coordinator.

1:58:46So, um to tell you the truth, counselor,

1:58:49I'm not sure if we have to ordinance it,

1:58:52and then set and again I made sure that

1:58:54I

1:58:55I I went through personnel with this. I

1:58:57went through the city attorney, but I

1:59:00think it's just a new um

1:59:03I don't know if I'm missing something

1:59:04here.

1:59:05>> did you when you discussed with

1:59:07personnel and the city attorney, did

1:59:09they mention that whether or not

1:59:11>> not creating I'm not creating a new job

1:59:13here. This is just extra duties for

1:59:16somebody. So

1:59:18>> So we do have the city attorney online

1:59:20currently.

1:59:21Attorney Hooten, can you enlighten us

1:59:25with any information that you see fit

1:59:28for this discussion?

1:59:30>> Well, to be honest with you, what's in

1:59:32front of you

1:59:33is to accept money.

1:59:35Not to create a position, but to accept

1:59:37money.

1:59:40>> So

1:59:40>> And and there's no denying that. But

1:59:44we can accept money, but can it be

1:59:45spent? That's the question. The money is

1:59:47is to be spent on a position called

1:59:50>> It's a big thing here says EMS

1:59:52coordinator, which tells me that's a

1:59:54person that's going to be doing a job

1:59:56and the job's going to be with the city.

1:59:58And if we're doing a city job, it has to

2:00:00be an ordinance for that position. So

2:00:02that's why I'm asking these questions.

2:00:04>> I I'm just I'm I'm a little and I don't

2:00:06obviously I I don't have it in front of

2:00:07me. I I'm unsure whether every fireman

2:00:11or fire woman is an ordinance position

2:00:13or it's a general classification.

2:00:16Um do they go down to what each and

2:00:17every person does? I don't know. I would

2:00:19have to look at that.

2:00:20>> And and attorney Hooten, I

2:00:22I believe like we overall have a not

2:00:25every person as a complete job

2:00:27description. We cross over a lot of

2:00:29duties and again this person is going to

2:00:31fall within within the training

2:00:34division. So as things evolve, it would

2:00:37be you know, what's our next thing?

2:00:39Let's say

2:00:41you know, lithium ion batteries is a

2:00:43huge thing in the fire service. There's

2:00:46a lot of different things in our 527

2:00:48CMR. I could take one section out of

2:00:53that book and I could make somebody's do

2:00:56that all their duties and it would be

2:00:59called something something different.

2:01:02>> So let's do this. We're not going to I

2:01:04don't think we're going to get a

2:01:05resolution on this tonight.

2:01:07I think my my opinion is that attorney

2:01:10Hooton I think that just

2:01:12you you're you're

2:01:13>> [snorts]

2:01:13>> I think making a good argument attorney

2:01:15Hooton regarding other publics. I think

2:01:18you're heading in that direction other

2:01:20police and fire and whether or not those

2:01:21are ordinance positions, etc. I would

2:01:24for for us to for me to be

2:01:27comfortable with with this

2:01:30And I realize this is all about money,

2:01:32but there's a purpose for the money.

2:01:33It's just not grabbing money. It's money

2:01:35to spend. So we're looking to spend it,

2:01:36looking to spend it on the position. And

2:01:38I just just double-check. So that's

2:01:40that's going to be that. The other

2:01:42things that that that would have

2:01:44that

2:01:46aren't necessarily germane to

2:01:50the specifics of accepting $70,000.

2:01:53I'm going to not I'm going to You're the

2:01:56expert. You're telling me that this

2:01:58money is important. I do know that you

2:02:00got more Most of your calls are medical

2:02:03related. I know that. And I know that

2:02:06this will probably be a very good thing.

2:02:09So please don't think of these questions

2:02:12as trying to find a roadblock to say no,

2:02:14I don't want you to go there. I just

2:02:15want to make sure we're doing it the

2:02:16right way and that we do You know what

2:02:18I'm saying? So that's the reason for it.

2:02:20That's why I'm agreeing that. The other

2:02:22thing that I don't want I'm going to

2:02:23start to go down the rabbit hole, but

2:02:24I'm going to take myself right out of it

2:02:26and which is this.

2:02:28The the contract for ambulances,

2:02:30especially I don't know what's happened

2:02:32to LGH, if that's still a thing, if it's

2:02:35no longer a thing, if we're going

2:02:36elsewhere. Is this a 3-year contract? Is

2:02:39this less less 3 years, more than 3

2:02:41years? Is there any con- I'm If it's

2:02:44less than 3 years, it As you all know,

2:02:47we don't get involved in contracts below

2:02:493 years. We get involved in contracts 3

2:02:51years, long-term contracts, and beyond.

2:02:53I don't know what that is.

2:02:55I was around when LGH got a no-bid

2:02:58contract under the Rivera

2:03:00administration. I was here. I didn't

2:03:02There was a lot of moving parts to that

2:03:04contract. Some stuff I was privy to and

2:03:06I wasn't privy to. So, there is a lot to

2:03:09unpack here, and I just Tonight, we have

2:03:12such so many things. I'm just laying

2:03:14issues out, not necessarily needing a

2:03:15response, but these are issues that I'm

2:03:17thinking about. We can come back later.

2:03:19>> If I can, can I respond to what comes

2:03:21up? I guess.

2:03:22I believe this contract states that as

2:03:24long as they have the contract that it's

2:03:27going to keep going, Cataldo.

2:03:30As long as they are involved with it,

2:03:32that we're going to keep We're going to

2:03:34keep receiving this. I'm pretty

2:03:37confident that it does not have to be

2:03:39ordinance.

2:03:41But, we we could check on that. One

2:03:44thing that I would hope is if somehow we

2:03:47could move this forward because they

2:03:50This was, you know,

2:03:52They

2:03:53gave us $70,000 for the year. This was

2:03:55already in July. We're getting We're one

2:03:59quarter into the season. So, I just

2:04:02don't want them to,

2:04:04you know, say, "Hey,

2:04:06we probably only should give you a 40 or

2:04:0850 now." Cuz

2:04:11But, I I This I've been sitting on this

2:04:13a long time. We've done our research,

2:04:14and I believe we're we're going about it

2:04:16the right way.

2:04:19>> Mr. Lynch.

2:04:20>> Council President.

2:04:21>> Thank you, Mr. Lynch.

2:04:23So, a couple of questions. Uh

2:04:26Um

2:04:26So, you mentioned that

2:04:28the new person

2:04:31or the person that is going to be doing

2:04:32this job,

2:04:34you said current firefighter.

2:04:38Correct?

2:04:40>> It it it calls for a lieutenant.

2:04:42>> Okay. It's a current firefighter.

2:04:45>> Well, yes, a current firefighter, but

2:04:47just want to be clear that the the

2:04:49lieutenant Yes, sir.

2:04:51>> Yes. So, there isn't any any uh,

2:04:55agreement with the union

2:04:56when it comes to

2:04:57>> I

2:04:58With everything

2:04:59>> the duties of this person.

2:05:00>> Yes, with everything I try to do I I try

2:05:02to include the union on it. And uh, I

2:05:05think um, we're doing this the correct

2:05:08way and and they're they they realize

2:05:11they're the ones that are doing these

2:05:13calls and and I have approached them

2:05:16with this and and they're on board.

2:05:19>> So, essentially,

2:05:20this [snorts] this this

2:05:22this is going to be extra duties?

2:05:25Or this is going to be their duties?

2:05:28>> That's going to be most of their duties,

2:05:30but they're also, you know, that's only

2:05:32funding 2/3, so we're we're also going

2:05:34to be doing some training there, some

2:05:36other things that they could do with the

2:05:38training division.

2:05:40>> No, what I'm what I'm thinking is like

2:05:42potentially

2:05:44right now, this person

2:05:47is doing

2:05:48X, Y, and Z,

2:05:50but eventually,

2:05:51the those duties are going to change and

2:05:54the city going to have to

2:05:57either assign somebody new to do those

2:06:01previous duties that this person was

2:06:02doing

2:06:04uh,

2:06:05to be able to provide and keep up the

2:06:08services that

2:06:09now are missing.

2:06:10>> This is is it's going to be an

2:06:13an additional position.

2:06:15>> All right.

2:06:17>> This is going to be an additional

2:06:19additional position.

2:06:25So,

2:06:26I

2:06:27I believe, and you guys could correct me

2:06:29if I'm wrong, but I'm Like,

2:06:31what I'm hearing from of tonight is

2:06:32permission to accept this $70,000

2:06:37and um

2:06:40and be able to to put it towards towards

2:06:42that position. We We do bid positions,

2:06:46so it it'll be a lieutenant's position.

2:06:49So, currently any lieutenant on the job

2:06:52could bid that bid this position.

2:06:55But, internally, we're not going to

2:06:56suffer from any other loss duties of the

2:07:00thing that there's going to be no holes

2:07:03in

2:07:05in our service.

2:07:08>> But, there will be.

2:07:09>> In reality, it will based on the man.

2:07:12Simple math.

2:07:14We changing somebody to do this new

2:07:16duties. Now, the previous duties are not

2:07:19going to be able to fulfill by

2:07:21other than an extra person, which means

2:07:24that the city going to have to come up

2:07:25with

2:07:26the 30% of this the salary plus the 100%

2:07:30of the

2:07:32the other salary of the next person that

2:07:35is going to fulfill these duties. The of

2:07:37the current person that is doing the

2:07:38job.

2:07:40>> Well, that this actually will will be a

2:07:42new person. But, the way we operate is

2:07:45we we bid.

2:07:47So, this will come this will come with a

2:07:48promotion.

2:07:50>> Okay, so I'm I'm going to make this easy

2:07:53easier for the committee. I don't

2:07:54believe

2:07:56where there's there's going there's

2:07:59there's back-and-forth. You're first

2:08:00you're first saying

2:08:02that it's not going to be a new

2:08:03position, new person, and now you're

2:08:04saying that it is, etc. And then when

2:08:07you read the first few pages of this

2:08:10document, even the language suggests

2:08:13that this is a new position or a new

2:08:15person. So, what I recommend is I

2:08:19I recommend for this committee to table

2:08:22um until we get concrete confirmation

2:08:26from the city attorney. and I understand

2:08:28your your concern chief. I recommend

2:08:31that you speak with Cataldo and make

2:08:33sure that they understand this is not a

2:08:35no, but we just want to make sure that

2:08:37we're doing this the right way.

2:08:38>> And and

2:08:39and I respect that counselor, but I have

2:08:42been at this since July. I have spoken

2:08:45to the city council. I've spoken to the

2:08:47personnel. I've had multiple

2:08:50meetings with Cataldo.

2:08:52Sorry if I'm if I'm confusing anything

2:08:56here, but this would be a a new

2:08:58position. So, the way that this would

2:09:01work is we have a

2:09:04lieutenant's list. We have somebody

2:09:06waiting on a lieutenant. They would be

2:09:08bumped up to a new lieutenant and it

2:09:11would open up a a firefighter spot.

2:09:14Whether the city decides to fill that

2:09:17spot and would would hope that they

2:09:18would, but we believe that this is well

2:09:22put together. It's well thought out.

2:09:24It's

2:09:26again I've I've been

2:09:28um

2:09:29on this um

2:09:31You know, I've I've found out from being

2:09:33the chief a lot of things we try to do

2:09:35it just takes a lot of time, which isn't

2:09:37a bad thing. It takes a lot of time. So,

2:09:40but I have been on this since the middle

2:09:43of the summer. And this is the first

2:09:46time that I'm really able to come in

2:09:49front of you. I believe we we are doing

2:09:51it correct. I believe

2:09:53wholeheartedly that that you you

2:09:57that we're here for you guys to to

2:10:00choose. Am I allowed to accept the

2:10:03$70,000?

2:10:04I have talking to the CAFO. I have

2:10:07talking to the personnel department.

2:10:10I have talking to the city attorney and

2:10:13I believe we're doing everything

2:10:15correct.

2:10:16>> So, so 3 minutes left.

2:10:18>> Hold on 1 second. Right. So,

2:10:22but here the way that it's being

2:10:24presented with the supporting document

2:10:27as well.

2:10:29We need to confirm whether or not this

2:10:31needs to be ordinance. And I understand

2:10:33that that it is under the the public

2:10:35safety component, but they are roles and

2:10:39positions even within fire safety that

2:10:41that had to be ordinance as well. So, I

2:10:45feel comfortable if we table this, uh

2:10:47make sure that get

2:10:51a letter from the city attorney ensuring

2:10:54that that whether or not we need to

2:10:57ordinance or not in order to then allow

2:10:59you to spend that money for salary.

2:11:03Council Council President.

2:11:04>> Thank you.

2:11:05Um

2:11:05well, I want to ask a couple of

2:11:07questions before we proceed. So, in case

2:11:10that um

2:11:12you need to bring those answers.

2:11:13So, let's simple math. I want to know

2:11:16the following.

2:11:17So, let's say that we are in in year

2:11:20three.

2:11:22End of the contract because something

2:11:23happened. I don't know. We don't know

2:11:26with contracts you would we don't know

2:11:27we don't know what's going to happen.

2:11:29Uh

2:11:30they are active today, but we don't know

2:11:31about tomorrow.

2:11:33There is contract here that has been

2:11:35active for years and years and years.

2:11:37And we keep on getting those services.

2:11:39So, year three,

2:11:41so the contract was not renewed.

2:11:44And let's say perhaps that we go back to

2:11:47the hospital providing those services,

2:11:49which was the case of the last about

2:11:5210 years or 12 years about that.

2:11:55So,

2:11:57so now we're going to have an actual

2:11:59lieutenant

2:12:00that we don't have

2:12:01uh that we were not planning on on on

2:12:04funding it.

2:12:06So, now we need to change

2:12:08the budgeting situation. And now we have

2:12:11an extra firefighter to be able to

2:12:13perform the operations

2:12:15uh

2:12:15not based on overtime.

2:12:18So, and if we just

2:12:20uh put in the overtime situation, it's

2:12:23going to be a lot more expensive. But,

2:12:24let's assume that that's not the case.

2:12:26We have two extra positions that we were

2:12:27we didn't have we didn't have before.

2:12:30Uh that we need to fulfill as a city.

2:12:32So, how we going to manage that

2:12:34situation? If you don't have the answer

2:12:36right now, that's fine. Just

2:12:37>> I do.

2:12:38>> Okay.

2:12:39>> I think it would be um

2:12:43For this, I'd I'd honestly, I think the

2:12:45city deserves it. I think it's well

2:12:48needed and if we had a another ambulance

2:12:51company, I think this would have to be

2:12:53negotiated in. Um for as long as I've

2:12:56been on the Lawrence Fire Department, we

2:12:58have not had one extra position. Um I go

2:13:02to a lot of different places. I talked

2:13:05to a lot of other chiefs. A lot of other

2:13:07departments are are evolving. The

2:13:09Lawrence Fire Department is is staying

2:13:11stagnant. We're not changing. My my 28

2:13:15years, we've we've just run the same.

2:13:17Things are changing. The the EMS service

2:13:21is changing. Firefighting is changing.

2:13:23Inspections are changing. The the

2:13:26Lawrence Fire Department is just kind of

2:13:29staying the same for the last 20 28

2:13:32years. And and tough is changing the

2:13:35fire service.

2:13:36I I agree that, but I'm I'm trying to

2:13:39push forward. We we have a lot of

2:13:41visionary people on the fire department

2:13:44and we have our meetings and we try to

2:13:47set benchmarks and goals the way that we

2:13:50see that it's that it's the best. This

2:13:53is the best right here. This $70,000 to

2:13:55create this really not for the Lawrence

2:13:58Fire Department. This is for the

2:13:59citizens of of the of the city of

2:14:03Lawrence. That's what That is what this

2:14:05$70,000, this lieutenant's position is

2:14:08going to in the long run, it's going to

2:14:10help. It's going to help our citizens. I

2:14:13respect I respect the council and we

2:14:15want to make sure that we want to do it

2:14:18correctly. If it has to be ordinance, if

2:14:20you know, if

2:14:22>> So, the next question that I have to

2:14:23you, Chief. Thank you for responding. Uh

2:14:25so, basically that you say that this

2:14:27this

2:14:28this have to be negotiated on the next

2:14:30one and the next contract in case.

2:14:32All right. Uh

2:14:34So, the next question that I have is the

2:14:35following.

2:14:37So, as far as I understand, the current

2:14:39contract

2:14:41uh

2:14:42Cataldo is the one controlling the

2:14:45the dispatcher

2:14:47when it comes to dispatching the

2:14:48ambulance to the different emergencies.

2:14:51So, that need to be revised

2:14:54because we need to be more involved.

2:14:56And also, is once let's say that we

2:14:59approve this position or the or the

2:15:01expenditure of the money,

2:15:04is this person going to be able to

2:15:07uh

2:15:09take on that take on part of that

2:15:11responsibility or share that

2:15:13responsibility with the current contract

2:15:16or contractor?

2:15:17>> As as in relation to

2:15:20>> uh

2:15:21dispatching

2:15:23the for when it comes to the

2:15:25emergencies.

2:15:26>> It's called the EMD.

2:15:27>> Yeah, the EMD right now that's again,

2:15:30when we get into this EMS world that's

2:15:32it's whole it's a whole thing. Right now

2:15:35it's I believe it's still a C-Med and

2:15:38it's um it's run by Lawrence General

2:15:42Hospital now. It's run by Cataldo. So,

2:15:45they they run the EMD. So, the Lawrence

2:15:49Fire Department, if we had the ability

2:15:51to run the EMD, we

2:15:53we would take that on, but right now

2:15:55that's not in our

2:15:57we we don't have that.

2:15:58>> So, this person is not going to be it

2:16:00have nothing to do with that.

2:16:04>> Well, no. The it would be a liaison

2:16:05counselor. So,

2:16:07um

2:16:08a lot of times when I come in in the

2:16:10morning, again we uh we do a lot of

2:16:12medicals. Um we think the people of the

2:16:14community deserve the best service, and

2:16:17sometimes the deputies and and this

2:16:20other outside organization clash a

2:16:23little bit on calls. So, if you if you

2:16:27call for service and we come to your

2:16:29house, you're having the Lawrence Fire

2:16:30Department, you're having a private

2:16:32ambulance Cataldo, and then you're

2:16:34having paramedics from the Lawrence

2:16:36General Hospital. So, if things

2:16:38sometimes could be done better, we're

2:16:40dealing with three organizations. I do

2:16:43not really have a person as a liaison to

2:16:47take care of certain things and make

2:16:50sure

2:16:51make sure things, you know, things are

2:16:54going well. One of our biggest

2:16:57We just had um that incident on Crawford

2:17:00Street, and one of the things that we

2:17:02did is we got together with Lawrence

2:17:04General Hospital, Cataldo, Lawrence Fire

2:17:07Department, deputy, and the three trucks

2:17:10that responded, and we had a we had a

2:17:12critique on what went in the in the

2:17:15Lawrence General Hospital about what

2:17:18went well, what went wrong. Again, these

2:17:21they're providing a very big service for

2:17:24the city, but it's not the Lawrence Fire

2:17:26Department. We want to make sure that

2:17:28they're delivering the service the to

2:17:30the best that our our citizens deserve.

