2026-09-23 - Housing and Economic Development Committee

09:45Good evening everyone. This is the

09:47Housing and Economic Development

09:48Committee. Uh today is Wednesday,

09:50September 23rd, 2026. It is

09:53approximately 6:39 p.m. Note, this

09:56meeting is also being conducted as a

09:58hybrid meeting. You may remotely access

10:01the meeting through the digital

10:02platforms such as our Facebook Lawren

10:04City Council page and YouTube Lawren

10:06City Council page.

10:08Voting members present today to my right

10:11is our uh counselor from District F,

10:14Mark Lant. And via online is our council

10:17president and counselor at large, Joanni

10:19Rodriguez. Please note um counselor

10:22Franklin Miguel um is uh noted as absent

10:25for today's meeting. Pursuant to chapter

10:2820 of the acts of 22 2022, this meeting

10:32of housing and econom economic

10:34development committee is being conducted

10:36both in person and via remote

10:38participation. A reminder that persons

10:40who would like to listen to and or view

10:42this meeting while in progress may

10:44either attend in person or at the

10:46locations that I have previously

10:48mentioned, which is our Facebook Lawren

10:49City Council page and our YouTube

10:51Laurens City Council page. Before we

10:53commence uh today's uh meeting, I would

10:56like to stand up briefly and start the

10:59um Oh my god, I'm losing my train of

11:01thought. The pledge of allegiance.

11:04>> I pledge allegiance to the flag of the

11:07United States of America and

11:09>> of America and to the republic for which

11:11it stands under God, indivisible, with

11:14liberty and justice for all.

11:21Okay.

11:24Um, top of the agenda, I'm looking for a

11:26motion to approve for the minutes for

11:28council uh approval of April 14 of 2026.

11:35>> So, move.

11:36>> Can I get a second?

11:37>> Second.

11:38>> Um, motion has been made, properly

11:41second. Uh, madame clerk, if you could

11:44please call the role.

11:49What?

11:51>> April 14, 2026.

11:56>> It is.

11:58>> Okay. Yeah. Madame clerk, if you could

12:02please call the role.

12:06>> Vivian Marmal here.

12:08>> Yes.

12:09>> Mark the plant,

12:12vice chair.

12:14>> I'm going to help you in a second. Uh,

12:15yes.

12:17>> I'm It's her first. So, let's preface by

12:20saying that this is her first meeting.

12:22And even if I spot something that she

12:25could uh, you know, be better at, I I

12:28figured maybe at the end we'll give her

12:29those pointers, but if you want to give

12:32it to her now. So, always address the

12:34coun uh counselor Mark Lant instead of

12:36Mark Lant. Counselor Mark Lant. And then

12:38counselor, what was it that you wanted

12:40to add?

12:44Yeah, he's the chair.

12:45>> The chair would be the last.

12:47>> Yeah, but I don't mind. I don't mind.

12:49Okay. And then you um did councelor

12:53Lelant, you you voted yes. Okay. And we

12:56need one. You need a call.

12:58>> And I vote.

12:59>> And I vote yes.

13:00>> Okay. Deani Rodriguez.

13:04>> Councelor Rodriguez.

13:06>> Counselor.

13:11Council freaking Miguel.

13:13>> And you and you'll say noted as absent.

13:15>> Noted as absent.

13:16>> Mhm.

13:19>> It's okay. It's okay. [laughter]

13:23Okay, everyone. So, I'm looking for a

13:25motion to untage

13:30three in our agenda.

13:32Untable item 51124.

13:35It's the economic development creation

13:37of a citywide master plan. Um we do have

13:42um our director Frank Cerillo and um Mr.

13:47Burns, if you don't mind coming up uh to

13:49the podium, state your name, your title,

13:52and the agency that you work for.

13:55>> Well, me or him first.

13:58>> Who has the clicker? You guys have the

13:59clicker?

14:00>> You go. You start. I'll introduce

14:02myself.

14:02>> Okay.

14:04>> Or you could introduce him as well. Good

14:07evening uh madam chair councilors as

14:11promised as we are on well underway of

14:14devel and of the creation of the

14:15economic development master plan for the

14:17city this is a part where we're asking

14:20counselors why

14:21>> wait I'm so sorry we didn't I was

14:24looking for a motion to table this item

14:26we have yet to do that

14:28>> so move

14:29>> can I get a second okay madame clerk

14:32could you please call a role this is to

14:34unte item 511 1124.

14:40>> Councelor Plant.

14:41>> Yes.

14:43>> Councelor Vice President Rodriguez.

14:47>> Yes.

14:49>> Madame Chair Marmmo.

14:52>> Yes. Okay.

14:55Discussion now with uh Director Surley.

14:57You could you could proceed. My

15:00apologies.

15:00>> That's okay. Um,

15:03so this meeting is to hear what the

15:06councils would also like to see in the

15:07economic development master plan. With

15:09me today is my project officer, Kenny

15:12Lamarge, and for Marmac Valley Planning

15:14Commission and our consultants who are

15:17helping us with the master plan, Ian

15:19Burns, and I will pass it on to Ian

15:21Burns for you could go through his

15:22presentation.

15:23>> Okay. Thank you.

15:27>> All right. Good evening, counselors.

15:29Thank you for having us here tonight.

15:32Um, the presentation can be pulled up

15:35now. I'll work through a couple slides.

15:36So, as Frank mentioned, my name is Ian

15:38Burns. Uh, I oversee the community and

15:40economic development department at the

15:42Marramac Valley Planning Commission. For

15:43anyone listening in who is unfamiliar

15:45with our organization, we're a public

15:47agency that supports the 15 cities and

15:49towns of the Marramac Valley region,

15:50ranging from Athuan to Newbury Port. And

15:52we assist all those communities in a

15:54wide range of long range planning

15:55efforts and development efforts. Uh the

15:58city of Lawrence contracted with us to

16:00assist with the creation of an economic

16:02development master plan. You all may

16:04recall that I was here a couple of

16:05months ago seeking approval on that line

16:07item that you were approving the funding

16:08for the master plan. Um what I'm here

16:11tonight for is to give you an update on

16:13the progress so far and what we've we've

16:16worked on. Um hear your feedback on how

16:19you'd like to be incorporated going

16:20forward. We certainly want some feedback

16:22tonight, but I also would welcome this

16:24opportunity to hear from you all about

16:26um specific times or or venues that

16:28would make the most sense to get even

16:30more feedback from the council

16:31throughout this process. Um I have a

16:33PowerPoint slide tonight. I'm not going

16:34to go through every single slide into

16:36detail in the interest of time, but I

16:37wanted you to have all the information.

16:39So, what I'm going to do is kind of work

16:40through it very quickly. Please do stop

16:42me if you want to talk about anything in

16:44particular and then we can um have some

16:46conversation about kind of where we're

16:47at and where we're going if that makes

16:48the most sense and is amendable to the

16:50counselors.

16:52Um so as I said today we just want to

16:54get some feedback from you, see where we

16:55are um in the plans process and update

16:58you on what we have going forward. At

16:59the beginning of this process a steering

17:01committee was formed [snorts] in

17:02partnership with city hall. That

17:03steering committee has representation

17:05from various departments within the city

17:07uh nonprofits within the city as well as

17:10um councelor um city council

17:13representative that has been added to

17:14the group a couple months ago as well.

17:16That steering committee has been meeting

17:18uh roughly every month uh since uh the

17:21springtime and has been reviewing uh

17:23data discussing strengths and weaknesses

17:25within the city and giving feedback on

17:27the process as we move forward.

17:30So the project components, as I

17:32mentioned, we formed the steering

17:33committee a couple of months ago. Um,

17:35within that steering committee, we spent

17:36some time defining what exactly we want

17:38to focus on within an economic

17:39development master plan, which I'll

17:40touch upon a little bit later. We went

17:43over some initial data analysis with

17:44that group. We did an initial SWAT

17:46analysis, which is strengths,

17:47weaknesses, opportunities, and threats.

17:49We hosted a few focus groups of key uh

17:51interest groups across the city. And

17:53then going forward, we have some

17:54additional community engagement to do

17:56for the plan, outlining goals and

17:58objectives of the plan, looking at some

17:59action items, um, and then eventually

18:01the timeline for this is to have a draft

18:03for you all this winter to be reviewing,

18:06and then hopefully looking for final

18:07approval of the plan in March. Our goal

18:09is to create a plan that both the city

18:11council endorses and the mayor's office

18:13endorses, and that this is something

18:14that the city as a whole um, can use for

18:17implementation and also not just

18:19government, but all of the interest

18:20groups that have been a part of the plan

18:22so far.

18:24So, as I mentioned, there's a steering

18:26committee that was formed. Um, knowing

18:27that there is a million different

18:29directions that you can take an economic

18:31development master plan and really

18:32anything relates back to economic

18:34development in the city, we wanted to

18:35spend some time outlining what

18:37specifically the plan should focus on.

18:39So that way, as we work through

18:40discussions from a data perspective and

18:42from an engagement perspective, we know

18:44exactly the key points that we want to

18:46keep going back to and we don't spend

18:47time addressing things that are a little

18:49bit outside the scope of a master plan.

18:51So, what we outlined with the steering

18:52committee were these six um kind of key

18:54pillars or focus areas of the master

18:56plan, which I'll spend really the most

18:57amount of time talking about tonight,

18:59just so that you're aware of the

19:00direction that we're thinking about

19:01taking this master plan. Those key focus

19:04areas, the first being industry growth

19:05and economic competitiveness. So looking

19:07at not only the key industries you have

19:08in the ind in the city here today but

19:11also what are the industries that both

19:12exist across the Commonwealth across the

19:14country and [snorts] industries that we

19:16know that are emerging over the next

19:17decade plus that are going to be key for

19:19the city to focus on developing and

19:21recruiting for um future economic

19:23development here in the city. Second

19:25pillar of course of workforce and

19:26education. We've had some strong

19:28engagement opportunities with local

19:30educational institutions and workforce

19:31training organizations. Looking at the

19:33pipeline of workforce development, not

19:35just in our young adults or with adult

19:37learners, but really thinking all the

19:38way from, you know, middle school

19:40through um uh through older adults and

19:43looking at their career pathways and

19:45developing the workforce that the city

19:46needs for its employment base. Uh small

19:49business and entrepreneurs. We've talked

19:51a lot about how the city um is one of

19:53the uh largest uh has the greatest

19:55concentration of business startups in

19:57the Commonwealth. It's one of the

19:58leading communities in terms of

20:00entrepreneurs starting new businesses

20:01across the state. And we know that

20:03that's a huge um component to employment

20:05in the city as well and economic driver

20:08for the community. So we want to talk

20:09about how small businesses continue to

20:12be incubated in the city, how we can

20:13support entrepreneurs, real estate

20:15development opportunities. So, we've

20:16talked a little bit about and we will

20:18going forward how the city is growing um

20:21much like many other gateway cities in

20:22the Commonwealth and we need to be

20:24looking at areas for growth within the

20:25city. We know that not every spot of the

20:27community is a good place to be growing.

20:29So, we need to think strategically about

20:30where growth might make sense and where

20:32those development opportunities exist uh

20:34both from an economic development lens

20:36when we're thinking about industry but

20:37also where are we housing those workers

20:39and where are we allowing the additional

20:40small businesses to flourish across the

20:42community. The fifth pillar here is

20:43enabling conditions for economic growth.

