2026-10-01 - Board of Zoning Adjustment

15:18I think that the that the uh they would

15:20have tried to figure that out before

15:21they got it uh the feasibility before

15:23they got it got it uh got it approved

15:26for a subdivision. So it it can be used

15:30for residential. Um it's just

15:34not you know they're not proposing that

15:36now. But I got some questions for you

15:37about the um layout. I know that parking

15:40in the rear is what uh um is what the

15:42overlay requires. So, how are they going

15:45to get are they are the entry doors on

15:47going to be on the front?

15:49There will be um entry doors on the back

15:53and in the front. And what I discussed

15:56with the owner is

15:58they would both enter into a central

16:01area where the cashier is. And so they

16:05so they could monitor both both

16:08entrances. So your your drive up traffic

16:11will be from the rear and your walk up

16:13traffic will be from the front.

16:14>> Okay. And you mentioned um loading and

16:17deliveries. That's that real concern to

16:19me. Um I was out there yesterday and I

16:23was on the uh um on the Parkway side,

16:25east Parkway side, and I measured the

16:27the road. It was right at 18 1/2 ft or

16:30so. Um and there was a truck that was

16:33unloading um for the construction of

16:36work on the park and there was no way

16:39that any car could get past that truck.

16:42And then on the other side on the uh um

16:44border side I measured about 23 feet.

16:47And so a truck is 86 wide or trailer's

16:5086 wide plus plus mirrors and such. And

16:53then with the turns internal in the

16:55neighborhood um

16:58how is a truck supposed to unload and

16:59not have an impact on the neighborhood

17:01and traffic? The um truck will be at the

17:04building rear and that alley is a public

17:08alley, but there's no no one using it

17:11currently except

17:14the um well, we're not really using the

17:16alley, but our drive will be in the rear

17:19and it's dedicated for this building

17:20only. So, it will not impact

17:25uh traffic on either of the side roads.

17:27>> Uh does the business um would they get

17:29their deliveries? Are they full full

17:31size 53 ft?

17:32>> It's panel trucks. It's not tractal

17:34trailers.

17:35>> All right. That's what Excuse me. That's

17:38what I wanted to know. Let's see if I

17:40got anything else.

17:44>> You mentioned the uh um a nice looking

17:47building.

17:49These variances are sight plan specific.

17:51Site plan specific. And you didn't give

17:53any um any renderings or or any details

17:57of construction materials and such. And

17:59I'm assuming that if they did the staff

18:03if the applicant did um present some

18:06drawings with with some specifications

18:08on the building and aesthetics,

18:10elevations that that could be specific

18:13as well for the approval, not just site

18:16plan.

18:19>> Jim,

18:22I don't know. I'm just asking. Uh, I

18:24know that the board has placed

18:25conditions on approvals before, uh,

18:28similar to the bank downtown. There was

18:29a condition placed on that special

18:31exception that it be a certain number of

18:32stories tall and that the exterior be

18:35brick. Um, the the Spring Hill overlay

18:38regulations do have several requirements

18:40as to the design of the structure and

18:42the applicant has stated that they will

18:44comply with that regulations with those

18:46regulations. Um, so I'm not sure. I

18:50would have to defer to legal as to any

18:52other conditions that could be placed on

18:54there.

18:54>> And I and I looked through the overlay

18:56yesterday and I didn't see any of those

18:58specifics um on the design criteria.

19:00>> They they do have specifics.

19:01>> What are those? Um,

19:02>> for instance, u the the ground floor,

19:07which we only have one floor, 12 to 18

19:10ft height,

19:11>> right? We um got a face hole shell. 50%

19:17of the facade must be windows. Um

19:23door space no more than 50 ft apart. Uh

19:2725% minimum of the primary facade must

19:32uh provide uh cover for pedestrians.

19:36>> Yeah, I've read all those. I'm familiar

19:38with those. But what um although you

19:39can't be held to it, what type of

19:41materials uh would be the on the

19:43exterior of the building? Um I haven't I

19:45would think that if I lived in the

19:47neighborhood, I'd want to know.

19:49>> The the owner and I have discussed it

19:52briefly, but have have not proceeded

19:55into that. But it would be a permanent

19:57it would be brick or, you know, some

20:00type of masonry. I would imagine,

20:02especially with the building

20:03configuration, it'll probably be masonry

20:06bearing walls and bar joist and

20:09>> Yeah, cuz it's a strange strange shape

20:11for a building.

20:12>> Yeah, the lot is uh I think I was quoted

20:15in the paper or the news last time about

20:19saying the lot was kind of like shaped

20:21like one of my kids squishy toys when

20:23they were kids. But but uh that's the

20:26truth. It's a it's a unusual shaped lot.

20:30All right, those are my questions. Thank

20:31you. Anything else from the board?

20:34>> Nope.

20:35>> Well, you said something about uh

20:38delivery trucks. We got photos from

20:40people in emails that showed 18-wheeler

20:43trucks in the parking lot delivering

20:45goods to the food pack.

20:47>> My my understanding is the owner can ask

20:50and will ask for the deliveries and

20:52panel trucks. So the other location is

20:57right off old shell and it's a little

20:58more

21:00you know it can handle that a little

21:03better.

21:06>> Is that it?

21:07>> Thank you.

21:09>> Thank you vice chair.

21:10>> Yes. I would like to, you know, bring up

21:12once again that that documentation was

21:14submitted showing compliance for reduced

21:16parking, tree planting, landscaping area

21:18variances and so those requests are mute

21:21and so just remind everybody that this

21:22is just simply a use variance.

21:25>> Okay.

21:26>> Thank you.

21:26>> Yes.

21:28>> All right. Is there anyone in the

21:28audience would like to speak in favor of

21:30the application?

21:37>> I guess that's a no. How about um

21:38against it? one or two.

21:51>> Yeah. Yeah, I'll mention that.

21:54>> Sorry.

21:56Good afternoon.

21:58My name is Kelly Myers and I live at

22:004270 Horowester Court, just 250 ft from

22:04the proposed site. 25 years ago, my

22:07husband and I and some neighbors started

22:09a nonprofit to raise funds to build a

22:11playground and redevelop Labrada Park.

22:13During that time, I met many neighbors

22:15in Country Club Village and helped them

22:17to start their civic organization. Since

22:20then, I've remained active in the

22:21organization, the neighborhood, and the

22:23surrounding area. Some of the neighbors

22:26have asked me to speak today to

22:28specifically communicate some of their

22:30feelings.

22:32Two to three years ago, Mrs. Taji came

22:35to a Country Club Village meeting to

22:37inform neighbors that they had purchased

22:39the property at 570 Old Shell Road and

22:41wanted to build a super food pack. Many

22:44questions were asked about their plans

22:45on the lot and about what they were

22:47doing with the current property and the

22:49two-story brick building they own next

22:51to it. Overall, neighbors communicated

22:54that they did not want an additional

22:55commercial development on that lot.

22:57Around the same time, we learned that

23:00parks and recreation department had

23:01received a grant and LVetta Park was

23:04chosen as a site for pickleball courts.

23:06Construction began and neighbors were

23:08very unhappy. That feeling has persisted

23:11with neighbors as they dealt with added

23:13noise, increased traffic, and more

23:16outsiders flowing in and out of the

23:18neighborhood. The city continues to work

23:21to resolve some of those issues, but

23:22ultimately neighbors continue to feel

23:25like they did not have a say in

23:27something that was impacted that has

23:29impacted the neighborhood and their

23:31quality of life. In early 2026, Maheen

23:35asked me to help her to gain

23:37community support for a proposed housing

23:39development. And I've given some photos.

23:43um

23:46they had a contract to sell the property

23:47to a developer and that was contingent

23:49on him receiving that approval for

23:51subdivision application from the

23:53planning commission. [snorts] I met with

23:55him, we set up meetings. He presented to

23:57the neighbors. Uh they were able to ask

23:59questions, voice concerns. Overall,

24:02there were some neighbors who um were

24:05not 100% happy with the scale of the

24:07project, but everyone was in agreement

24:09that they would rather have residential

24:11development over commercial development

24:13and supported it, sent in emails, and

24:16the plan, the application was approved

24:18unanimously on March 19th. On March 5th,

24:21the developer called to say that the

24:23Hijazis had pulled the contract. We were

24:25all very disappointed.

24:28Not long after, Maheen called to ask

24:30that I support them building a super

24:32food pack on the property. I told her

24:34that I fully supported the residential,

24:36but that I 100% opposed any commercial

24:38development and that the neighbors felt

24:40the same. I reminded her that every

24:42other attempt to reszone had been fought

24:44and denied.

24:47Everyone supports Food Pack as a

24:49business, but most neighbors in the

24:50surrounding area do not support adding

24:52an additional commercial development.

24:54They are already unhappy with the pickle

24:56ball courts and all of the added noise,

24:58traffic, and people. The possible

25:00addition of another commercial

25:02development into this neighborhood just

25:04heightens those feelings. The latest

25:06rendering shows that the Haj Hajis plan

25:08to use the city's alleyway for their

25:10drive and to give more space for parking

25:12and delivery trucks. There are four

25:14homes on the other side of that alleyway

25:16and those residents will absolutely see

25:18an increase in noise from the cars and

25:20offloading delivery trucks. customers

25:23coming and going and trash disposal

25:25having more light from security lighting

25:27and a commercial dumpster

25:29or not [snorts] at their backyards will

25:32at a minimum be very unpleasant. They

25:35will experience a loss of privacy,

25:36peace, quality of life, and home values.

25:39There is a city-owned parking lot in

25:41front of this property. That parking lot

25:43was built to provide a safe area for

25:46families, school buses. You'd be amazed

25:48by how many school buses and community

25:49vans we have come to the park.

25:52um to safely load and unload excited

25:56children to walk across Parkway East to

25:59enter the park. Before it was there,

26:01people parked along the street, creating

26:03a hazard for kids and passing cars.

26:06While it may be used at times by others,

26:08that lot is there is not there for

26:11business parking. with the proposed

26:13building entrance adjacent to the

26:16playground lot. Their customers will

26:18certainly assume that it is available to

26:21them. When there is not room open,

26:23visitors to the playground will end up

26:25parking on the street. Additionally, we

26:28worry about their delivery trucks. They

26:30do get 18-wheelers and box trucks

26:33accessing Parkway East because that

26:36drive for the alleyway now they have

26:38redesigned it so that it stretches from

26:40border east to Parkway East.

26:43Um

26:45it's worrisome that it will have access

26:46to Parkway East where those children

26:48cross between the playground and the

26:50parking lot. There are no traffic lights

26:52on Parkway East and Border Drive East.

26:54I've enclosed also the photos of the

26:56trucks that deliver to um Maple Street

26:59Biscuit and how um that is a narrow

27:03street and it already creates a problem

27:05for maneuvering through there. Neighbors

27:08already struggle to maneuver through

27:10these narrow streets, especially on

27:12delivery days for Maple Street because

27:14the streets are so tight. The Maple

27:16Street business delivery trucks pull

27:18onto Border Drive East, park, and

27:20unload, and then they have to back out

27:22onto Old Shell Road because they are

27:24unable to navigate the streets within

27:26the neighborhood. Adding another

27:28business will only compound the issues

27:29at these entrances. Neighbors already

27:32feel as if they had no say in the

27:34construction of the pickle ball courts

27:35and the resulting impact on the

27:37neighborhood. Please don't let this be a

27:39similar instance. In the planning

27:41commission meeting two weeks ago, Kenny

27:43Nichols noted that within the

27:44surrounding, 1400 feet of this site, 87%

27:48of the received feedback was in

27:49opposition. While neighbors hate the

27:52thought of food pack leaving, overall

27:55they do not want another commercial

27:56development in the neighborhood.

28:00>> That was perfect.

28:00>> Good timing. Good timing. [laughter]

28:03Did you practice that in the mirror?

28:05>> I sure.

28:07>> Thank you.

28:09All right. Anyone else?

28:11>> Yeah, I'm sorry. Um, question to the

28:13board. Ma'am Kelly.

28:15>> Yes.

28:15>> Could you come back, please? I'm sorry.

28:20>> Say, what organization did you

28:21represented?

28:22>> I'm sorry.

28:23>> What organization do you represent?

28:24>> I'm representing myself as a homeowner

28:26across from this site. Um, I don't I'm

28:29not here to represent an organization.

28:31But I thought I heard you said that a

28:33number of the residents

28:34>> the neighborhood country club village

28:36has a neighborhood association that they

28:38refer to as the country club village

28:39civic association and I have been

28:42involved with that um at the point where

28:45we helped to create it 25 years ago.