2:17:33So, this person would be a liaison, and

2:17:37>> So, thank you, Chief.

2:17:38>> Yes.

2:17:39>> Another question that I have, probably

2:17:40you don't have the answer now. Before

2:17:42when we previously had the other

2:17:43contract uh with the contractor related

2:17:46to the ambulance, the bigger issue that

2:17:48we have is people complaining that

2:17:50sometimes they don't need an ambulance,

2:17:52and they were

2:17:54kind of like, you know,

2:17:55not necessarily forced to use, but not

2:17:57not other alternative.

2:18:00And then therefore, they ended up using

2:18:02the the

2:18:03the the ambulance going to the Lawrence

2:18:06General and they ended up with a $1,500

2:18:08bill.

2:18:10So, is this person going to be able to

2:18:14manage that or he have nothing to do

2:18:17with that situation?

2:18:18>> No, I I think everything in in the EMS

2:18:20world that anything that goes with on at

2:18:22the EMS with the Lawrence General

2:18:24Hospital, with Cataldo, with Lawrence

2:18:27with Lawrence Fire would be in that

2:18:30person's um privy to to look into it and

2:18:33start a dialogue and we'd hope that that

2:18:36person would already have the

2:18:38relationships

2:18:39with the other dispatches, with the

2:18:42supervisors.

2:18:44Um

2:18:44in the short last couple months, I've

2:18:47already had the supervisors from

2:18:49Cataldo, the supervisors from Lawrence

2:18:52General Hospital, and uh some of our

2:18:54deputies in a meeting to make sure that

2:18:57that we're all on the same page. And

2:19:00again, Cataldo has been doing a great

2:19:02job, but they haven't worked in the city

2:19:05of Lawrence. So, we have a lot of young

2:19:07EMTs and uh we just want to make sure

2:19:11that we're all on the same page and that

2:19:13our community's receiving the best uh

2:19:15the best care that they they could. But

2:19:18as far as billing,

2:19:20um

2:19:21I used to be when I was on the trucks, I

2:19:23was big into the medicals. I became an

2:19:25EMT. The the

2:19:28BLS and ALS do a great job and you're

2:19:31allowed to refuse. If we you call an

2:19:33ambulance, they do very clear that that

2:19:36you don't have to go. You just have to

2:19:38sign. I I have never seen in my career

2:19:41anybody forced to go. The only people

2:19:44that would be forced to go is a child if

2:19:47they didn't have an adult around or

2:19:49somebody that we really couldn't make

2:19:52their own judgment. Any other adult has

2:19:55a right to refusal and I've I've never

2:19:58witnessed like anybody being forced to

2:20:01go. It's probably up to us to educate

2:20:05our community on their rights and maybe

2:20:08some people feel like they have to go,

2:20:10but I I haven't seen that counselor.

2:20:13>> no, I'm not saying forcing. I'm saying

2:20:14no other option.

2:20:17>> Yeah.

2:20:17>> Uh

2:20:18and if this person kind of like you know

2:20:20take on the on the uh

2:20:23on basically it's going to be the

2:20:24license between the city and the and the

2:20:26contractor.

2:20:28Uh the education piece of uh wait, if

2:20:31you take an ambulance and you probably

2:20:33don't need it

2:20:34and

2:20:35you might end up with

2:20:38an a bill.

2:20:39>> Yeah, and and I see and I do see that

2:20:41happening that maybe people don't have

2:20:43maybe a ride to the hospital and it

2:20:45doesn't maybe rise to an ALS or BLS and

2:20:49and they call and maybe they don't

2:20:51understand that yeah, you are you are

2:20:53going to you are going to receive this

2:20:56bill. But that that goes with the 911

2:20:59system. So when you call 911 like if

2:21:02Cataldo was was busy, there'd be another

2:21:04ambulance to fall in. If you ever called

2:21:07like a private ambulance, now your

2:21:10your bills would shoot way up.

2:21:12>> All right, thank you.

2:21:13>> Okay.

2:21:16>> Any other questions or comments?

2:21:17Councilor Plan.

2:21:18>> To me this is all about time. Can you

2:21:19just give me you earlier you were

2:21:21expressing this has been going on for

2:21:23some time and that you want to get this

2:21:25thing done.

2:21:26Are there any upcoming deadlines that we

2:21:28should be aware of?

2:21:32>> No, there's there's no deadlines.

2:21:34They're just

2:21:37just I've been working working on this

2:21:39for a while and I

2:21:42I could be wrong, but I don't believe it

2:21:43has to be ordinance. I think as the fire

2:21:45department um that we we are able to

2:21:48manage our our people around and again

2:21:52I'm I'm in front of the council to

2:21:53accept this 70,000. I think again, the

2:21:56union's on board with it. I think it's a

2:21:58great thing for the community. We drew

2:22:00up a 37-page of some of their duties,

2:22:04and uh but I I respect the council, and

2:22:06you want to make sure that things are

2:22:08done right. And if the right thing to do

2:22:10is to table it to make sure that we're

2:22:13doing the right thing here, I I respect

2:22:15that.

2:22:16>> And I And I think you. And And that's

2:22:18where I stand on this. Uh Madam Chair, I

2:22:20I stand on I am If the chief tells me he

2:22:24needs this, and I respect and trust the

2:22:26chief, then and I know there's lots of

2:22:29calls, I want to be in the camp of

2:22:31providing that. Uh I do think, however,

2:22:34not however, but in addition to that, we

2:22:35also need to be mindful of of that. I am

2:22:38very curious to get the city attorney's

2:22:40opinion on how our public service is

2:22:43different than maybe a DPW or a person

2:22:46or or the treasurer's office if if we

2:22:49don't have ordinance positions for

2:22:50those.

2:22:52I'm just curious of how that plays out.

2:22:53I don't have an answer. This is not a

2:22:54setup. This is me wanting to learn how

2:22:57our ordinances

2:23:00police and fire are different

2:23:02potentially than other other parts of

2:23:05our city government. That's all. So, I

2:23:07At the right time, I'll be interested in

2:23:09making a motion to table so we can get

2:23:11that answer.

2:23:13But

2:23:13will you let me know when now?

2:23:16>> Motion has been made. Is there a second?

2:23:19>> Uh and And can I just preface that by

2:23:20saying And to get information from the

2:23:22city attorney regarding the question

2:23:24that was just asked regarding the

2:23:26applicability

2:23:27of the ordinances

2:23:29for the ordinance positions in police

2:23:31and fire, more specifically for the EMS

2:23:34coordinator's position.

2:23:36>> Yeah, that sounds great. Uh

2:23:38>> That's the motion.

2:23:39>> Do you have that, Maria?

2:23:41Okay.

2:23:42Motion to table has been made. Is there

2:23:43a second?

2:23:44>> Second.

2:23:44>> Properly seconded. All those in favor,

2:23:46say I. I the eyes have it. Thank you,

2:23:49Chief.

2:23:49>> All right. Once again, I I really

2:23:51appreciate your time. Thank you.

2:23:54>> Next, we have You're welcome. Next, we

2:23:56have item 407-26,

2:23:59authorization to expand 43,500

2:24:03of the [snorts] BJA FY25, the Edward

2:24:06Byrne Memorial Justice Assistant

2:24:10JAG grant, which we have every year in

2:24:12front of us. Um we have the new director

2:24:15of support services for the police

2:24:17department. What was the director's name

2:24:18again? Director You have the floor.

2:24:20>> Good evening, City Council. Rosa Chepa,

2:24:22Lawrence Police Department, 55 Lowell

2:24:23Street. I am here today to

2:24:27um

2:24:28inform that the Lawrence Police

2:24:29Department has applied and was approved

2:24:32for the

2:24:33uh the FY25 Edward Byrne grant in the

2:24:36amount of 43,500.

2:24:38These um funds will be utilized to uh

2:24:41purchase G Tech laptops for the

2:24:43cruisers.

2:24:45>> Is there a specific laptop?

2:24:47>> Uh the the G Tech rugged laptop.

2:24:50>> G Tech. Okay.

2:24:51Uh counselors, any questions or comments

2:24:54for Director Chepa?

2:24:58Seeing none, I'll entertain a motion.

2:24:59>> I'll take um I'll make a motion and then

2:25:01one quick question.

2:25:02>> Um

2:25:03>> I'll make a motion to send it to the

2:25:04full council with a favorable

2:25:05recommendation. And then after that, a

2:25:07question.

2:25:07>> Motion has been made by the Council

2:25:09President, seconded by the vice chair.

2:25:11Discussion, Council President.

2:25:12>> How many laptops you guys are

2:25:14are planning on buying?

2:25:16>> Three on this grant.

2:25:17>> And how many we need uh

2:25:20for the department?

2:25:22>> So far, only three because we are in the

2:25:23process of acquiring more um cruisers

2:25:26for the police department.

2:25:28So we're trying to make sure that every

2:25:29cruiser in the police department is

2:25:31fully equipped.

2:25:33>> So this is only four laptops or because

2:25:35laptops are that expensive?

2:25:37>> Three laptops.

2:25:38>> How much are these laptops?

2:25:40>> Um you're looking for just a laptop

2:25:42itself, $3,580.

2:25:45Just the laptop without does not count

2:25:47with the equipment, the installation,

2:25:49the software. That's not counting none

2:25:50of that.

2:25:51>> So, how much is it all one

2:25:53>> the stuff.

2:25:54>> Everything.

2:25:54>> Yes.

2:25:54>> [laughter]

2:25:55>> Grand total of everything including the

2:25:56laptop.

2:25:57>> Including the laptop. See you right now.

2:26:01And do we have that with

2:26:02>> I think it's the same thing.

2:26:03>> it here?

2:26:04>> Mhm.

2:26:05Yeah, we have to turn it on.

2:26:07>> So, it's 32 $3,280.

2:26:10Um

2:26:12you're probably looking around $10,000

2:26:15to to to almost $12,000 per laptop with

2:26:17everything included.

2:26:19If it's 43,005, probably it's like

2:26:21around 10

2:26:23$12,000.

2:26:25>> All right, thank you.

2:26:28>> Any other questions or comments?

2:26:30Councilor DePalo.

2:26:31>> Yeah.

2:26:32I don't want to go down this rabbit hole

2:26:33again. I'm going to be on the periphery

2:26:35of the whole not going in.

2:26:37Um, the um

2:26:39we get this grant every year, right?

2:26:41We've been successful every year. And I

2:26:44I just as we we rarely do oversight when

2:26:47the when the money after we get it to

2:26:48expend it. Have we spent our on the

2:26:51other grant money that we've received,

2:26:53very generally speaking?

2:26:55Have we expended all the money for the

2:26:56purposes they were designed for or have

2:26:59we or has there been something other

2:27:01than that that that response?

2:27:02>> No, every grant that the Lawrence Police

2:27:05has applied and we are one we we apply

2:27:07exactly with what we asking for in the

2:27:09grant.

2:27:09>> And when we've gotten the money and we

2:27:11paid for it as prescribed, we're not

2:27:13turning any money back. We we spent all

2:27:15the money as as designed. Is that is

2:27:18that an accurate? I'm leading it to an

2:27:20to to

2:27:21to see if that's true. Is that is that

2:27:23true?

2:27:23>> When it comes to equipment, yes, we make

2:27:25sure that we we put we purchase

2:27:26everything.

2:27:27>> And my last Here's a comment you don't

2:27:28have to answer to. I'm surprised that

2:27:30we're still getting grants from the

2:27:31federal government. Just letting you

2:27:32know. I just think that's crazy. I'm not

2:27:34crazy, but I'm just I thought for sure

2:27:35by now the spigot would be totally

2:27:37turned off and we wouldn't be getting

2:27:38anything. So, I'm

2:27:40we're getting the money. So,

2:27:41>> We are not getting as many as before,

2:27:42but we getting some.

2:27:44>> Okay, let's keep spending it smartly.

2:27:45Thank you.

2:27:49>> Thank you.

2:27:50Um all those in any additional comments?

2:27:53Seeing none, all those in favor say I.

2:27:55>> I.

2:27:55>> I. The eyes have it.

2:27:58Thank you. Um oh, you have a second

2:27:59item.

2:28:00Item 408-26 introduction of pilot

2:28:04program

2:28:05Sound Thinking Plate Ranger Automat

2:28:08Automated Li- License Plate Recognition

2:28:12brought to us by Director Shepherd.

2:28:14Director, you have you have the floor.

2:28:16>> Sure.

2:28:17>> a presentation?

2:28:18>> Yes.

2:28:18>> Okay. I was just I was just asking

2:28:20Maria, I know they have a presentation,

2:28:21but I don't see their item here.

2:28:24Okay.

2:28:25>> [laughter]

2:28:26>> Okay.

2:28:26>> So, I'll do the introduction. Rosa

2:28:28Shepherd Director of Support Services

2:28:29for the Lawrence Police Department. With

2:28:31me tonight it is a Sergeant Dorr. The

2:28:33reason for being here is the the

2:28:35Lawrence Police Department is doing an

2:28:37introduction of the

2:28:39as a pilot program for the

2:28:43utilizing Sound Thinking Plate Reader

2:28:46license plate reader system today.

2:28:49So,

2:28:50for me today is Sergeant Dorr.

2:28:53>> Sergeant Dorr.

2:28:57>> Good evening. How are you?

2:28:59Uh so, we're here to introduce Sound

2:29:01Thinking.

2:29:02Uh

2:29:02>> I'm going to ask you to lower the mic a

2:29:04little bit.

2:29:05>> It's right in my face.

2:29:06>> There we go. Thank you.

2:29:08>> I can hear myself too now.

2:29:11Uh yes, so we're here to introduce Sound

2:29:13Thinking as an alternative.

2:29:15>> May I ask a question?

2:29:16>> I'm I'm sorry. Yes. Um for a second. Um

2:29:19the other item 407A all everything was

2:29:22approved. The one in favor. Okay.

2:29:25>> Thank you.

2:29:26>> All right.

2:29:27>> I'd like to introduce Kevin

2:29:29from Sound Thinking.

2:29:31Hi, how are you?

2:29:33Thanks for having me.

2:29:33>> Thank you for being here.

2:29:34>> Yeah, absolutely. I think this is a

2:29:36really exciting time for us. So,

2:29:38Lawrence has been a technology partner

2:29:40of ours since 2023 with ShotSpotter and

2:29:44also Crime Tracers, which is one of our

2:29:46products that's available through the

2:29:48Massachusetts Statewide.

2:29:50And this is a great opportunity to

2:29:52introduce a technology that is going to

2:29:55give them a capability that they really

2:29:56depend on.

2:29:58But with the safeguards installed the

2:29:59guardrails that the community really

2:30:01expects. So,

2:30:02>> Awesome.

2:30:03>> Yes.

2:30:03>> Thank you. Before we continue, Kevin,

2:30:04can you just state first last name, the

2:30:07business name again, and the business

2:30:08location for the record?

2:30:09>> Absolutely. So, Kevin Hutchison, I'm

2:30:11with SoundThinking.

2:30:13Um I lead our LPR initiative. Our

2:30:16headquarters located three 300 Fremont,

2:30:19um California.

2:30:20>> Thank you.

2:30:21>> Mhm. You can continue.

2:30:22>> Yeah.

2:30:23Absolutely.

2:30:26All right, very good. So,

2:30:28um we're here today to discuss Plate

2:30:30Ranger. That's our LPR technology

2:30:32solution.

2:30:33It's part of what we call uh it's

2:30:34incorporated into what we call our

2:30:36Safety Smart Platform.

2:30:38Um it consists of three different

2:30:40technologies. We have ShotSpotter for

2:30:42gunshot detection, Crime Tracers for our

2:30:44investigative intelligence, and we have

2:30:46Plate Ranger for our LPR.

2:30:49Um the interesting uh thing about these

2:30:51three different solutions is they

2:30:53actually talk to each other. They offer

2:30:54direct integration for

2:30:56a good example of uh ShotSpotter will

2:30:58tell you where a gunshot occurs.

2:31:00Uh Plate Ranger will tell you what

2:31:02vehicles were in the area or leaving

2:31:03that area during the time of the

2:31:05incident. And then Crime Tracers

2:31:07actually extends that investigative

2:31:09value from not just vehicles, but

2:31:11persons of interest, people that might

2:31:13maybe associated with that particular

2:31:14vehicle that's associated with with with

2:31:17that crime.

2:31:20So, something I like to always start off

2:31:22with is, you know, LPR, it's

2:31:25it

2:31:26I'm a former police officer myself of 9

2:31:28years. When I was a police officer, we

2:31:30didn't have these technologies. I come

2:31:32from a very small underfunded

2:31:33department. Um the big takeaway of LPR

2:31:37is that it really serves as a true force

2:31:39multiplier for departments.

2:31:41Um I think with budgets being in play,

2:31:44often times departments can't hire

2:31:46enough personnel. They're typically very

2:31:48constrained financially.

2:31:50Um

2:31:51they're being asked to do a lot more

2:31:52with a lot less. And LPR really serves

2:31:55as that force multiplier. It's that

2:31:57officer that really never never sleeps.

2:31:59It's one less person that that you know,

2:32:01that department has to have on payroll.

2:32:10Very good. So, what plate reader is and

2:32:13what it is not.

2:32:17So,

2:32:19uh it's not facial recognition.

2:32:21Um it doesn't collect any biometric or

2:32:23sensitive data, uh sensitive

2:32:25information. It's not used for tracking

2:32:27speed or parking violations. It's not

2:32:30used for immigration enforcement

2:32:32enforcement. Um it's not you know,

2:32:35there's there's no privacy invasive

2:32:36technology incorporated. Specifically,

2:32:39license plate reader technology. Nothing

2:32:41outside of that standard. It gathers

2:32:43objective evidence and facts about

2:32:46vehicles, not people. And that's very

2:32:48important. It's used to solve crime.

2:32:50It's it's another tool in an officer's

2:32:53arsenal that's going to help them more

2:32:54effectively uh serve their

2:32:57their constituents, their community.

2:33:01Um a very big different differentiator,

2:33:04I get asked this all the time. Well, you

2:33:06know, I

2:33:07everybody calls it a flock camera. Uh

2:33:09there's tons of different vendors out

2:33:10there. You have Motorola, you have Axon,

2:33:12Genetec, uh

2:33:14uh Elsag, Leonardo. You can keep going

2:33:17and going. Um they're not all the same.

2:33:19The technology underlying technology is

2:33:21typically the same. They serve the same

2:33:22purpose.

2:33:23And the conversation is really shifted.

2:33:25It's not about the technology anymore.

2:33:27It's shifted to the data, right? Who

2:33:29controls the data? Who has access to it?

2:33:32>> Exactly.

2:33:33>> Who can search it? Those are the Those

2:33:34are the questions that are being asked

2:33:36now.

2:33:37Um with Plate Reader, agencies

2:33:39everything is agency controlled. It's

2:33:41strict control. So, some vendors might

2:33:43have a national network where

2:33:46um let's say 8,000 10,000 agencies are

2:33:49in this big pool of data and you can

2:33:51just search another agency's data and

2:33:54they don't know why. They don't know the

2:33:55policy that that agency has in place.

