2026-10-22 - City Council Work Session

18:07Well, you know,

18:09my heart

18:12>> I'll get a ribbon. I'll get a ribbon.

18:14Wait, were we supposed to paint today?

18:16>> You see the email?

18:17>> No,

18:18>> that's an email.

18:19>> Okay. Well, that's all right. How's your

18:21family?

18:22>> Uh, grieving.

18:26>> Um, I'll get a ribbon.

18:38Please don't.

18:45>> Which was it?

18:57called your man.

19:07>> Ladies and gentlemen, we're going to go

19:08ahead

19:10>> if we're uh

19:11>> I don't know.

19:12>> We go ahead and get started.

19:14Um

19:17going to ask alter peri to lead us in a

19:20word of prayer.

19:21>> Thank you mayor if you would go to

19:23prayer with me. Heavenly father we come

19:25before you today with grateful hearts

19:27thankful for the opportunity to serve

19:29the people of Savannah and to work

19:31together for the betterment of our

19:32community. Lord as we begin this

19:35workshop we ask for your guidance in our

19:37conversations our wisdom in our

19:39deliberations and understanding in our

19:42disagreements. Help us to listen with

19:44open minds, speak with respect, and

19:47remember that although we may approach

19:48challenges differently, we share a

19:51common responsibility to serve our city

19:53and its people. Remind us that public

19:56service is not about ourselves, but

19:58about those who have the who we have the

20:00privilege to serve.

20:03Help us to move forward with a unity of

20:04purpose, compassion for our neighbors,

20:06and a shared vision for a stronger,

20:09safer, and more prosperous community,

20:10which we call Savannah. May our time

20:13together today be productive, our

20:15discussions be constructive, and our

20:17work be guided by wisdom, fairness, and

20:19is and a desire to do what is right. We

20:23ask these blessings in the name of God

20:25the creator, Christ the redeemer, and

20:27the Holy Spirit. Amen.

20:28>> Amen. Thank you all so much and good

20:31morning. Um,

20:35want to get one quick housekeeping out

20:38of the way. Uh, and then we will move

20:40forward in our workshop agenda. Um,

20:44Estella is not here. Linda, are you you

20:47going to city summit?

20:49>> Yes, sir.

20:50>> When are you leaving?

20:51>> On the 18th.

20:52>> That's what day is that?

20:54>> I mean, when are you leaving to come

20:55back?

20:57>> I think it's Sunday.

20:58>> Okay. Sunday. Okay. I just need an

21:00alternate for uh voting. So, I just need

21:02to make sure I get somebody's name.

21:04Okay. Make sure

21:05>> that that'll be on the 20. That'll be on

21:07the 21st. That said Saturday.

21:10>> Oh, I think we'll leave Sunday.

21:11>> All right. So, you still be Oh, you'll

21:12be here. Okay. All right. Just want to

21:14make sure.

21:15>> All right. Um

21:18and so for our workshop agenda, um we

21:22have a presentation from NPC on the 2024

21:24comprehensive plan update, a data center

21:28ordinance development discussion, uh

21:30that we uh committed to once we decided

21:33where we were going to move as it

21:34relates to that. Um and then we have

21:37exec session, I believe.

21:38>> Yes, sir.

21:39>> All right. On personnel

21:41>> or

21:42>> on real estate and a litigation.

21:44>> Litigation. Okay. Real estate

21:46litigation. Um before we get started

21:48with the NPC, I want to just address uh

21:51something out the gate. Um uh as you all

21:54know, I approve the agenda every um

21:58every two weeks, the Friday before, um

22:01it's published. And so I received a a

22:05request was on from the NPC for us to

22:08approve uh the comprehensive plan

22:10update. Um and it asked for a

22:12presentation. Um, as you all know and as

22:16we have all said, um, that we did not

22:18want to hear presentations on things we

22:21were going to vote on on the same day.