28:47It's kind of had its um ups and downs

28:51and active unactive times but I've been

28:54involved with it and I'm currently still

28:56involved with it. So, how many of those

28:59members approve or disapprove of this

29:01project?

29:07>> Well, we a good number of people I'll

29:10say this, I have been the public face of

29:12this and I've taken the beatings online

29:15from people and a lot of neighbors feel

29:19like they can't speak up because they're

29:21going to get attacked. Um but there is a

29:24a large number of people especially on

29:27this side of the neighborhood where this

29:28is being proposed who are opposed to

29:31this.

29:32>> Okay. Have you all talked to each other?

29:35Both parties talked to each other had

29:37meetings with each other in regards to

29:38this matter.

29:39>> Yes.

29:40>> The project people with the project and

29:42I have had conversations. Um we've

29:44talked I know that Maheen has met with

29:47Linda St. John with Village of Spring

29:49Hill. We've talked back and forth trying

29:51to think of alternatives, but from the

29:54start when this was first brought up two

29:56years ago, we expressed that we did not

29:59support commercial development there.

30:01We've never in the 25 years I've lived

30:03there, we've never

30:05um

30:07never pushed for commercial development

30:09there. We've always fought against it

30:12and it's been denied up until this

30:14point.

30:15>> Okay. Thank you,

30:16>> Kelly. What was the statistic you said

30:18about the 87%? I think that may help.

30:20>> Within 1,400

30:22ft or 1400 radius, I guess, of the site,

30:2787% of the emails they received were in

30:30opposition to this.

30:33>> Thank you.

30:33>> Thank you.

30:37Next.

30:42Hey, my name is Kyle Ankerson and I live

30:45at 159 Border Drive West in Country Club

30:47Village. Uh, as my co-presenters will

30:50establish, there is no public need for a

30:52residential variance here. Nor is there

30:54hardship inherent to this 46 acre

30:57residential lot. The applicant even had

31:00a contract in place to sell this lot to

31:01a residential home bu home builder,

31:03proving it has clear residential

31:05utility. I'm here to address the third

31:08legal standard before you, the severe

31:09negative impact the proposed use

31:11variance will inflict on our immediate

31:13neighbors and community. Two weeks ago,

31:16the planning commission evaluated this

31:17parcel and unanimously denied commercial

31:20development. They specifically found the

31:22commercial use at 550 570 Old Shell Road

31:26is incompatible with surrounding land

31:28uses, adversely impacts neighborhood

31:31neighboring properties, and causes a

31:33direct loss in residential property

31:34values. The human impact on our

31:37neighbors makes those findings crystal

31:39clear. Flawed assumptions about

31:41walkability and traffic impact. The

31:44applicant often argues that the customer

31:46simply walk to their store, claiming a

31:48new building won't increase traffic.

31:50This assumption is deeply flawed. Their

31:52current store operates with an existing

31:54parking lot and even now it gets big

31:56busy with vehicular traffic. A brand new

31:59expanded 6,500 ft² facility will

32:02inherently generate new interest, draw

32:04customers from outside the immediate

32:06neighborhood, and significantly increase

32:08vehicular traffic. We don't have to

32:10guess what happens when commercial

32:12operations squeeze into this area. We

32:15are already living it. An 18-year

32:17resident living at Border Drive East,

32:19directly across the

32:21directly across from this site, shared

32:23what happens during busy days at nearby

32:25Maple Street. customer traffic

32:28completely overflows their lot and fills

32:30the liberator parking lot. Need talking

32:34too much. Uh it gets so congested that

32:36park visitors are forced to park along

32:38the fence and home owners regularly have

32:41to ask commercial customers to stop

32:43parking in their private front yards.

32:45adding a major new commercial attractant

32:48which explicitly plans to use the public

32:51park parking lot and the storef faces

32:54the parking the city parking lot

32:57um will turn this existing parking

32:59nightmare into a daily reality for

33:00surrounding homeowners. Under this site

33:03plan, residents stepping out their front

33:04doors will look directly at an act an

33:06active unloading dock, commercial

33:08parking, headlights and delivery trucks.

33:12physical site constraints and safety

33:13risk. At just46 acres, this site is

33:17simply too constrained. The site plan

33:19explicitly marks future expansion zone

33:21next to the 6,500 ft building, proving

33:24this commercial footprint is designed to

33:26grow even larger. It pushes 18 parking

33:29spaces and delivery operations along the

33:31narrow 20ft alleyway directly against

33:33residential backyards on lots 9, 10, 11,

33:36and 12. It routes commercial traffic

33:38down Parkway East, creating severe

33:40hazards at the pedestrian crossing where

33:42children and families walk to the Letta

33:44Park. VI viable commercial alternatives

33:48exist. Opposing a variance on this

33:50residential lot does not mean opposing

33:51food packs business. Less than a mile

33:53down the road sits 5559 Old Shell Road,

33:57a 1.39 acre lot already zoned commercial

33:59and listed for sale. At three times the

34:02size of this parcel, it offers ample

34:04room for full vision, proper parking,

34:06setbacks, loading docks, while remaining

34:09completely walkable to Spring Hill in

34:10South Alabama.

34:12A use variance is meant to prevent a

34:14property from becoming useless, not to

34:17force a massive commercial buildout onto

34:19a46 acre residential lot based on

34:22speculative assumptions about food foot

34:24traffic. We respectfully ask the board

34:27of adjustments to protect our

34:28residential community, uphold the

34:30unanimous findings of the planning

34:31commission and deny this application for

34:34use variance. Thank you.

34:37>> Thank you. Any questions board

34:40gentlemen? Thank you.

34:50>> Linda St. John, 320 Avalon Street. I am

34:53president of the village of Spring Hill.

34:56There are several reasons why this

34:57application for a 6,500 square foot

35:00grocery store with plans for future

35:02expansion does not demonstrate the

35:04hardship required to justify use

35:06variance. Nor does it establish that the

35:09proposed use will not adversely affect

35:11the surrounding properties. The

35:13applicant has not demonstrated a

35:15hardship showing the property cannot

35:17reasonably be used under its current

35:19zoning. On the contrary, as others have

35:22said, in March, the planning commission

35:24approved a cottage style residential

35:26development on the same property,

35:30confirming that the viable use exists

35:32under the R1 zoning. The developer is

35:35still willing to revisit this

35:37residential development if this

35:38application is denied. There are

35:41suitable vacant properties in the area

35:42that exist without reszoning or changing

35:45the use of this residential property. I

35:48met with the applicant and connected

35:50them with commercial property owners and

35:52who have identified several alternative

35:55locations not far from this area in the

35:57village appropriately zoned B2. The

36:01applicant knowingly purchased property

36:03zoned R1 in a community with an

36:05established 21-year-old master plan,

36:08creating a self-imposed hardship. An

36:11attempt to change its use after purchase

36:14to an adverse development should not

36:16override the established zoning or use

36:19at an expense of a community plan or the

36:21adjacent residential properties. The

36:24proposed change would adversely affect

36:26the residential character of the area.

36:28During the planning commission meeting

36:30last month, it was stated that

36:31approximately 87% of the residents

36:34responding to the reszoning application

36:37opposed this property being reszoned B2

36:39for a 6,500 ft grocery store that may

36:43not even be viable in the future. Other

36:46concerns include an increased commercial

36:48activity, noise, traffic, and safety

36:51next to a children's park. The

36:53application was unanimously denied by

36:55the planning commission. This property

36:58is not located on Old Shell Road. It is

37:01the first lot in the Country Club

37:03Village neighborhood between Border

37:05Drive East and Parkway East. The

37:07proposed ingress and egress would route

37:10traffic and truck deliveries through

37:11both streets at the back of the building

37:13inside the residential neighborhood

37:15rather than directly onto Old Shell

37:17Road. The site plan shows no parking in

37:20the front. We always advocate for on

37:22street parking because our plan calls

37:25for on street parking because these

37:27properties are developed to the back of

37:29the sidewalks on on roadways, not in

37:32neighborhoods.

37:34The site plan shows no parking in the

37:36front and no provisions for dumpsters.

37:38No other property in the area along Old

37:40Shell Road is zoned for business, making

37:42this request a significant departure

37:45from the existing pattern of residential

37:47development in the area. Our master plan

37:50is a carefully considered community

37:53vision, not a suggestion or an obstacle

37:55to be overcome when a particular

37:57development does not fit. It established

38:00that the future of our community should

38:02be guided by a plan created with the

38:05community, not dictated by the

38:07developers seeking exception to

38:09accommodate projects that do not belong.

38:12This application is an obvious attempt

38:15to circumvent the planning commission's

38:16denial for reasonzoning. It is not a

38:19simple request to change the use of one

38:21parcel of property for a popular grocery

38:24store. If approved, it would set a

38:28precedent that commercial development

38:30could encroach inside neighborhoods in

38:32similar areas of Spring Hill by using

38:34the board of adjustments to change the

38:36use. This would not only undermine the

38:39village of Spring Hill master plan, but

38:41the master plan for the city as well,

38:43compromising the long-term vision these

38:46plans are designed to accomplish. One of

38:49the speakers in favor of resoning at the

38:51planning commission meeting last month

38:53stated how good Spring Hill was looking.

38:55I can assure you the reason for this is

38:57that our organization has been

38:59successful over the last 21 years with

39:02the support of the city and this board

39:04in defeating many attempts such as this

39:07one from compromising our plan, allowing

39:09us to successfully build it out in

39:12increments over time. We support

39:14responsible growth and work with

39:16developers to put projects in

39:17appropriate locations. But we will not

39:20support development that disregards the

39:22village of Spring Hill master plan,

39:24compromises our neighborhoods, or

39:25changes the fundamental character of our

39:28community for the benefit of a single

39:30project that may not even be viable in

39:32the future. We simply cannot allow

39:34non-compliant, inappropriate, and

39:37invasive land use based on emotion and

39:40sentiment. We are respectfully asking

39:42the board to please deny this

39:44application based on these facts that

39:46clearly show no hardship has been

39:48justified in changing the use of this

39:50property from R1 to B2. Thank you.

39:54>> You

39:54>> any questions?

39:56>> Any questions for Thank you so much.

40:04>> Good afternoon. My name is Thomas Myers.

40:06I live at 4270 Horloester Court

40:08approximately 250 ft from the subject

40:11property where my wife and I have lived

40:12for 25 years. Believe you all met her

40:14just a minute ago. Um I wanted to

40:16approach this from a slightly different

40:17angle. I was heavily involved uh working

40:20on the sprinkle overlay zone uh zoning

40:22in 2008 working with Dover Cole and

40:24partners in the city's planning

40:25department uh planning commission and

40:27city council. Uh while I also support

40:30foodp pack as a business, I want to

40:31express my strong opposition to the

40:33granting the use variance for the

40:35parcel. Uh this request fails to meet

40:37any of the objective criteria the

40:39findings of fact which would support its

40:40commercial use and for these reasons I

40:43request the application be denied. Um as

40:46you me as you heard earlier the subject

40:48property is proceeding with a resoning

40:49request from R1 to B2. Was denied

40:52unanimously by the planning commission

40:54two weeks ago. uh and it will go before

40:56the city council on November 3rd as the

40:59next step in that process. Uh the

41:01planning commission found that the

41:02resoning request failed to meet any of

41:04the objective criteria for doing so. Um

41:06in its recommendation, it found quote

41:09there was no mistake or error in the

41:10original zoning map and it would

41:13adversely impact neighboring properties

41:15and cause a loss of property values. End

41:17quote. Uh they go on to mention there's

41:20no additional capacity need uh no change

41:22in the underlying conditions of the area

41:25and that the request failed to fit the

41:27community's uh best interest and that's

41:29what the planning commission found. I

41:31fully understand this is a different

41:32process and a different governing body.

41:34However, some of the underlying criteria

41:36are still the same. Uh both of the

41:38current businesses at the neighborhood's

41:40entrances entrance was grandfathered in

41:42and are operating under use variances to

41:44R1. Um, importantly, both of those

41:47occupy pre-existing commercial buildings

41:50and did not add commercial capacity in

41:52front of a small neighborhood. Uh, this

41:54property is completely undeveloped and

41:56to our understanding, a use variance has

41:59not been recently granted maybe ever,

42:01uh, for any net new commercial

42:02development elsewhere in the city. I

42:04think that's an important part. Um, the

42:07other thing to point out is that uh,

42:09what we say is we're kind of moving food

42:11pack from one place to other. The

42:13current food pack is less than 3,000

42:15square feet. This is 6,500 square feet.

42:17Plus, uh, Maple Street Biscuit Company

42:20is also under 3,000 square feet. So,

42:22this addition more than doubles the

42:24commercial intensity at the entrance to

42:27the neighborhood and next to the park.