2:33:57They don't even know the justification

2:33:59behind that search. Plate Reader is

2:34:01different in that aspect. It starts off

2:34:02in a very closed uh data ecosystem where

2:34:05that agency is in strict control of who

2:34:07they want to share with. They don't have

2:34:09to share with anybody if they don't want

2:34:10to. Um they can just get NCIC hits,

2:34:13BOLOs, you know, from those different uh

2:34:16networks there. They can also uh

2:34:18strictly share with neighboring

2:34:20agencies. So, if they wanted to remain

2:34:22closed off and only share with Methuen

2:34:24or Lowell, they have the option to do

2:34:25that

2:34:27through an MOU, a memorandum of

2:34:28understanding that would be uh

2:34:31that would be uh agreed upon by both

2:34:33agencies, you know, various terms. And

2:34:36that would also be agreed on what type

2:34:37of data would be shared, what type of

2:34:39hot list, uh so on and so forth.

2:34:42Um it's CJIS compliant. So, uh

2:34:45multi-factor authentication is a big

2:34:46part of that.

2:34:48Um

2:34:49I've heard some stories where officers

2:34:50share their username and password.

2:34:52You're not able to do that with us. I've

2:34:54heard some, you know, sharing a username

2:34:56and password with, you know, federal

2:34:58agents, ICE and things like that. It's

2:35:00not a possibility cuz you do have that

2:35:02multi-factor authentication.

2:35:04Um it's hosted in a AWS GovCloud. So,

2:35:08it's the same cloud service that the

2:35:09federal government It basically meets

2:35:10all the standards for uh federal

2:35:12government to use.

2:35:14Um

2:35:15agencies own the data. So, we don't use

2:35:17it. We don't sell it. We're prohibited

2:35:19to sell it. Um the agency owns it even

2:35:22if we after we terminated an agreement,

2:35:23they own that data. We have no rights to

2:35:25it. We're merely the constituent of the

2:35:27data. You we we supply the resources for

2:35:29the technology to work.

2:35:31It's agency auditable. That's huge with

2:35:33us. It's huge with me. Um as a former

2:35:35police officer, I I I really present

2:35:38technology the same way that I served,

2:35:39right? I'm a neutral observer of facts.

2:35:42So I and that helps me uh in the LPR

2:35:44industry especially especially now um

2:35:48really hear voices from both sides of

2:35:50the aisles, the pros and the cons.

2:35:52And something that I strive to do is

2:35:54help agencies navigate that where they

2:35:56have that transparency for you know for

2:35:59the public that the city councils and

2:36:00the constituents.

2:36:02So every single feature um every plate

2:36:05read in Plate Ranger is completely

2:36:07auditable.

2:36:09Timestamp, you know, you can see who's

2:36:11searched searches the specific plate,

2:36:13what time, all that's available.

2:36:15Um and it meets all the statutory uh

2:36:17retention policy. So

2:36:20another really fun fact that I like

2:36:21about Plate Ranger, and I'm not saying

2:36:23this because I'm the director for it, um

2:36:26is that we see legislation changing

2:36:28non-stop right now. We're in a very

2:36:31uh

2:36:32a very

2:36:33uh

2:36:34turbulent time for the LPR industry.

2:36:36I'll just say that. Um I meet with uh

2:36:39many federal legislators uh

2:36:42on that. And a big part of what I do is

2:36:44trying to uh try to separate ourselves

2:36:46from the other vendors to say, "Hey,

2:36:48like our technology is very different

2:36:49and here's why." We don't want to be

2:36:51lumped in as Kleenex essentially. You

2:36:53know, "Hey, give me a Kleenex." when you

2:36:55know, it's it's a different tissue brand

2:36:57and with you know, possibly different

2:36:59purposes.

2:37:00When I say uh meet statutory retention

2:37:02policies,

2:37:04retention is agency controlled. So for

2:37:07example, 2 weeks from now if

2:37:08Massachusetts came out with a statutory

2:37:11that hey, you can only retain your data

2:37:13for 5 days, 7 days. They don't have to

2:37:16wait on us to make those changes. That

2:37:17agency administrator has full access to

2:37:19go into the system and they they control

2:37:22the retention right there. They don't

2:37:24wait on We don't have to take their

2:37:25system down.

2:37:26Um a big motto for us is your data, your

2:37:29rules and that goes all the way that

2:37:30starts with the data retention um as

2:37:32well.

2:37:36Um so something I like to always share

2:37:38is, you know, I I I try to be as

2:37:40educated as I can on this on this topic.

2:37:42You have multiple different um

2:37:44data sharing models. So you have open

2:37:46networks and that's going to reach a lot

2:37:48of broad partners. That's where all

2:37:49those agencies are in that They're in

2:37:51that big network and and it's great for

2:37:53a police officer cuz you're able to grab

2:37:55a lot of a lot of data from across

2:37:57multiple states.

2:37:59It's unfortunate because

2:38:02um you know, and that does give you a

2:38:03broad disc discovery.

2:38:05It's unfortunate because you don't know

2:38:07what that department's policy is. You

2:38:09don't know how they're using LPR. You

2:38:11don't know what justifications they're

2:38:12using. You don't know if they're

2:38:14advocating for responsible use with

2:38:16their agency.

2:38:17Um you have local only. So that's what I

2:38:21was telling you earlier, uh Plate

2:38:22Readers is deployed as a local model

2:38:24initially. So you can it would, you

2:38:27know, all of it only be incorporated

2:38:28within the city of Lawrence. That's it.

2:38:30It would be dictated by internal policy,

2:38:32not our network rules that we put up

2:38:34upon you.

2:38:36Um the trade-off that is it's narrow

2:38:38narrow discovery, you know, if you you

2:38:40have less access to data and that's just

2:38:42the simple trade-off.

2:38:43Um I really believe there's a solid in

2:38:45between here. It doesn't have to be no

2:38:47technology at all or, you know, complete

2:38:49control and that's really where

2:38:51bilateral MOUs come into play.

2:38:54That's where an agency can they can

2:38:57maintain that strict sharing, that

2:38:58closed data network and they can name

2:39:01what partners around them that they only

2:39:03want to share with. They can write the

2:39:05rules through an MOU as what's

2:39:06acceptable, what they do want to share

2:39:08with those partners. So, they still get

2:39:10that regional value of data share

2:39:12without the extended overreach of of an

2:39:15of a broad national network. And that's,

2:39:17you know, trade-off is going to be

2:39:18selective sharing.

2:39:23Um every plate read uh with Plate Ranger

2:39:25does come with a 8-to-15-second video um

2:39:28attached to it. That video is completely

2:39:30timestamped. It does not detect faces.

2:39:33It's strictly movement of that vehicle

2:39:35along with the plate. That's going to

2:39:36help a police uh provide a police

2:39:38officer a lot more investigative

2:39:40context, such as objects being thrown

2:39:42out of a window, shootings from a

2:39:44vehicle,

2:39:45drive-by shootings at that location.

2:39:48It's also going to help look for

2:39:49specific identifiers that might not have

2:39:51been been uh seen before if

2:39:53uh uh you know,

2:39:55on calls that I've been engaged in, a

2:39:57lot of times individuals aren't looking

2:39:58at a plate. They're in a lot of

2:40:00distress. They just want help.

2:40:02Um they might just see partial

2:40:04characteristics of a vehicle. It was a

2:40:06white Chevy pickup truck, and it had a

2:40:07big yellow sticker on the side of the

2:40:09truck. That video accuracy, that video

2:40:11review is going to help that officer

2:40:13solve that crime and and get justice for

2:40:15that victim.

2:40:17Real-time alerting, um officers need it

2:40:19now. So, they do get those alerts

2:40:21through a very uh very timely

2:40:23notification capability. Fast and

2:40:26friendly investigative search.

2:40:28Um Lawrence uses our Crime Tracers

2:40:30investigative software, and that's going

2:40:32to extend investigative capability from

2:40:34uh vehicle to persons of interest. Um

2:40:37they've increased their users for that

2:40:38also. So, it only makes sense to have

2:40:41our LPR incorporated now and really

2:40:43streamline that that that workflow that

2:40:45they already have in place.

2:40:48It also comes with a secure mobile app

2:40:50um that's associated with Plate Ranger.

2:40:52Nothing is saved to that officer's

2:40:54phone, very important, and we'll touch

2:40:55on that more shortly.

2:40:57Um we also have something called our our

2:40:59camera agent software, Plate Ranger

2:41:01agent. That's very valuable for

2:41:03municipalities. Um I come from a a

2:41:05municipality that was very underfunded,

2:41:07very un- under-

2:41:09under-budgeted. We were one of the last

2:41:11agencies in the in Virginia to get body

2:41:13cameras, to get laptops in our vehicle

2:41:15in our vehicles.

2:41:16We have an agent overlay software

2:41:19essentially that allows uh

2:41:22uh that allows the municipality to

2:41:23repurpose any ONVIF compliant

2:41:26surveillance cameras into LPR cameras.

2:41:29Um I love that because it lets them use

2:41:31their existing technology that they've

2:41:32already spent money on. You know, we

2:41:34there's no ripping and replace it. It's

2:41:36a push install um into that you know,

2:41:39directly into that. And if they have

2:41:40additional hardware through us,

2:41:42everything feeds in into that same that

2:41:45direct Plate Ranger platform

2:41:46essentially.

2:41:47Um they have to meet certain

2:41:48specifications. So, you know, Avigilon,

2:41:51Genetec are good examples. Some

2:41:53Verkadas, as long as they meet the the

2:41:55standards there. And that really helps

2:41:57an agency

2:41:58um a city itself really expand its its

2:42:00its investment there.

2:42:07So, Plate Ranger offers uh high-quality

2:42:10captures.

2:42:11But what makes it very unique is So,

2:42:13Plate Ranger's powered by Rekor. Uh

2:42:15Rekor has been in the LPR business for

2:42:16over 25 years.

2:42:18Um they didn't just start making LPR.

2:42:20This is something that they've they

2:42:22they've

2:42:23they've specialized in this for well

2:42:24over 25 years. The [snorts] difference

2:42:26is by us taking on Rekor as a solutions

2:42:28partner, we're able to integrate that

2:42:30with our existing technologies, Crime

2:42:32Tracers, ShotSpotter.

2:42:34What makes uh the Rekor system so uh

2:42:37fascinating is it actually captures that

2:42:39image that those images from the video.

2:42:41Um think of it like those old-timey

2:42:43Disney flip books. It takes a basically

2:42:45a series of images throughout that

2:42:47video. And then use uh leveraging AI

2:42:50technology, um it's able to pick out

2:42:52that exact best image for that police

2:42:54officer. And that's going to really help

2:42:56with your difficult to read plates that

2:42:58might be obstructed by mud, dirt,

2:43:00debris, a really bad angle, vehicle

2:43:02fleeing a scene um at a high rate of

2:43:04speed. It's also going to be great for

2:43:06your high accuracy night captures.

2:43:12So, um officers are able to search by

2:43:14vehicle make, model, color, partial

2:43:16plates, uh direction of travel, vehicle

2:43:18speed, plate number, and state of

2:43:21origin. It also flags for missing

2:43:22plates.

2:43:24>> [snorts]

2:43:24>> Um something in my career that I did use

2:43:26you know that I did see uh periodically

2:43:28is someone commits a crime, they take

2:43:29their plates off the vehicle so it can't

2:43:31be detected. Well, that person can be

2:43:34brought to justice with a Plate Hunter

2:43:36LPR.

2:43:42Um something very important to me and I

2:43:44actually added this specifically for

2:43:45this meeting. I know it's a it's a very

2:43:47big concern. It's you know, I'm a

2:43:49neutral observer of facts. Um as I

2:43:51mentioned earlier, I think it's very

2:43:52important that officers provide

2:43:54justification for every single search.

2:43:56Why are you searching this person? Why

2:43:58is this being searched?

2:43:59Um that's going to be dictated by

2:44:01department policy. I use typically

2:44:03advocate for a case number, make it a

2:44:05uniform case number. So, when that

2:44:07agency administrator performs their

2:44:08audits, they can look for any uh

2:44:11uh

2:44:12any uh any anomalies uh much easier,

2:44:15right? If you have a one uniform case

2:44:16number, it's mandated by your

2:44:18department, then it'll flag that um when

2:44:21when those audits are performed.

2:44:23So, users have to enter a document

2:44:25reason or case number before every

2:44:26single search plate.

2:44:28That image you see there, that's me

2:44:29trying to search without it. And the

2:44:31system automatically flags just to fake

2:44:33justification required. That's going to

2:44:35create an automal uh that automal record

2:44:38um of the of the legitimate law

2:44:40enforcement purpose behind that search.

2:44:47Um we have two options available. So, we

2:44:48have the Edge Pro. That's going to

2:44:50That's going to be popular model for

2:44:52most uh most rural cities. It's going to

2:44:54cover one to two lanes. Has a 75-ft max

2:44:57range. Most appropriate for your

2:44:58neighborhoods and your city streets.

2:45:01It's going to catch speeds up to 70 mph.

2:45:03And then we have our Edge Max. It's

2:45:04going to have a much broader coverage,

2:45:06up to six lanes, 300-ft max range. And

2:45:09that's great for your primary roads,

2:45:10highways, your more high rate of speed

2:45:13areas, up to 120 mph. It's also great

2:45:16for the storage capability.

2:45:20So, the Rekor Edge Pro, um the typical

2:45:23model, that's going to have a 256 GB.

2:45:26It's going to be able to retain up to 2

2:45:27weeks of video. And the Max is going to

2:45:30be able to retain up to 1 to 2 months.

2:45:31So, that's going to allow officers the

2:45:33capability to retain that video longer,

2:45:36um as long as it's documented, of

2:45:37course. They have that that full case

2:45:39file, and they're able to uh

2:45:41especially with a ShotSpotter

2:45:43deployment, um also.

2:45:49This is what the UI looks like. You

2:45:51know, it's very simple, very

2:45:52streamlined, no hidden features. You

2:45:55know, it'll have the amount of cameras,

2:45:56the sites those cameras are deployed at.

2:45:58Um number of plates read that week, any

2:46:00recent alerts. At the bottom right

2:46:02there, you're going to see that push

2:46:03notification for the alert.

2:46:07And that's uh secure web-based

2:46:08multi-factor authentication. So, no no

2:46:11sharing of usernames and passwords,

2:46:13nothing like that.

2:46:17So, we are able to push that NCIC

2:46:20hotlist for that agency. It's updated

2:46:22four to six times daily. It's going to

2:46:24provide a synchronized NCIC hotlist.

2:46:26They'll get those localized hotlists,

2:46:28localized BOLOs, intelligence alerts,

2:46:31and more importantly, your silver alerts

2:46:33and your mental health crisis there,

2:46:35your Amber Alerts,

2:46:36also.

2:46:40Um a new feature that we've added, and

2:46:42this will be available to Lawrence, is

2:46:43mandated search purposes. So, discussed

2:46:45this uh with uh I was in Kentucky

2:46:47yesterday and uh actually discussed this

2:46:49with a broad group of law enforcement

2:46:51agencies there for an educational

2:46:53seminar on LPR.

2:46:55Um so, the mandate of search purpose

2:46:57that helps uh that helps provide

2:46:59transparency to that search. Um so, you

2:47:02have the justification for why it was

2:47:04searched. What was the result of that

2:47:06search?

2:47:07Right? Uh

2:47:08what was it the outcome? That's uh

2:47:10captured investigative outcomes. The

2:47:12outcome feature was just added and that

2:47:14will be available for Lawrence as well.

2:47:16That allows an agency to um to

2:47:20dictate [snorts] the outcome. All right,

2:47:21well, did it result in an arrest? Did it

2:47:23result in a citation? Uh what was the

2:47:26result of that? And that's going to give

2:47:27[snorts] that full story from the

2:47:29initial plate read, the justification,

2:47:31why it was searched to the outcome of

2:47:33that search. It's going to give them the

2:47:35ability uh the investigative capability,

2:47:38but also that transparency, the full

2:47:40story that they're able to to

2:47:42effectively go in front of the community

2:47:43and say,

2:47:44"Hey, this is how this technology was

2:47:46used and it was also used responsibly

2:47:48and here's why."

2:47:52Um so, this is an analytics page that we

2:47:55have within Plate Ranger. Um at the

2:47:57bottom left, that's probably one of my

2:47:58favorite features. That's your vehicle

2:48:00volume. That's great if the city of

2:48:02Lawrence is planning for uh specific

2:48:04event, a parade.

2:48:06Um if you have uh certain event coming

2:48:08through that you want to set up for,

2:48:09officers are also able to see the

2:48:11highest and lowest volumes of traffic

2:48:13throughout a period of day uh period of

2:48:14time and that can really

2:48:16uh help moving forward with

2:48:18strategic planning also.

2:48:20Um

2:48:22total of alerts there. So, that's also

2:48:24very valuable if these plate readers are

2:48:26installed, if Plate Ranger's installed

2:48:28at certain locations and they're not

2:48:30getting the results that you know, that

2:48:32the city wants or PD wants, do we need

2:48:34to move those locations? That's going to

2:48:36provide a lot of uh analytics from from

2:48:38that also.

2:48:41And you're also able to monitor all the

2:48:42cameras performance uh right there.

2:48:45Um every plate read is

2:48:47um presented with a confidence level.

2:48:49Something that I make

2:48:50I'm a very stern advocate um

2:48:53of LPR does not replace a police

2:48:56officer. You still have to acknowledge

2:48:58the plate read. You have to you do you

2:49:00have to use your officer's discretion.

2:49:02You have to make sure that that plate

2:49:03read matches the vehicle in front of

2:49:05you. That is so important. When I hear

2:49:08stories of innocent people being pulled

2:49:09out of their car because the officer did

2:49:11not um acknowledge the plate read, they

2:49:13went strictly off of the hit. That

2:49:16That's not that's not good. Um I'm a big

2:49:18advocate in that. That confidence rating

2:49:20that it provides that officer is a

2:49:22tremendous feature to me.

2:49:24Now you'll see it blue highlighted there

2:49:25with a hyperlink underneath the

2:49:26confidence. What that is is our direct

2:49:29Crime Tracers integration.

2:49:31So an officer is able to click on that

2:49:33plate read and it directly logs them

2:49:35into the Crime Tracers software that

2:49:37they already use. And that gives them an

2:49:38integrated workflow. So they're not in

2:49:40the middle of patrol and have and and

2:49:42get a plate read and have to log into a

2:49:44separate system. They can be on patrol.

2:49:47The value in this is tremendous coming

2:49:49from somebody who didn't have this

2:49:50technology on patrol.

2:49:52When I was on patrol, I had to run a

2:49:54license plate through dispatch. By the

2:49:56time that information came back, I was

2:49:58already at the driver's side window. I

2:49:59had no idea who I was talking to. I

2:50:01didn't know if that vehicle was stolen.

2:50:03I didn't know if that person had just

2:50:04robbed a store.