20:45So there's a lot of little pieces that

20:47are kind of behind the scenes that

20:49contribute to economic growth. Two

20:51factors here that we talk a lot about

20:52about a lot about are what we call uh

20:54physical and um personal infrastructure,

20:57civic infrastructure. So what that means

20:59is not only the the sewer lines and the

21:01water lines within the community and the

21:02roads, but also what is the civic

21:04infrastructure that exists that allows

21:05residents to be engaged. Are they

21:07communicating well with city hall? Is

21:09city hall communicating well with them?

21:11What does that back and forth look like?

21:13and do folks know what is happening

21:14across the city and is there strong

21:16communication for growth of all sectors?

21:19And then the last one, economic identity

21:20and promotion. The steering committee

21:22spent a good amount of time discussing

21:23this because there was a lot of of of

21:25concern and hope for greater promotion

21:27of the city across the Commonwealth. And

21:29so uh so that we can ensure that when

21:32folks think about the city of Lawrence,

21:33they see a growing and thriving city and

21:35that there's no reputation that's

21:36preceding it in folks minds when they're

21:38outside of the city looking in. That

21:40Lawrence is seen as a place that is

21:41growing and is attracting both

21:43businesses, um workers, and new

21:45families.

21:49So with that, like I said, I'm not going

21:50to stop at every single point, but we

21:52just wanted to highlight a couple key

21:53data points. What we're doing as a part

21:55of this plan is we'll have a full

21:57section up front that is diving deep

21:58into economic data within the city, what

22:01we're seeing for trends, and what we

22:02want to keep in mind when thinking about

22:04goals and vision for the community. So,

22:06we just pulled out a couple data points

22:07that we thought we'd highlight for you

22:09today. And it looks like the images

22:11aren't quite rendering on my slide here.

22:16That's strange. [snorts]

22:18I hope you have those in your printouts.

22:22redo the bar graphs.

22:25>> Yeah, that's weird that they're not on

22:26the

22:27>> Oh, it doesn't populate there.

22:28>> No.

22:29>> Oh, I mean, I guess we can see it.

22:32>> If you can see them on your printouts, I

22:34will talk about a couple of them if

22:35that's okay with

22:37>> with you if I'll keep pressing forward

22:38with a few points. Um, so the population

22:42projections we were just talking about

22:43before the meeting started. The city is

22:44projected to grow. Um, and as you'll see

22:47in one of the charts on there, we uh

22:48throughout the plan are going to be

22:50comparing Lawrence to comparable gateway

22:51cities across the Commonwealth. And uh,

22:54Lawrence is the one of the fastest

22:55growing communities, actually the fast

22:57fastest growing city in that city cohort

22:59that we're analyzing it against. Growing

23:01cities is a good thing. You don't want

23:02to be a stagnating city or shrinking

23:04city. And so what we want to think about

23:05is how we can accommodate that growth

23:07within the community. These population

23:09projections, I'm going to say, are based

23:10off of u most recent historic trends.

23:13And so it's not thinking about um uh new

23:16developments that are in the pipeline

23:17right now for your community, for

23:18example. What it's really doing is

23:20saying if your pace of growth continued

23:22from the past 10 or 20 years, how would

23:24that look going forward, factoring in

23:26the birth rates we're seeing, the death

23:28rates we're seeing, the immigration

23:29rates we're seeing within the community.

23:31These are done out of the UMass

23:32Donahghue Institute. They do population

23:34estimates for the entire Commonwealth,

23:36each city and town. Um and we work with

23:38them to get our population estimates for

23:40our community. Um, and so really if

23:42Lawrence, it's basically saying if

23:44nothing changed, this is what you might

23:45be looking at for population

23:46projections, but we know things will

23:48change. And so it's really a factor to

23:49think about, okay, if we're growing, how

23:51do we want to make sure we're growing

23:52and accommodating that growth and that

23:54we have, um, both the infrastructure and

23:56the jobs and the housing that is needed

23:58to accommodate a growing population.

24:01[snorts] Um, and then the next slide

24:03here, uh, on the left, of course, we

24:04have median household income. on the

24:06right, the bar graph that's not

24:07populating for some reason on the uh the

24:09TV here is comparing Lawrence again to

24:11the other gateway cities. Um so you see

24:13Lawrence isn't too far off in terms of

24:15median household income uh compared to

24:17the this cohort of cities we have here.

24:19Not quite the lowest, but is uh lower

24:21down um uh in scale compared to other

24:24communities. It is the uh lowest

24:26household income community within the

24:27region. I don't think it's quite a

24:29surprise to any of us, but it is

24:30certainly a thing that we need to think

24:31about because when we look at economic

24:33growth, what we want to consider is

24:34growth for all residents and making sure

24:36that as those income incomes rise, we're

24:38also not pricing out residents and they

24:40have the ability to access the city um

24:42as we're trying to be competitive both

24:44within the region and across the state.

24:48Um we took a little bit little bit of a

24:50look at workforce rates. So, we've seen

24:52um Lawrence's workforce base grow, which

24:54is really important. that's attractive

24:56for employers. When we talk to employers

24:57um as an agency across this the region

24:59and the state, we find their number one

25:01request, no surprise, is workforce. Yes,

25:03they're concerned about tax rates. Yes.

25:05Um they're wondering about other

25:06industry [snorts] around them, but the

25:07number one thing is workforce. So, we're

25:09glad to see a growing workforce in the

25:10city. Um we also look at educational

25:12attainment. That's been a big topic of

25:13course for the city and its nonprofit

25:15partners over the past decade or so. Uh

25:18Lawrence does have one of the lower

25:19educational attainments both for

25:20bachelor's degree and high school

25:22degrees um compared to some other

25:24gateway cities across the Commonwealth.

25:25And of course um we know that a

25:27bachelor's degree is a pretty strong

25:28predictor of accumulating wealth and and

25:30and passing on wealth to future

25:32residents.

25:34[snorts] And then the next slide we

25:36talked a little about commercial

25:37occupancy rates. There's a pretty strong

25:38difference between retail and office

25:40occupancy rates in the city. Um I mean

25:42postcoid we certainly saw a dip in

25:44office occupancy rates but what's

25:45interesting to us in looking at these

25:47charts here is that um Lawrence is very

25:49competitive in terms of its retail

25:50occupancy rates um when looking at other

25:52cities across the Commonwealth but

25:54office occupancy rates are lower and

25:56tend to be on the low end compared to

25:57the rest of the state. And so retail is

25:59very strong. I think that goes back to

26:01um a lot of uh new startups and new

26:03small businesses we were talking about

26:04earlier. But certainly there is progress

26:06to be made in the office occupancy

26:08rates. That being said, an occupancy

26:10rate anywhere between 90 and 92 92%

26:12which is where the city has sat isn't a

26:14bad occupancy rate. Um, certainly it

26:16could be more competitive, but that's

26:17not anywhere near as low as what some uh

26:20even downtown Boston has seen in recent

26:22years since COVID in terms of the the

26:23occupancy rates.

26:26So, just to summarize as we looked at

26:28all the data, the key takeaways, a

26:29couple things. Um, number one, we're

26:32looking at significant population growth

26:34potentially over the next 10, 20, 30

26:36years. um household income substantially

26:38lower than the surrounding region and

26:40lower than peer communities across the

26:42state. Growing workforce, but in that

26:44workforce, we've seen that employment

26:45concentrated in service providing

26:47industries which tend to be lower wage.

26:49And we see uh commercial real estate

26:51conditions differing between retail and

26:53office markets both within the city and

26:55comparing the city to uh peer cities.

27:00Um the steering committee also went

27:01through a SWAT analysis. I won't go

27:02through every single one, every single

27:04piece of the SWAT analysis. What's

27:05important to keep in mind here is when

27:07you look at a SWAT analysis, which is

27:08strengths, weaknesses, opportunities,

27:09and threats. Those strengths and

27:11weaknesses we try to identify are the

27:13internal elements and the things that

27:14you can control typically for a city.

27:17And the opportunities and threats are

27:18what we call external elements. And

27:19those are things that are maybe outside

27:21of your control, but we have to consider

27:22them as important factors when thinking

27:24about economic development. So, a couple

27:26of things that that came forward, not a

27:28huge surprise, but things that we need

27:29to keep note of in terms of strengths

27:30for the city. We have a strong workforce

27:32like we mentioned, and we have a vibrant

27:33small business community. weaknesses.

27:35We've talked a lot about gaps in

27:37coordination, communication, not only

27:39among city departments, but also between

27:41the city and the community and seeing uh

27:43that there is a bit of a gap in business

27:45owners and residents have reported

27:47looking for additional communication to

27:49know what's happening.

27:51Um then the opportunities and threats.

27:54Um there are still plenty of state and

27:55federal funding opportunities out there

27:56and there are federal funding and state

27:58funding opportunities that target cities

28:00just like Lawrence, especially in the

28:01state level looking at gateway cities.

28:03um the federal level, there are still

28:04opportunities out there, especially as

28:06the opportunity zones program gets

28:07rebooted [snorts] um across the state

28:09and across the nation. So, there are a

28:11significant amount of opportunities out

28:13there funding wise. Um we also talked a

28:15little bit about the assets the city has

28:16like the Lawrence Municipal Airport. Um,

28:19and we talked a little bit about uh the

28:20opportunities in workforce development,

28:22how there's a lot of activity happening

28:24both within Boston and the Boston CPS

28:26and at the state house. Um, looking at

28:28ways to legalize new pathways to work

28:30for residents that maybe don't have

28:32their certificates here, but they earn

28:33them somewhere else after moving or

28:35before moving here, I should say. And

28:37then finally, threats. A couple things

28:39uh like census undercount. And so we

28:40always are worried about not having a

28:42complete picture of the amount of

28:43residents in the city due to the census

28:45undercount. there are challenges that

28:47we've talked about that relate mostly to

28:48state and federal policies. And so we

28:50started to create kind of a list of

28:51those things that um although it'd be

28:53nice to change them, we're not going to

28:54be able to change them tomorrow. So

28:55that's um might be things um like like

28:58HUD housing policies where they're

29:00looking at income levels and those

29:01affect the affordable housing rates. um

29:03the the changes that might be happening

29:04on the state level relative to um

29:07dealing with the homeless population and

29:08where services are centered in the city.

29:10It makes it challenging where everybody

29:11comes here for services and it's not

29:13quite dispersed and even though someone

29:15might not be from here, they're coming

29:16here for those services. So, um, the

29:19SWAT analysis really giving that

29:20steering committee a base for looking at

29:23potential goals and opportunities going

29:25forward and is hopefully setting the

29:27table for what the city could look at in

29:30terms of economic development strategies

29:32over the next 10 or so years. And then

29:35I'll just summarize, we have been doing

29:36public engagement throughout this entire

29:38process. The first piece of that public

29:40engagement has been focus groups. And so

29:42so far we've had focus groups with um

29:44nonprofits, small businesses and

29:46entrepreneurs, real estate developers,

29:48and education and workforce

29:49organizations. So this was um about 10

29:52uh representatives from each of these

29:53groups were at each focus group meeting

29:55where we asked them some targeted

29:56questions about their experience working

29:58within the city, working with the city,

30:00doing their work here in Lawrence. Um

30:02there were a lot of themes that emerged

30:04specific to each sector, but there were

30:06some themes that came up again and again

30:08across all of those conversations. One

30:10of those was talking about um a desire

30:12to strengthen the collaboration between

30:14the city, the employers, the nonprofits

30:16and businesses. Folks kept reporting

30:18that they saw although it has been

30:20strong in the past, there's always a

30:21continued need for greater collaboration

30:23and greater coordination amongst the

30:25city and its institutions. Um in every

30:28group actually the workforce pathways

30:30came up and one of the strongest things

30:31we heard about was language language

30:33access and ESOL training. And so, not

30:35only in our nonprofits, but in all of

30:37our other groups, they were reflecting

30:38on the challenge with uh getting English

30:41language learners um um up to task and

30:44learning about uh sorry, getting English

30:47language learners more familiar with

30:48English language before they go into the

30:50workforce and how that is one of the

30:51biggest barriers they see and they see

30:53additional opportunities for streamlined

30:54English language training.

