2026-09-22 - Public Safety Committee

00:00meeting of the city council.

00:03Uh [sighs and gasps]

00:04the committee members are Councilwoman

00:06Ingram, Councilman Pin. Is that correct?

00:09>> Yes.

00:10>> Thank you. Uh we have most everybody

00:13here today. Our only missing member is

00:15Councilman Reynolds, and of course, our

00:17attorney, Jonathan Maples, is also here.

00:18And of course, we have a great audience

00:21full of a lot of our executive u staff

00:23from the police department and um many

00:26other interest folks. So, thank you all.

00:28and fire or two fire guys. Y'all are

00:31sitting on that second row. You need to

00:33get on that first row next time. Anyway,

00:35uh thank you all for coming. Appreciate

00:36y'all being here. Um we've got a list of

00:39questions that I know you all have. So,

00:42I'm just going to read those just so

00:45that we can have that for the record and

00:46then uh I think it may be easier at this

00:50setting if we just go through these

00:51questions. And I know it may take a

00:54while and if we find that this is going

00:55to be too long for today, I don't think

00:57anybody wants to stay here until five

00:59o'clock going through all of these. So

01:00we may just, you know, take these

01:02questions as many as we can today and

01:04potentially schedule another meeting for

01:07some time down the road to continue this

01:09because this is really more of a factf

01:11finding some questions about what's

01:13going on and sharing of information

01:15today more than anything else I think.

01:17All right.

01:19So all right, if you have you can read

01:21along with me.

01:22uh any information that can be shared

01:24publicly related to the video from

01:27Saturday around 1:00 a.m. And what date

01:29was that?

01:30>> August August 23rd.

01:32>> August 23rd. Okay. Any updates from the

01:35last video in terms of being resolved or

01:38not resolved? Same same date.

01:41>> That's a different date. That was the

01:42one in reference to establishing a

01:45council notification protocol. Um, and I

01:48don't have the exact date on that, but

01:49um, we had spoken with attorney Ricardo

01:52at that time. And so, um, I'm not sure

01:55if Curt um, Director Graves is tracking

01:58that one.

02:00>> Are you talking about the August 23rd

02:01incident?

02:02>> The first one is dealing with August

02:0423rd and then the other one is dealing

02:06with the incident um,

02:09that might have been in July.

02:13>> Okay.

02:14>> All right.

02:15uh current enforcement procedures for

02:17the city's juvenile curfew, particularly

02:20within the downtown entertainment

02:22district. I think we've heard some

02:23things about that recently. The process

02:26for promptly notifying city council when

02:28police related incidents have potential

02:30to become widely circulated,

02:32controversial, or generate significant

02:35public concern. Departmental standards

02:38for determining appropriate officer

02:40staffing and deployment based on crowd

02:42size, anticipated risk and event

02:45conditions. Policies and training

02:48standards regarding deescalation, crowd

02:51control, use of force, and what

02:53constitutes excessive force. Procedures

02:56for documenting, reviewing, and

02:58communicating incidents involving use of

03:00force or significant crowd management

03:03actions. Um, and this is from

03:05Councilwoman Ingram, but I will read

03:07this. I would like an update on the safe

03:09passage program, including how the

03:11program is currently working. Also, an

03:14updated crime report showing where we

03:17currently stand as a city. Like to see

03:20the latest numbers compared to this same

03:22time period last year, including

03:24homicides, shootings, violent crime,

03:27property crime, vehicle thefts, and any

03:29other major crime trends. If possible,

03:32also like to see the data broken down by

03:34police precinct or area so that we can

03:37better understand where increases or

03:40decreases are occurring. So that's a

03:43lot, madame vice president.

03:45>> Yes, ma'am. Council,

03:46>> I'm going to take credit for these great

03:47questions. The last two that looks like

03:50Councilman Pin. [laughter]

03:52>> Were Were those Councilman Pin?

03:54>> Okay. Well, the I would like to those

03:56those come from Councilman Pin. So, we

03:58got to give credit where credit's due,

04:00>> right? All right, since we've gone

04:02through all of these, why don't we just

04:03start at the top and I know you've been

04:05working on some of these. So, uh, Chief

04:08and Director Graves, however y'all want

04:10to handle it, if you want to just start

04:11with the first one and give us whatever

04:13updates you've got and we can go from

04:15there.

04:19>> Okay. Uh well, I'll tell you we are

04:24>> Yeah, let's get the mic.

04:26>> I'll tell you that that [clears throat]

04:28PD has tire tirelessly tried to um get

04:33this information together for us. Um and

04:36I will tell you that uh it is not easy

04:40um trying to police society today. We

04:43all know that, right? Uh however, the

04:46information that you're asking for, some

04:48of that information is privileged

04:50information even for some council

04:52members and legals here, they can speak

04:53to some of that. Uh but the goal today

04:56is hopefully we will be able to identify

04:58what can be shared and what cannot be

05:00shared. Uh but outside of that, Chief

05:03Jackson is going to speak to the two

05:06incidents

05:08uh that are in question. So that if you

05:11have questions relative to what he

05:12shares, keeping in mind that there are

05:14certain bits of information that are

05:16private. It's privileged information

05:18only because people are attached to it.

05:22And because people are attached to it,

05:23we have to make sure that we guard that

05:25information carefully. So I'm going to

05:27start with Chief Jackson explaining

05:29those two dates.

05:31>> Okay. This is the first and second one

05:32on those videos. Okay.

05:34>> And the U Yeah.

05:37>> Yes, ma'am. Thank you, Madam Vice

05:39President. I just want to um make sure

05:42it's clear that we're not asking for

05:43investigative information that cannot

05:45legally be released. This is more about

05:47factual preliminary notification,

05:50information that will allow us to be

05:52informed about what's going on so that

05:54we can communicate uh with what's

05:56happening in our community, especially

05:58when it's hap when it's your area and

06:00you're receiving the calls. So I I just

06:01want to make sure the record is straight

06:03in terms of this is not we're not asking

06:06for any information that is

06:07investigative. Our request is about

06:09factual preliminary notification of what

06:12can be shared.

06:13>> Okay.

06:13>> Yeah. And and before [clears throat] you

06:14go, Chief Jackson, and thank you for

06:15doing this. Um, I think also because it

06:19may be a weekend or late night or

06:21something and we start going through

06:22Facebook and all of a sudden we see

06:24these videos and so if you're

06:26Councilwoman Ingram and it's her

06:28district, she's going, "I had no idea

06:30this was going on. What is this?" Now

06:32people start calling her. Same for any

06:34of us. If something happened in our

06:36district, so I think a lot of it is just

06:38for us to be able to find out what's

06:40going on is is is whatever you can give

06:42us and us being able to respond to our

06:45residents. this is what's going on. This

06:46is what we know. This is what we are

06:48doing sort of thing. So nothing you

06:50can't, you know, tell us. We don't want

06:53anything that's privileged obviously

06:55that would hurt your case.

06:56>> Right. Well, to begin with on that, I

06:58think all of you and if you're not, let

07:00me know and we'll make sure you are. But

07:02all of you get the daily recap that goes

07:03out. The same thing that we send out to

07:05our media partners. We send that out to

07:07you as well in significant event forms.

07:09So I'm pretty certain that you're all on

07:11that email. If you're not, let me know.

07:13That's that comes out every day. Every

07:15morning somewhere around 900 9:30 that's

07:18going to come out to you. Uh and that

07:20tells you what events what significant

07:22events happened over the previous night.

07:23Now, as you said on the weekend, you

07:25know, the PIO's are not at work on the

07:27weekend. So on Monday, they do a weekend

07:29recap. And unfortunately, sometimes in

07:31one of those incidents that you're

07:32talking about, the first time we saw it

07:35was on Facebook. And so because when it

07:37happens at two o'clock in the morning

07:38and you wake up at 8 o'clock the next

07:40morning and you have text messages of

07:41people sending you the video, that's the

07:43first time sometimes you see it as well.

07:45So, but as far as communication, if

07:47you're not on that um email thread, let

07:49me know. You should be um as far as the

07:52two instances, the the very first

07:54incident has already been cleared. Um

07:56and it was there was misconduct found

07:58and there was administrative discipline

08:00given to the officer. Uh I won't go into

08:03what you know what the policy failures

08:05were and what his discipline was unless

08:07legal wants to do that. Uh but uh that

08:10was found to be improper conduct and

08:12there was discipline given out. The

08:14second situation at at this point is not

08:16closed but at this point there are no

08:18policy failures to to speak of.

08:22>> Madame vice president.

08:23>> Go ahead again. Chief, thank you so much

08:25for sharing this information with us.

08:27Um, we appreciate the work you put in

08:30and and your commitment to public

08:31safety. My my first question is a

08:33follow-up. That's great news that you

08:35know, you're sharing with us that you

08:37know the status of that, but again,

08:39we're trying to build public confidence.

08:42What is the protocol to let the public

08:43know that just what you said that the

08:46public information you just gave us that

08:47yes, we found out that there was a break

08:50in protocol and of course you're going

08:52to deal with it. That we're not

08:53concerned about that, but that will help

08:55build public confidence. I understand.

08:57I'd have to ask legal what his view

09:01would be on us releasing the officer's

09:03uh situation, but that would be for

09:05Robert.

09:07>> Yeah. C certainly with regard to um a

09:10personnel matter, uh that's not

09:12something that we would we would

09:13release. But I think your question may

09:15be a little different.

09:16>> That it's totally different. Okay. I

09:17want to I want to say it a third time.

09:20We do not want any information that

09:23would jeopardize and place us at risk,

09:25but we do want information that would

09:26build public confidence. So, just like

09:28he just shared, just very general, that

09:31we found that we broke a policy or or

09:34whatever it might be, whatever you can

09:36share with the public, is there a

09:38protocol to share with public, you know,

09:40so that they know that it's been closed

09:42out. So, for example, I have um

09:44constituents that are constantly

09:46emailing me about that incident, right?

09:49But I find out today that that's closed.

09:51We're done with that. It's over with. Is

09:53there any way in our process or can we

09:55have a a structure to let us know when

09:58things like that are closed out?

09:59>> Well, certainly, you know,

10:01Representative um Councilwoman, I I

10:03would say, you know, as as the

10:04representative for your district, you

10:05know, we're we're always happy to engage

10:07with you uh and have those conversations

10:09if there are specific incidents. Um, if

10:12you're talking about just just more

10:13broadly speaking like any protocol that

10:16may have been breached, I think that

10:18that presents a number of challenges,

10:20but specific to this incident in

10:21particular, you know, we're always

10:22welcome to have those conversations and

10:24we we invite that dialogue.