42:29So, that's pretty important. Um,

42:31specifically addressing the required

42:33findings of fact, uh, it does not meet

42:35any of the three criteria. It's

42:37obviously against the public interest as

42:39discussed by other speakers and

42:40reaffirmed by the planning commission

42:42and it would harm the public interest in

42:44terms of traffic noise and reduce public

42:46uh property values and the rear of the

42:49parking rear of the parking uh abuts for

42:52residential properties adjacent to the

42:53park. Uh secondly, there are no special

42:56conditions that result in unnecessary

42:58hardship. Uh it's been zoned residential

43:00since it would was incorporated into the

43:02city zoning in 1967.

43:04It was purchased approximately five

43:06years ago by the applicant with the

43:07knowledge it was zoned R1. Uh and they

43:10were also aware of previous attempts to

43:12reszone it for commercial use that also

43:14failed. Uh furthermore, the applicants

43:16received tenative approval to subdivide

43:18as you saw. Um and for whatever reason

43:21that project fell apart. Um economic

43:23loss associated with not be able to re

43:25relocate their current business from a

43:27nearby parcel cannot be the basis for a

43:29hardship and requires that this

43:31application be denied. In fact, quote,

43:33"No variant shall be granted where

43:34economic loss is the sole basis for the

43:36required variance." End quote. This is

43:39not a hardship based case as residential

43:41development is fully possible as we saw

43:44and was recently pursued by the

43:45applicant. Third, to receive approval,

43:48this request must meet the spirit of the

43:50variance criteria and substantial

43:52justice be done for both applicant and

43:54surrounding neighborhood. Is clear the

43:56development is not interest in the

43:58interest of the neighborhood and only

43:59benefits the applicant. increased

44:02traffic, noise, loss of property values,

44:04and a more than doubling of commercial

44:06capacity at the entrance to a small

44:08neighborhood. All work contrary to the

44:10neighborhood's interest. Um, based on

44:13his failure to meet any of the required

44:14findings of facts, um, I'd request the

44:16board of zoning adjustment deny this

44:19application. Thank you for your

44:20consideration today.

44:21>> Thank you. Any questions for the board?

44:23Thank you.

44:24>> Thank you.

44:25>> Is there another? Was that three?

44:27>> Four.

44:28>> That was four. Okay. I can't count. Um

44:31you have some time to for rebuttal if uh

44:33if you like. Yeah.

44:37>> Yes. Thank you. Um

44:41it's good to see that people care about

44:43the neighborhood and

44:46I think the owners of food pack care

44:49immensely about the neighborhood.

44:50They're not going to develop something

44:52that's detrimental.

44:54this the community knows the impact um

44:58of noise and so forth because they've

45:00been there for many years. Um we meet

45:04all the requirements except the use. Uh

45:08the original zoning,

45:11you know, the lot is surveyed. It's

45:13labeled commercial lot 2. It's been that

45:16way since like ' 64 or something. It was

45:20not grandfathered in as commercial when

45:22they when the city annexed it. Did they

45:25make a mistake? Well, we weren't there.

45:28Um so, but

45:32um you know, a lot of the things that

45:36were were stated are are valid, but the

45:39owner is committed to doing a a nice

45:42project and we comply. Do we have the

45:45overlay, the Spring Hill overlay that

45:47shows the neighborhood general? The

45:49orange illustration.

45:53Well, that's not it. But you you can see

45:56that area includes the commercial

45:58properties as well as the entrance to

46:00live a park. That's not that's not

46:03partitioned off as residential lots. I

46:06mean that's

46:08um so but

46:11with all due respect at this time with

46:13the limited number of commission board

46:16members present we would ask for a

46:19one-mon hold over on the project on the

46:22application.

46:25>> Okay. Thank you. Any any questions of

46:28board?

46:29Okay. Thank you.

46:33All right. Well, we've heard from both

46:34sides. Um, and the applicant has uh um

46:39has asked the board to uh for a one-mon

46:42holdover um as I mentioned in in the

46:45beginning. So, that being the case, um

46:48the board would like to uh um um to

46:50grant that to allow that chair here a

46:53motion to that effect.

46:56>> Motion to grant a 30-day hold over.

46:59>> Do we have a second?

47:00>> A second.

47:01>> All right.

47:03Make a motion in a second. All in favor

47:04say I.

47:05>> Opposed? Motion carries. 30-day

47:07holdover.

47:11>> Is there a chance

47:13we're holding it over

47:15after

47:18>> come up?

47:23>> I'm sorry. I was just asking if it's

47:25being held over for a month, is there a

47:28chance that we can wait until it goes

47:30before the city council on November 3rd

47:33and they make their decision on nove

47:35November 15th?

47:37>> It's already been we've already we've

47:40already made we've already decided that.

47:42>> Okay. Yeah.

47:42>> And and the next board of adjustment

47:44meeting is on November 5th. So it will

47:46be after the November 3rd city council

47:48meeting.

47:49>> Right. Okay.

47:51>> Okay. Thank you. All right, give a few

47:54minutes for everybody to pack up and go

47:56if you like

47:58or if you can stay. It's fun.

48:02Oh, yeah. Can't you tell?

48:05All right. What's next?

48:52You coming back, Doug?

48:56>> Come on. Come on.

49:08All right, we can move on. Um,

49:12application number one, case number

49:146669, has been withdrawn.

49:17So, we don't need to do anything on

49:19that. All right. Application number two,

49:22case number 6784,

49:24852 Spring Hill Avenue, PCDA

49:27Architecture.

49:38>> All right. Name and address for the

49:39record.

49:40>> Hi, good afternoon. My name is Jonathan

49:41Blberg representing PCDA Architecture at

49:44756 St. Louis Street. Um, we're working

49:48on a design at 852 Springh Hill Avenue.

49:52We're requesting a variance um due to

49:54our proposed design not being in

49:56compliance with the minimum 20% glazing

49:59requirement. Um, our design is compliant

50:03on three sides of the building, but

50:05there's one elevation along North

50:07Jefferson Street where the design

50:09includes three bedrooms, a combined

50:12living and dining area, and a garage.

50:14The owner has expressed privacy and

50:16security concerns regarding extensive

50:18glazing in these spaces. Therefore,

50:21requesting a variance for this elevation

50:24only. The remaining three sides exceed

50:26the minimum glazing percentage by up to

50:2813%.

50:32Can you I know um we've read the

50:34application, but having a and I see the

50:37elevations, but just as a narrative,

50:40tell us what y'all are planning on doing

50:41because it seems fascinating to me and I

50:43don't really have good a good grip on

50:45it.

50:45>> Yes, sir. Um the owner currently uses

50:48the building as their office. They're um

50:50a contractor and they wish to add a

50:54residential portion to the building as

50:55well. So, we're going to use the

50:57existing building that's there. Um,

51:00that'll become the residential unit and

51:03then we're adding in front of that the

51:05office space.

51:07>> Okay. All right. Any questions of the

51:10board?

51:13All right. Thank you.

51:15>> Thank you. Is anyone here to speak in

51:17favor of this application

51:20or against it?

51:24>> Come on.

51:35My name is Anthony Johnson and I'm the

51:37owner of that particular property.

51:39>> Name address

51:40>> 852 Spring Hill Avenue and I'm the owner

51:42and I'd like to speak in favor of it for

51:44sure.

51:45>> Okay, that's it. Any questions?

51:48I've been there for over 30 years now as

51:50a business, several businesses there and

51:52look forward to getting into compliance

51:54and doing whatever I need to do to get

51:56it up to standards.

51:57>> Well, I think it's fascinating. I'm glad

51:58you're doing it.

51:59>> Thank you.

52:00>> Pretty cool. I don't think we have

52:01anything else like that.

52:02>> Yeah.

52:02>> You know, certainly not on broad.

52:04>> I think it's going to give a great

52:05appearance to the area.

52:06>> I think so, too. Thank you very much.

52:08>> Okay. Thank you.

52:10>> All right. We have an application. Um

52:15there were no questions. Uh Jerald here

52:17a motion

52:21motion. Motion to approve.

52:23>> We have a second.

52:24>> A second.

52:25>> All right. All in favor say I.

52:27>> I.

52:28>> Opposed.

52:29>> Motion carries.

52:33All right. Application number three.

52:35Case number 6785 at 407 Hillrest Road.

52:39Uh Geographic Consulting LLC. Applicant

52:42here.

52:52Uh John Pillar, uh 4031 Lakefront Drive

52:56West.

52:58Uh

52:59this is my first time being in a room

53:01like this. And I hope

53:03>> first two

53:04>> I hope mine goes more like the second

53:06one than the first. [laughter]

53:08Uh that was that was interesting to

53:09hear. Um, I bought the piece of property

53:14at 407 Hillrest Road. Uh, it was a

53:17residential house in between two other

53:20residences

53:22directly on Hillrest Road. Okay. You

53:24see, can we show the map of kind of what

53:28right there? So, the the parcel there to

53:31the south is a tax office. I believe

53:34it's had a variance already. Um it is,

53:38you know, they they park in the grass in

53:40the back and just kind of

53:43um you know, it's commercial use only

53:46for what their their purposes are. Uh

53:49the piece of property that I bought was

53:51in horrible condition. Um it it's been

53:54since cleaned up several dumpsters. The

53:57area is really nice going down through

53:59there. And I've got an insurance agency

54:02around the corner. And so I'd like to

54:05move. I've been renting there for 20

54:07years. I'd like to move into this piece

54:10of property and fix it up and continue

54:14my office, professional office area

54:17there. It is a it's a small agency. Um

54:20very little.

54:21>> There won't be a residential component

54:23of it. It's just

54:24>> zero. Yes. Um, it's a small agency. Uh,

54:28insurance has definitely gone more

54:30towards online email. You know, very few

54:35foot traffic, very little walk-in. Uh,

54:39so it's it's really uh I think would be

54:43it's going to suit the area as far as

54:46what Hillrest is all along that right

54:48side of the road. Now there's only one

54:53house which is there to the north that's

54:55in rough shape but a residence. All the

54:59other pieces of property are either

55:00multi- family or commercial

55:05all on that side.

55:07So goes Alabama Power, this tax office,

55:10and then me.

55:14What

55:15>> about behind you?

55:16>> Uh behind it's it's grown up wooded. Um

55:20it is somebody the backyard to the

55:24McKenna drive. Um it is also in rough

55:28shape grown up overgrown. Um you know

55:32which all that will be fenced from my

55:34side. Um you know the fences in between

55:37are all falling down and it's it's going

55:41to definitely be an improvement to the

55:43area. I don't plan to have, you know,

55:47plan to approve a good debt.

55:54>> Have you had discussions with the uh um

55:56um with the neighbor to the north?

55:58>> I have not.

56:00>> Have there been any uh um any comments?

56:04>> We did receive a comment for this and it

56:06is on your iPad.

56:07>> I'm sorry. I didn't hear you.

56:08>> Was what?

56:09>> We received one comment for this uh

56:11application. And it was emailed uh

56:13yesterday to Katherine Clark.

56:15>> Okay.

56:20>> Does anybody have that?

56:22>> Yeah. Any any questions for the

56:24applicant?

56:25>> Oh, the emailard

56:40chair.

56:46Okay, no questions. Okay, sir.

56:50>> Name and address.

56:51>> John Cranble, uh 18172 Old Brady Road,

56:55Bayonette.

56:57I'm actually the uh designer.

56:59>> Come closer a little bit, please.

57:00>> I'm the designer. I'm actually working

57:01with the engineer. Uh she had she was

57:04out of the country for this meeting. So,

57:06I'm actually stepping in to answer any

57:08questions or talk about what we need to

57:10about these variances.

57:13Uh, the biggest the biggest problem we

57:15have is, you know, you get an existing

57:17house on existing lot and there's three

57:20existing live oaks. Uh, to the south

57:23there's a 36-inch live oak. Uh, they

57:26want the they're asking for us to have a

57:3020ft access drive between the house and

57:32that oak tree. Uh I showing 16

57:37and the only reason that is is because

57:39we're getting closer to that root system

57:41and you know moving 4 ft. I think we

57:43have six feet now between the pavement

57:45and the tree and we're thinking that I

57:48may kill the tree and I know Mr.

57:50Pillager would like to keep the trees

57:51and keep them healthy. Uh we also would

57:54like to have you know some grass between

57:57the pavement and the property line and

57:59the fence so that everything coming on

58:02to the site from the west and the south

58:05can flow across the grass before it, you

58:07know, gets in asphalt. So do y'all have

58:11any questions? Any questions on the

58:13board?

58:14>> All right. Thank you very much.

58:15>> Thank you. Anyone here in opposition to

58:16this application?