30:57And then we are planning to hold

30:58additional focus groups uh in the coming

31:00months. One of those focus groups we

31:01want to talk to the youth in the city.

31:03So talking to some of the nonprofits

31:04that have youth programs and listening

31:06to the youth high schoolers and seeing

31:08what they might be looking for in a

31:09community so that if they do leave

31:10Lawrence to get a bachelor's degree or

31:12go off and work somewhere else that they

31:14still see Lawrence as a good place to

31:15come back to and work and live in in the

31:17future when they're adults and raising

31:18their own families and seeing what

31:19they're looking for as young adults

31:20today. Um we also are hoping to have

31:22another focus group with some uh real

31:24estate interests. We had a couple show

31:26up to the real estate development focus

31:27group but not as many as we would have

31:29wanted. I think we only had two or three

31:30out of about a 15 person invite list.

31:32So, we do want to target them again and

31:34get more feedback.

31:37We've also been doing a community survey

31:38of residents. So, we had drafted a

31:40survey that we've been soliciting

31:42responses to at events like farmers

31:45markets where we're offering incentives

31:46for folks to fill out the fill out the

31:48survey. We've had uh about 70 responses

31:50so far to the survey, which has been

31:52pretty strong. And that's really asking

31:53residents questions like, you know,

31:55their consumer behaviors. Where do they

31:57shop within the city? What type of

31:58businesses are they going to? What do

31:59they feel they need to leave the city

32:01for if they're going and and shopping or

32:03doing their business elsewhere? Um, do

32:05they feel like they have strong access

32:06to employment, transportation, that

32:08employment within the city? Really

32:09getting a sense of what residents are

32:10dealing with um across all uh age

32:13cohorts um and across all um income

32:16groups within the community. So, we're

32:17trying to get a sense of what residents

32:18are looking for in addition to um the

32:21key institutions that we had as a part

32:23of our focus groups.

32:26Now, what we're looking at going

32:27forward, a couple of pieces. Number one,

32:29we want to host what we're calling a

32:31community stakeholder event. So, we

32:32brought a lot of uh community

32:34stakeholders together in those focus

32:36groups. But as this plan progresses, one

32:38of our big goals is to outline some

32:40initial drafts of uh objectives and

32:43strategies for the plan, but then to

32:44kind of ground truth it with the folks

32:46that have part participated in focus

32:48groups and hopefully with uh local

32:50leaders as well, such as yourselves,

32:51where we can get everyone in one room to

32:54talk about the progress in the plan, but

32:55to get their feedback on what exactly

32:57they might be looking for out of the

32:59objectives, the goals, and strategies.

33:01um and bring them together in one space

33:02to kind of talk about a little bit about

33:04what I talked about to you here tonight,

33:06but then to hear their feedback to to

33:08talk to them about what we heard from

33:09them. So hopefully we can make sure that

33:11we heard the right things and that we're

33:12reflecting their feedback throughout the

33:14plan. We're aiming to do that uh before

33:16the holidays this fall. We're also

33:18continuing additional community

33:19engagement and then as I said at the

33:21beginning of this going forward, we're

33:22going to start drafting goals and

33:24objectives with that steering committee.

33:26That would be a key time to come back

33:27here to this council and get your

33:29feedback on some key strategies, goals,

33:31and objectives. Because what we want to

33:32do at the end of this is create a really

33:34targeted action plan, what we're calling

33:35an action and implementation plan. So

33:37that this is not something that is

33:39speaking in broad brush and just has

33:40really lofty language about economic

33:42development, but has some um actual

33:44tangible outcomes and actions the city

33:46can take once the economic development

33:48plan is finished. You know, where to

33:49start and what your year one, year two,

33:51year three actions could be coming out

33:53of this.

33:56That is everything that I had on slides

33:58tonight. Like I said, I wanted to fly

34:00through it just to give you an overview.

34:02Happy to go back to anything and discuss

34:04any pieces that you are wondering about.

34:06Make sure we're incorporating your

34:07feedback in the plan. But like I said,

34:09I'd also be open to hearing what forums

34:11you think might be most [snorts]

34:12effective for continued engagement with

34:14you all as a body so we can make sure

34:16that when we come back in February time

34:19frame and we have a full draft of the

34:20plan, it's not your first time seeing a

34:22lot of those elements and you're

34:23familiar and feel like your voices have

34:25been heard throughout the process. So,

34:26thank you.

34:29[snorts]

34:30>> Counselor's discussion, questions,

34:35>> councelor Rodriguez.

34:37Uh thank [clears throat] you madam

34:38chair.

34:41So um

34:43well thank you for putting this

34:44together. We we highly appreciate that

34:46the city's moving on um on this

34:49direction when it comes to a master plan

34:51for the city uh when it comes to

34:53economic development.

34:56So I see that u

34:59uh the plant is it's it's wide open u

35:03when it comes to uh many different

35:05barriers

35:06variables that are uh going to be um

35:09implemented potentially or study. So

35:13basically I want to know like uh what is

35:16the main source of the data that you

35:18guys are gathering?

35:19>> Yeah good question. Um so it's a variety

35:21of data sources. Um, a lot of our

35:23demographic data is census data and so

35:25it tends to be the most recent American

35:27community survey data which is right now

35:30uh 22 to 24 is when that American

35:32community survey data is from. And then

35:34we also get a good chunk of our real

35:36estate and commercial data from CoStar

35:38which is national real estate database.

35:40Um they have really strong indicators

35:42for commercial markets locally and

35:45regionally. Um and then also the um the

35:48Massachusetts state data office has a

35:50good amount of data on local industry

35:52and regional industry. We pull data from

35:54uh the department [snorts] of economic

35:55research with the state uh through the

35:57state data office.

35:58>> Okay. Um

36:01[snorts] I want I want to know like you

36:03know um essentially when you when you

36:06talk about when you when we discuss

36:07economic development we we think about

36:10businesses

36:12>> uh and we also think about clients uh

36:15who is going to be uh going to those uh

36:18to those businesses and and consume so

36:21they can they can drive. Uh when it

36:25comes to the the the economic

36:28development of the city, are you looking

36:31to the upside of the community like a

36:34buffer of so many miles

36:36>> that are going to be coming over

36:38>> uh for different attractions or

36:40different uh

36:41>> different uh

36:43different scenarios that we present that

36:46are going to be attractive to people

36:47from around the regions.

36:49>> Yeah. So a couple things that we look at

36:51that wasn't included in this slide

36:52today. We've been pulling some data on

36:54uh both the commuting and general

36:56transportation patterns of uh the region

36:59as a whole. So, greater Lawrence and

37:01going up to southern New Hampshire and

37:03um south of Lawrence as well and seeing

37:05how many folks right now, for example,

37:07as baseline, how many folks are coming

37:08into the city to work, how many folks

37:10are leaving the city to work, [snorts]

37:11how many folks are coming into the city

37:12on weekends, maybe that's more for

37:14commercial activity or retail activity.

37:17Um and so we're looking at some of that

37:18modeling. We're also looking at from an

37:21industry perspective like I was kind of

37:22touched upon earlier um what the

37:25industries of tomorrow so to speak are

37:27seeing things like climate tech and

37:28otherwise that other cities right now

37:30are incubating and are trying to do a

37:32lot of work to create a workforce

37:34pipeline in that area so that companies

37:35are attracted there. So we're looking at

37:37other areas of the state think like

37:39Northshore Lynn and Salem area even just

37:41west of us in Lel and um um uh UMass

37:45Lowel and some of the jobs and training

37:47programs they're launching. How can all

37:49of those areas which are within uh you

37:51know a commuting distance, what are they

37:53doing that might be attractive for us to

37:55have here so that we can all benefit

37:57from what is happening in some of those

37:58other cities we can both share a

38:00workforce but also continue to incubate

38:02employers that are going to be

38:03benefiting from some of the actions in

38:05those other communities.

38:06>> Okay. Um

38:09when I when I think about uh a master

38:12plan for the city,

38:14I also need to think like what works

38:18>> what what is it that have worked for

38:19other cities in town and what is it that

38:23uh it might work on the city on the city

38:25of Lawrence that is unique to the city.

38:28Something that I have found is like uh

38:30the engagement of of others

38:33>> that that sometime we're missing. uh and

38:36I and I have found I I have found

38:38throughout research that um and you know

38:43experience that once people get to know

38:46the city of Lawrence they they get

38:49attractive to the city and uh and engage

38:53more

38:54>> the engagement portion of it is is a is

38:56a key uh it's a key indicator that we

39:00are in the progress of uh of making

39:04something happen. So what are going to

39:06be the the those those uh activities or

39:10those um engagement that we're going to

39:14be using in in this master plan to be to

39:17ensure that people are going to be um

39:21they're going to be coming to work

39:23perhaps coming to do an event but then

39:26eventually that they going to come back

39:28>> and use other uh other other things that

39:33we offer. on the city of Lmers, how we

39:35going to be able to [snorts] accomplish

39:38those specifics

39:39>> that are not quite defined on the on on

39:42this yet.

39:43>> Yeah. So, one of the things that we were

39:44talking about with the steering

39:45committee, it it kind of links back to

39:47one of those focus areas that we were

39:48talking about earlier, that economic

39:50identity and promotion. And that's not

39:52only for folks outside of the city that

39:54have never been here before, but also

39:56folks that come to the city for either

39:57their job, maybe they live here, but

39:59really I think what you're getting at is

40:00folks that come here for a reason other

40:02than living here. and is it, you know,

40:04while they're here, are they going to

40:05want to come back and why are they going

40:06to want to come back? And so, one of the

40:09things we've been thinking about is how

40:10to get some feedback from that cohort.

40:12Um, we talked a little bit about

40:14potentially engaging with workers that

40:15live outside the city. Right now, our

40:17survey has been focused mostly on

40:18residents, but we could start to think

40:20about that survey being more for um

40:22folks that are in the community for

40:23events or something, which we have not

40:25done yet, which is worthwhile

40:26considering. Um, and what we're trying

40:29to do is think about this economic

40:31development plan in the [clears throat]

40:33context of uh both small businesses and

40:36industry, but [snorts] not getting too

40:39far down the line of the city thinking

40:40about a city-wide master plan in the

40:42future. And we're trying to kind of

40:43thread the needle here where we're

40:44thinking about economic development and

40:46business development. Um, and not quite

40:48getting into I think the city's been

40:49talking about next year doing a full

40:51comprehensive plan looking at the the

40:53city as a whole for for land use and

40:55otherwise. Um, but I'd be curious, you

40:57know, if you have thoughts or ideas on

40:58how to engage um,

41:01transient's not the right word, but

41:03folks coming into the city for reasons

41:04other than living here, we'd be happy to

41:06engage with that and get feedback from

41:07them to make sure that they, you know,

41:08have a good experience in the city when

41:10they visit and that they want to come

41:11back, which we haven't done yet.

41:13>> U, I'll give you a good example. I mean

41:15it's not something that we're going to

41:17implement and on on on a project like

41:19this but I give you my own experience

41:22>> with somebody that um that worked in the

41:25city

41:26>> but had never I had never uh kind of

41:30like go away from from the the work for

41:32the from the workplace. that person um

41:36we we have a great experience for about

41:383 months or longer. Um that she actually

41:42get to know the city and places that she

41:46she have u a

41:49a kind of like you know a cliche oh

41:52that's dangerous area that's a dangerous

41:54area when she ended up going over she

41:57find out that it was uh not as people

42:00mentioned. So a and then eventually once

42:04the project was done, she was the one

42:07going to those places by herself.