10:25>> Okay. And that'll work for me. So, I'm

10:27going to just summarize what I think I

10:29heard you say. So, for example, that was

10:31an incident that occurred in my area. I

10:33would follow back up with the chief or

10:35with Miss Brown and say, "Okay, can we

10:37get a close out, a status of this?" and

10:39then she would they would articulate

10:41that to me and then I can communicate

10:42that to my constituents. Is that what

10:44I'm hearing?

10:45>> Yes. If it's something that we can share

10:46and and as we said before, you know,

10:48there are certain privileges that attach

10:50to these things and in certain instances

10:51we're not able to share that

10:52information. If it's something that

10:53we're able to share specific to a

10:55relative incident, if you reach out,

10:56we're happy to have that conversation.

10:58>> Okay. Um I want to jump in with just one

11:01thing. Just listening to Councilwoman

11:02Ingram and the videos and how things are

11:05handled. Is there,

11:07>> and I don't want to put more burden on

11:10your officers, but possibly, would there

11:13be a way for someone who knows what's

11:15going on when some of these things

11:16happen to notify the council person,

11:21maybe ahead of the media, maybe ahead of

11:23some others, like when when you get it,

11:24you notify the mayor or the chief of

11:26staff or whomever, notify the council

11:28person if it's in our district, that,

11:30hey, this is going on. We're looking at

11:31it. Just want to give you the heads up

11:32that this is taking place. and whenever

11:34we get more information, we'll get it to

11:36you.

11:37>> Sure. I share everything with the

11:38director. If he's if he wants to do

11:40that, that's fine. Uh, one thing,

11:41Councilwoman Ingram, that I thought

11:43about when you when I sat back down is

11:45we do send a letter to the to the

11:47complainant or the victim of a citizen's

11:48complaint, letting them know what the

11:50outcome is and if we did or did not find

11:52policy errors and if we did or not, uh,

11:55give discipline. And additionally, u,

11:57anytime a use of force is done, we don't

11:58wait on a complaint to be done. It's

12:00automatically get generated by the

12:01supervisor on duty. So, um, that's what

12:04you'll see a lot of times in the

12:05significant event emails that you get

12:07the next morning is that this happened

12:09and when it's happened, there's already

12:10an administrative investigation started.

12:12But we do send correspondence to the

12:14complainant or the victim in any of

12:16those situations.

12:17>> So, back to madame vice president

12:19question. So, is it possible at that

12:22point that we are notified and that now

12:25we have a protocol? I mean, and maybe

12:27it's not a protocol, but at least I know

12:28in my area, I know what the the decision

12:31was and I can move forward from there. I

12:33think that's what she's asking.

12:34>> Yeah. Just something because, you know,

12:36a lot of times I know if I hear

12:38something, I'll call I'll I'll I'll

12:40follow. Hey, I heard this happened.

12:42What's going on? I I just need to know

12:43in case anybody calls me. So, I I think

12:46that's kind of what she's asking for.

12:48Put us on that priority list. Um and

12:51Curtis may be the one that can do that

12:52because I think everything goes to him

12:54anyway. But I think that's what

12:56Councilwoman Ingram would like.

12:57>> Yes. What I'll have to do is just redact

12:59certain bits of information that we

13:00cannot share. Uh and what we'll do is

13:03follow the chain that we currently have

13:05in place. Uh Kesha Brown will receive

13:07that information. Then she'll

13:08disseminate it to the council.

13:09>> Okay.

13:10>> Okay.

13:11[laughter]

13:14>> Follow.

13:15>> Thank you.

13:16>> Okay. Yes. Councilman P.

13:18>> Thank you, Madam Vice President. My

13:19question um the information you stated

13:21that like whatever after the

13:24investigation you sent a letter to the

13:28person in question is that public record

13:31is that does that now become public

13:33record?

13:34>> Uh

13:34>> when that letter goes out to that person

13:36>> it's not something that we publish but

13:38it's something that we give to them and

13:39we can't control if they were to

13:41>> publish it they could. So, but um the

13:43point I guess the point what I'm saying

13:45is if you're giving them that

13:46information of course it's becoming

13:48public then because that person now

13:50>> it's completely in their hands

13:51>> hands. That's right. Okay. So, they has

13:53that information. Um so, is it could you

13:57give that information to us as well? Is

14:01that legal?

14:03>> Again, I think I want to be careful

14:05here. you know, we we want to be able to

14:08um have a free flow exchange of

14:10information where it's appropriate, but

14:12but it's difficult to speak in broad

14:14generalities and say, "Yeah, we'll just

14:15give you anytime we send out a letter uh

14:18closing something out, but we'll copy

14:19the council person on it." It depends on

14:21the substance of that correspondence.

14:23And just because we communicate

14:24something to a particular citizen does

14:27not mean that, you know, we need to CC

14:29the entire public or the entire

14:30community. Oftentimes, that's

14:32information that they may want kept

14:33private as well. So again, I think as I

14:36said before, I think the protocol moving

14:38forward is if if you have a specific

14:41incident that that you want to ask us

14:43about, we're always happy to to field

14:45those requests and and to have that

14:46conversation with you. But to put in

14:49place some kind of blanket or general

14:51protocol where we're going to copy the

14:54council or the public on on any

14:56correspondence we send out, I think that

14:57that that opens us up to a lot of

15:00problems and a lot of uh

15:01miscommunication. No, I get what you're

15:04saying, but I I guess my

15:08you just stated that I'm sure you're not

15:10going to send a person any information

15:12you don't want the public to know

15:15>> that's going through legal matters,

15:17>> right? Yes. As as to legal matters,

15:19certainly. Right. But what I'm saying is

15:21when we're communicating with a citizen,

15:23right? I mean, there may be information

15:25that that particular citizen is not

15:27looking to broadcast to the broader

15:29public, right? I mean, and again, I it's

15:31tough for me to speak in generalities

15:33here, uh, Councilman, because every case

15:36is different. Every specific instance is

15:37different. And like I said, you know,

15:40you know, we we all have a great working

15:41relationship. I like to think we do, and

15:43we're always happy to have these

15:44conversations with you as these specific

15:46instances arise. But to say that we're

15:49just going to, you know, copy uh the

15:52council or the public on on any letter

15:54we send out, I I think we have to look

15:57at it on a case- by case basis. Um and

16:00and I and I hear you and I agree, but

16:01that wasn't my my question. Um it wasn't

16:05I didn't ask can you CC me into our

16:08council for the letter. The question was

16:10legally

16:12when it goes out to them is it now

16:15public they able to do whatever they

16:16want and I'm sure

16:17>> certainly [clears throat and laughter]

16:18we cannot control what is disseminated.

16:20>> So so all right. So now my next question

16:23would be then that information that you

16:25shared with them is it illegal to share

16:28with the council. I'm not asking to do

16:30it. I'm I'm asking is it illegal to be

16:33able to do that?

16:34>> Is it illegal for us to share

16:36information that we have sent to an

16:38individual? Again I I think it's going

16:40to it's it's going to depend on the

16:42specific uh matter that we're talking

16:45about what's involved. I mean for me to

16:47just say any information we send to a

16:49third party we can send to the council

16:52it just depends on what it is.

16:53>> Okay. So in this situation with the

16:56officerled situation where this now is

16:59in public the video is out we did I'm

17:02talking about this just particular

17:04situation

17:04>> right

17:05>> would have been illegal after you share

17:08that information and sent the letter and

17:09said this officer we went through a

17:11discipline process we seen policy were

17:13broken. Would that have been illegal to

17:14share it with us in this situation what

17:16you just sent to them?

17:17>> In this particular instance, I do not

17:19think it has, but I will say I have not

17:20seen this particular closeout letter.

17:22So, I'd have to look at

17:23>> Okay. So the the the the reason why I'm

17:25asking that because I think it's I mean

17:28I'm not I can't direct any

17:29administration to do anything but I

17:31think that going back to Council

17:33Ingramman's point when we have these

17:36type of situations where she's kind of

17:37getting flooded with information. It's

17:40good to give transparency to the

17:42community to let them know something is

17:44taking place. If she's quiet on the

17:46issue and she don't have anything and

17:48then a letter is sent out, I think it's

17:50just good for the council in that

17:52situation now can and and support the

17:55administration and support MPD and say,

17:56"Hey, they have investigated this

17:58matter. This is what's taking place. I

18:01can't share any more information, but

18:02that's that's what's taking place." So I

18:05I think that if we could in moments

18:07where

18:09it's highly public to talk to that

18:12council member, I think it just would be

18:14great from engagement standpoint, not

18:16just for her, but for the administration

18:17as as well for MPD to let the community

18:20know we're taking we taking every

18:22situation serious and we are doing what

18:25we're supposed to be doing.

18:26>> Yeah. And what I would say is that this

18:28mayor and this administration believes

18:30in transparency. We believe in engaging

18:32in that dialogue with the community. Uh

18:35at the same time, it's important for our

18:37officers, I think you all have

18:38acknowledged it, um that for us to uh to

18:42effectively safeguard our communities,

18:44for us to effectively police our

18:45communities, that there are certain

18:47matters that have to be kept privileged

18:49and and frankly are designated as

18:51privilege under Alabama statute. Um and

18:53so that's something that we're always

18:54conscientious of. And so, uh you know,

18:57again, we'll always engage in these uh

18:59conversations. We're happy to have this

19:01dialogue. We just have to know what

19:03specifically we're talking about, what

19:04specifically the request is when it

19:06comes to the information that's being

19:08asked of us.

19:09>> Gotcha.

19:10>> Thank you,

19:11>> madame vice president.

19:13>> Okay.

19:14>> Um I just have a clarification question,

19:16Mr. Shre. Sorry, I waited till you sat

19:19down, then I was going to ask you.

19:21>> Um [laughter] figured try to get your

19:22step count in. Um so, so we're talking

19:26about a closeout letter. um uh is what

19:28you just referred to it as. What? And

19:31just for for the sake of sake of

19:33understanding, what triggers that

19:34closeout letter? Is that an officer?

19:36Obviously, if an officer is involved in

19:38something, um there's going to be some

19:40sort of report, I would believe. Um is

19:43it the is it the report itself that

19:45triggers the closeout letter or is it

19:47more of a um more of a [clears throat]

19:48concern expressed by a citizen or or I

19:51guess how do we get to a closeout

19:53letter?