22:24Um, and so to that end, I asked the city

22:26manager to contact Miss Wilson and for

22:29them to move the um, presentation that

22:34was requested on council agenda to

22:36workshop. Um, and so that is why it's on

22:40the workshop agenda today. Uh to that

22:42end, um now city manager has informed me

22:45that this is supposedly date certain. Um

22:48it has to be by um the 31st or whatever,

22:52but given our council's uh instructions,

22:55we won't be able to vote on this until

22:58um the first meeting in November. So, I

23:01just want to make sure you all knew this

23:04uh before Miss Wilson made her her

23:06presentation. Um and then you all decide

23:09about which way you go. But it was not

23:12because um myself or the city manager um

23:16ignored the will of council as it

23:18relates to u making sure that we space

23:20out um the information we get and then

23:24the information that we're asking

23:25council to make a decision on.

23:28>> Okay.

23:28>> Thank you so much. I appreciate that.

23:30>> I just want to make sure we're all

23:31clear. So, you know that that's how uh

23:33that kind of came to that. So, I don't

23:35know if you have anything to add, Mr.

23:37Manager. Um and Miss Wilson, I don't

23:39know whether uh again, you know, given

23:42the way that we've publicly moved um you

23:46know, the earliest our first meeting is

23:48what the 20 the 7th. When's our meeting

23:51in November? First meeting in November,

23:54Mr. Clerk.

23:54>> Uh good question.

24:00>> 12.

24:00>> 12. Okay. 12th, right? So that would

24:03have been the earliest that we given our

24:06reg our normal cadence that we would

24:08vote on it. Again um you know I think we

24:13can under emergent circumstances

24:16um you know choose to do what council

24:18chooses to do but I wanted to make sure

24:20again that the cadence that you all

24:22requested um that we were respecting. So

24:26that's where we are miss manager.

24:27>> Yeah. Thank you mayor. Thank you,

24:28council. And I I'm sure Miss Wilson can

24:31talk more about the state's deadline of

24:34October 31st for comprehensive plan

24:36updates. Comprehensive plan um and plan

24:40updates are a requirement for every

24:42municipality. And so, uh we do need to

24:45meet that requirement. Um however um u

24:49perhaps between now and the meeting,

24:52Miss Wilson and I can make a call to DCA

24:54to understand exactly what the

24:56possibilities are um for a later

24:58adoption from city council on the plan

25:02update. Um so we will try to get as much

25:04information as we can um on that in time

25:07for city council to to act. Um, but with

25:10that, I do want to make the space for

25:14um, Miss Melanie Wilson, who is the

25:16executive director and CEO of the

25:18Metropolitan um, Planning Commission,

25:21um, to give an update on the proposed

25:25comprehensive plan update, which I

25:27believe is titled 2040 2045.

25:31>> Okay. Um, with that, I'll turn it over

25:32to Miss Wilson.

25:34>> Question.

25:34>> Sure.

25:38We didn't know that this plan was

25:40supposed to be completed by by the 31st

25:44of October. We knew it and nobody said

25:46anything or did anything.

25:48>> Oh yes, ma'am. We know it. And um and if

25:50you recall um MPC um came before council

25:55several months ago because we the they

25:57MPC also requires

26:00um approval of the draft plan to be

26:02submitted to DCA for an initial review.

26:06um which uh uh which was done by city

26:09council at that time. I believe flash

26:12drives were provided or even before then

26:15um of the comprehensive plan itself.

26:17Miss Wilson can talk to you about the

26:19plan development. Um but yes um the

26:23October 31st deadline um has been known

26:28um by MPC and by the city for some time.

26:33>> Thank you. I have a question. Yes ma'am.

26:35[clears throat]

26:36>> So last year uh when we had

26:41CEDA and the county and some other

26:44agencies come and they had put some

26:48millions together and they were going to

26:51um

26:53they wanted us to bring a couple members

26:56in the county that meeting. There was a

26:58real sense of urgency at that meeting

27:01about uh the plan. Is this the same

27:04plan?

27:05>> No.

27:07>> So there's another plan floating

27:09floating around. Uh that that initiative

27:12which I believe is called vision 2033

27:15was the name of that initiative per the

27:18IG. Um there has not been an initial

27:22meeting um of the board members um of

27:25that plan that I'm aware of.