42:09>> Mhm.

42:10>> So

42:12uh and that that tells me that the

42:15perception of people of what's going on

42:17here in the city is is sometime more

42:20negative than the reality that we live

42:22in.

42:23So focusing on that and be able to

42:26engage uh people to get to know the city

42:30uh on on a different level

42:33um will help out tremendously because it

42:36worked for me and and at the end of the

42:38day if it worked for uh someone why not

42:41try it out.

42:43>> Great. Thank you. I'm just writing down

42:44some notes. So, um I have uh four four

42:48more questions, but I'm going to allow

42:50to continue the conversation to continue

42:51with other counselors.

42:53>> Council Lant, do you have any?

42:55>> Sure.

42:55>> Okay. Council Lant,

42:57>> this actually fits in quite well with

42:58Mr. Rodriguez's comments. Um

43:02first one is when was the last time we

43:04had economic

43:06master plan in the city?

43:08>> I don't believe you've done one before

43:10unless Frank has seen it.

43:13So the answer to that counselor is none.

43:16No, this will be the first one. Um to

43:19touch on something before I let because

43:23one of the things we are also looking at

43:25is doing tourism in the city. The city

43:29has huge historical significations

43:32throughout not just Lawrence but

43:33throughout the Commonwealth and

43:35throughout the the United States. So,

43:37we're looking to reopen and open up an

43:40actual tourism and show all the

43:41historical sites in the city. Um, from

43:44the bread and roses festival to all the

43:48movies that's been filmed in the city of

43:49Lawrence. And yes, the perception and

43:52this we're hoping to lead into

43:54rebranding of the city as a whole before

43:57we look at doing a um master plan for

44:00the whole city with everything else

44:01included. Was there in in any of the

44:05previous master plans, a section of the

44:07master plan that had anything to do with

44:08economic development? Are we just on

44:10virgin territory, never even pure as a

44:14driven snow? Never even talked about it.

44:16Nothing has ever happened in the 150

44:18some odd years we've been a city. We've

44:20never dealt with this.

44:21>> So we've never had a any a master plan

44:23in the city. Neither a economic or a

44:26master plan for the city. So these will

44:28be the first endeavors. What I what I

44:31might offer is although it's not a

44:34direct um direct correlation um

44:38certainly the past urban renewal plan

44:39had a lot to say about certainly the

44:41past urban renewal plan

44:43>> past urban renewal thank you

44:45>> um had a lot to say about econ economic

44:47development although that's a function

44:48not of city hall it has a lot of

44:50economic development components and so

44:53that is something that we've looked at

44:54to learn what was strategized last time

44:56around from an economic development

44:58perspective but as a is a citywide

45:00master plan. I haven't seen anything um

45:03specific to econom

45:03>> I don't want to drill too much on this

45:05except that I'm shocked by that to be

45:07honest with you there I would have

45:11thought there would have been some sort

45:12of tentacles or some maybe nothing as

45:15formal as an MA economic development

45:17master nothing as formal as that but

45:20over the course of time probably through

45:22the 70s I'm going to go back a little

45:23bit here 70s and 80s uh where you you

45:26can still see to this day around the

45:27city you can see the eagle on some signs

45:30and there used to be Lawrence is moving

45:32up or something like there was a

45:34catchphrase of some sort. Um and the

45:36eagle was prominent because top of this

45:38building for example it's the newspapers

45:41named after it and so we had the eagle

45:43named after as a part of the marketing.

45:44We also had the airmill clock tower for

45:46example that's always been a big

45:48representative of the of Lawrence and

45:50what the what that tower means uh with

45:53respect to the mills and workers etc. So

45:56there are I I just think that when these

45:59things were developed that there were

46:02discussions.

46:03>> Sure. that what what are we going to do

46:05to bring people in historic not the

46:07first time there have been conversations

46:10we had a vibrant

46:12and back I don't want to taking too much

46:13time on this but back years ago we used

46:16to have a vibrant historical community

46:19which would look at to this day we still

46:22have the heritage state park which is

46:24part of that was founded because the

46:27city wanted to [snorts]

46:28focus on its history and got federal

46:32monies during ing the guy named Paul

46:34Sonis who was a benefactor to Lel and

46:38then we we as a city were able to

46:41leverage say not just ll we've have

46:43stuff here and that was the offshoot of

46:46the heritage state park the Lawrence

46:48etc. Sorry. I just think that there is

46:51stuff out there. What I'm really I'm

46:53asking that I I'm just curious to see

46:55what we have done cuz I am

46:59I I am concerned that we're putting a

47:01lot of work and effort and time into it

47:03and my concern is is that despite what

47:07is a promising beginning and I can I can

47:10see that there is going to be some

47:13stamina and uh we're going to continue

47:15at this and I and you've got the

47:17blueprint. I think it's going to get to

47:19a conclusion. My concern and I which

47:22will come to my second question. My

47:23concern is are we going what is going to

47:28be the end product? Is it going to be a

47:30book, a PowerPoint, something? And then

47:33who is going to reference that? Who is

47:35this for? Who is our target audience?

47:38Right?

47:38>> Which goes back to this. Let me ask you

47:41that was commentary. Mhm.

47:42>> Now, a question. You've you said and

47:45you've been focusing on the other

47:46gateway cities. Which of these gateway

47:49cities have a a a um economic

47:52development master plan?

47:55>> I don't know specifically an economic

47:57development master plan, but most of

47:58them have citywide master plans that

48:00have economic development sections.

48:03>> And that's what I thought we would have

48:04had. Reason why I thought that we have a

48:07we had a master plan. I'm surprised

48:08there wasn't a economic development

48:11portion of that master plan dedicated.

48:13>> There may be I I haven't seen it. So I'm

48:15happy to look and see if it's if it's

48:16out there, right? Incorporate that.

48:18Yeah.

48:19>> So that's that I I suspect that there I

48:21can't imagine a master plan just

48:23ignoring this.

48:24>> Yeah. No, I'm sure I'm sure there's

48:25something done in the past and I'd be

48:27more than happy to take a look at it and

48:29and find that.

48:31>> My apologies. Octavian's fantasy advisor

48:33to the mayor. I think you're correct. Uh

48:36they have been uh previous um documents

48:41but they were from the redevelopment

48:42authority back in in the 70s. Uh I think

48:46we went through some of the historical

48:48archives uh and the information that we

48:50received and um there were also

48:53development but not [snorts]

48:55specifically an economic development

48:58plan that that where number one has been

49:01used for funding

49:02>> or number two uh number one it would be

49:05to lay out a plan for the city how we

49:08promote a city and how we attract

49:10attract investment and second of all is

49:12to um

49:15uh to guide the vision of of the elected

49:19official and the community in general,

49:21what we supposed to do.

49:24>> Thank you. So,

49:26what I what I'm I'm want to jump on what

49:29my colleague and council president said

49:31regarding the um the other gateway

49:35communities. I just

49:38there's got who who's done this

49:40successfully? Mhm.

49:41>> Who has what community has done this and

49:44did it right?

49:48>> I think we've seen a lot of great

49:49examples of other communities creating

49:52[snorts] master plans and following

49:54them. The master plans themselves tend

49:55to be, you know, regional or or I'm

49:58sorry, communitywide land use plans, but

50:00they the communities that plan for

50:02growth particular areas. I'm thinking

50:03about Lel for example. They did a great

50:05master planning process two years ago

50:08now and they had identified areas that

50:10they wanted to grow as a city and

50:12they've been taking action in that

50:13direction after creating that plan. Um

50:16there are communities in our region as

50:17well, not cities like Lawrence in our

50:19region, but a lot of our towns have

50:21created master plans over the past 5

50:23years and they've now taken steps to

50:25modify their regulations and their local

50:27zoning to adhere to their master plan if

50:29that's what you're looking for. Um, but

50:30the the cities in terms of the other

50:32gateway cities we've identified here,

50:34um, we have gateway cities across the

50:36Commonwealth. We've looked at a couple

50:37of their master plans. I haven't

50:39followed up with them to learn what

50:40they've implemented since then, but they

50:41all have master plans as well.

50:43>> And and and this is where I I just this

50:47is the belly of why I'm concerned.

50:50We are not even sure of what other

50:53communities cities I think it's easier.

50:57I've got my reasons for thinking this.

50:58I'm not going to bore everyone for those

51:00reasons. Why a town with their section

51:03of government with maybe a town manager,

51:05[snorts] board of selectmen, while

51:07they're they've got elections that are

51:10off years and they're staggered

51:13in the city like us and the cities that

51:17I think are representative in I think

51:19each one of these LOL's got a city

51:22manager.

51:24Habil's got a mayor. Brockton's got a

51:26mayor. New Bedford has a mayor. Paul

51:28River has a mayor. Lynn's got a mayor. I

51:31think LOL's probably going with a city

51:33manager form of government over there.

51:35>> Um

51:36>> I will say the city of Haveril as well.

51:37They finished their master plan two

51:39years ago and they've taken step

51:41actually probably five years ago now I

51:42should say and there were several

51:44several recommendations that they've

51:46implemented since then. Um mostly zoning

51:48changes that they recommended there. um

51:50as well as development projects that are

51:52taking place in their downtown that they

51:54identified as a part of that master

51:55planning process.

51:56>> And let me bring up let me tell you what

51:58the concern is. I've been beating around

52:00the bush. I'm going to be very direct.

52:02>> My concern is that in the way that our

52:05government is

52:08that we vote for a mayor every four

52:10years. Mhm.

52:12>> A mayor will a new mayor will come in

52:15and want to put their vision, their

52:18impromator that what the what they

52:20campaigned on that's what they want to

52:23install in the city that may or may not

52:26be in line with the with the with the

52:30any master plan. Mhm.

52:32>> And all of a sudden, this master plan,

52:34I'm using this, it's not going to be

52:35this big, but this master plan

52:39that a lot of time and work and effort

52:41has gone into it. I'm just wondering,

52:44can it withstand any

52:47the the the time? I think that the work

52:50that's been done on this now, just

52:52bringing some raw elements, bringing

52:54context helps me as a decision maker in

52:57the city. going through this process. I

53:00could see projections that helps me. I

53:02can see again you're you're synthesizing

53:06things from the community surveys which

53:07is part of the census. your sensitiz and

53:10things from the the Donnie who wants to

53:11do UMass or whatever else they're

53:13getting stuff from and you're putting

53:14them into this as for me as a decision

53:17maker that helps me

53:18>> because now I can kind of see things

53:20although

53:23the puzzle that I'm trying to put the

53:25pieces together are always going to be

53:27impacted based on other political

53:30factors in in our city the most powerful

53:33person in government is the mayor. It's

53:36a powerful, it's a strong form of form

53:38of government. Um, we have checks, we've

53:42got balances, of course, but it's a

53:45strong form. It's a strong m form of

53:46government. That's where our charter is.