19:53>> Certainly, I think Chief Jackson's

19:55probably in a better situation to speak

19:56to that. Yeah. So that that letter

19:58that's sent out is at the end when the

20:00investigation's completed and the

20:02findings are done whether or not there's

20:03a policy failure and whether

20:04discipline's been held, whether it's

20:06policy failure and and that person uh

20:08has gone before a trial board or

20:09something of that nature, but once the

20:12once the findings are done, there's a

20:13letter done to the citizen that made the

20:14complaint. And and I'll say this, I know

20:16the attorney hasn't seen these letters,

20:18but there's nothing really privileged

20:20put into those letters other than the

20:22officer's name or the employees name.

20:25Um, so you know, we don't go into the

20:28details of the case. We just basically

20:29tell them, was there a policy failure?

20:31The things that were reviewed through

20:33the investigation, was there a policy

20:34failure? And if there was, what the

20:36outcome was, and if there wasn't, that

20:38they were found, you know, to not be a

20:40credible complaint.

20:43>> Okay. Thank you, Madam Vice President.

20:45Um, I just want to f, you know, figure

20:47out where we landed in that

20:49conversation. I recall hearing that Miss

20:52Brown would communicate with us. If I

20:55can just get a summary of so where are

20:57we with that in terms of communicating

20:59back to the council, you know, the

21:02status of something like that? Where do

21:04we land?

21:05>> Okay. Well, I can tell you this. We're

21:07talking about hypothetical situations

21:09right now, right? Uh and it is hard to

21:12pinpoint how we would handle a

21:14hypothetical situation. I would tell you

21:17that it is customary for Chief Jackson

21:19to reach out to me when there is a

21:20significant event that occurs in the

21:22city. Uh he notifies me of it uh along

21:24with information that is privileged

21:26information. Again, uh that information

21:29often times is so vital to the

21:32investigation that very little

21:34conversation needs to be had about it

21:36whatsoever. Uh ideally, I understand

21:39that there is a need to know to talk to

21:41your constituents about different things

21:43that they alert you to. However, our

21:47ultimate goal is to put the

21:48[clears throat] interest of public

21:49safety first. And I know you all have

21:52responsibilities and we don't I don't I

21:54don't I'm not ignoring those. Uh but I

21:57know that the where we're crossing right

22:01now is what you would like to have

22:06versus what we can possibly give you due

22:09to the nature of certain circumstances.

22:12Um

22:13it is it is um it's what we can do and

22:18what we will do. As I mentioned before,

22:20we will make sure that we provide uh

22:23Miss Brown with information that

22:25pertains to something that happens that

22:28is not so pertinent that we keep it

22:31close

22:33>> that we but those other situations. Yes.

22:36And I'll also say this, there are some

22:37things that Chief Jackson spoke to

22:38earlier that we don't know. We don't

22:41know when stuff pops up on social media

22:43sometimes until you all do. Sometimes

22:45you find out before we do. Uh but what

22:48we do is intentionally look for uh the

22:50answers to those questions and they

22:52often evolve. Uh so when you hear it

22:55first from us so quickly, often times it

22:57may not be as accurate

23:00as we want it to be.

23:01>> So there are necessary delays in sharing

23:04information.

23:05>> Yeah. I mean, I I think what we're

23:06asking for is just

23:09>> not every little thing that happens,

23:11obviously, but the bigger incidents that

23:13happen that get coverage, get news media

23:16play, and get people engaged on social

23:19media,

23:20>> the sooner the better that you can give

23:22us some information that is not going to

23:26uh hinder your investigation,

23:29>> the better. Because people will be

23:31calling. They will get on social media

23:33and say, "What's the city doing? the

23:34city's not doing anything and we need to

23:36be able to counter that with yes the

23:38city is doing the police are

23:40investigating we don't know all the

23:42details yet but you know whatever we can

23:44say to them to let them know she knows I

23:46know he knows what's as much as possible

23:49we know something happened on it they

23:52are staying in contact with us because I

23:54think what she's afraid of and I would

23:56be too is well Councilwoman Ingram don't

23:59have any clue what's going on in her own

24:01district you know and we don't want that

24:02to happen so we will help you guys, you

24:05know, we will help the police because

24:06she too can be kind of a spokesperson

24:08for you all as long as you know, you

24:10help us do that. You know, we work as a

24:13team and and nothing that is going to

24:15hinder your investigation. We all

24:17understand that.

24:18>> We appreciate that. And I will tell you

24:20just as an example of information that

24:22gets out through social media, the

24:25August 23rd incident, people I believe

24:28assumed that these were juveniles that

24:30were involved in this huge issue, this

24:33fight. Uh they were actually adults.

24:36>> They were not kids. Uh and most of what

24:39we encounter are oftentimes adults and

24:41not kids. But often times it's

24:43identified on social media that they

24:45are. And that goes back to my point

24:47earlier. Sometimes we have to pause

24:49[snorts] in certain in sharing certain

24:51bits of information because we don't

24:52know what we don't know

24:54>> exactly

24:54>> until we're able to actually thoroughly

24:56process it

24:57>> and then share it.

24:59>> Right, [clears throat]

25:00>> Councilman Small Commander?

25:02>> Yes.

25:02>> Uh so it is true that this last video

25:05you all did not know about the video

25:07until it was presented through

25:09pre-conference. Correct.

25:11>> That's correct for I know. Yeah.

25:12>> Yeah. Sir, I mean I understand my

25:14colleagues and I understand you all

25:16>> but I guess when the bigger issues come

25:19up if you can just say hey we do know

25:21about this because again the second

25:23video you all did not know about right

25:25but the first one you all did. So I

25:28guess we were asking this the major

25:30issues. Hey you know Councilman woman

25:33you know Ingram you know this and that

25:34and that and this you know I believe and

25:37I understand your hands are full. I mean

25:39between the good stuff and the bad stuff

25:41just as well a Kesha Brown

25:42>> but going through Kesha Brown then Kesha

25:45Brown got to turn turn around go back to

25:46the council person. I believe it might

25:49be much easier and you know and more

25:52come you know besides going to a third

25:54person or third party and just say hey

25:56councilwoman Ingram this had happened

25:58you know last evening would you like a

26:00followup

26:01>> because she might not want to follow up

26:02on the on the next thing and I know you

26:05have to remember every little thing you

26:06know you know she want to follow up you

26:08just just write it down just say hey

26:10I'll follow up and you know maybe six

26:12weeks down the road the case might be

26:14closed out and say hey councilwoman

26:15Ingram hey this was closed out you know

26:17and we didn't find no findings or we did

26:19find some findings besides just going

26:21through Kesha Brown and just be a

26:23one-on-one conversation be like what

26:25Kesha said that Curtis said this and

26:26that and this. So I think it might be

26:28more easier doing that way.

26:29>> I'm all for finding a solution that

26:31works for everyone.

26:32>> Uh I think that we'll sit down with

26:34legal and we'll discuss things that we

26:36can actually share stuff that we know

26:39that is routine. Uh but keeping in mind

26:41that a lot of things are not routine. uh

26:43and those things that are not routine

26:45takes a little time for us to share with

26:46you even though social media may have it

26:47out there broadcast. However, uh what

26:50they often broadcast is not accurate.

26:52>> Yeah. And I truly understand that. But

26:55just like seeing baby core Gina, you

26:58know, between council pre-consil and

27:00council meeting say, "Hey, you know,

27:02Miss Gregory, um we did, you know,

27:04follow up on this and you know, was a

27:06closing or hey, we still working on

27:08that." Yeah. Something simple like that.

27:10I think it's going through Kesha Brown

27:12and Kesha Brown kind of I think that's a

27:14little bit too much.

27:15>> We'll follow up with with with

27:16[clears throat] Robert uh attorney

27:18Shrie. Uh and again I'll say this uh our

27:20job is our goal is not to make it

27:22difficult for you all. Our goal is to

27:25make sure that we are doing our due

27:26diligence and making sure that officers

27:29remain safe, that those that report to

27:31us remain safe, and that the general

27:34public remains safe.

27:37>> Thank you, Madam Vice President. Um I do

27:39have a question for you. The incident

27:41that was just closed out you well I

27:43shouldn't say just closed out but the um

27:44video that has been closed out where you

27:46all did find that we you know broke our

27:49policy. What was the date on that close

27:51out? When did they receive that closeout

27:52letter?

27:53>> I don't have it with me.

27:56>> Do you know if it was like a couple

27:57months ago or

28:00usually it just depends on the

28:01investigation but you the investigation

28:03usually takes a few weeks to get

28:04completed. So, uh, to give you an actual

28:06date because at this in this situation

28:08after the investigation was completed,

28:10you had to have an administrative

28:11hearing held with the officer and then

28:13the findings come in. So, I don't have

28:15the date for you. I mean, it's easily

28:16for me to get. I just don't have it with

28:18me now.

28:18>> Okay. And my point in that question is

28:20this, just to summarize what madame vice

28:23president has shared and president,

28:24[clears throat]

28:24is that we shouldn't come here to a

28:26meeting to find out that it's closed

28:28out. I can now respond back to the 10

28:30people that have responded to me to say,

28:32"Yes, we've addressed that. It has been

28:34closed out. We just don't want to find

28:36out in this type of meeting." So,

28:38whatever that protocol, you know,

28:40whatever is designed, whatever is going

28:42to look like, maybe it's not a protocol,

28:43but if we can just find a way to in a

28:45timely way to keep us informed is all

28:47we're asking.

28:48>> I'm opposed to it.

28:49>> Thank you, sir.

28:51>> Anybody else on these first two?

28:54All right, moving right along then.

28:56Let's go to the third one. um

28:58enforcement uh for the city's juvenile

29:00curfew, particularly downtown.

29:04Who wants to start?

29:09[laughter]

29:15[laughter]

29:17Generally speaking, the juvenile curfew

29:20uh that's in place in the entertainment

29:21district uh that applies to those that

29:23are under the age of 18 obviously,

29:25right?

29:25>> Under the age. Can you speak into the

29:27microphone? It's hard to hear.

29:28>> Under the age of 18. Um, and so what it

29:32comes down to is,

29:35uh, if our officers come across someone

29:36who appears to be under 18 or we have

29:38information they under 18 in

29:41entertainment district after the the

29:43time, um, then officer is going to stop

29:46them, going to ask them for

29:47identification, you know, or or name and

29:49address, those things, uh, and try to

29:51determine exactly how old they are. Um,

29:54if they're determined to be in

29:56violation, if they are a juvenile, uh,

29:59then there's several steps we can take.

