2026-10-06 - City Council

00:0720 seconds.

00:10Ready?

00:11>> All right.

00:13>> Good evening. Welcome to the October

00:156th, 2026 meeting of the Topeka

00:18governing body. I will now call this

00:20meeting to order. This evening, Council

00:22Member Ortiz has the invocation. So, if

00:25you could please turn your attention to

00:26her and please rise if you are able.

00:32Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I would like to

00:34call up uh Reverend Jonas Franco to the

00:37podium.

00:40He is an ordained minister and member of

00:42a mintorial body of Pentecostal Church

00:44of God International Movement. He has

00:47served in ministry for 19 years and has

00:50had the privilege of serving in pastoral

00:52leadership within the Topeka community.

00:55Most recently he served for five years

00:58as senior pastor of Roco

01:04>> Frede I'm sorry during his pastorial

01:07tenure which means

01:10strong rock becoming actively engaged in

01:13the community serving and supporting

01:15individuals and families through a

01:17variety of outreach efforts and

01:19community incentives.

01:22Um, I'm not going to read the rest, but

01:24um, him and his wife along with their

01:27three children are grateful to call

01:28Kansas their home. And if you'd like to

01:30add anything to that, you you may. Thank

01:33you.

01:35>> Thank you. Good evening. Uh, first I

01:38want to express my sincere gratitude to

01:42the mayor, uh, the members of the city

01:45council, council member Silva Ortiz, and

01:48everyone who made it possible for me to

01:50be here this evening. Uh, thank you for

01:53the honor and privilege of offering

01:54tonight's invocation.

01:56Uh, as was mentioned, my name is

01:59Reverend Jonas Franco. My wife and I are

02:02currently in the process of planting a

02:04new congregation in uh Oakland uh

02:06community here in Topeka, Living Truth

02:09Church, uh Eglesia Verda Biva, part of

02:12the Pentecostal Church of God

02:13International Movement. Our denomination

02:16is represented uh internationally by our

02:19international bishop, Reverend William

02:20Ortiz. and I'm grateful for the

02:23spiritual covering and fellowship of our

02:25church organization as uh we begin this

02:28new work here in our community. It is

02:31truly an honor to stand before you

02:33tonight, not only as a minister, but

02:36also as someone who loves this community

02:38and believes in praying for those who

02:41have accepted the responsibility of

02:43serving it. I invite you to join me in

02:46prayer.

02:48In the name of the Father, the Son, and

02:50the Holy Spirit. Amen. Heavenly Father,

02:53we come before your presence tonight

02:55with grateful hearts, acknowledging that

02:58you are God, that you are sovereign, and

03:01that every good and perfect gift comes

03:04from you. Lord, tonight you uh we thank

03:09you for the city of Topeka. Thank you

03:11for every family, every neighborhood,

03:13every business, every church, and every

03:16person who calls this city home. Father,

03:19I lift before you, our mayor, every

03:22member of this city council, and all

03:24those who serve our community. Grant

03:27them the wisdom that comes from above.

03:29Give them discernment when decisions are

03:31difficult. Courage when leadership

03:34requires it and compassion to remember

03:36the people who lives are affected by the

03:39decisions made in this room. Holy

03:42Spirit, guide them. Where there is

03:44uncertainty, God, bring clarity. Where

03:47there is disagreement, bring

03:48understanding. Where there are

03:50challenges, Father God, provide

03:52solutions. And where there is division,

03:54Lord, help us find unity of purpose for

03:57the good of good of our community.

04:00Place your hand of protection over our

04:02city. Father, bless our police officers,

04:06firefighters, first responders,

04:09educators, city employee, community

04:12leaders, and all those who serve day

04:14after day, often without recognition.

04:18Remember our children, Father, and our

04:20young people. Remember our elderly.

04:23Remember those who are struggling, those

04:26who feel forgotten, those who are

04:28without adequate shelter or resources,

04:31and every family carrying burdens that

04:33no one else can see. May Topeka be a

04:36city where people can find hope,

04:38opportunity, peace, and community. And

04:42father, as this governing body conducts

04:44its business tonight, may every

04:46conversation and every decision be

04:49guided by wisdom, integrity, justice,

04:52and a sincere desire to serve. May your

04:55presence fill this place, and may your

04:57peace rest upon everyone gathered

04:59tonight. We place this meeting, our

05:02leaders, our families, and our beloved

05:03city of Topeka in your hands. And we ask

05:06all these things in the mighty and

05:08precious name of Jesus Christ. In the

05:11name of the Father, the Son, and the

05:13Holy Spirit. Amen.

05:15>> Amen.

05:16>> Amen.

05:21I pledge algiance to the flag of the

05:24United States of America and to the

05:27republic for which it stands. One nation

05:31under God, indivisible, with liberty and

05:35justice for all.

05:43>> All right. Ask the clerk to take roll

05:45call, please. Mayor Duncan

05:47>> here.

05:48>> Uh, Council Member Hiller

05:50>> here.

05:52Maldivia [clears throat] Aqua

05:54>> here. Ortiz

05:57>> here.

05:58>> Banks

05:59>> here.

06:00>> Kell

06:00>> here.

06:01>> Miller

06:02>> here.

06:02>> Bradberry here. McGee

06:05>> here.

06:06>> And Hoer

06:07>> here.

06:08>> All right, we have 10 present.

06:10>> All right, we'll move on to item two,

06:12appointments. City clerk.

06:15>> A is a board appointment recommending

06:17the appointment of Colleen Campbell to

06:19the Topeka Sustainability Advisory Board

06:20for a term ending October 6, 2028. B is

06:24a board appointment recommending the

06:25reappoint of Fatima Perez Luthie to the

06:28Topeka Metropolitan Transit Board for a

06:30term ending October 11, 2030. and C is a

06:33board appointment um recommending

06:35Michael Bayon to the Topeka City of or

06:38City of Topeka Americans with

06:39Disabilities Act Advisory Council for a

06:41term ending September 13, 2028.

06:44>> All right, we have a motion to approve

06:46from Council Member Kell

06:48and a second from Council Member McGee.

06:50Any questions or comments?

06:53If not, I ask the clerk to take a vote,

06:55please.

06:59>> Council member Valdivia Akla. Oh, you're

07:02in. Sorry. Gotcha.

07:04All right. We have nine. Yes, the motion

07:06carries.

07:08>> All right. I believe I see Colleen out

07:10there. I think Michael's here. I don't

07:11know if team is here, but if you'd

07:13stand, please be recognized. Thank you

07:16very much for willing to serve. It is

07:17much appreciated. [applause]

07:26With that, we will move on to item

07:28three, the consent agenda. City clerk. A

07:31is approval of public works department

07:32contract between the city of Topeka and

07:34JEO Consulting Group Incorporated for

07:37professional engineering and design

07:38services in an amount not to exceed

07:41$213,420.

07:44B is approval of a public works

07:45department contract between the city of

07:47Topeka and Bartland West Incorporated

07:48for professional engineering and design

07:51services in an amount not to exceed

07:53$373,896.

07:57C is approval of prof professional

07:59services contract between the city of

08:01Topeka and Columbia Capital Management

08:03LLC for debt and cash management

08:05services. D is an ordinance introduced

08:07by city manager Dr. Robert Perez

08:09allowing and approving city expenditures

08:11for the period of August 1 through

08:13August 28, 2026 and enumerating said

08:16expenditures therein. E are minutes of

08:19the regular meeting of September 15,

08:212026 and there are no applications.

08:26All right, we have a motion to approve

08:27from Council Member Miller and a second

08:29from Council Member Bradberry. The clerk

08:31would take the vote, please.

08:45>> Council member Bradberry.

08:51>> Okay, we have 10. Yes, the motion

08:53carries.

08:55All right, we're going to move on to

08:56action items. Start with 4 A. City

08:59clerk.

09:00>> A is an ordinance introduced by city

09:02manager Dr. Robert Perez pertaining to

09:04an amendment to the text and map of the

09:06Topeka comprehensive plan for the

09:08historic Oldtown Neighborhood Plan

09:10update.

09:11>> City Manager.

09:12>> Thank you, mayor, members of the

09:14governing body. As part of this item,

09:16you will be asked for your consideration

09:17to amend the city of Topeka's

09:18comprehensive plan to include the update

09:20to historic Oldtown neighborhood plan.

09:23Since 2025, the historic Oldtown

09:25community and staff have worked to

09:26update the neighborhood plan to

09:28memorialize conditions of neighborhood

09:30housing infrastructure crime and owner

09:32occupancy, highlight the neighborhood's

09:34profile and data, and discuss the

09:36neighborhood's vision and goals for

09:37future land use revital revitalization

09:39strategies and implementation of

09:41infrastructure pro projects utilizing

09:441.4 $4 million of Dreams One funding.

09:47With that, consistent with the planning

09:48commission's recommendation, staff and I

09:50do recommend approval of this item. And

09:52I will now turn this over to Dan Warner,

09:54director of planning and development to

09:55lead us through this discussion. Dan.

09:59>> Thank you, city manager, mayor,

10:00governing body. Um, as previously

10:03mentioned, this is uh the update of the

10:05historical town neighborhood plan. Uh,

10:08just a little bit on process. Uh, this

10:10is a fairly typical process that we

10:12follow. We'll have a kickoff meeting

10:14where we invite all the property owners

10:15in the neighborhood to attend and learn

10:17about what we're trying to do. Uh we ask

10:20folks to sign up and be part of

10:22committee that will review various parts

10:24of the plan. Um after that kickoff

10:26meeting at some point we'll end up at

10:28the final meeting where we'll, you know,

10:30have the draft done and we'll um ask

10:32folks to review that and perhaps, you

10:35know, prioritize a few things through

10:37some exercises. And then the last couple

10:40steps there go to the planning

10:42commission where they have a public

10:43hearing on the comprehensive plan

10:45amendment. And uh in this case the plan

10:48commission did recommend approval and

10:50then the governing body has the final

10:52say on this. So just a little bit about

10:55the neighborhood. Um you know the

10:57boundaries of Oldtown are 6th Avenue on

11:00the north, Topeka Boulevard on the east,

11:03um 10th on the south, and Summit on the

11:07west.

11:10So, this plan was originally done back

11:13in 2003.

11:16Um, so it's been a little bit since

11:18we've updated Oldtown's neighborhood

11:20plan. So, some of the issues that um

11:23were identified through this update is,

11:26you know, decreased homeownership rates.

11:29Um, we've that was based on the previous

11:32uh measurement back in 2003. There's a

11:35clear need for infrastructure that needs

11:37to be improved. Um, a lack of green

11:39space in the neighborhood and that's a

11:40an idea that carried back to the 2003

11:43plan as well. That neighborhood uh does

11:45not have a park. Um, that was identified

11:48back then and again as another as a

11:50continuing issue. Uh, lack of infill

11:53housing options and vacant lots within

11:56Oldtown. And we'll talk a little bit

11:58more about that.

12:01So, real quickly on future land use. Um,

12:04so the future land use, each

12:06neighborhood plan has a future land use

12:08plan has a more specific plan for a

12:10neighborhood. You know, our

12:11comprehensive plan has a future land use

12:13for the city that's more of a 30,000

12:15foot view. Uh, what we do with

12:17neighborhood plans is get in a little uh

12:20closer and and show some future land

12:22use. Uh, the changes here are fairly

12:25slight. Um, we're really promoting more

12:27neighborhood, commercial, mixed use

12:30type, basically more mixed use in the

12:33neighborhood. That was something the

12:34neighborhood mentioned, something that

12:35we're obviously in favor of

12:40infrastructure. So, this neighborhood is

12:42still part of the dreams one uh program

12:45that is no longer uh active in its

12:48current form. Um, so there's 1.4 million

12:51available for infrastructure projects in

12:53this as part of this process. So, the

12:55neighborhood identified 26 sidewalk

12:58projects, six curb and gutter, and a

13:00mill and overlay uh street project on

13:02southwest Lincoln.

13:05Um there's a number of projects um you

13:09know, again, multiple sidewalk projects

13:12and some other uh projects. Um and then

13:15the park um which I'll talk about coming

13:19up kind of foreshadowing a little bit

13:20here. That's part of the the it's not

13:23shown in this total, but that's another

13:25element of money that will be dedicated.

13:28Um, and what we always try to do in

13:30neighborhood plans is identify

13:32infrastructure projects that that can't

13:34that we just can't pay for now, but

13:36maybe in some point in the future when

13:38the neighborhood can find some other

13:40forms of funding, uh, they will have

13:43projects identified in their plan, they

13:45would have cost estimates, they will

13:46have, you know, from where to where and

13:49so on. So, uh, one of the future

13:51projects for Oldtown is potentially

13:53doing a mill and overlay on Southwest

13:55Pulk. Um, so a number of projects

13:58identified that that we just can't pay

14:00for now and that's about $1.4 million as

14:03well.

14:06So, plan highlights. Um, so really

14:08working to stabilize the intensive care

14:10block group. So, we have a neighborhood

14:12health for this neighborhood. It's got

14:13one intensive care block group. Uh we

14:15talked about infrastructure already and

14:17really that infrastructure was focused

14:19on accessibility throughout the

14:20neighborhood. So improving those

14:22sidewalks, making that accessibility

14:24work better and then activate vacant

14:27land through neighborhood scale economic

14:28development. And what this plan has that

14:31we haven't done before is a neighbor is

14:33a economic development chapter. Um, so

14:36Leah Bowling, the city's economic

14:39development director, put together the

14:41the economic development chapter that's

14:43in this plan, and that's something that

14:44we will continue through future

14:47neighborhood plans. You know, we're

14:48underway right now in East Topeka South.

14:50So, that neighborhood will also have an

14:52economic development plan. Um, and that

14:55plan's really focused on how to activate

14:57that vacant land. Um, and then I

15:00mentioned the park sort of already, but

15:03um, the neighborhood has worked with

15:04Shaunie County Parks and Wreck, and the

15:07county's actually purchased some land in

15:08the neighborhood, and they're going to,

15:10uh, develop a park in that neighborhood,

15:12and this Dreams funding will help pay

15:14for that. Um, so that's great news for

15:17the neighborhood. Again, that goes way

15:18back. Um, this neighborhood just has not

15:20had a park in the past. So, that's

15:22really great that that worked out.

15:25Um so staff recommends approval of this

15:28plan. Um we again the planning

15:31commission has has acted on this in a

15:33public hearing and has recommended

15:34approval. Um the next steps here is

15:38assuming the council approves tonight

15:40and it would move to project design and

15:42implementation in 27 and 28 um as we get

15:45those sidewalks and the various projects

15:48built. With that I'll be happy to try to

15:50answer any questions.

15:52>> Thank you Dan. Council member Hiller.

15:56>> Well, I don't have any questions. I just

15:57want to give a shout out to the

15:58neighborhood reps. The leadership is

16:00standing in the back there and they've

16:01worked really hard, had a lot of

16:03meetings with a variety of people

16:04through the neighborhood and the staff

16:06as well to get this cranked out. And um

16:09the vision that they have in terms of

16:11looking at really the variety of housing

16:14and other amenities that are in the

16:16neighborhood and what could work to fill

16:20and revitalize the blocks that need it.

16:23um in including the mixed use that Dan

16:25talked about. Those are those are really

16:27visionary and it it's really some great

16:29work also looking at various sources of

16:32funding not just the immediate city

16:35grants and again to the great credit of

16:37everybody involved and so I will

16:40certainly move to support

16:47>> council done council member Kell

16:51what um safety features were looked at

16:53around the hospitals because I know

16:55that's been a big issue for the last few

16:57years to try to improve some of the

17:00safety with all the foot traffic that

17:02happens around there plus all the

17:03accidents, people blowing through stop

17:05signs, things like that that keep on

17:07happening around the hospitals.

17:09So, the neighborhood plan specifically

17:12is probably focused on the areas that

17:14are outside of the hospital, the more

17:16residential areas and not so much the

17:18hospital. So, I don't know that the plan

17:21um or we looked very closely at at the

17:25the issues around the hospital from a

17:27traffic safety perspective. I'm not sure

17:30if there's been any other efforts uh by

17:32the city to do that, but I don't think

17:34the plan focused much on on the area

17:36around the hospital.

17:40>> All right. Thank you.

17:44>> All right. Any other comments or

17:46questions from the governing body? We

17:47have a motion to approve from Council

17:49Member Hiller. Uh, Council Member Ortiz,

17:53>> it's always good to see a updated plan.

17:56It's always good to see a park go in.

17:57What's the location for the park, Dan?

18:01>> I believe it is 7th and

18:06>> is it Western?

18:10Um,

18:10>> they're nodding. Yes.

18:11>> Yes.

18:12>> Seventh and Western. It's the [laughter]

18:14uh the northwest northeast corner.

18:19>> Okay.

18:21Just make sure those high school kids

18:22stay at school and not in the park like

18:25they do at high.

18:31See no other comments or questions. We

18:33have a motion to approve from council

18:34member Hiller.

18:36We have a second from Council Member

18:38Banks. Before any vote is taken, this

18:40does require anyone to uh indicate if

18:43they've had any exparte communication.

18:46Prior to proceeding with the vote, each

18:47member of the governing body who has

18:48engaged in exparte communication with

18:51any individual either in favor of or

18:53against that matter being considered

18:55must state that the communication

18:56occurred and indicate that even in light

18:58of having engaged in the communication,

19:00they were able to fairly, objectively,

19:02and impartially consider the measure

19:04based only upon the evidence provided on

19:06the record. The record includes the

19:08planning commission minutes, the staff

19:10report and its attachments, the public

19:11comments made during the planning

19:13commission hearing, and similar relevant

19:15information related to the matter. Does

19:18anyone have any exparte communication

19:20they would like to disclose?

19:22Council member Hiller,

19:24>> I was not at most of the work sessions,

19:26but I've had conversation with staff as

19:28well as with people from the

19:30neighborhood, and I do not think that

19:32will negatively influence my vote.

19:35>> Anyone else?

19:38All right. If there are no other

19:40comments or questions on this matter, we

19:42will ask the clerk to take the vote,

19:44please.

19:58Okay, we have 10. Yes, the motion

20:00carries.

20:03All right, with that we will move on to

20:06item

20:074B

20:10is an ordinance introduced by city

20:11manager Dr. Robert Perez amending the

20:13district map referred to and made a part

20:15of the zoning ordinances by section 1850

20:18of the Topeka municipal code by

20:20providing for certain changes in zoning

20:22on property located at 1600 Southwest

20:24Topeka Boulevard from OI12

20:27office in an institutional district to

20:29M12 family dwelling district all being

20:32within the city of Topeka Shauny County

20:34Kansas.

20:36>> City manager.

20:37>> Thank you mayor and members of the

20:38governing body. As part of this item,

20:40you will be asked to consider zoning

20:41change of a vacant property at 1600

20:44Southwest Top Pika Boulevard from office

20:45and institutional district to two family

20:48dwelling district to allow for

20:50construction of a duplex. Following the

20:52planning commission's recommendation for

20:53approval, staff and I recommend approval

20:55of this item. With that, I'll turn this

20:56over to Dan Warner, director of planning

20:58and development, to lead us through this

20:59item. Dan,

21:01>> thank you, city manager, mayor,

21:03governing body. Uh, we don't quite have

21:04the presentation up, but I'll go through

21:07this. Um, so as was mentioned, this is a

21:10resoning from Office and Institutional

21:12to M12 Family. This is a property at

21:151600 Southwest Topeka Boulevard. Uh,

21:18this is on the corner. It's been vacant

21:20for a few years now. Uh, so the

21:23applicant wants to construct a duplex on

21:25the property. Uh, that M1 zoning would

21:28allow that. The office and institutional

21:30does not. So that's the need for the

21:33reszoning. Um, SC was awarded funding

21:36through the affordable housing trust

21:37fund earlier this year and this property

21:40was part of that application. So, they

21:42will be using that some of that funding

21:44to construct this dwelling. Um, set

21:48Holdings is in good standing with the

21:50Kansas Secretary of State and there's no

21:52active code cases on the property. U, so

21:55the applicant held a neighborhood

21:56information meeting. Planning Commission

21:58held a public hearing and recommended

22:00approval. Um staff recommends approval

22:02as well. Be happy to try to answer any

22:05questions.

22:06>> Do we have any comments or questions for

22:08Dan?

22:11>> I do want uh we we do have a motion, but

22:14I'm going to need some clarification

22:16because in these cases, as you know, we

22:17have three options in front of us. We

22:19can approve the planning commission's

22:21recommendation, which requires six

22:23votes. We can reject the recommendation,

22:25which is seven votes, or we can remand

22:27back to the planning commission, which

22:28requires six votes. So what is your

22:30motion council member to approve the

22:32plan as presented?

22:33>> Okay. Is that what you seconded?

22:35Council. Okay. Perfect. All right. Now,

22:37do we have any comments or questions

22:38from the governing body?

22:41Council member Valdovia Alcala.

22:44>> Thank you, Mayor Dan. I just wanted to

22:46make sure you said no current code

22:48violations, but the rest of that, too.

22:52No back taxes, any of that. That should

22:56be part of that that they do not owe.

23:00We're taking up now,

23:02>> Councilwoman. So, on zoning cases, what

23:05we've been instructed to check is the

23:07good standing with the Secretary of

23:09State and that there's no active code

23:12cases on the property.

23:14>> Um, we

23:18we can start checking the the I'm sorry.

23:22When they apply as through their

23:24application, I'm Let me back up a little

23:26bit, Councilwoman. when they apply

23:27through their uh application, uh we do

23:30check their property taxes. So, um yes,

23:33that's been checked in addition to the

23:35code cases and the secretary of state.

23:38>> Okay. I just you left that out, but I

23:40just want to make sure we're consistent.

23:42>> Yeah.

23:42>> Across the board as we're bringing all

23:44of that forward as new policy. Thank

23:46you.

23:47>> Yeah.

23:50>> All right. Once again, you get to hear

23:51me repeat that which I've already

23:52repeated, but I am required to do. Prior

23:55to proceeding with the vote, each member

23:57of the governing body who has engaged in

23:58exparte communication with any

24:00individual either in favor of or against

24:02the matter being considered must state

24:04that the communication occurred and

24:06indicate that even in light of having

24:07engaged in the communication, they were

24:09able to fairly, objectively, and

24:10impartially consider the measure based

24:13only upon the evidence provided on the

24:14record. The record includes the planning

24:16commission minutes, the staff report and

24:18its attachments, the public comments

24:19made during the planning commission

24:20hearing and similar relevant information

24:23related to the manner. Does anybody else

24:25need to or does anybody need to have any

24:28exparte communication to disclose?

24:33All right. I do not see any other

24:35comments or questions. So if that's the

24:36case, we have a motion and a second. I

24:38would ask clerk to take the vote,

24:39please.

24:46Okay, we have 10. Yes, the motion

24:48carries.

24:50>> All right, get to move on to action item

24:524 C. City clerk.

24:56C is an ordinance introduced by city

24:58manager Dr. Robert Perez amending the

25:00district map referred to and made a part

25:01of the zoning ordinances by section 1850

25:04of the Topeka municipal code by

25:06providing for certain changes in zoning

25:08on 30 acres of property located at 2016

25:12southwest 10th Avenue from C2 commercial

25:14district to M12 family dwelling

25:17district.

25:19>> City manager.

25:20>> Thank you mayor, members of the

25:22governing body. As part of this item,

25:23you'll be asked to consider zoning

25:24change of a partially vacant property

25:26located at 2016 Southwest 10th Avenue

25:29from office and institutional to two

25:31family dwelling district to allow for

25:33construction of a single family dwelling

25:34on the vacant portion of the par parcel.

25:37Following the planning commission's

25:38recommendation for approval, staff and I

25:40recommend approval of this item. And

25:41with that, I'll turn this back over to

25:42Dan Warner, director of planning and

25:44development to lead us through the item.

25:46Dan,

25:47>> thank you, city manager. mayor governing

25:49body as mentioned already uh reszoning

25:52from C2 to M1. So C2 commercial doesn't

25:56allow the construction of a single

25:58family uh dwelling. Um you may or may

26:01not remember there was a zoning case

26:03earlier this year for the property to

26:04the east directly to the east uh that

26:07was also reszoned from commercial to

26:09residential to support uh converting

26:11that building to a single family use.

26:13Um, so, uh, just a little bit about the

26:16property. That property has been vacant

26:18for since probably about 2020. Um, and

26:22and there's also an existing residence

26:23on the east side. So, all told, the

26:25reasoning includes the property to the

26:27east. So, we're making that a little

26:29more conforming and then building a new

26:31house on the vacant portion. Um, so,

26:35similar to the last case, uh, Watson

26:37real estate's in good standing with the

26:39Secretary of State. uh taxes are current

26:41and the property has no active code

26:42cases. Um the applicant held a

26:45neighborhood information meeting. Um we

26:48have a neighbor and and the historic

26:50Oldtown NIA attended that meeting um and

26:52asked questions of the applicant at that

26:54time. Um ultimately the NIA stated that

26:58they wouldn't support or or disapprove

27:02of the resoning. So they're kind of in

27:03the middle is the is the statement. I

27:06believe it's in the packet from the NIA.

27:08Uh the planning commission held a public

27:10hearing on the resoning and recommended

27:12approval. Staff recommends approval as

27:14well. Happy to answer any questions.

27:18>> Questions or comments from the governing

27:20body?

27:22Council member Vald Diviala.

27:24>> Thank you, Mayor Dan. You had told me

27:26when I sent the email to you this

27:27afternoon that the price point that

27:29they're looking at is what again?

27:32Between 200 and 230.

27:34Yeah, it was mentioned at the

27:36neighborhood information meeting that

27:37they were looking to be between 200 and

27:40230

27:42uh for the for the new house.

27:45>> And is that uh comparable to

27:50single family around their price point?

27:54>> I don't believe it. The appraised values

27:56are similar to that. Probably lower in

28:00that area. Um but he is trying to build

28:02a new house here and um the cost of

28:05construction, you know, these days is is

28:08challenging. So I think that's where

28:09they were trying to get to is 200 to

28:11230.

28:13Do you have any I barely scanned the

28:16letter from the NIA that I think Shemica

28:19had written and you said they didn't

28:22they stood neutral on it. Was there any

28:26discussion about the price point on the

28:29house and that more being constructed in

28:33that area? And look, I'm just totally

28:36asking this off the cuff. I don't know

28:38if it was talked about, but I just want

28:40to understand

28:42is that with this reszoning and uh

28:45higherend price points,

28:48was there discussions of any concerns

28:50about gentrification?

28:54Uh, I don't believe the staff report

28:56talks about that. Um, it's possible that

28:58was discussed at the neighborhood

29:00information meeting. Um, but besides

29:03that, I don't think we I don't think the

29:05analysis uh considered that issue.

29:08[clears throat]

29:09So, I do not want to speak for other

29:11people, but in reading the material, I

29:14think the concern was less the specific

29:16price point of the house and more about

29:19how that specific price point being

29:21different from the other homes factors

29:24into how we calculate healthy

29:26neighborhoods in terms of values of

29:28homes. In other words, if people can't

29:30move into those homes, does that harm

29:32their rating over time, keep them down?

29:35And that's a very oversimplification.

29:37And I think there's a valid concern in

29:39there and something that as we deal with

29:41this issue more because to Dan's point,

29:42the cost of homes is just basic home

29:45$200,000 in neighborhoods where it's

29:48probably something we need to look at.

29:49But I but I think that was more the

29:51issue is how's it going to impact

29:53neighborhood health ratings, how we

29:55judge these things, and what the overall

29:57impact is to the neighborhood over time.

29:59So that's that's a very

30:00oversimplification, but and a very valid

30:02concern on their part.

30:04>> All right. Thank you. Thank you, Dan.

30:05Thank you, Mayor.

30:09Council member Hoer.

30:13>> Dan, it looks like it is one platted

30:16parcel. What happens if one of the

30:19houses decides to be told sold? Are they

30:22going to have to come back and replplat

30:24[clears throat] it?

30:26>> Uh, let me just check real quick what

30:29the

30:31lot arrangement is.

30:37So the property actually contains 24 I'm

30:42sorry four 25 foot wide platted lots.

30:45>> Mhm.

30:46>> So assuming the the houses can sit on

30:49two lots a piece then there's no issue

30:52with selling. I mean they're on their

30:54own property basically. There's no plat

30:56there's no [clears throat] platting

30:57issue if they can fit them on the four

30:59lots that are currently platted on.

31:03>> Okay. So if they go to when they go to

31:05build it and get their building permit,

31:07it's going to be set up. So it is within

31:10those say two of the four.

31:13>> I would think that's the intention.

31:15Yeah. Um and it's something that we

31:17would check and and try to work with

31:19them because that that other house is

31:21all the way to the east

31:22>> on the property. So there should be room

31:25there.

31:26>> Yeah. I couldn't tell which

31:28I saw the house there, but I couldn't

31:30tell the orientation of the new one. So

31:32that's why I was questioning what they

31:34were going to do.

31:36>> You know, there used to be two houses on

31:38that vacant portion there. So they used

31:40to used to be a little more dense than

31:43what they're proposing.

31:45>> And will they have to have a drive that

31:48is not on 10th Street?

31:50>> I believe their drive, you know, will

31:52either be the alley or possibly that um

31:56>> Lynenwood.

31:58>> Okay. I'm just want to make sure we

32:01don't have any problems going forward.

32:05>> I don't think so.

32:06>> Okay. Thank you,

32:08>> Council Member Hiller.

32:09>> Thank you. I I was at that neighborhood

32:11meeting. Um it's in my district. There

32:14is a tea alley, so it's no problem for

32:17access to the from the back. Um, I I

32:21would say that Dan has pretty accurately

32:24described the mixed feelings that we

32:26have and it's throughout District 1, but

32:28other neighborhoods that need

32:29revitalization.