58:19>> Nope. Okay. Okay. And by the way, I want

58:20to go back uh to number two and uh um

58:23make sure that we had findings of fact.

58:27>> Yeah.

58:28>> Just want to put that in the record for

58:30that approval.

58:35>> Yeah. One number one, two, and three.

58:37Okay. All right. Um

58:40we've heard from the applicant. Um

58:43Cheryl entertain a motion on number

58:44three.

59:05I'll make a motion to approve uh

59:08following P the A, B, and C findings

59:10effects

59:11>> and conditions

59:11>> with the conditions as listed

59:13>> one through

59:14>> one through eight.

59:15>> Okay. Do we have a second?

59:19>> Second.

59:20>> All right. All in favor say I. I

59:22opposed. Motion carries.

59:30All right, on to item number four. Case

59:32number 6786 and 6647

59:36at 24603rd Avenue. The comforter,

59:39heating, and air conditioning. Come on

59:41down.

59:53Hello, my name is uh Adri Bush uh owner

59:56of the company of Heating and Air and

59:5824593rd Avenue is the address. And we

1:00:03were requesting that we be granted a

1:00:05variance to put a shed uh behind the

1:00:09business uh so that we can store our

1:00:12material and tools and uh items to keep

1:00:16it from you know uh the public view and

1:00:20we respectfully asked uh that we be

1:00:22granted permission to uh have a shed uh

1:00:26on the property. We were granted a

1:00:28variance to operate the business at this

1:00:30location. Um,

1:00:33and we just respectfully asked for the

1:00:36shed to be built or to have a shed

1:00:41and we have uh just to give us a little

1:00:43background on this uh I grew up across

1:00:45the street uh um in 2459rd Avenue my mom

1:00:50house we started the business out of her

1:00:52house and uh and uh

1:00:57it's little to no traffic. We got four

1:00:59vehicles total, mostly family. It's a

1:01:02part-time job for me. And uh there's no

1:01:06traffic, no increased traffic. Uh we've

1:01:08already been operating there for uh

1:01:10eight years and almost eight years. And

1:01:13uh

1:01:16and we uh serve the community. We do

1:01:19free repairs for the 80s and 90 year old

1:01:21residents in the neighborhood. We uh

1:01:24donate to the community, keep the

1:01:26community clean, you know, uh to the Bay

1:01:28Area Women Coalition in the neighborhood

1:01:31and uh we got hundreds of signatures

1:01:34from neighbors that we have served or

1:01:37many that we have served and um many

1:01:39that you know okay with us operating in

1:01:43the neighborhood. And so that's all we

1:01:45asking this variance to have a shed so

1:01:47we can put our tools and equipment in

1:01:51respectfully. Okay. Any questions

1:01:53before?

1:01:54>> Do I understand? So, and Doug, maybe

1:01:58you can add. So, this was we we denied

1:02:00it in February of 25.

1:02:02>> It was it was denied. Uh he appealed it

1:02:04to circuit court. Judge York heard the

1:02:06case. My associate Emma Hope handled it

1:02:09uh for the city. Judge York went to the

1:02:12site

1:02:14um and made a determination that he was

1:02:16entitled to his variances.

1:02:20>> He was what? entitled to his variances

1:02:22and and granted his appeal.

1:02:24>> Um the judge asked the staff for

1:02:27conditions that should be included which

1:02:30are listed here on page five of your

1:02:34report. Um the report also says that

1:02:37he's not in compliance with all those

1:02:40conditions.

1:02:42I'll read this as to indicate that even

1:02:45after that he went and built another

1:02:46building. Is that correct? without

1:02:48permits staff. Yeah. I mean, he's he's

1:02:52violated it again. He he's known he was

1:02:55in violation and he goes out there and

1:02:56builds another. As the staff report

1:02:59says, if he's you know, if if he's not

1:03:02in compliance with the court order, why

1:03:04should we let him to continue and add uh

1:03:08illegal buildings?

1:03:10Are you in complian with the court

1:03:11order? Well, um, honestly, what happened

1:03:14when we got granted the varants, we

1:03:16thought that we could put a shed up and

1:03:18then I realized I couldn't get a permit

1:03:20after we discussed with the board of

1:03:23zoning, I realized I couldn't get a

1:03:24permit to have a shed. So, we thought

1:03:26that once he granted us the bearings

1:03:28that we could get the uh permit to get

1:03:31the building. So, we would just backlog.

1:03:33We couldn't get the permit because we

1:03:34didn't have permission. So, we kind of I

1:03:36kind of went ahead. It was my ignorance.

1:03:38I didn't know, you know, I thought that

1:03:40we can, you know, construct the shed

1:03:41after the judge gave us permission to

1:03:43have the variance. The uh first building

1:03:46was already there, but the second one we

1:03:49constructed, I'm thinking that, you

1:03:50know, we was uh had a right to put a a

1:03:54shed up, you know, long as we got a

1:03:56permit. But when I tried to get the

1:03:58permit, we realized that, you know, we

1:04:00couldn't move forward without getting

1:04:02permission. So that's why we didn't do

1:04:04it in um because you got to remember u

1:04:06when I first did it when we first opened

1:04:08the business I didn't know that we even

1:04:09had to get a variance. So everything was

1:04:11new to me and when we found out we

1:04:13immediately we initiated the process of

1:04:16getting a variance. Nobody forced us to

1:04:17go down to the border zone and we

1:04:19initiated it when I got the

1:04:20understanding that we had to do that. I

1:04:22thought that we could just you know

1:04:23operate a business or just you know put

1:04:25up a shed you know and so it's my

1:04:28ignorance. Yes. Uh it was my ignorance,

1:04:29but it was the intent to violate was not

1:04:32there. And um so uh we did I did contact

1:04:36I've been in contact with Miss York, you

1:04:38know, about getting in compliance. We

1:04:40done everything that uh all the

1:04:42everything that the court told us to do,

1:04:44we did it other than this building that

1:04:46we put up that we are now asking for

1:04:49permission to um be granted the

1:04:52building. I spent a lot of money. I

1:04:53wouldn't have spent that money, you

1:04:54know, ignorantly, you know. I spent a

1:04:56lot of money and all we trying to do we

1:04:58trying to improve our business, improve

1:05:00the neighborhood and we not uh have no

1:05:03intentions to violate the law or go

1:05:04against the court orders or anything

1:05:06like that. And I've been trying all that

1:05:08I know to try to get in compliance. We

1:05:11got the parking, we got the uh signs, we

1:05:14got the uh everything that the fencing,

1:05:16we done everything that the court asked

1:05:17us. But uh the only reason that we have

1:05:20this building is because of my

1:05:22ignorance, not knowing that we could I

1:05:24thought once we got the barrier that we

1:05:25could get the permit to get the shed

1:05:28which we would keep our tools in.

1:05:29>> Sir, we just got a

1:05:30>> I'm sorry. I thought you were through.

1:05:32I'm sorry. The staff report states, "The

1:05:34site plan does not comply with some

1:05:37conditions of the court order,

1:05:38specifically screening around the

1:05:40storage area, obtaining of sign permits,

1:05:44and the greening of a sidewalk waiver if

1:05:46no public sidewalk is provided.

1:05:50Have you

1:05:50>> The only thing that we haven't done is

1:05:52the sidewalk waiver, but we were trying

1:05:54to see how this process was going to go.

1:05:56Uh, I've been in contact with Miss York

1:05:58about it and um, the only thing that we

1:06:01haven't done is the requesting for the

1:06:02sidewalk waiver, but everything else

1:06:04from my knowledge we've already done.

1:06:06>> Did you get a signed permit,

1:06:08>> sir? Signed?

1:06:09>> No, she told me we thought we had to get

1:06:10a signed bearings. Like I said,

1:06:11everything is my ignorance. We thought

1:06:13we had to get a signed bearings. Miss

1:06:14York told me that we only have to get a

1:06:16permit. And so, we haven't done that

1:06:18only because we just trying to wait and

1:06:20see the process. I've been in

1:06:21communication with her about it. Uh, but

1:06:24we just trying to, you know, find out,

1:06:27you know, the steps. I'm willing to do

1:06:29whatever. Uh, but it just, you know, I'm

1:06:32just trying to wait and see.

1:06:34>> Okay. Staff, it it says that, um, use

1:06:37variance to allow an HBAC contractor

1:06:40with reduced access, maneuvering area,

1:06:42non-residential buffer, no tree

1:06:43planting. Um, but he's saying that it

1:06:48was about a building.

1:06:51Uh,

1:06:51>> we only asking for the building. Oh, I'm

1:06:53sorry.

1:06:56>> Well, he's asking for it says for use

1:06:59variance to allow an HVAC contractor,

1:07:02not about a building. So,

1:07:04>> the building was

1:07:07>> part of the first

1:07:10two.

1:07:11>> Okay.

1:07:13>> The court allowed him to keep the

1:07:15building that he built.

1:07:19The court allowed him to [clears throat]

1:07:20keep the building

1:07:23that he had built without permits. That

1:07:25that was what the first permit the first

1:07:28variance was for.

1:07:30>> Is that correct?

1:07:31>> That is correct. Uh permit uh

1:07:33application was submitted to permit the

1:07:36existing structure that was initially on

1:07:38the site. And when staff was reviewing

1:07:40that permit, it was uh observed that

1:07:43there was a second structure on the

1:07:44property that had not been on the

1:07:47property when the variance application

1:07:48was initially approved. And so

1:07:50therefore, because variances are site

1:07:52plan specific, Mr. Bush was advised that

1:07:54he needed to come back. Uh a site a sign

1:07:58permit has not been able to be issued

1:08:00yet because in order to have a sign

1:08:03permit issued, you must have either an

1:08:05active business license or building

1:08:07permit. and he has not been able to get

1:08:09the building permit because the site

1:08:11does not match the variance that was

1:08:13granted.

1:08:13>> That's why we couldn't move forward with

1:08:15the site.

1:08:15>> Okay. So, so, so the use variance is for

1:08:18the building that was placed afterward.

1:08:20>> Correct. So, this is to bring up the

1:08:22site to not only compliance with the

1:08:25courtordered uh conditions, but uh to

1:08:28accommodate the second structure as

1:08:30well.

1:08:30>> But was there a permit to build the sec

1:08:32the the latest structure?

1:08:34>> No. So, no permits have been issued at

1:08:36this point.

1:08:37staff. Would it if the

1:08:41board wants to go this route, would it

1:08:44be best to

1:08:47hold over so he can revise the site plan

1:08:49so we can see what's there?

1:08:52>> I think so.

1:08:53>> And he says he's done all that, but get

1:08:56a signed permit.

1:08:59I mean, if there's if there's screening,

1:09:01I want to see it. Obviously, Judge York

1:09:04took or or had the opinion that this

1:09:08business was not detrimental to the

1:09:10neighborhood, which I can understand. I

1:09:13respect that decision, but

1:09:17you know, it's it's violation after

1:09:19violation. And um I I would personally

1:09:23from the legal viewpoint before we grant

1:09:25more variances, I want to make sure he's

1:09:27in compliance with that court order.

1:09:29That's just my opinion.

1:09:32>> Yeah. Go ahead.

1:09:33>> Okay. Would you be willing to hold you

1:09:35hold over for 30 days till you get the

1:09:38>> hearing problem? Sorry.

1:09:39>> So, will will you be willing to hold

1:09:41over instead of us making decision today

1:09:43for 30 days to make sure you get your

1:09:45paperwork in in order so that when you

1:09:48come back again, we may be able to

1:09:49approve it.

1:09:50>> Yes, I'm willing to do whatever. if you

1:09:53could do a a revised site plan showing

1:09:55all the improvements, the screening is,

1:09:57you know, everything that was set out in

1:09:59that court order and bring some

1:10:01photographs so we can see it, please.

1:10:03>> Yes, sir.

1:10:03>> Thank you.

1:10:04>> Now, how about building permit though?

1:10:05Will he have to get an after the fact

1:10:06building permit?

1:10:08>> He will. That will be depending on the

1:10:11uh decision of the board to uh on the

1:10:13application.

1:10:14>> Okay. But I'm sure there weren't any

1:10:17plans drawn or anything. Did you just

1:10:19build it yourself or

1:10:20>> We've already I had an architect uh draw

1:10:23everything up. I thought that he had

1:10:25submitted it, but he had drew everything

1:10:27up. Um Miss York, I don't know if he uh

1:10:30he submitted it. From my understanding,

1:10:32I thought he did.

1:10:37>> Doug, there is a site plan that shows

1:10:39two buildings.

1:10:41the the site plan doesn't uh clearly

1:10:43depict the um enclosure around the back

1:10:46of the property that the court wanted.

1:10:48Uh I think it would be I think what Mr.