53:48>> And so, I just I that's the concern. We

53:52don't know of any other city that's

53:53successfully done. I haven't heard one

53:55yet because what I would want to know is

53:57how do they do it? How do how did they

54:00succeed with that political tail that

54:02headwind? That's what I want to know. I

54:04guess what I would offer is I first I

54:06would say I apologize if I made it sound

54:08like no city has done successfully

54:09because I don't think that's quite

54:10accurate. Okay. Um like I was mentioning

54:12before both Haveril and Lel had master

54:15plans that have been done in recent

54:16years and they've implemented policies

54:18and recommendations from those master

54:19plans including Hil has had a mayoral

54:21transition since then and they've seen

54:23implementation happening there. What I

54:25would offer and I it's not always

54:27satisfying because it depends on

54:28everyone in terms of who's the audience

54:30for this plan. The reason that we are

54:32here tonight and we are in doing

54:34engagement with focus groups and like I

54:35mentioned we want to have a stakeholder

54:37session again in a couple months is so

54:39that there's universal buyin beyond the

54:41mayor's office. to us, you know, as a

54:43planning agency when we do plans across

54:45all of our communities. What's important

54:47is that it's not just either the

54:49municipal CEO that approves of it or

54:51whoever the the chairman of the local

54:53board is at the time, but that everyone

54:55buys into it because in four years, if

54:57the mayor changes, I would bet that

54:59there's still going to be a couple

55:00counselors around that were a part of

55:01this process and that agree to this

55:03plan. And as a council, as a body, you

55:05also have a say in the direction the

55:06city goes in. And so I would encourage a

55:08the council to have buyin and agree to

55:10this plan because then you have that

55:12going forward to say to a new mayor,

55:14hey, we all establish this as what we

55:16want to see and we still want to stick

55:17to it. How can we maybe you won't do

55:19everything. I'm going to give you that.

55:20You're not going to finish everything.

55:21And I would also say, you know, in a

55:22city like Lawrence where you have such

55:24strong independent institutions,

55:26nonprofits, educational institutions,

55:28and otherwise, they need to buy in as

55:31well because they're going to be doing a

55:32lot of the work, maybe not always with

55:33city hall, but pretty often with city

55:35hall. And if they buy in as well,

55:36they're going to be the ones going to

55:38the city and saying we want to work on

55:39this project. So it's identified in the

55:40plan. So it it doesn't work if it's just

55:43the mayor's office saying this is our

55:44plan today. I think the only time it

55:46works is when we get buyin from this

55:48body and buyin from all the stakeholders

55:50across the city. It won't work if it's

55:51just the mayor right now saying that he

55:53likes it and approves it in in my

55:55opinion.

55:55>> No, I and I I don't disagree with that.

55:57Um my last point is this and I'll yield

55:59back because there's more questions on

56:01the other side. [snorts] Uh, one of the

56:03things doesn't talk about is how

56:06transient we are as a community.

56:08>> And I think that's important, too. I

56:10mean, if we got this, this city has

56:12consistently as an immigrant

56:13consistently being highly transient. And

56:15I don't we haven't changed. We haven't

56:16changed in years. We've been like this

56:18for a while. I know when I go out and

56:20vote, it's amazing how my the voter list

56:22changes. You every two years I'm

56:24knocking on someone's door, that

56:25person's moved out. Oh, okay.

56:27>> Person's moved out. And it happens an

56:28awful lot. They don't live there

56:30anymore. So, I know we're transient, but

56:32that's been around for a while. And I

56:34just wonder as we are trying to wrap our

56:36minds around what are we trying to do?

56:38We're getting information from people

56:39today who may not be here tomorrow. And

56:41I don't I don't know if there's a better

56:43way of doing it, but uh I'm just curious

56:45as to if there's numbers that can

56:48buttress what I just

56:51my optics.

56:53>> Yeah. Um I'd be interested to look at um

56:56change in addresses or being able to

56:58look at the tenure breakdown of housing

56:59residents. So, if there's been any

57:00transition between renting and ownership

57:02and what the metrics were 20 years ago

57:04versus today, would be curious to see

57:06the change there. Um, I will say that

57:08wasn't something that we talked about,

57:09but I'm going to add it into some of the

57:10notes, especially that SWAT analysis. I

57:12don't think that came out of there and

57:13it should be a factor that we consider.

57:15So, I'm just writing that down as

57:16another thing to look at, see if there's

57:17data points we can grab on it. So, thank

57:19you. Um, council president, if you don't

57:22mind, I'm I want to um throw out a few

57:25of my

57:27points across um I agree in terms of the

57:32master plan um and having these

57:34different stakeholders that um comprise

57:37of this com community um having their

57:41buyin would definitely um

57:45make it would influence uh the direction

57:48of this master plan and and to see to

57:50flourish. Uh, but I'm also a big

57:52believer that

57:54what the goal is of this master plan,

57:57regardless of who the mayor is, I feel

57:59like there's just common thing there.

58:01There's there's common goals that

58:03regardless of who the mayor is, uh,

58:05there should be a buyin. Um, I'm the way

58:09I operate when I'm looking at these

58:11goals is I I like to see actionable

58:13items. Um, and to to councelor Leland's

58:18defense, I and I agree. We we see

58:20something as major as this, I would like

58:22to see micro goals like like there's a

58:25major goal and like what are the micro

58:27goals within that major goal to to reach

58:29that point? What are like the certain

58:31what are certain micro goals that our

58:34city should be focusing on as of now?

58:37Um, and I'll give an example. I feel

58:39like when I'm looking at some of the

58:41challenges

58:43and and rooms that like the rooms of

58:46growth and improvement that that we

58:49could be working on. There could be like

58:51this one solution which is parking for

58:53example. Parking could be the one thing

58:56that alleviates five bullet points that

58:59are mentioned here. Whether it's the

59:01tourism, whether it's the small

59:03businesses that are opening up and

59:05they're probably struggling. Um which

59:08brings me to my other point is like what

59:10are actionable items um that are based

59:14on this master plan you are you know uh

59:18identifying areas that we should be

59:21looking into. So it's like what is it um

59:24what is the city doing in order to to

59:26look into this and and improve it. So,

59:29you know, for example, I'm just going to

59:31um throw it out there once again. We

59:34have a bunch of brand new small

59:37businesses that are opening up, brand

59:38new restaurants.

59:40What is the city doing to make sure

59:42because new businesses, [clears throat]

59:44I feel like they're usually most

59:48vulnerable within their first what year,

59:50two to three years. So, it's like, are

59:52we there to provide that necessary help,

59:55resources, and tools for those

59:57businesses not to to give up or struggle

1:00:01and and um once the first three years um

1:00:05were able to like look into other

1:00:07things? I I'm just wondering cuz I'm

1:00:09seeing the grand scheme of things, but I

1:00:12think the way I operate is I want to see

1:00:14actionable items as to what is it that

1:00:17we could currently be doing and should

1:00:20potentially be doing within um the next,

1:00:23you know, uh two to three months to then

1:00:26see and then re-evaluate has there been

1:00:29improvement based on implementing those

1:00:32changes. I know I'm saying a lot and I'm

1:00:34hoping that you're in the right. Yep.

1:00:37And I what I'll just offer is I'm glad

1:00:39you said that because that's exactly the

1:00:41direction that we want to go in next.

1:00:42We're trying to go broad and then funnel

1:00:44down to specific. And so what we're

1:00:47starting with here is some of those big

1:00:48picture goals and looking for both now

1:00:50and over the next couple weeks, you

1:00:52know, red flags of like you're missing

1:00:53this one giant thing and then hopefully

1:00:56getting those specific action items out

1:00:58of those and getting those micro goals

1:00:59that you're talking about. So when we

1:01:00are having our next conversation,

1:01:02whether it's here or in a different

1:01:03forum, that's exactly what we're going

1:01:05to want to drill down to so we can get

1:01:07those pieces.

1:01:07>> Okay. I would love to see that because I

1:01:09know right now if we really break down

1:01:12um the grand scheme of things of like

1:01:14this master plan, I'm pretty sure

1:01:16there's 20 plus things that we need to

1:01:18be doing. But from those 20 plus, are we

1:01:22focusing on like the major four to five

1:01:24or whatever you guys make the

1:01:26determination on like what are the four,

1:01:27five, six pillars of what should um what

1:01:33what would make sense of what our city

1:01:35is struggling with.

1:01:37>> Um [snorts]

1:01:39>> so just to get into the nitty-gritty a

1:01:41little bit with um your steering

1:01:44committee, I'm assuming that's

1:01:46completely different from your focus

1:01:47groups, right?

1:01:48>> Yes.

1:01:49who who's part of this uh this

1:01:51committee?

1:01:52>> Give the list one second here.

1:01:55>> I Yeah, I saw your focus group and I

1:01:57think that's amazing to bring in.

1:02:00Um so we have city hall, a couple local

1:02:04um developers. We have the local

1:02:06chamber. Um I'm scrolling down. I'm

1:02:10sorry.

1:02:10>> Massire.

1:02:11>> Mass hire. Yeah.

1:02:12>> Okay. So it's very similar to your focus

1:02:14groups. Okay. Mass hire.

1:02:18>> Yeah. And but we have the the focus

1:02:20groups. For example, if we have mass

1:02:22hire on our steering committee, that's

1:02:24one workforce organization. And the

1:02:25focus groups, we brought together, you

1:02:27know, eight or 10 nonprofits that do

1:02:29workforce that aren't on the steering

1:02:30committee and we're seeing every month,

1:02:31but we brought them together separate

1:02:33from mass hires so we can have a

1:02:34conversation with them about workforce

1:02:35just as an example. Is there anything

1:02:40um repetitive that's come that's uh

1:02:43across the board from all these

1:02:45different focus groups and organizations

1:02:47that they have brought up?

1:02:49>> Yep. Yeah. Um a couple of things it it

1:02:52sounds simple but what came up most

1:02:54often was just communication and

1:02:56coordination. So sometimes folks felt um

1:03:00like there could be better coordination

1:03:02both between um the city and its

1:03:05institutions but also between uh

1:03:07residents and small business owners and

1:03:09the city. So I'll give you an example.

1:03:11Small business owners were saying that

1:03:13they weren't aware of all the resources

1:03:14that were out there. We know there's a

1:03:16lot of resources available but they

1:03:18don't know where to start [snorts] or

1:03:19where to go or how to access them. Some

1:03:21know very well but the ones that don't

1:03:23don't even know where to start. And so

1:03:24that's an example of there. Then from a

1:03:26a planning and development standpoint,

1:03:28um you think about the amount of um you

1:03:31know nonprofits in the community that

1:03:33are doing development work. What's their

1:03:34coordination like with the city so that

1:03:36both of their goals are aligned? And

1:03:38then from a workforce perspective, we

1:03:39were talking a lot about in terms of the

1:03:41communication and the coordination where

1:03:43you have a lot of individual agencies

1:03:45working on workforce development, but

1:03:47they might all be off doing their own

1:03:48thing and and but they're very similar

1:03:50programs. Why aren't they aligned? That

1:03:51coordination piece of it. And the second

1:03:53piece that we heard, it was interesting

1:03:55and I I I drilled, this is more

1:03:56specific, but in multiple focus groups

1:03:58when we talked about workforce, um it

1:04:01came up that that English language

1:04:03training was one of the biggest things

1:04:04that we kept hearing about and the need

1:04:05for coordinated English language

1:04:07learning um because most folks said that

1:04:09was one of the largest barriers to work,

1:04:12which is not a surprise, but I think

1:04:13when you really drill down to it, it's

1:04:15important for us to center that because

1:04:16it feels very tangible. And again, going

1:04:18back to your micro goals, what can come

1:04:20out of that? if that's coming up again

1:04:21and again, how can we take some first

1:04:22steps towards better coordination with

1:04:24that? And then I had like four bullets

1:04:26on one of the slides with a couple other

1:04:28summaries of of that area. And I'm also

1:04:30happy to send um some notes from those

1:04:32focus groups to the council if you'd

1:04:34like to see the full full details.