32:31We don't want to. On the one hand, this

32:34this neighborhood has really advocated

32:36for keeping the housing. And so getting

32:38a reversion of two from C2 to M1 on 10th

32:41Street is a big deal. on the other hand,

32:44having a brand new house go in at that

32:46size and price was was a little scary

32:50for them. And so, and it's something

32:52that we all are are having of mind as we

32:55talk about affordable housing and and

32:57where to where to use trust fund money

33:00and and the importance of it and so on.

33:02If you look at the housing study, even

33:05the price points that they cla that that

33:07study claims somebody at 30% of median

33:10income can afford are not possible. And

33:13so us as a as a body looking at what the

33:17true affordability is and what the price

33:19what the values are in the neighborhoods

33:21as we start on our next chapter of work

33:24on neighborhood revitalization.

33:27Um, that was a big deal and they it was

33:29a legitimate concern on their part

33:31because we don't want to price ourselves

33:33and our neighbors out of the out of the

33:35neighborhood.

33:37Thanks.

33:41>> Any other comments or questions for Dan

33:44on this issue?

33:48If not, motion is always in order. We

33:50have a motion to approve from Council

33:52Member Hiller.

33:56Do we have a second?

34:01Second from Council Member Bradberry.

34:03All right, here's the bad news. You get

34:04to hear me say this one more time. Good

34:06news is it's the last time I have to say

34:07it tonight. Prior to proceeding with the

34:10vote, each member of the governing body

34:12who has engaged in exparte communication

34:14with any individual either in favor of

34:16or against the matter being considered

34:18must state that the communication

34:19occurred and indicate that even in light

34:21of having engaged in the communication,

34:23they were able to fairly, objectively,

34:25and impartially consider the measure

34:26based only upon the evidence provided on

34:28the record. The record includes the

34:30planning commission minutes, the staff

34:32report and its attachments, the public

34:33comments made during the planning

34:34commission hearing, and similar relevant

34:36information related to the matter. Is

34:38there anyone who needs to indicate

34:40exparte communication?

34:43>> Already did.

34:44>> Council member Hiller is on the record

34:45already.

34:47Anyone else?

34:49>> All right. If not, if there are no other

34:52comments or questions on this matter, I

34:53will ask the clerk to take the vote,

34:55please.

35:03Okay, we have nine yes with council

35:05member Valdivia Aqua voting no. The

35:07motion carries.

35:11>> With that, we move on to action item 4D.

35:14City clerk.

35:21D is an ordinance introduced by city

35:22manager Dr. Robert Perez annexing land

35:24to the city of Topeka, Kansas in

35:26accordance with KSA 12520 located at

35:29Southwest 37 Street and Gage Boulevard.

35:37City Manager.

35:38>> Thank you, mayor, members of the

35:39governing body. As part of this item,

35:41you will be asked to consider annexation

35:43of a 19.35 acre track of land located at

35:46Southwest 37th Engage Boulevard. The

35:48annexation is needed to provide city

35:50water and sewer services to support the

35:52construction of a new church and future

35:54mixeduse development. Staff and I do

35:56recommend approval of this item. And

35:58with that, I'll turn this over to Dan

35:59Warner, director of planning and

36:00development to lead us through the item.

36:01Dan,

36:03>> thank you, city manager. Uh, mayor

36:05governing body, last item for me. Um, so

36:08the city manager mentioned the proposed

36:11use. So again, the church is meant to is

36:14uh

36:16going to locate on the south end of that

36:18property. Um, we don't know what's going

36:21to happen more towards the intersection

36:23of 37th and engage at this point yet. I

36:26expect some sort of potential mixeduse

36:28development in the future on that

36:30corner. Um, this property is located

36:33within tier 2 of the city's urban growth

36:36area. Um, and what that means, uh, tier

36:392 areas are areas that, um, are ready

36:41for annexation because they have all

36:43five of the critical urban services

36:45available, such as water, sewer, got a

36:48nice street out there. Um, so,

36:52and the other issue here with this

36:54annexation is the property is surrounded

36:56by the city currently. So, uh, it makes

36:58perfect sense to just go ahead and annex

37:00the whole thing. Um, so both property

37:03owners are in good standing with the

37:05Secretary of State. There's no active

37:06code cases. Um, the the process for an

37:12annexation of this type, um, one where

37:14the property owner is consented to

37:16annexation and where the property is

37:19contiguous to the city boundary. Um,

37:22this type of annexation can be approved

37:24[clears throat] by the governing body by

37:25adopting an ordinance approving the

37:27annexation. So, that's all that really

37:29has to happen with this type of

37:31annexation is the governing body approve

37:33an ordinance that adopts the annexation.

37:36Uh, with that, I'll be happy to try to

37:37answer any questions.

37:39>> Questions or comments for Dan?

37:44>> I see none.

37:47Council member Kell,

37:49>> I'm just if I'm trying to read this

37:51right, um

37:53there's concern of future system

37:55capacity for high density or intent

37:56commercial development.

38:04>> It says located in the primary service

38:06area. There's a concern for future

38:08system capacity for high density and

38:10intense commercial development. the San

38:13Dieer mains to the west will need to be

38:15upsized to handle the greater capacity.

38:17[clears throat]

38:20>> I believe that was a comment from

38:21utilities. Um I I can't really speak to

38:25that.

38:26Um

38:29very well.

38:32>> Y thank you.

38:35So obviously the development of this

38:37particular parcel as a church with the

38:41corresponding graveyard is not going to

38:43put an undue burden on the utilities.

38:46The comment from the utilities

38:48department was if there would be a

38:53high density development on other vacant

38:56land um owned by the property owner

39:00who's trying to develop that property.

39:03that could put a burden on the utilities

39:06in terms of being able to serve it

39:09because when those utilities were put in

39:10in terms of the water and sanitary

39:15the study that was done at the time

39:18designed those based upon single family

39:20residential development. So this

39:24particular parcel not an issue. in the

39:26future if someone comes in and says we

39:28want to do a 10story mixeduse

39:30development that could put a burden on

39:33it but we won't know until we actually

39:35have a proposal that comes forward with

39:38some facts. So for this for this case

39:41church cemetery

39:44not in the future vacant property

39:46adjacent potentially depending on what

39:49the development is and what they come in

39:50to to zone it as.

39:53uh and this was to help to allow them to

39:55connect to our our system. Are we are we

39:58paying for any of that cost or are they

39:59paying for all that cost?

40:00>> So the infrastructure is there

40:05already.

40:06>> Okay.

40:06>> They would have to pay the system fees

40:08to be able to to tie in for the water

40:11and sanitary sewing.

40:12>> Okay. I just want to make sure we didn't

40:13have extra, you know, if it was on the

40:15east side of the road. Now we're having

40:16to run stuff over to the west side

40:18towards them uh of gauge there. So, I

40:21just want to make sure we're not

40:22incurring cost on that. Thank you,

40:27>> Council Member Bradberry.

40:28>> Yes. Thank you. Can you speak a little

40:31more about the cemetery portion?

40:37>> That was new to me. So,

40:40>> so the church will have a small cemetery

40:44uh to the west of it, kind of behind. Um

40:46it's a fairly large property that they

40:49they have. Um,

40:52and it's it's really it's just meant for

40:54the the members of the church. So, it's

40:57not going to be particularly large. It's

40:58considered an accessory use for the

41:00church. It's not a standalone cemetery

41:03that's out there by itself. So, it's

41:06part of their development. It's again,

41:08it's behind the church. The church will

41:10be more towards gage and the cemetery

41:12will be behind the church. Um, and

41:16again, not particularly large. Uh it's

41:19an accessory use for the church.

41:26>> So

41:28with that, is there like a maximum

41:32size that that can be? I just trying to

41:36wrap my head around a cemetery going in

41:38the middle of that housing area.

41:43um that you know our stand our standards

41:47are more for a standalone cemetery. Um

41:50it has to be accessory to the church. It

41:53can't be,

41:56you know, and we'll review that as part

41:58of the site plan process. So they're in

42:00with a site plan. I don't have it with

42:02me, but um so they're in with a site

42:04plan that's being reviewed. Um

42:08I you know, we're working through the

42:10the issues. I guess we don't really have

42:12anything that says it can't be this big

42:14or not. It's what they're proposing. And

42:15do we consider it accessory? Does it fit

42:17with the overall site development of the

42:19of the pro of the project? Um

42:25with it being an accessory development,

42:29does it still

42:31have the same type of requirements as a

42:33standalone cemetery?

42:35>> For sure. For sure. Uh the the land use

42:38issue is it's accessory to the church.

42:41The issue with doing it the cemetery

42:43still has to meet the whatever standards

42:45there are to develop a cemetery.

42:49>> Okay. Thank you.

42:53>> Any other comments or questions from the

42:55governing body?

42:57If not, guess I will move to approve.

43:04We have a second from council member

43:05Banks. Any other additional comments or

43:08questions? It's not up here. So, clerk

43:11would take the vote, please.

43:26Council member Valdivia Aqua.

43:32I pushed my button but said yes.

43:35>> Yes. Okay.

43:39>> All right. We have 10. Yes. The motion

43:40carries.

43:42>> All right. Thank you, Dan.

43:45>> We'll now move on to action item 4E.

43:48City clerk.

43:51E is a contract between the city of

43:53Topeka and Breakthrough House

43:54Incorporated in an amount not to exceed

43:56$300,000 for a homeless outreach

43:59program.

44:00>> City manager.

44:01>> Thank you, ma'am. Members of the

44:03governing body, as part of this item, we

44:05will provide a brief bill for Zero

44:06update and tied to our bill for Zero

44:08efforts, you will be asked to consider a

44:10contract with Breakthrough House

44:12utilizing our opioid settlement funds to

44:14provide outreach service outreach

44:16services to unsheltered individuals

44:19experiencing opioid addiction. As we go

44:22through the bill for Zero discussion, I

44:23will ask for you to note the Built for

44:25Zero program costs on slide six for

44:27future consideration of our upcoming

44:29sales tax discussion. Please also note

44:31that this is utilizing 300,000 of

44:33approximately 1.1 million of available

44:36opio opioid fund uh collections.

44:39Collections of these funds began in 2024

44:42and we anticipate receiving another $1.2

44:44million in settlement funds through

44:46FY2038 for combined collections of $2.3

44:49million. To continue activating these

44:52dollars, the team and I are identifying

44:53internal uses and also working to

44:56develop an RFP to solicit proposed

44:58community uses of these funds. With

45:00that, staff and I do recommend approval

45:01of this item and I'll turn this over to

45:03Carrie Higgins, director of housing and

45:05homeless services to lead us through

45:06this item. Carrie,

45:07>> thank you. Good evening, Mr. Mayor and

45:09governing body. So, as the city manager

45:12said, we have the homeless outreach

45:14contract before you tonight and a built

45:16for zero update. This contract did go

45:18before the public health and safety

45:20committee as well and was recommended um

45:23moving on to the governing body for

45:24approval. So, a refresher on built for

45:27zero. It is a framework that takes the

45:30challenges a community experiences in

45:32trying to solve homelessness and turns

45:35th that framework uh into solutions. So

45:38it's using a single integrated

45:39accountable team that uses weekly case

45:42conferencing. It's a shared measurable

45:44aim instead of working in silos. It is

45:47real time by name quality data and it is

45:50using targeted resources.

45:53So this is our data feedback loop that

45:55we use. So we're looking at the total

45:58number of active homeless as well as

46:00those that are flowing into the system

46:02and where from and those that are

46:04flowing out of the system and where

46:06specifically they are going. So this

46:08gives us data, real time data of all of

46:11our individuals experiencing

46:12homelessness in our community 365 days

46:16out of the year instead of twice a year

46:18when we conduct our point in time counts

46:21updates. So um we have made uh some

46:24progress. uh it has been very slow

46:26without a doubt uh but we have made

46:29progress. So the first is our case

46:30conferencing. We moved to this method in

46:32January of this year. This is a targeted

46:36accountable approach to assisting

46:38individuals. Uh we now officially have

46:40all community and agency participation

46:43and all agencies are entering the data

46:45into our system we call clarity. So we

46:48have MAP entering all of their

46:50unsheltered data into our system. We

46:52have the all hands- on deck coalition

46:54using the built for zero framework and

46:56working within it with all of their

46:57projects. And we have the homeless task

46:59force using that framework as well. And

47:02first quarter of this year, the homeless

47:04task force uh revamped all of their

47:06policies and [clears throat] procedures

47:07to align with our built for zero

47:09framework. We also have a built for zero

47:11conference coming up in about two weeks

47:13and for the first time ever we have all

47:15of these agencies you see listed uh

47:18joining us at that conference. That is

47:20important because we will be setting our

47:22next sixmonth and 12-month action cycles

47:25not only for the city but also for the

47:27state. So having that level of community

47:29buyin and participation is really

47:31important.

47:34And then the other uh main area that

47:36we've made progress in is with our uh

47:38quality data benchmarks. So we have

47:40what's called a scorecard. There are 29

47:42questions that we have to answer yes to

47:44in order to hit the quality data and

47:47then we have to maintain that data and

47:50that scorecard for 3 months before we we

47:52reach what built for zero calls quality

47:55data designation. So we were previously

47:58at a score of 12 on that scorecard. In

48:00the past year, we have moved up to a

48:02score of 23. And those remaining six

48:05points, six questions that we need to

48:07work on all revolve around outreach in

48:10some capacity. So that is why this

48:12contract is before you tonight. We need

48:14to fill that gap in order to continue to

48:16make progress on our built for zero

48:18work.

48:21So estimated cost for built for zero. Um

48:23this is a little bit challenging to

48:25figure. The framework with built forzero

48:26takes all of our community resources

48:28that we already have. We look at ways

48:30that we can reallocate those to be more

48:32efficient and effective and then we use

48:34the built forzero data to determine what

48:36additional needs and resources our

48:38community has. So doing that we are

48:41estimating there's roughly uh a need for

48:43300,000 in outreach services which is

48:45the contract before you tonight. Uh

48:48anywhere from 500,000 to a million in

48:50rental assistance. We have data that

48:52shows the need for this assistance in

48:54our community is far greater than the

48:56funds that are currently available. Uh

48:58we need additional affordable housing in

49:01some capacity and then also additional

49:03incomebased housing in some capacity.

49:06And we have been researching tiny home

49:09villages and what that would look like.

49:10And the estimated cost for that is 4.7

49:14million to build and roughly 185,000

49:17annually in operating costs.

49:21So the specific framework with built for

49:23zero and outreach is using real-time by

49:25name data to know exactly who is

49:27homeless, exactly what their needs are

49:29and what stands in their way of becoming

49:32housed. So we use that then the that

49:35information to address their barriers.

49:37We know that individuals who are

49:38chronically homeless, who are suffering

49:40from mental illness or substance abuse

49:42issues, will need more support and more

49:45wraparound services in order to not only

49:48become housed, but to be able to sa

49:50sustain that housing long-term,

49:54which brings us to our outreach teams.

49:56So, this list here are all of our

49:58partners that we work with. Outreach is

50:00the only agency that is doing regular

50:02outreach. They are out two days a week.

50:05all of these other entities go out as

50:07needed or as issues arrive. So, our

50:10community is working in a reactive model

50:12instead of a proactive model. And that's

50:15just because we don't have the teams or

50:17the resources to be able to be proactive

50:19at this time.

50:22So, that brings us to the request for

50:24proposals. In order to fill that gap, we

50:26are looking at using the opioid grant

50:28funding to contract with an outreach

50:30team. So, we released that RFP on May

50:334th. We had one agency apply that was

50:36Breakthrough House. The outreach program

50:39and contract will include weekly street

50:41outreach. It will be the team conducting

50:44assessments in the field and correct

50:45connecting those individuals to

50:47treatment. They will assist the

50:49individuals in becoming housing ready

50:51and continue to assist them and provide

50:53case management and support even after

50:56they're housed so that we can ensure

50:58long-term stability for those

51:00individuals. And the team will also

51:02participate in our case conferencing and

51:04our data collection and in our alignment

51:06with built for zero.

51:09The program budget and the contract you

51:11have before you is for 300,000.

51:14245,000 of that is for personnel cost.

51:1745,000 of that is for outreach supplies

51:20and client engagement. That is things

51:22like personal care items and water in

51:25order to build that trust and rapport

51:26with individuals so they are willing and

51:29ready to take the next step as well as

51:31things like IDs and birth certificates

51:33in order to get an individual housing

51:35ready. And then 10,000 in program admin

51:38and compliance

51:41and uh I'm happy to answer any questions

51:43you might have. We also have uh

51:45breakthrough house here tonight as well

51:46in case you have any questions for them

51:48as well.

51:50All right, Council Member Valdivia

51:51Alkala.

51:53>> Thank you. Thank you, uh, Carrie and

51:56city manager for bringing the

51:58presentation forward. Um, I had

52:02requested it because I think that it's

52:04been a minute since we have had

52:10to me this is really a high overview

52:12because

52:14my belief is that as we start talking

52:19about the ballot initiatives and this

52:23onetenth of a sales onetenth of a

52:26percent

52:28um which for homelessness

52:32uh it should be going some of that

52:34should be going uh to and obviously

52:37that would be the built for zero

52:39program. I believe that we have to even

52:43be a little bit more expansive

52:46about what built for zero is in the

52:50future as we talk through this.

52:53need to be for the public to understand

52:57and we need to understand as a governing

53:00body what it means to get to functional

53:02zero.

53:04We also need to be able to look at model

53:08cities that I do believe the built for

53:12zero now has been in existence for 20

53:14years. when we first started having

53:18meetings, we had it with a comparable uh

53:20demographic city, which was Rockford,

53:23Illinois. But I think that we also have

53:26to show the governing body and we have

53:28to show the public what it looks like

53:32for a built for zero program that is

53:36working.

53:37And I also believe that in future

53:40presentations,

53:42we need to be putting on there what that

53:44partnership with the state is about so

53:48that constituents, so residents, and

53:51taxpayers can understand

53:54and understand as well the benefits that

53:58may come from that state partnership and

54:01any possible dollars that we can try to

54:03leverage from that state partnership. as

54:07part of a stronger, more aggressive

54:09legislative agenda.

54:11I think that we know that the sales tax

54:14initiative is meeting a lot of push back

54:18that you can see out there on social

54:20media, that is not the same as a voting

54:22yes or no. But I think that if we can

54:26get a really thorough understanding in

54:29an easy to digest way about the success

54:34of Built for Zero in cities comparable

54:38to ours, I think that that will be

54:40beneficial. But I really do appreciate

54:42this presentation

54:44uh Carrie and the nuances that were

54:47given. Thank you, Mayor.

54:49>> Council member Bradberry.

54:52Thank you. Um I have maybe four

54:57questions, five maybe. Um when you spoke

55:02of the program taking a targeted

55:04accountable approach, can you talk about

55:06that about what that means?

55:09>> Yes. So previously we operated um more

55:12in silos and so this is really bringing

55:14the community together. we're instead of

55:16looking at individual outcomes, we're

55:18looking at are we actually reducing

55:20homelessness? Are we working together?

55:22Um, so that's a big piece of it.

55:24>> Okay. And when you were talking about

55:27the scorecard questions and that there

55:31were about six other questions remaining

55:34that you still had to get to. Yes. What

55:36were those questions? What are some of

55:37those targets?

55:38>> Yeah. So, do it's things like do we have

55:41um outreach teams that are covering the

55:44entire city and county? Are they going

55:46out at times that make the most sense to

55:48reach all individuals? Do we have a

55:49full-time outreach team? Um, do we have

55:52policies and procedures in place for our

55:54outreach teams and how that data

55:56translates into our by name list? Those

55:59are really what the the remaining six

56:00questions focus on um that we will be

56:03able to put in place hopefully once we

56:06have a robust outreach team. Okay. Um,

56:13the tiny home village, um,

56:18when you're talking about I think it was

56:204.7 million to build, how many tiny

56:24homes are in

56:27>> that estimate is for 32 [clears throat]

56:29tiny homes. 32.

56:31>> Tiny homes. Yes.

56:38And when you say like what is the

56:40approximate square footage of

56:44the approximate square footage of those

56:46homes? How much would that about

56:47approximately be

56:49>> to come up with?

56:49>> They were based like off the Eden

56:51Village 300 and something square feet. I

56:53want to say they're they're a bedroom, a

56:55bathroom, a living space, and then like

56:58a closet. And

56:59>> okay,

56:59>> just trying to get some idea.

57:01>> 300 plus, but yeah, it's between three

57:02and 400. I can't really I can't remember

57:04the exact number.

57:05>> Okay. Um

57:08and

57:11then

57:12if we were able to get the

57:16one10enth sales tax initiative

57:21pass the council um to a vote from the

57:24public and that approved if if that

57:28happened. What would that mean for this

57:30program?

57:32it would be tremendous for this program.

57:34So, lack of funding is is one of the

57:37reasons that uh we haven't been able to

57:39make as much progress whether it's with

57:41funding outreach, whether it's funding

57:42rental assistance, whether it's

57:44additional affordable housing or

57:46permanent housing. Having that um steady

57:50resource coming in would make a big

57:52difference.

57:53>> And would that help with those remaining

57:56six questions that

57:58>> Yes. And the uh contract that's before

58:01you tonight will allow us if if

58:04approved, it will allow us to finish

58:06those remaining six questions and we

58:08would be looking at reaching quality

58:10data within the next four to six months.

58:13>> Okay. Thank you. Absolutely.

58:15>> Council member Hiller.

58:18>> Thank you. Um I thought I understood

58:20where this 300,000 fit, but based on

58:23what city manager said, I I have a

58:26question. My understanding was that the

58:30300,000 would cover that that right now

58:33we don't have an outreach team. So this

58:34would help us recreate an outreach team

58:37itemized by whom you said would be in

58:40it. But that was 300,000 for one year of

58:44operation. Is that correct?

58:46>> That is correct. and that I was my

58:49understanding was that okay that's about

58:52a third of the amount of money that we

58:54have in the in the fund right now but

58:57that we were going to continue to get

58:59money into that fund so that we could

59:03continue to fund that 300,000 a year out

59:06of that fund and

59:10city manager I think I heard you say 1.2

59:132 million that has to last until 2038.

59:16So that wasn't working.

59:18>> No. So, so we have $1.1 million that

59:20we've collected since 2024 in that fund.

59:23So, this would use about $300,000 of

59:26that, leaving us about $800,000, right?

59:28>> We anticipate another 1.2 coming in

59:30between now and 2020 2038. So, uh at

59:34total we'll have $2.3 million. Um that

59:37is one of the challenges with this

59:39council member is that um those opioid

59:41dollars are finite in that you know we

59:44and as mentioned we're also looking at

59:46other ways to utilize those funds within

59:48our existing budget and then also put

59:51out uh a call for projects or proposals

59:54um to see what other community resources

59:56might be available for us. So, you are

59:58correct that the $300,000 is an annual

1:00:01allocation and we'd have to evaluate

1:00:03that on an annual basis based upon the

1:00:06available funding.

1:00:06>> Yeah.

1:00:08>> Okay. That unfortunately confirms what I

1:00:12thought I heard. Um, thank you.

1:00:16>> Council member Kell

1:00:18totally for the tiny home idea. I've

1:00:21even I've been saying for years uh about

1:00:23two three blocks away from my house is a

1:00:25nice open field that used to be a uh

1:00:27trailer park back in the day at 37th in

1:00:30Kansas. Um perfect spot. My issue is I

1:00:34think we're kind of going about this the

1:00:35wrong way. We're doing the outreach

1:00:37first then possibly maybe building I

1:00:40think we should build what we're going

1:00:41to build first then have be able to go

1:00:43out and outreach and be able to put

1:00:45someone in. Can we go out and touch talk

1:00:47to people and do all those kinds of but

1:00:48if we're not really accomplishing

1:00:49anything and we're not moving forward I

1:00:52think we're going about it in a

1:00:54backwards mentality

1:00:56uh not necessarily a 100% proponent of

1:00:59built for zero for the simple fact of is

1:01:01a zero barrier or low barrier uh entity

1:01:05that necessarily doesn't have a lot of

1:01:07rules to it and you can mix people in

1:01:11that situation where you could have a a

1:01:13recovered recovering addict with an

1:01:16active addict right next to each other

1:01:18and that's going to be really hard on

1:01:19that recovering addict to not uh to not

1:01:23relapse. Um the sometimes as aspects of

1:01:27of there's aspects of it like keeping

1:01:29the families together. Great. The no

1:01:31curfew. I'm not in agreeance with that

1:01:33cuz it's been proven several times with

1:01:35this type of situation. You'll get

1:01:37people with when they have no rules to

1:01:40stay stay clean, start roaming through a

1:01:43neighborhood somewhere high and we're

1:01:46not doing it. We're pretty much funding

1:01:47a situation that's making it harder on

1:01:49our rest of our neighbors. So, I think

1:01:51we need to find that middle ground of

1:01:54not being a high barrier shelter, but

1:01:56that medium and then be able to try to

1:01:58separate people that are actively using

1:02:01versus the recovering uh people. So this

1:02:04way we're not having that relapse back

1:02:06and forth. A lot less safety issues uh

1:02:09when we when we go that more the middle

1:02:11ground uh a lot less u detrimental to to

1:02:14neighborhoods and and I've been the

1:02:16proponent I want this in my

1:02:18neighborhood. I think this is a great

1:02:19idea. So, this not that I'm against this

1:02:21idea or I think we shouldn't be doing

1:02:23it, but I think we need to we need to

1:02:24tighten up a little bit. And I think

1:02:26we're going about it the wrong way where

1:02:27we we need to build our structures first

1:02:30and then start putting people into those

1:02:32structures rather than going out and oh,

1:02:34we're here but we got nothing for you at

1:02:36this present moment besides just here's

1:02:38a pamphlet, here's this, here's this. I

1:02:40think the structures first then then we

1:02:42go over the outreach aspect.

1:02:44>> May I clarify? Yeah, just two quick

1:02:45things and I call it the So, first of

1:02:47all, I know you didn't mean to come, but

1:02:49the bill for zero program really has

1:02:51nothing to do with moving towards any

1:02:52kind of specific shelter model. What it

1:02:55>> Yeah, it actually does. It says it on

1:02:56there.

1:02:57>> It actually bill for zero discourages

1:03:00low barrier shelters and says they

1:03:02should never be your first your first

1:03:04construction model. Um the the bill for

1:03:07zero program is all about how a city and

1:03:09how the community and the nonprofits in

1:03:11that community and the service providers

1:03:12work together in a very centralized

1:03:15manner to give you sort of an organized

1:03:17path to getting people from homelessness

1:03:19off the street and into a more

1:03:21constructive model which is one reason

1:03:23why we wanted to go into it so much

1:03:24because we spent so many years with I

1:03:27call that shotgun approach. Maybe this

1:03:28will work, maybe this will work, maybe

1:03:29this will work. And this kind of gives

1:03:31not only us but the community to say

1:03:33this is what we're doing. This is the

1:03:35path. We hope everyone and thankfully to

1:03:38every group out there has gotten on

1:03:39board to be a part of this. But my

1:03:42second question or my question then is

1:03:44can you just explain a little bit more

1:03:45specifically as to what the outreach

1:03:47teams do and what we're missing by not

1:03:50having them right now.

1:03:52>> Yes. So we do have some housing that's

1:03:55available and we have Union at Tower

1:03:56District. Uh we very quickly filled up

1:03:59the first building that opened about 6

1:04:01months ago. They're getting ready to

1:04:02open up uh the second and third building

1:04:04which will be about an additional 200

1:04:06units. But if we don't have individuals

1:04:08that are housing ready or have the

1:04:11supportive services to move in there,

1:04:14then we're kind of stuck. And so what

1:04:15the outreach teams do, it's not only um

1:04:18connecting with them in the field,

1:04:19getting assessments taken care of,

1:04:21getting them connected to treatment, but

1:04:23it is walking alongside them to get them

1:04:25prepared for housing. So where are they

1:04:27at? What do they need? Do they need IDs

1:04:29and birth certificates? do they need to

1:04:31apply for SSDI or employment? And those

1:04:34seem like fairly basic things, but when

1:04:36you are living in crisis and

1:04:37overwhelmed, those are really

1:04:38challenging. And our systems are can be

1:04:40really challenging to navigate. So the

1:04:42outreach teams will walk alongside those

1:04:44individuals and help them with that

1:04:46process every step of the way. Help them

1:04:48get housing ready, help them find

1:04:50housing and get into housing based upon

1:04:51what their needs are. Maybe they um are

1:04:55okay with market rate housing, maybe

1:04:56they need income based housing, whatever

1:04:58that is for each individual. And then

1:05:00it's in continuing to provide that care

1:05:03and support. The outreach teams will

1:05:05continue to do that even after they're

1:05:06housed. We know we have proven data that

1:05:09that shows that if we just take an

1:05:11unsheltered individual, especially

1:05:12someone that's chronically unsheltered,

1:05:14and house them, they will not be able to

1:05:16sustain that long term. we have to give

1:05:18them the wraparound services and the

1:05:20supports and connect them to whatever it

1:05:22is they need to ensure they can sustain

1:05:24that long term. We have agencies that

1:05:26are providing that um at some levels

1:05:28throughout the community, but most of

1:05:30them are tied to a specific program. Um

1:05:33so if the individual isn't willing to do

1:05:35X, Y, and Z, they are not able to

1:05:38receive those services. We don't have

1:05:40any outreach teams that are just out

1:05:42there reaching out to anyone that is

1:05:45interested to get them to that place

1:05:47where they are ready to be housed and

1:05:49can sustain it long term.