30:00We can, uh, we can warn, release, we can

30:04hold, call the parent and give the

30:07parent a warning and release them to the

30:08parent. Uh, or we can, uh, write a

30:11citation uh, to that parent. Uh, and the

30:14first citation, I believe, is first fine

30:16is $100. uh any subsequent fine within a

30:20one-year period uh that fine increases

30:24uh I believe to I I don't recall the

30:26exact amount but it increases to maybe

30:28250 500. Okay.

30:31>> So,

30:32>> okay.

30:32>> And I think the problem what we're

30:34seeing though is what the chief uh or

30:37actually director Gray spoke to earlier

30:38is that uh to a lot of us uh 18 year

30:42olds look like children. It's just the

30:45honest truth. And so when you see them

30:47on social media, media downtown, um it

30:50may be that they that they look like

30:52children, uh but that they're actually

30:54above the age that it falls into that

30:56that that you know.

30:58>> Oh, so you're saying that people who

30:59were 21 and above sometimes look like

31:01they're 18 to y'all? It's kind of hard

31:03to tell. Is that what

31:04>> No, I'm saying no, no, no, no, no. I'm

31:06saying that the public's perception if

31:08they see 18 year olds in a social media

31:11video on Dolphin Street late on a Friday

31:13night, they'll say, "What are all these

31:15children doing downtown?"

31:16>> Oh. Oh.

31:17>> And it may be the fact that they're not

31:20they are,

31:20>> right? And so we we do get a lot of

31:22complaints about that that people just

31:23assume that uh you know that gap between

31:2718 and 21 a lot of times they can look

31:29like children u especially to older

31:32adults obviously. And so uh but there's

31:34obviously not much we can do about that

31:35and and that is an issue that we have

31:37faced downtown is the uh that gap

31:40between 18 and 21. They're too old for

31:42the curfew but they're too young to go

31:45into the businesses right into the into

31:46the bars or the clubs. Um and so that's

31:50where a lot of our issue comes from.

31:52>> Okay. Uh questions.

31:55>> Thank you and thank you again for

31:57sharing. My question to that in terms of

32:00uh enforcement um and and you might not

32:03have all the statistics with you but how

32:05many um violations would you say you

32:07know on an average that you all have

32:09actually had to enforce that in terms of

32:12arrest?

32:13>> I don't have hard numbers on that. Don't

32:15uh I would say in my experience downtown

32:17overwhelmingly

32:19uh most people if we do determine that

32:21they are juvenile and they are valid in

32:23the curfew uh most of the time they

32:25comply uh and there's no enforcement

32:27action that has to be taken. We're able

32:28to find a parent um and it's it's it's

32:32in my experience pretty rare that we've

32:34had to take enforcement action.

32:36>> Okay.

32:37>> Yeah.

32:38>> Right. Thank you

32:40CJ. What is the average age?

32:43[clears throat] Are we having problems

32:44with citizens? I mean, because like you

32:45said, the last video, many people

32:47thought that was children, teenagers,

32:49but they were actually adults. What's

32:51the average age? Are we having issues

32:53with, you know, the citizens,

32:56>> right? So, I I I I'd be lying if I told

32:58you I knew an exact age, but I do know

33:01downtown on the entertainment district,

33:03uh, in my experience down there, those

33:0618 to 21 or 18 to 20, I should say,

33:09before they've turned 21, uh, were the

33:12biggest issues because, uh, they would

33:15loiter, right? And obviously it's not

33:17against the law to loiter uh for the

33:20most part uh especially in an

33:21entertainment district because we're

33:23we're inviting people we're inviting

33:24adults to come down and to do just that.

33:26We shut down the street so that they can

33:27stand in the street. Um only problem is

33:30most people that are 21 and older uh

33:32that go into the businesses. They may

33:34spend a little time in the street or

33:35traversing from one business or one bar

33:37or one club to the next, but they're not

33:39going to remain there the entire night.

33:41If you're 18 to 20 years old though, you

33:44don't have much choice if you want to

33:45stay downtown because you can't go

33:47inside. Uh so you'll see them a lot of

33:49times gathered up in the street. Uh

33:51maybe on some of the picnic tables that

33:53some of the restaurants have on outdoor

33:56seating. Um and that that's caused some

33:59issue. Obviously um you know young

34:01people uh with nothing but time on their

34:03hands sometimes uh things get a lot of

34:06get a little out of hand. uh especially

34:08if they want to hang around areas where

34:11alcohol are being served and they're

34:12trying to get their hands on alcohol as

34:13well. So um but but yes 18 to 20 would

34:17be the biggest uh hurdle we have

34:19downtown or the biggest uh

34:21>> so I guess the question is really to the

34:24city. Do we need to expand

34:28the age from 18 to 21? Because you

34:32saying that the most issue that we have

34:34is between the ages of 18 and 21 because

34:37they don't have nothing to do. So if you

34:39don't have nothing to do, you should not

34:40be down there because you can't go

34:42inside the club. So that's like an

34:44option that we can need to expand the

34:46age from like to 21 and over.

34:51I I think maybe you run into there once

34:53someone becomes 18 uh then you run into

34:56a constitutional issue uh that we cannot

34:59uh tell an adult that they can't stand

35:01on a public sidewalk or stand in a

35:03public street but we've shut down for

35:05that particular use. Um and so that's

35:09again that's kind of where where it gets

35:11really really tricky uh for the the

35:13council to try to pass an ordinance

35:15saying that unless you're 21 you can't

35:18be in this area. I I don't know that

35:20that's possible.

35:21>> But you tell someone adult that's 19

35:24that you can't drink because you had 21.

35:26>> Well, I know. I You guys know, right?

35:28State of Alabama does, right? Um but

35:31again, that may be something that that

35:34Mr. Sh can speak to a little bit better

35:36than I can.

35:39>> Yeah. I think just getting back to what

35:41Matt said, I mean, you know, a lot of

35:43these individuals are adults under the

35:45law, right? And so that's something that

35:47we have to consider. Um, we're always

35:49willing to look into different options,

35:51you know, like you mentioned. I mean,

35:52we're happy to have those discussions

35:54and and research different ways to um to

35:57make downtown safer. Uh, and and happy

36:00to listen to any any proposals that any

36:02of you have. Um, but in terms of, you

36:06know, just yeah, raising the age to 21,

36:07I don't know that that's something we

36:08can do.

36:10>> Yeah. Especially if you're having

36:11problems with the ages with adults

36:14between the ages of 18 and 21. I mean,

36:17again, you telling them they can't drink

36:19until they turn 21. So, you're in a

36:21drinking area, you know. So, that's what

36:23I was looking at.

36:25>> Yeah.

36:26>> Um, going [clears throat] back to um the

36:29steps that you're using um for the

36:31curfew, you mentioned uh warn and

36:34release, parents warning, and possibly

36:36writing citations. Are any of these

36:38steps, do any of these steps involve

36:40detaining juveniles, and if so, where is

36:43that being done?

36:44>> Sure. So, we do not have a when we first

36:47back years ago, and I'm not sure I

36:50believe maybe you were on the council at

36:51that point, um uh we did have a uh not a

36:55detention center, but we had a a a

36:57facility uh to where the juveniles could

37:00be transported there by the police

37:02officer. Uh and there were personnel

37:04there uh that were dedicated to uh

37:06handling the process, right? in that

37:08process involved first of all notifying

37:10a parent um and then determining whether

37:14or not that parent was going to receive

37:15a citation based on the circumstances.

37:18Uh today we do not have a curfew center

37:20is what we called it. Uh we do not have

37:22a curfew center so it's really done uh

37:26locally so to speak per precinct, right?

37:28So if we have a officer who's got a

37:30juvenile um and we need to contact a

37:33parent, they're going to try to do it

37:34right there from the scene, right there

37:35from their police car, right? Um, and a

37:38lot of times we can get the parent to

37:40come right there to the scene to pick

37:41the child up.

37:42>> If we have issues where we can't contact

37:44the parent, there's some delay there,

37:47then we very well may take them back to

37:48the precinct. Uh, obviously somewhere,

37:51you know, air condition, seating,

37:53bathroom, things of that nature. U so

37:55that we can continue uh working on

37:57trying to reach a parent or a guardian

37:59or someone of age. Um but like I said

38:02most of the time uh we are fortunate in

38:05that uh we we are able to to remedy it

38:09on scene so to speak.

38:12>> Madam vice president uh thank you u for

38:15that uh sharing of that because I was

38:17concerned about not having a facility

38:19but as I listen to you um you're sharing

38:22you you know where we are in terms of

38:23the curfew. It sounds like you're saying

38:26that the existing curfew we have, the

38:29ordinance, the tools we have, they're

38:31working for you that it's working. And

38:33and I want to give an isolate one

38:35incident and I'm sure if I can go back

38:37through my notes, I can find others. But

38:39one recent incident where um a juvenile

38:42was killed downtown and that child was

38:45underage and there were others down

38:47there because I know the family, I know

38:48the other kids that were down there. To

38:51me, again, they were violating the

38:53curfew. But what I hear you say is that,

38:56you know, that it's really not an issue.

38:58You know, I know was I know it wasn't an

39:00issue on the August 23rd. Those were

39:02people older than, you know, 18,

39:05>> but there's a clear uh situation where

39:10they were juveniles, right?

39:12>> Sure.

39:12>> And I guess my question is, you know,

39:16how are we enforcing that? You know, it

39:19do we enforce that?

39:21>> Right. So I I won't say to back to the

39:24beginning of your question where you're

39:25saying that it's not necessarily an

39:26issue for us or that it's working for

39:28us. I wouldn't go so far as to say that

39:29it's necessarily completely working for

39:31us. Um I think any of you that are

39:34familiar with the the curfew for minors

39:37ordinance uh knows that uh we're not

39:40actually holding the juvenile

39:42accountable. We can't. It's the parent

39:44or the guardian. Um, and so for us to

39:47take an enforcement action or to to

39:48issue a citation, it can only go to that

39:52parent or guardian. Um, we can't take

39:55the child to Strickland Youth Center for

39:57violating the curfew. Uh, Strickland

39:59Youth Center. Uh, obviously it's not

40:01going to take a child for uh violating a

40:03city ordinance. And in in effect, really

40:06the the child is not the one that's

40:07violating the ordinance the way it's

40:09written. It's the parent. uh that the

40:11the child is just, you know, kind of the

40:13byproduct of it, so to speak. Um and so

40:16to say that it's necessarily working for

40:18us, uh it's definitely a tool we we use

40:21and that we do lean on. However, to say

40:24that it has the teeth that we would like

40:26for it to have, no, I mean,

40:28understandably, we would like to be able

40:31to uh take that child somewhere like

40:34Strickland Youth Center and and and do

40:36the processing from that point so that

40:38we go ahead and get them off the street.