1:04:36>> Great. Um

1:04:38the last point and as I'm listening to

1:04:40you and I I guess maybe relay this to

1:04:44the senior adviser and the mayor I when

1:04:46I when I think about what's being

1:04:48mentioned resources and communication

1:04:50coordination I'm I'm brought to think

1:04:54about the Lawrence partnership and when

1:04:56they host their which is it's huge

1:05:00and there's people that invest in it and

1:05:02I see the turnout it's pretty hu I feel

1:05:05like the city needs to do their own

1:05:06version of that. Um, and they, you know

1:05:10what I mean? Like we're we're supposed

1:05:11to be the one uh steering those type of

1:05:16uh events and and those partnerships.

1:05:19Um, it's good to to see what other

1:05:22organizations are doing and it it's

1:05:24working for them and what are ways that

1:05:26we should be kind of doing our own thing

1:05:29and using um those relationships to

1:05:34pretty much help us facilitate what the

1:05:36vision is for the city. Um, council I I

1:05:40don't know if you had anything to say.

1:05:41>> I wanted to mention something that I

1:05:44think should be part of it. uh the

1:05:46document [snorts]

1:05:47um and um MVPC can include some of the

1:05:52answer some of the questions you had uh

1:05:54councelor Lel plant um of cities and

1:05:58communities that have been successful.

1:06:00Uh there's a list of them that we did

1:06:02some quick research myself um uh Frank

1:06:06and and I also have done some of them.

1:06:08I'm not going to go through them uh

1:06:11because I think that should be discussed

1:06:13with our consultant. uh I think is a

1:06:15valid question that uh has been raised

1:06:19and should receive a response because um

1:06:22it validates that number one the

1:06:25community would say okay why are you

1:06:26spending the money in this uh and after

1:06:29you ask the question if I would have

1:06:31been a resident and I'm not

1:06:32knowledgeable of of the of the subject I

1:06:36would say you know he's right why are we

1:06:37spending so much money where in which

1:06:39other communities because we haven't

1:06:40heard about this uh in in that is

1:06:43happening elsewhere where but it it is

1:06:46happening and it has produced results.

1:06:49Some communities have benefited more

1:06:51than others but it depends on on the uh

1:06:55on the elected officials the community

1:06:59in general and how is it sold to

1:07:01investors. Uh the other part is um you

1:07:04can also compare it to a comprehensive

1:07:07planning process which also [snorts] res

1:07:10relies on an economic de economic

1:07:13development information. Um many

1:07:16communities rely on on uh how you're

1:07:20planning in the next 10 years. What is

1:07:22it that you're going to do? How that why

1:07:24is that document so important? because

1:07:26that's how you determine how much

1:07:27funding you're going to put into

1:07:29schools, in transportation, in fixing

1:07:31roads and so forth. When we came in, um

1:07:35we did have some information that um

1:07:38mass development um had. We requested

1:07:41some of the information that they had

1:07:42early on uh during the first term. We

1:07:45sat with them and then there was also

1:07:47economic prosperity plan that was

1:07:49prepared um just for us to um initiate

1:07:54this process. But the the questions are

1:07:56legitimate in your answer to answer your

1:08:00question. I remember when I first

1:08:02started uh I first worked with the city

1:08:04of Lawrence and here there was uh some

1:08:07sort of uh distrust in government at

1:08:11that time as well. And in those days was

1:08:13the Hispanic community, the Latino

1:08:15community that didn't felt that they

1:08:17were were acknowledged or there was not

1:08:20much that was done for them. remember

1:08:22downtown after the 80s and then you had

1:08:25the 90s. It was basically

1:08:28um a ghost a ghost city. Uh but not only

1:08:31Lawrence, it was l it was Haveril. Uh

1:08:35Somerville was part of it. Chelsea and

1:08:38also Charles Town was initially uh a

1:08:41place where recodist or uh people um

1:08:48stayed in the community because there

1:08:50was a prison. But then Lawrence in the

1:08:53in the basically relied back then there

1:08:56was a lot of uh drug activities in the

1:08:58city and that is not happening in our

1:09:01downtown area which is is becoming

1:09:03revitalized and and at that time I

1:09:07remember I told the mayor Patricia

1:09:08Darling uh and it was also recorded in

1:09:11one of the newspaper that says we don't

1:09:13need government

1:09:15what we need is to entice because it's

1:09:18it's capital that is invested but how is

1:09:20it that I'm going to convince you as a

1:09:23investor to see Lawrence as one of your

1:09:26options and without a plan or without

1:09:29numbers that what we're doing right

1:09:31[snorts] now or MVPC is doing it's not

1:09:34credible is by hearsay. Uh the other

1:09:37part yes I do believe that um the city

1:09:40should be uh take the take the initial

1:09:44lead but I believe at that time based on

1:09:47conversations that I had with several

1:09:50members of um uh let's say the founding

1:09:53fathers of MVP um of [snorts] the

1:09:56Lawrence partnership

1:09:58um you know the city was involved but

1:10:01then they took the lead and in a sense

1:10:04it's good but if the city decides if if

1:10:07the elected officials decide you that

1:10:10represent the community that it's

1:10:12necessary for us to get more involved. I

1:10:14think um that is something that we can

1:10:17contemplate without taking that

1:10:19independence from the business community

1:10:21because you can play politics with it as

1:10:23well and we try as much not to get

1:10:26involved in in the b in in that sense

1:10:29with the business community. Sorry.

1:10:33>> Okay.

1:10:33>> Um did the Oh,

1:10:37>> did you want to say something?

1:10:38>> I will say that to the council

1:10:40president.

1:10:40>> Oh, okay. I was supposed to say speak

1:10:41into the mic. Um I'm so sorry, council

1:10:43president. One more thing that I forgot

1:10:45to mention

1:10:46>> as I'm hearing you speak regarding the

1:10:49bachelor's degree.

1:10:50>> Yeah.

1:10:51>> Part of me wants to kind of feel a

1:10:52little bit

1:10:54I it's like it's a touchy subject for me

1:10:56because I come from a vocational school

1:10:58and I'm a big believer that the city

1:11:00does a lot to invest in um training

1:11:05um whether it's via mass hire or just

1:11:09partnering with other organizations

1:11:11um giving our students other avenues to

1:11:16success and

1:11:18I am curious to see was that considered

1:11:22in the data

1:11:24>> certainly one of the things that we

1:11:26think about is not just bachelor degrees

1:11:29they're one factor in the data we're

1:11:30looking at um but there are a lot of

1:11:32jobs out there that don't require a

1:11:33bachelor's degree so one of the things

1:11:35we've been looking at is what are the

1:11:37top sectors for employment in the city

1:11:39and what is the level of degree

1:11:40attainment required for those jobs and

1:11:42so not only looking at you know what do

1:11:45you need to get to that job but also

1:11:46what is that job paying and so we do

1:11:48have some charts I'm happy to send them

1:11:49along in addition to this PowerPoint

1:11:51where we have a the top sectors for

1:11:53employment employing the most people b

1:11:55what is the average wage for those jobs

1:11:57and c what is the degree required for

1:11:59those jobs and you certainly see um

1:12:02plenty of jobs that don't require a

1:12:03bachelor's degree that are paying a lot.

1:12:05Also huge fans of the tech schools.

1:12:06We've had them involved in the

1:12:07conversations. They joined our workforce

1:12:09focus group, both the tech schools and

1:12:11NCC, which of course is associates

1:12:13degrees and other certificate programs.

1:12:15And so we're looking beyond just a

1:12:16four-year degree.

1:12:17>> Okay. Thank you. Thank you, Council

1:12:19President.

1:12:20>> Thank you. Um

1:12:24yeah, very excited, very excited about

1:12:26this topic and everybody I guess that uh

1:12:29it's excited to to have this

1:12:31conversation.

1:12:32>> That's good. People usually think my

1:12:34stuff is boring. So, I'm glad that

1:12:35you're excited with it.

1:12:36>> So many things going on at the same

1:12:39time. I mean, my mind is is is blowing

1:12:42so many things, you know, so many

1:12:45thinking too many things. But I mean I

1:12:47think that going back to cancel a plan

1:12:50uh I think that what we need to do on

1:12:52this master plan is to make sure that

1:12:56you know we have one

1:12:58>> because otherwise we're just [snorts]

1:13:00going to be like in the way that we have

1:13:03been

1:13:04>> we haven't defined what is it that are

1:13:07the main priorities of the city

1:13:10>> when it comes to creating jobs when it

1:13:12comes to potentially housing when it

1:13:14comes to pathway to success.

1:13:17And and I think that by by having a plan

1:13:21uh we have a definition and if we make

1:13:24it very generic

1:13:26>> and we defined the need of the city it

1:13:30is not going to depend on who is who is

1:13:32on on on that corner seat because if we

1:13:36make it very generic we're going to

1:13:38define points that that person that is

1:13:41sitting on that corner uh is going to

1:13:44agree upon. So making sure that the the

1:13:47plant bite uh make sure that everybody

1:13:51is engaged into into the plan uh and

1:13:56making it you know open it up to the

1:13:58community that that ensure that you know

1:14:01people get engaged into developing it

1:14:04and and eventually uh anybody that um

1:14:07sit on [snorts] there going to you know

1:14:11buy in into a potential specific speific

1:14:15specific things that we have in the

1:14:16plan. [snorts] You know, it's frustrate

1:14:18me that sometime that we don't have a

1:14:21definition of what we're looking for in

1:14:22the city and sometime we just depend on,

1:14:25you know, what is it that we can do on

1:14:28this location perhaps or what is it that

1:14:30we can do on on on

1:14:34an specific area? How can we develop it?

1:14:37At the moment we jump in and we are we

1:14:39act uh reactively

1:14:42and people come in and said oh I can do

1:14:46this and then another person come in and

1:14:50say yeah I I support that person and all

1:14:52of the sudden we're doing something that

1:14:54is not quite the city's benefit

1:14:57somebody else benefit because we

1:15:00reacting to the situation and we want to

1:15:02do something by defining this plan very

1:15:05broad We gonna we're gonna touch base on

1:15:09those that the city needs this. What is

1:15:14that? I don't know. I'm not going to

1:15:16define it myself.

1:15:18I going to allow others to define it.

1:15:20And if we make that abroad, that

1:15:23definition is very open that whoever

1:15:26seat on any of the seats either here or

1:15:29down there [snorts]

1:15:30uh going to agree upon something that we

1:15:32already talk about it. And that's

1:15:35basically my a good definition of what a

1:15:37a a master plan is. Master plan is is

1:15:40master is is not a specific necessarily

1:15:43even though we have minor uh goals that

1:15:46we're going to accomplish uh at the

1:15:48moment that we implementing but always

1:15:50with the main goal in mind which is it

1:15:54could be creating jobs uh in economic

1:15:57development based on job creation. And

1:15:59if we define it as that and then you

1:16:03know the key indicators are going to be

1:16:06uh second to that [clears throat]

1:16:08perhaps if we have if we define the

1:16:10goals of creating jobs and we have 20

1:16:14different activities attached to those

1:16:1620 20 attached to each of those

1:16:18activities we're going to have an

1:16:20specific amount of job that we're

1:16:21looking for. Mhm.

1:16:23>> And if we accomplish that and then

1:16:25eventually anybody that come over and

1:16:27say, "Look, there is a specific things

1:16:29on that plan that I want to implement.