1:10:50Metaf is is asking and uh Mr. Anderson

1:10:53is asking about is having the site plan

1:10:55revised to clearly depict the height and

1:10:57materials of that structure as well as

1:10:59compliance with the other uh court

1:11:01ordered conditions.

1:11:02>> But with the with the information that

1:11:04um he says he had an architect that

1:11:07designed the shed. Is that what you

1:11:08said?

1:11:09>> Okay. And was that ever submitted to the

1:11:11city?

1:11:12>> He submitted it.

1:11:13>> I believe those plans were submitted

1:11:15with the building permit application.

1:11:17>> Okay.

1:11:19>> Post construction.

1:11:20>> Post construction.

1:11:22>> Correct.

1:11:23>> Okay.

1:11:25So, my question is, you still don't have

1:11:28a permit or license to operate a

1:11:30business?

1:11:32There is a homebased occupation business

1:11:35license that has been granted for the

1:11:37comforter, but not at this location. It

1:11:39is across the street at Mr. Bush's

1:11:41parents house.

1:11:42>> We started out of my mom house across

1:11:44the street from the site.

1:11:46>> Well, my question now, do you think 30

1:11:48days will be long enough or you need a

1:11:50little bit more time more than 30 days

1:11:52to to get in compliance with what we're

1:11:54requesting of you?

1:11:56>> Okay. Uh, do I what more do I need to

1:11:59submit other than um the site plans and

1:12:01and what the architect they've already

1:12:03submitted? Do I just need to take

1:12:04pictures?

1:12:07>> I don't know.

1:12:07>> Oh, I ask the legal what do you need to

1:12:10do?

1:12:11>> So,

1:12:12>> yeah,

1:12:13>> he he will need a business license

1:12:15eventually at this location prior to uh

1:12:17his issue or either a building permit or

1:12:20a business license will be required

1:12:21prior to the issuance of a signed

1:12:23permit. Uh, Mr. Bush, you and I can uh

1:12:26discuss after the meeting more about

1:12:28what revisions need to be made to the

1:12:29site plan and what uh needs to be

1:12:31submitted uh for the board for the next

1:12:33meeting.

1:12:34>> Yes, ma'am.

1:12:34>> And so, let's say he does that and he

1:12:36comes back um the only thing that the

1:12:40board will have to do is either do or

1:12:43not is to issue or to uh um to approve

1:12:46the use of that particular building

1:12:49because it was not in the original court

1:12:51order.

1:12:52That correct? That is correct. Yes, sir.

1:12:56Okay.

1:12:58>> All right. Any other questions?

1:13:01>> All right. Thank you.

1:13:02>> Okay. Thank you'all for your time.

1:13:04>> Thank you, sir.

1:13:06>> Yes. Yeah. Um, we need to make a motion

1:13:09to uh um hold this over for 30 days. I

1:13:12have a motion.

1:13:13>> Motion.

1:13:14>> Motion to approve 30 days.

1:13:15>> Before we vote, did we ask for uh

1:13:17anybody to speak in favor or opposition?

1:13:19Is there anyone here in favor or

1:13:21opposition to this application?

1:13:25Oh, anyone else here that want to speak

1:13:28in favor of or not?

1:13:31>> All right. Thank you.

1:13:33>> You're good.

1:13:34>> All right. We have a motion.

1:13:36>> Motion to approve 30-day holdover.

1:13:40>> Second.

1:13:41>> All right. All in favor say I. I. Post.

1:13:44Motion carries for 30-day extension.

1:13:55All right. Case number 6787 and 6692,

1:13:59700 West I65 Service Road, ANR

1:14:01Development Group, LLC.

1:14:04Come on down.

1:14:08Hey

1:14:08>> everyone, my name is um Stuart Tames.

1:14:09I'm with Mayor Nexon 11 North Water

1:14:12Street 360602. I'm filming with Jay

1:14:14Watkins today here representing

1:14:16>> He's in Scotland.

1:14:16>> He is in Scotland. Yeah, that's right.

1:14:18and I'm representing the applicant ANR

1:14:20development group for uh 700 West I65

1:14:23Service Road South. Uh today we're going

1:14:26to request a density variance to allow

1:14:28more than 25 dwelling units per acre

1:14:29from multif family development in a B3

1:14:32zone. As you all may or may not

1:14:34remember, you all approved this variance

1:14:36back in August of 2025.

1:14:39That time my client was unable to uh

1:14:41receive a PUD in the six-month period.

1:14:44Um, they have now received the PUD and

1:14:46now they're back in front of this board

1:14:48respectfully requesting that you all

1:14:49approve this variance again.

1:14:51>> Is there anything different in this than

1:14:53the first one,

1:14:55>> Murray?

1:14:57>> No, sir.

1:14:58>> Okay.

1:15:00>> All right. Any questions the board?

1:15:02>> All right. Thank you. Awesome. Thank

1:15:03you.

1:15:04>> Anyone here speaking in favor of or in

1:15:05opposition to this?

1:15:08>> All right. Board or motion?

1:15:10>> I do have a question for staff. There's

1:15:12mention here about um the number of

1:15:15units. So today they're asking for 240

1:15:18correct?

1:15:21>> Yes, sir.

1:15:22>> And so they're they they received

1:15:25approval for 217. Are they going to have

1:15:27to go back and do something else or is

1:15:28this

1:15:31>> I believe it's the opposite. I believe

1:15:32originally it was 240 and now they're

1:15:34now they do they weren't sure at the

1:15:36time regarding their plans and now

1:15:37they're only going to need they're only

1:15:39going to have 217 units. So I believe

1:15:40it's the opposite.

1:15:47>> Okay.

1:15:48>> Okay.

1:15:51>> Okay. Thank you. Thank you. Sorry.

1:15:56>> Thank you.

1:15:58>> All right. Border Hill motion. Chairman

1:16:00>> make a motion to approve

1:16:03findings of fact A, B, and C and the

1:16:07following conditions one, two, and

1:16:08three.

1:16:09>> All right. We have a motion to approve

1:16:10based on findings of facts and of the

1:16:12conditions one, two, and three. Um, have

1:16:16a second.

1:16:18>> A second.

1:16:18>> All right. All in favor say I.

1:16:20>> I. Motion carries.

1:16:28Hi.

1:16:30>> Application uh case number 6788, 2040

1:16:34Schillinger Road, Spark Sign Company.

1:16:44Good afternoon. Hayden Oliver, Spark

1:16:45Sign Company, 7738 McKinley Avenue.

1:16:49We're requesting a variance to allow

1:16:51five wall signs including electronic

1:16:52message center that's above the roof

1:16:54line instead of the normally allowed

1:16:56three including a freestanding sign.

1:16:58This building was previously owned by

1:16:59another building owner. They had many of

1:17:02the same signage including three on the

1:17:03building and then one freestanding sign

1:17:06on the on the road. Now, we're asking to

1:17:08do the same thing, but to increase the

1:17:09number of signage due to the

1:17:11topographical um hardship that that the

1:17:14building offers, you know, with the the

1:17:16old style castle it represents, as well

1:17:18as trying to update and modernize the

1:17:20building itself,

1:17:27if you would describe this

1:17:31video board there.

1:17:34>> Yeah, this electronic message center.

1:17:36You see these at, you know, banks,

1:17:38schools, churches, and some multiple

1:17:40other businesses.

1:17:41>> And what's it gonna And what what would

1:17:43it say on for this kind of business?

1:17:46Nickel beer. I mean, [laughter]

1:17:48>> it's Well, it's for children, so I'm

1:17:50sure my age be there for college.

1:17:53>> But Chuck- E-Cheese had beer. [laughter]

1:17:56>> Yeah. Yeah. No, no beer. I'm I'm sure

1:17:58just kind of just representing what

1:17:59they're having inside the building.

1:18:00Promotionals. Um, as well as just

1:18:03static. Um these can be made static,

1:18:04dimmable at nighttime like many of these

1:18:06have to be um from dust to dawn dimmable

1:18:09as well. But just you know demonstrating

1:18:11promotional things happening inside the

1:18:13building and events happening inside the

1:18:15building as well.

1:18:16>> It wasn't listed in the uh report but

1:18:18are we good on the the distance to

1:18:21residential?

1:18:22>> No.

1:18:23>> No sir. It is listed in the report.

1:18:24There is residential across the street.

1:18:26>> Across the street.

1:18:42nine of the staff report indicates all

1:18:44the residences across the street.

1:18:46>> And I know we got a comment from one of

1:18:50those residents

1:18:52in opposition.

1:18:59And does that residence across the

1:19:00street face Chillinger or does it face

1:19:02east? It faces east. Yeah, it does.

1:19:06Yeah, that's right. That's the back.

1:19:08Okay.

1:19:12And as far as the wall signs, what

1:19:14what's uh permitted here?

1:19:17>> They are allowed a total of three signs

1:19:19overall, including a freestanding sign.

1:19:21So, if they're wanting a freestanding

1:19:23sign, then they would only be allowed to

1:19:24have two wall signs by right. They're

1:19:27asking for

1:19:28>> uh they are asking for I believe it's

1:19:31four or five

1:19:32>> asking for five

1:19:33>> see five wall signs. Some of the signs

1:19:36that they are proposing are classified

1:19:37asformational because they do not

1:19:39contain the business name and are less

1:19:41than 20 square feet.

1:19:43>> So, so what are the five signs? Yeah,

1:19:45that's let's see

1:19:48>> five signs of

1:19:49>> let's see if we are looking at the at

1:19:51the structure here we have uh the

1:19:54electronic message center is uh one sign

1:19:57the winter hub and let's play sign is a

1:20:00second sign

1:20:02>> those are together

1:20:03>> those are two different signs

1:20:04>> those are two different ones

1:20:06>> uh the game on sign that's on that same

1:20:08page uh I have been told is behind the

1:20:10glass and so therefore is not included

1:20:12in the variance

1:20:14uh if you look On page two, uh, party

1:20:17room and winter hub are the other, uh,

1:20:21our other two wall signs. Cafe and games

1:20:24are determined, uh, were determined to

1:20:26beformational. And then we have the

1:20:28freestanding sign there.

1:20:30>> Page 15 gives an overall

1:20:33view in one in one picture.

1:20:37>> Yeah.

1:20:38>> Yes. There you go. You're asking for a

1:20:40lot of signs there.

1:20:42Asking for some signs. some of them

1:20:44including the win the winter hub and

1:20:46let's play one. That's actually an

1:20:47interior fixture that she mentioned. And

1:20:49also we're kind of just continuing what

1:20:51the previous um building owner or the

1:20:53building resident had. They had those

1:20:55same three signs on the wall as well as

1:20:56the freestanding sign. We're only asking

1:20:58to match both sides due to Chillinger's,

1:21:01you know, topographical location of

1:21:03slightly going uphill. You miss those

1:21:05signs coming the other direction. This

1:21:07is going to help,

1:21:09you know, restrict view and traffic, you

1:21:12know, instances. is that way they're

1:21:13going to be able to see this see the

1:21:15building correctly, see what the

1:21:17building has inside correctly as well as

1:21:19you know going not having to have it on

1:21:22one single side of the building. It's

1:21:23going to have multiple sides due to the

1:21:25kind of just hardship the building

1:21:27structure

1:21:27>> has. Is this what was there before as

1:21:30far as the numbers and such?

1:21:31>> Uh what was there before uh was

1:21:34installed prior to being annexed into

1:21:35the city. Uh and from my understanding

1:21:37it actually did comply with the city

1:21:40regulations.

1:21:40>> It did. But did the previous owner have

1:21:43an electric message board?

1:21:45>> They did not.

1:21:46>> Yeah. And that's

1:21:48>> Yeah.

1:21:49>> Would to ask the applicant, would you be

1:21:51willing to remove the electronic sign in

1:21:54order to get the

1:21:55>> I could ask, you know, who representing?

1:21:56I could ask that question to them, but

1:21:59for right now, I mean, I believe that's

1:22:01something they are wanting, something

1:22:02that is part of the signage they are

1:22:04prepared to spend by. You know, that's

1:22:06kind of the signs they're looking to

1:22:07modernize Mobile. you know, that's a

1:22:09modern sign. They're able to show and

1:22:11demonstrate multiple different, you

1:22:13know, instances on the sign as well. But

1:22:15it also, you know, like other signs, can

1:22:17be made dimmable and static at night.

1:22:19That way, it's not going to interrupt or

1:22:21afflict any, you know, surrounding

1:22:23areas.

1:22:26>> So, you would say dim

1:22:28>> what

1:22:29>> dimmable or off at night?

1:22:32>> If you need to ask them, that might push

1:22:35you to a holdover.

1:22:36>> Yeah. Okay.