40:40so that those type situations don't

40:41happen. Uh now, my experience downtown,

40:44we would have uh for the most part,

40:48uh when we would put out PSAs, uh and

40:50put up the the signs downtown about the

40:52juvenile curfew, we would get for the

40:54most part compliance. However, there

40:56would be uh what I would call um nights

40:59where you would have an influx where it

41:02was like, I don't know if it was a a

41:03social media thing where they would all

41:05say, "Hey, let's all head downtown." And

41:07those were very difficult because when

41:09you've got, you know, several, you know,

41:12maybe 50 to 100 juveniles that that uh

41:15come downtown at one time, um trying to

41:19detain that many juveniles and find that

41:21many parents, it's just not feasible.

41:24So, uh in those kind of cases, uh we try

41:27to contain it. We try to find the kind

41:29of the leaders or the troublemakers, try

41:32to remove them, enforce the curfew upon

41:34them. Uh but to say that we can do to do

41:37that, you give a blanket statement if we

41:39do it to everybody that comes downtown

41:40is under 18 would not be accurate.

41:43>> So just as a followup, I think what I

41:45hear him saying is that you know they do

41:47we do need some support with that

41:49because when they do make that decision

41:51and it's more than one or two, they have

41:52nowhere to place the students not but

41:55the uh juveniles. So that's right. Okay.

41:58>> Yeah. Other than to go to a precinct.

42:01>> That's right. Go ahead. Also, Miss to to

42:04your point as well, if the if it's if

42:06the juvenile is there and doesn't look

42:08like a juvenile and we have no reason to

42:10engage with them, which oftentimes is

42:11the situation until something happens,

42:14um they're not violating any any laws or

42:16or anything. So, if if they give us the

42:19opportunity or if they absolutely look

42:20just too young, then then we're going to

42:22check them. But if they're not

42:24misbehaving and there's no reason to

42:25check them, it's a possibility that a

42:2817-year-old kid could be down there and

42:29he looks 19 and there's not a reason for

42:32us to check them.

42:34>> Okay, anybody else? Okay, let's uh go on

42:38to number four.

42:41I think we probably have already covered

42:43this one. Um the process for promptly

42:46notifying city council. Yeah. Okay.

42:49departmental standards for determining

42:51appropriate officer staffing and

42:52deployment based on crowd size,

42:54anticipated risk and event conditions.

42:57Um

43:01>> yes, so obviously we look we work off of

43:03mostly off of historical data. We know

43:05what events are coming. Uh we plan for

43:07those events. Uh depends on if there's

43:10something uh additional happening on

43:12that addition on that weekend and we'll

43:14deploy, you know, more resources. uh but

43:16just the history of it and I won't bring

43:19put Chief Garrett back on the spot but

43:20he ran it for years down there is we

43:22look at the historical data of what

43:23certain events bring and so that that

43:25allows us to know what type of police

43:28manpower we need down there very seldom

43:31do we get in a situation where we don't

43:33have enough uh on the on the average

43:34weekend we do most of the same thing on

43:36every weekend but it's just say if there

43:37was going to be a concert somewhere if

43:39there was an event at the Sanger we may

43:41have additional so we look at what what

43:43the events are going to be and we kind

43:44of know based on that what resources we

43:46need to put there.

43:47>> I I think as far as the big events, the

43:49planned events, the things that we know

43:50about, y'all do a terrific job. I mean,

43:52I have them out at the fairgrounds all

43:54the time. I think Josh and I can both

43:56agree that you all do an amazing job. It

43:59may be what Councilwoman Ingram is

44:01asking about are things that maybe are

44:04not the big pop that pop up. We see

44:07those and we try our best to monitor,

44:09you know, social media and see if

44:10there's an event being scheduled or

44:12somebody promoting one. And if there is,

44:14we allocate additional resources. But

44:15you're right, there are times when we

44:17don't know until they show up and then

44:18we have to there's times where we have

44:20to pull officers from other precincts to

44:21come assist until we can get it home.

44:23But that's not very often. Usually we

44:26know what's going to be and we plan for

44:27it.

44:28>> Okay. Anybody else?

44:29>> That does speak to another issue when we

44:31talk about social media and what we're

44:33seeing on social media. When things pop

44:36up about meeting here or meeting there,

44:38oftent times we're seeing that folks are

44:40talking about doing things in areas

44:43and creating major problem for the city.

44:46Um it is

44:49dare I say very difficult to anticipate

44:51that

44:52>> uh or have the appropriate number of

44:54officers there at the time this incident

44:57happens. Uh we're just dealing with a

44:59lot of nuances, a lot of new things that

45:01we traditionally in the past did not

45:02have to deal with and we're trying to

45:04figure it out like every other

45:05department across the country. Uh but to

45:08your point, yes, these are things that

45:09pop up. They pop up. when they do pop

45:11up. Sometimes we find out after others

45:14find out and we try to respond to it

45:16accordingly.

45:17>> Yeah, I've seen lots of news stories

45:19lately about some of these popups and

45:21takeovers or whatever they're they're

45:23called sort of thing. Yeah. Anybody else

45:25questions? Okay, let's go on to number

45:28six then. That's um

45:30policies, training standards regarding

45:33deescalation, crowd control, use of

45:35force, and what constitutes excessive

45:37force.

45:42Good afternoon. So, when we're talking

45:45about uh you know, we have policies,

45:48general orders, things like that that

45:50does govern how we use force. Um when we

45:52talk about deescalation,

45:54um we train at Adazi. Okay. For the most

45:57part, I've been doing this job for about

46:0026 years and I can say I've taught more

46:04people in the back of that police car

46:06than I've had to put hands on. Um but

46:08that's not always the case. Um when we

46:11train, when we talk about um

46:13deescalation, uh things like that, we

46:16are leading um the state right now in uh

46:18crisis intervention intervention

46:20training. Um that's huge. Okay, that's

46:23huge. Um we we much rather talk someone

46:27in the calming down than we would having

46:30to go hands-on. Um we have what they

46:32call force continuum. All right? And

46:34that's taught in the academy. It's

46:36taught in inservice. It's taught in RO

46:38uh roll call training. Again, we do it

46:40at Nauseium. Um and a lot of times, you

46:44know, do I is there something saying I

46:47have to go by the force continuum

46:49continuum to a tea all the time

46:51depending on the situation? Okay. The

46:54officers are taught and officers are

46:55trained to take control of situation as

46:58quickly as possible so nothing else

47:01happens, right? So that may that may go

47:04from step one to step four very very

47:06rapidly. It just depends. Um but again

47:09training is paramount, right? We want to

47:11make sure that the officers do have the

47:13tools, the training and the knowhow to

47:15bring that that situation down as quick

47:19and rapidly as possible. When we talk

47:21about um crowd control, crowd control,

47:24it depends. There's several factors. um

47:27you know we we do send them to a school

47:29that happens in uh in North Alabama

47:32about um our QRF training which is a

47:34quick response force that we use um

47:37depending on the the uh crowd uh or

47:40things like that just like Chief um

47:43Jackson talked about depending on our

47:45staffing and depending on um the event

47:47itself um we may put extra resources or

47:50extra uh manpower in that to control a

47:53possibility of a crowd that may happen

47:56um later on in that that that aspect.

47:58So, um again, training is paramount. We

48:01don't make we want to make sure that our

48:02officers do have the uh the skills um to

48:05make that happen. When we talk about

48:07what constitutes

48:09um excessive force, that's on a case- by

48:12case basis. That's what the

48:13investigation is for. Okay. Um if we do

48:16get a um again, if there's force used,

48:19we do an investigation before a

48:22complaint even comes. we're they're on

48:23that supervisor on that um from the

48:26get-go. That then runs up several chains

48:28and several eyes look at that to

48:30determine whether or not it is excessive

48:33or whether or not it's within policy.

48:36>> I've got a little followup to this is a

48:41this is for you and for Chief Glisten.

48:43Um, when you come to a scene and there's

48:46a lot going on, maybe it's a crowd of

48:47people, maybe someone has been shot and

48:50par fire medics arrive on the scene, how

48:53do you work together to ensure that they

48:57can get over there and do their job to

48:59try to prevent any further injuries,

49:02loss of life while this maybe crowd is,

49:06you're still trying to control the

49:07crowd. How do you all partner together

49:09to make these things work? Well, one

49:10thing that we do is uh once we get on

49:12the scene, once the officers get on the

49:14scene, we want to make sure that again

49:16that the crowd is docile. If there if

49:18there we get enough personnel on the

49:19scene to try to back this crowd up, try

49:21to get room so that the fire makers can

49:24come in and do their work. A lot of

49:25times we make sure we render the scene

49:28um safe before they get there on the

49:31scene so they they can go in and do the

49:33work they they need to without a

49:35distraction or interruption. I think

49:37sometimes you all have to try to even

49:39subdue some of the folks involved so

49:41that the fire medics can come in and

49:44>> that's a possibility. Yes, ma'am. It's a

49:46possibility.

49:47>> Absolutely.

49:47>> Anything you want to add, chief, with

49:49that?

49:51>> For us, it's safety.

49:54We do have ballistic that type of stuff

49:56that's issued to all of our crew

49:58members. So if there is an incident warm

50:02necessarily an active shooting but not

50:04necessarily a cold zone we can go in

50:07there and start shooting the victim and

50:09get them out there.

50:11[snorts]

50:13>> Okay. Thank you. Any followup? Anybody?

50:16>> Just one thing I want to add. Okay.