1:16:31There is other things that are going to

1:16:32disagree." That's fine. At least you're

1:16:34doing something out of the plan. And and

1:16:36and that the city is is well defined and

1:16:39eventually we're going to have result

1:16:43and that's how I see this type of

1:16:45process. Uh also uh when it comes to u

1:16:50you know the mentality of the people

1:16:51from Lars what is it to me is different

1:16:55than anybody anybody sitting on this

1:16:57group or anybody sitting on this room a

1:17:01lot of people uh get that mentality of

1:17:06if you get to Lawrence is a transitional

1:17:08city

1:17:09and they don't feel proud about staying

1:17:12a lot of people leave how can we work on

1:17:16on on this master plan. The you know how

1:17:19people feel proud about the city and

1:17:22that's something that the going back to

1:17:24my original point the engagement of the

1:17:26community uh within the plan and

1:17:29[snorts] doing a specific things that uh

1:17:33is going to engage the community going

1:17:34to make them feel proud and they're not

1:17:36looking forward to just move sometime

1:17:38when they have those bachelor's degree.

1:17:41It's a way it's it's a time to move out.

1:17:44That's how they define success. Oh, I

1:17:48have a good job. I I get a I get my

1:17:50bachelors. I get my masters

1:17:54and and then all of a sudden they move.

1:17:57How can we get uh and by the way that

1:18:00was not my case. I get my masters and

1:18:02then I move to the city.

1:18:04Uh because I see how the city was have a

1:18:08lot of potential

1:18:10and Essentially, that's basically how

1:18:12we're going to uh uh have people that

1:18:15feel proud and feel engaged and and and

1:18:18and feel that the city is part of their

1:18:20own. I think that that's that's

1:18:23something essential the people the

1:18:25definition of the plant also how we

1:18:27going to defi how we going to prioritize

1:18:29the plant if it is based on job

1:18:32creation. I just taking that as an

1:18:33example. [snorts] How we going to be

1:18:35able to define

1:18:38those benefit to create jobs tiff?

1:18:41How we going to be providing tiff? It's

1:18:44not just because someone would like to

1:18:46get a tiff.

1:18:49It's how much of of how many job you're

1:18:51going to be creating to

1:18:53>> justify

1:18:54>> justify the tiff. If you create one job,

1:18:58you know, you know what I'm going to

1:18:59say? I'm not going to say [laughter]

1:19:02but you know but if you're creating an

1:19:04specific amount that the the plan define

1:19:07it I define this as okay you are going

1:19:12to be able to based on the plant at

1:19:13least apply and then let's see what

1:19:15happen

1:19:17and the council will make a

1:19:18determination the mayor will make a

1:19:20determination on that but at least we

1:19:22have we have something that is well

1:19:24defined and we are not we not just

1:19:27taking

1:19:29something out of okay we have done this

1:19:32in 20 in the past why not why why am I

1:19:36am I not going to get a tiff

1:19:38>> so those type of definitions is what

1:19:40going to uh make sure that we have a

1:19:42successful something a successful plan

1:19:45or successful idea or something around

1:19:48that so I think that you know having

1:19:50this plant well defined uh with you know

1:19:53broad amount of goals that you know

1:19:55anybody that sit on any seat will take

1:19:59something out of the land and that is is

1:20:01significant because they have the

1:20:03tangibles.

1:20:04>> What are those tangibles? What are the

1:20:06key indicators of those? And I seen that

1:20:09as a potential I seeing this as a

1:20:12potential topic that you know can bring

1:20:14a lot of people together

1:20:16and you know political differences. I

1:20:18don't I don't you know I'm not buying

1:20:20into that. If we put the city first

1:20:23there is not going to be political

1:20:25differences.

1:20:26What we need to define in a broad point

1:20:29of view it is what is it that we want to

1:20:32see want people to stay.

1:20:35Believe it or not every time that I

1:20:37speak with somebody in Marabali

1:20:40they have something to do with Lawrence

1:20:44especially old people. I love to talk to

1:20:46old people because they always said oh

1:20:49you live on Lens. I used to live on this

1:20:51place. My father used to live on this

1:20:53place. My mother my grandpad. some

1:20:56everybody from around I mean majority of

1:20:59people from around the area have

1:21:00something to do with Lawrence. How can

1:21:03we you know engage those that were part

1:21:08of the city at some point and they move

1:21:10out for some reason and then make them

1:21:12make them come make them spend some

1:21:15dollars here because I mean

1:21:19minor things make a difference. I

1:21:21remember a point example

1:21:24that when we actually pull all the flags

1:21:27on the on the common, a lot of people

1:21:30came because of because of all the flags

1:21:32that we put in there. Nobody was

1:21:34thinking about the economic portion of

1:21:35it, the economic development portion of

1:21:37it. But a lot of people used to come

1:21:39from around the area, take pictures,

1:21:41look at it, read about it, and all of a

1:21:45sudden they were going to local

1:21:46restaurants

1:21:48uh and eat and and enjoy food. and then

1:21:51all of a sudden they have a

1:21:52conversation. Oh, you know, positive

1:21:56things and and other not as positive.

1:21:59But what I'm saying is we need to have

1:22:01something that we can go by

1:22:04on this plans just to uh yield yield my

1:22:07my my time on this plan. I think we

1:22:11should define also how we going to we're

1:22:13going to see the city in the future.

1:22:16Do we we do we want a clean city?

1:22:20Right. If we do want a clean city, those

1:22:23are the recommended steps when it comes

1:22:25to ordinance,

1:22:28perhaps prohibiting some things that are

1:22:30going out of hands

1:22:32and working together with the city

1:22:34council as of this should be some type

1:22:38of prohibition that you put in place

1:22:41because otherwise we're not going to

1:22:42accomplish this. We're not going to

1:22:44accomplish anything on this plan.

1:22:47I mean working together with different

1:22:49ordinance that we might put in place as

1:22:53part of the part of the plans will be

1:22:56essential. Yes. What we need to do

1:22:59essentially is defining what is it that

1:23:00we want.

1:23:02>> So um council president is there

1:23:03anything cuz I'm assuming we're going to

1:23:05table this item and then ask you guys

1:23:07back to get an update. Um you you

1:23:10mentioned that there will be future

1:23:13focus groups. Did you say that uh some

1:23:16of these focus groups you might invite

1:23:18counselors? I'm not sure.

1:23:20>> We would certainly want a form where we

1:23:21could have you all there. I just want to

1:23:23respect whatever setup we need to do

1:23:25regards to open meeting law, but we

1:23:27would like to have a a session where we

1:23:28can have more direct targeted questions

1:23:30for you all and get feedback if that's

1:23:32something you're open to. If that's

1:23:33doing like a committee of the whole and

1:23:34public

1:23:35>> I was about to mention that committee

1:23:36>> just advertise a public meeting but you

1:23:39just have it be targeted at this. We

1:23:41would love to do that.

1:23:42>> Well, whenever you're ready. Um, and if

1:23:44there's anything that you may want to

1:23:48propose for the next time that they come

1:23:50before us, any type of request, uh,

1:23:53anything that you guys would like to

1:23:54see, any documentation, any data, um,

1:23:59>> target,

1:24:04>> uh, if you could.

1:24:05>> Yeah. So next time that we meet I would

1:24:07like to see like you know some type of

1:24:09tangibles of the plan as to how we're

1:24:11going to proceed minor things or or

1:24:13bigger things and also example of

1:24:16mobility that we're going to be using uh

1:24:18at in the city uh and talk about that

1:24:21and if you guys going to implement job

1:24:24creations how that going to look like

1:24:27then we can talk about those three and

1:24:28>> I want to make sure a madam clerk gets

1:24:30that so that way we have it in writing

1:24:33as what was requested.

1:24:35Um, councelor Lelant.

1:24:37>> Yeah, I just have a question. This is

1:24:38actually I think to Mr. Spanner. Uh, I

1:24:42think anybody we had a guy by the name

1:24:43of Jim Carris who was uh somebody who

1:24:46was very did a lot of work. He's was a

1:24:49Harvard professor still is.

1:24:51>> Um, and I remember he was interviewing

1:24:54me back maybe three years ago and he was

1:24:56doing a lot of work on that. So I think

1:24:58that there's been a lot of ground that's

1:25:00already been been made on that. talked

1:25:02with him and he's been involved in some

1:25:04of the steering committee meetings and

1:25:05welcome to join them and give feedback

1:25:06because some of the work he was doing

1:25:08was in regards to the urban urban

1:25:10renewal plan but I've been in

1:25:12communication with him and getting some

1:25:13of the feedback that he's received

1:25:14already so that's being incorporated as

1:25:16well.

1:25:16>> Now the L was doing a lot of work as

1:25:18well and I realize that's a kind of a

1:25:20third rail discussion but I I know that

1:25:22they were doing some stuff.

1:25:24>> Yes.

1:25:24>> And I'm just wondering again rather than

1:25:28>> that they plowed some ground. you're

1:25:31exactly right. Let's find out what's

1:25:32going on

1:25:32>> in recognizing that there's a lot of

1:25:34other questions out there in that area

1:25:36right now. But when we first started

1:25:37this process, the initial um approach

1:25:40was going to be doing as much from both

1:25:42the economic development plan and the

1:25:44urban renewal plan at the same time so

1:25:46that we weren't duplicating efforts

1:25:48going forward. So at least over the past

1:25:50few months, I was coordinating with

1:25:52James Carris um on some of the items

1:25:54that he was doing on the urban renewal

1:25:56plan and that I was doing on the

1:25:57economic development plan and we were

1:25:59combining some efforts. So, for example,

1:26:00the resident survey, some of the

1:26:02questions on there were questions he was

1:26:04looking to have answered for some of

1:26:05those pieces. And vice versa, he has to

1:26:07do anything from an urban renewal

1:26:09standpoint. He's also um collecting

1:26:11information for this plan as well. And

1:26:13so, we've been sharing data points,

1:26:15feedback, and focus groups so that we

1:26:17can make sure we're not then going back

1:26:18and asking the public or or residents

1:26:20for a whole another section of feedback

1:26:22on a whole new plan. We're doing it at

1:26:23the same time.

1:26:24>> Good.

1:26:24>> Yep.

1:26:24>> Good.

1:26:25>> Did you want

1:26:26>> Okay. Um well on my end it was just

1:26:29seeing the micro goals.

1:26:31>> Yeah.

1:26:32>> And actionable items as to what it is

1:26:34that is required on the city's end or on

1:26:36the city council's end to currently work

1:26:40towards accomplishing those micro goals.

1:26:42>> And so a question I would I would have

1:26:44for you too is would you like us to have

1:26:47there's two approaches we can take with

1:26:48that. One is structuring a discussion to

1:26:51help you articulate some of those goals

1:26:53with us or we can come to you with

1:26:55already propos proposed goals for you to

1:26:57say or action items micro goals for you

1:27:00to say these are good or these are bad

1:27:01and we do that in varying ways. What

1:27:04what what would this body be looking for

1:27:05in terms of a structured discussion from

1:27:07us? Do you want us to already have the

1:27:09prepared micro goals for you to look at

1:27:11or do you want us to have the buckets

1:27:13and then we tease out together what that

1:27:15might look like

1:27:17>> based on the current focus groups um

1:27:19discussions that you've had.

1:27:22>> Is there a common ground as to what are

1:27:26some because I know there's many goals?

1:27:29>> Yeah. What we we can do is we can come

1:27:31up with some specific

1:27:33Yep.

1:27:33>> I'm not the expert of economic

1:27:35development. I just happen to chair it.

1:27:37[laughter]

1:27:38just happened to chair the committee.

1:27:40>> But I I personally for me, I look to the

1:27:42experts to tell me

1:27:44>> based on the needs of the city, based on

1:27:45the data, you know, uh based on speaking

1:27:48with these different organizations that

1:27:51are more of like the the boots on the

1:27:53ground. Yeah.