2:50:06That alone

2:50:08it it

2:50:09the the the value add in that feature

2:50:11alone, that direct integration giving

2:50:14that police officer that capability um

2:50:17to better protect himself and better

2:50:19serve this the community with that

2:50:20direct integration component is so

2:50:22important. It will offer multiple

2:50:24candidates as well at the bottom right.

2:50:27So we all know sometimes an S can get

2:50:29mistaken for a five.

2:50:31Um dirt debris can be incorporated into

2:50:33the plate. Uh you know,

2:50:35technology is only so good as we make

2:50:37it. Man makes technology and man is not

2:50:39perfect. So, by providing multiple

2:50:42candidates, it does give that officer

2:50:44additional options.

2:50:45That bottom left arrow you see, that's

2:50:47the direct import

2:50:49integrated into evidence.com. That's the

2:50:51evidence collection software that

2:50:53Lawrence already uses. So, they're able

2:50:55to actually upload this entire

2:50:57workflow directly to a system that they

2:51:00already use with evidence.com.

2:51:03They can download a a still image. They

2:51:05can

2:51:06download a PDF report of it. At the very

2:51:09top, you'll see location. So, if we were

2:51:11in the live environment, I'd be able to

2:51:13click on that location and it would show

2:51:14that officer the location of that plate

2:51:16hit. And then the video, of course,

2:51:18that's going to provide the 8 8 to

2:51:2015-second HD video there.

2:51:28This is going to be what a standard

2:51:30plate read looks like. Nothing super

2:51:31fancy, but I think it's very good

2:51:33quality. It's HD quality. Um not SD. Um

2:51:36no no legacy uh a video software you

2:51:39use. This is all up-to-date HD

2:51:43back one slide, please.

2:51:46Yep. So, the Plate Reader mobile app,

2:51:47it's probably one of my favorite

2:51:48features that we have here uh just from

2:51:50an officer safety standpoint. I've

2:51:52worked with detectives before. Uh

2:51:54sometimes detectives are deployed at

2:51:56certain locations and they're

2:51:57undercover. They don't have radios with

2:51:59them. They're in plain clothes for

2:52:01certain reasons.

2:52:03Well,

2:52:04a detective can actually use this

2:52:05application and if they get a a hit from

2:52:07a license plate, uh let's say a an alert

2:52:10on a stolen vehicle,

2:52:12everybody at headquarters with Lawrence

2:52:14PD will get that same alert with that

2:52:16with that notification on the on the

2:52:18dispatch map.

2:52:19So, now they can actually dispatch other

2:52:21police officers to that detective's

2:52:23location and make sure that he's safe,

2:52:25that he's okay.

2:52:26Another good tool for this would be like

2:52:28your street takeover events. That's

2:52:30been all over the media here recently.

2:52:32Officers are the they're trying to quell

2:52:35the violence. They're trying to maintain

2:52:36officer safety and go home effectively.

2:52:39They don't have time to really pin out a

2:52:40pull out a pin and a paper and start

2:52:42writing down tag numbers. So, with this

2:52:44simple app, they can pull that out, they

2:52:45can scan plates that were in the area.

2:52:48That sends it straight back to their

2:52:49Plate Reader platform. They can deal

2:52:51with everything in the instance, and

2:52:53then when they get back to headquarters,

2:52:55they can start working on that

2:52:56investigation. Who was there, who was

2:52:57leaving, who was committing the

2:52:59violence, and left when I told them that

2:53:01they weren't free to leave.

2:53:03And nothing is saved to that officer's

2:53:05phone. That's transmitted directly

2:53:07through the AWS GovCloud.

2:53:10This is the Plate Reader Agent software

2:53:13we kind of briefly discussed here

2:53:15earlier.

2:53:16We also call it bring your own camera.

2:53:17This transforms a city surveillance

2:53:20camera into a ONVIF compliant LPR

2:53:23system. So, no expensive new hardware

2:53:25required, no rip and replace. I love

2:53:27this because of the value add I

2:53:30local governments are very strapped for

2:53:32cash and a lot of times it's it's hard

2:53:34for them to get the tools that that they

2:53:36need to more effectively serve their

2:53:38citizens. So, this is another way to do

2:53:40that. It's scalable and cost-effective,

2:53:42low very low bandwidth consumption, and

2:53:45it uses the same edge processing that

2:53:47the

2:53:47that the

2:53:49hardware units would use.

2:53:53Sound thinking itself is over 200 plus

2:53:55integrations. So, you'll see a lot of

2:53:56big names on there. We play very nicely

2:53:58with Motorola, Axon Fuze, Microsoft

2:54:01Aware, Central Square Technologies,

2:54:05Tyler Technologies, Mark 43.

2:54:07Um

2:54:09Yep, also other other LPR units such as

2:54:12Motorola, Vigilant. As long as that

2:54:14other vendor is willing to to give their

2:54:16data to that agency and share it with

2:54:18us, we can also integrate with it as

2:54:20well. Um there is one vendor that we do

2:54:22not integrate with and that is Flock

2:54:24Safety.

2:54:27Field Agent deployment analytics. Um as

2:54:29actually speaking with Lawrence PD

2:54:31earlier about this. I think this is very

2:54:33valuable. It's It's valuable because it

2:54:36So, this is a resource where

2:54:38um I can actually utilize the city of

2:54:40Lawrence's uh CAD data, their calls for

2:54:42service and their incidents for violent

2:54:44crime, property crime.

2:54:46And we have a a product called Field

2:54:48Agent where I can it can actually ingest

2:54:51that data

2:54:52and I can provide a an LPR deployment

2:54:55analysis based on that data.

2:54:57And I think that's very important

2:54:58because constituents want to know, "Why

2:55:00do I have 15 cameras

2:55:03located in the in the northwest section

2:55:05of my city? I feel like I'm being

2:55:06targeted."

2:55:07And with that report, that PDF report

2:55:09that I'm able to repair for that

2:55:11officer, they're able to effectively

2:55:13explain that that's a data-backed

2:55:15deployment um that it's in that area to

2:55:17better serve the constituents, to keep

2:55:19everyone safe, um that no one is in fact

2:55:21being targeted. And I I think that's

2:55:23very important for public transparency.

2:55:29Um so, IPVM, their independent reviewer

2:55:31of LPR technologies, um they uh conduct

2:55:34this uh research every 2 years. Um some

2:55:38vendors do not participate, some vendors

2:55:40used to participate um and no longer do.

2:55:44Um Genetec, Rekor, uh which is which is

2:55:47the solution that powers Plate Ranger,

2:55:49scores exceptionally well across the

2:55:51board for large letter, stack lettering,

2:55:53ignore extra lettering, overall plate

2:55:56detect accuracy at 100%.

2:56:01Uh vehicle type day accuracy, IR mode,

2:56:04um you know, it's very difficult for

2:56:06pretty much all LPR to detect color uh

2:56:08various colors at night, so most are

2:56:11typically going to perform at zero.

2:56:12That's not a technology that's been

2:56:14quite developed yet.

2:56:20Uh Crime Chaser, so the real power is,

2:56:23you know, um as I was discussing

2:56:24earlier, when these technologies are

2:56:26incorporated, this is a

2:56:28Crime Tracer is a product that, so you

2:56:30know, Lawrence is already using.

2:56:32Um they've also increased their their

2:56:34users uh with Crime Tracer over the past

2:56:37year dramatically. Um so having that

2:56:40initial plate read feed directly to that

2:56:42Crime Tracer component that uh Lawrence

2:56:45PD already relies on um while also being

2:56:48transparent giving them the tools to be

2:56:51transparent with the community in a

2:56:53closed eco uh data weak ecosystem

2:56:55without the risk and the and full

2:56:57control of that data. Um

2:56:59>> Can I interrupt?

2:57:00>> Yeah.

2:57:00>> So, in our document, it's talking about

2:57:03the Plate Ranger, and I know that in

2:57:05your original, there were three elements

2:57:07to this. This is the Plate Ranger, this

2:57:09is the You just lost it it Whatever that

2:57:12What's this What's your about What are

2:57:13you talking about now?

2:57:14>> That's Crime Tracer. That's the tool

2:57:15that Lawrence PD already uses. Yes, it's

2:57:17Crime Tracer.

2:57:18>> Can we keep the presentation up?

2:57:21I don't know who's managing that.

2:57:22>> Yeah, the only reason why I'm I'm

2:57:23calling that out is that we're being

2:57:25asked tonight on Plate Ranger, not on

2:57:28Crime Tracer.

2:57:29>> We already have that.

2:57:30>> We already have it, so we're Okay, so

2:57:32we're going to talk about something we

2:57:33already have, which is fine.

2:57:35>> So, yeah, so so the the solutions

2:57:37directly integrate. It's a it's a

2:57:39product that Lawrence already depends

2:57:41on. So with like it like no other

2:57:43solution can offer this value for

2:57:45Lawrence.

2:57:47Yes, sir. No no problem.

2:57:49Yes, sir.

2:57:50>> Mhm.

2:57:50>> Um so this improves the capability that

2:57:52Lawrence our Lawrence PD already depends

2:57:54on, and it comes from a a place of good

2:57:56faith, a controlled data environment.

2:58:00>> Next.

2:58:01>> That next?

2:58:05So, Plate Ranger and Crime Tracer,

2:58:07that's going to give officers faster

2:58:09investigative leads. It's going to

2:58:10accelerate their investigations that

2:58:12they're already uh performing. It's

2:58:14going to eliminate searching data silos.

2:58:17That's the biggest takeaway. They

2:58:18directly integrate. No other No other

2:58:21LPR system on the market will integrate

2:58:24with Crime Tracers. It's specifically

2:58:25made to integrate with Plate Ranger. And

2:58:27that's they're going to be able to

2:58:28locate vehicles and previous occupants

2:58:30much more quickly with that streamline

2:58:32integration.

2:58:35So, Crime the Crime Tracers component,

2:58:37that's over a billion

2:58:38criminal records that are available to

2:58:40law enforcement and that's contributed

2:58:43through you know, through agencies CAD

2:58:45CAD data,

2:58:47Thomson Reuters Clear.

2:58:55That's kind of what a an example would

2:58:57look like. So, what this would mean for

2:58:58Lawrence. So,

2:59:00investigative value your officers depend

2:59:02on real-time stolen vehicle and bolo

2:59:04alerts, which is expected in any LPR

2:59:06system, Amber Alert integration, vehicle

2:59:09identification at crime scenes without

2:59:11witnesses or 911 calls.

2:59:14Convoy analysis, common vehicle

2:59:15analysis, and partial plate searching as

2:59:17well. That's a big option within Plate

2:59:19Ranger. Often times vehicles don't

2:59:21travel alone.

2:59:23So, that convoy analysis is a great is a

2:59:24great value add. Video context with

2:59:27every plate read for evidentiary value.

2:59:31That's not something that we charge

2:59:32extra for. Also, the app. Something I

2:59:36forgot to mention is there's no max user

2:59:38license for the app. That's available

2:59:40that's automatically included with the

2:59:42Plate Ranger LPR system. It's not a

2:59:44separate charge or anything.

2:59:46The agent overlay

2:59:48on existing city surveillance cameras

2:59:50expanding coverage without need of new

2:59:52hardware.

2:59:53Safeguards your community can trust. So,

2:59:55no national network. Plate reads stay

2:59:57directly in Lawrence unless they choose

2:59:59otherwise. No outside agency can ever

3:00:02query Lawrence's data without explicit

3:00:04permission.

3:00:06And Lawrence sets their own data

3:00:07retention policies and that's going to

3:00:09allow them to adjust as legislation

3:00:11continues to evolve in this turbulent

3:00:13environment we're in. And more

3:00:15importantly, that full audit trail on

3:00:17every single search with user timestamp

3:00:19and the reason that's going to be

3:00:20logged. Role-based access controls. A

3:00:23lot of times officers

3:00:25um they don't It's not It's not uh privy

3:00:27for them to have the same access to the

3:00:29same information that an investigator

3:00:32would. So, they role-based access

3:00:34controls are also also incorporated.

3:00:36Agency-controlled sharing. So, if a

3:00:38neighboring agency such as Methuen or

3:00:40Lowell, if they were to incorporate the

3:00:42Plate Ranger

3:00:44uh LPR system here, they you guys would

3:00:46be able to share uh regionally, but also

3:00:48be in control of that data without a

3:00:50broad national network data share.

3:00:53Um no vendor Yep, very good.

3:00:56So, the scope of the pilot that we've

3:00:58discussed is a is 10 fixed LPR cameras.

3:01:01That's the Plate Ranger Pro Solar. Uh

3:01:033-month evaluation period with no cost

3:01:06or obligation. All the pilot fees are

3:01:08waived. Uh placements determined with

3:01:11LPD um using that historical crime data,

3:01:13local landscape, institutional

3:01:15knowledge, and infrastructure analysis.

3:01:18Uh virtual site survey, solar

3:01:20assessment, installation on any existing

3:01:23poles, camera installation, and

3:01:24acceptance testing.

3:01:26Full Plate Ranger access with unlimited

3:01:29user licenses, integration with your

3:01:31existing ShotSpotter and Crime Tracers

3:01:33products. That's of course going to have

3:01:35a CJIS approved AWS GovCloud hosting.

3:01:38Full onboarding, best practice sessions,

3:01:41training, and onsite go-live support.

3:01:44And the success criteria that we have

3:01:46outlined is

3:01:48uh the LPR is going to have to meet or

3:01:50exceed the department's expectations.

3:01:52Vehicle image quality. It's going to

3:01:54have to provide consistent high-quality

3:01:56images that allow zoom in and extraction

3:01:58of key characteristics. Video motion

3:02:01events, which are going to consist of

3:02:03video motion activated events. Video

3:02:05plate reads, consistent video clips of

3:02:08each plate read, and of course that

3:02:10user-friendly searching and reporting

3:02:12that's going to provide quickly. That's

3:02:14going to let them quickly identify

3:02:15vehicles of interest by partial matches,

3:02:17make classification, model, color,

3:02:20location, or time without Yeah, very

3:02:23good.

3:02:23>> That's

3:02:25>> And I'll be happy to answer

3:02:26>> Oh,

3:02:27I thought it was shut down.

3:02:27>> Yeah, that's it. That's it. I had my

3:02:29invisible clicker today.

3:02:31Yes, ma'am. And I'll answer any

3:02:33questions you have, guys.

3:02:35>> Thank you. Counselors, any question

3:02:38pertaining to the

3:02:40presentation and technology pilot

3:02:43program

3:02:44before us?

3:02:45Counselor De Plant.

3:02:46>> Thanks.

3:02:49Uh

3:02:52Let's just start with the ordinance. We

3:02:54have um

3:02:55just happened to have a an ord- public

3:02:57hearing next

3:02:59Tuesday to deal with the surveillance

3:03:01cameras. And as we become more

3:03:03comfortable and familiar with our

3:03:05ordinance as we're trying to

3:03:07play catch-up [snorts]

3:03:08with it.

3:03:09Um

3:03:10This particular, even though it's a

3:03:13pilot program, we could easily argue

3:03:16that it still has to comport with our

3:03:20ordinance, which you're probably not

3:03:21familiar with.

3:03:22>> Yes, sir.

3:03:23>> Or are you?

3:03:24>> I'm not. No, sir.

3:03:24>> You're not. Okay, that's fine. So, on

3:03:26something like this, I think we would

3:03:28have to order a public hearing on it.

3:03:31And and specifically the uh

3:03:35this technology is

3:03:37expressly defined

3:03:40in the ordinance under definitions of

3:03:42surveillance technology. If you look at

3:03:44uh

3:03:45under I'm going to say this, no one's

3:03:46going to write it down, which is fine.

3:03:489.0 9.25

3:03:50.020 the definitions, surveillance

3:03:53technology includes sub-letter B,

3:03:56automatic license plate readers, which

3:03:59this is it. This is it. And when that

3:04:02does trigger it, then we need to go down

3:04:05to 9.25030,

3:04:08which is the City Council approval of

3:04:10surveillance technology, and that would

3:04:12be under A

3:04:14I would argue number two.

3:04:16Um

3:04:20acquire or borrow any surveillance

3:04:22technology, whether or not that

3:04:23acquisition is made through the exchange

3:04:25of money or other consideration,

3:04:27using new or existing surveillance

3:04:30technology for a purpose or in a manner

3:04:31not previously approved by the City

3:04:33Council.

3:04:34That might be tying to that. So, it it

3:04:37very definitely fits right there. And

3:04:39then I think the last part,

3:04:42um

3:04:44is that and this is really a um this is

3:04:47the responsibility of the Police

3:04:48Department, not necessarily the

3:04:49contractor.

3:04:51All of this, uh but it's under a

3:04:539.25040,

3:04:56which is the requirement of a

3:04:57surveillance impact report and a

3:04:59surveillance use policy, of which I am

3:05:01not going to read because it is lengthy.

3:05:04Sergeant Dar, you apparently have some

3:05:05answers, [snorts] so I'm eager to hear.

3:05:07>> Yes, sir. So,

3:05:10under the 9.25, we we have submitted

3:05:12this for the next uh hearing. As as

3:05:16mentioned um earlier. Um I know that

3:05:21we've uh

3:05:22we've I believe we've caught up when it

3:05:25comes to submitting documentations

3:05:28uh fully.

3:05:29I also think this is exactly parallel to

3:05:32what you've expressed that needs to

3:05:34happen. And we're going exactly to what

3:05:37has been requested. We're presenting a

3:05:41new technology as a pilot program, which

3:05:43is also expressed in 9.25.

3:05:47So, we are we are doing this ahead of

3:05:49time so that it's not contradicting 9.25

3:05:54where it says that we need to introduce

3:05:55this first to you before we can even get

3:05:57to that point.

3:05:59Uh

3:06:00I think we're doing that right now.

3:06:03So, the expression here is pretty much

3:06:06making it completely transparent where

3:06:09we're looking at no cost, a 90-day trial

3:06:11period.

3:06:12Um and this is also um evaluating

3:06:17the evaluation gives the city an

3:06:18objective, right? And Lawrence specific

3:06:21data before any future LPR decision is

3:06:24even taken. So,

3:06:26we're we're looking at all of these

3:06:28factors um

3:06:30before we even ask the city council,

3:06:32"Hey, we want to we do want to pursue

3:06:34this, right?" So, going into this phase

3:06:37of

3:06:39uh producing a

3:06:40this in front of you, this is what we're

3:06:42just trying to make sure that we're

3:06:43conforming to what you've asked.

3:06:44>> No, I appreciate that very much. Uh

3:06:47and thank you for taking this so

3:06:48seriously cuz we do have that public

3:06:50hearing on Tuesday.

3:06:51Uh but I just want to go back to what

3:06:53you said. So, in anticipation

3:06:56of this, you've included all of the

3:06:58pertinent documents into the packet that

3:07:01we all will be getting as early as

3:07:03tomorrow from the city clerk. Um

3:07:07>> It's already been submitted.

3:07:08>> But we don't have it. I don't think we

3:07:09have received I think we're going to

3:07:11receive that as early as tomorrow.

3:07:13Uh

3:07:14but you're telling me that that's all in

3:07:16packet of stuff.

3:07:17>> Yes, it is.