50:17Councilwoman uh Gregory. Um I'm excited

50:20when we talk about CIT training our uh

50:23crisis intervention training. Um we're

50:25leading again we're leading the state

50:27>> in this training. uh so much so that we

50:29are in the process of being the leading

50:31hub in uh training. We have several

50:33officers trained um and we put two

50:36officers per squad on uh in every

50:39precinct. When we talk about crisis

50:41intervention training, most people think

50:44that you know it's always a mental or

50:46some type of mental uh illness or mental

50:48issue that they're going through, but

50:49that may not always be the case. Crisis

50:52is what it is. um a crisis and that

50:55person may be going through something

50:57that they've never had to go through

50:59before. So they may be in a situation uh

51:02where they are going through a crisis

51:03and that's why that it's important that

51:05we have officers that can deescalate

51:07that situation

51:09um before you know before we there have

51:11to be a hands-on type situation. So,

51:14we're pushing that training down and

51:15we've again we've been doing that at

51:17Nauseium, making sure that we do have

51:19the appropriate resources to deal with

51:21the uh the citizens, not only the

51:23officer safety, but the citizen safety

51:25as well.

51:27>> Anybody else? Any other follow-ups?

51:28Thank you.

51:29>> Thank you. Let's see. Um where are we?

51:32Uh procedures for documenting,

51:34reviewing, and communicating incidents

51:36involving use of force or significant

51:38crowd management actions. We've kind of

51:40already been t talking about that. um

51:43how do you all uh report that and I

51:47guess not just to the media but but for

51:49us

51:49>> yeah like we've already

51:52investigation start in the field where

51:54it happens most of the time

51:56>> and it's going to make it way you know

51:57once the investigation done it's come up

52:00for review and ultimately to me so it's

52:05the same procedure we were already

52:06talking about before whether it's a

52:07citizens complaint or whether it's an

52:09investigation that our supervisors start

52:11based on a number of factors. Doesn't

52:13always have to use force. It could be

52:16something as simple as having to an

52:19injury. There's every investigation get

52:22done work

52:25to our desk.

52:34So, just go.

52:36>> Okay. All right. Anything else? Um, I

52:39did see Blake Brown in the back and I

52:41just want to say to all of you all and

52:43to him while he's here, great job.

52:46>> He is really, really good at getting all

52:48the information to us as quickly as

52:50possible. When it changes, he updates

52:52us. So, great job, Blake.

52:55>> All right. Uh, let's go on to um I guess

52:59we're on number eight. Well, we are

53:00going through these. Okay. Update on

53:02safe passage program, including how the

53:04program is currently working.

53:07I want to

53:09[laughter]

53:14thank the way

53:21[snorts]

53:22safe passage um I would tell you it's

53:25one of the gems of my office right now

53:28in terms of what we're trying to

53:29accomplish because when we talk about

53:32crime and reduction of crime we have to

53:34also think about how do

53:36uh tie in uh non-traditional

53:40things that we need to do uh that law

53:43enforcement traditionally does not do or

53:45public safety in general um that we're

53:47trying to do now to address issues that

53:50oftentimes we used to say weed and seed

53:53that was a federal program. Uh but

53:56that's what we're doing. We are we are

53:59still diligently enforcing the law. We

54:04are looking for bad actors, but we're

54:06also trying to give others opportunities

54:09to do better. Uh, I'm going to hand out

54:12a few things to you.

54:19>> Best safe passage in a nutshell.

54:21>> Okay.

54:22>> Kind of speaks to what it's about, the

54:24purpose of it,

54:25>> and what um our hope and our intent will

54:29be. Uh but that is uh you know currently

54:33we're at the floor and we're at

54:35Williamson.

54:36>> Uh the goal is this right now is it's in

54:38a pilot stage. Uh uh safe passage is not

54:42something new. So Mobile we did not just

54:45come up with this strategy. This is a

54:47strategy that a lot of cities I won't

54:49say a lot of cities but some cities uh

54:51Chicago being one uh that have

54:55implemented strategies like this. Um it

54:58is for the purpose of creating

55:01uh safe passageways for youth to go to

55:04and from school home or a recreation

55:09center and and we have our recreation

55:11centers that we encourage them to

55:13actually go to because we have

55:14additional programming there. I will

55:17tell you you see the fire you see the

55:19fire department here fire department's

55:21here because this is a team effort on

55:24our part in public safety. It's not just

55:26the police. It's not just our nonsworn.

55:29It's uh is our firefighters as well. Our

55:31firefighters are actually out with us.

55:34They are in the parks. They're on the

55:36sidewalks of schools. They're engaging

55:38students where they are. And they are

55:41finding it to be enjoyable in the sense

55:43that they're getting a chance to give

55:45back and have engagement with young

55:47people. And young people are getting a

55:49chance to see professional people,

55:51accountable people, uh in their space at

55:54some point in time.

55:56Um, so this program is uh working as it

56:00should and we continue to um to

56:04fine-tune it.

56:06But I am thankful that Councilman Pin

56:09and others who have asked to participate

56:13are wanting to participate and I

56:15encourage everyone uh to participate. Uh

56:19public safety is communal.

56:21>> It's not just something that law

56:23enforcement does. It is something that

56:25we all have a stake in and in order for

56:28law enforcement to be successful,

56:30the public has to be part of the

56:32solution. Uh Chief Jackson and I talk

56:35quite a bit and one of the things that

56:37we're running into, we have kids that

56:39are in middle school that are out here

56:42shooting indiscriminately.

56:45This is why this program is so

56:47important.

56:49Um, we are encouraging everyone

56:53uh to get from behind the keyboard,

56:56those that do,

56:59and to actually be part of a solution.

57:01It's just that simple.

57:03Uh, 30 minutes out of your out of your

57:06day, once a week, or once a month.

57:11That's what we're asking. those who

57:14truly want to see safer communities,

57:17then they have to be a part of that.

57:20We've got a we've got a ways to go like

57:22any other city,

57:24but this is our start.

57:28>> Okay, council.

57:30>> Yeah. Thank you, Madam Vice President,

57:31and thank you, Director Graves, um for

57:34sharing this information about the safe

57:36passage program. And like I said before,

57:39um we definitely have my support, and

57:41we're meeting September the 29th. Um,

57:43and I'm asking all pastors, all business

57:46leaders, all residents to join in and be

57:49a part. Um, because like you said, at a

57:52certain point, we got to stop being

57:54behind the computer screen. We have to

57:55get out in the community and work

57:57together. Um, this is not a MPD problem.

58:00This is not a fire department. This not

58:02this this all of our problems. And we

58:05have to come collectively to create

58:07change. And so, I'm excited about

58:10September 29th. I think this is a good

58:12opportunity to build those relationships

58:16um and show a difference. Um we have

58:18seen um I lost a classmate recently um

58:22to gun violence um and we have seen the

58:25shooting that has been taking place at

58:27Rick Park. Um and we have to do

58:30something about it. And so even now as

58:33uh if you know something, say something.

58:35You know, it's different ways that you

58:37can be a part of a safe passage program.

58:40Um, and I think this is a key. So, thank

58:42you so much for presenting this

58:44information um to us.

58:47>> I would add one other thing and Chief

58:49Jackson can speak to it as well. Uh, the

58:51city of Mobile Police Department uh made

58:55a pledge to the International

58:56Association of Chiefs of Police, IECP,

58:59uh, building trust campaign. Uh, Chief

59:01Jackson signed that campaign letter uh,

59:04year was it?

59:05>> 24. uh is it speaks to multiple tenants

59:10that are goal setting tenants for any

59:13agency seeking to be part of that

59:16solution and that is part of safer

59:18communities but it's part about it's

59:20part part of it is about building trust

59:22as uh Dr. spoke to uh we do have to

59:25build trust. We have to improve trust.

59:27We have trust but we have to improve it.

59:28We always have to improve it. Um but the

59:31uh but that that commitment that

59:34building trust campaign commitment means

59:36a lot. We are the only agency

59:39in our region that made that commitment.

59:42If that means anything to you means a

59:44lot to me.

59:46Okay? We're not waiting for others to do

59:48it. We're doing it. Uh, so I just want

59:52to say more more importantly, I know we

59:54still have some other things to talk

59:55about, but I can't speak enough about

59:58the great things that Mobile Police

1:00:00Department does.

1:00:02So, uh, will they always get it right?

1:00:05You know, we have 500 officers, over 500

1:00:07officers. Things will happen, but the

1:00:11response is there.

1:00:14Yeah, madam vice president. Um, and I

1:00:17and I agree with you, dire director

1:00:19Graves. Um, and I think that's the

1:00:20biggest key. I think even the beginning

1:00:22when we was asking about the information

1:00:25regarding the video, I think it's not I

1:00:28think sometimes as a city, I'm saying we

1:00:31I think sometimes we we get to a place

1:00:33where we see the council, we see the

1:00:34administration, we see the MPD, we see

1:00:37the fire department, um, and we all

1:00:40start working in our own silos instead

1:00:42of working together. Um, and so the

1:00:44information that we're requesting,

1:00:47um, is not more of like

1:00:50we're upset at the department as a

1:00:53whole, but it's it's being an advocate.

1:00:56I heard Vice President Gregory say, "We

1:00:59want to be an advocate. We want to say

1:01:01like, no, this when we receive

1:01:03information, no, I know that they're

1:01:06going to investigate this matter and if

1:01:08they find something, that person is

1:01:11going to be held responsible from some

1:01:13way, whatever the policy states from a

1:01:15disciplinary um action, but when we

1:01:18don't have that information or even from

1:01:20like the safe passage program, we want

1:01:22to be able to

1:01:24>> to highlight these things.

1:01:26>> So, um just going forward and you have

1:01:28done amazing. I'm just want to highlight

1:01:29and let the public know I do think we

1:01:32can elevate that where we can come

1:01:33together as a team and just work a

1:01:35little better knowing that it's not just

1:01:38one department. This shouldn't just be

1:01:39on you all. It should be a we are part

1:01:41of it as well. And we got to be able to

1:01:43tell the story,

1:01:44>> but the only way to tell the story is to

1:01:46know the story and know exactly what's

1:01:48going on.

1:01:48>> I appreciate that. There's an old adage

1:01:50that, you know, you'll never make all

1:01:52the people happy all of the time. Uh but

1:01:54we try our very best to make as many

1:01:57happy as we can. That's the goal. Um but

1:02:01understanding reality is reality and and

1:02:04to the point that you all have made here

1:02:06today, uh we do want to find ways of

1:02:09providing information to you in ways

1:02:12that allow you at best to respond to

1:02:15things that you can respond to. But

1:02:18going back to my original statement,

1:02:20there are some things that are going to

1:02:21be very difficult to do that way.

1:02:24Bo,

1:02:26>> Commander Graves, thank you. Um, this is

1:02:29really directed more towards safe

1:02:31passage. Uh, one thing that stands out

1:02:34to me and with this whole program is one

1:02:37word I keep seeing over and over and

1:02:39it's relationships.