27:28>> It's vision 2033.

27:30>> That was the name of the initiative that

27:32Alderwoman Lane Lenir is discussing

27:33which was a contribution of a million

27:36dollars which had been budgeted um

27:39before my time. um a million dollars

27:41from the county as well as a million

27:44dollars pledged by uh the business

27:48community

27:49um to um for a plan. But it it it is not

27:53>> the city as well.

27:54>> The city, yes, the city a million dollar

27:56involved

27:58>> if this is 2033

28:01and today we're talking about 2045.

28:05So we're going to revert back to 2033

28:09after we submit 2045.

28:12>> So to and Miss Wilson and NBC who

28:15managed the comprehensive plan um effort

28:19for the city and for unincorporated

28:21Chattam County can talk about what a

28:23comprehensive plan is. Comprehensive

28:25plan is a formal document that is

28:28required by all local jurisdictions to

28:31be submitted to the state. Um it is a

28:34formal planning document. Um part of

28:37that planning document um you're all

28:40familiar with which is the future land

28:42use map which is something that council

28:44takes action on amending um uh from time

28:48to time as they're requested and

28:50recommended through the MPC. There are

28:52other components of the comprehensive

28:55plan as well. The planning initiative

28:58that Aldwoman Lane Lenir is speaking of,

29:01the vision 2033 planning initiative um

29:04is not a comprehensive plan um

29:08initiative um

29:11at least not in its um proposed form.

29:14It's more of a um

29:18a

29:22a planning effort that is not a formal

29:26documented planning effort. So I

29:28understand we're going to 2045 and going

29:31back to 2033. I think the vision 2033

29:35plan is just a naming convention based

29:37on our tsentennial. So um but what is

29:41absolutely necessary for all local

29:44governments to do is to adopt a

29:48comprehensive plan and comprehensive

29:50plan updates by the timelines

29:54um that are set out for by the state.

29:57The entity that develops our

29:59comprehensive plan for our community as

30:01well as for unincorporated Chattam

30:04County is MPC. um and they have been

30:07leading this effort for the last year

30:10and a half um when the comprehensive

30:13plan update and so I think the if uh

30:16that Miss Wilson will be able to provide

30:18and shed more light um on this plan. I

30:20will also say that I've been here five

30:23years. I believe in one of my first few

30:25council members council meetings as city

30:27manager um we adopted our last

30:31comprehensive plan update um in the fall

30:34of 2021.

30:36if I remember correctly.

30:43>> Okay.

30:43>> So that Miss Wilson.

30:46>> Okay. Thank you um for um allowing us to

30:50come and um present the update for the

30:53um 2040 U plan. It's 204045.

30:57Um, I just want to note that I came

30:59before this board last year in October

31:02at your October meeting and gave you a

31:04schedule with regards to what the

31:06timelines are for this comprehensive

31:09plan update. within that schedule there

31:11were meeting dates uh things of that

31:14nature and uh each time uh I've I've

31:19been very transparent with regards to

31:20what this process was um working uh in

31:24partnership with the manager, the city

31:26manager and the county manager. I sent

31:28out memos um in April of this year

31:32earlier to just remind them about

31:34setting this date so that we could meet

31:36the October 31st deadline. Um and um

31:41that's one of the reasons that we've

31:43moved forward with regards to having it

31:45on the agenda. Um just so that you know

31:49uh the Georgia Department of Community

31:51Affairs, they have a requirement that a

31:54comprehensive plan is updated. Um you

31:58get a new comprehensive plan usually

31:59with the new census, but the update

32:01happens like every five years uh in

32:04order to continue to have your qualified

32:06local government status. and that allows

32:07you to get CDBG monies as well as other

32:10funds that come in through the state.

32:12So, if this is not approved, then those

32:16funds uh then then you wouldn't be

32:19considered a qualified local government.

32:21Um it's per the the general statutes

32:25which is the Georgia Planning Act

32:27OCGA45-12-200.