3:07:19This is

3:07:19>> And it has and just just let me finish

3:07:22the question and I'll I'll listen again.

3:07:24This has a surveillance impact report

3:07:26and a surveillance use policy, both are

3:07:28part of that?

3:07:29>> Yes, sir.

3:07:30>> Okay.

3:07:31All right.

3:07:31>> And we also added a third policy, which

3:07:34is

3:07:35the technology policy.

3:07:37>> Okay.

3:07:37>> And the use of technology within the

3:07:39department.

3:07:41>> Uh the only thing now moving away from

3:07:43that and just with the substance now of

3:07:45this and and I think we'll

3:07:47we have so much next Tuesday. It's going

3:07:49to be crazy. We've got

3:07:51the no confidence vote, we have this, we

3:07:54have the What else we have that's big?

3:07:56Oh, we have this the noise ordinance

3:07:58thing coming up as well. So, we've got a

3:08:01pretty big meeting, a lot of big things

3:08:03meaty things coming up. So, this is it's

3:08:05going to be long. Um

3:08:08When I say you, I mean the police

3:08:09department. The police department has in

3:08:11the past had LPRs.

3:08:13Um and what I'm interested in knowing

3:08:16is we stopped using it from what I am

3:08:19told or I should I should better ask

3:08:22you. Why did we stop using it? Or are we

3:08:24using it still using it?

3:08:25>> We we we are still using it. We did not

3:08:27stop using LPR. What we stopped using is

3:08:29um

3:08:30They were under ALPRs which were mounted

3:08:33on cruisers. We have evolved since then.

3:08:36Those were back in 2018.

3:08:38>> Mhm.

3:08:39>> Uh we did stop using those. Uh and then

3:08:41soon after that we did uh

3:08:44go into with Flock. So, this would be

3:08:47again, it's in in conjunction with that.

3:08:50We're continuously using LPRs with

3:08:52Flock.

3:08:53Uh this is obviously evaluating a

3:08:55different system, uh an alternative

3:08:57option.

3:08:58So, we're not, you know, just uh

3:09:01bounded by one one one particular vendor

3:09:03that has that technology.

3:09:04>> And so, the the

3:09:06where the police department was

3:09:08unsatisfied previously was when the

3:09:11license plate readers were on a move on

3:09:14a police cruiser driving by

3:09:17picking up picking up picking up

3:09:19>> say sir by any means unsatisfied. I

3:09:22think technology evolves. So, if it's

3:09:25obsolete we have to move on and see

3:09:28what's better for us. That's something

3:09:30that's, you know,

3:09:31that's the reason why we stopped that.

3:09:33>> I Not to be argumentative, but from what

3:09:35I've heard from people that you served

3:09:37with or or have served with was that

3:09:40they were turning it off because it was

3:09:43just reading too too information and

3:09:46that it became a distraction from what

3:09:48they were trying to accomplish. It was

3:09:50just forcing information onto a screen.

3:09:53>> Correct.

3:09:54>> It became unwieldy to them and because

3:09:56of that, from what I'm told, because it

3:09:58became unwieldy and then it became not a

3:10:01tool because they were shutting it off

3:10:03and they just decided to not deal with

3:10:05it. So, that's a lesson I mean I It's

3:10:09all hearsay. I'm just hearing from other

3:10:10officers who are talking to me. So.

3:10:12>> It's obviously subjective and and I

3:10:15think when it comes to technology your

3:10:18your approach has to be

3:10:20>> [snorts]

3:10:20>> if you're looking at it in the now, it

3:10:22was probably the hottest thing on the

3:10:24market just like any other gadget that

3:10:26comes across. A new iPhone comes out,

3:10:28you know, they now they have us on on a

3:10:30bench for every single year you're

3:10:32looking at something different. Same

3:10:33concept goes here where if it's no

3:10:35longer conducive to the department, we

3:10:37have to evolve with what technology has

3:10:39next and that's what happened there.

3:10:41There was this like gap in between

3:10:43um

3:10:45in between the time that we had the

3:10:46mounted on the cruiser versus what was

3:10:48available. Um and then in between that

3:10:51too we had, you know, other things

3:10:53played factors. Um funding was a big

3:10:55thing too. So, you know.

3:10:57>> And so I'll leave I'll leave with this

3:10:59cuz again late other than council didn't

3:11:00want to speak. I think what's

3:11:02interesting about this

3:11:04is that it is a trial period. It is a

3:11:06pilot project and so um

3:11:08you will be able to determine within 90

3:11:11days I guess whether or not this is a

3:11:12good fit not a good fit for the

3:11:14department and those bugs or things that

3:11:16I just mentioned may or may not be

3:11:18prevalent or it may

3:11:20you may find it to be really good and

3:11:22then you'll come back to us and say,

3:11:23"Yeah,

3:11:24we want to do it and we want to engage

3:11:26in whatever the contract or whatever it

3:11:28is that you

3:11:29>> Absolutely. We want to produce the data

3:11:30that can back this up.

3:11:32We we we don't want to move with

3:11:34anything that, you know, that can that

3:11:37can't prove that, you know.

3:11:38>> I'm done for now. Thank you.

3:11:41So, we don't That's the one thing. we

3:11:42don't need to order We are technically

3:11:44required to order a public hearing on

3:11:46this. We can do Well, that's

3:11:50That's fascinating. It's a fascinating

3:11:51question because they [snorts]

3:11:54already went ahead.

3:11:55They have already given the information.

3:11:58Technically, we published.

3:12:02But, we

3:12:03it was information put in calendars and

3:12:06such. The The amount of information that

3:12:08we have is fairly thick and we're not

3:12:10going to put all this in the newspaper.

3:12:13kind of thing. And so,

3:12:15um it's a fascinating question. Do

3:12:17Should we are we required to go ahead

3:12:18and order a public hearing? Although we

3:12:20did already and they've included it. So,

3:12:23I don't know. I

3:12:24I think at this point, if you're going

3:12:25to ask me, I'm thinking out loud. If

3:12:26you're going to ask me, I would probably

3:12:28say, "Let's not order a public hearing

3:12:30because one has been ordered and we've

3:12:32just received assurances that this

3:12:33information is in there, so that

3:12:35probably does qualify." There. I'm going

3:12:37to come up with my call. Thank you.

3:12:38>> May I May I say one more thing?

3:12:40Um

3:12:41obviously, this pilot, it runs alongside

3:12:44and it does not change our current

3:12:46operation.

3:12:47It That is very important. This is not

3:12:50something um if we were to label it as

3:12:52new technology, no. We We are using LPR.

3:12:56Uh which makes a big difference. I can

3:12:58understand when you're looking at

3:13:00something uh completely new, yes. But,

3:13:04if it This is a again, another

3:13:05alternative that we're looking at.

3:13:09>> Council Manager, thank

3:13:10>> Council President.

3:13:11>> I have a couple of questions. Um

3:13:15do you uh integrate uh

3:13:18with external with external SSO?

3:13:24>> I'm sorry.

3:13:24>> So, single sign-on.

3:13:28>> Yes.

3:13:30Yes.

3:13:31>> So, like uh what perhaps do you guys

3:13:35um

3:13:36>> For single sign-on?

3:13:37>> Mhm.

3:13:38>> So, we have our credentials set up uh

3:13:40in-house when it comes to single

3:13:42sign-ons.

3:13:44>> So, that means that

3:13:46you using a with Microsoft Azure?

3:13:49>> you have you have to have uh compliance,

3:13:51right? Especially with CJIS. That's part

3:13:54of this um

3:13:56in order to access something. If you're

3:13:58looking for access, we do have single

3:14:00sign-on.

3:14:01>> Okay.

3:14:02>> Yeah.

3:14:04>> So, you mentioned

3:14:06>> [clears throat]

3:14:06>> up there they have a local option.

3:14:09But, they're still cloud

3:14:11cloud uh cloud-based

3:14:13>> Yes.

3:14:13>> option. So, is is local, but it's cloud.

3:14:17Is is is means which is which means that

3:14:21if anybody get into the cloud and then

3:14:24they will have access, too.

3:14:26>> Well, yeah. So, it's served on a on AWS

3:14:28GovCloud. So, that's the same cloud

3:14:30service that's essent- we're essentially

3:14:32FedRAMP authorized, but we're not Fed-

3:14:36we meet all the standards for FedRAMP,

3:14:37essentially.

3:14:38Um are you familiar with AWS GovCloud?

3:14:42>> Well, you can tell us. Tell us more.

3:14:45>> Yeah, so so SOC 2, it's

3:14:47a extremely secure GovCloud service. The

3:14:50initial plate read happens at the edge.

3:14:53That's and then it's sent to the AWS,

3:14:55and that's where it's compared against

3:14:56the the hot list there.

3:14:58>> So, other agencies

3:15:01um I have access to?

3:15:03>> No, not at all.

3:15:05>> So, if we choose the local

3:15:07option.

3:15:08>> Yeah, absolutely. And some agencies and

3:15:10some age- every community is going to be

3:15:11different. Some agencies they they might

3:15:14not want any partners. They might, you

3:15:16know, they only want to share within the

3:15:17city of Lawrence. And that's completely

3:15:19an option that's available. Everything

3:15:21within Plate Ranger is is is opt-in, not

3:15:24opt-out. You're not automatically thrown

3:15:26into a network with any other agency.

3:15:29It's controlled sharing. But, if another

3:15:31agency next door, let's say Methuen were

3:15:34to take on Plate Ranger,

3:15:36they'd be able to share data bilaterally

3:15:39Yeah, bilaterally through an MOU, which

3:15:41would be agreed upon by both agencies

3:15:44and a and a API key.

3:15:45>> So, both cities?

3:15:46>> Yes.

3:15:48>> You call When you say agency, I'm

3:15:50thinking something else.

3:15:51>> Yeah, both Yeah, both cities, right.

3:15:53Mhm.

3:15:54>> Um

3:15:55>> I think your first your second your

3:15:57second question ties in with the first

3:15:59one with the single sign-on.

3:16:01>> Yes.

3:16:05>> So, uh

3:16:14So, the are you capable of connecting

3:16:15with our current system that we have in

3:16:17the city of Lawrence?

3:16:19Uh perhaps [clears throat]

3:16:20to develop a

3:16:22a uh unique

3:16:24system that only work for the city of

3:16:27Lawrence?

3:16:28Or that's not an option?

3:16:30>> Uh

3:16:31>> Because like what I'm thinking is like

3:16:33let's say

3:16:34um

3:16:36that um

3:16:39You know, a lot of people is concerned

3:16:41about the Flock. Right? Because of the

3:16:43sharing situation.

3:16:44>> Obviously.

3:16:45>> So, developing a new local

3:16:48uh camera base, which is basically the

3:16:51same thing.

3:16:52>> Mhm.

3:16:52>> Uh

3:16:54and not necessarily

3:16:56uh

3:16:57using most of the stuff that is up

3:17:00there.

3:17:01Is that will create

3:17:03Do you guys offer that options or not?

3:17:06>> So,

3:17:07>> We need to use your system.

3:17:09>> Um it's it

3:17:10So, it it would be all access through

3:17:11the system. You know, you would just

3:17:13decide if you want to share with anybody

3:17:15or if you didn't want to.

3:17:17Um the data stays within Lawrence

3:17:19regardless. Like

3:17:21you know, you can

3:17:22>> But I feel like that's the same story as

3:17:23the Flock.

3:17:26>> I'm sorry?

3:17:27>> I feel like that's the same story

3:17:30of the Flock.

3:17:31>> No, that's the whole reason behind the

3:17:33Flock back outlash is that they have a

3:17:35national data network that agencies are

3:17:37automatically thrown into. External

3:17:40agencies can search that city's data

3:17:43unknowingly without any justification

3:17:45that they're

3:17:46privy to.

3:17:49You can't You can't It's not It's not

3:17:50even possible with the Plate Ranger

3:17:52system.

3:17:53>> Okay.

3:17:55>> As there's no

3:17:57like

3:17:58ICE can't search the city of Lawrence's

3:18:00data.

3:18:02Uh Methuen can't do it. Nobody can do it

3:18:05unless

3:18:06you

3:18:06>> Well, that's a given access.

3:18:07>> Right, exactly. It's impossible.

3:18:09>> It's a You're looking towards an

3:18:12enclosed system.

3:18:13>> Yeah, it's a closed closed ecosystem of

3:18:14data.

3:18:15>> so

3:18:16if we are comparing with our current

3:18:18system with Flock, the range is wider.

3:18:21If you think of it that way.

3:18:23Uh

3:18:23>> But I mean, what I'm saying is this is

3:18:25kind of like similar stories because

3:18:27that's a same quote. If I ask the same

3:18:30question to Flock, they'll tell me the

3:18:32same thing.

3:18:32>> No, because

3:18:34they won't. Their Their reach is That's

3:18:36what I'm saying, their reach is way

3:18:37further without having the safeguards

3:18:40that

3:18:43actually you're looking for.

3:18:45So,

3:18:46>> If I can

3:18:47>> cloud. It's cloud-based.

3:18:49So, meaning that

3:18:51it could be.

3:18:54>> So, that's Yeah, that's going to be with

3:18:55any LPR vendor that you evaluate.

3:18:58>> That's why That's why my second question

3:19:00came up to whether or not

3:19:02we can integrate those cameras into the

3:19:04current system we have to avoid that

3:19:07type of issue because we can uh we can

3:19:09maintain it locally.

3:19:11They have the same technology of license

3:19:13plate readings and so forth and so on.

3:19:17>> Access to the internal system is

3:19:19independent from

3:19:21this platform.

3:19:23Our infrastructure,

3:19:25which is along with the city, is

3:19:27enclosed.

3:19:29What we share is strictly with LPD.

3:19:33Uh it's not outside of LPD.

3:19:37>> On the current system, right?

3:19:38>> On the current system.

3:19:39>> That's what I'm saying to you.

3:19:40>> to It would apply to

3:19:42uh SoundThinking as well with the Plate

3:19:44Ranger

3:19:45when it comes to single sign-on.

3:19:48When you go ahead and you're talking

3:19:49about uh sharing information or data

3:19:52with other agencies that can

3:19:55uh come into our system, that's

3:19:57independently upon

3:20:00the department to choose if that they're

3:20:02going to do that. But, we have a policy

3:20:04that says otherwise, that we can't.

3:20:06Right? And that's how we it's governed

3:20:08by. Where if we're looking back at our

3:20:11current system with Flock,

3:20:13again, it goes to reach. The uh the

3:20:17ability of what it can do is exactly

3:20:20where the concerns are. Uh so, it allows

3:20:24other municipality to look into your

3:20:27system.

3:20:29If that makes any sense.

3:20:32>> I just wanted to put everything uh

3:20:36I mean, at least have the conversation.

3:20:38So, tell me the difference between the

3:20:39current system we have and this system.

3:20:42>> Uh absolutely. Are we able to get the

3:20:44>> the way we get it so we can record in

3:20:45case something happen.

3:20:46>> Uh super simple. Are we able to get the

3:20:47PowerPoint back up real quick?

3:20:50>> No, but just just told me, you know,

3:20:52>> Uh yeah, absolutely. So, there's one

3:20:54part in the PowerPoint when we discussed

3:20:56uh uh

3:20:57open networks, right? Bilateral

3:20:59networks, and then the the closed

3:21:02network.

3:21:03With Plate Ranger, you're able to It's

3:21:05your data. You dictate if you want to be

3:21:07closed off and not share with anybody,

3:21:10not have any other agency external

3:21:12agencies able to query your data, or or

3:21:15you just want to share with selected

3:21:16partners in your region, or if you want

3:21:18to opt into a national uh record network

3:21:22um that's much smaller, essentially.

3:21:25>> So, okay, just want to make sure like we

3:21:26we we repeat that after I ask I ask you

3:21:29the question. So, um

3:21:32another question that I have is

3:21:34when it comes to

3:21:36uh

3:21:37access to the system,

3:21:39is uh you say that you uh

3:21:42once you once you're in, you need to

3:21:44have a a a reason as a why

3:21:47you uh

3:21:49perhaps are getting alerts on a specific

3:21:51license plate, right?

3:21:52>> Uh no. So, whenever you query anybody's

3:21:54anyone's plate data, it will require

3:21:57justification purpose. And that's that

3:21:59justification is is auditable.

3:22:01>> So,

3:22:02>> Why are you searching the plate?

3:22:04>> So, perhaps it's it's that situation

3:22:06hit-and-run happened South Lawrence,

3:22:10uh and they put a they put a target on

3:22:13that license on that specific vehicle.

3:22:16It's around the city on the north, and

3:22:18it's picking up on different locations.

3:22:21>> Mhm.

3:22:22>> That's that's a possibility, right?

3:22:23>> No. So, yeah, so that officer would So,

3:22:26if it's entered into NCIC, then an alert

3:22:28would would happen off of that off of

3:22:30that plate hit.

3:22:31>> As soon as it pass by another location,

3:22:33>> an independent search. Like an officer

3:22:35can't just query a plate for no reason,

3:22:37essentially. But they would get that

3:22:39immediate NCIC hit if that plate was

3:22:42entered um as a stolen vehicle.

3:22:44>> I'll give you a example if it's at at

3:22:46the

3:22:48looking for it in a specific black car

3:22:52on one side of the city,

3:22:54and then

3:22:56it happened to be a Honda Civic,

3:22:57perhaps. I don't know.

3:22:59Uh

3:23:00and then if it pass by another cameras,

3:23:03is that going to be picked up and give

3:23:05give a alert to the officer?

3:23:07>> sir. No, it won't it won't be logged in

3:23:09as an alert. It'll be logged in as a

3:23:10plate read. But if that officer queries

3:23:12any data for any vehicles that have

3:23:15those characteristics, they have to

3:23:17enter the justification as to why

3:23:18they're doing that.

3:23:20>> And a justification

3:23:22um a justification is anything or it

3:23:26have to be a specific?

3:23:27>> So yeah, that would be dictated by a

3:23:28department policy. That goes back to

3:23:31early in the presentation. I typically

3:23:32recommend a case number, something

3:23:34that's going to be uniform, so when

3:23:36audits are performed, it's easier to

3:23:38spot any anomalies in the audits.

3:23:41>> Okay.

3:23:43So essentially

3:23:46you

3:23:48when uh let's say you got pulled over

3:23:51and then the your license plate your

3:23:54license plate got read.

3:23:57Uh

3:23:58that officer going to have all the data

3:24:02uh related to

3:24:04the other systems that is in combination

3:24:07with the license plate reader?

3:24:10Perhaps crime uh crimes related to that

3:24:13person or whatever the case

3:24:15>> integrated with Crime Trac or that'll

3:24:16extend the investigative value from that

3:24:18vehicle into a tool that yeah, law

3:24:20enforcement already uses Crime Trac or

3:24:21yes, sir.

3:24:22>> So essentially

3:24:24uh

3:24:25an officer put the license plate or stop

3:24:28you

3:24:28get you get your readings

3:24:32it will automatically search for

3:24:35uh

3:24:35other cases that you might have.