1:05:50>> Now, on your partners' outreach team,

1:05:53you have the sheriff's department. Does

1:05:55that include the jail or is that just

1:05:56the on the street officers and the

1:05:59management of the of the sheriff's

1:06:00department? We

1:06:02>> we do work with the jail and with Brian

1:06:05Cole. Um, but we have uh one main uh

1:06:08sheriff deputy that uh attends our

1:06:11monthly outreach meetings and works with

1:06:12us on outreach

1:06:13>> because I I I'd like to see like KDOC

1:06:15involved in that also because you're

1:06:17going to have people walking out of the

1:06:18jail, walking out of the prison and if

1:06:22we can kind of maybe catch them on the

1:06:24way out and transition them easier that

1:06:27way than letting them be out on the

1:06:29streets for whatever amount of time

1:06:31because as you said the services take a

1:06:33long time to get. You know, you only

1:06:35usually get released with a month worth

1:06:36of medication. So, if you have any

1:06:38mental health medication, you're on. You

1:06:40run out. By the time you get on, I'm

1:06:42back on disability. You're having

1:06:44issues. Um, same with the jail. If if

1:06:47you have nowhere to go, you're going to

1:06:48go back out. Then you're going to say,

1:06:49"Well, I have no money. I know nothing

1:06:51else. Let's go out and do something else

1:06:52to try to get this money." Now, you're

1:06:54back in jail. So, if we can try to keep

1:06:56that and get the KDOC and the and the

1:06:59not just Shiny County Sheriff's

1:07:00Department, but the the Shy County Jail

1:07:02involved in that also with with

1:07:06some type of recommendation or this or

1:07:08that to allow those people when they're

1:07:10they're going out to to not fall fall

1:07:13out in their face, but we're we're kind

1:07:14of grabbing them as they're coming out

1:07:16and helping them transition.

1:07:18>> Absolutely.

1:07:21>> Council member Valdivia Alcala.

1:07:24Thank you, mayor. I I just want to say

1:07:26that the foundation that Carrie is

1:07:28talking about, if we don't do this, it

1:07:31doesn't matter if we have a tiny

1:07:33village, it doesn't matter if we have

1:07:34200, 300 apartments, it doesn't matter

1:07:37if we have two or 300 houses available

1:07:40because if this serious foundation is

1:07:43not built, which takes time, because

1:07:45like she said, it took a tremendous

1:07:47amount of time just to get out of the

1:07:49silo mindset. And then when they go into

1:07:53that outreach, they go by name. They

1:07:55learn every individual on the street's

1:07:59name. So without that foundation, it's

1:08:03like trying to build something on shaky

1:08:05ground. And it is a harm reduction

1:08:07model. I'm sure it could be considered a

1:08:10harm reduction model. It is not going to

1:08:12be a perfect entity. Nothing is. But

1:08:15unless there is some other tangible

1:08:18methodologydriven

1:08:20program out there that has proven

1:08:23success, not perfection, but proven

1:08:26success, then this is the model I

1:08:28believe that is the best for us at this

1:08:30time and I think the state of Kansas

1:08:32agrees with that as well. Thank you,

1:08:34Mayor.

1:08:35>> Council member Ortiz.

1:08:38>> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I think we're

1:08:40slowly moving, but we are moving. I want

1:08:44to express I don't know how many times a

1:08:47week I contact Carrie and say,

1:08:51"Can you give me a call? I have another

1:08:53person that's homeless.

1:08:55Uh, Deputy Chief Hulcom. He's my number

1:08:58one guy. I call him and I run things by

1:09:01him." Brett, I wanted you to hear this

1:09:02before you leave.

1:09:04>> [laughter]

1:09:05>> I want you to hear this because at the

1:09:09jail they now have for a special spot

1:09:11for the mental health and breakthrough

1:09:14has their own social worker that works

1:09:17there several hours. So when they get

1:09:20there, they're not with the other um

1:09:23people in jail. They they go into that

1:09:26special unit. And when they go into that

1:09:28special unit, that case worker from

1:09:31Breakthrough who I've met and she spends

1:09:34several hours they she goes there to get

1:09:37them what they need, whether it's

1:09:40medication, whether it's homeless,

1:09:43whatever it is.

1:09:45So that's her job. That's what she does.

1:09:47And most she knows most of these clients

1:09:50because she is a case manager for

1:09:51Breakthrough. That's a that's a huge

1:09:54step from the from the county. you you

1:09:57were offered uh time to go through and

1:10:00I'm sure Brian Cole will take you

1:10:01through the

1:10:03to go in and tour it, but they have I

1:10:06forget how many beds do you know Carrie?

1:10:08I think that's what I wanted to say like

1:10:1130 or 40 beds. And that's that's really

1:10:14huge to take them out of population with

1:10:17everybody else because they have a

1:10:19different issue. They don't have the

1:10:20same issues as the other population uh

1:10:24with inmates. And so, yes, we are slowly

1:10:27slowly moving. Maybe not at any fast

1:10:30pace that we would like it to be, but

1:10:33we're slowly slowly moving. I guess my

1:10:36question is, and my question will always

1:10:38be, um, I'm I'm grateful that we're all

1:10:41getting together. I'm grateful for our

1:10:43behavior unit because I know how much

1:10:45they have helped me with different

1:10:47people and there continues to help me

1:10:48and I can go in and and talk to the

1:10:51deputy chief and say, "Okay, let's let's

1:10:52have this conversation." I'm grateful

1:10:54for the conversation I have with you to

1:10:56throw out there with a we got a guy with

1:10:58a a kid that's going to be homeless cuz

1:11:00he can't he can't pay his rent.

1:11:03I mean, it's it's it's tough out there.

1:11:06It's really really tough. But I found

1:11:09out this week there are four homeless

1:11:12high schoolers that are going to school.

1:11:14Where does Built for Zero, where do they

1:11:17fit in in all this?

1:11:19built for zero the it works for anyone

1:11:23for all ages. Uh we also those

1:11:25individuals if you can help me get

1:11:27connected to them uh would also qualify

1:11:29for impact avenues program that

1:11:30specifically works with

1:11:32>> if they are 18 Carrie and and their

1:11:35parents have asked them to leave or I

1:11:38don't know what the situation is but I

1:11:40know there's four of them.

1:11:41>> Yes. If they are still in high school in

1:11:4418 even if they are on their own we

1:11:46would be happy to connect with them and

1:11:47and help them. you just saved me a call.

1:11:50Okay, I'll get you that information.

1:11:51[laughter]

1:11:52But in in all reality, um I'm grateful

1:11:55that um Councilwoman brought this up. Um

1:11:59and I think it's slowly moving and I

1:12:01think once the ball gets to rolling,

1:12:03we'll we'll get more people people on

1:12:06board once they see that it's working.

1:12:08But it's hard. Um and I will say this to

1:12:11Mr. Kell. I have a gentleman and he has

1:12:15diabetes and he has both of his legs

1:12:17amputated and he's running around here

1:12:19in a wheelchair and I and I took this um

1:12:23this same gentleman to and I talked with

1:12:25um Deputy Chief Hulcom and um he advised

1:12:28me that he's surprised he's still

1:12:31running around here because his bone is

1:12:33showing and he won't get any help. He

1:12:36won't get any help. And um we're trying

1:12:40to figure that out without just

1:12:42arresting him or trying to figure it out

1:12:44how to help him because he won't help

1:12:46himself. We've got a lot of that too. A

1:12:49lot of that. So, um thank you and I I'll

1:12:52I'll look forward to send you that

1:12:54information.

1:12:54>> Thank you,

1:12:55>> city manager.

1:12:57>> Thank you, mayor. Um, I just wanted to

1:12:59uh to point out uh to the councilman's

1:13:01point, um, we're talking about $4.7

1:13:05million to build uh, one of the

1:13:07villages. Uh, even a quarter of that is

1:13:09probably going to eat up all these

1:13:10funds. So, I I hear your point as far

1:13:13as, you know, um, doing the village

1:13:16first before the outreach. Um, but

1:13:18again, we don't even have the full 2.3

1:13:20million in hand. So, uh, if we did try

1:13:23something, it would have to be

1:13:25relatively scaled back from what's

1:13:27envisioned here. So, I just just wanted

1:13:29to put that out. Um, and then also too,

1:13:31because they're opioid funds, we'd have

1:13:33to specifically target them to that um

1:13:37that population as far as those who are

1:13:39experiencing uh opioid addiction. So, I

1:13:43just wanted to put that out for

1:13:44additional context. Thank you, Mayor.

1:13:46>> Council member Kell. Well, we can focus

1:13:49on on recovering, can't we? On on that

1:13:50aspect also. So, that's what I'm saying

1:13:52is where we need to watch out for the

1:13:55recovery recovering addicts of opioids

1:13:58and not put them with a active user

1:14:01because that can run into situations.

1:14:04Um, speaking of programs, I've worked at

1:14:07DCF. I've worked at at the uh prisons in

1:14:10uh prison in Kansas. Worked at the

1:14:11halfway house. programs can be great,

1:14:13but sometimes they don't really offer

1:14:17anything tangible. There are some great

1:14:19programs that

1:14:22there's one the the Kansas partner

1:14:24correction runs called Brothers in Blue.

1:14:26Great getting guys in straight and

1:14:28narrow. Literally, the people that run

1:14:30the program turn their back on those on

1:14:32those gentlemen when they walk out the

1:14:33prison door. And it is sad to see that

1:14:37that that's what happens. So programs

1:14:39can be great and and then isolation can

1:14:42be good, but you also need to now also

1:14:44reintegrate those uh those people that

1:14:46are now stabilized on their on

1:14:48medications and things like that back

1:14:49into the general population. I see that

1:14:52seen that at KDOC. They're separated,

1:14:54separated, separated, released out the

1:14:55door. They don't know how to function

1:14:57without having that constant supervision

1:15:01of being in a mental uh the the the

1:15:06specialized units at the prison.

1:15:09And

1:15:11it's you need these programs can be good

1:15:14at like the mental health unit at the

1:15:15jail and at the prisons, but when you

1:15:17just separate them and don't let them

1:15:20work their way back in the general

1:15:21population, they don't necessarily know

1:15:22how to work their way back out into

1:15:24society.

1:15:26So

1:15:29the thing here also is tangible. I I I

1:15:33say if we build a quarter of the of the

1:15:35to start off with that tiny village

1:15:38that's something to show people that are

1:15:39looking for housing that are homeless

1:15:41something tangible because I can sit

1:15:43there and say oh hey we're here to talk

1:15:44about about housing I I can guarantee

1:15:47one the first question is there

1:15:48something available or am I a six-month

1:15:50waiting list or year waiting list

1:15:53because if you don't have something

1:15:54tangible a lot of people don't want to

1:15:56listen and you know I dealt with that

1:16:00with with working the prison working at

1:16:02DCF Jeff, if you don't have something

1:16:03tangible right there to ready start

1:16:05working forward with them, they're not

1:16:08really willing to to do what they need

1:16:11to do or or feel that we're doing what

1:16:13we need to do to help them. Cuz talk is

1:16:15one thing, but actually having something

1:16:17there tangible for them to try to attain

1:16:20to is what I think where we need to go

1:16:23first rather than go out and just

1:16:24talking to everyone and not having that

1:16:26tangible thing, putting them on a

1:16:27six-month or year-long waiting list.

1:16:32It's I I think I I know outreach is

1:16:36important and it educates and gets

1:16:38things out there and allows people to

1:16:40understand there are things out there

1:16:41for them because I understand working at

1:16:44the prison not everyone knew what the

1:16:45programs when you walked out the out the

1:16:47gates were. When you walked out of um uh

1:16:50out of DCF when you walked in not

1:16:53everything you didn't know all the

1:16:54programs are available for you. So

1:16:55outreach is good, but if there's nothing

1:16:57tangible there for the people to know

1:17:00that there's something that they can

1:17:01work towards and it's not a year down

1:17:03the road, it it's going to do a lot more

1:17:06to have that set set up than doing a

1:17:09year's worth of outreach and then

1:17:10looking at where all these things are

1:17:11going to go. And

1:17:15I'd almost like to see a good 5 to 10

1:17:18year plan longterm of what exactly our

1:17:20plan is year to year.

1:17:24Our goals cuz I know everything's

1:17:26fluctuates, but what's what's our 100%

1:17:28goal on this? Because we can throw $1.2

1:17:31million at this issue and be left with

1:17:34nothing in the end. So, uh, I'd like to

1:17:38see a lot more. I agree with this

1:17:39program. I like it and I I even said I

1:17:42I'll put the tiny village in my in my

1:17:45neighborhood. 100% agree with that. But

1:17:48we need to make sure we're doing this

1:17:49the right way or else we're doing what

1:17:50we've done the last six years I've been

1:17:53on up here. So,

1:17:55>> Council [clears throat] Member Heler,

1:17:57>> I just wanted to to punch in briefly on

1:18:00it. Um, some of the pieces that I like

1:18:02hearing the most, you know, built for

1:18:04zero and housing first is important, but

1:18:07when you're out there, it's people

1:18:09first. You've got to make those

1:18:10connections with the people and build

1:18:12that relationship. And it takes some

1:18:14time. We also um don't have to be the

1:18:18first provider. We've got a tremendous

1:18:20community network, including the private

1:18:22landlord sector who who sometimes go by

1:18:26the the term of second chance landlords.

1:18:29And it's a very strong sector in this

1:18:31community. The thing I like the most

1:18:34about where we are right now, and I I

1:18:36agree with Councilman Kell that a 10

1:18:3810-year plan, if we're ready for that

1:18:40now, we've positioned the pieces in

1:18:43place. Um, having been in that network

1:18:46myself, um, rather than just talking

1:18:49about a team and a one-stop shop and you

1:18:52got to be there Thursday or Tuesday from

1:18:5410 to noon, um, instead that that

1:18:58coalition of agencies coming together,

1:19:01but a fullyworked

1:19:04uh, social service and support network

1:19:06is what has worked well in this

1:19:08community in the past. and and it's it's

1:19:11interesting to see the baton get passed

1:19:13around to Breakthrough to step into a

1:19:14lead role. That's new for them, but for

1:19:16instance, Mirror, Inc. is very active

1:19:18with the jail and with people once

1:19:20they've gotten out. It might be helpful

1:19:23to all of us, those of us on the

1:19:25council, but also the community to see

1:19:28um maybe share with the our our public

1:19:31information people just a master list of

1:19:34all those partners and what roles they

1:19:36play so we can see it because it's it's

1:19:39really phenomenal. But but it most of us

1:19:43don't see it every day. So I'm I'm

1:19:46really pleased that because I asked

1:19:48Carrie, I said, "Do they have to come to

1:19:49the one-stop shop?" because I know that

1:19:51that doesn't work. And she said, "No,

1:19:54[laughter]

1:19:54you know, that's an opportunity to bring

1:19:56people together who need that, but also

1:19:58that full engagement network and now a

1:20:01shared database as well is huge." So,

1:20:06it's been a while. I see other people

1:20:08that are involved in that out there.

1:20:09Thanks. Thanks to everybody for the work

1:20:12to get us this far, but [clears throat]

1:20:14it's nice to see it shape up.

1:20:16>> Thanks.

1:20:17>> All right. I've moved to approve. We

1:20:19have a second from council member

1:20:20Bradberry.

1:20:22Any other comments or questions?

1:20:25If not, then I'm going to ask the clerk

1:20:28to take a vote, please.

1:20:35>> Brenda, my m my application went down,

1:20:38so I'll vote yes.

1:20:41>> Okay, gotcha.

1:20:44All right, we have 10 yes. The motion

1:20:46carries. Thank you. All right, with that

1:20:49we'll move on to item 4F.

1:20:52City clerk. [applause]

1:20:55>> F is a resolution introduced by city

1:20:57manager Dr. Robert Perez relating to the

1:20:59city of Topeka's legislative agenda for

1:21:01the 2027 legislative session.

1:21:04>> City manager. Thank you, mayor, members

1:21:07of the governing body. As part of this

1:21:09item, you will be asked to consider

1:21:10adoption of our 2027 legislative agenda.

1:21:13Our team began this process in August by

1:21:15sending the governing body and briefing

1:21:17the draft agenda with the policy and

1:21:19finance committee. During and after the

1:21:21policy and finance committee briefing

1:21:23and discussion with the governing body

1:21:24on September 1st, we heard feedback from

1:21:26the governing body and incorporated that

1:21:28feedback into the presentation for

1:21:30discussion and consideration this

1:21:32evening. A couple items that I want to

1:21:34highlight as recent considerations to

1:21:36our recommended uh legislative agenda

1:21:38include the city of Topeka supporting

1:21:40the preservation of a city's ability to

1:21:42charge utility franchise fees. We

1:21:44anticipate that there will be a push by

1:21:46utilities to eliminate franchise fees

1:21:49which generates about $16 million

1:21:51annually for the city of Topeka. And

1:21:53then also uh for torque claims uh found

1:21:56on the legislative agenda on line 51

1:21:58which speaks to the government the

1:22:00government's duty regarding street

1:22:01conditions is only to the public at

1:22:03large traveling those streets and not to

1:22:05an individual person. This is uh

1:22:07directly tied to the recent Kansas

1:22:09Supreme Court decision decision to allow

1:22:11pothole negligence lawsuit to go to a

1:22:14jury trial. This decision has statewide

1:22:16impacts and that needs to be addressed

1:22:17through legislation. As previously

1:22:19noted, we typically meet with the Shauny

1:22:21County delegation the first week of

1:22:22December. Adoption of the legislative

1:22:25agenda will allow us to begin meeting

1:22:26and communicating our priorities with

1:22:28our delegation members and other

1:22:29municipal stakeholders before December.

1:22:32Stephan, I do recommend approval of this

1:22:33item. And with that, I will now turn

1:22:34this over to our city lobbyist, Kell

1:22:36Beam, with the Beam Consulting Group to

1:22:38lead us through this item. Kell,

1:22:42>> thank you, governing body. um appreciate

1:22:44the opportunity to appear before you

1:22:46today and um give a recap of the

1:22:49proposed changes to the 2027 legislative

1:22:52agenda.

1:22:55We do have a PowerPoint

1:22:58>> you say about the delegation?

1:23:01>> No, but I don't know. I didn't hear

1:23:31>> [clears throat]

1:23:40>> They have the presentation in their

1:23:42packet, so you can go ahead and move

1:23:43forward.

1:23:43>> Okay. If you want to go ahead and Yeah.

1:23:45>> Thank you.

1:23:46>> She looks for it.

1:23:48Um well, thank you for the opportunity

1:23:50to appear before you today. Um you'll

1:23:53notice the uh 2027 proposed legislative

1:23:56agenda is very similar um to the 2026

1:24:01agenda um with a few um additions that

1:24:05were made by the policy and finance

1:24:06committee back in August. Um additions

1:24:10one and two both relate to uh the

1:24:14protection of infrastructure funding for

1:24:16highways, roads, and bridges. Um, one is

1:24:21uh more specific to the state highway

1:24:24fund and ensuring uh supporting um the

1:24:30preservation of funding in the state

1:24:31highway fund to ensure that it isn't

1:24:34shifted to the state general fund as it

1:24:36has been in years past. And then number

1:24:39two

1:24:41is um more geared towards the city

1:24:44county highway fund. Um

1:24:48this is a fund that is uh primary fin

1:24:51primarily financed through motor fuels

1:24:55taxes and as vehicles have become more

1:24:58efficient um and we've seen a shift

1:25:01towards hybrid and electric vehicles

1:25:04um that we have seen declining revenues

1:25:06in that funds in recent years. So there

1:25:09was a provision added by the policy and

1:25:11finance committee um to uh encourage the

1:25:16state to look at additional financing

1:25:18mechanisms uh for that fund.

1:25:22Um addition number three is related to

1:25:26the flood insurance rate map. Um the

1:25:30city uh the county is in need of updated

1:25:33flood insurance maps. um they haven't

1:25:36been updated in over 10 years. Um

1:25:39traditionally those have been funded uh

1:25:42by the federal government. However, uh

1:25:45due to budget cuts um funding has not

1:25:48been available for that. So there was a

1:25:50provision added to the legislative

1:25:53agenda to seek to seek state and federal

1:25:56funding um for updates to the flood map

1:25:59and also for additional flood mitigation

1:26:02efforts.

1:26:05Um, addition number four,

1:26:08um, is in response to legislation that

1:26:12has been proposed by the

1:26:13telecommunications industry that would,

1:26:16uh, require, uh, municipalities to pay

1:26:20to reimburse um, utilities for the cost

1:26:23of relocating

1:26:25um, their equipment out of the rightway

1:26:27when it needs to be done for uh, public

1:26:30works projects. Currently, utilities are

1:26:33responsible for those costs, but there's

1:26:35been legislation introduced that would

1:26:37shift those costs uh to municipalities.

1:26:41Number five relates to um the Kansas

1:26:44Housing Resources Corporations

1:26:47um qualified allocation plan. Um they

1:26:52have uh included in that plan a they

1:26:56award points when scoring projects to uh

1:27:00developers that have received a waiver

1:27:03of uh municipal building permit fees. Um

1:27:08we have added a provision in the

1:27:10legislative agenda um that would limit

1:27:13their ability to incentivize those

1:27:16permit fee waivers.

1:27:19Um number six, this is a um this was

1:27:23actually included in last year's

1:27:24legislative agenda um and was included

1:27:28again in this year um the support for um

1:27:32state level efforts to combat human

1:27:34trafficking.

1:27:36And then number seven is in response to

1:27:38the um Supreme Court case that um city

1:27:42manager mentioned

1:27:45um to support legislation that would

1:27:48limit the government's duty regarding

1:27:50street conditions only to the public at

1:27:53large and not to an individual person.

1:27:58Um these are a few other potential

1:28:00additions that were discussed at the

1:28:02last governing body. Um the last time

1:28:05the governing body um had a discussion

1:28:07on the legislative agenda

1:28:10um regarding

1:28:11uh zeroing out of vacant properties for

1:28:16appraisal purposes.

1:28:18um changing the state statute that

1:28:22requires um municipalities

1:28:26uh to abate um vegetation. Instead,

1:28:29changing that to a may from a shall

1:28:33um requiring landlords to advise tenants

1:28:36of open code violations prior to them

1:28:38moving in.

1:28:41um overriding the state law that um

1:28:44allows for

1:28:46uh campaign signs in the public rightway

1:28:49during election times.

1:28:52And then also uh preserving the city's

1:28:55ability to charge utility franchise

1:28:58fees. Again, there's been some talk that

1:29:00utilities may bring legislation to limit

1:29:03the city's ability to charge franchise

1:29:05fees. And then there is also discussion

1:29:08um about having the governing body

1:29:11prioritize um items within the

1:29:14legislative agenda.

1:29:18Uh here is a timeline that the city

1:29:20manager mentioned. Um

1:29:23if the governing body does approve um

1:29:26the uh legislative agenda tonight, uh we

1:29:30would begin uh having conversations with

1:29:33the Shauny County delegation and other

1:29:35stakeholders about our legislative

1:29:37agenda in advance of the um legislative

1:29:41agenda. And then we will have a more

1:29:43formal uh presentation to the Shauny

1:29:46County delegation in December.

1:29:50Um, with that I'm happy to answer any

1:29:52questions.

1:29:54>> Council member Kell.

1:29:56>> Yeah. On uh number six here, the combat

1:29:59human trafficking. I'd almost on top of

1:30:02that title like to put the child sex

1:30:03abuse. I think that is just as important

1:30:05or if not more important than human

1:30:07trafficking because a lot of child sex

1:30:09uh uh victims end up in human

1:30:12trafficking. So uh so that needs kind of

1:30:14be in that title work also. So that's

1:30:16shows the the predominant of the of what

1:30:20the issue is there.

1:30:23Um how long in the future can we add

1:30:26stuff to this like in two months if we

1:30:28add something to it? I I I've thought

1:30:31about it cuz I just yesterday or Sunday,

1:30:33excuse me. The thought that came to me

1:30:36is what our teachers are dealing with

1:30:38with safety in the classroom right now

1:30:41and how teachers and and other students

1:30:43are constantly being victimized by

1:30:46having students get sent out of the room

1:30:48and get sent right back and the ch the

1:30:50student may throw a chair across the

1:30:51room, hit two students and the teacher

1:30:53and in this scenario they go to the

1:30:56office they're right back. There's

1:30:57nothing out there that helps the

1:30:59teacher. And there's scenarios out there

1:31:02right now in real life where a teacher

1:31:05breaks up a fight and they've been

1:31:07arrested for breaking up the fight. And

1:31:09then so another teacher like, "Well, I'm

1:31:11not going to get arrested for this. I'm

1:31:12not going to break up the next fight."

1:31:13Then that that teacher is getting sued

1:31:15for not breaking up the fight. So, and

1:31:18then you almost have the district

1:31:19standing back like, "Well, what a we

1:31:20gave them training on this stuff, but

1:31:22they're so ambiguous on what the

1:31:25responsibility of the teacher is, what

1:31:26the responsibility of the administration

1:31:27is, what the responsibility of the

1:31:29district is, and we're having students

1:31:32and teachers hurt and just wanting to

1:31:34walk out the door on an everyday basis

1:31:36because there's nothing out there that

1:31:38tells them what their responsibilities

1:31:40are, what their protections are."

1:31:43Uh because the minute they speak up and

1:31:45say, "Hey, I'm in an unsafe environment,

1:31:48they're they're almost targeted as,

1:31:50well, you're causing issues here or

1:31:51you're you're picking on the students."

1:31:53Well, you have students throwing chairs

1:31:54across the room, throwing rocks across

1:31:56the room or whatever, and that student

1:31:58gets sent out and gets sent right back

1:32:00into the classroom. You have other

1:32:01students getting hurt by this and things

1:32:02like that. And there's nothing out there

1:32:04that kind of sets the standard for a

1:32:06teacher to protect them physically and

1:32:09and professionally because there are,

1:32:12like I said, one teacher doesn't break

1:32:14up a fight, they're they're sued.

1:32:16Another teacher breaks up a fight,

1:32:17they're arrested. So what what is a

1:32:19teacher supposed to do? Uh there's

1:32:21nothing out there. And it it's

1:32:24that whole scenario is becoming a very

1:32:26hard uh on the teaching profession as a

1:32:28whole. And we already have a shortage of

1:32:30teachers and substitutes. So, I think we

1:32:33may maybe need to help get something

1:32:35some guidelines out there for teachers

1:32:38because it's happening throughout Johnny

1:32:39County. I hear from teachers all the

1:32:40time that have this issue. I My wife's a

1:32:43teacher, but so I know a lot of other

1:32:44teachers, but this is a constant battle

1:32:46that I've been hearing about between uh

1:32:48teachers and this district and what the

1:32:51rules are.

1:32:52>> This is a living document and if at some

1:32:54point you want to bring anything to the

1:32:56council to include, you are welcome to

1:32:57do that.

1:32:58>> All right. Thank you,

1:33:01>> Council Member Hiller.

1:33:02>> Thank you, Mayor. I've got three things.

1:33:04One that I would like to see as an

1:33:06amendment. I've mentioned it before. And

1:33:08two, that I guess I want I want to make

1:33:10sure in the record and the people

1:33:11consider. Um I've been advised by the

1:33:14mayor and we've seen that that this is a

1:33:16living document. So, it doesn't have to

1:33:18be exactly what we're going to do or

1:33:20what our representatives will do, but I

1:33:23do believe in in in creating the

1:33:25language that that is um that's

1:33:28appropriate. So, the the one that I'd

1:33:30like to see changed, I think that the

1:33:32section on housing is very good. And

1:33:35what it says right now is recognizing

1:33:37that residents have a right to live in

1:33:39safe affordable housing, we support

1:33:40legislation allowing cities to require

1:33:43mandatory inspections for landlords

1:33:45accepting public funds, strengthening

1:33:48protections for enforcement of equitable

1:33:50interest in contract deed arrangements,

1:33:52and giving cities additional tools to

1:33:54deal with vacant and abandoned housing

1:33:56in order to decrease blight in

1:33:58neighborhoods and return houses to

1:34:00productive use. Basically, that's some

1:34:02good broad language that talks about

1:34:04rental housing, talks about contracts

1:34:07for deed and vacant housing. Um, but the

1:34:11the language that's in there that we put

1:34:12in about 3 years ago is very narrow in

1:34:15terms of just government assisted

1:34:17housing and asking for mandatory

1:34:20inspections, which we've learned we

1:34:22probably can't get. And my preference

1:34:25would be to substitute

1:34:28for that the first one on rentals to

1:34:30just say um we want to assist renters in

1:34:34asserting their rights for safe

1:34:36affordable housing and have some broad

1:34:38language that then could be filled in.

1:34:40There's a really great professional

1:34:42association that Carrie's involved with

1:34:44that's working on statewide legislative

1:34:47issues and so on. I just think that that

1:34:50substitute language for one thing

1:34:52acknowledges that we are now monitoring

1:34:55programs that have government assisted

1:34:58housing. And so hopefully that

1:35:01monitoring will be adequate to make sure

1:35:04that those inspections are done by those

1:35:05entities and reported to us as a city.

1:35:08We've got that set up already. And also

1:35:10we've because of people's privacy and

1:35:13property rights have had resistance

1:35:15about mandatory inspections and

1:35:17unlimited ones. So if there was somebody

1:35:20who was willing to support changing that

1:35:23language, I would be happy to either

1:35:26make the motion or second one to

1:35:29substitute assist renters in asserting

1:35:31their rights for safe affordable

1:35:32housing.

1:35:33>> Okay. So council, can you give us the

1:35:34page number, the line number, what

1:35:36language? That section is lines 54 to

1:35:3959.

1:35:40>> So you want to strike 54 to 59.

1:35:44>> No, it's only a phrase.

1:35:47>> So it would be to substitute

1:35:50from require mandatory inspections for

1:35:52landlords accepting public funds to

1:35:56replace that

1:35:58with assist renters in asset in

1:36:01asserting their rights for safe

1:36:03affordable housing.

1:36:09Okay. So, the motion is to remove

1:36:11require mandatory inspections for

1:36:12landlords accepting public funds and

1:36:14replace it with assist renters in

1:36:17exercising their rights

1:36:23>> for safe affordable housing.

1:36:29>> Okay. So, there's a motion on the floor.

1:36:31Is there a second?

1:36:41I do not see one. One more chance.

1:36:45>> All right.