1:02:40>> And, um, I just I'm really have bought

1:02:44into this. Um, I see the relationships

1:02:47between MPD, mobile fire and rescue,

1:02:50neighborhoods, community leaders,

1:02:52schools. So, I'm excited uh to hopefully

1:02:55be able to attend on the 29th um with

1:02:58Councilman Penn and anyone else. Um, so

1:03:02I've bought in u you know, I'm excited

1:03:06to hear about how this pilot goes with

1:03:08Williamson before um your department as

1:03:11far as MPD, fire and rescue. Um, uh, so

1:03:16thank you for providing this to us.

1:03:17>> Thank you. And I would like to say this

1:03:18too as well, Mobile Fire. Um, I mean,

1:03:22they're out with us.

1:03:24Who does that? The people that do that

1:03:27are folks that are team oriented. They

1:03:29understand what we're trying to

1:03:30accomplish

1:03:32and they're doing it. So, yeah. And I

1:03:34and Chief Glisten, thank you for for

1:03:36part of the I I'm not a public safety

1:03:38expert, but I just feel like having the

1:03:41community having a strong rapport with

1:03:43our community uh and public safety

1:03:45leaders, fire, police, everybody. I

1:03:49being visible,

1:03:51seeing these folks in their

1:03:52neighborhood, recognizing it's a good

1:03:54thing that you're there and that it's

1:03:56not always a bad thing when you see

1:03:57these first responders and and MPD in

1:03:59your neighborhood. So, I appreciate that

1:04:02and um I'm I'm looking forward to being

1:04:04involved in whatever capacity I can.

1:04:06>> Okay,

1:04:07>> Madam Vice President,

1:04:08>> um I want to echo the sentiments of

1:04:11Councilman Pin. Um I agree in the sense

1:04:13that this is an awesome opportunity.

1:04:16Thank you uh for the work that you're

1:04:17doing and moving this forward. Um but I

1:04:20do want to get clarity. So I know that

1:04:24it's happening in uh at Laflu and

1:04:25Williamson and I'll be there on the 29th

1:04:28but when you look at how well the

1:04:30program is doing knowing that you're

1:04:31just starting I'm thinking about

1:04:32Williamson because I want to be able to

1:04:34make sure that um as we collaborate

1:04:37because it takes all of us that we are

1:04:38really moving our moving in the right

1:04:41direction and supporting the program. So

1:04:43when you think about Williamson, what's

1:04:44the one thing, you know, in your initial

1:04:47implementation that you need more of or

1:04:49or that you you can get that we can help

1:04:51with, you know, and I when I say we, I'm

1:04:54talking about the full council, but just

1:04:56as Councilman Pian stated, you know,

1:04:58it's nothing for me to be able to reach

1:04:59out to stakeholders in district 2 to say

1:05:02this is exactly what we need in order to

1:05:04make this program work. So what's that

1:05:05one thing, you know, like where are we

1:05:07right now at Williamson that would would

1:05:10help you accelerate this program? Great

1:05:12question. Uh the public,

1:05:16that's it.

1:05:17>> That's what's missing. That's the

1:05:18missing ingredient. Uh the public, the

1:05:20general public. Uh it is not and

1:05:23everyone should report crime. We want

1:05:25people to report crime. We want people

1:05:26to express their frustration with it as

1:05:29they should, but we also want people to

1:05:31be part of the solution. So, we're

1:05:33asking the public uh to be a be on board

1:05:36with what we're trying to accomplish.

1:05:38See it from the vantage point. We're not

1:05:40asking anyone to do anything outside of

1:05:42their sphere of influence. Uh standing

1:05:45up outside during dismissal

1:05:48doesn't take a lot other than just your

1:05:50desire to do it and to be a kind face to

1:05:54a young person who may need it.

1:05:57>> I'll follow up that to that question. So

1:05:59when you say the public, so I'm I'm just

1:06:01I want specifics because of course, you

1:06:02know, I'm going to put it in my

1:06:03newsletter. Um but for example, one

1:06:06thing would be we want the residents to

1:06:08come out at dismissal time and be at

1:06:11their front door to be a part and

1:06:13greeting the students and telling them

1:06:14to get on where they're supposed to go.

1:06:15Is that what you mean when you say the

1:06:17public?

1:06:17>> It varies because for example when kids

1:06:20are leaving from Williamson going to

1:06:23Harmon there are no houses there

1:06:26>> unlike the floor. Well I take that back

1:06:28the old school yes you had houses on on

1:06:31the street. Uh our intent is to make

1:06:34sure that from a from a vantage point of

1:06:37having uh folks who are interested in

1:06:42helping to just come out

1:06:44>> to the school

1:06:45>> to come out. There is a way to actually

1:06:46reach out to us and the school system

1:06:49>> uh to participate.

1:06:51>> Uh there's a QR code. I don't have it

1:06:53with me, but they can actually use that

1:06:56QR code and they can sign up and they

1:07:00will uh be called

1:07:02and they can say, "Hey, I want to do I

1:07:04want to spend 30 minutes a month

1:07:06>> and just come out and and we're w we

1:07:10hope that people do that."

1:07:12>> Okay, we'll be sure to put that in all

1:07:14of our newsletters so that people can

1:07:16get that. So, you don't have to live in

1:07:18the Williamson district, but you can go

1:07:19to any of the schools. This is about

1:07:21making sure that they our young folks

1:07:23our most valuable resource

1:07:26>> and right now they're just these two

1:07:27schools. Do you look to go toward u

1:07:30middle schools, elementary schools later

1:07:32on or

1:07:33>> Well, again, I mean, we're scaling it

1:07:35right now. Hopefully, we are trying to

1:07:36fine-tune it. We we will scale it

1:07:38hopefully uh if it proves to be uh all

1:07:41that we hope that it will be as we build

1:07:43out the matrix for it, the success

1:07:45outcomes. Uh the goal is for us to see

1:07:49how do we expand,

1:07:50>> okay?

1:07:51>> And where do we expand? Uh because we

1:07:53can't be everywhere,

1:07:55>> but once you get the community engaged,

1:07:59we can in we can increase the span of

1:08:01our ability to actually be in other

1:08:04areas.

1:08:05>> Okay. Uh let's see the last question.

1:08:09Well, we actually have one more that's

1:08:10going to be an additional, but let's

1:08:12take number nine. uh updated crime

1:08:14report showing where we currently stand.

1:08:17It may be in in this report. Um

1:08:19>> Jackson has the most recent.

1:08:21>> Yeah, the latest.

1:08:22>> This is what I have this September 11th,

1:08:25>> but he can speak to those date those

1:08:27those crime stats better.

1:08:28>> Yeah,

1:08:31>> I'm sorry I didn't bring you all the

1:08:32copy of this. I can make you a copy

1:08:33afterwards, but these numbers were as of

1:08:35just a few hours ago before before we

1:08:37came down here.

1:08:38>> Got enough for everybody.

1:08:47No. All right. Thank you. So, uh, those

1:08:49are some numbers that I I gave to the

1:08:51director last week, but just a few hours

1:08:53ago before coming down here, the most

1:08:55current numbers that I can make you all

1:08:56copy of is, you know, we're still

1:08:58trending down thankfully. Okay. Um,

1:09:01we're uh we're 19% down in homicides,

1:09:0513% almost 14% down in robberies, 13%

1:09:09down in assaults with gunshot wounds,

1:09:12and we're we're not down much. We're

1:09:14still down over 1% in in shooting into

1:09:16vehicles and residents uh cases. This is

1:09:19something that I can make you a copy of.

1:09:21This was just pulled recently. Um,

1:09:23however, Councilman Penn, I apologize.

1:09:26didn't see the rest of your request as

1:09:28far as a breakdown. But what I can tell

1:09:30you is every precinct that we have

1:09:32overall right now is still significantly

1:09:34down in violent crime. Uh there's only

1:09:36one precinct um Miss Gregor

1:09:38unfortunately out in the fourth precinct

1:09:40has had some property crimes issues.

1:09:42However, those have been solved crimes,

1:09:44but they still count on the stats. But

1:09:46as far as um violent crime, uh we're

1:09:49still down across the citywide. Awesome.

1:09:52>> Yeah, if you can just give that to us,

1:09:53we'd probably like to share that in our

1:09:55newsletters as well.

1:09:56>> Yeah, I can make you a copy of this.

1:09:57>> Okay, that'd be great.

1:09:58>> Great.

1:09:59>> And then um the additional question,

1:10:01this kind of goes back to some of the

1:10:03ones that number one and two and three

1:10:06possibly the Ricky Park um situation

1:10:09that happened recently. I know

1:10:10Councilwoman Ingram had some questions

1:10:12about that. You want to share what your

1:10:14specifics are?

1:10:15>> Thank you, Ma, Madam Vice President.

1:10:17Yes. Um, first of all, I I do want to

1:10:20thank um the team starting with Miss

1:10:22Brown for trying to help us get a

1:10:23community meeting organized. I know you

1:10:25you're working on that. The $2,500

1:10:28reward. I've had uh residents to think,

1:10:30you know, to say yes, that's a good

1:10:31start. Along with the use of cameras, I

1:10:34think it's been advertised that you're

1:10:35going to be using the uh footage from

1:10:37the Ricky uh park cameras and you can

1:10:40clarify that if not along with the extra

1:10:42patrol. I'm sharing these things because

1:10:44what I'm finding is that the community

1:10:47is not aware that we these things are

1:10:49happening. So, I'm trying to make it

1:10:50public and and what needs to be

1:10:52corrected, please do correct for me. But

1:10:55based off of the multiple incidents

1:10:56starting from June 11th, I think July

1:10:5912th, October the 13th, um my question

1:11:02is do we have a specific strategic

1:11:07um plan for Rickerby being that it is um

1:11:13in one specific area that we're seeing

1:11:15this not saying that it's not happening

1:11:17other places, but we have the data to

1:11:19show that this is a concentrated area.

1:11:22And I'm asking is there if there's a

1:11:24specific strategy just for that

1:11:25residential area.