3:24:38>> Uh throughout the Crime Trac or network,

3:24:40but yeah, it starts with the

3:24:41justification. So it happens at the

3:24:43initial plate read. That justification

3:24:46is logged. That officer has to log a

3:24:48justification. That could be the case

3:24:50number associated with the stop, you

3:24:52know, the reason for the stop. And yeah,

3:24:55and then the information becomes

3:24:56auditable all the way from the search

3:24:58all the way through the the Crime Trac

3:24:59or component.

3:25:02>> All right, no more questions for

3:25:03>> Yes, sir.

3:25:04>> Thank you.

3:25:05>> Any other questions or comments?

3:25:10I have

3:25:13maybe three, but two as of right now.

3:25:17So, we're hearing a lot from I'm sorry,

3:25:19I I forgot your name.

3:25:21>> I'm Kev- Kevin.

3:25:22>> Kevin. We're hearing a Thank you. Um I'm

3:25:24hearing a lot from Kevin that the

3:25:26municipality or the the client has the

3:25:30option to choose whom they share this

3:25:34information with.

3:25:36So, now I'm going to get you off the hot

3:25:39seat. I'm putting LPD on the hot seat.

3:25:41What is the purpose

3:25:44and intention from LPD? Cuz he's telling

3:25:47us, you know, yeah, there is

3:25:49you know, there's security, whatever,

3:25:51all depends on the municipality, but

3:25:53what if

3:25:54say the chief is like, nope, like we

3:25:57we are going to share this data with ICE

3:26:00or whomever. I'm just using that cuz we

3:26:03>> Well, we could we can actually It's a

3:26:06Great point. We have The policy has been

3:26:08revised.

3:26:09And it does say that specifically that

3:26:11we do not share that with ICE.

3:26:13Those those information are in the our

3:26:15current policies. So, this is

3:26:18uh we mentioned this briefly also last

3:26:20night that we're very uh

3:26:23reactive. 911 call comes in.

3:26:27There is an emergency. It's a part one

3:26:31incident, crime involving a firearm or

3:26:34whatnot.

3:26:35This is a vehicle that fled on scene.

3:26:37This is a tool that we use. It's

3:26:39reactive.

3:26:41We don't have the luxury or the manpower

3:26:43to have somebody sitting there and just

3:26:45watching and running. That's not the

3:26:47purpose of this whatsoever. Okay, so

3:26:50what is what is the So, that's one part,

3:26:53but what is the intention as of now

3:26:56in conversations, perhaps it can change,

3:26:59but

3:27:00is LPD looking to keep this data

3:27:04internal?

3:27:06>> Absolutely.

3:27:07All data I'm I'm a big proponent on

3:27:10safeguarding our data. I mean, that's

3:27:12what makes

3:27:13the police department uh you know, in

3:27:15the role we are in the position we are

3:27:17is public safety.

3:27:19If we can't protect the data, then

3:27:20there's a there's a big issue here.

3:27:23Uh

3:27:23you know,

3:27:24>> Thank you.

3:27:24>> Yes.

3:27:25>> My second question, maybe this is now

3:27:26for Kev, is

3:27:29does it read through, you know how

3:27:31sometimes, and I see this a lot through

3:27:32our community, those those darken

3:27:35license plate covers?

3:27:38Like the black like the translucent

3:27:40black covers that people put Oh, the

3:27:43yeah, that people put over the license

3:27:45plate.

3:27:46Does it read through that? And also,

3:27:49I've seen um

3:27:51reflective

3:27:53uh covers where you can actually carve

3:27:55out the reflective piece of material

3:27:58into the number or or

3:28:02uh letter. Can it read through that as

3:28:04well?

3:28:04>> So, I've seen those. Um I don't have any

3:28:06formal testing on it. It can read

3:28:09There's so many new

3:28:11Criminals are always going to develop

3:28:12tools to to get around information. It's

3:28:15something that police

3:28:16constantly have to pivot around.

3:28:18Um next week it might be a a marker that

3:28:21somebody uses. It might be a a new type

3:28:23of nail polish. Um

3:28:26as far as the covers go,

3:28:28um

3:28:29to my to my recollection, yes, it will

3:28:31read through the covers.

3:28:33Um it would most likely depend on the

3:28:34density of that specific color, right?

3:28:36What it's made out of, the exact

3:28:38material.

3:28:40Um I have seen the cutouts.

3:28:42I don't have any studies where we've,

3:28:44you know, where Rekor has compared the

3:28:46LPR technology with with that. It's

3:28:48something brand new that just came out.

3:28:51Um

3:28:52>> Okay.

3:28:52>> We can definitely test it out for you.

3:28:54>> Yes. Thank you.

3:28:55>> That's That's something we could

3:28:56definitely test during the pilot. I

3:28:58would love that.

3:28:59>> [laughter]

3:28:59>> Thank you.

3:29:00Um

3:29:02for LPD, are we looking to use the Edge

3:29:04Max or the Edge Pro

3:29:07for the test for this pilot program?

3:29:10>> I believe

3:29:12that's a

3:29:12>> That would be the Edge. That's the Edge

3:29:14Pro, yes, ma'am. That's the one to two

3:29:15lane option. That's going to be standard

3:29:17for most cities. If at any point, you

3:29:20know, LPD sees uh you know, adding a Max

3:29:23or two for the invest for the additional

3:29:26storage value or you know, if there's a

3:29:28uh any areas of high rates of speed, you

3:29:31know, we'll we'll definitely work with

3:29:32you on that for sure.

3:29:33>> Okay, I'm glad that you said that

3:29:34because my

3:29:37I'm liking what I'm hearing so far. So

3:29:39far about this technology, I'm I'm

3:29:41liking what I'm hearing particularly

3:29:43because

3:29:44Lawrence is is an active city and

3:29:48um

3:29:51I I don't believe that our our activity

3:29:54is declining from what I've been seeing

3:29:55as of recently.

3:29:57Um and in my district, there are certain

3:30:00areas

3:30:01I can use my own street as an example

3:30:03where drag racing racing is a problem.

3:30:07>> Right.

3:30:07>> I have an issue with an with an

3:30:09industrial park that every summer

3:30:12there's meetups and then they fly

3:30:14when the when the police shows up. So,

3:30:16we haven't been able to actually control

3:30:18that environment either because of that.

3:30:21And I believe that technology that like

3:30:24this will help with the drag racing and

3:30:26will help um with meetups like that. And

3:30:29also,

3:30:30you know, other situations that have

3:30:32occurred um throughout our city. So, but

3:30:36the that's also my concern though

3:30:39that

3:30:40if we're going to go, I mean,

3:30:43with Edge Pro, that's 70 mph,

3:30:47kind of defeats the purpose. But then

3:30:49you just mentioned that you would work

3:30:50with the city to highlight

3:30:53>> Absolutely. If you have an area like I

3:30:55was I was mentioning earlier, we can

3:30:57actually ingest a big portion of your

3:31:00CAD data. So, those calls for service

3:31:02where police officers are being

3:31:03dispatched for drag racing, um

3:31:06we we can literally develop a deployment

3:31:09analysis that we can help locate

3:31:12pinpoint those locations where the max

3:31:15would be most appropriate for

3:31:16installation.

3:31:18Yes, ma'am.

3:31:19>> Okay.

3:31:20Council Member

3:31:22>> Has LPD

3:31:25made an assessment as to

3:31:27where these cameras would be located

3:31:30based on, you know, hotspots or

3:31:32>> Yeah, so we're going to be conducting a

3:31:34data analysis and

3:31:37as to where the hotspots are currently.

3:31:39Once we localize if we want to use

3:31:43obviously

3:31:44we do CompStat monthly, so we have the

3:31:47ability to see where they need to be

3:31:48deployed. We'll probably do some

3:31:50contrast to where we currently have

3:31:52versus where, you know,

3:31:55in conjunction with plate ranger, so

3:31:58we will be focusing on those particular

3:32:01areas, those particular hotspots that we

3:32:03have on the list.

3:32:03>> Is that information that you guys would

3:32:06be able to provide to the council?

3:32:08>> We will be able to

3:32:09provide it to individually, yes.

3:32:12>> Okay. How many cameras is it?

3:32:15>> For the

3:32:16for the pilot, it would be 10.

3:32:18>> And

3:32:19>> Yes.

3:32:20>> Okay. It's really good to know.

3:32:22Um

3:32:25My apologies. My My intention is not for

3:32:27you to repeat yourself cuz I know our

3:32:29Council President did talk on the

3:32:30justification.

3:32:33Is there a drop-down box on that

3:32:34justification which gives you some sort

3:32:37of like options or is it upon the

3:32:41officer to pretty much come up with a

3:32:44justification and

3:32:46>> So, that's going to be Yeah, that's

3:32:47going to be the use policy. That's going

3:32:50to be governed by the department.

3:32:51>> Yes, we're going to be using

3:32:53um

3:32:55>> a similar list of incidents that's going

3:32:57to that's going to be required to be

3:32:59entered.

3:33:00>> Okay.

3:33:01>> So, what is this in reference to? Is it

3:33:03a hit-and-run motor vehicle? Is it a

3:33:05BNE? Is it you know, what was the

3:33:07incident involved in that you're running

3:33:08this? So, there's going to be a list of

3:33:10of criteria you have to meet before you

3:33:11can run.

3:33:12>> And is there a way for um supervisors

3:33:17are able to determine if an officer is

3:33:19not misusing those classifications?

3:33:22>> There is audit features.

3:33:23>> So, it's like, well, I'm doing an

3:33:24investigation on a hit-and-run, but

3:33:25there wasn't and it's just they wanted

3:33:27to search that vehicle for whatever

3:33:30reason.

3:33:30>> Absolutely. There's the audit allows you

3:33:33>> Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, it's fully

3:33:35auditable. So,

3:33:37you know, the agency itself can dictate

3:33:39that policy, how frequently, how often,

3:33:41what they're auditing for,

3:33:43um audited by individual users, logins,

3:33:45plate searches. And then the outcomes

3:33:48feature that I was covering with you

3:33:49guys earlier, I love that because that

3:33:52that like finishes the story, right? You

3:33:54start with the search, why you were

3:33:56searching it, what was the outcome of

3:33:57that search. So, you have that full

3:34:00storyline. There's no break in it all

3:34:02the way from the officer throughout the

3:34:03audit to the outcome.

3:34:05>> Okay.

3:34:06Um I love your dashboard. It it seems

3:34:08pretty cool. Is there So, for one, I'm

3:34:11assuming all officers would have access

3:34:14to that dashboard that we saw?

3:34:15>> Yes.

3:34:16>> And

3:34:17um is there any training required for an

3:34:20officer to understand how to utilize

3:34:23this?

3:34:24>> Well, most dashboards are in two

3:34:25different settings. There's an

3:34:27administrative side as far as setting up

3:34:29credentials and whatnot, and audit

3:34:31features are usually left to the

3:34:33superiors superior officers, and then

3:34:36officers will have the ability to do

3:34:38those conduct those search under those

3:34:39investigations.

3:34:41>> Okay.

3:34:42Um and your presentation was pretty

3:34:44awesome. So there was like questions

3:34:46that I had regarding the accuracy rate

3:34:48and I saw that it was 98% then I was

3:34:51like, "Oh, I wonder how it tests at

3:34:53night time." and then I saw that it was

3:34:55added to your presentation as well. So

3:34:58and then um our Madam Chair did ask good

3:35:00questions regarding altered uh license

3:35:03plates. So

3:35:05I love it. I'm just hoping that this

3:35:07ends up being

3:35:10beneficial

3:35:12specifically for our city cuz our city

3:35:14has I guess uh

3:35:16a unique set of needs

3:35:19um and our officers need the right

3:35:21equipment to tend to those challenges

3:35:24and and phone calls that we get.

3:35:25>> I appreciate that. If I can just real

3:35:27quick. So yeah, it goes back to how I I

3:35:30like to present the technology, right?

3:35:31It's not even really about presenting.

3:35:33It's It's the It's literally how it's

3:35:34built. It's the complete architecture of

3:35:36Plate Ranger. It's

3:35:38our our motto or my motto specifically

3:35:41is like everyone has LPR. Like

3:35:44Flock

3:35:46Leonardo

3:35:47City of Lawrence can go with anybody.

3:35:48There's at the end of the day they all

3:35:50do the same thing.

3:35:52Everyone has LPR. They don't have an LPR

3:35:55system that they can confidently stand

3:35:57behind, right? That they can effectively

3:35:59explain and have that full story line.

3:36:01So it's going to give the city of

3:36:03Lawrence the capability that they depend

3:36:05on to better serve their constituents

3:36:08and then when those questions arise,

3:36:09they have that They have that full

3:36:11visibility, that full transparency that

3:36:14that they can that they can show that

3:36:15they can show the council, that they can

3:36:17show the city that it was responsibly

3:36:19used.

3:36:20Yes, ma'am.

3:36:21>> Um

3:36:23Um I'm sorry. I'm just looking at the

3:36:25[clears throat] MOU.

3:36:27Uh how long is this pilot for again? I'm

3:36:30I thought I saw it.

3:36:31>> 90 days.

3:36:32>> 90 36 3 months. Is that sufficient um on

3:36:36a my

3:36:37determine or

3:36:38>> We can always ask for more

3:36:39>> Considering the training, I'm wondering

3:36:41like

3:36:42by the time an officer gets accustomed

3:36:45with how to use it and then I don't

3:36:47know. I was just wondering if 90 days

3:36:49was sufficient. Um

3:36:51to

3:36:51>> I I

3:36:52>> make a proper assessment.

3:36:54>> I believe the conversation is if in 90

3:36:56days we still need more time, we can

3:36:58always ask for more time.

3:36:59>> Oh, okay. All right.

3:37:02I'm all set.

3:37:04And you I'm going to leave you with a

3:37:05last uh comment. Um

3:37:08And we can talk more about this offline.

3:37:10Sorry, I think I think you have my my

3:37:12number, so you can give me a call

3:37:13tomorrow. But um I think that you should

3:37:17also consider at least one or two

3:37:19non-hot zones to pilot. And um there's a

3:37:23reason why I'm saying that and you and I

3:37:25can have that discussion offline

3:37:27tomorrow or Monday.

3:37:29>> Sure.

3:37:29>> All right, thank you. Any final

3:37:32Motion to send to full council with a

3:37:34favorable recommendation. Do I have to

3:37:37specify the item number?

3:37:38Item 408-26.

3:37:42>> Motion has been made. Is there a second?

3:37:45>> Second.

3:37:46>> Properly seconded. Any further

3:37:48discussion?

3:37:49>> Yeah, I just want to make sure how how

3:37:50are we going to handle this? We got a

3:37:51public hearing on the other thing. We

3:37:53should probably have that prior to this.

3:37:56If we vote for this and then have the

3:37:58public hearing, it's kind of backwards,

3:37:59right?

3:37:59>> Oh, okay.

3:38:01Uh so as a committee report pending the

3:38:03public hearing? Su- submit it up as a

3:38:06committee report pending

3:38:07>> no, no. I I think we need to do that.

3:38:10It's just the timing of how we how we

3:38:12deal with it.

3:38:13>> Councilor Rivera

3:38:15>> I think that um

3:38:18it will um

3:38:19we want to open up the public hearing

3:38:21>> Mhm.

3:38:22>> and then

3:38:23allow people to speak on the technology

3:38:26itself and any other camera system that

3:38:28we have.

3:38:29Uh so while we are at the public hearing

3:38:32and to subsequently be able to discuss

3:38:34this and also

3:38:36be able to they're going to be able to

3:38:38hear out people that have any type of

3:38:41concern if there is any.

3:38:44>> Okay, so there there is already a public

3:38:46hearing on the agenda for next week.

3:38:48Okay.

3:38:49All right.

3:38:49>> So, how should I modify my motion? Just

3:38:51leave it as is? Okay. So, motion was

3:38:54already made and properly

3:38:55>> Seconded.

3:38:57>> Seconded. You asked your question, okay.

3:38:59All those in favor

3:39:00>> say I.

3:39:00>> I.

3:39:01>> I. The eyes have it. Thank you so much,

3:39:03gentlemen. We'll see you next week.

3:39:06Next we have is item 409-26,

3:39:09net metering electricity off-take

3:39:12agreements, 20-year electricity billing

3:39:15credit agreements with 978 Solar

3:39:18Development LLC.

3:39:20NewLeaf

3:39:22Energy brought to us by Simon Pereira,

3:39:24supervisor of energy projects. Simon,

3:39:27you have the floor.

3:39:29>> Good evening, and I'm here with Joe

3:39:31Capadona,

3:39:33Colonial Power, I'm an energy broker.

3:39:37>> Sorry.

3:39:38>> Good evening, Council.

3:39:39>> Yep.

3:39:39>> We are asking the committee to recommend

3:39:41the approval of item 409-26.

3:39:44Under the proposed agreement,

3:39:46approximately 6 million kilowatt hours

3:39:49of net metering credits

3:39:51um, from three different off-site solar

3:39:54projects

3:39:56um, will be allocated to the city

3:39:58accounts, so city energy accounts

3:40:00um, for electricity.

3:40:02Um, the utility applies these credits to

3:40:05city bills, so the credits are going

3:40:07towards bills.

3:40:08Um, and then the city pays NewLeaf 90%

3:40:12of the value,

3:40:13so there's a 10% discount.

3:40:14>> Your mic Your mic is off.

3:40:16>> Oh my god, that whole time?

3:40:18>> Uh, just start again.

3:40:20>> I'm so sorry.

3:40:21>> Here we are.

3:40:23Happy to start again. Um, good evening,

3:40:24Council.

3:40:26Um, we are asking the committee to

3:40:27recommend the approval of item 409-26.

3:40:31Um, under the proposed agreement, about

3:40:3316 million kilowatt hours, which is a

3:40:36unit of electricity,

3:40:38um,

3:40:39of net metering credits from three

3:40:42different offsite solar solar projects

3:40:45will be allocated to city accounts, so

3:40:47city energy, um, specifically

3:40:49electricity accounts.

3:40:51Um, the utility applies these credits to

3:40:52the city bills, and the city pays nearly

3:40:5590% of the value received and retains

3:40:5910% as savings. So, there's a 10%

3:41:01savings, um, discounted to that

3:41:04electricity.

3:41:05And then, the current model projects

3:41:07about,

3:41:08um, just over 400, um, thousand dollars

3:41:11in savings every year, and

3:41:13approximately, um, 10 million over the

3:41:16the term, the initial term of 20 years.

3:41:19So,

3:41:21projected 10 million dollars in savings.

3:41:23And we have Jared sort of, you know,

3:41:26comment more on this, talk about talk a

3:41:28little about things, and then to answer

3:41:29any questions, and I'll be here, as

3:41:31well.

3:41:32>> Yes.

3:41:33>> Thank you.

3:41:34>> Hi, good evening.

3:41:34>> Welcome.

3:41:35>> Uh, Joe Capadona, Colonial Power Group,

3:41:375 Mount Royal Ave, Marlborough. I'm sure

3:41:39you guys remember we were here probably

3:41:414 months ago about a very similar

3:41:44agreement. Unfortunately,

3:41:47um,

3:41:47the market kind of ran and we weren't

3:41:50able to finalize that agreement before

3:41:52it was executed.