1:36:45>> Well, if it comes back, then I'm happy

1:36:47to punch in. I I didn't want to push it

1:36:49right away. The other two that I have, I

1:36:52just would like to be on the record for

1:36:53supporting the vegetation abatement

1:36:56abatement section that our our lobbyist

1:36:59mentioned. Um if we need to do more

1:37:01study on it, fine. But because we have

1:37:04added all overgrown vegetation to our

1:37:06property maintenance ordinance. So it

1:37:08could be whole rows of shrubs or trees

1:37:11and things like that being unless

1:37:14there's a reason not to not to change

1:37:17the the state law right now. It requires

1:37:20that any vegetation that we write up, if

1:37:22we're going to write it up, we have to

1:37:24abate it. Whereas if we if the state

1:37:28changed the language to say may abate

1:37:30it, it would let us have a a standard

1:37:33operating procedure that we always do

1:37:35the mowing, but we might not have to do

1:37:38all of the big stuff.

1:37:41>> Um, so

1:37:42>> yeah, I'm sorry. Um, I just I just

1:37:45wanted to state for the record that that

1:37:46is not included in here. It's what we

1:37:48heard,

1:37:48>> correct?

1:37:49>> For for consideration. So it's actually

1:37:51not in the draft agenda. So

1:37:53>> I just wanted for the record that we had

1:37:56discussed it and would encourage staff

1:37:58appropriately to research that and see

1:38:01if it is something we would want to move

1:38:03forward. Um and the last one is we've

1:38:06discussed LLC's and the fact that people

1:38:10are wanting it to be a little easier to

1:38:12find out who the stakeholders are in

1:38:15limited liability corporations.

1:38:18And so, um, it may be premature to put

1:38:21this as a specific thing in the agenda,

1:38:24but I would like to see folks research

1:38:27further whether we could ask what they

1:38:30call foreign LLC's.

1:38:33Uh, right now Kansas, the state of

1:38:34Kansas asks any LLC that files in the

1:38:38state of Kansas to

1:38:42to record on that document any

1:38:45stakeholders in that LLC that have a 5%

1:38:48or greater interest. We do not require

1:38:51that from the out ofstate LLC's.

1:38:54So, if it turns out that their state

1:38:57doesn't require it, it's still it's

1:39:00still possible to find out who who the

1:39:02stakeholders are in the LLC's, but it's

1:39:04a lot easier if the state has required

1:39:06them to file.

1:39:08So, I just wanted to suggest that

1:39:11anyway. Again, if people think that

1:39:13those second two need more um research,

1:39:16that's fine.

1:39:19>> And I'll just follow up. Kayla and I

1:39:20have talked about the vegetation which

1:39:22is the moving it from May to shall and

1:39:24all that. We think that could be an easy

1:39:26fix, but we're going to kick the tires

1:39:27on that and see what that looks like and

1:39:30make sure that there's not some

1:39:32>> huge implication that we didn't see

1:39:34that, you know, a comes to us and says,

1:39:36"Whoa, you didn't realize the A

1:39:38>> that doesn't make it insurmountable.

1:39:39Maybe we can carve out an exception."

1:39:41So, we're going to take a look at that.

1:39:42And then your second one, I think again,

1:39:44we are going to look into that. I think

1:39:46we as you and I talked or mentioned to

1:39:47you, we we look at that in the context

1:39:49of the housing issue, but that change

1:39:51actually has a big ripple effect in lots

1:39:54of industries across the state. And I

1:39:56promise you there will be a lot of

1:39:57business entities that are going to have

1:39:59something to say about that. So, we want

1:40:01to go talk with them first to see, we

1:40:03might be surprised. They may say to us,

1:40:05"No, we really don't care. It's already

1:40:07standard in most states and great." But

1:40:09if they say, "Eh, we want to come back

1:40:11and talk to you and say, "This is what

1:40:13we heard. What do you think you want to

1:40:15do next? [clears throat]

1:40:15>> And and that's fine. We had that

1:40:17discussion. I just wanted to make sure I

1:40:18mentioned it here so that it was on the

1:40:21record that it was an issue we were

1:40:22looking into.

1:40:25>> Council member Ortiz.

1:40:27>> Well, since it's a living document,

1:40:29every year I come and talk about the

1:40:31boarded up houses and we just don't get

1:40:33any traction anywhere.

1:40:39Is it Can you throw something in there?

1:40:42Well,

1:40:45>> what um thank you for the question,

1:40:48council member. Um are you wanting are

1:40:52you referring to the section um

1:40:57uh

1:40:59regarding giving cities additional tools

1:41:01to deal deal with vacant and abandoned

1:41:03housing in order to decrease flight?

1:41:06>> It's in there. That was a trick

1:41:08question. Okay. Thank [laughter] you.

1:41:13Council member Valdivia.

1:41:16>> Thank you, Mayor. I am just like beyond

1:41:19grateful that nobody took up a second on

1:41:21that motion to strike out the

1:41:23inspections. That is it. I mean, just to

1:41:27be really blunt, silly, and inane

1:41:30because it it takes the knees. It it

1:41:33just like strikes us at the knees on

1:41:36everything that we have been trying to

1:41:38work with to help with the slum lords

1:41:42that we have and help to try to build a

1:41:45coalition

1:41:46that is not going to be busting down

1:41:49doors demanding inspections.

1:41:53But we saw what happened at Timberly.

1:41:56We've seen what has happened at other

1:41:58housing that has not been inspected

1:42:01adequately. So, I am very grateful that

1:42:04no one took up on that second because to

1:42:07me it adds a weakness to our legislative

1:42:10agenda when we need a strong and

1:42:13progressive legislative agenda. So, I'm

1:42:17just wanted to say like I'm grateful.

1:42:20Thank you, Mayor. Council member Kell.

1:42:23So, I'd like to make that formal

1:42:24amendment on uh line 81 to do the uh sex

1:42:29trafficking/child

1:42:30uh child sex abuse.

1:42:33>> So, you want to add it just say the

1:42:35motion would be to change the title from

1:42:37human trafficking to human trafficking

1:42:40and child sex abuse. Yes. Or sexual

1:42:42abuse

1:42:43>> which is referenced in line 82.

1:42:45>> But I add that

1:42:46>> to me that it almost highlights just the

1:42:48human trafficking. It's almost screaming

1:42:50the document. I think it needs a a

1:42:53highlight both.

1:42:56>> That's I will second that.

1:42:59So, we have a motion in a second to

1:43:01change line 81 from human trafficking to

1:43:03human trafficking and child sexual abuse

1:43:05to reference that it's also in the line

1:43:0882.

1:43:10Any comments or questions on that

1:43:12motion?

1:43:14If not, I'd ask the clerk to take a vote

1:43:15on that, please.

1:43:36Okay, we have 10. Yes, the motion

1:43:38carries.

1:43:41All right, we do have someone signed up

1:43:43for public comment on these issues. I'm

1:43:45going to go ahead and move to that

1:43:46before we take any other steps. Now that

1:43:48we've had some discussion,

1:43:50I've got Mr. Joseph Lebet.

1:44:01Evening, governing body and citizens.

1:44:03Um, I don't have the living document in

1:44:06front of me, but I was taking some

1:44:07notes. Um, one thing that happens when

1:44:10when you're legislating and you're

1:44:12lobbying is if the list is too big,

1:44:16uh, it gets pretty, uh, pretty hard to

1:44:19accomplish much of anything. I know when

1:44:21I was focused on the, uh, focy viuct, I

1:44:25focused on that project. We also focused

1:44:28on a couple of the minor projects for

1:44:30the chamber, but focus is key. And I

1:44:33don't I'm not saying any of these are

1:44:36bad, but uh that's just my comment. I

1:44:40would like to see in the future that you

1:44:42uh uh ask for specific highway projects.

1:44:46Uh and I I don't know that I've ever

1:44:48seen that other than references of Poke

1:44:51Quincy Boduct. Uh there's a 49th Street

1:44:54that crosses over uh 75 highway that

1:44:59would be excellent for a diamond

1:45:00interchange. probably about $20 million

1:45:03in current dollars. And it just that

1:45:07interchange is could be very valuable

1:45:09for developing industrial property there

1:45:12in the city. Most of that intersection

1:45:14is in the city, not all of it. Uh I

1:45:17would love to see that project move

1:45:18forward. Um, the last time they did a

1:45:22flood uh control was uh map was federal

1:45:27and it was 2011

1:45:29and I still believe there's a lot of

1:45:31inaccuracies in that but uh it wasn't

1:45:33taken up. The city could have refuted it

1:45:37but they just accepted it. Um

1:45:40$50 million in franchise fees. That's a

1:45:43lot of money. I didn't know you guys

1:45:45were getting that much. Um,

1:45:48you know, it kind of goes to some of my

1:45:51concerns about our budgeting up here. We

1:45:53don't get monthly financial reports, and

1:45:56that's an internal problem. That's a

1:45:59government problem here. Uh, but I was

1:46:02surprised by that. Obviously, we

1:46:04wouldn't want to lose that. Of course,

1:46:06uh, the out of town developments that we

1:46:09hook up sewer to and water, they don't

1:46:11pay those to us. Just just saying.

1:46:15um

1:46:16open code violations being a public

1:46:20record or has to be disclosed. Yeah, I

1:46:23think that's a good idea, but I don't

1:46:24know that you couldn't do that uh by

1:46:27just putting on a website and it's going

1:46:28to be have to be accurate because you

1:46:30don't want defamation. So, that means

1:46:32it's going to have to be uh monitored

1:46:34and kept up to date. [snorts] But uh you

1:46:38know, if if you'd had that at Highest

1:46:40when I was president a few years back, I

1:46:42don't think anything would have been

1:46:43rentable. Uh, and we had a serious

1:46:47slumlord problem over there. And it took

1:46:50determination and passion, not just from

1:46:52the NIA, but from some of the leadership

1:46:55to confront them and deal with that. And

1:46:59that neighborhood has completely turned

1:47:01around. It's not perfect, but from what

1:47:03it was 10 years ago and with the help of

1:47:05Sen and the NAS and certain passionate

1:47:09presidents that we had, it

1:47:11[clears throat] it did turn around and

1:47:12it's a much better community. Anyway,

1:47:15that's enough. Thank you. Thank you.

1:47:21[clears throat] I can't hit my button

1:47:23here, but it's all right. Um, any other

1:47:26comments or questions on the legislative

1:47:28agenda?

1:47:30I was trying to make a motion to

1:47:31approve, but I can't. My button's not

1:47:33there. There we go.

1:47:38A motion to approve from me. And we have

1:47:39a second from council member Valdivia

1:47:41Alkala. Any other questions, comments,

1:47:43or discussion on this item at this time?

1:47:47If not, then I will ask the clerk to

1:47:49take a vote to approve, please.

1:47:51>> Council member Valdivia Aqua.

1:47:55>> I pushed the button.

1:47:57>> All right, we got it now. Thank you.

1:48:00We have 10. Yes. The motion carries.

1:48:03>> All right. Thank you very much, Kale.

1:48:05>> Thank you.

1:48:07>> With that, we now move on to non-action

1:48:08items. We'll start with 5A. City clerk.

1:48:14>> A is discussion concerning the 2027

1:48:17special alcohol and drug funding

1:48:18recommendations in the amount of

1:48:20$865,924.

1:48:23>> City manager.

1:48:25>> Thank you, mayor, members of the

1:48:26governing body. The city of Topeka

1:48:28receives liquor tax collected by the

1:48:29state of Kansas that funds our special

1:48:31alcohol and drug program fund. These

1:48:34funds, estimated 866,000 for FY2027,

1:48:38can only be used to support programs

1:48:40focused on alcohol or drug abuse

1:48:42prevention, education, intervention, or

1:48:44detoxification.

1:48:46Earlier this year, our team advertised a

1:48:48request for proposals, and this evening,

1:48:50we'll discuss the special drug and

1:48:51alcohol grant review committee and

1:48:53advisory council's grant

1:48:54recommendations. With that, I will turn

1:48:56this over to Carrie Higgins, director of

1:48:57housing and homeless services to lead us

1:48:59through this discussion. Carrie,

1:49:00>> thank you. Good evening. So, tonight we

1:49:03have the special alcohol and drug grant

1:49:05recommendations for you. Um, as the city

1:49:08manager mentioned, we are looking at an

1:49:09estimated uh roughly $865,9247

1:49:16uh fund. uh this amount is projected

1:49:19based on that liquor tax that is

1:49:20collected by the state of Kansas and a

1:49:23third of that is required to be given

1:49:25back to alcohol and drug programs. So

1:49:27the grant process started in June of

1:49:292026 when the RFP was released in July

1:49:33the applications were due. We had uh

1:49:36seven agencies apply this year, two of

1:49:38those being new agencies. Uh at the end

1:49:41of July, we met with the grant review

1:49:43committee to score those applications

1:49:45and then in August those recommendations

1:49:48went before the advisory council for

1:49:51approval and then the agencies have one

1:49:53week to appeal if they wish to do so. We

1:49:56had no appeals this year and then

1:49:58tonight we are before you with these

1:50:00recommendations uh for discussion and we

1:50:03will be back next week for approval.

1:50:06So you can see on the chart in front of

1:50:08you each of the agencies that applied uh

1:50:11for which program and what their

1:50:12requested amount was for 2027. In your

1:50:16packets, we gave you more details on

1:50:18each of the programs and what

1:50:20specifically they were funding. So you

1:50:22can see the request for 2027 as well as

1:50:24the amounts that were funded in the

1:50:25previous years. And because this is an

1:50:29estimated amount a year in advance, the

1:50:32fund has uh accumulated a little bit of

1:50:34a balance. So Josh previously

1:50:37recommended that we spend down our fund

1:50:39balance a little bit this year, which is

1:50:41why we um as the committee are

1:50:44recommending that we fund each of these

1:50:46programs at their ask amount, which is

1:50:48the column you see on the right that is

1:50:50highlighted in yellow. And with that, I

1:50:53am happy to answer any questions that

1:50:56you might have. We also have um all of

1:50:58the agencies here in attendance tonight

1:51:00in case you have any questions for them

1:51:02as well.

1:51:03questions or comments for Carrie.

1:51:09>> Well, that was easy.

1:51:12>> Sounds like it went pretty pretty well

1:51:14this year.

1:51:14>> Yes, it did.

1:51:15>> Great. That's always good to hear.

1:51:16Appreciate all the work that went into

1:51:18it. All right, last call for questions

1:51:20or comments. If not, I'm going to let

1:51:21her loose.

1:51:23>> All right. Thank you, Carrie.

1:51:24>> Thank you.

1:51:27All right, as we are approaching close

1:51:30enough to 8:00 and then we've got

1:51:31several issues that have some

1:51:32presentations. We're going to go ahead

1:51:34and take our 8:00 break. So 10 minutes.

1:51:37So be back here few minutes after 8:00,

1:51:39please.

1:51:51>> All right, we are back from recess. With

1:51:53that, we are going to move on to our

1:51:55next non-action item. B. City clerk.

1:51:58>> B is discussion on the collaborative

1:52:00public safety approach between the

1:52:02Topeka Police Department, the Shauny

1:52:03County Sheriff's Office on the use of

1:52:05public safety cameras.

1:52:07>> City manager.

1:52:09>> Thank you, Mayor, members of the

1:52:10government governing body. Recently, we

1:52:12have received inquiries about the city's

1:52:13use of license plate readers and public

1:52:15safety cameras, namely flock cameras. To

1:52:18address questions, I've asked the team

1:52:20to prepare this briefing to discuss the

1:52:21city's use of recor and elsag license

1:52:23plate reader systems and not flock and

1:52:26how those tools are used as part of our

1:52:28real-time crime center. This briefing

1:52:30will cover topics including how we limit

1:52:32access only to authorized users and

1:52:34retain data for 21 days. I'm going now

1:52:36turn this over to Jamie Halum, chief of

1:52:39staff, to lead us through this item.

1:52:41Jamie.

1:52:57Thank you, mayor and governing body. Uh,

1:52:59as the city manager said, tonight we'll

1:53:01be giving an overview on the public

1:53:03safety camera systems uh that we utilize

1:53:06here in Topeka, what some of that

1:53:07technology is and what some of the

1:53:09applications are. Um, tonight I have

1:53:13with me Lieutenant Andy Badel. Um, the

1:53:16lieutenant is a a wealth of information

1:53:18on the technology and the application of

1:53:21those systems and cameras. Um, he's been

1:53:24a part of uh this since the beginning

1:53:26since since Topeka was introduced to

1:53:29this technology. Um, so he can assist in

1:53:31answering questions as well.

1:53:34With that, we'll get started. Um,

1:53:39so public safety cameras in and your

1:53:41police department, what what is it? We

1:53:44we want to talk about um the systems

1:53:47themselves a little bit and how um we

1:53:50apply uh that technology and and and how

1:53:53we don't apply that technology.

1:53:56So let let's start with some of the

1:53:58systems. Um,

1:54:02Flock is a commercial provider of

1:54:05license plate readers with an expanded

1:54:08network of data sharing. TPD does not

1:54:11have a contract with Flock for cameras

1:54:14or access to to their databases.

1:54:18Recor is a stationary license plate

1:54:21reader system. TPD currently leases 20

1:54:24Recor devices. This contract will end uh

1:54:28in December of 2026

1:54:31and we are in conversation uh about what

1:54:34that looks like moving forward in 2027.

1:54:37Um as it pertains to our collaboration

1:54:40with Shauny County Sheriff and the

1:54:42Realtime Crime Center.

1:54:45Uh Shauny County Sheriff's Office leases

1:54:47Recore cameras as well. An agreement for

1:54:49TPD to have access to the rec data

1:54:52through SSO is being drafted.

1:54:56Elsa TPD owns six mobile license plate

1:55:01reader units. They're attached to mobile

1:55:04uh to vehicle patrol vehicles and they

1:55:06collect data locally.

1:55:10Um and as we've talked about uh

1:55:12previously, the Realtime Crime Center uh

1:55:14or RTCC is run by the Shauny County

1:55:17Sheriff's Office.

1:55:19It's staffed by a combination of SSO and

1:55:22TPD personnel through a memorandum of

1:55:24understanding and it brings information

1:55:27from multiple sources into one

1:55:28observable location to enhance response

1:55:31times and resource deployment.

1:55:42So how do we use it?

1:55:45uh to help identify suspect vehicles,

1:55:48stolen vehicles, connections between

1:55:51criminal incidents when reasonable

1:55:53suspicion and probable cause exist. Some

1:55:56examples of uh the type of incidents or

1:55:58scenarios or crimes that we apply this

1:56:00technology to uh robberies, homicides,

1:56:04aggravated batteries, and hit-and-run

1:56:06accidents.

1:56:10These are also a extremely valuable

1:56:14resource uh when vehicles are involved

1:56:18with Amber Alerts and Silver Alerts. Um

1:56:22as you can imagine um Amber Alerts and

1:56:25Silver Alerts um cause us great concern

1:56:27with some of our most vulnerable

1:56:29citizens. that search area for these

1:56:32folks can be enormous. Um especially if

1:56:36you don't have a

1:56:38jumping off point or a starting point.

1:56:40When a vehicle is involved and we can

1:56:42apply this technology, it can greatly

1:56:45greatly reduce that search area, give us

1:56:47a starting point um and give us a

1:56:51greater chance for a successful

1:56:52resolution um in those areas.

1:56:57Utilizing this technology to determine

1:56:59where a vehicle was last publicly

1:57:02observed can significantly reser reduce

1:57:04reduce search time and improve

1:57:06likelihood of safely locating an

1:57:08endangered person or taking a dangerous

1:57:10suspect into custody and limiting

1:57:12further harm.

1:57:16We also use this technology to rule out

1:57:18potential suspects and redirect

1:57:21resources to correct individuals.

1:57:25Accountability.

1:57:30As with other protected information

1:57:32accessible to officers, law and policy

1:57:36limit [clears throat] when law

1:57:36enforcement officers may access this

1:57:38information.

1:57:40Systems are audited regularly for

1:57:43concerning patterns of use

1:57:45and all use and access is logged through

1:57:48the system to aid in review if a concern

1:57:51is raised.

1:57:56So the data control

1:58:00TPD's primary system recor collects and

1:58:03maintains data generated in the vendor

1:58:06uh governmental cloud account. Um so

1:58:10this is not designed to be uh for a

1:58:14commercial use or commercial sharing.

1:58:18access is limited to legitimate public

1:58:21safety objectives, investigations.

1:58:26LPR data uh was recently reduced uh the

1:58:30retention was recently reduced to 21

1:58:33days. Um prior to that it was set at 90

1:58:36days.

1:58:38TPDS systems are through companies with

1:58:41public safety and law enforcement

1:58:42applications rather than commercial or a

1:58:44public application.

1:58:47LPR alerts are a lead, but steps must be

1:58:50taken to verify that information. So,

1:58:55we simply get an alert from an LPR. Um,

1:58:59that is not the end of the discussion.

1:59:00That's not the end of that

1:59:01investigation. There's a human factor.

1:59:03There's an investigator behind those

1:59:05leads verifying and following that.

1:59:14And to summarize, the LPR systems are

1:59:17utilized by the TPI Police Department to

1:59:19ensure better information,

1:59:22faster response, more efficient

1:59:24investigations, more crimes solved,

1:59:27justice brought to those victims and

1:59:29families,

1:59:31more innocent people cleared, and better

1:59:34use of taxpayer resources.

1:59:38And with that, we will stand for

1:59:41questions.

1:59:43All right, Council Member Valdivia

1:59:45Alkala.

1:59:47>> Thank you, Mayor. Um,

1:59:50I just have a couple of questions.

1:59:53First, a couple of comments based on

1:59:56specific recor cameras, understanding

1:59:59that they are not block cameras. uh and

2:00:03I think a lot of the emails and we have

2:00:05received a large amount of emails over

2:00:08the past I would say I don't know four

2:00:12to eight weeks or so maybe um I think

2:00:15all of them were referring to block

2:00:17cameras so it's good to have the

2:00:20differentiation there when it comes to

2:00:23the recor cameras though there does seem

2:00:26to be some of the same concerns as with

2:00:30flocks uh the flock cameras.

2:00:35One of the main ones is the AI component

2:00:38and we know how AI is becoming such a

2:00:42behemoth and a real concern to a lot of

2:00:45folks. Uh, I know that, you know, the

2:00:49ACLU, the Electronic Frontier

2:00:52Foundation, they warned that the rapid

2:00:54expansion of these cameras poses

2:00:57significant risk to privacy, due

2:01:00process, and equal treatment. Um it goes

2:01:04on to state the indiscriminate what is

2:01:08being created whether it's reor whether

2:01:10it's flock or whoever is an

2:01:13indiscriminate mass tracking and

2:01:15retrospective surveillance.

2:01:18uh

2:01:20the advanced AI capabilities. It says

2:01:23specifically recor uses advanced AI

2:01:27intelligence and machine learning to

2:01:30analyze vehicle data. Uh Jamie or I'm

2:01:34sorry the other person sitting next to

2:01:36you. I apologize for not getting your

2:01:37name. I think it's Batal. Can you tell

2:01:40me if this is true? Did they

2:01:43do they utilize the advanced artificial

2:01:46intelligence and machine learning to

2:01:48analyze vehicle data?

2:01:51>> The the data that I believe that they're

2:01:53referring to is going to be uh character

2:01:56recognition. Basically, the letters and

2:01:58numbers of the license plate as well as

2:02:01the color of the vehicle. It'll say it's

2:02:03a red car or a blue car. and also

2:02:07basically the the style of car SUV, a

2:02:11truck or a passenger car. That is the

2:02:14the only AI that I believe that they are

2:02:16using.

2:02:18>> Okay. So, it doesn't go into the

2:02:22bumper stickers, roof [clears throat]

2:02:24racks, surface damage, anything of that.

2:02:27I feel a little bit dubious about asking

2:02:29that, but I want clarity. I can see

2:02:31where that would be beneficial. But I

2:02:34also see with what they are saying is

2:02:37that critics argue this enables

2:02:39suspicionless generation searches where

2:02:43law enforcement can track everyone

2:02:45driving a specific type of vehicle in a

2:02:47region without a targeted warrant. So,

2:02:51with these specifics that we're talking

2:02:53about that some recor

2:02:56uh systems use with bumper stickers,

2:02:58roof racks, d surface damage, is that

2:03:01what our recor is able to analyze?

2:03:06>> Not uh not the tier that we're using. Uh

2:03:08I don't believe I have not seen that on

2:03:10any of our uh our programs.

2:03:14>> Okay. Thank you. And you've gone down

2:03:17from 90 days to 21 days. Correct.

2:03:20>> Correct.

2:03:21>> Okay. It says here that recor has been

2:03:25publicly calling for national standards.

2:03:28Um

2:03:30but there has been concerns about

2:03:34privacy experts noting that vendor

2:03:37contracts can can contain ambiguous fine

2:03:41print where a city claims to own the

2:03:45data. But the company retains the right

2:03:47to license,

2:03:49share or store it in aggregated clouds

2:03:53available to external agencies.

2:03:57Is that in our contract at all?

2:04:00>> Not the last. I did not see that in

2:04:02anything that I looked over. It went

2:04:04over through uh legal and everything

2:04:05else. Uh and I do not believe that's in

2:04:08our contract.

2:04:10>> Okay. So I not meaning to press the

2:04:13issue but your certain your belief that

2:04:16there is not should equal their

2:04:18certainty that there is not. Correct.

2:04:21>> Correct.

2:04:22>> Okay. Um I would just say with the

2:04:26number of concerns that we've been

2:04:27having I'm glad I'm really glad that we

2:04:29had this presentation. I understand that

2:04:32there's going to be you know that the

2:04:35city wants to invest in continuing to

2:04:38use this. Um, I think that we really

2:04:41need to take a hard look at the AI

2:04:43component, the privacy component

2:04:46where if there's any kind of inequity

2:04:49that's involved in this going into

2:04:51communities uh of more disenfranchised

2:04:55communities. I don't know what we were

2:04:57using before rec

2:05:00um but I believe that just because there

2:05:03is the newest better bigger technology

2:05:07whether it's in law enforcement

2:05:10whether it's for anything we are being

2:05:12so driven at a madman's pace for

2:05:18technology the best technology wherever

2:05:21and whenever that eventually it is going

2:05:24to swing back and it is going to hurt

2:05:26us. And so from the limited amount that

2:05:30I've seen, uh this is not a type of um

2:05:35surveillance that that I can feel uh

2:05:38supportive of. Thank you, mayor.

2:05:40>> I did get a little ahead of myself when

2:05:41I called on Councilwoman, which is not a

2:05:43big deal, but we do have several people

2:05:44signed up for public comment. I want to

2:05:46give them an opportunity to come speak.

2:05:48So, first up on this item, I have Jolene

2:05:50Greyel.

2:05:57Thank you, Mr. Mayor. I'm Jolan Greyel.

2:05:59I live at 1262 Collins in central

2:06:01Topeka, and I've been there for 35

2:06:03years. And I just learned about this

2:06:06issue a couple months ago when I heard

2:06:07about flock in the news for the first

2:06:09time. So, I pulled up a map on online

2:06:13and I found out there are 44

2:06:17uh of these cameras within my normal

2:06:20path around town. And I was kind of

2:06:22shocked by that to think that there was

2:06:24that many cameras tracking, documenting,

2:06:28resto recording what I was doing and

2:06:31keeping that somewhere for some amount

2:06:33of time. So recently I looked into it a

2:06:37little deeper and what I want to say is

2:06:39what I heard tonight makes me feel

2:06:40better than might have been my

2:06:44expectations this evening. So that's

2:06:46good. But the thing my research taught

2:06:49me is we can't depend on the companies,

2:06:53the vendors to promise us what they will

2:06:56do with this data because once data is

2:06:59collected and owned by a corporation,

2:07:03it's very hard to keep it from being

2:07:05shared. And I think there are ways the

2:07:08city can do that. And I must have been

2:07:11reading the same document that uh our

2:07:14other uh council member was reading from

2:07:16the ACLU because they have recommended a

2:07:20group of issues that should be addressed

2:07:22when looking at these contracts and I

2:07:24found it very helpful and you may find

2:07:26it helpful too. Um, and they are

2:07:32uh and and they actually have a local

2:07:34audio automatic license plate reader

2:07:37privacy model bill or ordinance in our

2:07:40case. If anybody wants that, I'd be

2:07:43happy to provide it to you. Uh, but the

2:07:46list of issues is number one, choose a

2:07:50short data retention period. Obviously,

2:07:52you reduced it to 21 from 90, right? But

2:07:56what I heard is 7 days is kind of the

2:07:58standard now. And I even saw one uh

2:08:02recommendation for like three minutes,

2:08:04which I thought seemed pretty pretty

2:08:07tiny for anybody to get anything done.

2:08:08it. Um, the next one is to disallow

2:08:12nationwide sharing, which is, I think,

2:08:16sounds like a really difficult contract

2:08:18issue to resolve, partly because of what

2:08:21uh the council member was saying about

2:08:23wording and contracts being very

2:08:26difficult. But it says, remember, it's

2:08:27in the company's financial interest for

2:08:30local governments to allow nationwide

2:08:32data sharing. Still, data sharing can

2:08:35easily be limited at other levels,

2:08:37whether statewide, [clears throat]

2:08:38regional, department by department, as

2:08:40needed to serve local needs and

2:08:42interest. And if our law enforcement

2:08:45goals are our local needs and interests,

2:08:47we should be able to limit that to to a

2:08:50great degree and hopefully control it as

2:08:53much as possible locally, including

2:08:56storage. The third was to decline AI

2:09:00analytics and those issues have been

2:09:02discussed, but I want to sit in in

2:09:05concert with those concerns to maintain

2:09:08the option to impose restrictions that

2:09:11protect privacy and civil liberties in

2:09:14the city ordinances rather than in the

2:09:17contracts because contracts have to be

2:09:20renegotiated. If we depend on law

2:09:22enforcement, I know they're going to be

2:09:24doing their best job, but they may not

2:09:26be thinking of everything. We may need

2:09:28it in ordinance to protect us. And the

2:09:31last is to propose

2:09:34uh legal limits on license scanning on

2:09:36what it can do, what actual vendors do

2:09:39with that information and how they

2:09:41maintain it. I just want to say this

2:09:43feels like one issue that's

2:09:46hitting me for many ways these days,

2:09:48which is more power and authority over

2:09:50my life is being given to private

2:09:53corporations

2:09:54without my permission taking away some

2:09:58privacy and uh I'm not sure the results

2:10:02is to our benefit. Thank you.