1:22:39I'd like to request then the 30-day hold

1:22:41over then that's going going to be the

1:22:43case.

1:22:44>> Yeah, because we've been uh um you know

1:22:46>> you're just you're up against a hard

1:22:47standard

1:22:47>> here and we we granted these before when

1:22:51the residences are behind the building

1:22:54and the sign's not facing it. So we have

1:22:56a legal precedent that y'all have

1:22:58established. Uh here we got these houses

1:23:00right across the street staring right at

1:23:02it. I don't care if it's a front yard or

1:23:04backyard. So, if if y'all could agree to

1:23:06that, that would be great.

1:23:07>> And well, and I mean, and one of my

1:23:09concerns would be the elevation of the

1:23:11sign. Yes. It's not the the height, how

1:23:13high the the sign. I mean, it's one

1:23:15thing if it's out on the road in a

1:23:16monument fashion. It's another thing if

1:23:18it's at the highest point of the

1:23:19building.

1:23:20>> And signs aren't allow any signs aren't

1:23:21allowed over the uh um over the the roof

1:23:24line.

1:23:25>> That is correct. Yes, sir. The digital

1:23:26sign within 300 ft and over two. That's,

1:23:30you know, it's a Vshape, so it's almost

1:23:33two signs.

1:23:35All right. He has asked for a holdover,

1:23:37but u the board can uh um can act how we

1:23:40want to here. We want to go ahead and uh

1:23:42um and address this now.

1:23:46As far as um um

1:23:55>> if you deny it, you're going to

1:23:57accomplish what you want him to do next

1:24:00month and come back and say he will

1:24:02donor will remove it.

1:24:03>> Right.

1:24:03>> So,

1:24:05you know, I'm not saying that's what you

1:24:07ought to do. I'm just saying it's really

1:24:08the same.

1:24:09>> Yeah.

1:24:10>> Same finish.

1:24:12>> Okay.

1:24:12>> Same ending point.

1:24:13>> All right. Thank you. I may call you

1:24:15back, but go ahead. Anyone here in favor

1:24:17of or um against this application?

1:24:21Guys, what do you think? I kind of agree

1:24:23with Doug. Um I think if if if it's the

1:24:26if it's the u um opinion of the board um

1:24:29that we don't want the uh um to approve

1:24:31the digital sign, we can go ahead and

1:24:33move on that if we'd like to.

1:24:36You good with that? Okay. I'll hear a

1:24:38motion.

1:24:41Motion to approve the application

1:24:44without the electronic sign. Uh so let

1:24:47me get my wording correct with the

1:24:48following findings of fact um

1:24:52A and C and the uh

1:24:56conditions one and two.

1:24:58>> Okay. Okay. So, we have a motion to

1:25:00approve but uh with the uh condition

1:25:03that uh um that the uh not allowing the

1:25:06>> it does not include the

1:25:07>> does not include the electronic sign and

1:25:09the approval for um findings of fact AB

1:25:11and C and uh the uh conditions one and

1:25:14two

1:25:15>> that would be the electronic message

1:25:17board. I think they're all electronic

1:25:19designs but electronic message board for

1:25:22the

1:25:22>> electronic message board the thing that

1:25:24flashes.

1:25:25>> Okay. Do we have a second? Second.

1:25:28>> All right. All in favor say I.

1:25:30>> I.

1:25:30>> All right.

1:25:35All right. Moving on.

1:25:39All right. Number seven. Case number

1:25:416789 which is at 251 and 255 St. Louis

1:25:45Street and 106 160 North Jackson GS

1:25:48Realy LLC. And Mr. Gerald D. Bird.

1:25:57Jerry Bird, bird survey, [clears throat]

1:25:592609 Halls Mill Road

1:26:02here with the owners today.

1:26:05Um,

1:26:08yes, you know, the two variances we're

1:26:10asking for. One is to allow the curb cut

1:26:13onto St. Louis Street and two over on

1:26:17Jackson Street. and combining the

1:26:20properties. We can't access North Joacam

1:26:24Street because the building is at that

1:26:26end. Uh that's going to be a proposed um

1:26:31Ace Hardware and a liquor store on that

1:26:35end. Um

1:26:39the parking lot was developed

1:26:44thinking that the southern

1:26:47smaller what looks like a small

1:26:49standalone lot is will be for employees

1:26:54basically employees only for Ace

1:26:57Hardware and the Greer's grocery store

1:27:01that they thinking they will get them

1:27:04off of the street and onto the site and

1:27:06then customers

1:27:08uh can park on the street

1:27:12closer to the store.

1:27:15The

1:27:19main

1:27:22what I call the main driveway coming in

1:27:25from Jackson Street over and up to St.

1:27:27Louis, two-way drive going in and out.

1:27:31um that will accommodate

1:27:35the contractors

1:27:38with larger pickup truck maybe and a

1:27:40trailer to come in to the hardware store

1:27:43and purchase whatever they need to and

1:27:46haul it out. Uh even though there are a

1:27:50lot of tenants in the uh yeah a lot of

1:27:52residents in the area that can walk and

1:27:55gather small things, there'll be some

1:27:57items in that hardware store that

1:27:59they're not going to want to carry down

1:28:01the street a couple of blocks and up

1:28:03into their apartment. So they'll be

1:28:05driving over. Um

1:28:09if we

1:28:10tried to maximize that, we wouldn't have

1:28:13left that uh green space

1:28:17uh landscaped area on the corner which

1:28:20is going to have some benches in it

1:28:23accommodating the deli customers that

1:28:26are at the um grocery store during

1:28:30lunch. Uh

1:28:32now

1:28:34every day they have customers that are

1:28:37actually parking out on this property

1:28:41accessing the deli because they have a

1:28:43large deli trade. So it parking lot is

1:28:47basically serving u the Ace Hardware

1:28:53the liquor store and overflow at the uh

1:28:57grocery store.

1:28:58>> How many parking spaces are are y'all

1:28:59showing there? What?

1:29:01>> How many parking spaces are in there?

1:29:02>> I don't know.

1:29:05>> Don't ask me questions like that. Come

1:29:07on, Jerry.

1:29:08>> It might have been on the might have

1:29:10been on the drawing I submitted.

1:29:11>> How many?

1:29:12>> 64.

1:29:13>> 64. Okay. [laughter]

1:29:15>> Um,

1:29:16>> you want her to finish for you?

1:29:18>> Jerry, I was going to ask you this

1:29:19question, but I'll ask it of Lucy. The

1:29:22parallel parkings, well, after the St.

1:29:25Louis improvements are completed. Will

1:29:27there be the parallel parking spots that

1:29:30are there now?

1:29:34>> Address, please.

1:29:35>> Lucy Greer, 154 Holy Head Drive. Do you

1:29:37mean on the grocery store side?

1:29:39>> No, on this side.

1:29:40>> On the other side. Um,

1:29:42>> on this side?

1:29:44>> I would have to ask Jen Green Marie, do

1:29:47you know if there's I don't think there

1:29:49is there going to be street parking?

1:29:51Honestly, I can't remember. I'm sorry,

1:29:53Doug. I I am not sure on this part. Uh

1:29:56that would be like you said Jen Green

1:29:58would know for sure. I'm not sure.

1:30:01>> And Jerry, I'll ask you this. This curb

1:30:04cut to St. Louis, where does it line up

1:30:07to the curb cut into the grocery store

1:30:09parking lot? Traffic engineer. No.

1:30:14Oh, okay. You're not traffic. I'm sorry.

1:30:18[laughter]

1:30:19>> I can't I never see over there, so I

1:30:20never I don't know who you are.

1:30:22away.

1:30:27>> It's going to pretty much line up with

1:30:30the western curve but

1:30:32>> across the street.

1:30:36>> Yeah, I think it'll be

1:30:37>> this building

1:30:39>> over. Yeah.

1:30:41>> Wait. Uh Sarah Greer 63 6763 Bay Road.

1:30:46What's the question?

1:30:47>> The curb cut. The curb cut that's shown

1:30:51on the plane that y'all want to St.

1:30:52Louis Street. Is it directly across the

1:30:55curb cut into the Greer's parking lot?

1:31:00>> The Greer's parking lot, and I don't

1:31:02know, east, I guess, west, whatever we

1:31:04are, is further to the right. If I'm

1:31:07looking at our grocery store, it's

1:31:08further to the right. It's not directly

1:31:10across.

1:31:12You can't go out of this curb cut and

1:31:14into the grocery store. That's what

1:31:16you're asking. If you go to the liquor

1:31:18store, you can. [laughter]

1:31:20>> And back to the street parking, I can't

1:31:23with a 100% certainty say, but I I

1:31:26believe at least in front of the liquor

1:31:28store, they were talking about expanding

1:31:31that sidewalk out. So, I think street

1:31:32parking is not going to be there, but I

1:31:35don't know unless we ask Jen Green.

1:31:40>> Is the plan in compliance otherwise with

1:31:43the green and the islands and all that?

1:31:46Yes, sir. Okay.

1:31:50>> All right. Any other any questions?

1:31:53All right. Thank I think you dropped

1:31:54your glasses, Jerry.

1:31:55>> It was his pen.

1:31:56>> Oh, was it okay?

1:31:58>> Look, he's an old guy. We got to look

1:31:59out for him. [laughter]

1:32:02>> All right. Thank you very much.

1:32:06>> Yeah.

1:32:09>> Hey, Lucy Greer again. Um, I just wanted

1:32:13to say that our goal is, of course, to

1:32:18improve things in that area. We've been

1:32:21so happy with our business that we

1:32:24invested in the grocery store 5 years

1:32:26ago. And it's just been interesting

1:32:28because we kind of felt like it was

1:32:30going to be really just patron by people

1:32:32in the downtown community, which of

1:32:34course it is. People that live and work

1:32:36down here, but there are so many people

1:32:38that come and visit the store from

1:32:40Baldwin County, all of Mobile County.

1:32:43It's become quite the destination. So,

1:32:47we completely understand wanting to

1:32:48have, you know, a walkable community,

1:32:50but there are so many people coming to

1:32:52this location from other areas that

1:32:55aren't walkable, so they have to come

1:32:56downtown anyway and have somewhere to

1:33:00park. And we appreciate Jerry's help and

1:33:03just reiterating a few things. He said,

1:33:06"This is, you know, three businesses

1:33:08really that we're kind of joining. So,

1:33:10we wouldn't have purchased additional

1:33:13property unless we needed additional

1:33:16parking. So, we only have 33 spots on

1:33:18the grocery side and we have around 15

1:33:21people that are employed at one time on

1:33:25a shift. And so, that's already, you

1:33:28know, only 15 17 spots available and

1:33:32we're going to be adding additional

1:33:33employees with the add additional

1:33:36businesses.

1:33:37So, we knew that we didn't have to have

1:33:41all of that parking and so we thought,

1:33:44well, what can we do for the community

1:33:46and have it really a nice space? So,

1:33:48that's why we were proposing that green

1:33:51space. So, we tried to minimize the

1:33:54parking and not have more than what we

1:33:57needed. So, this is what we felt like

1:33:59was necessary for us to just do business

1:34:03on a normal basis. So, we appreciate

1:34:06y'all's consideration and thanks to

1:34:08Marie for helping us along the way.

1:34:11Thank you.

1:34:12>> All right. Thank you.

1:34:15>> All right. Anyone here else want to

1:34:17speak in favor of or against?

1:34:23No.

1:34:25All right. No questions. All right. We

1:34:27have an application here. Um the uh

1:34:31chair will entertain a motion. Before

1:34:40we make a motion, do we need to have

1:34:42something in here that states that that

1:34:45goes along with what St. Louis street's

1:34:48going to be? Because if that driveway

1:34:49needs to be shifted one way or the other

1:34:52based on the new layout, is that

1:34:54something that we need to put into this?

1:34:55>> I think that would be in the just

1:34:56working with the engineering department

1:34:59um

1:34:59>> to handle that. Yeah, because I don't

1:35:00think that the city the city wouldn't

1:35:02approve something that was in in

1:35:04conflict with what's going on.

1:35:06>> I know that Jen Green, who is in charge

1:35:08of the project that's being done on St.

1:35:11Louis Street, is very aware of the work

1:35:13going on at this location as well as the

1:35:16uh other projects in this area. uh and

1:35:19so they are in uh conversations with

1:35:22them to make sure that the proposed

1:35:24changes that the private property owners

1:35:26are proposing will work handinhand with

1:35:29the work that the city is proposing.

1:35:31>> Okay.

1:35:31>> So, so our approval isn't specific to

1:35:34this drawing. It is just allowing an

1:35:36additional curve cut.

1:35:39>> Well, variances are site plan specific.