3:41:54>> [snorts]

3:41:55>> So, as you guys also will know, um, our

3:41:57main job is aggregation, Colonial Power

3:42:00Group. So, you know, we have a lot of

3:42:02conversations with solar developers, um,

3:42:04battery storage, wind energy committees,

3:42:07so forth and so on. Um, so,

3:42:10this deal was

3:42:12kind of brought before us years in

3:42:15before. So, the 15% wasn't able to get

3:42:18executed, the one that we spoke about 4

3:42:20months ago.

3:42:22But, you know, New Leaf,

3:42:24the developer who we had the agreement

3:42:27with, really wanted to, you know, do

3:42:29right by the city of Lawrence.

3:42:31So, they kind of rework some portfolios.

3:42:33They found three projects that had some

3:42:35capacity available

3:42:38and were able to make this offering for

3:42:41the city of Lawrence.

3:42:42So, it's the contracts have already been

3:42:46vetted by the city attorney. They're the

3:42:47exact same agreements. So forth and so

3:42:50on. We just, you know, want to go

3:42:52through the process

3:42:54again.

3:42:54I'm sure as you you guys all well know

3:42:57that global supply chain

3:42:59and just inflation costs kind of

3:43:02have blown markets out of proportion.

3:43:05>> And we are still able to capture a lot

3:43:06of and despite the discount rate coming

3:43:08down, we were able to add extra

3:43:10electricity

3:43:12accounts basically to increase the

3:43:14amount of

3:43:15energy being saved so that we could

3:43:17still see roughly comparable savings.

3:43:19So, basically, the discount rate on said

3:43:22energy came down, but we were able to up

3:43:24the amount of energy that we could sort

3:43:26of apply the discount to to see, you

3:43:28know,

3:43:30uh favor super favorable savings over

3:43:32the course of the term and then also

3:43:35it's still is a very strong deal.

3:43:37Um

3:43:37>> Go over the lunches.

3:43:39>> How's positive?

3:43:40>> Yeah, yes yes uh just give us some

3:43:42context as of

3:43:43what was the discussion before. We I

3:43:46know that

3:43:47uh we were talking about the 15%

3:43:48discount that it was going to be

3:43:51towards the customer.

3:43:53Or towards the city bills.

3:43:55>> The city accounts. The city accounts.

3:43:57Yes, that's

3:43:58>> So, now we that fall off.

3:44:01Uh and now we have another three

3:44:03external project external project that

3:44:06we're going to be able to have some

3:44:08savings

3:44:09>> Yes.

3:44:09>> on that. And uh what is the difference

3:44:11between the two agreements?

3:44:13>> So, the first agreement

3:44:14>> and when it comes to saving.

3:44:16>> So, the the savings is uh the

3:44:18difference. The first

3:44:20agreement was about 12 million in

3:44:22savings, and this one is about 11. So, a

3:44:24difference of about $1 million.

3:44:27>> And time frame?

3:44:28>> Um

3:44:30within 2027, these projects are expected

3:44:32to be built.

3:44:34>> No, I mean uh the the saving expected

3:44:37expect I mean I expected amount of time.

3:44:40So, is that 11 million going to be over

3:44:4220 years? And the 15% it was going to be

3:44:45over 20 years as well?

3:44:46>> Yes. And about

3:44:48a little or over $400,000 a year for 20

3:44:51years. And then uh I in the contract, I

3:44:53believe there's a also extensions if the

3:44:56city wants to engage in them 5 or 10

3:44:58years, they can extend it.

3:44:59>> when it comes to the

3:45:01the rate

3:45:03what was the difference?

3:45:06>> So, this

3:45:07>> This doesn't have anything to do with uh

3:45:09the rate. Um this is

3:45:12The relationship with the utility

3:45:14remains exactly the same. Um the the

3:45:16city is still

3:45:18getting billed for the delivery and the

3:45:19supply. Uh

3:45:21the credits are just essentially going

3:45:22to pay for that bill, and then the city

3:45:25will get a bill from NewLeaf for 90% of

3:45:28that. So,

3:45:29it doesn't affect the supply rate or um

3:45:32the delivery rate at all.

3:45:35>> Okay. And then uh

3:45:41I I I'll

3:45:42I'll I'll ask more questions next week.

3:45:45>> Okay.

3:45:48>> I have a question, actually. Attorney

3:45:50Hooten,

3:45:51has your office reviewed this

3:45:5430-page 20-year contract?

3:45:5831-page 20-year contract.

3:46:01>> I have not.

3:46:03>> Okay.

3:46:03>> This is This is uh I believe you have.

3:46:05These um

3:46:07A- A- Neil A- Neil would have sent these

3:46:09over to you. Um he he told me that they

3:46:11were reviewed by you.

3:46:13Um

3:46:14>> I I don't have I didn't come in this

3:46:16issue, so I don't even see the

3:46:17documents, but

3:46:18>> Okay.

3:46:19Um

3:46:21Yeah, we we can

3:46:23>> Let's send it over.

3:46:23>> resend them to you, but but to my

3:46:26knowledge you have seen these. And then

3:46:27they're the

3:46:28basically the exact same agreements

3:46:30um as the the last um agreement signed

3:46:34for for the prior deal.

3:46:36>> Okay. So, can we get this over to the

3:46:39city attorney's office so that we can

3:46:41have

3:46:42a letter from the city attorney

3:46:45um just ensuring that he reviewed it and

3:46:47or someone, you know, we have two

3:46:49assistant city attorneys or someone from

3:46:50his office reviewed it to make sure that

3:46:53we are covered the city and cuz you

3:46:56never know this is a 20-year contract,

3:46:58so you never know what can happen.

3:47:00Attorney does that sound good to you?

3:47:02>> That's fine. I'll take a look and if if

3:47:04I have reviewed it up once I see it,

3:47:06I'll let you know.

3:47:06>> Okay, thank you.

3:47:08Any other comments or questions?

3:47:12Councilor De Parte?

3:47:13>> Has the CAFO looked at this as well and

3:47:15that

3:47:15>> The the CAFO is with us. Um

3:47:18Uh CAFO Sabajos?

3:47:21>> Yes, I'm here. Good evening, councilors.

3:47:23>> Good evening, Councilor De Parte.

3:47:25>> Yeah, just are you are you familiar uh

3:47:28with the um with the proposal and uh

3:47:32agree with the amount of money that the

3:47:34city would be accruing?

3:47:37>> Yes, so I did review the um

3:47:40presentation with Anil

3:47:43and it sounds like a great opportunity

3:47:45for the city in terms of savings. Um so,

3:47:48that's something we can work with the

3:47:49schools in terms of maybe looking into

3:47:53hiring a person that would be managing

3:47:55the uh utility bills

3:47:57and benefit from these credits.

3:48:03>> Okay. So, the CAFO seems to have no

3:48:05problems with it. City attorney

3:48:08will take a look at it or

3:48:10double check to make sure that that

3:48:12that's that our and just to confirm Mr.

3:48:15Pierre just we're all in this together

3:48:17here but

3:48:18that our our interests are being served.

3:48:21I have a just an odd question.

3:48:25Here's a left field question.

3:48:27Why was this picture taken or chosen to

3:48:30be on there?

3:48:34That is Sacred Heart Church in Lawrence

3:48:36which is a kind of an odd thing to pull

3:48:38out and put on your present that and

3:48:39somebody's presentation.

3:48:42>> And and Neil was the one who drafted

3:48:43that so you'll have to refer the

3:48:44question to him.

3:48:45>> Okay.

3:48:46>> I thought it was pretty.

3:48:47>> It is a pretty building. Okay.

3:48:48[laughter]

3:48:50>> I I don't see any like

3:48:52religious

3:48:52>> I happen to be a parishioner there and

3:48:54it just seemed a little odd that that

3:48:55way a certain church would happen to be

3:48:58featured as part of the briefing

3:49:00presentation. That's all.

3:49:01>> I grew up going to that church also and

3:49:03>> Okay.

3:49:04>> But I think that relates to this project

3:49:06so I don't know.

3:49:06>> Okay.

3:49:07And the last thing I don't have much

3:49:08comment I I be candid with you it

3:49:12the city attorney's fine. We're saving

3:49:14money.

3:49:16I it it's we're getting a Mr. Pierre

3:49:19you're you're saying this is a

3:49:20good a good deal for our city and I

3:49:24I am not an expert in this and it this

3:49:29this is language that I it is unfamiliar

3:49:32to me so I'd have to kind of learn the

3:49:34language and learn the dynamics a little

3:49:35bit even though I know you try to

3:49:37somebody try to dumb it down with some

3:49:38nice pictures and stuff. So anyway that

3:49:41and one last thing Madam Chair this it

3:49:43is now

3:49:46later it's 9:47.

3:49:48Uh today's Thursday it's been a full

3:49:50day. Mr. Pierre I just want to thank you

3:49:52for and for all the other city employees

3:49:54who are here late this evening time out

3:49:56of your day to to come here and to

3:49:58explain this to us it's we're asking an

3:50:00awful lot of you you have family. You've

3:50:02been here since what time? Have you been

3:50:03here today?

3:50:04>> 8:30.

3:50:05>> You've been here since 8:30 in the

3:50:05morning. So, uh it's been a long day.

3:50:07And so, I just want to I want to

3:50:09acknowledge that and thank you uh for

3:50:12for hanging in there and and uh doing

3:50:14this presentation tonight. Thank you.

3:50:16>> I appreciate that. Thank you.

3:50:17>> Um one thing um Council, can you also

3:50:20include a letter um from yourself uh for

3:50:24the full Council next week?

3:50:27>> Absolutely.

3:50:28>> Thank you.

3:50:29>> I will entertain a motion.

3:50:33>> I will send

3:50:34>> I will send a letter.

3:50:38>> Motion to send item 409-26 as a

3:50:41committee report to the full Council.

3:50:44>> Pending pending

3:50:46pending letter from the city attorney

3:50:48and our Council.

3:50:51>> Seconded by Council President. Any

3:50:53further questions or

3:50:55comments?

3:50:57Seeing none, all those in favor say I.

3:50:59>> I.

3:51:00>> All right. Thank you. Thank you so much,

3:51:01gentlemen.

3:51:02>> No, thank you. Have a great day.

3:51:03>> We'll come back with the reports. Thank

3:51:04you.

3:51:04>> Thank you.

3:51:05>> Thank you.

3:51:05>> Um item 410-26

3:51:08transfer of funds in the amount of

3:51:10$2,000

3:51:12from legal from the legal services

3:51:15account

3:51:17to the claims account brought to us by

3:51:20Attorney Huen. Attorney, you have the

3:51:21floor.

3:51:23>> Um this is just a housekeeping matter.

3:51:25Uh claims is where we pay like pothole

3:51:27claims or if somebody's window is broken

3:51:30by a uh DPW worker using a whipper. Uh

3:51:33we just paid out a couple of claims, so

3:51:35I'm just looking to refresh that money.

3:51:38>> All right. Any questions or comments for

3:51:40Attorney Huen?

3:51:41>> I'll make a motion we send it to the

3:51:42full Council with a favorable

3:51:43recommendation.

3:51:44>> Motion has been made by the Council

3:51:45President, seconded by the Vice Chair.

3:51:47Any discussion?

3:51:49Seeing none, all those in favor say I.

3:51:51>> I.

3:51:52>> I.

3:51:53>> I.

3:51:54>> [laughter]

3:51:56>> Thank you.

3:51:57>> Thank you very much.

3:51:58>> All right. So, I thought we were going

3:52:05Is Mr. Hooton is this Mr. Hooton still

3:52:06with us here?

3:52:07>> Mr. Hooton Attorney Hooton and our

3:52:09council are still with us. I'm assuming

3:52:11it's for this item.

3:52:13Uh can I have a

3:52:14motion to untable item 389-26

3:52:18home rule petition for credible service

3:52:20for six of our firefighters?

3:52:24380 383-26

3:52:27>> So I'll second.

3:52:29>> Motion has been made by Council Clark

3:52:30seconded by Council Larmo. All those in

3:52:33favor

3:52:33>> Aye.

3:52:34>> Aye.

3:52:34>> Aye.

3:52:36>> Okay, so we do have the union

3:52:39representatives here with us tonight. Um

3:52:41Attorney Hooton the last time we we left

3:52:44off um

3:52:45this discussion wanting to see a

3:52:48comparison as to how it would look

3:52:52um if the city paid

3:52:56paid for the credible service um

3:52:58compared to

3:53:00the individuals paying

3:53:02their portion. I mean and you also did

3:53:06provide us with the language but can you

3:53:08just walk walk us through this?

3:53:12>> Okay, just so you know that um

3:53:14your your video is is faded out and I

3:53:18got about every fourth word so hopefully

3:53:20you can understand me when I'm speaking.

3:53:22Um the

3:53:25What I was asked to do was to take this

3:53:28uh which was a a request for a home rule

3:53:30petition uh to grant uh

3:53:33um some additional time uh

3:53:36for services provided uh for these

3:53:39gentlemen and I was asked to do it in

3:53:41two forms. One is if the city picked up

3:53:43the the ba- the balance of it and the

3:53:46other one is if the individuals picked

3:53:48up the balance for it. And as you can

3:53:50see the amount would be about $22,000

3:53:54per person of the six people. That money

3:53:57would have to be paid after um the

3:54:00legislature approved it uh because

3:54:02that's the discounted amount. It's not

3:54:05the amount over the length of the uh the

3:54:07time. It's It's the upfront cost

3:54:10uh which I believe comes to about

3:54:11$133,000.

3:54:13So, uh that's what I was asked to do.

3:54:15That's what I did. So, you have two

3:54:17different forms and you can pick each

3:54:19either one if you wish.

3:54:22>> Thank you. Just to be exact, it is

3:54:24$133,000

3:54:26$300

3:54:28in total for the

3:54:31upfront cost. Um Capital,

3:54:34I'm sorry, per per person.

3:54:37I mean, yeah, by by six. Yeah, total.

3:54:40Um Capital, you are here with us

3:54:43tonight. There were some questions uh

3:54:45pertaining to the finances from the city

3:54:48side. Is there anything that you would

3:54:49like to add?

3:54:50Aside from what we just heard.

3:54:53>> Uh no. So, basically, we have the

3:54:54actuaries KMS provided uh the actuary

3:54:58actuarial present cost of present value

3:55:01of these benefits, which you just

3:55:03mentioned, $133,300.

3:55:06So, it's uh I believe you the council

3:55:09has all the information you need to make

3:55:12a decision on this matter.

3:55:15>> Thank you. Any questions or comments?

3:55:17Councilor Lefranc.

3:55:18>> You know, when the other the other day

3:55:20we had a a long discussion regarding uh

3:55:24another home rule petition. I don't want

3:55:26to go into all the details

3:55:28of that for a

3:55:30police officer that that was killed. Um

3:55:34and one of the things that came up

3:55:37during that discussion was the unfunded

3:55:41obligations for the city.

3:55:43And I I don't want to put a number out

3:55:46there, so I want if you [snorts] have a

3:55:49number

3:55:50could we could you please inform us as

3:55:53to what our unfunded obligations are? I

3:55:55know that's supposed to be down to zero

3:55:57in 10 years, but what is it today?

3:56:00>> It's about 197 million dollars.

3:56:04>> I'm so glad you said that cuz that's

3:56:06what I said that night and I thought

3:56:07that was right and I did say that. So,

3:56:09okay. So, it's 197 million dollars of

3:56:12unfunded obligations that we have to pay

3:56:14down in essentially 10 years. That's a

3:56:16lot of money that's coming out of our

3:56:17pockets. I if I understand that

3:56:19correctly, we have to fund that money.

3:56:22Um and we can talk about whether I'm

3:56:24going to kick the can down the road. We

3:56:25can talk about that. If that's going to

3:56:27be a hard 10 years,

3:56:29who knows, right? But right now as it

3:56:30stands, we have 197.

3:56:33So,

3:56:34um

3:56:36the the 22216 is per person. That sounds

3:56:39like an awful lot of money, but

3:56:42um

3:56:44my my

3:56:46my sense is that

3:56:49um

3:56:50if if these individuals are able to get

3:56:53into the system,

3:56:55will that essentially be paying itself

3:56:57off over time? Is this more of an

3:56:59investment of money? Do we have any kind

3:57:01of

3:57:02I mean, I guess it all depends on how

3:57:05long people live and all that, of

3:57:06course, but do we have a sense as to how

3:57:09how

3:57:10what the benefit would be for for the

3:57:12firefighters if they opt in and they do

3:57:14pay this money?

3:57:19>> Is that a question for the council?

3:57:20>> It would be a question whoever is

3:57:22knowledgeable. I I I it's kind of a a

3:57:25retirement pension question, so it may

3:57:27be unfair to the council. Uh but she she

3:57:30might have the answer.

3:57:31>> understanding they're purchasing an

3:57:32additional 22 to 24 months of service.

3:57:35>> Mhm.

3:57:38So, 22 to 24 months. Okay.

3:57:42>> So, if

3:57:43comes up, I may I think it's really up

3:57:45to the individual firefighters to see

3:57:46whether it's worth it for them.

3:57:49And the numbers can't be explained

3:57:51because I we have no idea whether any of

3:57:53these firefighters are going to work 20,

3:57:5530 years.

3:57:58What's their highest rate of pay? What

3:58:00are they going to get back in retirement

3:58:01benefits? All those are undetermined.

3:58:03What this does is, you know, allows them

3:58:07that instead of let's say they retired

3:58:09at say and got the benefits for 23

3:58:11years, they now get the benefits for 25

3:58:14years, which is a greater percentage and

3:58:16a greater payment over the length of the

3:58:18retirement.

3:58:21>> At their high I would imagine at their

3:58:22high 3 years that the or 5 depending on

3:58:24when they get hired, right? That's I

3:58:26don't

3:58:27I believe that's what the retirement

3:58:28package is at high 3 years for for fire.

3:58:31>> Yeah, typically a best three and and I

3:58:33can assist with that question. So,

3:58:35counselors, just good evening and thanks

3:58:37for taking the time to meet. So, Jeff

3:58:39Martin, Local 146 Lawrence Firefighters

3:58:41Union president. I'm joined here by Jose

3:58:43Abreu, uh vice president of Local 146.

3:58:46If we want, I can give kind of a brief

3:58:48synopsis, not like the other week, on

3:58:50why we're here and and why we're here

3:58:52today.

3:58:53Uh if that would be beneficial and then

3:58:55I can kind of touch on some of those um

3:58:58items and the CFO knows better than me.

3:59:00She's better with the numbers on kind of

3:59:02how the retirement board through that

3:59:04third party got to some of those

3:59:07numbers.

3:59:08So, I I again, we're here to kind of

3:59:11just clarify the circumstances around

3:59:13members that uh include six of our uh

3:59:16from the local to that point, 22 to 24

3:59:19months. So, Firefighter Shane Battle,

3:59:22Francis Trinidad, Jose Perez, Paul King,

3:59:25Dio Blanco, and Mike Romano

3:59:27were unaware at some point when they got

3:59:30appointed and put on this reserve list

3:59:32that the Commonwealth would again amend

3:59:34and change a Mass General Law or a

3:59:37statute that would directly affect this

3:59:39credible time.