2:10:04>> Thank you very much. Next up, Miss

2:10:06Daniel Twimlo.

2:10:09>> Good job.

2:10:11>> [clears throat]

2:10:19>> Thank you. Um, I just want to put on

2:10:22record that I do believe that there's

2:10:24been lots of um, intentional changes

2:10:27that have been occurring um, within our

2:10:29local department that I'm very

2:10:31appreciative of. I also um, think that

2:10:34things that we heard tonight might also

2:10:36speak to some more concerning things

2:10:38that maybe we don't have knowledge of.

2:10:40Um, like for instance, um, I was

2:10:43actually able to access 748

2:10:47of our police searches online through a

2:10:51cloud share database um, because other

2:10:54agencies around the country chose to

2:10:56release their audit logs. And if we've

2:10:59accessed their cameras in search for

2:11:01anything and they release those audit

2:11:04logs or any other organization, I can

2:11:06tell you the police officer's name, the

2:11:08license plate, which cameras he

2:11:11accessed, for how long he accessed them,

2:11:13how many times he went back to access

2:11:15them. Um, for instance, April 1st, 2025

2:11:20at 2:01 p.m. Um, but I will not divulge

2:11:23all that other personal information. So

2:11:25speaking to the fact that we actually

2:11:28don't know the degree at which this

2:11:32information is being shared and

2:11:35published, this is a a database um that

2:11:38is accessible by anyone. Um it even had

2:11:41some flags of some of those um uh

2:11:45searches that had happened um and for

2:11:48the frequency and time frame. Um, I do

2:11:50also I'm glad to hear that um I would

2:11:53like some extra look though into our um

2:11:57contract um because there are some

2:12:00optins that changed um specifically with

2:12:04um Rayor um it used to be you had to opt

2:12:07in to do the sharing um and now it's

2:12:10automatic um so you have to actually opt

2:12:12out. So that was a change that came with

2:12:14that. Um, I do want to say that I I

2:12:16think we need to be very intentional

2:12:18whether it is something that we choose

2:12:20to do as a city council as making an

2:12:22ordinance so it withstands for all of

2:12:24time being very intentional with those

2:12:26ACLU recommendations. Um, because for

2:12:29instance there is an add-on that signal

2:12:32trace but possibly we don't have that

2:12:33level. Um, which is really concerning

2:12:36with the provider Leonardo. So I don't

2:12:38want us getting held up on the the the

2:12:40flock name that's just like Kleenex. Um

2:12:43it's not the tell all. Um but this new

2:12:46signal trace um is very problematic. It

2:12:50can track not only the license plate but

2:12:53also devices through their Bluetooth and

2:12:55other wireless emissions. It reads

2:12:57unique ID broadcast not only by phones

2:12:59but also tablets, laptops and any other

2:13:01wireless capable objects that might

2:13:04happen to be in a car as well as wire

2:13:06wireless components of the car itself

2:13:09such as audio video systems and the tire

2:13:11pressure monitoring system that now all

2:13:14cars are um have to have. So we want to

2:13:17make sure that within whatever contracts

2:13:20we do have that we are not opting into

2:13:22those level of information whether we're

2:13:24looking at it or whether it is an opt-in

2:13:27feature that this or company is

2:13:30collecting for their information um

2:13:32because clearly that is accessible in

2:13:34ways that we weren't maybe aware of um

2:13:37and so we need to be very careful about

2:13:39what they are pulling in um so I would

2:13:42like us to really second um give a

2:13:44second look and dive through about um

2:13:47how far um this information reaches and

2:13:50how much they are actually collecting.

2:13:52It's kind of like our computer when we

2:13:54do an internet search and they're kind

2:13:56of pulling a whole lot more information

2:13:58than we even know and selling it off and

2:14:00you open up your Facebook and there's an

2:14:03ad to something that you were talking

2:14:04about without your phone even being

2:14:06open, right? Um, we need to make sure

2:14:09that these systems are not collecting

2:14:12more information than we're willing to

2:14:14give up of our citizens. Um, because

2:14:16currently, while flock might not be the

2:14:18only version, they're problematic ones.

2:14:21Thank you.

2:14:21>> Thank you very much.

2:14:24All right. Now, we'll go back to the

2:14:25city council. Council member Kell.

2:14:28>> All right. Um,

2:14:30how many cameras does the city actually

2:14:33operate within the city limits total

2:14:37>> of LPRs

2:14:38>> or just of of like that works with the

2:14:40real-time crime center?

2:14:41>> Um, we have 20 LPRs that are stationary

2:14:45on uh traffic lights and stuff like

2:14:47that. We have six of the mobile ones and

2:14:50then there's a uh handful that uh the

2:14:54city owned but the majority of them are

2:14:56owned by Shauny County Sheriff's Office.

2:14:58>> Okay. So

2:15:00just trying trying to point out uh

2:15:03something here like going to finding

2:15:04flock.com. It says we have 126 in the

2:15:07city limit. So that would be untrue.

2:15:09Correct.

2:15:10>> Not [clears throat] city of Topek owned.

2:15:11No.

2:15:11>> No.

2:15:12>> That I'm aware of.

2:15:13>> Does the county have any flock cameras?

2:15:15>> Uh I do not know. They I know they they

2:15:19did for a moment, but I think they

2:15:20retracted a lot of their stuff.

2:15:23>> Do you know anything [clears throat]

2:15:24about the cameras were placed on 470 and

2:15:26I70 about the time of the World Cup that

2:15:28they went up on the highways?

2:15:30>> At first, I thought they were just

2:15:32traffic cameras trying to work the flow

2:15:34of of of the World Cup, but they've been

2:15:36up since then. So, um I think there's

2:15:39one at right off Gage, just just east of

2:15:42Gage. It's a temporary camera right

2:15:44there and they're they're all down I70.

2:15:47Um

2:15:49now, uh when it comes to the AI aspect,

2:15:52one thing I I learned going through one

2:15:54of the citizens academy, a lot of the AI

2:15:56aspect is more for like traffic. Um and

2:16:00Jason may be able to talk more about

2:16:01this, but it's uh to monitor like uh how

2:16:05much flow of traffic. So if they need to

2:16:07run a light a little bit uh longer in

2:16:10green in one intersection, it kind of

2:16:13learns from that and then makes

2:16:14determinations on how long to run the

2:16:16lights for is more the AI aspect.

2:16:18Correct.

2:16:19>> Uh not not our systems. I can I think

2:16:22that might be a

2:16:22>> Okay. I thought it was tied into the

2:16:23real time center. So the the utility

2:16:27part of it the streets start

2:16:28>> mayor I can

2:16:30>> Yep. Braxton I can

2:16:32>> two completely different systems.

2:16:34>> Okay. So, our the public works

2:16:37department has traffic cameras that um

2:16:41we do have some machine learning in

2:16:43those and you're absolutely you hit the

2:16:45nail on the head in terms of looking at

2:16:48the traffic flow, making slight

2:16:50adjustments to be able to most

2:16:52efficiently move the traffic in and out.

2:16:55Those are in no way, shape or form

2:16:57connected to the real time crime center.

2:17:00Those only go to our control center and

2:17:03they are purely for efficiently

2:17:05operating the traffic signals at those

2:17:07locations.

2:17:08>> Right. Thank you.

2:17:10>> Um, now how many have our LPRs or any of

2:17:13those cameras helped solve crimes? Like

2:17:15let's say for instance, was one used in

2:17:17the in the noto shooting a couple weeks

2:17:19ago?

2:17:21Um,

2:17:23let me speak in in in general um terms

2:17:26as as opposed to maybe an ongoing um

2:17:30colonel investigation. Um, to answer

2:17:32your question, yes. Um, LPR's this tech

2:17:37technology is vital in solving um,

2:17:41crimes here in Topeka. Um

2:17:45an example given um you know we we may

2:17:48be able to um obtain an image um through

2:17:52cooperation with a private citizen and

2:17:55uh maybe a a camera system that they

2:17:57have at their home. And we obtain a a

2:18:00image of a vehicle and and through

2:18:03analyzing that that image we're able to

2:18:06narrow down uh maybe a make and model

2:18:08and a year range of what we believe that

2:18:10vehicle to be. and that vehicle um was

2:18:14involved in some sort of violent crime.

2:18:18Um we can

2:18:21then

2:18:23check close LPRs that are close closely

2:18:27located in the vicinity of that crime

2:18:29and see if we have a matching vehicle

2:18:33that passed through um that LPR within a

2:18:36reasonable amount of time that may point

2:18:39towards that vehicle. We then we're able

2:18:41to capture that license plate

2:18:43information and it gives us like we

2:18:45talked about earlier a lead,

2:18:48but then we have to verify that

2:18:49information through the investigation to

2:18:52see if if that lead is going to take us

2:18:54[music] somewhere. And often times it

2:18:58does and often times it is the key to

2:19:02opening up that investigation and coming

2:19:04to a successful resolution. And that's

2:19:07kind of the point I wanted to bring up

2:19:09and kind of lead you into was how the

2:19:10positives of this how everyone wants to

2:19:12look at the negatives, but there's great

2:19:13positives in this. Yes, it's not 100%

2:19:15accurate. There's been issues uh where

2:19:18maybe a department didn't go through the

2:19:19proper investigations and just said

2:19:22someone did something and and didn't do

2:19:24it, but that's not here in Topeka as far

2:19:26as I know of. Um, but I kind of want to

2:19:28lead you in the positives because

2:19:31everyone's to me all the emails and

2:19:33everything where it's it's this uh big

2:19:36brother mentality right now, but you

2:19:39don't realize and no one's realizing

2:19:41when they walk into a big box store or

2:19:42get on a website, they're doing so much

2:19:45more damage than themselves and walking

2:19:46down a street right now with an with an

2:19:49LPR, you know, checking them out. So,

2:19:52uh, uh, it it's one of those things. It

2:19:56it's it's a tool for for the city and

2:19:59and for the police department. And as

2:20:01long as we're using, you know, those

2:20:03access logs like you're talking about,

2:20:04auditing those access logs, I think as

2:20:07long as we don't have any issues there,

2:20:08this is a great tool for our city to

2:20:10have and use and and try to figure out

2:20:15the best ways and and change as you

2:20:16know, as like they said, contract

2:20:18changes or they make a change and say,

2:20:21"Oh, you need to opt out now." We need

2:20:23to be aware of those changes and make

2:20:24sure we're opting in or opting out or

2:20:26check with legal and the city manager on

2:20:27what's the best recourse for us. Uh but

2:20:31uh to me I think this is a good system

2:20:33to have and we and we should keep on

2:20:34using it. Thank you,

2:20:36>> Council Member Bradberry.

2:20:40>> Thank you. Um I have a couple of

2:20:44questions on the systems audit um when

2:20:47it talks about systems are audited

2:20:50regularly. Um

2:20:53can you define regularly?

2:20:56>> There's an audit done every 30 days.

2:20:58It's every 30 days

2:20:59>> at least.

2:21:00>> Okay. Um, and what does an audit of

2:21:05those systems look like?

2:21:08>> It's uh we and the sheriff's department

2:21:11since we're kind of co-doing this with

2:21:13the real time crime center uh we both

2:21:16basically do separate ones. Uh they pick

2:21:19several uh officers and do the uh their

2:21:22audit. What we do is we what I do is I

2:21:24search the number of times tags have

2:21:28been ran and that's a very good

2:21:30indicator if somebody is using it uh

2:21:32inappropriately. There'll be numerous

2:21:34times the tag has been ran over

2:21:37a long period of time and that that

2:21:39shows the misuse. So then we'd then look

2:21:43through that tag and find out where that

2:21:44tag goes and if it's something that

2:21:48shouldn't be used uh that would be

2:21:50brought up and brought to the chain of

2:21:52command.

2:21:54>> Hopefully that doesn't occur.

2:21:56>> I have not had it happen.

2:21:58>> Okay, good. Um and then the next

2:22:00question I have is regarding the LPR

2:22:03retention being reduced to 21 days.

2:22:07How does that data get deleted? Is that

2:22:10a manual process or is that system?

2:22:14>> It's purged in the the it's housed in

2:22:18the AWS law enforcement or government

2:22:21cloud and it is purged every 21 days. We

2:22:25that system we have the ability to tell

2:22:27the vendor, hey, this is what we're

2:22:29calling cutting it off. And that's

2:22:31that's where it gets cut off and gets

2:22:33purchased the system. curious. Does

2:22:35anybody ever go check that it's actually

2:22:37deleted after 21 days?

2:22:40>> Not. Uh we follow the the directions of

2:22:43the the vendor and they say that it is.

2:22:45So,

2:22:46>> okay. Thank you.

2:22:47>> You bring up good you bring up a good

2:22:48point though and that that's something

2:22:49that that we can look into on

2:22:52[clears throat] our process. That's a

2:22:53really good point.

2:22:54>> Thank you,

2:22:56>> Council Member McGee.

2:22:58>> Thank you. I was I was going to ask

2:23:00about how often you were audited and you

2:23:02say 30 days. Um how many officers have

2:23:07the digital key or access to the system

2:23:12>> for just uh searching or the auditing

2:23:15process?

2:23:18>> No.

2:23:19Just how many

2:23:22how many officers had access to the

2:23:25>> to the system? I don't have the exact

2:23:27numbers right now but uh majority of the

2:23:29or patrol officers they cannot do the

2:23:31audit. There's different layers and

2:23:34admission admin restoration rights and

2:23:37there's only a handful of people that

2:23:38have the admin rights.

2:23:41>> Okay. But but your patrol officers could

2:23:44actually

2:23:46access the system then. uh they can run

2:23:48tags and if they have a a call that

2:23:50they're working in and we have a license

2:23:52plate that could lead us to a criminal

2:23:54or a find a missing person or something

2:23:57like that. Yes, they can run it.

2:24:02>> All right. Thank you,

2:24:04>> Council Member Miller.

2:24:08>> Thank you, Mayor. Um

2:24:11of and I appreciate this presentation. I

2:24:15think um there is a lot of uh

2:24:17misunderstanding of what we do as

2:24:19[clears throat] a city with these

2:24:20cameras. Um but I'm glad that we're

2:24:23having this discussion out in the open

2:24:26for everybody to understand. Um when you

2:24:29mentioned the leads,

2:24:32um I'm very curious about that part.

2:24:35Um how many leads do you think have been

2:24:38incorrect?

2:24:42I I wouldn't have an exact uh number of

2:24:46incorrect leads or leads, you know, at

2:24:48my at my fingertips this evening, but

2:24:51>> not not an exact number. I apologize.

2:24:52That was that was an unfair question.

2:24:54>> Yeah. That

2:24:55>> would you say a percentage?

2:24:58>> Well, and I and I think I understand I

2:25:00think I understand the question. Um so

2:25:03that that that's why we talk about

2:25:06having the the human verification part.

2:25:09We have that because some of the

2:25:13information that it might take us in one

2:25:15direction obviously through that

2:25:18verification process we learn that it is

2:25:20not. That's what we talked about in the

2:25:22presentation where it can it can

2:25:23actually rule out um persons of interest

2:25:27and then it puts us back on the right

2:25:30track or we know we need to start in a

2:25:32different direction. So, I mean to

2:25:35answer your question, yes, there there

2:25:36is a percentage of leads that are

2:25:39developed that do not end up being the

2:25:42end road to that investigation.

2:25:44>> Thank you very much. Um, the reason I

2:25:47asked that is cuz I would like to know

2:25:49in your words, have there been any

2:25:51substantial resources, Topeka resources

2:25:55utilized or deployed because of any of

2:25:57those leads that were incorrect?

2:26:00>> I would I would say no. Uh kind of what

2:26:04the chief staff's saying is

2:26:07all license plate licensed plate readers

2:26:10do is read ABC123.

2:26:12And if that is in the national crime uh

2:26:15information database, it says, "Hey,

2:26:17ABC123

2:26:20was seen here," then that's when it

2:26:22says, "Hey, you might want to look at

2:26:23this." uh an officer or trained uh

2:26:27somebody in the crime center has to go

2:26:29that yes that matches this thing in the

2:26:33NCIC. So it's not just hey it pops up

2:26:36hey we're going to stop that car.

2:26:38There's there's other steps that we have

2:26:40to take to and verify that that is

2:26:42correct information before we act on it.

2:26:45And I think I think more often than not

2:26:49it it actually prevents us from

2:26:52deploying a large number of resources in

2:26:56the wrong direction. Um

2:27:00some of that information is is very

2:27:02easily verifiable through our

2:27:04investigations from a a desk setting um

2:27:08following those leads as opposed to a

2:27:10massive deployment of manpower and

2:27:12resources. Perfect. Thank you very much.

2:27:15Cuz I wanted to I wanted to shine a

2:27:17light on the fact that our our our

2:27:19police use that human element more than

2:27:23some other communities may or how some

2:27:26people may perceive that our our

2:27:29officers are doing. So I want to make

2:27:30sure that you guys were on the record

2:27:31about that. So I appreciate that. Um

2:27:35now a word you used a little bit ago and

2:27:38I'm going to push back on that is you

2:27:40said that it's vital.

2:27:42We've been solving crimes before this

2:27:44technology came around. Let's keep it

2:27:46above.

2:27:48Is [clears throat] it an assistance?

2:27:49Does it help? Yes. But I don't know if I

2:27:52would use the word vital,

2:27:54if that makes sense.

2:27:56>> I would I would agree that it's it's

2:27:58it's not vital in every investigation,

2:28:00but I would argue that some

2:28:02investigations it it is vital. um

2:28:05specifically um the the safe return of a

2:28:10of a um

2:28:13juvenile um that was in part of a double

2:28:17homicide in the Oakland area. That was

2:28:19vital.

2:28:20>> Yeah.

2:28:21>> Um and that occurred quickly solely

2:28:24because of this technology.

2:28:26>> Yeah. I do not disagree that there are

2:28:28times that this technology can certainly

2:28:29help us 100%. Um, so if we're solving

2:28:34crimes faster because of this

2:28:37technology, um, and not utilizing our

2:28:39citizens data in a way that it would not

2:28:42be, um,

2:28:44that would not follow the policies of

2:28:46this city and it's, uh, probably the

2:28:49recommendations of this governing body,

2:28:51then I can support this. So, um,

2:28:54appreciate you. Thank you.

2:28:56>> We had one other individual signed up

2:28:58for public comment, and I sorry I missed

2:29:00him. Uh, Megan Ryan,

2:29:08>> good evening. It's funny how those

2:29:10things kind of fall through the cracks

2:29:11sometimes with data and gathering. Um, I

2:29:15want to thank you all for having this

2:29:16and to be putting this effort into

2:29:19looking at the safety of the community.

2:29:21Um, of course, I've spoken so much in at

2:29:24length about public health, right? We

2:29:25talk about prevention of the core. Um,

2:29:28but I'm going to dive a little bit

2:29:29deeper into my undergrad. I received a

2:29:32double major in political science in

2:29:33German with a minor in international

2:29:35studies from Washurn University,

2:29:38graduating with honors. I've done a lot

2:29:39of reading. Um, you know, and I have a

2:29:42special interest [laughter]

2:29:44in general. My senior thesis was on uh

2:29:47German propaganda. Um, I I studied

2:29:50abroad in Austria. I've done all this.

2:29:52And so I'm going to take a really high

2:29:53level uh because of course I want our

2:29:56folks here on TPD to be safer as well.

2:29:58But we see a misuse of this database of

2:30:02law enforcement against other law

2:30:04enforcement, right? We've seen that. Um

2:30:07during my undergrad, I actually dated a

2:30:09loser. Uh he was in criminal justice. Um

2:30:12and those cameras and all of that, that

2:30:14didn't stop him from committing crimes

2:30:16against me, right? Um can you guarantee

2:30:19my safety?

2:30:21When we talk about these regimes that

2:30:24are using mass surveillance of their

2:30:26communities

2:30:28and oppressing groups,

2:30:31is this improving the safety of our

2:30:34constituents of color? Is it improving

2:30:38and guaranteeing the safety of political

2:30:40opponents like me? getting a bit loud

2:30:43when we talk about access to data and

2:30:46technology and the

2:30:49lack of thereof, right? Can you

2:30:51guarantee that there isn't going to be

2:30:53some rich technocrat looking at my

2:30:55license plate? Because it sounds like

2:30:57when we talk about, oh, these criminal

2:30:59license plates,

2:31:01they're all of our license plates. This

2:31:04is all of our data constantly being

2:31:06surveiled. And I don't know about this

2:31:09level, sure, fine. But we were talking

2:31:11about this mass surveillance and AI

2:31:14technology being used. Where did this

2:31:16come from? Where was it tested? In the

2:31:19Gaza Strip against the Palestinians,

2:31:22right? And so where does the line

2:31:25drawn when it comes to sharing our

2:31:28information, when it comes to

2:31:30sacrificing our privacy, our liberty,

2:31:33our freedom, because I do not feel safer

2:31:36with these cameras. And it is wonderful

2:31:38that we catch these bad guys and that we

2:31:40save those kids. But the underlying

2:31:43issue is lack of access, right? It's

2:31:46mental health care. It's access to food.

2:31:49We we got to reduce these other things.

2:31:51And so when we're looking at this

2:31:53greater issue of data centers and how

2:31:56they are used for AI and surveillance

2:31:59specifically in terms of the

2:32:00proliferation of military technology and

2:32:04the usage of places in Gaza against

2:32:07Palestinians against children.

2:32:10So when I ask you all when you are

2:32:12weighing these options as you go through

2:32:13this one-year moratorum and you're

2:32:15digging into all these deeper things

2:32:16because these are all connected, right?

2:32:18The AI surveillance issue, the data

2:32:19center issue. Is this bringing us closer

2:32:22to a more freedom and and a stronger

2:32:26democracy? Does this bring our most

2:32:28vulnerable constituents, our people of

2:32:30color, our LGBTQ community, our women,

2:32:33those folks that are already underserved

2:32:35and targeted? Does that make us safer?

2:32:38What are you willing to bet on the the

2:32:41safety and data access? Are you willing

2:32:42to bet my life? [laughter] Right. When

2:32:45people are looking at my information for

2:32:46raising some heck, these are real people

2:32:49as well. And the data does show that has

2:32:52been abused. So, I'm pushing for more

2:32:54regulations and protections and to weigh

2:32:57is this sinking us deeper into a

2:32:59dystopian or Wellingian police state or

2:33:01does it bring us closer to a true

2:33:03freedom and democracy? Thank you. Thank

2:33:06you, Council Member Hiller.

2:33:09>> Thank you. That was really good.

2:33:12[laughter]

2:33:14Um, I have not done a deep dive into

2:33:17this, but I've been around as my

2:33:20colleagues have when people have asked

2:33:22for it. And so, I want to ask you a

2:33:24couple of questions about how it's being

2:33:25used right now. The first one that I

2:33:27remember was when people started running

2:33:29red lights at Six and Topeka. Could we

2:33:31just have cameras out there to catch

2:33:33those people so they um don't run red

2:33:37lights anymore so that we can catch

2:33:38them? People were kind of thinking about

2:33:41the police force being a little short

2:33:43and using cameras instead or whatever.

2:33:45Are we doing that now? Are we using for

2:33:48traffic violations?

2:33:50>> No.

2:33:51>> Okay. Um, another place that came up, I

2:33:54represent downtown and people wanted

2:33:56cameras to watch the homeless folks

2:33:59behaviors in downtown.

2:34:02Uh, we do now have them up in downtown.

2:34:05How are those being used? What are we

2:34:07getting out of those? Yeah.

2:34:10Uh crimes that do happen, we do review

2:34:13uh along with the real-time crime center

2:34:15review those and we have made several

2:34:19uh arrests on crimes that happen

2:34:21downtown.

2:34:23>> Okay. And those were with the the the

2:34:25city cameras. A lot of people have their

2:34:27own cameras as well.

2:34:28>> Yeah. And that's part of the

2:34:29investigation. We will use these cameras

2:34:32as well as we'll go to uh citizens in

2:34:34the area and ask for if because a lot of

2:34:36the citizens don't have or don't we

2:34:38don't know about those cameras that we

2:34:39make personal contact with them and see

2:34:41if we can get those that footage.

2:34:44just just wanted to check. I think one

2:34:46of the also thinking back to the ways

2:34:48rules get broken because there seems to

2:34:50be a good reason to do that. And so if

2:34:52for instance you had a serial killer but

2:34:55you don't necessarily know you don't

2:34:57begin to build the case for that person

2:34:59and wondering where they were sometimes

2:35:02for a couple of months let's say is

2:35:07people can break the rules and say you

2:35:11know

2:35:12this got used by somebody to catch

2:35:14someone who'd been on the road for two

2:35:17months. Maybe we should keep our stuff

2:35:18for 90 days after all. something like

2:35:21that. Have you

2:35:24>> maybe it's too early to know if

2:35:28>> Yeah, I I think there's always going to

2:35:29be examples of we wish we would have had

2:35:33it longer. Um but the the conversations

2:35:37between us and our and our partners at

2:35:39the county, we wanted to set a a

2:35:42retention time that that was reasonable

2:35:44um and efficient and you know garnered

2:35:47um public trust in our decision-m

2:35:50um and we felt that that 21 days, 3

2:35:53weeks um subjectively

2:35:57um was a good place to land, a good

2:36:00alternative to some of the ones that we

2:36:02see across the country, 30 days, 90

2:36:04days, sometimes a year, sometimes

2:36:07longer. Um, that's where we're at right

2:36:11now. But yeah, I mean, to your point,

2:36:14there will always be that example where

2:36:16we say, "Well, I wish I wish it darn."

2:36:19Exactly. I wish it would have been 90

2:36:21days, but we're comfortable with the

2:36:23retention period that that we're set at

2:36:25right now.

2:36:26>> Well, thanks for the answers. like, you

2:36:27know, the the anxiety that people have

2:36:29done a good job of describing, you know,

2:36:31it's like, well, but if you could put it

2:36:33someplace else and just do it, it's

2:36:35scary. I get that. Thanks.

2:36:38>> Thank you.

2:36:40>> Any other comments or questions for

2:36:42staff on this issue at this time?

2:36:45I'm sure this will not be the last time

2:36:47we discuss this.

2:36:48>> Thank you very much.

2:36:50>> Thank you.

2:36:53All right, with that we'll move on to

2:36:56item 5C.

2:36:59City clerk see is discussion regarding

2:37:02ballot initiatives for multiple sales

2:37:04tax proposals and city auditor to be

2:37:06presented to voters in the first quarter

2:37:08of 2027.

2:37:10>> City manager

2:37:27Thank you, mayor [clears throat] and

2:37:28members of the governing body. As we've

2:37:30gone through the last few years of

2:37:31budget cycles to address our projected

2:37:34deficits, we've had to use a combination

2:37:35of our financial reserves and reductions

2:37:38to balance our budgets. In more recent

2:37:41discussions, we have identified

2:37:42potential sales tax initiatives to

2:37:44address both our future projected

2:37:45deficits and to fund community

2:37:47identified priorities. Based upon

2:37:50governing body guidance this evening, we

2:37:52will further discuss a half cent general

2:37:54purpose sales tax to sustain our

2:37:56governmental operations and to

2:37:58potentially cash fund at least two fire

2:37:59stations identified in the fire station

2:38:01relocation plan. A tenth of a cent

2:38:04special use tax for affordable housing

2:38:05and homeless services. renewal of the

2:38:08citywide halfsent infrastructure sales

2:38:09tax and the charter amendment for the

2:38:12city auditor to report directly to the

2:38:14governing body. During our September

2:38:1615th discussion, I heard the governing

2:38:18body ask for more specific language

2:38:20within the ballot question. And I'm

2:38:22ready to discuss options in the general

2:38:23government use to include supporting

2:38:25minimum staffing levels of police and

2:38:26fire personnel. But I do want to hear

2:38:28from the governing body this evening

2:38:29about your thoughts on the language.

2:38:32Also, I asked you to note the built for

2:38:33zero program cost earlier this evening

2:38:35that could be considered for inclusion

2:38:37in the homeless discussion. Again, I'm

2:38:39ready to add language such as building

2:38:41and funding a tiny home village to the

2:38:43ballot. However, in both initiatives,

2:38:45please note that the more specific

2:38:47language that is included in the ballot

2:38:48language, the more restrictive the use

2:38:50of funds gets. After this meeting, the

2:38:53schedule does include another work

2:38:54session on October 13th before final

2:38:56consideration on October 20th.

2:38:59Finally, I don't have a slide for this,

2:39:01but before I open the presentation for

2:39:03questions, I will also discuss and ask

2:39:06for input on waiting until an August

2:39:08ballot to allow for a community-led

2:39:10citizen sales tax committee. With that,

2:39:12Dalton Badel, uh, deputy director of

2:39:14budget and finance, and I will lead you

2:39:16through this item.

2:39:19Clicker.

2:39:26So, as presented during the 5-year

2:39:27financial forecast discussion on August

2:39:2925th, revenue generated by the general

2:39:31fund is insufficient to cover our budget

2:39:33expenditures, thus creating a recurring

2:39:35imbalance between ongoing revenues and

2:39:37expenses. Our 2027 budget is balanced,

2:39:41which was adopted a few weeks ago.

2:39:43However, the financial the 5-year

2:39:45financial forecast shows projected

2:39:47deficits of 13.3 million in 2028 and

2:39:52$17.4 million in 2029.

2:39:54uh without doing anything significant to

2:39:56significantly increase our revenues or

2:39:59uh reduce uh expenditures or a

2:40:01combination of both um our deficit

2:40:04continues to grow through the 5-year

2:40:05financial forecast period.