32:31So, I did want to make sure that I let

32:34you know what the process was and what

32:37what we've done. The clearest

32:39explanation with regards to what we've

32:41done for this update, as you can see,

32:42we've got a new logo. We work with the

32:44SCAD serve um folks to come up with this

32:48logo in order to show that to different

32:50documents. So, I do want to uh thank

32:52them for working with us on um on that

32:56component.

32:58But the long range plan really is the

33:00framework that is currently going to

33:02stay in place. What this update does,

33:04and it's an update, it updates the data

33:07that's in this plan. When we did the

33:10previous plan, we had data that came

33:12from 2018

33:14to 2020 because if you recall, the

33:17census came out a little bit late uh

33:20based on COVID and some other stuff. So,

33:23the data in this document has been

33:26updated. It sets up also a five-year

33:29checkpoint uh with regards to where we

33:32are with moving forward toward

33:34implementing uh the components of the

33:36document. So again, this long range plan

33:40basically is the foundation and then the

33:43five-year checkpoint, we spend time

33:46looking at what the framework is, how

33:47are we doing with the work plan and

33:49things of that nature.

33:51>> Let me ask you a question, Mr. Mayor. I

33:53just have a question.

33:54>> Sure. Is it any way possible that we

33:56could get a better copy of this? Cuz

33:58this stuff is so tiny you can barely

34:00read it.

34:02>> Can you see it up here though?

34:05>> I have made copy.

34:08>> Thank you so much. This is so small.

34:18>> Thank you.

34:28extra.

34:30>> Is that Is that better? Do you need one,

34:31Mr. Mayor, or do you have

34:33>> Thank you.

34:33>> Does everybody have one?

34:35>> I've got I've got extra if everybody

34:37didn't have one.

34:37>> Okay.

34:40>> It's bigger. The wording is bigger.

34:43Can't see.

34:46>> That was quick.

34:58Um,

35:01>> okay. And as you can see, the the clip

35:02that you see on there basically is

35:03recognizing that we're 70 years old as

35:05an organization, one of the oldest

35:07planning commissions in the country. But

35:09again,

35:10>> I didn't hear that. I said the clip that

35:12you've got as part of the handout

35:14basically is one of the giveaways that

35:16we have used because it's recognizing

35:18the fact that the MPC is 70 years old.

35:21>> Oh, okay.

35:22>> Um and one of the oldest planning

35:23commissions in the country.

35:25>> Fantastic.

35:25>> Um

35:27>> but again, this basically is showing you

35:31what some of the things that have

35:33changed. So when you start looking at

35:34what's changed, we looked at, you know,

35:37what [snorts] the baseline was as I said

35:39with CO um the numbers were a little

35:43different because things came out late.

35:45Um so we were again able to deal with

35:48updating that information uh with ACS

35:51data uh that we received. Uh housing

35:54policies and things of that nature have

35:56changed. If you recall, um the um in the

36:00past the county was not a big proponent

36:03with regards to addressing housing. They

36:05felt that it was a city problem. With

36:07this update, we're able to show that

36:10we've got a a a coalition. There's been

36:12some partnering and there's been some

36:13recognition that it is a joint uh uh

36:17initiative that multiple folks are

36:19working on with regards to to addressing

36:21and moving it forward.

36:23We basically use this again as a

36:25baseline for shared policy.

36:29Um, we've got the same economic pillars,

36:33but we've got a different regional

36:34economy. When we did the last update, we

36:36didn't have Hyundai, nor did we have

36:38some of the other facilities. We've got

36:41that now, and that's kind of changed how

36:42we look at moving forward with regards

36:44to services and other things that are

36:46needed. Um, we've looked at things like

36:49the logistics, uh, the advanced

36:52manufacturing workforce housing. Again,

36:54that's where we've had that partnership,

36:57uh, with, uh, the, um, with the county,

37:00uh, looking at things that can be done.

37:03And the fact that we've diversified as a

37:05county, as a county, and as a community,

37:07going from just purely tourism to

37:10looking at manufacturing and other

37:11things with regards to how we move

37:13forward to as an economy.