3:59:40So, that's why we're here today.

3:59:42Everyone that came before them.

3:59:44Um so, there is significant past

3:59:47practice here, whether it was police or

3:59:49fire. Uh

3:59:51they did get their reserve time and they

3:59:53also did not have to pay. So, they got

3:59:55their years of service and did not have

3:59:57to pay.

3:59:58Um with that, they now are uh 15 years

4:00:02in, so they're about halfway through

4:00:03their uh respective careers. So, we're

4:00:05not talking

4:00:07um about a decade's length of time of

4:00:10being on a reserve list. We're talking

4:00:12that time frame of up to 2 years and

4:00:15then obviously this got tabled um I

4:00:18believe on September 22nd and we're now

4:00:21talking on it. Those numbers that you

4:00:23guys that uh Attorney Hooton just

4:00:26provided to you, if if the city were to

4:00:29pay, it is it's it's $133,300,

4:00:35$133,302.

4:00:36That would be the total cost

4:00:38of the city.

4:00:40It's my understanding and the retirement

4:00:43board director, Gina, would be able to

4:00:45speak on this more at length, is that

4:00:48number would continue to grow the longer

4:00:49that this waits. So, there is some

4:00:52benefit to the city in terms of paying

4:00:54and paying,

4:00:55you know, soon uh sooner as opposed to

4:00:58later.

4:00:59Um the individual and again, thanks Tim

4:01:02for doing the work there and getting

4:01:03back to me, um cost is that $22,216,

4:01:08which is a significant lump sum for an

4:01:11individual to pay

4:01:13uh on an already established reserve

4:01:14list that was

4:01:16no fault of their own um

4:01:18that the law changed during the time

4:01:20frame that they were on it.

4:01:23We're

4:01:26>> Council President.

4:01:27>> So, uh through you, I want to chair.

4:01:29So, um last discussion was around

4:01:33whether or not uh

4:01:36will the the the council will approve

4:01:40uh a

4:01:41home rule petition similar

4:01:45to

4:01:46to what

4:01:49was approved in the past.

4:01:51Uh and

4:01:53one of the biggest factor

4:01:55of that is that that that individual

4:01:58that was

4:01:59uh

4:02:01uh

4:02:02on the positive vote

4:02:04for the home rule petition

4:02:06pay for the service.

4:02:08And and the argument around that was to

4:02:13be fair

4:02:14and keep it a system. So, the question

4:02:16will be is the firefighter willing to

4:02:19pay for

4:02:20uh for this credible time of about up to

4:02:242 years.

4:02:25And if he pays, it will be about

4:02:27$22,000.

4:02:28>> Yeah, and I'm here on behalf of the

4:02:31local representing those six members to

4:02:33to advocate that the city does pay. Um

4:02:36with that, I think that's

4:02:37>> So, that means Hold on a second. That

4:02:39means that no, the members are not

4:02:41willing to pay. The city will pick pick

4:02:43up the money.

4:02:44>> to Mr. Hooton's point when we tabled

4:02:46this the last budget and finance

4:02:48meeting, it was

4:02:50under my impression that we were going

4:02:51to have kind of an option A and an

4:02:52option B. And ideally, I'd like to go

4:02:55with option A. We we would entertain

4:02:57both on the table.

4:02:59So,

4:03:01I think that if we're relating this to

4:03:03the

4:03:05the last time that this came up in this

4:03:08room in regards to Lawrence Police

4:03:11Department, in my opinion, they're not

4:03:14the same. So, this is more narrowly

4:03:17focused on six of our members on a

4:03:20reserve list for the Lawrence Fire

4:03:22Department and not an outside agency

4:03:26um or another department. So,

4:03:29to me it's it's not the same. There is

4:03:33some historic value in kind of how, um,

4:03:36this came about. The six firefighters on

4:03:39this list are kind of defined in that

4:03:42group. They're not a new class of

4:03:44employees. This isn't something new.

4:03:46Um, and it's something in years past

4:03:48members did not have to buy back.

4:03:51>> So, our question would be, uh,

4:03:54So, it was different because the person

4:03:57the previous case, it was not a a served

4:04:00to the city of Lawrence, and this is is

4:04:03different because this person these

4:04:05people serve the city of Lawrence. Tell

4:04:08me, what is a called reserve

4:04:09firefighter?

4:04:11>> So, a reserve firefighter list is

4:04:13something that, uh, we no longer have

4:04:15and actually from this date that they

4:04:17got put on. So, um,

4:04:20what this does, it's it's really not an

4:04:24unprecedented

4:04:25concept uh, concept really. It's not

4:04:29just simply put on a list. It's they

4:04:31were appointed and placed on this list

4:04:34and signed onto it, which created their

4:04:36start time, which by Mass General Laws,

4:04:39everything was consistent and by the

4:04:41books.

4:04:42So, that was an established reserve

4:04:44list. The they remained eligible and

4:04:47assign uh, for assignment during that

4:04:49whole time. So, again, it's similar to

4:04:52what you guys have dealt with in the

4:04:54past, but it's not the same. So,

4:04:57Mass General Law has recognized this

4:04:59type of reserve firefighter service and

4:05:00this list to constitute as credible

4:05:03service. This is Mass General Law. So,

4:05:05our request this time around is very,

4:05:08again, limited in

4:05:09>> Yeah, but I mean, I'm not asking that.

4:05:11>> Mhm.

4:05:12>> I My question was just simple. What is a

4:05:15reserve a called reserve firefighter?

4:05:18>> So, okay.

4:05:18>> Motion to pass time.

4:05:20>> Second.

4:05:20>> Second. Motion has been made by Council

4:05:23second by the Vice Chair. All those in

4:05:24favor say I.

4:05:25>> I.

4:05:26>> I, the eyes have it.

4:05:28>> Mhm. Yeah.

4:05:30So,

4:05:32a reserve list they got

4:05:34put on to in anticipation of becoming

4:05:38appointed as a full-time professional

4:05:40firefighter.

4:05:42>> So, if I understand correctly,

4:05:45they got a job offer.

4:05:48>> They are put on a list.

4:05:50>> Yeah.

4:05:50>> Yes. They They put them on a list and

4:05:52the city perhaps says

4:05:54uh multiple circumstances

4:05:57could happen, but let's say one of them.

4:05:59We don't have the money right now.

4:06:02Eventually, when you got the money,

4:06:04you're going to get hired.

4:06:06Am Are we We agree on those points?

4:06:08>> assessment. When they When they got put

4:06:09on this list, they wouldn't know if they

4:06:10were going to get hired next week or or

4:06:1210 years.

4:06:13>> So,

4:06:14so we we agree on that.

4:06:15>> Yeah.

4:06:16>> So, and then

4:06:18a couple of them were called back 22

4:06:21months later.

4:06:23And then one of them was called back 2

4:06:25years later, 24 months later.

4:06:27>> Correct.

4:06:27>> Correct.

4:06:28>> Yeah.

4:06:28>> So, we agree on that.

4:06:29Um

4:06:31during that time,

4:06:33it was not like they were waiting just

4:06:35home, like waiting for this phone call.

4:06:37They were They were working, right?

4:06:39>> I would imagine that.

4:06:40>> Yeah. And then also

4:06:42uh there is There is also a a

4:06:46a

4:06:48a presumption that the state changed

4:06:50that law

4:06:52for a specific reason that we don't

4:06:53know. Do you have any contacts on that?

4:06:55>> I do not have any contacts of

4:06:57>> As of why the state

4:06:58>> Mass General Law

4:06:59>> Yeah. Change.

4:07:02Um

4:07:04So,

4:07:05I mean, I think that if if I mean uh I

4:07:08haven't

4:07:10discussed this to any uh or have a

4:07:13conversation to any individual

4:07:14counselors, but I mean, I feel like that

4:07:17uh based on the based on the

4:07:20uh

4:07:20how the discussion went last time,

4:07:23I wasn't here present. I was

4:07:25on Zoom,

4:07:26but I feel like the

4:07:28you know,

4:07:31it could be that this is this can be

4:07:33done if the firefighters have to pay for

4:07:36the services.

4:07:38Uh

4:07:38but I mean, I hear that you guys prefer

4:07:41to go with the version one, which is the

4:07:43city pick up the tab, and therefore,

4:07:46uh

4:07:49the city won't be able to pay right

4:07:51away.

4:07:52And this amount of money will be about

4:07:55almost $200,000

4:07:57if we pay between now

4:07:59and

4:08:00and 2036. [clears throat]

4:08:03So, uh

4:08:05I don't know. I mean,

4:08:07that's that's basically

4:08:10um

4:08:13how I see how I see the the conversation

4:08:15going.

4:08:18>> Good.

4:08:19>> I have a few comments to make. Um

4:08:23Firstly, hearing that you know, the

4:08:25conversation between the firefighter

4:08:28union president and council president,

4:08:31making statements like now we have

4:08:32identified the firefighters and this is

4:08:35for Lawrence and then the fire

4:08:36department and whatever, basically

4:08:40belittles the work that I tried to do 2

4:08:42years ago, 3 years ago, because I did

4:08:45include the six these six firefighters.

4:08:47So, it's not like no work was made or

4:08:50that no effort was made to include these

4:08:52six firefighters. Secondly,

4:08:55last um

4:08:57last uh meeting, we had a conversation

4:09:00and again,

4:09:01I'm going to make the the disclaimer

4:09:03like I did last time,

4:09:05we will agree to disagree, but the MBTA,

4:09:08imagine the MBTA closing down the

4:09:11Haverhill line, and how many hundreds of

4:09:15Law- Lawrecians will be affected. So,

4:09:17yes, it is a valuable service to the

4:09:20city.

4:09:21Um secondly,

4:09:23um these were fire fighters. I mean, we

4:09:27we keep going back to an individual or

4:09:30not connecting to Lawrence,

4:09:32um but we're talking about individuals

4:09:33that were put on the reserve list that

4:09:35also at that time weren't servicing the

4:09:37city of Lawrence. They were elected or

4:09:39or selected to become fire fighters were

4:09:42put on the list, but they weren't

4:09:44actively serving either. So, we want to

4:09:46make that comparison. I think that's a

4:09:48similar comparison. And lastly, what I

4:09:51don't like a second uh well, the first

4:09:53one what I don't like is you belittling

4:09:56my my previous work, but sec- secondly,

4:09:59I don't like that it keeps going back to

4:10:01the same individual.

4:10:03Um

4:10:04and now I'm seeing that

4:10:07the re- part of the reason aside

4:10:09financially that perhaps this didn't

4:10:11pass or go through before is because of

4:10:14one individual, and that's not fair. I

4:10:16keep hearing that um indirectly within

4:10:19these discussions. Um

4:10:23my

4:10:24my honest

4:10:27um efforts I wanted to see all of this

4:10:30for everyone across the board cuz I

4:10:32thought that they deserved it, but now

4:10:35how how this is coming about, I'm not

4:10:37happy about it whatsoever.

4:10:39>> So,

4:10:40can I speak on that?

4:10:42So, again, if if

4:10:46I did not come here tonight or the

4:10:49previous time

4:10:50uh to speak at 10:00 at night to

4:10:52belittle anybody. So,

4:10:55we can

4:10:56if that is what you are

4:10:59under the assumption, that is a

4:11:01miscommunication at best. I what I am

4:11:04trying to present here is completely

4:11:06objective and not subjective at all.

4:11:11With that,

4:11:13you keep saying I I mentioned an

4:11:14individual. When I mention these

4:11:17individuals, I mentioned all six.

4:11:19So, I I I I can't attest to that. I

4:11:22will, again, use my terms, agree to

4:11:25disagree that there are similarities

4:11:28with the MBTA,

4:11:30but this is different. That's my

4:11:33personal opinion.

4:11:35Um

4:11:36so, again,

4:11:37I want to be crystal clear on that.

4:11:40I'm not up here to belittle anybody.

4:11:42>> Thank you.

4:11:42>> here to advocate for our members.

4:11:44>> Thank you for that clarification. Um my

4:11:47other question to you is

4:11:49another issue that I had last meeting

4:11:51was this change of statue that the

4:11:54retirement board never bothered to

4:11:56mention 3 years ago, 2 years ago, but

4:11:58now all of a sudden this this is the the

4:12:01the the foundation or the or the the

4:12:04primary um

4:12:06uh

4:12:08reason behind it. So, how did you guys

4:12:11get to this to that point? How how how

4:12:14were you able to find this out? Because

4:12:16they didn't provide that information to

4:12:18us the first time.

4:12:18>> Again,

4:12:21I wasn't here in 2024 when that issue

4:12:24was being first addressed, which I I

4:12:25know you know, but all I did was simply

4:12:27ask. So, when I went to the retirement

4:12:29board and spoke to the director, um they

4:12:32have made the same, if not very similar,

4:12:35statements

4:12:36with most recently the Lawrence Police

4:12:39Department in years past regarding

4:12:42retirement time, incredible service, and

4:12:45how she goes about that. Now, with that,

4:12:48again, I would say that my dealings with

4:12:50the retirement board have been very very

4:12:53objective. So, we we simply sat down

4:12:56with the retirement board director, and

4:12:59we We some of those facts,

4:13:01and to our credit and some of that hard

4:13:04work, I think this time around it is

4:13:08again more laser-focused on our members

4:13:11and not outside

4:13:13entities.

4:13:21>> Any other questions or comments?

4:13:23>> I just want to make one distinction.

4:13:25So,

4:13:27uh if these home rule petitions go

4:13:30through, either or,

4:13:33um

4:13:35let's say perhaps that

4:13:39option two

4:13:41or version two goes through, which is

4:13:43also including the payment

4:13:45of the amount,

4:13:47uh

4:13:49if those individual,

4:13:53let's say

4:13:54two of them agreed to buy out the time,

4:13:58that will be the doable, and then the

4:14:01other

4:14:02the other remaining

4:14:04they not going to be able to

4:14:06uh unless they get

4:14:08uh

4:14:09they pay the amount. That could be done

4:14:13uh

4:14:14from here until they retire.

4:14:16So,

4:14:18it could be

4:14:19not necessarily right away, but the

4:14:21amount

4:14:23uh

4:14:24due to the fact that they integrating on

4:14:26a specific amount into the home rule

4:14:27petition,

4:14:29uh

4:14:29that amount, I think it it might change

4:14:32over the years.

4:14:34>> So, I I'll even backtrack. We're we're

4:14:36in agreement um with the Mass General

4:14:39Law, both both the council and the

4:14:41union. So, we agree that they should get

4:14:44their time back, and now we're at that

4:14:45point with saying how should the payment

4:14:48be go about from here.

4:14:50Again, back to option one, the city,

4:14:52option two, the individual. The

4:14:54individuals right we we could work with

4:14:57to entertain that payment. Um

4:15:00>> So, go hold on hold on

4:15:02before you continue on that.

4:15:04You say that um

4:15:08it the sense is that we agree upon

4:15:11that, but we we the city council have

4:15:13never voted

4:15:14on either or. So, I just want to make

4:15:16sure like if members are one of those

4:15:18members are seeing uh this discussion

4:15:20that that they will I just want to be

4:15:22fully transparent we haven't take a

4:15:24vote. But, the sense is like

4:15:26we might be on the agreement of that

4:15:28because nobody have take a position or a

4:15:31vote

4:15:33on on any one of those of those two

4:15:36positions. It could be that there is

4:15:37councilors

4:15:38uh that at some point even though uh it

4:15:41could be it could be that they vote

4:15:44on

4:15:46it could no on either one of those two

4:15:48versions.

4:15:49So, we don't know, but it the sense is

4:15:52like

4:15:54presumably right, we agree.

4:15:56>> So, yeah,

4:15:57the principle of it, right, I I

4:16:00feel like we are in agreement with until

4:16:02we get that vote uh officially and we're

4:16:05deciding on the payment.

4:16:07So.

4:16:08Um listen, I I I want to come here and

4:16:10just say

4:16:11what we're doing here tonight it has

4:16:13been done before. Most recently it has

4:16:16been done in Revere, Mass. uh with the

4:16:19fire department and real recently in the

4:16:22last month plus it's been done in the

4:16:24Salem, Mass. fire department. So, coming

4:16:28in front of you guys in front of the

4:16:29committee uh to untable and discuss this

4:16:31issue with the intent of getting a

4:16:33favorable uh recommendation to full

4:16:35council is our goal. From there, it

4:16:39still has a lengthy process it has to

4:16:41go. It has to get voted on and pass. Uh

4:16:43the petition is the best avenue the home

4:16:46rule petition is the best avenue to

4:16:48um see this through, but it it will

4:16:51eventually, if it goes through the

4:16:52process, end up at the state house where

4:16:55they would have to again make a decision

4:16:57here. So, I think just by coming in

4:17:00front of you and wrecking

4:17:02recognizing this time, it acknowledges

4:17:05that these members members were hired in

4:17:08a consistent manner.

4:17:10Um

4:17:11And again, back to those two payment

4:17:13options options in the home rule

4:17:14petition itself, that is ultimately

4:17:17going to be the decision of yourself and

4:17:20the council.

4:17:39>> I Last meeting, I made myself clear. Um

4:17:42the council was very hard on me as a

4:17:45sponsor about credible service. Um when

4:17:48I did bring this up as a package and

4:17:50ultimately ended up passing because

4:17:53one individual came to me and said,

4:17:56"Hey, you know what? I still want to try

4:17:58and I'm willing to pay for it." Um and

4:18:00then that's how it ended up moving along

4:18:02through the council. So,

4:18:04if that was what I went through as a

4:18:06sponsor, I'm I'm looking to keep the

4:18:09process the same because like I

4:18:10mentioned,

4:18:12I'm I'm going with version one. Version

4:18:15two is the one.

4:18:19I'm sorry. Yes, it's version two.

4:18:37So, I recommend that we

4:18:43>> I'll make a motion to send version two

4:18:46to the full council,

4:18:48as a committee report.

4:18:50Obviously, the council can pull

4:18:53version one if they decide to.

4:18:57Huh? Or amended, which is basically just

4:18:59deleting one one section.

4:19:02As

4:19:04>> Committee report, table that.

4:19:06>> Committee report.

4:19:09That way we just leave it open for

4:19:10discussion.

4:19:13>> Motion has been made been made to set up

4:19:14as a committee report, seconded by the

4:19:16vice chair. Any further discussion on

4:19:18the matter?

4:19:18>> Version two.

4:19:19>> Of version two, yes.

4:19:23Seeing none, all those in favor say I.

4:19:26I. The I's have it.

4:19:29Thank you so much, gentlemen.

4:19:30>> Thank you.

4:19:35>> At this point, councilors, can I please

4:19:37have a motion to adjourn? So moved.

4:19:40>> Sure, yes, of course.

4:19:41>> Motion has been made,

4:19:42seconded seconded by

4:19:46councilor Platt.

4:19:48>> You know my god was that.

4:19:49>> [laughter]

4:19:49>> All those in favor say I.

4:19:51>> I.

4:19:52>> I. The I's have it.

4:19:54>> I don't know if that really did

4:19:55anything.

4:19:56>> Hm?