2:40:09So, what we're discussing this evening,

2:40:11as I mentioned, uh, and what we've cons

2:40:14what we've considered recently is a new

2:40:15half cent citywide sales tax. About half

2:40:18a cent that would generate $20 million

2:40:20annually for general purposes to

2:40:21adequate adequately fund city's

2:40:24operations and services to include fire,

2:40:26police, code, enforcement, courts, and

2:40:28public works. and a new onetenth of a

2:40:30cent special use citywide tax that would

2:40:33generate approximately $4 million

2:40:34annually to fund the affordable housing

2:40:36trust fund and homeless services. I'd

2:40:39also ask for consideration to renew the

2:40:40existing halfcent citywide

2:40:42infrastructure sales tax which sunsets

2:40:44in 2029 and then also as part of the uh

2:40:47future ballot implementing an office of

2:40:50city auditor that will report directly

2:40:52to city council which will require a

2:40:54charter amendment.

2:40:56As we showed uh in our last

2:40:58presentation, our current uh sales tax

2:41:01in Topeka is 9.35%. There's a breakout

2:41:04between state of Kansas at 6 and a half%

2:41:06Shauny County at 1.35%. And the city of

2:41:09Topeka is 1.5% which is currently 1% for

2:41:13general use and half a percent for

2:41:15citywide uh sales tax for their

2:41:17infrastructure. There are state imposed

2:41:19sales tax limits uh to include 2%

2:41:21general fund purpose. So, uh, that 2%

2:41:25given the 1% that we currently use,

2:41:27there's about a 1% uh, capacity there.

2:41:30Um, general sales taxes, uh, are in

2:41:33effect until repealed by the city or

2:41:35until there if there's a sunset, uh,

2:41:38imposed in the ballot question. And then

2:41:40there's also a 1% limit for special use.

2:41:43Um, these these uh, special use taxes

2:41:46expire after 10ear period. Again, uh we

2:41:50currently have a 0.5% uh citywide

2:41:53special use half cent citywide uh sales

2:41:56tax for infrastructure. So we have about

2:41:57half a percent capacity there.

2:42:02So what we've done is we've uh ran out

2:42:06uh a halfcent scenario. Um essentially

2:42:09again uh assuming that a sales tax

2:42:11halfcent would be generated uh or yeah

2:42:14if a halfcent were implemented in March

2:42:16or approved in March uh first data

2:42:19collection being July 1st we would

2:42:20assume collections of of half the $20

2:42:22million for half the year so $10 million

2:42:26uh and that sales tax infusion 005%. And

2:42:29then you see the 20 million ran out uh

2:42:31through the 5year forecast period. So

2:42:33what this does is that it generates

2:42:35again $20 million annually uh assuming

2:42:3710% or $10 million collection beginning

2:42:39in July 1. This provides for a

2:42:42structurally balanced budget through

2:42:43FYI29 with reserves above 30%

2:42:45[clears throat] through 2030.

2:42:47This would also move our 2027 reserves

2:42:50from 27.9 million to 37.9 million.

2:42:56So, what we've looked at here and as

2:42:58we've discussed previously and as I

2:43:00mentioned in the intro, um looking at a

2:43:03halfcentent scenario and also funding

2:43:05two cash funding two of our fire

2:43:06stations. Um what this does is that it

2:43:10provides and you'll see the $20 million

2:43:13uh probably in about a the middle of

2:43:15that and FY2028 a $20 million

2:43:18expenditure assuming that fire stations

2:43:20come in at $10 million each. You'll see

2:43:22that this provides for sustainable

2:43:24budget through FY29. And when I say

2:43:26that, uh, look at the operating

2:43:28surplus/deficit line. It's going to be

2:43:30the third line down or third line from

2:43:32the bottom. Um, you'll see that, uh, in

2:43:352029, we're still operating, uh, in the

2:43:38positive as far as our revenues

2:43:41exceeding our expenditures. But in 2030

2:43:44and 2031, you see us starting to go into

2:43:46the deficit again. uh managing a $90,000

2:43:49deficit is is relatively simple. Uh and

2:43:53also a $2.9 million deficit in 2031 is

2:43:58very manageable. As mentioned, uh this

2:44:00this scenario would actually fund uh

2:44:02provide $20 million in cash to cash fund

2:44:05uh two fire stations in 2028.

2:44:09We also looked at well, do you need the

2:44:10full half cent? What if you just do a

2:44:124fifth of a cent? Uh essentially, uh

2:44:15it's going to be half um uh or not half,

2:44:18but uh it'll be uh quarter less. So

2:44:21you're looking at $16 million annually,

2:44:23uh $8 million in FY2027.

2:44:26Again, this provides a structurally

2:44:28balanced budget through FY28 with

2:44:30reserves above 20% through FY2030.

2:44:33Um the FY27 reserves will move from 27.9

2:44:36million to $35.9 million.

2:44:41We've also looked at what it would uh we

2:44:43also evaluated what it would look like

2:44:45to uh cash fund one fire station in the

2:44:48fourth cent scenario. Uh again, you'll

2:44:51see the $10 million expenditure in 2028.

2:44:54Um it does provide for reserves above

2:44:5615% through FY2030, but then you see the

2:44:58dip in FY2031 to 10 uh 6%. Uh and again,

2:45:03this does provide $10 million to cash

2:45:05fund one fire station in 2028.

2:45:08Uh what we did was we just showed the

2:45:10the scenarios high level. So a half cent

2:45:14uh scenario uh again cash funding two

2:45:17fire stations uh gives us reserves of

2:45:2128%

2:45:23uh 2027 running down through 15% in

2:45:262031.

2:45:28uh four fifths of a cent uh cash funding

2:45:31one fire station uh would give us uh

2:45:34reserves of 26.9% in 27. And then you'll

2:45:39see the percentage the reserve

2:45:41percentage going 19% in FY2028

2:45:44down to uh 10.57% in 2031.

2:45:50And then a half cent scenario uh with no

2:45:52cash funding of our fire stations uh

2:45:55again uh gives us uh reserves ranging

2:45:58from 28.4 to 28.82%

2:46:02through the 2031 budget. A half a

2:46:044-centent scenario and again not cash

2:46:07funding a fire station gives us reserves

2:46:10in 2027 of 26.9%

2:46:13trending down to 17% uh by the end of

2:46:172031.

2:46:20So, as I mentioned, uh I am ready to

2:46:23speak to uh including a little bit more

2:46:25detailed language within the ballot. Uh

2:46:27specifically for the general use, uh

2:46:30looking at adding the language including

2:46:32the construction of at least two fire

2:46:34stations.

2:46:35>> We can consider other things such as

2:46:37minimum staffing levels uh uh I guess

2:46:40congruent with what we have currently

2:46:42funded in our 2027 budget.

2:46:45Um but again would be interested to hear

2:46:47feedback from the governing body. Uh and

2:46:50then also uh speaking to the tenth of a

2:46:53cent for affordable housing and homeless

2:46:55services. Uh essentially we would look

2:46:58to change that to homeless initiatives

2:46:59instead of market rate housing. Uh again

2:47:02going back to the discussion on built

2:47:04for zero. we can add something to the

2:47:07effect of building a tiny home

2:47:08community, building and operating tiny

2:47:10home community or such other services

2:47:12that that you know are deemed uh proper

2:47:17for this.

2:47:19And then this again just as mentioned uh

2:47:21I would ask for renewal of the uh

2:47:24existing half cent uh sales tax for

2:47:27infrastructure uh with the understanding

2:47:29that the new measure uh would basically

2:47:31take and it would go into effect when

2:47:34the current measure uh expires October 1

2:47:36and 29.

2:47:39And then uh we also talked about uh

2:47:42changing doing a charter uh amendment uh

2:47:44to allow the city auditor to report

2:47:46directly to city council.

2:47:49And again, this is a uh timeline as far

2:47:53as um gearing towards a March 2nd uh

2:47:57special election for mail and ballot. Uh

2:48:00again, the the need would be for us to

2:48:03finalize language to send to the

2:48:05elections office by uh the end of of the

2:48:08month. Um and if approved in March, July

2:48:101st would be uh the first day of the new

2:48:13sales tax collections.

2:48:15Again, before before I open up for any

2:48:17questions, I did mention um an

2:48:20alternative path. Uh some of the one of

2:48:23the questions that I received is well,

2:48:25what did you do in other communities? Uh

2:48:28and the thought was uh we actually had

2:48:31or I've I've been part of uh

2:48:34community-led initiatives where you have

2:48:36a community uh committee uh almost kind

2:48:39of like we're doing with the fire

2:48:40commission uh where you actually get a

2:48:43group of residents together uh to

2:48:45discuss uh what would be um recommended

2:48:49for inclusion in any sales tax uh or

2:48:52bond program uh projects and programs.

2:48:55So, uh, we could do that if, uh, if

2:48:58there was, uh, a desire to do so. Um,

2:49:01essentially gearing towards an August

2:49:02ballot and getting, uh, community input

2:49:06on a citizen-led or community-led

2:49:08initiative. Um, and so my I guess my

2:49:12challenge with that is we had considered

2:49:15uh, a March ballot for the fact that by

2:49:17doing something in March, I know what

2:49:19we're what we have to do going into our

2:49:21FY2028 budget process. I'll know whether

2:49:24or not we have sales tax or not. Uh if

2:49:26we do wait for an August initiative, uh

2:49:28essentially we'd end up uh proposing or

2:49:30developing two proposed budgets. Uh one

2:49:33with and one without sales tax. So um

2:49:37with that, we'll take any questions you

2:49:38may have.

2:49:40>> All right, we have several people signed

2:49:41up for public comment. We're going to go

2:49:42to them first. First up, Mr. Joe Led

2:49:44Better.

2:49:50>> Thank you. I stand opposed to uh another

2:49:53sales tax. Um

2:49:57I know that at the beginning of this

2:49:59year uh we had much baloo about we were

2:50:03in a $15 million shortfall. 15 million.

2:50:05I just kept hearing it over and over

2:50:07again. I said, "You haven't even started

2:50:08your cuts." And I sent a lot of those

2:50:10cuts to y'all. [clears throat] And you

2:50:12got them by email. And everybody up here

2:50:14worked on that, including the mayor. I

2:50:15met with him even and and the manager.

2:50:18And guess what?

2:50:20We got it down to a $900,000

2:50:23increase, which basically is a little

2:50:25bit around inflation.

2:50:28So,

2:50:31I'm having a little problem with

2:50:32credibility.

2:50:34Two years ago, I met the new manager and

2:50:38there's two things he brought up. Whoa,

2:50:39we've just got to start a half cent

2:50:42sales tax. Don't you think that'd be a

2:50:43good idea? I said, no. I said, where's

2:50:46the cuts? I want to know how many FTEEs

2:50:49we've got. I want to do what normal uh

2:50:52you know managers do of cities and start

2:50:54the cuts first, trim excess staff, trim

2:50:59excess cost and get to the bare bones.

2:51:03And I don't think we've done that in any

2:51:06way. Have we done that on this proposed

2:51:09sales tax? First off, I just heard

2:51:11tonight we've got a $15 million or a $50

2:51:14million income on franchise fees. Uh, I

2:51:19want to know

2:51:21how much revenue is in these

2:51:23projections. I want to know where the

2:51:25projections came from. [clears throat]

2:51:26Were they done by consultants? Were they

2:51:28done by our staff? Who did it? I want to

2:51:32know uh all the numbers.

2:51:36Uh, remember I had to file cororus a

2:51:39couple years ago just to find out how

2:51:41much debt this city had because council

2:51:43members didn't know, you know. And I'm

2:51:46not blaming you. I'm blaming this

2:51:48system. Most people are fed up with this

2:51:51manager form of government now. They

2:51:53just can't stomach it one more year. Uh

2:51:56I'm looking at the charter.

2:51:59It says the city manager shall have the

2:52:01power and it shall be his or her duty to

2:52:04and I go down to letter K, keep the

2:52:06council at all times fully advised as to

2:52:09the financial condition and needs of the

2:52:11city. [cough and clears throat]

2:52:13I'm not making fun of not having an

2:52:15auditor, but we already have a manager

2:52:17who should be doing that and his large

2:52:20staff.

2:52:22Uh the truth is I I just think

2:52:26we're a little bit out of control down

2:52:28here and uh whether it's on streets or

2:52:31other topics, I'm not satisfied that we

2:52:35are actually doing a good job. I'm

2:52:38talking about management level people of

2:52:41presenting budgets and finding out where

2:52:44our money is.

2:52:46We have 15 million coming off of

2:52:49interest in income off of our cash

2:52:51balances. I had to give you that. That

2:52:54wasn't presented. I also presented to

2:52:57you that we have $10 million coming off

2:53:00of administrative transfers from

2:53:03utilities and that could be larger

2:53:05because their reserves are so large.

2:53:08Uh I don't think we've begun to touch

2:53:12the bottom of where this budget needs to

2:53:14be. And uh as far as new fire stations,

2:53:18well, why don't we have some uh

2:53:20community town hall meetings where the

2:53:23public can come and talk and we can have

2:53:25a give and take? Why can't we do that

2:53:27over the next 3 to four months and

2:53:29actually talk about it uh with the

2:53:32public? Do you really want to pay

2:53:33another half cent on your groceries?

2:53:36Remember, we have some inflation. People

2:53:38are already fed up. And remember, those

2:53:41sales taxes will go back on our

2:53:43utilities. Remember that. We have to pay

2:53:45taxes as city residents on our

2:53:47utilities.

2:53:49I And our personal property and on and

2:53:53on. Thank you very much. Uh

2:53:57I'm absolutely opposed to this. I just

2:53:59want the management team to do their job

2:54:01and start cutting. [clears throat]

2:54:02>> Thank you. Next up, I have Jane

2:54:05Williams.

2:54:14Good evening. My name is Jane Williams.

2:54:18I'm a member of Trinity Presbyterian

2:54:20Church and I'm here tonight representing

2:54:22Topeka Jump. We've been very excited to

2:54:26see the funding from the proposed

2:54:28onetenth of one penny in sales tax

2:54:31switched back to its original proposal.

2:54:35Good going guys.

2:54:37So this would be supporting affordable

2:54:39housing trust fund and homeless

2:54:41services. Thank you to all the council

2:54:44members who spoke out for doing what is

2:54:47right, letting peakans vote on what our

2:54:51community needs. You'll notice tonight

2:54:54that it's a little bit abnormal as I'm

2:54:57the only one here representing Jump.

2:55:00That's not because everyone else feels

2:55:02like our work is done and has stopped

2:55:06paying attention to the issue. Over 50

2:55:09of our organizational leaders are

2:55:11meeting right now

2:55:14to finalize our listening process.

2:55:17So far, we've engaged 500 community

2:55:20members in this process with an

2:55:23increasing number of people lifting up

2:55:25stories about new and increasing

2:55:28struggles to find safe and affordable

2:55:30housing.

2:55:32Several others have shared about loved

2:55:35ones living in the streets in their

2:55:38community and struggling to regain

2:55:41stability. Our community is clearly

2:55:44crying out for a change on these

2:55:47pressing problems. If the city of Topeka

2:55:50can further define specific homelessness

2:55:53services that will be funded with this

2:55:56tax proposal and maintain funding for

2:55:59the affordable housing trust fund,

2:56:02Topeka Jump will be excited to support

2:56:04the proposal. Our

2:56:08500 individual members will work to

2:56:11organize support adi amidst the 7,000

2:56:16people in our member congregations

2:56:19and expand that support into the broader

2:56:22community

2:56:23because we need affordable housing now

2:56:26and we also need a proven homeless

2:56:29solution now. And we believe that if

2:56:33given the opportunity, Topekans will

2:56:35vote to support funding for these

2:56:38solutions that our community desperately

2:56:40needs. Thank you.

2:56:43>> Thank you.

2:56:47Um,

2:56:49I'm going to open this up to the

2:56:50governing body. I I guess I think I'm I

2:56:52think I'm going to go first. Um, just so

2:56:55everyone kind of knows where I stand cuz

2:56:57I've obviously been asked about a lot

2:56:58and there's no secret that I've

2:57:00struggled with this and gone back and

2:57:01forth since since we've been talking

2:57:03about it off and on for the last year.

2:57:05Um,

2:57:07I do have concerns and still unanswered

2:57:09questions about kind of where we're

2:57:11headed and what what the end result of

2:57:12this is going to be. I do have general

2:57:15concerns about what an increased sales

2:57:17tax means to the residents, to the

2:57:18future growth of this city, to the

2:57:20businesses in this community. But I also

2:57:22acknowledge my my position has slightly

2:57:25evolved as we've gone through this

2:57:26discussion from where I was when it

2:57:27started because I do have to acknowledge

2:57:29that we have very difficult financial

2:57:32realities that face our city. Our costs

2:57:34which are beyond our control. The costs

2:57:36that we don't control continue to go up

2:57:38just like they do for everybody. And

2:57:40obviously our revenues are going in the

2:57:42opposite direction.

2:57:44uh particularly our personnel expenses

2:57:45as we've worked really hard the last

2:57:47five years to make sure that we have

2:57:48competitive wages and that we're you

2:57:50know part of the marketplace so that we

2:57:52can retain good people. We've made

2:57:54difficult cuts and I know that we're

2:57:56going to continue to have to make some

2:57:57efficiencies and look at cuts as we move

2:57:59forward. Um and we also have to

2:58:01acknowledge that the more we do that as

2:58:03we're asked to do mean it can impact the

2:58:06level of service that we offer folks in

2:58:08this community. Our goal is always to

2:58:12remain committed to reducing costs for

2:58:13our residents. And that means that we've

2:58:16been asked multiple times not to touch

2:58:18property taxes to increase those. And so

2:58:21we have to look for other ways to

2:58:22generate revenue. So that's why we got

2:58:24to that that's why we're here. That's

2:58:25why we're having this conversation

2:58:27internally and externally with the

2:58:28public is what are our other options if

2:58:31we're constantly told the property taxes

2:58:32are the most hated and and worst one to

2:58:34stay away from. So, I've been open to

2:58:37having this conversation at the council

2:58:39level. I'm glad that we're having it. I

2:58:41want to hear the perspect perspectives

2:58:42of everybody, both staff and of the

2:58:44council. And I think it's been critical

2:58:46to hear even early on without some of

2:58:49the specifics, what the priorities and

2:58:50the concerns of the public are. I also

2:58:53have been very clear that I think it's

2:58:55imperative that we have a a ballot

2:58:57question that's very clear as to where

2:58:59our dollars would be spent, that's

2:59:02targeted, that's specific, and that

2:59:04shows folks we can account and will be

2:59:06accountable. That includes the

2:59:08affordable housing trust fund citizen

2:59:10advisory board's proposal to help create

2:59:12more funding for our housing programs,

2:59:14which I do support that one even even if

2:59:17this council wants to move on with that

2:59:18one independently before we decide any

2:59:20other resolution to any of the other

2:59:22questions.

2:59:23[clears throat] Ultimately, we don't get

2:59:25to make the final decision on this. The

2:59:27people do at the ballot box, and I think

2:59:28that's an important piece of this that

2:59:30they will get a say if this moves

2:59:32forward.

2:59:33But the fact that they make the final

2:59:36decision doesn't lessen our

2:59:37responsibility. I think it actually adds

2:59:39to our responsibility. Before I'm

2:59:42comfortable placing anything on a

2:59:44ballot, I want to be clear to the

2:59:45citizens of the city about what we're

2:59:47proposing, what options we have fully

2:59:50considered, how every dollar will be

2:59:52allocated when they make that approval,

2:59:54what safeguards and accountability

2:59:55measures we've put in place and continue

2:59:57to be put in place, and how the proposal

2:59:59will affect the residents and businesses

3:00:01of this community.

3:00:03Most importantly, the public needs to

3:00:05have a meaningful opportunity to help

3:00:07shape the proposal, not simply have to

3:00:10react to whatever it is we ask them to

3:00:12vote on. My concern at this point is

3:00:17that we're running out of time. I don't

3:00:19know that we have enough time in two

3:00:21weeks and three meetings left to provide

3:00:24all of those things that I would feel

3:00:26more comfortable with if we put

3:00:28something forward and to just simply

3:00:30finalize something in the next couple

3:00:31weeks.

3:00:32My preference is to take this

3:00:34conversation into the community over the

3:00:36next eight months as the city manager

3:00:37has indicated is a is a secondary

3:00:39option. That way we can listen to the

3:00:41residents. We can listen to the

3:00:43businesses. We can clearly define what

3:00:45our needs are and why we're making this

3:00:46request. We can show them the

3:00:48alternatives. I think there's healthy I

3:00:50think there's something healthy about

3:00:52having to put together two budgets and

3:00:54show the citizens what that looks like

3:00:56and what that really means. That's an

3:00:58honest, transparent conversation we can

3:00:59have with this with the citizens of

3:01:01Topeka. We can put something on the

3:01:04ballot in August when there's already an

3:01:06election scheduled.

3:01:08I will say if a majority of this council

3:01:10thinks that we can fully develop a vet

3:01:12and carefully write a ballot question on

3:01:14both a targeted sales tax and affordable

3:01:16housing sales tax by October 20th, I'm

3:01:19here to do everything I can to

3:01:20facilitate that conversation and make

3:01:22sure that you can get to where you need

3:01:24to get and that it's as productive as

3:01:26possible. But I can't promise a vote of

3:01:28support if I'm not comfortable that in

3:01:30the next couple weeks we've gone through

3:01:32those steps that I feel this community

3:01:33is asking for and needs. The good news

3:01:36for us is our 27 budget is done. Our 28

3:01:40budget doesn't need to be truly

3:01:41finalized until the end of September of

3:01:43next year, which would be after an

3:01:45August 4th election. And while I do

3:01:48wholly understand the thin margin that

3:01:50creates and some of the extra work, I

3:01:53think that as we look upon having a

3:01:54finance director put in place, as we

3:01:56look at having an auditor position put

3:01:58in place and having more support with

3:01:59people who can look at those numbers,

3:02:01we've got we've got reinforcements

3:02:03coming through this process that I think

3:02:05can help us. So for me, I'm not trying

3:02:07to close the door on this idea, but I am

3:02:10want to be very clear that I have some

3:02:13consternation that doing this over just

3:02:16the next couple weeks may not lead us to

3:02:18the best path to success both in having

3:02:21this conversation with the community and

3:02:23what the outcome could be if we put

3:02:24something on the March ballot. So just

3:02:26want to be clear and set the stage as we

3:02:28have this conversation so nobody's

3:02:30sitting here wondering what what's the

3:02:32mayor thinking as he listens to all

3:02:33this. So with that, I will open it up to

3:02:35the council. Council member Kell,

3:02:38[clears throat] I

3:02:39>> I know you mentioned a little extra

3:02:40work. I think if we actually do this the

3:02:42right way, that extra work will already

3:02:43be done before that date when we have

3:02:45both plans to give to the public to show

3:02:47them what's going to be what our options

3:02:49are going to be. So, um, when it comes

3:02:52to cuts, we we've done a lot of cutting

3:02:55already, and if we cut any more, we're

3:02:56we're going to be hurting our citizens

3:02:58and we're going to be hurting our staff.

3:03:00Uh we're going to have, you know,

3:03:01overworked firefighters are going to

3:03:03have an accident on the job trying to

3:03:05trying to do something because they're

3:03:07stressed and tired and overworked. We're

3:03:09having an officer possibly have an

3:03:11accident when they're out there because

3:03:13they're overworked stressed and and

3:03:16we're just going to burn out of all of

3:03:17our staff and we just keep on taking,

3:03:19you know, three jobs make that into two

3:03:21jobs and that two jobs into one job,

3:03:23then we're we're undervaluing our own

3:03:26staff and it's going to hurt our

3:03:27citizens.

3:03:29Now, uh, Mr. City Manager, you

3:03:31mentioned, uh, possibly moving this to

3:03:33August, correct?

3:03:34>> Yes, sir.

3:03:34>> I I completely agree with that. I'm not

3:03:36a big fan of mailin ballots. Um, I'd

3:03:39rather have a general uh primary

3:03:40election where people can go to the

3:03:42polls and take care of this and and read

3:03:44the ballot. And

3:03:46um I would like to see uh from uh from

3:03:50finance a

3:03:52breakdown of

3:03:55what the difference of a mill levy would

3:03:57be like to to try to even just to just

3:03:59get the balance

3:04:01>> what a mill levy increase would would

3:04:02would have to be.

3:04:04>> Uh so that would be about 10 mills. Uh

3:04:07each bill is about $1.4 million. So to

3:04:10address a $13.3 million deficit. Well, I

3:04:12would have broken down kind of almost

3:04:13maybe like every $25,000 for a house

3:04:15value so people can understand what

3:04:17their house is. Um, and then break it

3:04:21down and I just broke down some numbers

3:04:22when this first started here. Just

3:04:24looking at using US census and then a

3:04:27couple different grocery tracking

3:04:29websites

3:04:32that we're looking at off BA household

3:04:34size is 2.21. We're looking about a $160

3:04:38a month per person per household that a

3:04:41sales tax would cost. So I'd like to see

3:04:43how much that would 10 mills would cost

3:04:45a household of $100,000 and be able to

3:04:48break that down and show people what the

3:04:50difference is there per month what

3:04:53they're going to be possibly or per year

3:04:54what they're going to be paying per

3:04:56person to to really break it down to for

3:04:58for the public uh and to understand that

3:05:02the mill levy only affects the citizens

3:05:04of Topeka. sales tax affects anyone that

3:05:06comes and spends a dollar in Topeka. And

3:05:08we have so many people within five miles

3:05:10of our city borders. And we have so many

3:05:12people that come into town for different

3:05:13activities that they'll be taking the

3:05:17burden off the citizens with the sales

3:05:18tax rather than if we have to go with

3:05:21the middle of your route, which is our

3:05:23property tax. And that could really

3:05:26affect a lot of people. And you know, I

3:05:30I'd rather pay an extra $150 a month to

3:05:33for my groceries

3:05:35than have to pay an extra $1,000, let's

3:05:38say, in mill levby taxes,

3:05:41you know. So, we need to I need to be

3:05:44able to break this down for the public

3:05:46to show them here's what this is going

3:05:48to cost for a sales tax. Here's what a

3:05:50mill levy increase just the balance is.

3:05:52And that's including cuts that we've

3:05:54already planned. uh we're we're going to

3:05:56have to, you know, if we do mill levy,

3:05:58we're still going to have to make cuts.

3:05:59And every year that's going to go up

3:06:00because we're going to have to stay

3:06:01competitive with our salaries with our

3:06:04fire, police, and a few other unions or

3:06:06else we're going to lose employees

3:06:08there. And if we're not competitive,

3:06:10we're going to have a hard time getting

3:06:11good qualified employees there. So,

3:06:15I've [clears throat] been saying for 3

3:06:16years things were looking off, you know,

3:06:20maybe a little before that. And it

3:06:21seemed like our budget was way too easy

3:06:23there for a couple years and all of a

3:06:24sudden we you know break through the

3:06:25wall of the budget time frame everything

3:06:27looked good on the other side. Let's go

3:06:29to the next year and all of a sudden one

3:06:31year it's all those contracts came up.

3:06:33We wanted to be competitive. We wanted

3:06:34to try to save our staff and that was

3:06:36the monster behind one of those walls

3:06:38when we broke down and unfortunately Dr.

3:06:40Perez you've been the main blame for

3:06:42this and this was about the time you

3:06:44were hired. So I I try to tell people

3:06:47all the time this is not your fault. uh

3:06:50this is just what happened with the

3:06:52economy, with with society, with with

3:06:54with our our needs of our staffing. And

3:06:58I think if we can be open, transparent,

3:07:01and show those numbers to the to the

3:07:03public, I think especially in a polling

3:07:07place vote, I think we we'll get the

3:07:10answer from a majority of of peakans. Um

3:07:15and correct me if I'm wrong, uh Mr.

3:07:17Mayor, isn't the state trying to if

3:07:19something like this were to come up that

3:07:21the citizens outside the city could vote

3:07:22on this? Also, wasn't the state trying

3:07:24to do that?

3:07:27>> There's some sort of bill like that

3:07:29every year. But

3:07:29>> so in essence, people outside the city

3:07:32could vote to shut this down so they

3:07:34don't have to pay it, but we as citizens

3:07:35have to pay more because we have to

3:07:37increase the mill levy. So, um, that's

3:07:40something to look at long term because

3:07:42that could be that right could be taken

3:07:44out of our hands as citizens and allow

3:07:47people that aren't citizens to vote on

3:07:48what we have in our city, uh, on on

3:07:50attacks. So, uh, I think we just need to

3:07:54look long and hard at this and look at

3:07:56the numbers and be very transparent and

3:07:58open to to the public about this. Thank

3:07:59you,

3:08:01>> Council Member Valdiv Alcala.

3:08:03>> Thank you, Mayor. I agree with you. I

3:08:07think that a committee coming forth

3:08:10uh citizens uh is important because my

3:08:16really deep concern is is that if

3:08:18anything would go out for March, I don't

3:08:21think I don't think the halfent will

3:08:23pass. There's so much irritation and

3:08:26frustration

3:08:28out there by voters. I think that we

3:08:31need to get somebody hired as soon as

3:08:34possible in the auditor position. We

3:08:36need to put good faith forward to

3:08:40constituents to residents and we need to

3:08:43start the new year hitting the ground

3:08:46running with an audit whether it goes by

3:08:50department forensic audit in in some of

3:08:53the most concerning departments.

3:08:56But I fear

3:08:58even though I've supported a ballot

3:09:00initiative from the beginning, let the

3:09:02people decide, I fear with the tenor

3:09:05that is out there that people do not

3:09:08trust the spending or what the real

3:09:10numbers are that the city has. We have

3:09:14gone for I don't know almost two years

3:09:17without a CFO.

3:09:19We need the auditor. We need to get to

3:09:22we need to prove to the people that us

3:09:24putting a ballot initiative forward is

3:09:27going to be worth them taking the time

3:09:29to consider it by starting to get a

3:09:31handle on what many people have concerns

3:09:35about what I have concerns about in

3:09:38having called for a forensic audit. I

3:09:40also think that we need to bring go to

3:09:43PA to the table and we need to look at

3:09:47all of the incentives to see if they are

3:09:52abiding by the employment requirements.