1:27:54>> Having this close relationship with

1:27:56businesses as to what is it that the

1:28:00city needs cuz I'm going to talk like me

1:28:02personally coming up with goals. I could

1:28:03talk to you as a standpoint as a

1:28:06consumer myself, as a resident. I'm

1:28:08thinking of parking. I'm thinking of

1:28:10helping [snorts] small businesses and

1:28:11I'm thinking of job creation. Yeah.

1:28:13>> But I know that there's there's layers

1:28:16to this. And I don't want my um

1:28:22my lack of I don't want to say education

1:28:24or knowledge within this realm to not

1:28:27include maybe other more important goals

1:28:30that probably require priority and our

1:28:33attention at the moment.

1:28:34>> We can bring specific recommendations

1:28:36and goals. The only reason I ask is

1:28:38sometimes I'll go before a council or

1:28:39board and they'll say, "You didn't

1:28:40consult me before coming up with these

1:28:41specifics." And I don't want I want to

1:28:43make sure I'm going through all the

1:28:44right steps for you all.

1:28:45>> [laughter]

1:28:46>> Um, so we're happy to come to you with

1:28:48some specifics and then we'll we'll

1:28:49build on

1:28:49>> come with the specifics and if you guys

1:28:51are open to make adjustments or adding,

1:28:54you know,

1:28:54>> we're not asking for fun. We're open for

1:28:56it and we want to know.

1:28:57>> All right. Um, any lasting comments?

1:29:01Okay. So, I'm looking for a motion to

1:29:03table this item.

1:29:04>> So, move.

1:29:05>> Okay. Can I get a second?

1:29:10>> Did you properly second it? I'm out of

1:29:12here. I'm so sorry. Um, all those in No,

1:29:16we don't need a roll call anymore. All

1:29:18those

1:29:18>> we do. Sorry.

1:29:21>> I think we do. Um, all those in favor

1:29:23say I. I.

1:29:24>> I. Motion carries. Um, counselors,

1:29:28before we adjourn, I'm looking for a

1:29:30motion to withdraw item

1:29:34uh it's under tabled new business

1:29:37January 20th, 2026. It's item 2226,

1:29:42the update on status of litigation

1:29:44regarding the Lawrence Redevelopment

1:29:46Authority, LRA property transfers. Um,

1:29:51we already received we already received

1:29:53an update. Um, so I'm looking to have

1:29:57this item withdrawn.

1:29:59>> Withdraw.

1:30:00>> Can I get a second?

1:30:01>> Second.

1:30:01>> All those in favor say I. I.

1:30:03>> I. And the eyes have it. Madam,

1:30:04>> we send the full council to withdraw,

1:30:06right?

1:30:07>> Yeah.

1:30:07>> Okay. It's item 0226.

1:30:14There has been a motion to send up to

1:30:16the full council for withdrawal.

1:30:22And

1:30:26um

1:30:28>> what what about these L L parcels that

1:30:31are just taking up space?

1:30:33>> Where

1:30:33>> the next page?

1:30:34>> The second uh page two. Page two. All of

1:30:38them

1:30:42>> just uh just I mean

1:30:44>> should we make a motion to withdraw

1:30:47these as well or what's the

1:30:49recommendation

1:30:51>> until I mean I'm assuming that the

1:30:53conversation will will go back.

1:30:56>> Say that again.

1:30:57>> I'm assuming that the conversation will

1:30:59go back. I mean we can send it up to

1:31:02withdraw, but I mean I don't think it's

1:31:04a good idea.

1:31:05>> You do or don't? No,

1:31:07>> you don't think it's you should you

1:31:08think we should keep it here?

1:31:09>> Yeah.

1:31:11At some point they're going to come back

1:31:13to discuss with us.

1:31:17>> I uh

1:31:20[snorts]

1:31:21I don't know. I have a I I know we all

1:31:24have our personal opinions right now.

1:31:25>> What do you guys want?

1:31:31going your going with your route as

1:31:33leaving these items tabled would leave

1:31:35it up now for potential future

1:31:38discussions on a case-by case basis or

1:31:41on a parcel by parcel basis.

1:31:44>> Okay, let's send it to

1:31:48>> I know that that's just my opinion. I'm

1:31:50not Is that your sentiment as well,

1:31:52counselor?

1:31:55I just think that a lot of things have

1:31:57happened since these proposals were

1:31:58initiated. It's been over a year. A lot

1:32:01of things have happened. A lot of things

1:32:04in this building have happened. And I

1:32:06just I just think that we're going to

1:32:08need to start from scratch. Okay.

1:32:10>> On some of them. I just think if if

1:32:11there is a proposal that somebody wants

1:32:13to

1:32:14>> pick any one of them out,

1:32:18[snorts]

1:32:18>> I got it. Let's send it up to the full

1:32:20council to

1:32:20>> Could we get a motion as a block? Should

1:32:23we do it as a block?

1:32:24>> Um, could someone uh make that motion,

1:32:26please?

1:32:26>> Um, I'll be happy to read it. I'd like

1:32:28to make a motion that we withdraw

1:32:29document 30 33225. I'm just going to

1:32:32mention that the property. So, it's on

1:32:34the record. Approval of the transfer of

1:32:35city owned parcel to the LRA, which is

1:32:37the seven of the uh let me how should I

1:32:41say this? the South Canal phase 1

1:32:43Marramac paper 33325

1:32:46which is the South Canal phase 2 33425

1:32:50which is the Peton Park parcel number

1:32:533325 which is the Methuan Street East

1:32:56parcel 33625 which is Methuan West

1:33:00parcel 33725 which is the uh Essex

1:33:04Street 205 Essex Street parcel 33825

1:33:08which is the Common Street West or 40

1:33:11442502

1:33:13Common Street

1:33:15and I think last is 33925 approval. Uh

1:33:18I'm sorry uh the Common Street East

1:33:20which is 139 Common Street.

1:33:25>> Motion to withdraw those.

1:33:26>> Second.

1:33:27>> Okay. All those in favor say I.

1:33:29>> I. Motion carries. Madame clerk, do you

1:33:33were you able to um understand it's

1:33:35pretty much all of page two sent up to

1:33:39uh full counsel for a withdrawal?

1:33:42And

1:33:49I'm so sorry, guys. I'm looking to see

1:33:51if it's still necessary to have this

1:33:53still tabled. It's on the third page. um

1:33:57tabled under new business February 6,

1:33:592024. Um economic development committee

1:34:03update council president um

1:34:08it's your name, my name and and

1:34:12vice president at the time, Stephanie

1:34:14Infante. Councelor Infante, do we need

1:34:17this item still?

1:34:18>> It's very related to this item.

1:34:19>> It's a but it's a committee. No, it's

1:34:22the committee. Committee updates.

1:34:23>> Oh, we don't need it.

1:34:24>> Yeah. It says economic development

1:34:26committee update. So there's no update

1:34:28on on the on behalf of the committee. So

1:34:32I'm looking for a motion to

1:34:33>> withdraw. I'll move on that motion to

1:34:35withdraw.

1:34:35>> Can I get a second?

1:34:36>> Second.

1:34:37>> All those in favor say I.

1:34:38>> I.

1:34:39>> I.

1:34:39>> If we're doing house cleaning.

1:34:41>> I mean what's apparent. So I don't know

1:34:43if there's anything.

1:34:44>> I've got stuff that I put 2010. I'm I'm

1:34:46not moving on it. So if you want I mean

1:34:48that's 16 years ago. It's the first

1:34:50thing on the agenda.

1:34:52>> Okay. Uh I just we haven't moved on it.

1:34:55And

1:34:56>> what page is it on?

1:34:57>> Last page.

1:34:58>> Page five. No,

1:35:01>> what was the item that you mentioned

1:35:02before? The economic development.

1:35:03>> So it's page three.

1:35:05>> Yes.

1:35:05>> 2824.

1:35:07It's under new business February 6,

1:35:092024.

1:35:13>> Okay.

1:35:14>> All right. Right now we're on page

1:35:18six.

1:35:19>> Six.

1:35:20>> Go ahead. Go ahead. I'm a little I'm a

1:35:22little queasy on 288a so I'll pass that

1:35:24one. So just 36410 housing receiverhip

1:35:26program looking to make a motion to

1:35:28withdraw sign up to

1:35:30>> 36410

1:35:31>> 36410

1:35:34all these are my are essentially my

1:35:36items.

1:35:39>> Um a motion has been made. I'm looking

1:35:41for a second.

1:35:44>> Second.

1:35:46>> Uh motion made properly second. All

1:35:48those in favor say I. I I and the eyes

1:35:51have it. Madam clerk, you have it.

1:35:5236410.

1:35:54>> Yes. [snorts]

1:35:55>> Okay.

1:35:55>> Next is 27412 conditions at 77 South

1:35:58Union Street. Looking I'm making a

1:36:00motion to withdraw. Send this up to full

1:36:02counsel. [snorts]

1:36:03>> Second.

1:36:04>> All those in favor say I.

1:36:06>> I.

1:36:07>> Uh this councelor hasn't been around a

1:36:10bazillion years. 26813 26913. These are

1:36:14both city-owned properties review.

1:36:16Looking to send this up. You want to

1:36:17keep that here? That's the That was that

1:36:20three minutes. That was the item that we

1:36:22used to kind of like get update from

1:36:24different sales.

1:36:25>> Okay, never mind.

1:36:26>> Remember the one that we just have?

1:36:27>> Sure.

1:36:28>> Oh, okay.

1:36:28>> What about What about 4114

1:36:31acceptance of attorney general's grant

1:36:33of 80 80,000? I'm sure we've gotten it.

1:36:36>> Yep.

1:36:36>> Make a motion to withdraw.

1:36:38>> Second.

1:36:39>> All those in favor say I.

1:36:41>> I.

1:36:42>> Uh 69. I'm going to go fast if I'm

1:36:44going.

1:36:44>> Madam clerk, that was 4114. I'm so

1:36:46sorry, counselor. 4114 withdrawal. Okay.

1:36:50Go ahead, councelor. I'm sorry.

1:36:51>> 69 B 09 I guess. Disposition of 30306

1:36:56Prospect Street. Looking to withdraw.

1:36:59>> Second.

1:37:00>> All those in favor say I.

1:37:02>> I.

1:37:03>> Uh 2 um 270 287 BO4 surplus property at

1:37:07318 Lola Street. Looking to make a

1:37:09motion to withdraw.

1:37:11>> Second.

1:37:11>> All those in favor say I.

1:37:13>> I.

1:37:14195A

1:37:16surplus property 7 Florence Street.

1:37:18Making a motion to withdraw.

1:37:21>> Second.

1:37:23>> All those in favor say I.

1:37:24>> I.

1:37:26>> 276B13

1:37:28Surplus Property 25 Oxford Street.

1:37:30Looking to make a motion to withdraw.

1:37:32>> Second.

1:37:33>> All those in favor say I.

1:37:34>> I.

1:37:35>> I.

1:37:36>> And I'm going to stop at this last one

1:37:37just I'm getting tired. Uh 34214 Fire

1:37:40Station, corner of Oxford and Low

1:37:42Street. Looking to make a motion to

1:37:44withdraw.

1:37:44>> Second.

1:37:48>> Okay. All those in favor say I.

1:37:50>> I.

1:37:51>> And that was a productive

1:37:56a productive meeting. Um going to get a

1:37:59motion to adjourn.

1:38:01>> So moved. Second.

1:38:02>> All those in favor say I. I.

1:38:05>> Good evening.

1:38:09[laughter]