1:35:41So, uh we could approve administratively

1:35:45very minor adjustments. So if uh Jen

1:35:47Green and company needed that curb cut

1:35:50to be shifted somewhat, we could approve

1:35:52that administratively without having to

1:35:54come back.

1:35:55>> Didn't want it to come back because of

1:35:56something like that.

1:35:57>> Yeah.

1:35:57>> Yeah. We we could of it

1:35:59>> and and if you were so inclined, you

1:36:01could put a condition on there that uh

1:36:04the curb cut to St. Louis Street be uh

1:36:07worked with uh Jen Green's office on on

1:36:10that placement.

1:36:11>> Okay. Make the motion

1:36:15question. So motion to approve with the

1:36:18findings of facts A, B, and C and the

1:36:19conditions one and two with an

1:36:22additional condition to of the

1:36:24improvements to be coordinated

1:36:26>> with the project manager for the St.

1:36:28Louis construction.

1:36:30>> Uh we have a motion to approve um sub

1:36:33findings of fact and uh uh conditions

1:36:35one and two and with an additional

1:36:37condition that the uh um will work in

1:36:39conjunction with the city um along with

1:36:42the uh work being done on St. move

1:36:44straight. All right, we got a second.

1:36:46>> Second.

1:36:47>> All in favor say I.

1:36:48>> I.

1:36:49>> Motion to approve.

1:36:55>> All right, we've got number eight, case

1:36:57number 6790 at 250 St. Francis Street.

1:37:00Mark Pipper.

1:37:02>> Yes, sir. Mark Pipper, 157 Lake Ridge

1:37:04Drive, Madison, Mississippi. Uh I'm here

1:37:08with Dale Partners who I'm employed with

1:37:11be a construction administrator on this

1:37:13PR. excuse [clears throat] me, project

1:37:15here representing the design team and

1:37:17Mr. Patel. We have four different

1:37:19variances we'd like to seek your

1:37:21approval on today for the Home Two

1:37:23Suites Hotel uh between uh St. Francis

1:37:27and uh St. Michael's. The first has a

1:37:30transparency issue along the St.

1:37:32Michaels Street. Uh we're short of the

1:37:35ordinance requirement and part of that's

1:37:37driven by a couple of things. Uh number

1:37:39one on the first floor there is a

1:37:42mechanical room. Uh there's adjacent to

1:37:45it is the stairwell that obviously goes

1:37:47from first floor all the way up

1:37:50uh to the top floor, fifth floor of this

1:37:52facility. And so on the first floor in

1:37:54those two spaces, obviously we didn't

1:37:56have any windows added there. Uh maybe

1:37:59on that mar that uh if you had that

1:38:03rendering that might be helpful.

1:38:07Oh, he's referring to the the rendering

1:38:10here that uh has been placed at all of

1:38:12your your seats there.

1:38:14>> Yes, sir. That that north one right

1:38:16there.

1:38:18>> So, um you see the little opening with

1:38:20the X in it. That's the exit from the

1:38:22stairwell.

1:38:24Immediate to its left is the stairwell

1:38:26that exceed that extends all the way up

1:38:29the facility. And so, obviously, we

1:38:31didn't want to add windows there. Uh ju

1:38:34just to the left of that is that

1:38:36mechanical room on floors two through

1:38:38five. Above the mechanical room is the

1:38:41restrooms.

1:38:43And then where you see the stairwell

1:38:45exit,

1:38:46the door with the X in it. Above those

1:38:49are the uh also u restrooms for those

1:38:52guest rooms on floors two through five.

1:38:55And then just to the right of it, floors

1:38:58two through five is the bedroom for a

1:39:01king suite. So, if we were to add

1:39:03windows in that room and on the other

1:39:06side, the east elevation,

1:39:08it wouldn't uh be really conducive to

1:39:11installing bedroom furniture. You'd

1:39:13either have a bed or a TV or something

1:39:16have to be mounted on a window. One of

1:39:18those two windows and have a wall. Yeah.

1:39:20>> Yes, sir.

1:39:22The second, if you want me to go to the

1:39:24second one, uh would be on the awnings

1:39:27on the east and south sides. The design

1:39:30of the building was such that uh as I

1:39:33understand the ordinance you require six

1:39:35foot awning over at least 80% run of the

1:39:38building. On our east side we have about

1:39:40185 ft. And if you look at the

1:39:42landscaping rendering with the trees

1:39:45that are being added uh rather than do

1:39:48the sixoot we actually included a twoft

1:39:51awning over each of the punched windows

1:39:53on both those elevations.

1:39:56>> Which elevations are those? I'm looking

1:39:58at at this. Yes, sir. That's correct.

1:40:00This is This is the east and this is the

1:40:03south.

1:40:03>> Where where are the where are the

1:40:06awnings in this picture?

1:40:09>> Well, that one probably don't

1:40:12>> Are they in in any of them?

1:40:14>> Well, you can see them. They're behind

1:40:15the trees.

1:40:16>> Behind the trees. Oh, okay. I I see I

1:40:18see them, sir.

1:40:19>> Yeah. Gotcha.

1:40:20>> I'm sorry. It's a two foot awning over

1:40:21each punched window.

1:40:23>> I see it.

1:40:24>> Thank you.

1:40:26Are those trees going to be that big

1:40:27when you put them in? [laughter]

1:40:31>> Hopefully.

1:40:32>> Yeah.

1:40:33>> Yes. U then the third and the fourth

1:40:35have to do with a curb cut uh width of

1:40:38one and also uh with a dumpster and I'm

1:40:41going to defer to my associate here, Mr.

1:40:44Adam Martin.

1:40:46>> All right. Name and address, please.

1:40:48>> Adam Martin, 11 North Water Street.

1:40:51Um, and then this variance is requesting

1:40:54um

1:40:56what we're calling maneuvering. Um,

1:40:59there's actually a sort of a a complex

1:41:02variance because it's there's there's

1:41:04two ways to service trash here. You can

1:41:06either pull into the dumpster itself if

1:41:08a stationary dumpster is going to be

1:41:10required, which is some of the

1:41:12conversation we've had with staff. Well,

1:41:14what we'd really like to happen is for a

1:41:17uh a movable dumpster similar to uh the

1:41:21just a larger version of the cans you

1:41:23see all over downtown that are wheeled

1:41:25out on two wheels, picked up curbside by

1:41:27a stationary vehicle, usually a side

1:41:29dump. We're looking for um to allow uh

1:41:34two fouryard bins to roll out of it

1:41:38would actually be a private service that

1:41:39would come to the enclosure. they would

1:41:41pull them out of the bins, put them in

1:41:43the street, overhead dump, and then go

1:41:44about their way. Um, we prefer not to do

1:41:48any maneuvering in the rightway. Um, but

1:41:52for sake of trying to get the

1:41:54flexibility we need and not

1:41:55understanding where the uh the board was

1:41:57going to be, we requested what was

1:41:59called maneuvering and for the dumpster

1:42:02to be uh positioned in the right way.

1:42:04>> What's the enclosure like?

1:42:06there. Um, in the images, uh, there's a

1:42:09there's an image of that enclosure, but

1:42:11it's it's going to be welldesigned. It's

1:42:12going to be painted um painted wood, uh,

1:42:16a similar kind of aesthetic to

1:42:18complement the building.

1:42:19>> I I got it.

1:42:20>> Mhm.

1:42:22[clears throat]

1:42:23>> And you said you'd have two portable

1:42:25ones inside there?

1:42:27>> Yes, sir. There's another image I sent

1:42:28to Miss York this morning. Um, this same

1:42:33condition exists uh several blocks away

1:42:35on St. Michael. So, pretty much what you

1:42:38see there, these this company, they roll

1:42:40these couple dumpsters out for a dump

1:42:42day. They dump them and then they go

1:42:45about their way and then they put them

1:42:46back inside.

1:42:48So,

1:42:48>> sir, if I if I can ask a question about

1:42:51the dump just the dumpsters right now

1:42:53because we got four we're trying to talk

1:42:54about here. So, I mean, you you've drawn

1:42:56this with this angled uh wooden

1:43:00thing as if it would be a dumpster you

1:43:05or or the truck accessing it from the

1:43:07rightway, right? So, if you were to

1:43:09change it to the rolling, I mean, does

1:43:10it have to be does it have to look like

1:43:12a dumpster bin at that point or can it

1:43:15>> change to be I'm not sure I understand

1:43:16the question.

1:43:17>> Yeah. I mean, right now in the in the

1:43:19rendering, it's angled as if it was

1:43:20going to be accessed from the road with

1:43:22a

1:43:22>> That's simply to make it easier to

1:43:24actually roll the dumpsters out because

1:43:26we would use the curb cut to do that.

1:43:29>> We would use the driveway to do that.

1:43:30And and I'm just thinking could you I

1:43:32mean and I maybe it's beyond what we're

1:43:33trying to address here, but could it be

1:43:34could it look not like a dumpster bin at

1:43:37that point and just since you're

1:43:39wheeling it out

1:43:45>> probably two follow um is there an

1:43:49enlargement of the site

1:43:52of that particular site

1:43:55>> in the

1:43:58>> because technically I have two sites

1:43:59here. They're technically two different.

1:44:01>> So this on the primary site with

1:44:03>> Yeah. There is there an enlargement of

1:44:04it in there? No. Okay. Um I think to

1:44:08answer your question, it's possible. Um

1:44:13it's possible.

1:44:15So you would you're you're suggesting

1:44:17that would basically open toward what is

1:44:19the internal drive?

1:44:21>> Possibly. I mean, I'm not trying to

1:44:23design the site for you, but I just as

1:44:25if I look at that when I drive by it, it

1:44:26looks like a dumpster container. And I

1:44:28and if we get rid of trying to access

1:44:30from the rightway with a traditional

1:44:32dumpster and you're going to the wheeled

1:44:34method, um maybe there's a better

1:44:37>> You're talking about materials.

1:44:39>> Yeah. Maybe look more like

1:44:41>> it's it's behind the fence or something.

1:44:43Not Yeah. I mean, not not just I think

1:44:46you've answered my question.

1:44:47>> You follow what he's trying to say?

1:44:49>> And I can show you on your picture after

1:44:51if you want. Um I

1:44:54>> think what he's saying is does it have

1:44:55to look like a dumpster enclosure?

1:44:58I mean,

1:45:01[laughter] we can

1:45:02>> It is a dumpster. It is. What do you

1:45:04want? Yeah. I mean, that would be my

1:45:05question. Is

1:45:06>> Yeah. Is there Is there a I mean, we

1:45:08could use some more of the material that

1:45:10is on the building. Probably pull that

1:45:12into the design. You mean

1:45:13>> I think that would look better

1:45:14>> with brick like brick and things like

1:45:16that

1:45:17>> and still because you don't necessarily

1:45:18I mean anyway, I I think you understand

1:45:20what I'm saying. Right now it looks like

1:45:22it

1:45:22>> will be del

1:45:23>> and it it'll deteriorate over time and

1:45:25then

1:45:26>> look like

1:45:27>> we I mean we can certainly use a higher

1:45:29grade material that more complimentary

1:45:31of the building. Right.

1:45:32>> Well, but I think you're accomplishing

1:45:34your goal by getting a wheeled dumpster

1:45:36potentially.

1:45:37>> Yeah.

1:45:38>> Yes, that can be done.

1:45:41>> On the on the drive valve width, what is

1:45:44there any particular

1:45:47>> the curb cut that's on the side? the

1:45:50width of the a lot of that is related to

1:45:53um if we if we are not allowed to

1:45:58stage the trash cans for a stationary

1:46:02overhead dump. So if if this if this uh

1:46:05vehicle is not allowed to pull up on St.

1:46:08Michael Street park

1:46:10>> overhead dump

1:46:11>> and go on its way. Then that means we

1:46:13are going to have to maneuver across the

1:46:15right because that's the only other way

1:46:16to get into the enclosure

1:46:18>> which we don't really want to do. We

1:46:19want to be able to roll the dumpsters

1:46:20out to the street overhead dump them and

1:46:22go about our way. But that's one of the

1:46:24reasons for that.

1:46:25>> So is your is your curb cut width

1:46:28request solely based on the

1:46:31>> It is. just based on maneuvering for the

1:46:32to to accommodate a a vehicle to

1:46:35>> so if we solve your problem with the

1:46:38wheel

1:46:38>> we don't need 25 we don't need over 25

1:46:40ft you're right that variance goes away

1:46:44that's helpful thank you

1:46:45>> not entirely because you would still

1:46:47have to have a variance to allow the

1:46:48curb cut to your primary street frontage

1:46:53because you have a curb cut on all

1:46:54street frontage

1:46:55>> but we are allowed one curb cut per

1:46:56frontage

1:46:57>> with the exception of your primary

1:46:59frontage if there is a secondary

1:47:00frontage available That's not our

1:47:01primary frontage. Our primary frontage

1:47:03is Joe Aackham,

1:47:04>> which you have a curb cut for the

1:47:05parking lot.