3:09:55If the employment requirements are not

3:09:57being met, that incentives being drawn

3:10:01drawn back because some of what you are

3:10:03hearing out in the public is that the

3:10:06incentives that are being given to large

3:10:09businesses, large corporations or the

3:10:12incentives that are being given already

3:10:15over time over time over time to the

3:10:18same businesses in their minds is BS

3:10:22because they end up paying for it.

3:10:25I don't know what the new way moving

3:10:28forward is, but the way that we're doing

3:10:31it now is only increasing the upset by

3:10:35the taxpayers to where eventually we're

3:10:38going to shoot ourselves in the foot and

3:10:40anything we try to put forward isn't

3:10:42going to pass because people are not

3:10:45trusting us. And so I think it's a very

3:10:49thoughtful approach to that of what

3:10:51you're saying, mayor. It gives us more

3:10:54time, but I also think we need to hit

3:10:56the ground running with that auditor and

3:10:59we need to have some forensic audits

3:11:02done sooner rather than later. Thank

3:11:05you,

3:11:07>> Council Member Ortiz.

3:11:09>> Well, I agree with um everything that's

3:11:11been said. I just want to say that I

3:11:13think two weeks is rushing it. Um,

3:11:19I'm glad to see it go on the ballot so

3:11:22that we can put this to rest because

3:11:26residents

3:11:28in Oakland in East Topeka, Southeast

3:11:31Topeka,

3:11:33we pay for a tax. We pay for some a

3:11:35service that we don't even get. And I'm

3:11:37talking about the existing when it comes

3:11:39to the streets.

3:11:41We we we can't get anything like that.

3:11:44We have to have our streets put back the

3:11:46same same way that they were tore up.

3:11:49And that's that's really a shame because

3:11:52I feel like and a lot of my constituents

3:11:54feel like we pay for something that we

3:11:56don't get. I don't want to continue to

3:11:58pay for that. Um so I can't support that

3:12:01um when it comes to the streets. And

3:12:03we're not going to take that word out

3:12:05existing. If we do take it out, I'll

3:12:07support it. But as long as it's in

3:12:09there, I will not support it because I

3:12:11would like a curb, a gut, or a sidewalk,

3:12:15you know. Other than that, I just have a

3:12:17ditch. It's kind of nice that sometimes

3:12:19you can throw people in the ditch or

3:12:21throw in there, you [laughter]

3:12:22know, run a car in the ditch or

3:12:25something or even myself goes in the

3:12:27ditch. But and I think that was a a big

3:12:31problem is people seen that we were

3:12:34going to do all these great things with

3:12:36the streets and the structure and the

3:12:38sidewalks, but they forgot that one

3:12:40little word. So, I want to make sure

3:12:42that our residents get a clear

3:12:44understanding of what they're going to

3:12:46get, what they have to pay. Um, and I I

3:12:50can't support two weeks. I I just can't.

3:12:52I don't think that's going to be enough

3:12:54time to spin it around. Um, especially

3:12:58looking at some of the verbiage, I think

3:13:00it's going to have to be more detailed

3:13:02in there. Um, and it's just like the

3:13:05streets, you know, we had one city

3:13:07manager that said, "Yeah, we can use it

3:13:08on maintenance." And another one that

3:13:10said we can't. So, we need to make sure

3:13:12that the people understand what they're

3:13:14they're doing when it comes to public um

3:13:17safety. Um,

3:13:20we we need to really look at is with

3:13:22with I what I don't want us to do is put

3:13:26public safety in there and then oh yeah,

3:13:28we're going to give them a raise. We're

3:13:29going to give them this money. I don't

3:13:32think that's what I want this for and I

3:13:34don't think that's what a lot of

3:13:35citizens don't. So, I would agree either

3:13:38have some town hall meetings, but it's

3:13:40got to be made very, very clear because

3:13:43the people I talk to, they're just taxed

3:13:45to death. I'm taxed to death. I'm tired

3:13:47of it. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

3:13:49>> Thank you, Council Member McGee.

3:13:53>> Thank you. I I feel we this is a very

3:13:57important issue and we don't want to

3:14:00rush into making a decision. Um, I do

3:14:04think we need to take the time to to

3:14:07gather public input. I think we need to

3:14:11be very very clear in defining exactly

3:14:17how the you know if if we put this

3:14:20together exactly how the funds can be

3:14:22used

3:14:24and and define that

3:14:28set set very clear boundaries. Um and I

3:14:33mean then we're the public's going to

3:14:36hold us accountable. we say how it's

3:14:39going to be done, then that's the way

3:14:41it's going to be done. Um, and give give

3:14:46it give us a little time and have the

3:14:48opportunity to have the proper staff,

3:14:50have more staff involved

3:14:53with expertise

3:14:55that can assist us in evaluating the

3:14:59data.

3:15:01And so that we know we can educate

3:15:05ourselves better on where we're at and

3:15:10where we anticipate we can be.

3:15:14You know, I ran these numbers, you know,

3:15:18in the last 24 hours on on sales tax

3:15:22revenues.

3:15:24I'm not I'm not the CFO.

3:15:27I'd really rather them run the numbers

3:15:31and and provide their

3:15:34input.

3:15:36Um,

3:15:38but I I I really think it comes down to

3:15:40we have to be very specific,

3:15:43very clear just like we did couple weeks

3:15:48ago.

3:15:50When we talked about the tenth of a

3:15:52cent,

3:15:54we went around this table and and

3:15:57discussed

3:15:59we want that tenth of a cent

3:16:03for homeless programs and affordable

3:16:06housing. And we made it very clear that

3:16:09it's for affordable housing.

3:16:12I think we we've got to make sure the

3:16:15messaging and the definitions

3:16:18are crystal clear. So, I think we need

3:16:21to take the time to get the input and

3:16:25really

3:16:28make sure the wording is appropriate

3:16:30that everybody understands what we're

3:16:33talking about.

3:16:35>> Thank you,

3:16:37>> Council Member Hiller.

3:16:39>> Thank you. Um, I too agree with the

3:16:41comments that have been made so far. Um,

3:16:46um, respectfully, I would point out that

3:16:49the four-fifth cent is not really

3:16:514-fifths of a cent, it's 4/10 of a cent.

3:16:55And so for credibility, it's important

3:16:58to get the numbers right. Um, so, uh,

3:17:02for for next time. Um,

3:17:06as far as the affordable housing and,

3:17:08um, homeless

3:17:10services, I think that's the name right

3:17:12now. I'm actually comfortable with

3:17:14getting that going. I think people have

3:17:16waited, if there's enough of a general

3:17:18consensus that that's where the money

3:17:19should come from. We're eager to get

3:17:21started, but I don't know if it's

3:17:23cost-effective to do that one alone all

3:17:26by itself in March. Um, so maybe if if

3:17:30there is a thought to wait, we can look

3:17:32at at some way to maybe private grant

3:17:35money or whatever to to get something

3:17:38moving in there prior to um and in a in

3:17:43the big picture of things, whether it's

3:17:45really wise to on the alternative to run

3:17:48the homeless and housing and a half cent

3:17:51sales tax and the street all at the same

3:17:54time. Either maybe we should think

3:17:57through I personally also have said all

3:18:00along that I I think it is not not

3:18:03something we should consider at all to

3:18:05mix in capital projects such as fire

3:18:08stations with operating funds. And so uh

3:18:12we can we can talk about that further

3:18:14but I would suggest getting them out.

3:18:16Um,

3:18:18again, if people want to fund those with

3:18:20cash though, I think there are either

3:18:23one of them at a time or all three

3:18:25together, if three is a commitment that

3:18:27we have, would would would get a fair

3:18:30public consideration and a yes or a no

3:18:33on a ballot question at some point.

3:18:36Um

3:18:39I do think that um [snorts] with the

3:18:42discussion of good faith efforts on our

3:18:44part, if we don't if we opt not to go

3:18:47forward with March,

3:18:51um we could consider, as we discussed

3:18:53when we passed the budget, looking at

3:18:55let's say $2 million worth of grant of

3:18:58cuts that we would settle on between now

3:19:00and the 1st of January and start off the

3:19:04year at demonstrating that that we've

3:19:07been able to look program by program and

3:19:10and make some cuts.

3:19:13Um,

3:19:15in terms of the in internal audit or the

3:19:18the auditor position, we have we've had

3:19:21a few conversations along. I'm

3:19:24comfortable with creating that that role

3:19:27for us that reports to us. I think there

3:19:30was some conversation about whether we

3:19:32really had to wait until we changed the

3:19:34charter with an election in order for us

3:19:37to work out something internally that

3:19:39that person could report to us and and

3:19:41get started.

3:19:43I also liked the suggestion that

3:19:45somebody made along the way that we

3:19:47could use the dollars that in the past

3:19:50have been designated for the internal

3:19:52investigator position

3:19:54for that audit position. simply

3:19:57substitute that role.

3:20:00I am also inclined and I I read not word

3:20:03for word but some of the two pieces that

3:20:06the the [snorts] gentleman who's

3:20:08recommended that gave to us and I still

3:20:13think we should look at at contract at

3:20:15setting [snorts] a budget for how much

3:20:16we would spend on audits each year but

3:20:19consider contracting people for the

3:20:22specific audits that we want planning

3:20:25those in advance and and doing them as

3:20:27contracts rather than having a full-time

3:20:30person that might need something to do

3:20:32from time to time. That's that's just

3:20:35me. Um, I did notice that the city

3:20:39manager, to your point, left preventive

3:20:42maintenance out of the description of

3:20:44the street tax and and I support that. I

3:20:48think we still need enough major redo of

3:20:50the streets that we need to continue

3:20:53limiting

3:20:54um

3:20:57the

3:20:58saving our streets rather than just the

3:21:00preventive. Um, with that, um, I've

3:21:04mentioned it before, but I still think a

3:21:06map for all of us to look at that we can

3:21:09see what where the dollars have been

3:21:12spent over the first 20 years, what the

3:21:14conditions are of our streets so that we

3:21:16have something in hand to look at as we

3:21:20finalize what wording we put with the

3:21:22street renewal.

3:21:24That's it.

3:21:26>> I'll just offer a piece of

3:21:27clarification. The auditor positions in

3:21:28our 27 budget. We've already been

3:21:31talking to staff about we can hire that

3:21:33individual and work out an arrangement

3:21:35with the city manager's office to make

3:21:37sure that while they until we ever

3:21:39change till we get the charter change,

3:21:41they would still report to him, but give

3:21:43us some ability to direct what projects

3:21:45we want to put them on. So that we don't

3:21:47need to wait for that for that vote to

3:21:49happen to at least get that person in

3:21:51here based on our budget. So

3:21:54>> thank you for that clarification. I

3:21:56still think that that in part whether we

3:22:00have staff whe whether it's a full-time

3:22:02staff or contracted out that the

3:22:05contracting out especially would would

3:22:07put us in a position of having to decide

3:22:10what it was we wanted to see audited as

3:22:12a body in plenty of time to to get the

3:22:16person

3:22:17>> understood. I just wanted the public to

3:22:19understand that we we are moving forward

3:22:20on that piece of it at least in some

3:22:23form. So yeah, to to the mayor's point,

3:22:25council member, um whenever you have a

3:22:26city auditor, you'll the governing body

3:22:28will develop an annual work plan or

3:22:31audit plan. So that way you do have the

3:22:33opportunity to weigh in and decide as a

3:22:37as a whole what it is you want the

3:22:39auditor to look at in a given fiscal

3:22:41year. Thank you. To your discussion that

3:22:45it's in the budget, we're also holding a

3:22:47lot of positions vacant and I think the

3:22:50internal investigator was one of them.

3:22:53And so, you know, if we could start to

3:22:56step by step finalize some of those

3:22:57things, that's that's why I brought it

3:22:59up again.

3:23:01>> Thanks, Council Member Miller.

3:23:03>> Thank you, Mayor. Um, council members

3:23:06have brought up some very good points.

3:23:08Um, I want to address something that uh,

3:23:11Councilman Kale said earlier, and tell

3:23:14me if I'm wrong on that, but I think the

3:23:15numbers of what it would cost the

3:23:16average family do exist.

3:23:19>> The number of what? the the the average

3:23:22family and what it would cost him with

3:23:24the sales tax. I think those numbers

3:23:26already exist within our financial

3:23:28department. Correct.

3:23:29>> Yes, we it's it's easy to calculate

3:23:31though, councilman. I mean, we would

3:23:33essentially um [clears throat] would

3:23:34essentially calculate a 10 mil increase

3:23:36and then how that would affect a

3:23:38household if value of a home was, you

3:23:42know, 100, 200,000, 300,000, etc.

3:23:45>> We can do that.

3:23:47>> I I appreciate that cuz I thought I had

3:23:48seen that before. Um, and I I think that

3:23:52uh Councilwoman Ortiz on spot was

3:23:54something that including maybe not in

3:23:56the language but specifically because of

3:23:58how projects change and priorities

3:24:01change throughout the years something

3:24:03that in the language about how what

3:24:06something that it would not fund. So

3:24:08like if we were to say like we will not

3:24:10use this money for XYZ instead of well

3:24:13it'd be hard to say what we'll use it

3:24:15for. Okay, the the citizens don't want

3:24:17us to use it for this few things. Can we

3:24:20have it in that language to where it's

3:24:22clear we're not using it for say

3:24:24salaries or you know whatever the case

3:24:26may be?

3:24:28>> We can look at something like that. Um

3:24:30I'm I'm guessing that we don't really

3:24:32break out our current 1% general use to

3:24:35say it won't be used for salaries or

3:24:37won't be used for etc. So again, the

3:24:41half cent or the the 1%

3:24:44general government use is just used just

3:24:46for that. I think it's used for

3:24:47everything except for debt service if

3:24:49I'm not mistaken. So it would be part

3:24:51just like just like our property taxes,

3:24:53right? Like if if we raised our mill 10

3:24:56mills, it would go to our general use

3:24:57and not necessarily to a specific use.

3:25:01It it would fund everything, police,

3:25:03fire, everything in our general fund. So

3:25:05that that is um again we can talk about

3:25:08what it won't be used for but again we

3:25:10don't break out our current 1% like

3:25:12that. Uh it's just part of our general

3:25:15fund revenues that come in.

3:25:18>> Okay. I can I can understand that's how

3:25:20we currently do it. I was just thinking

3:25:21of ways that the public would be able to

3:25:23to be able to support it themselves um

3:25:26to understanding what we're not going to

3:25:28be using it for. So thank you for that.

3:25:30And if I could, I think that's the

3:25:32beauty of actually including a

3:25:34community-led effort for the fact that

3:25:36the recommendation [clears throat] in

3:25:38theory should come from that community-

3:25:40based group. Um, so that way number one,

3:25:44they have the input, but also number

3:25:45two, you actually have a group of

3:25:47champions uh hopefully out in the

3:25:49community trying to help help justify

3:25:51why we're doing this.

3:25:52>> Okay. Thank you,

3:25:54>> Council Member Banks.

3:25:56>> Thank you, Mayor. Um,

3:25:59I appreciate the information that uh

3:26:02we're gathering from our colleagues

3:26:04tonight. Uh, something that's been uh a

3:26:08continuum for

3:26:11this council and certainly my district

3:26:14is no different than any other about

3:26:16concerns on certain things that we do as

3:26:21a governing body. Last night at the NIA

3:26:25meeting, uh we were talking about uh the

3:26:29possibility of a a tax or meal levy

3:26:33increase and

3:26:36a few things keep coming up. Go to PA

3:26:39keeps coming up and $5 million. We've

3:26:42been hearing that from uh constituents

3:26:45for the last

3:26:47three years that I've been on this

3:26:49committee. So I think in anything we do

3:26:54for budget concerns, we certainly need

3:26:56to look at that and give the community

3:27:00some answers about go to [clears throat]

3:27:02PA incentives

3:27:05uh those things that we're putting out

3:27:07there

3:27:09when we're asking them to uh do this uh

3:27:12ballot initiative.

3:27:14Now, I support the efforts

3:27:18that we initially set forth for GoPA,

3:27:22but from what I'm hearing and we heard

3:27:25tonight about, it's not clear where uh

3:27:29money is is going or coming from. And

3:27:32like uh Councilwoman uh Valdivia said,

3:27:37uh we need to definitely have an audit.

3:27:41the auditor position needs to be done

3:27:44and we needs to figure out where the

3:27:46money is coming and going. Now also I

3:27:50think it's important for us to take a

3:27:53little bit of time like mayor said I

3:27:55don't think a couple of weeks three

3:27:57weeks is going to be enough time to be

3:28:00effective in what we put together to

3:28:02present to public.

3:28:05Um,

3:28:07I think that when we have public comment

3:28:09and people come up and they tell us

3:28:12about things, they're wanting us to get

3:28:16back with them to let them know we

3:28:18[clears throat] should not have uh

3:28:22core requests that cost people an

3:28:25enormous amount of money. We should not

3:28:27have core requests not being answered.

3:28:30We're better. We're better than that. if

3:28:33we've got things going, let's just put

3:28:36it out there on the table. That is

3:28:38what's going to sustain the city and

3:28:41legitimize the vote that all of us got.

3:28:45I think those are the things that we

3:28:46need to consider when we're doing um if

3:28:50we decide to have a committee and some

3:28:55time to put together something specific

3:28:58as Councilman McGee was talking about.

3:29:01Thank you, Mr. Mayor,

3:29:03>> Council Member Bradberry,

3:29:06>> thank you.

3:29:08Um, I understand and [clears throat]

3:29:11appreciate the need to

3:29:14take some additional time for the

3:29:17language on the House sales tax.

3:29:21Um,

3:29:27I don't necessarily agree that

3:29:31moving the 10th

3:29:33sales tax for homelessness and

3:29:35affordable housing

3:29:38um,

3:29:41should wait until August.

3:29:45Yet, I also understand

3:29:48that the cost involved with having two

3:29:51different

3:29:53elections.

3:29:55And

3:29:57I guess really what I'm trying to say is

3:29:59that even though I wouldn't support

3:30:01something like that, I do understand

3:30:04um

3:30:05if that's the decision that we need to

3:30:09go um because of needing to refine the

3:30:13language for the half cent. I guess if

3:30:16that's making any sense.

3:30:18>> No, that makes sense. Yeah, I I I think

3:30:20that's part of the discussion we can

3:30:22have in the next couple weeks is whether

3:30:24we bifurcate this thing to to move one

3:30:26forward or we think it's better to do

3:30:28them at one time. I think that's a very

3:30:31valid conversation.

3:30:33Council member Hiller

3:30:35>> question out of that point. Um

3:30:38apparently it it would cost us somewhere

3:30:41in the neighborhood of $100,000 to do

3:30:44this special election in March. 115 for

3:30:47melon, 180 for uh in person.

3:30:50>> Okay. If we wait till August, which is a

3:30:53broader election,

3:30:55>> then do we have to pay at all?

3:30:59>> I don't think so.

3:31:00>> Nope. [clears throat]

3:31:01>> If we do, it'll be shared among if we

3:31:03do, it'll be shared amongst uh all the

3:31:04other entities that are paying that

3:31:08>> pays for local elections.

3:31:09>> Okay.

3:31:09>> Just checking.

3:31:10>> Yep.

3:31:13>> Thank you. Other

3:31:18comments and questions from the

3:31:19governing body at this time?

3:31:25Any other comments from staff?

3:31:26Questions?

3:31:27>> So, next uh next week we'll come back. I

3:31:30will give you a revised timeline working

3:31:33backwards from an August ballot so you

3:31:35have that information. Essentially, that

3:31:37gives us uh three or four extra months

3:31:39to work on something. Um because if we

3:31:42if we work back four months from August,

3:31:45we're looking at April that we'd have to

3:31:47have final uh language. March, April, by

3:31:49the time we'd have to fi have final

3:31:51language together for consideration of

3:31:53an August ballot. So I'll work backwards

3:31:57from an August ballot 4 months back and

3:32:00then what we have to do internally to

3:32:02get that done. Um and we can have that

3:32:04for discussion. I'm hearing what I'm

3:32:06hearing is let's slow down. Let's focus

3:32:09on something for uh August. I will also

3:32:13mention for those who want to see

3:32:14something for affordable housing. Uh we

3:32:16do still have $650,000 of the affordable

3:32:19housing trust fund that we've shared

3:32:21with you that we are also putting our

3:32:23RFP for smaller projects for that. That

3:32:25will probably come back I'm guessing

3:32:27first of the year uh as we are working

3:32:29through the affordable housing trust

3:32:31fund to get uh that RFP developed. Um,

3:32:34so there'll still be some movement on

3:32:36affordable housing trust fund uh while

3:32:38we look and scope something uh for an

3:32:40[clears throat] August ballot.

3:32:42>> So, so I would also request because I

3:32:44think there's at least some interest in

3:32:45having the information so we can have a

3:32:46discussion about it that you we also

3:32:49have what I would call the best final

3:32:52language we think we could have as it

3:32:53relates to the affordable housing trust

3:32:55fund question and the auditor question

3:32:58and then the exact cost again of what

3:33:01that's going to be the 115. But so we

3:33:03know what that looks like. So if the

3:33:05council wants to have that conversation

3:33:06about okay, if we really do want to

3:33:08bifurcate these and do the one in March

3:33:10and want to we at least, you know, know

3:33:12what that would look like and just go

3:33:15from there. Okay.

3:33:15>> We may not do it, but at least then we

3:33:17we know we the options are there and we

3:33:18have the information to have that

3:33:20conversation.

3:33:20>> For sure.

3:33:21>> Yeah.

3:33:22>> I have a question, mayor.

3:33:23>> Yes, [clears throat]

3:33:24council member. Um, I think it's been I

3:33:29don't know 6 weeks, 7 weeks maybe since

3:33:32[clears throat] a request was put in to

3:33:35uh have Goats Pika come forward so we

3:33:37can ask questions. Questions that I can

3:33:40tell you I'm getting from that I have no

3:33:44idea how to answer. Some of those I have

3:33:46sent forth already to go to PA and

3:33:49receive responses. But I think that even

3:33:52though the comments keep getting made

3:33:54that people can attend the JTO meetings,

3:33:58we know that that's probably not really

3:34:00a reality. And I think that since these

3:34:03taxpayer dollars that GoPA/JO

3:34:07is utilizing, they need to come before

3:34:10this governing body. And we need to be

3:34:12able to ask the questions in a

3:34:14transparent way that we need to ask. and

3:34:16I have never received a response on when

3:34:19that is going to happen.

3:34:21>> We haven't heard back from them, but I

3:34:23will follow up with that tomorrow and

3:34:24let you know. I'll I'll

3:34:26>> I'll make this request again tomorrow.

3:34:29>> Thank you.

3:34:33>> All right. Anything else on this issue?

3:34:36All right. If not, we're going to move

3:34:38on to public comment. But first, I'm

3:34:39going to make a motion to go beyond

3:34:4010:00. Can I get a second?

3:34:43>> Second.

3:34:43>> Second from council from Deputy Mayor

3:34:45Hoer. All those in favor say I.

3:34:48>> I. All those in favor opposed say no.

3:34:50>> No.

3:34:52>> Council member Ortiz is a no.

3:34:55>> With that we're going to move to public

3:34:57comment. First up I have Natalie Allen.

3:35:04>> I've actually signed up to talk um

3:35:07during the camera surveillance. So I

3:35:11don't understand. So, I feel bad that

3:35:14half of the people I wanted to address

3:35:16or some of the people I wanted to dress

3:35:18are not here. And then

3:35:22I mean this kind of as a joke, but also

3:35:24serious. You want to know my opinion on

3:35:27how to save some money in the budget?

3:35:28You could always get rid of the ALDRS.

3:35:32Um, so I'm a librarian by trade, so I

3:35:38thrive on cracked information.

3:35:41And the two gentlemen that were up here,

3:35:43the two police officers, I do respect

3:35:45them, but they were misinformed on a

3:35:48couple of facts on the camera

3:35:50surveillance. If you want to talk to

3:35:53Catchy Kansas, they will tell you that

3:35:56their police officers were not using the

3:35:59cameras for child traffic, for Amber

3:36:02Alerts, their silver alerts. They were

3:36:04using them to stalk women that the

3:36:05police officers found attractive and to

3:36:08see where they went.

3:36:10Um 54 US cities have canceled their

3:36:13flock contract contracts because of how

3:36:17they got them because they thought they

3:36:19were going to use them for Amber Alerts

3:36:20and Silver Alerts, but all they did was

3:36:22find out that they were being misused

3:36:24and that the camera surveillance system

3:36:26can't tell the difference between an O

3:36:28and a Zero. And that's your license

3:36:30plate or my license plate. That does

3:36:33matter.

3:36:35Um,

3:36:39>> sorry. I've never spoken in public

3:36:40before.

3:36:41>> You're fine. You're doing [laughter]

3:36:42good. You're doing fine.

3:36:44>> They do lead to an increase in dangerous

3:36:47police presence because of how if my car

3:36:51matches the description of somebody that

3:36:53committed a violent offense, then I have

3:36:57police officers that pull me over with

3:36:58their guns drawn. even though I'm just

3:37:00driving on my way to work.

3:37:03I don't appreciate them. I don't like

3:37:06them. I think that they are gross

3:37:10misjust

3:37:11misunderstanding of our privacy issues.

3:37:14And the CEO, Garrett Lingley

3:37:18of Flock cameras actually said that

3:37:20privacy is dead, which is why I wore my

3:37:22black dress because that's what you wear

3:37:23to a funeral. I don't want Topeka to be

3:37:27a city where privacy is dead.

3:37:29I don't want this for my citizens, for

3:37:32the women.

3:37:34And Russia hacked the camera

3:37:36surveillance system in 2025 and was

3:37:39giving it away to their allies.

3:37:43So, they are hackable in countries

3:37:45outside of us. That is not something

3:37:48that America, who celebrated 250 years

3:37:52of freedom, should be endorsing.

3:37:55I should be able to drive around and not

3:37:58fear that a cop is going to pull me over

3:38:02because my silver car matches a silver

3:38:05car that was also used for some crime. I

3:38:10should feel safe that police officers

3:38:13are not going to stalk me in my car.

3:38:17>> You still have a minute.

3:38:19But that is what I wanted to address and

3:38:22that is what the data has shown on what

3:38:24flop cameras get used for.

3:38:27Thank you.

3:38:28>> Thank you very much.

3:38:30Next up I have Joseph Lebar.

3:38:33[clears throat]

3:38:35>> Thank you.

3:38:40First, I want to thank the uh council

3:38:42mayor uh for uh these thoughtful things

3:38:46about slowing things down. So, when you

3:38:48get exact legal language, it's really

3:38:50important and especially timelines. Is

3:38:53this going to go on for 10 years,

3:38:562 years, 20 years into perpetuity? These

3:38:59are very important questions to answer.

3:39:01And I I I like the idea of town hall

3:39:02meetings where the public can come and

3:39:05and talk and raise questions and not

3:39:07just have a little group that gets

3:39:09together and makes a decision. Um

3:39:13I'm very concerned about the lack of

3:39:15progress on our construction projects.

3:39:19And before I begin, I I know you can't

3:39:23see this, but I showed this to the mayor

3:39:24earlier and I showed this to uh the

3:39:27manager last week, but we had this

3:39:29handout of uh Topeka Boulevard. And on

3:39:32the bottom are various consulting firms

3:39:35and engineering firms, and then we've

3:39:38got utilities. Now, here's public works.

3:39:40There's contact information. These are

3:39:42people that were handed this, but

3:39:44utilities is blank. I mean, it's

3:39:46utilities there, but I said, uh, don't

3:39:49you think that's a problem? Since

3:39:50they're about half the equation in

3:39:53these, uh, street constructions, they

3:39:55are very involved with water lines and

3:39:58different things. And if the contractors

3:40:01can't get a hold of them or they're not

3:40:02returning coals in a timely fashion,

3:40:05guess what? It slows the project down. I

3:40:09know that's been happening for about two

3:40:12years because I was asking a couple

3:40:14years ago when they started on Topeka

3:40:16Boulevard and I contacted one of the uh

3:40:19project firms that was private and they

3:40:22gave me answers. They said, "Yeah, we uh

3:40:24we couldn't get utilities to show up at

3:40:27the same time." Now, I want these

3:40:30problems solved. These are clearly in

3:40:32the manager's wheelhouse. This is his

3:40:35job, his staff's job to make sure that

3:40:38everything is flowing smoothly. You

3:40:40cannot tell what a project's doing if

3:40:42you don't get out of the office and

3:40:44actually write drive it once a week. And

3:40:48I think that's why the mess we why we've

3:40:52got the horrendous mess on Fairline. I

3:40:56think it was just let go and people

3:40:59weren't paying attention. And I started

3:41:01noticing I was chopping over there

3:41:03dealing. I said, "What's going on?

3:41:05There's no activity." And it was month

3:41:06after month. So I started asking

3:41:08questions. Of course, the neighbors were

3:41:10asking questions. What is going on? We

3:41:13know what's not going on. It's called

3:41:14construction. So one of the things that

3:41:17uh people were surveyed about earlier

3:41:21this year was, "Do you want more street

3:41:24repairs?" And of course, everybody said,

3:41:25"Sure. Yeah, of course I want more

3:41:28street repairs. The question they

3:41:30weren't asked is, do you want them to be

3:41:33just torn up and left open or you can't

3:41:36drive for months on a road like Topeka

3:41:40was done uh for 7 months with 21st and

3:41:44Topeka Boulevard uh like 29th was last

3:41:48year and now they I've been told they're

3:41:50shutting 29th down again. And you have a

3:41:53lot of merchants and people that pay

3:41:56tremendous amount of taxes and

3:41:58commercial rates for these streets to be

3:42:01open so they can get customers because

3:42:04the customers buy things creating jobs

3:42:06and creating sales tax. Remember we need

3:42:09sales tax. And so I don't understand how

3:42:13you can have this many projects going

3:42:15and expect to be successful especially

3:42:18this late in the year.