1:11:30>> There is a strategy there is an evolving

1:11:32strategy to address the issues. Um, one

1:11:35of the things that we've already done,

1:11:37we've looked at lighting in that area,

1:11:40um, as a concern, um, to make sure that

1:11:43there is adequate lighting, not just on

1:11:45Ricky, but in other areas that surround

1:11:48Rickabe. Uh, and to make sure that we

1:11:50address those issues for safety reasons,

1:11:52just that goes beyond just this incident

1:11:55itself. Uh, but we are looking at uh,

1:11:59creating a a platform or a space to

1:12:02speak to the public. uh not about the

1:12:05investigation

1:12:07but about the things that concern them.

1:12:10Uh that will be the the the nucleus of

1:12:14that conversation we have with them. We

1:12:16will hope to have our federal partners

1:12:19with us. I've not reached out to them

1:12:20yet. My hope is to have them available

1:12:23to come out and be beside us uh because

1:12:26this is a team effort. This is all of us

1:12:29trying to come up with ways of

1:12:30addressing the immediate concerns of

1:12:32Ricky while also addressing the things

1:12:35that we may need to do in other areas as

1:12:37a result of what's happened in Ricky.

1:12:42>> So just in summary, you said you it's an

1:12:44evolving strategy that that we're

1:12:46working on. Um lighting is um something

1:12:50uh another action that you're going to

1:12:51take um in terms of this. But the ones

1:12:54that I called out, the use of the

1:12:55cameras, is that correct that that those

1:12:57cameras were functional and that we're

1:12:59we're using that? I read that somewhere.

1:13:02>> Yes, ma'am. That is correct. There was

1:13:03some footage captured on that cam the

1:13:05cameras that are assisting. And in the

1:13:07second incident, obviously knew there

1:13:08was some door ring bell door ring video.

1:13:11So, those are being u looked at as well.

1:13:13As the director says, it's evolving. Uh

1:13:16just last week while I was at another

1:13:18function, Chief Jones and Captain Lewis

1:13:20of the first precinct and others were

1:13:21out there just came just walking and

1:13:23talking to the neighborhood door to door

1:13:25for over an hour. Uh just no particular

1:13:27reason, just letting them know that

1:13:29we're there. And so there's a lot of

1:13:31things that we are doing already and

1:13:33continue to do.

1:13:34>> And and Madame Vice President, if I can,

1:13:36I just want to thank you all for that. I

1:13:38want the public to hear that there are

1:13:39some things that we're doing, you know,

1:13:41like you said, you know, out there going

1:13:42doortodoor. They want to be heard. And

1:13:45so, thank you. I want to commend you for

1:13:46that because that that is the one thing

1:13:48that was requested and I did not realize

1:13:50you're doing that now. So, thank you for

1:13:52sharing that and and I look forward to

1:13:54seeing the the full strategy on what

1:13:57we're going to do to ensure that the

1:13:59public feels safe in that area. Thank

1:14:02you.

1:14:03>> Go ahead.

1:14:04>> Thank you, Madam Vice President. Um I

1:14:07know um Director Graves, I think, um you

1:14:09have received some information regarding

1:14:11like in my area the St. Stevens Road

1:14:13where people are hanging out clearly

1:14:17like across the street from the soul

1:14:18house. I don't know if you heard about

1:14:20>> I have I have

1:14:22>> and so um I know in the past the

1:14:25challenge has been what is that process

1:14:28when we see people just parking on the

1:14:30side of the road not just even St.

1:14:32Stevens but parking on the side of the

1:14:34road hanging out drinking

1:14:39and it's it it's not their property. is

1:14:41just a vacant lot. What is that process

1:14:44of if if MPD see that, what is the

1:14:48policy to to move forward to to stop

1:14:51that, I guess?

1:14:51>> Well, often times when you're talking

1:14:52about private property, I mean, there

1:14:54needs to be uh some acknowledgement by

1:14:57the owner that they need assistance on

1:15:00that particular property. Uh if

1:15:02someone's doing something, obviously

1:15:03that is violation of the law. officer

1:15:05can approach that person and ask

1:15:08questions that may lead to to an arrest

1:15:10or may not. Uh [snorts] but to the

1:15:12greater point of your question, uh

1:15:14you're right, it's not just your area,

1:15:16it's all over and we're trying to figure

1:15:18out strategies to address that. One of

1:15:20the strategies that we're currently

1:15:21looking at that's continuing to evolve.

1:15:24uh but that is finding ways to get

1:15:26property owners to agree to allow law

1:15:29enforcement to go onto their property

1:15:32and exercise their right to remove a

1:15:34person from their property. Uh uh that's

1:15:37going to take some some some technology

1:15:40use through MIS and some other things

1:15:42that we're currently working on. We're

1:15:44working with the uh environmental

1:15:46enforcement. Uh but the goal is to

1:15:49create a platform that allow residents,

1:15:52property owners, uh who have vacant

1:15:54property or any property that they wish

1:15:57for law enforcement to go onto their

1:16:00property and remove a person

1:16:04um to have the right to do that or have

1:16:06the authority to do that because often

1:16:08times people don't want to press

1:16:09charges. They tell us that we want you

1:16:11to come out here or go out and officer

1:16:14goes out and nothing's done to their

1:16:17satisfaction.

1:16:19>> Gotcha. Uh but the goal is to uh give

1:16:22people the option of actually wanting

1:16:25law enforcement to come onto their

1:16:27property uh by consent of of of our

1:16:30permission and then us having the

1:16:32ability on officers MDTs to be able to

1:16:36go into the system and see if that

1:16:38numerical address uh is is a property

1:16:42that the owner has given permission to.

1:16:45And this is still in the early stages,

1:16:46but this is something that we're working

1:16:48on because again, a lot of these issues

1:16:49are issues that have existed for a long

1:16:51time. Some of them are new, some of they

1:16:53they compound. Um, but but to your

1:16:57point, uh, these are issues that go far

1:16:59beyond just your area, for sure.

1:17:01>> Okay. And then my last question, I've

1:17:03been receiving a lot of calls and a lot

1:17:05of issues, and I'm sure it's some 311

1:17:07requests about these four-wheelers going

1:17:10late at night, all in the community,

1:17:12loud noises. Um,

1:17:16four-wheelers are illegal, right, to be

1:17:18on the road. Is that correct?

1:17:19>> That's correct.

1:17:20>> Okay. So, when they What is the process?

1:17:25Do they get a ticket? How many like what

1:17:27is this process? Cuz I mean, it's going

1:17:29nonstop. Like, what is that?

1:17:32>> Unfortunately, I haven't gotten the

1:17:33complaint about four-wheelers. Now, what

1:17:34I've gotten is about some ebike

1:17:36situations. Um, which unfortunately

1:17:38there's not a lot we can do about the

1:17:39ebikes right now. Uh, but I don't know

1:17:41what the four-wheeler situation you're

1:17:43speaking of. But yes, they can be

1:17:44stopped, they can be cited, the vehicle

1:17:46can be towed just like a vehicle on the

1:17:48roadway if it's not, you know, equipped

1:17:50to be on the roadway.

1:17:51>> Okay, perfect.

1:17:52>> But if you want to forward me that

1:17:53complaint, I haven't yet heard of it.

1:17:54>> Yeah, I said I Yeah, I I I send it your

1:17:57way, Chief. It's Yeah, it's it's been a

1:17:59lot.

1:17:59>> That's the first I heard of that one.

1:18:01Okay. Okay.

1:18:02>> All right.

1:18:02>> I think that kind of

1:18:03>> I think that kind of goes along with

1:18:05scooters and things as well. You know,

1:18:07kids on these motorbikes.

1:18:10running all over the streets and it's

1:18:13very very difficult to catch them. But

1:18:15we see that throughout the city as well.

1:18:18Very dangerous. I've gotten some videos

1:18:19before of kids going the wrong direction

1:18:21on a street on a motor scooter with cars

1:18:24going down the street trying to turn

1:18:26into their driveway and the kid on the

1:18:28scooter is going right in front of the

1:18:29car. So that's happening everywhere.

1:18:33>> But again, it's I know it's very

1:18:35difficult.

1:18:35>> Unfortunately, the ebikes fall under the

1:18:37same as

1:18:37>> ebike. Same same thing.

1:18:39>> But we have some conversations going on

1:18:41the director and I to get with Mr.

1:18:42McNair to try to see I know there

1:18:44already have been a push for it before

1:18:45but it failed. But we really need it. We

1:18:47need some legislation on it.

1:18:49>> Well, they're they're going down

1:18:50streets. They're going down sidewalks.

1:18:51It's just

1:18:55>> and anybody Yeah. And they're fast. Very

1:18:57fast. [gasps] Anybody else? Well, thank

1:19:01Oh, yeah. Go ahead. Madam Vice

1:19:02President, I do want to acknowledge that

1:19:03I didn't bring up downtown Mobile and I

1:19:05didn't because um I had a meeting today

1:19:07with Chief Barber and a business owner

1:19:09and we're going to have a separate

1:19:11meeting to um address some of their

1:19:13concerns down there and so that's why

1:19:15>> Oh, okay. All right. Yeah, I remember

1:19:17that from earlier today. Okay. Well,

1:19:18very good. Well, listen y'all,

1:19:20>> Vice President, I'd like to say uh

1:19:22publicly Curtis and to the chief and the

1:19:25rest of the chief, thank y'all so much

1:19:26for your hard work. I know you all have

1:19:27a hard job and everything, but I do we

1:19:30do appreciate it, you know, and it's not

1:19:32that we banging on y'all just because

1:19:35our constituent would be banging on us

1:19:37and we don't have nobody else to bang

1:19:39over. [clears throat]

1:19:40Thank [laughter] y'all so much.

1:19:41>> We're just sharing the love, you know,

1:19:43sharing. Yes, sir. Yes,

1:19:45>> agree with you. We're not banging up on

1:19:46them.

1:19:47>> I'm sorry. We're not banging up on them.

1:19:48But I do want to say to President Small

1:19:51uh his point is that you're giving us

1:19:53information so we can be advocates for

1:19:55you. you know, I I can't wait to go back

1:19:57and let them know I told you they're

1:19:59going to follow up. They're going to

1:20:00follow through and it's done. And so

1:20:02that's why we want this information

1:20:03because we know that you're the backbone

1:20:05of what we do. Uh and it's critical to

1:20:07have you. So, thank you for what you're

1:20:09doing. Uh on behalf of public safety,

1:20:11thank you.

1:20:12>> We really appreciate all of the

1:20:14information, all of the sharing, and

1:20:15everything that you do. Um

1:20:18just thank you for being there and

1:20:20serving our citizens every day. Anybody

1:20:23else? All right, we are adjourned. Thank

1:20:25you.

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