1:47:06>> You have a curb cut to Joe.

1:47:08>> No, we removed them.

1:47:10>> There's one that was submitted with the

1:47:12application. There's a curb cut to Jo.

1:47:14>> Can you zoom out? There's one on

1:47:16Jackson.

1:47:17>> Yeah. Not

1:47:18>> so that was removed. This must be an old

1:47:20site. That was actually a comment in the

1:47:22per the original Tier 2 permit submitt.

1:47:24And unless I'm mistaken, we've we I I'm

1:47:28not mistaken. We've removed that one.

1:47:30Um, it's just this is an old

1:47:31>> plan doesn't show anything on Oh, this

1:47:34one up here.

1:47:35>> Yeah. So, Drew Akim that that curve

1:47:36cut's been removed. We're only emptying

1:47:38out onto Jackson Street and Michael

1:47:39Street, St. Michael Street.

1:47:43>> We would love to have that curve cut,

1:47:45but in order to accommodate staff

1:47:47comments during permitting, we removed

1:47:48that driveway. So, that's not there

1:47:50anymore. Our primary fund is Joacum,

1:47:52which is why we added the street trees,

1:47:53which by the way are not required by the

1:47:55ordinance. That's an above and beyond

1:47:56thing. uh because we are trying to make

1:47:59that more of a primary frontage. It's a

1:48:00it's going to what lead it's going to be

1:48:02what leads you to Dolphin Street and all

1:48:04the you know the places that are you

1:48:07know the destination places of downtown.

1:48:09So we are that's the way we're looking

1:48:11at Joakim Street. It is our true

1:48:13frontage.

1:48:16>> So I'm looking at a site plan here that

1:48:18on your secondary parking lot site it

1:48:21doesn't touch but there is a single exit

1:48:23on Jackson. Is that the right current

1:48:27>> site plan you're looking at

1:48:30is older. This one on the screen looks

1:48:33>> I'm looking at I'm looking at something

1:48:35that's in our

1:48:36>> Okay. That's correct. Yes.

1:48:38>> It's just not in the report.

1:48:39>> It's just not in the report.

1:48:41>> Yeah.

1:48:42>> Yes, sir.

1:48:43>> That's correct.

1:48:44>> Those are in the supplemental documents.

1:48:46>> Yeah. Not the report.

1:48:47>> Correct. And that's what will be part of

1:48:50the permit.

1:48:52>> Okay. Thank Thank you.

1:48:54>> Okay.

1:48:56>> Anything else?

1:48:58I think so.

1:49:00All right. Thank you.

1:49:03All right. Anyone here in the audience

1:49:05um want to speak in favor of or against

1:49:07this application?

1:49:09All right.

1:49:12All right. We have an application. Um

1:49:15do we have um any other comments of the

1:49:18board?

1:49:20No. All right. Jill a motion.

1:49:23>> I'll make a motion to approve

1:49:26and following the findings of fact 8 B

1:49:30and C and conditions one, two, and

1:49:32three. But I want to be clear that so

1:49:34we're going to allow the wheeled

1:49:35dumpster,

1:49:39but we're not going to approve the

1:49:41extended curb cut.

1:49:44So you're recommend your your motion is

1:49:47to approve all of the requested

1:49:50variances with the exception of the curb

1:49:51cut width.

1:49:52>> Yeah. Yeah. Um

1:49:54>> how about the materials of the um

1:49:56enclosure that they do?

1:49:59>> Yeah. Yeah. And then we we also want to

1:50:00add a condition to match the conditions

1:50:03of the dumpster enclosure to the

1:50:04structure the primary structure. So the

1:50:07condition is the materials of the

1:50:09dumpster enclosure needs the materials

1:50:12of the hotel.

1:50:14>> Correct.

1:50:14>> Okay.

1:50:14>> And then

1:50:15>> you okay with that?

1:50:17>> Come on back.

1:50:17>> Just just to be clear in

1:50:19>> Sorry,

1:50:20>> I don't want to hear him you in. But

1:50:22>> just to be clear,

1:50:23>> we're just talking about the width of

1:50:25the driveway. The driveway would be

1:50:26there. We just

1:50:27>> driveway is allowed. It's just not your

1:50:29question. Yeah.

1:50:29>> Extended width

1:50:31>> exceeding 25 ft. That's right.

1:50:33>> It's not Yeah.

1:50:37Yep.

1:50:37>> All right. You got that, Murray?

1:50:40>> Yes, sir. I think so. Thank you.

1:50:42>> All right. We have that motion um with

1:50:45[clears throat] findings of facts and

1:50:46the conditions one, two, and three with

1:50:48additional conditions um [clears throat]

1:50:52that Marie has the no extended width of

1:50:55the curb cut and the materials to uh um

1:50:59be more consistent with the primary

1:51:01structures. All right, we have a second.

1:51:04[cough] I second. [clears throat]

1:51:05>> Okay,

1:51:07>> I second.

1:51:08>> Okay, second. All right, got a motion

1:51:09and a second.

1:51:10>> Oh, I thought it was.

1:51:11>> All in favor?

1:51:13>> I post. Motion carries. Thank you, guys.

1:51:22>> Let's not do No, no, not let's not do

1:51:24number nine again. We'll do that when

1:51:25Bill's here.

1:51:27>> Hey, we tell him, but we did that for

1:51:28him,

1:51:29>> right? All right. number 10. Um, which

1:51:33is, uh, 6792 and 6752 Newman Lane.

1:51:39Carrie,

1:51:42>> come on down.

1:51:46>> Thanks y'all. Carrie Commandis, uh, 150

1:51:48Government Street, Mobile. So, I'm here

1:51:51for a It's basically a driveway with

1:51:53variance for both of these properties.

1:52:00What was approved at these sites

1:52:02previously or was that before the

1:52:03planning commission? I don't recall.

1:52:05>> No, it was approved previously for a

1:52:08single driveway to go between it's two

1:52:10lots and we had sought a cottage court

1:52:13approval when the two parcels when we

1:52:15were going to treat the two parcels as

1:52:17one. Um, but now we are splitting the

1:52:21parcels back apart the way they've

1:52:23always been and utilizing the existing

1:52:25curb cuts with interior parking. And

1:52:28it's not like it's going to be um

1:52:32uh a parking lot. It's just more of a

1:52:35parking pad for the three modest houses.

1:52:39>> Give us a little background on what

1:52:41y'all are doing there.

1:52:43>> Um renovating uh five historic

1:52:45>> renovating just

1:52:47>> five historic houses. They're

1:52:49contributing. The first the first parcel

1:52:51in front of you has three houses on it

1:52:54and a lot right next door has two

1:52:57houses.

1:52:58there. Again though, I'd like to stress

1:53:00that these are modestsized houses. There

1:53:02will be um onebedrooms and studios.

1:53:06>> And who's doing this?

1:53:07>> Africa Town Redevelopment Corporation.

1:53:09>> It's the group. Okay.

1:53:11>> Yes. They actually have almost 15

1:53:14projects under construction right now.

1:53:16>> That's fantastic.

1:53:16>> It is.

1:53:17>> Yeah. So,

1:53:18>> that's great.

1:53:19>> Okay. Any questions here?

1:53:24All right. Is anyone here in favor or

1:53:26opposition to this? Doesn't look like

1:53:28it. All right. That being the case, um

1:53:30hearing their motion.

1:53:38I'll make a motion to approve um subject

1:53:40to findings facts A, B, and C and

1:53:43conditions one, two, and three.

1:53:46>> Second.

1:53:47>> All right. We have a motion and a

1:53:48second. All in favor say I.

1:53:49>> I.

1:53:50>> Oppos. Motion.

1:53:54So this is the property right next door

1:53:56on the next property.

1:54:08>> I'm sorry. I'm I'm sorry. I didn't It's

1:54:10the same.

1:54:12>> Yeah.

1:54:14[laughter] I didn't realize.

1:54:17>> Thanks.

1:54:20speak on this

1:54:22>> motion to approve findings in fact AB

1:54:25and C uh conditions one, two, and three.

1:54:28>> Second.

1:54:28>> A second motion to second. All favor say

1:54:31I.

1:54:32>> I

1:54:44pay attention up there.

1:54:46>> I'm really far back here.

1:54:49It's number.

1:54:52>> What was that?

1:54:55>> Well, just sticking to it.

1:54:57>> Yeah.

1:55:03>> Uh my name is Alvin Ramos. Uh 4590 118th

1:55:07Avenue North, Clearwater, Florida. Uh

1:55:09I'm here uh on behalf of Thomas Sign and

1:55:12Awning representing Wawa. Uh we are here

1:55:16to request for an amendment to an

1:55:19existing approved variance from 2025.

1:55:22Um uh at this newly constructed WAWA,

1:55:25we're seeking uh an addition or or to

1:55:29complete uh the intent of an existing

1:55:31multi-tenant uh commercial pylon that

1:55:34was already on the parcel uh when this

1:55:36parcel uh was newly developed for this

1:55:39gas station uh retail location. Uh the

1:55:44per previous agreements between uh the

1:55:48property owner and Wawwa uh the original

1:55:50intent was to complete the thought and

1:55:53the idea to be able to add the

1:55:54additional uh copy area to the existing

1:55:58multi-tenant sign that is on Wawwa's

1:56:00property. Currently, uh there is no face

1:56:04in that multi-tenant pylon. There hasn't

1:56:06been a face since we started this

1:56:07project 2 years ago and through all of

1:56:10our reviews previous to it, it's been

1:56:12empty. So, uh it's kind of a an

1:56:17a common agreement or at least something

1:56:19that was decided upon in the initial

1:56:22lease kind of uh agreement that WAWA

1:56:25could and would be able to uh add their

1:56:28additional just copy area to the

1:56:31existing multi-tenant sign. Uh each sign

1:56:34that we're proposing right now just in a

1:56:36copy area in itself is uh about uh just

1:56:39under nine square feet. Uh

1:56:43uh the multi-tenant sign I believe is

1:56:45internally illuminated.

1:56:47Uh but it is an existing sign. Um and

1:56:50Wawa would like to uh continue with that

1:56:53general agreement in order to add their

1:56:55copy area.

1:56:58This site was previously granted a sign

1:57:00variance to allow Wawwa to have two

1:57:03freestanding signs as well as three wall

1:57:05signs. So they wish to amend that

1:57:09previously granted sign variance to

1:57:11allow them to have an additional uh

1:57:13panel on this existing multi-tenant uh

1:57:15sign

1:57:20>> to modify the existing sign variants.

1:57:23They are required to come back to the

1:57:25board. Yes, sir.

1:57:29Yeah,

1:57:30>> it's not an administrative appeal. This

1:57:31is a variance.

1:57:40>> Is there anything you can do about

1:57:41matching these gas prices that are on

1:57:43this side?

1:57:45>> Like $2 diesel, $150.

1:57:47>> Unfortunately, if I could, I probably

1:57:49would, but that is uh that is out of my

1:57:52pay grade, unfortunately.

1:57:56I wish because in just two years time

1:57:58that is uh it's drastic. So anything we

1:58:01could do to to help that out?

1:58:10>> Motion to approve with uh facts and

1:58:14findings and additional condition number

1:58:17one.

1:58:21I

1:58:23>> second.

1:58:26>> I

1:58:26>> I

1:58:30>> That's all right. I have a good time.

1:58:32Staying downtown, so

1:58:33>> All right.

1:58:34>> I'm all right.

1:58:36>> Thank you.

1:58:36>> Thank you very much. Enjoy your uh

1:58:38evening.

1:58:38>> Where you going to dinner? Uh well uh

1:58:41the the place I'm staying at is uh seems

1:58:43to have a pretty good uh o oyster bar.

1:58:46So we're going to try that at the uh

1:58:48Maaga in

1:58:49>> Malaga.

1:58:50>> I'll go.

1:58:51>> Don't say Malaga, man. You're out of

1:58:52here.

1:58:53>> Yeah, [laughter]

1:58:54>> that's like saying Mobile.

1:58:55>> Yeah.

1:58:57>> All right. Thank you very much, Doug. We

1:58:59got anything, buddy? We we had a

1:59:01speaking of pronunciation we had a trial

1:59:10[laughter]

1:59:11from New York.

1:59:13>> Whatever.

1:59:15>> Welcome to Ka County.

1:59:18>> Hey, that's Hey,

1:59:20>> Doug. That's when you go like that. Out.

1:59:23Out.

1:59:24Maybe he's ajourned.

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