3:42:20We're running out of sunshine. For those

3:42:22who ever got to spend time on a farm,

3:42:25the farmers will say that we do not have

3:42:27more sunshine to to plant. We've got to

3:42:30get these crops in. We've got to get

3:42:32these roads done before the winter sets

3:42:34in. And I have a lot more ideas and I'm

3:42:37going to share them with uh the manager.

3:42:39I'm going to share them with uh

3:42:41different people over the next couple

3:42:42weeks how to speed it up. But we've got

3:42:45to work on this management. Thank you.

3:42:48>> Thank you. Next up, I have Reverend

3:42:51Julie Mcola.

3:43:04My girlfriend is right here.

3:43:06>> Okay. So, I hope I don't hit it.

3:43:24City Manager Dr. Perez, Mayor Duncan,

3:43:28City Council members, Topeka and

3:43:30surrounding area citizens both in person

3:43:33and online.

3:43:37I write this on Friday, September 25th.

3:43:42I read a couple of articles in the paper

3:43:45this morning of which I will make

3:43:47mention. The first one was about the

3:43:52increase in deaths among Topeka's

3:43:54homeless people. And it made me think of

3:43:57a concern I had wondered about through

3:44:00the heat of summer.

3:44:02I had raised a question with someone who

3:44:05I thought might know or would certainly

3:44:08be motivated to find out.

3:44:11But I never heard back anything back and

3:44:14I didn't

3:44:16p pursue it any further. My concern was

3:44:20partly stirred because I had seen an

3:44:24article that said that exposure to

3:44:27extreme heat can be even more dangerous

3:44:31than exposure to extreme cold.

3:44:34And I wondered if there were special

3:44:37cooling water stations set up for

3:44:40homeless people in the ne in extreme

3:44:43heat since from what I understand

3:44:48residents of shelters must be out during

3:44:51the day.

3:44:53I wondered how many of the homeless

3:44:56deaths this year could be attributed to

3:45:00overexposure to extreme heat and

3:45:04dehydration.

3:45:06I wondered,

3:45:08but I didn't push to get an answer to my

3:45:10question.

3:45:12There were surely increased needs this

3:45:15summer, but I didn't ask what was needed

3:45:19or what I could contribute.

3:45:22So, if anyone lost their lives this

3:45:25summer due to homelessness, if anyone

3:45:29might have been chased out of a business

3:45:32for trespassing when they may have just

3:45:36been trying to be in a place long enough

3:45:40to to hydrate and cool off, part of that

3:45:46is on me. Is part of it on you, too?

3:45:51I've had to do a lot of thinking about

3:45:54value and worth throughout my adulthood.

3:45:58How do we measure the worth of a life?

3:46:00Is it in the money we make, the wisdom

3:46:03to invest, or how much we can acquire?

3:46:07Is it in having enough security that we

3:46:10feel we could never fall into

3:46:12homelessness?

3:46:15What if we're b born without something

3:46:17that most of society seems to have?

3:46:21Does that take away from our value?

3:46:24While we're focusing on life value, I

3:46:28saw something else in the paper about a

3:46:30couple seeking help from the community

3:46:33to keep their mobile snack business

3:46:36going. Their van and equipment are at a

3:46:39point that they are breaking down a lot.

3:46:41The article mentioned that a homeless

3:46:43man stopped to help with a recent

3:46:46breakdown. This man no doubt had had

3:46:50plenty of problems of his own, but he

3:46:53saw a need that he might be able to meet

3:46:56and he stopped to help.

3:47:00Going back to the first article, Topeka

3:47:03lives lost in homelessness so far this

3:47:06year were celebrated. These folks were

3:47:09loved and remembered. Their lives

3:47:12touched the lives of others. Some of

3:47:14them had great successes in their lives.

3:47:18Whether they knew it or not, their lives

3:47:20mattered to someone.

3:47:23If I have any value, I don't want to

3:47:26lose it. And I don't want to see anyone

3:47:29forgotten. This matters to me because I

3:47:32love someone who has been homeless and a

3:47:35couple of people who I am concerned are

3:47:37homeless. Who matters to you? who

3:47:40matters to us. Thank you.

3:47:43>> Thank you.

3:47:46>> Next up, I have Marshall Barber. Is

3:47:49Marshall still here?

3:47:51Oh, there he is.

3:48:04Well, the hour grows late and I fear

3:48:06that I uh have a tendency to become a uh

3:48:10geyser of irrelevance, but I'll I'll do

3:48:13my best. First of all, during the

3:48:15discussion of cameras, I couldn't help

3:48:18but contemplate how photogenic I've

3:48:20become

3:48:22as as a result of celebrating my

3:48:25birthday by going to the Brink Salon and

3:48:31Color Bar with 14 highly trained

3:48:34stylists at 1309 South Kansas. I might

3:48:37add parenthetically,

3:48:40a business that has chosen to locate

3:48:43downtown for 14 years continuously.

3:48:46And uh as you as you can perhaps deduce

3:48:49from my personal appearance tonight,

3:48:50they do an excellent job. That's Brink

3:48:53Salon and Hair Color Bar 309 South

3:48:57Kansas. Now, I came here tonight ready

3:49:01to fulminate uh about this uh proposal

3:49:05to raise the sales tax, but I've kind of

3:49:08had an epiphany about this whole thing.

3:49:12Instead of grousing about, well, we go

3:49:15to 9.85 85 and then we add another10

3:49:20to go to 9.95

3:49:22and pretty soon we're chasing KBY Kansas

3:49:25around for the honor of being the city

3:49:27in Kansas that has the highest sales tax

3:49:30rate. KBY by the way is 12%. So if we

3:49:34could just add 0.5 to what's already

3:49:36been proposed, we could get into double

3:49:38figures and be right behind Colby. But

3:49:42like I said, I've had an epiphany. As as

3:49:45opposed to whining and complaining about

3:49:48the sales tax, I just have a couple of

3:49:50modest suggestions. Why don't we couch

3:49:53it in terms of more fun things to spend

3:49:57money on such as a new KBI building?

3:50:02Now, Topeka could become a bastion could

3:50:06become a bastion of affordable real

3:50:08estate. already is to a certain extent a

3:50:10bastion of affordable real estate.

3:50:13There's been national articles about

3:50:15this. But when people drive west on I70

3:50:20and get off on the 10th Street exit,

3:50:24what do they see?

3:50:26They see what looks like a bargain

3:50:28basement city. Not a city that they want

3:50:31to be part of. Let's make the gateway to

3:50:35Topeka along 10th Street as attractive

3:50:38as possible

3:50:40perhaps by doing everything we can as a

3:50:44city to support the idea of a new KBI

3:50:47building. Let's not forget the fact that

3:50:50in the Kansas legislature, there's a lot

3:50:53of people who would love to take the KBI

3:50:56building or or the KBI agency and move

3:51:00it somewhere else. There's a lot of guys

3:51:03in that legislature who hate they hate

3:51:06Topeka, they hate minorities, they hate

3:51:08government, they hate us, and they would

3:51:11love to to do something to hurt Topeka.

3:51:15So, let's not give them a chance. Let's

3:51:17do whatever we can to uh to to get that

3:51:22KBI thing going. Maybe add that to the

3:51:25language of this sales tax proposal. And

3:51:28on that sales tax proposal, it occurs to

3:51:31me, could we possibly rebrand it, make

3:51:34it sound like something that's fun?

3:51:37Maybe call it something like the Topeka

3:51:39Livability Initiative. Uh maybe try to

3:51:44rally the stakeholders in this town to

3:51:47to the idea of uh chipping in. And the

3:51:51last thing I might mention because I got

3:51:54nine seconds left, public safety and

3:51:57consolidation. Thank you.

3:51:59>> Thank you, sir.

3:52:02Next up, we have Jeff Fog.

3:52:11>> Good evening. Um Jeff Fog. I'm here

3:52:15speaking on today on behalf of Fieldline

3:52:18Residential Builders. I'm not here to

3:52:20make a speech. Permits are down. They've

3:52:22been down for 3 weeks. I laid off 22

3:52:26guys now, right? We're the controlling

3:52:29interest in Loring Bay now. We're

3:52:32getting ready to build there. All my

3:52:34investors do not want to be in Topeka.

3:52:38Called your office six times over two

3:52:41weeks. No response, not an email, not a

3:52:45voicemail, nothing. I have spoken to

3:52:47several council members. They've been

3:52:50very responsive.

3:52:51Our guys, I don't care about the profit.

3:52:54I don't care about the goals for next

3:52:55year. Care about any of that. I care

3:52:57about my guys. And my guys got laid off.

3:53:01No money, no permits, no digging. We got

3:53:04a stop work order. You know how

3:53:06insulting that is? A stop work order

3:53:09when y'all can't issue permits. That's

3:53:12crazy, right? like you can't give me a

3:53:15permit, but you're [snorts] going to

3:53:16tell me to stop working. So, I laid off

3:53:18seven guys. We laid off more today.

3:53:22Y'all are killing me. I don't know who

3:53:24put this new thing in program or who

3:53:27decided to do this program.

3:53:29We didn't hire Mr. Perez. We hired

3:53:32y'all. Y'all will be held accountable.

3:53:35We're going to move out of Topeka if we

3:53:37have to, and that's fine. There are

3:53:38places in Kansas. We don't even need

3:53:40permits. Love to build there. But I love

3:53:43Topeka. All my workers are from Topeka.

3:53:46We just invest in Lawrence Bay. We got

3:53:4970 houses going up in the next 18 months

3:53:51in Lawrence Bay. Actual affordable

3:53:54housing, right?

3:53:56How can I do that if I can't get a

3:53:58permit? I call down there. I get nine

3:54:02different answers from three different

3:54:03people depending on the time of day,

3:54:06whether they've had lunch or not.

3:54:08I do not want to blame the people that

3:54:10work down there. They're doing the best

3:54:12they can. They've always done great

3:54:14things. Every contractor I know right

3:54:17now is working without permits. That's a

3:54:20safety issue. There is literally no

3:54:22inspections going on for roofing,

3:54:25plumbing, electrical. Why? There's no

3:54:28permits, no way to call in for an

3:54:30inspection. I got four open trenches

3:54:32right now with sewer lines. I can't get

3:54:35the license or the permit or an

3:54:36inspection. So, we're just going to

3:54:38cover them up. Why? This is dumb. You

3:54:42know, get me some permits so I can

3:54:44build. We're building four houses on

3:54:46Southeast Belleview. If anybody wants to

3:54:48come down there, we're going to still be

3:54:50working. Y'all can arrest me if you

3:54:52want, but I got to build. I can't lay

3:54:55off the remaining four guys. I got

3:54:59Everybody needs construction workers and

3:55:01we're going to lose ours, right? I mean,

3:55:05no speech. Just I need some permits, you

3:55:08know.

3:55:09So anyway, that's all I got for y'all.

3:55:12>> Thank you.

3:55:15Next up, I have Cynthia Guerrero.

3:55:21Cynthia Guerrero still here.

3:55:26No, last call. Cynthia Guerrero.

3:55:30Next up, Henry Mccclure.

3:55:42That's a tough act to follow,

3:55:45but I tell you that that's the state of

3:55:47the state.

3:55:49Mo,

3:55:52when um Eisenhower

3:55:54decided we were going to have

3:55:56interstates,

3:55:57they dedicated a state law that said

3:56:00money now from the federal government is

3:56:03going to come into communities and

3:56:05everywhere. and and they gave the uh

3:56:08docking the order to to create the MO.

3:56:12Now we call it the MTPO.

3:56:15And uh I want to thank the guy that

3:56:17invited me to attend the meeting the

3:56:19other day.

3:56:21But uh the whole idea of the MO was to

3:56:25designate where the federal dollars were

3:56:28were uh coming into the community and

3:56:30the county was supposed to submit a CIP.

3:56:34The city was supposed to submit a CIP.

3:56:38The city did their work. The county

3:56:39never did. We wouldn't approve the

3:56:42transportation plan until the county

3:56:44finally

3:56:46um

3:56:49played by the federal guidelines.

3:56:51So what you do is you get the two CIPs

3:56:54in and then you have public involvement.

3:56:59Well, we were the first NO to ever have

3:57:02public involvement. And the minute we

3:57:05started making some efforts and trying

3:57:06to change, Vic Miller disbanded

3:57:10the the planning commission from the

3:57:12county side. I mean, that's why we have

3:57:16two planning commissions now. And the

3:57:18MTPO, I was there for the second

3:57:21question.

3:57:23I looked at the map of the MTPO. They

3:57:25had it gerrymandered around the cities

3:57:27in the county. Alurn, Willard, uh,

3:57:31Rosville.

3:57:33They don't even get to participate in

3:57:35the new way you've done it. It seems

3:57:37like anytime the public ever tries to

3:57:40come down here and make a change, the

3:57:43government does exactly the opposite to

3:57:46keep us out. It's a republic. Some

3:57:49people call it's not a democracy. We're

3:57:51a republic. You are representatives of

3:57:54our republic.

3:57:59Senate Bill 104 is the best example. The

3:58:01minute we wanted to uh try to get a

3:58:03citizens commission going so we could

3:58:06analyze

3:58:08whe whether we should consolidate our

3:58:10governments. Well, you guys, you nixed

3:58:13that faster than Kennedy got shot in

3:58:16Dallas.

3:58:18I'm telling you guys the go listen that

3:58:21guy

3:58:28the difference is between like that guy

3:58:31and me. We we're trying to build stuff

3:58:33in the community

3:58:35and the government every at every turn

3:58:40turns your your consolidation group that

3:58:44meets every 10 years. The guy was deaf.

3:58:48I mean, literally bringing new meaning

3:58:50to falling on deaf ears.

3:58:57We've got to consolidate our

3:58:59governments.

3:59:00Now, let's talk about this auditing

3:59:02thing because that's a smoke screen.

3:59:04I've proven to you right now how you can

3:59:07cancel GoPA's contract because of the

3:59:10charity. They can't give away money to

3:59:12where they're giving it. And you can't

3:59:15go back and erase it. There's no way to

3:59:18change the ballot issue. Why should we

3:59:21uh promote more sales tax when you don't

3:59:24live up to the ballot issue that we

3:59:26approved?

3:59:28This is going to be so easy to kill. And

3:59:31I think today it's the time people we're

3:59:34catching on to the pingpong ball between

3:59:35the city and the county. And uh I think

3:59:38the federal go, you know, they're

3:59:40putting a a call center out at uh or a

3:59:43data center out at Forbes.

3:59:46>> Can I have one minute?

3:59:47>> Nope. There's no extensions this evening

3:59:49due to the number of people we have

3:59:50signed up to speak.

3:59:52>> I expected that from you.

3:59:55>> I do treat everyone equally. Thank you

3:59:57for the acknowledgement of that.

4:00:00Next up, Miss Danielle Tremllo.

4:00:11I will keep it quick because actually um

4:00:14much of my comments were reiterated by

4:00:16many of you during um the sales tax

4:00:19discussion. Um you know just wanting to

4:00:22make sure that we keep in the forefront

4:00:24when we're talking about the budget as

4:00:26well. um that I haven't except for

4:00:28tonight heard a lot about trimming um

4:00:31some of that economic development money

4:00:33as we're asking departments to trim

4:00:35their funds um and citizens to pay more

4:00:38in taxes. So um I brought up once before

4:00:41that we have the opportunity to also um

4:00:44trim down the transient um guest tax and

4:00:47the amount of money we're giving um to

4:00:50visit Topeka. I believe it's a 9010

4:00:52split. We changed an ordinance in 2025

4:00:56capping their money to the revenue of

4:00:582025 and we were capturing the remainder

4:01:01revenue um to go to Hotel Topeka and pay

4:01:04that off. We absolutely within our

4:01:07authority um can increase that

4:01:09substantially for the next 3 to 5 years

4:01:12to pay down the hotel Topeka debt,

4:01:14reduce the interest that we are

4:01:16gathering on that uh free up the money

4:01:18with that from general funds that were

4:01:20paying that down. um which only seems

4:01:23reasonable. Um, additionally, I happened

4:01:26to go through 10 plus years of JADO

4:01:29minutes um recently looking for why Go

4:01:32Topeka has like a $13 million carryover

4:01:35fund. Um I suspected it was just from

4:01:38COVID time, but it was not. It was much

4:01:40earlier than that. But I found besides

4:01:44all of the same things we're talking

4:01:46about lead better and leone and everyone

4:01:49have been bringing up the fight since

4:01:50the inception about transparency with

4:01:53that goa money that um uh Winder Road

4:01:58came up which was um the CIP I happened

4:02:01to bring up a couple weeks ago um about

4:02:05a water man that randomly couldn't trace

4:02:07where it was going and why it was in a

4:02:10budget and then not in a budget. and

4:02:11then it's back in a budget. Um, and as a

4:02:13matter of fact, it was discussed for

4:02:16several years um, at the inception of

4:02:18Jedo. Um, because we got much large

4:02:22federal grant money um, to pay for that

4:02:26infrastructure and that water man along

4:02:27that area um, along with EPA dollars

4:02:31because we were developing that area for

4:02:33Home Depot, Target. We didn't know what

4:02:36was going in there at the time. We had

4:02:37just purchased that land to be an

4:02:39industrial zone. um and got a whole

4:02:41bunch of money and JATO money to build

4:02:44that infrastructure. Now I will say I

4:02:47think there was some discussion of

4:02:48increasing the pipe at some point um

4:02:51size but my point being are we also

4:02:54looking at how within JO um interlocal

4:02:58agreement it states that the holding

4:03:01amount for all the money needed to

4:03:03complete the economic development

4:03:05programs and identified infrastructure

4:03:07improvements and quality of life

4:03:09projects are ways that that money um can

4:03:12also continue to be used. So, if this

4:03:15was an economic development project from

4:03:18the get-go, are we looking at ways that

4:03:20we can be using um that JATO fund to

4:03:23continue some of these projects that we

4:03:25have going on? Um although I find it

4:03:27very confusing that we have so many

4:03:29sales tax that go to road projects and

4:03:32development and there's a whole lot more

4:03:34of that. So, that transparency piece is

4:03:36is really important. So we have lots of

4:03:38ways that we can also look at how we can

4:03:41be more resourceful with the money that

4:03:43we have um and use it more uh

4:03:46diligently. And I like a broken record,

4:03:48we'll just say one more time as everyone

4:03:50else um you know in absence of a CFO or

4:03:54even you know another person within um

4:03:58our financial department on the weight

4:04:00of um a proper auditing position that I

4:04:04do agree with um contracting for a

4:04:07forensic audit to look where we can free

4:04:10up even more funds. So thank you.

4:04:12>> Thank you.

4:04:14Next up, I have Lone Grace.

4:04:21[clears throat]

4:04:32Good evening, Mayor, City Council.

4:04:35Uh, I really just wanted to come and

4:04:38thank uh the city manager's office and

4:04:41the staff that was made available for

4:04:43the community impact measures. I don't

4:04:46think that people understand uh what

4:04:49that has the potential to do when you're

4:04:51looking at these public funded projects

4:04:53and affordable housing. And it was just

4:04:55a way of trying to make sure that uh you

4:04:58think about this community first when

4:04:59you're making these decisions.

4:05:02There are um

4:05:04probably some other things that are

4:05:07coming up and of course I also want to

4:05:09thank Miss Quimllo for adding her

4:05:12comments and input as well as the

4:05:14committee that listened to us on the

4:05:17discussion and the council who led it

4:05:19move forward. Now that that's sort of

4:05:21sitting to the side as a a pillar for

4:05:23workforce development, going to try to

4:05:25work on some of the other areas I think

4:05:27that Councilman Kell had mentioned on

4:05:29far as uh uh increasing the opportunity

4:05:32for our local small businesses, local

4:05:35small emergency b businesses.

4:05:38Mr. Jefferson had gave a lot of legal

4:05:41ease and I think uh council uh deputy

4:05:44city manager Mr. Mr. Copley, he had

4:05:47mentioned you know some of the

4:05:50roadblocks of thinking about how we can

4:05:53do something but I had shared with you

4:05:57all something probably several weeks ago

4:06:00that I'm hoping that can be consider in

4:06:03consideration. Uh hopefully Mr.

4:06:05hopefully because I see that you're

4:06:07leaving that this is would be one extra

4:06:10task that you can look into that uh that

4:06:14can also create some type of a pillar

4:06:16for that other side for the contractors

4:06:19local businesses to work on these public

4:06:22funded projects. And so I really just I

4:06:25came here on February 10th with 10

4:06:27questions August 18th you did the

4:06:31community impact measures. That's what I

4:06:32call progress. um whoever the nonprofits

4:06:36are working with those organizations

4:06:38hopefully we can get them informed so

4:06:40that whoever becomes the city's

4:06:42negotiator you know this community

4:06:45impact measures gives a negotiating tool

4:06:48you know as long as they are negotiating

4:06:49for the city with a community first

4:06:51perspective I feel that we're going to

4:06:53be getting some wins if you could move

4:06:56on and make a decision on what I had

4:06:58submitted earlier for uh or earlier for

4:07:02the uh business portion of it before the

4:07:05beginning of the year. Uh that would

4:07:06give those organizations who are sort of

4:07:09the small business uh support

4:07:11organizations to work with these

4:07:13policies and see what can we do so that

4:07:16when a company says, "Yeah, we're

4:07:19interested in some training of local

4:07:20people. What do you have?" You know,

4:07:22city employees are not going to have the

4:07:24answers. Maybe it's just a brochure that

4:07:26they slide across to the table that

4:07:28shares where the training programs, who

4:07:31the contacts are in different things.

4:07:32So, the job isn't over yet, but I did

4:07:35want to uh take the time to publicly

4:07:38thank the city and the staff, you know,

4:07:40for taking time with that, and I hope

4:07:42that uh they'll take the same time and

4:07:44effort for what I also presented to you

4:07:47for consideration on the other side.

4:07:51Thank you.

4:07:52>> Thank you.

4:07:54That is everyone, I have signed up for

4:07:55public comment this evening.

4:07:59All right, with that we will move on to

4:08:02announcements.

4:08:05City clerk

4:08:06>> for the October 13th agenda. We have

4:08:08three presentations. The first one is on

4:08:10the fiscal year 2027 through 2030

4:08:13strategic plan. Second is the planned

4:08:16MTAa data center. The third one is the

4:08:19island annexation overview. On the

4:08:21consent agenda, we have approval of the

4:08:232026 um to 2028 labor agreement for Ask

4:08:26Me Water Union. Uh action includes

4:08:29approval of the 2027 special alcohol and

4:08:32drug funding recommendations and the

4:08:34non-action items included discussion on

4:08:36the strategic plan. Um continued

4:08:39discussion on sales tax initiative.

4:08:43>> All right, city manager.

4:08:46>> Nothing tonight, sir. Thank you,

4:08:49>> Council Member Ortiz.

4:08:52>> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. It's late. It's

4:08:55time to go home. But before we do, I

4:08:57just want to say October is National

4:09:00Fire Prevention Month. And city manager,

4:09:02I hope that um my good police chief or

4:09:06fire chief would come up and give us a

4:09:08little tit for tat. He's not here

4:09:10tonight. He can do it tomorrow or next

4:09:12meeting.

4:09:13>> He was here. He can do he can prepare

4:09:16himself and do it for next

4:09:18>> that the next council meeting. But I

4:09:21will remind everybody to get your smoke

4:09:23alarms. Um I will be bringing

4:09:25applications to the next meeting to pass

4:09:27out and we really need to push these to

4:09:30help. As you've heard, we need two fire

4:09:32stations. We need to really help our

4:09:35guys um especially in different parts of

4:09:39the neighborhoods. But, you know, I'm

4:09:41going to throw I'm going to throw

4:09:42District 9 in there because they don't

4:09:43have a fire station in in their area.

4:09:46So, if we can um if we could do that,

4:09:49get those passed out and get some fire

4:09:52um alarms up, that would help them. Um

4:09:56they always have a a little quote

4:09:59in the um every year, a little theme,

4:10:01and it is charge into fire safety. Safe

4:10:05charging is a superpower.

4:10:08And it says, "Councilman Banks, don't

4:10:11plug up your phone and go to sleep. Make

4:10:13sure that you're awake and don't put it

4:10:15on the couch when you got it plugged

4:10:17in." But you probably already know that.

4:10:20All right. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

4:10:22>> Council member Banks.

4:10:25>> Tough.

4:10:26>> If Thank you, Mayor. If the chief can't

4:10:29be here, I'll give the fire education

4:10:31message. I did it for over a decade. So,

4:10:36>> why don't why don't you just plan on

4:10:37doing that?

4:10:38>> [laughter]

4:10:39>> Well, I have to ask for compensation.

4:10:43>> Nothing tonight, Mr. Mayor. Thank you.

4:10:45>> All right, Council Member Kell.

4:10:49>> This past weekend, uh, Saturday night, I

4:10:53was privileged to be a part of the, uh,

4:10:54celebrity waiter suare held by Childcare

4:10:57Aware of Eastern Kansas.

4:10:59uh they last year and this year they've

4:11:02had me kind of help run the silent

4:11:03auction and the auctions side of things

4:11:05and it's really fun. But it's a great

4:11:08organization that helps uh find child

4:11:10care and do uh do a lot of things with

4:11:13child care. But the biggest thing that

4:11:15they do is they with with the lack of

4:11:18child care, it doesn't just affect the

4:11:20household. It affects businesses. that

4:11:22affects our economy with uh people not

4:11:24be able to get to work with people not

4:11:27be out when they have to stay home and

4:11:28not be able to work if they want to.

4:11:30They aren't able to earn which hurts the

4:11:33spending. So, um they're an organization

4:11:36that's my wife and I used when we were

4:11:38when we were younger when our girls were

4:11:40younger, but uh it's an organization I'm

4:11:42proud to be a part of and work with and

4:11:44hopefully can continue to work with them

4:11:46in the future. Uh thank you.

4:11:48>> Thank you, Council Member Miller.

4:11:50>> Nothing, Mayor. Thank you,

4:11:52>> Council Member Bradberry.

4:11:53>> Nothing.

4:11:55>> Council member McGee.

4:11:56>> Uh, I don't have anything.

4:11:58>> Deputy Mayor Hoer.

4:12:00>> Nothing tonight.

4:12:01>> Council member Hiller,

4:12:04>> repeat nothing.

4:12:06>> Council member Vald Divial.

4:12:08>> Thanks, Mayor. Just wanted to remind

4:12:11folks that know and those that don't

4:12:14know that on Saturday, this coming

4:12:16Saturday, October 10th, from 11 to 3 uh

4:12:21p.m. at the Oakland Community Center,

4:12:23the Oakland neighborhood will be

4:12:25celebrating its 100year annexation.

4:12:29Uh 1926 is when the community annex

4:12:34requested annexation into Topeka. We are

4:12:37going to have the uh Oakland NIA has

4:12:40been working really really hard with

4:12:42getting all kinds of activities um and

4:12:46vendors

4:12:47um and history

4:12:50uh of the annexation and of the

4:12:52community. So all are invited to attend.

4:12:55Also, I just wanted to speak real

4:12:57briefly on the Lyman Street uh issues

4:13:01that continue to uh the sidewalk issues

4:13:05that continue to plague us a little bit.

4:13:08Uh last night was a long NIA meeting.

4:13:12Uh, I do want to thank public works

4:13:15director Jason Tryion for being out

4:13:17there and fielding a number of questions

4:13:20and for the continued work to try to get

4:13:22the miscommunication

4:13:25that I think has plagued this project

4:13:28for a little bit uh settled and dealing

4:13:32with some challenges with the third

4:13:34party contractor. It is good to know

4:13:37that there are fines being levied where

4:13:39needed so that contractors know we are

4:13:42serious about when these lags or these

4:13:45inefficiencies are occurring. So, uh, I

4:13:49just want to tell the folks out there in

4:13:51that side of town that, uh, if you

4:13:54continue to have issues, continue to

4:13:57need to let me know or Jensen Triumph

4:14:00through public works because, uh,

4:14:02everything is trying to get resolved as

4:14:05soon as possible, taking into account

4:14:07the large amount of rain that we've had.

4:14:09Thank you, mayor.

4:14:10>> Thank you. Uh, I have nothing this

4:14:13evening. However, we do have a need for

4:14:15an executive session. May I say one

4:14:17thing really quickly? My mother and I

4:14:19responded for public comment

4:14:22late. I just want to acknowledge that

4:14:23we've been here and we're waiting, but I

4:14:26would much rather we all get to go home.

4:14:27So,

4:14:28>> can you tell me how you submitted that

4:14:29request?

4:14:30>> Um, we got uh we submitted it through

4:14:32email and we both got confirmation back

4:14:34for general public comments.

4:14:35>> That's the fourth one this evening. So,

4:14:37we'll we'll talk about that. I am very

4:14:39sorry about that. There's clearly an

4:14:41issue today. All right. With that, we

4:14:43have a need for an executive session. If

4:14:45the city attorney would state the

4:14:46motion,

4:14:48>> the motion would be to recess into

4:14:50executive session to exceed 15 minutes

4:14:52to give legal advice and discuss cases

4:14:55currently in litigation and other

4:14:57matters deemed privileged under the

4:14:58attorney client privilege as allowed

4:15:01under KSA75-4319B2.

4:15:05The open meeting will resume in this

4:15:07room in the governing body chambers and

4:15:08the following staff will be necessary to

4:15:10assist the governing body in its

4:15:12deliberations. the city attorney and

4:15:14other staff members as needed.

4:15:16>> Uh I will move to approve. Do I have a

4:15:18second?

4:15:19>> Second.

4:15:19>> Second from deputy mayor. All those in

4:15:21favor say I.

4:15:23>> I. All those opposed say no.

4:15:24>> No.

4:15:25>> Council member Ortiz and Miller are nos.

4:15:27With that we will go immediately into

4:15:29executive session.

4:15:30>> You sure are eventually getting a

4:15:32majority on that.

4:15:38>> All right. We have come out of executive

4:15:40session. No action is to be taken by

4:15:42this governing body. That concludes our

4:15:44meeting this evening. And at 10:36 p.m.

4:15:46we are adjourned.