37:16Um the quarters uh our quarter approach

37:20is the same as you know we have the NPO

37:22the NPO we've already updated our

37:24long-range transportation plan that gets

37:26incorporated into this document too

37:27because all of this is interconnected

37:29and it's what's used to make

37:30determinations on how we get funds. Um

37:39we looked at and incorporated the

37:41connection between transportation and

37:43housing.

37:43>> What's that ma'am?

37:44>> Mr. Mayor. Um, city manager, are we

37:46waiting until she finish before

37:48>> Let Yeah, let it go through.

37:50>> Okay. Yes, sir.

37:51>> Um,

37:51>> thank you.

37:52>> Yes, sir.

37:53>> Okay. Uh, so we've looked at um treating

37:57transportation and housing kind of as a

37:59one growth question because they're

38:01interconnected. You people need to be

38:03able to get to housing. Uh, they need to

38:06be able to have transportation to get to

38:08work. Um, and it's all interconnected

38:10and we talk about that as we deal as we

38:13deal with the updates within this

38:14document. Um, and again, we've updated

38:17the data that addresses and shows uh

38:19what some of the concerns are and what

38:21some of the needs are with regards to um

38:24moving this forward.

38:28Again, we still have existing things. We

38:30still have talk about natural resources

38:33um and the environment. Um, for those of

38:36you that's on the policy committee, you

38:38know, we've got an urban flood model

38:40that we're looking at with regards to

38:41looking at what happens with storm water

38:43management and other things as we make

38:45improvements to our infrastructure, the

38:47road network. Um, we've got more

38:50discussion about the implementation

38:51talking about quality of life. Um, and a

38:54lot of this was based on feedback we got

38:56from the community meetings that we had

38:59um, and for u the surveys that we did

39:03and others. Um with regards to providing

39:06those updates,

39:11the biggest change basically is what

39:13happens um after after the policy.

39:17Again,

39:18what is meant by that is you know we had

39:21to go in look at what what we were able

39:23to accomplish from 2040 to for that

39:275year period of time based on what we

39:29said we were going to do in the work

39:30program. So that's got that's got

39:33addressed. We were able to highlight

39:36more what some action items uh could be

39:40and should be for implementation. So

39:41it's going to make it easier for both

39:43you, the county, anybody looking at this

39:46document to know what what needs to

39:48happen with regards to moving forward

39:49with implementation of the policies are

39:52within this document. and it also tells

39:55you what's on the horizon based on

39:57information that we've heard from our

39:58partners as we've dealt with this uh

40:00update. Um

40:07it the other piece too is that we have

40:1018 actions um six community goals within

40:14this and uh the identified about

40:17approximately $735,000

40:19in what the cost would be for dealing

40:21with some of these implementation

40:23components. The thing that's very

40:25different for this document based on the

40:27previous document is that previously we

40:29also did the service delivery strategy

40:31which should be very important to you

40:32all as you annex you also look at what

40:35services and how you provide the

40:37services for that um that area that

40:39you're annexing. Uh that is something

40:42that the DCA made a change on. They

40:46wanted the comprehensive plan done first

40:48and the supplemental piece would be the

40:50service delivery strategy which we um

40:53will [clears throat] work on as soon as

40:54we get this approved. But they basically

40:56have said absolutely no working on that

40:58until this document is done. Uh that

41:01will that will come before you and that

41:03will look at like memorandums of

41:05understanding regards to shared services

41:08that you might have with other

41:09jurisdictions. um that's looking at, you

41:12know, everything from parks and recrecks

41:13to um fire, police,

41:18other services where we might have that

41:19shared vision. Um again, the biggest

41:23change in this is the updating the data,

41:25the update, getting feedback from the

41:27community with regards to what their um

41:31vision and their um what they would like

41:33to see. We had a number of meetings uh

41:36throughout the city. Uh one, two, three,

41:39four, five,

41:44We met, we had 17 meetings um throughout

41:47the city uh of Savannah and pardon the

41:50county. We had a couple at MTC. Um

41:54as we move forward with looking at this,

41:56I want to stress that this is not the

41:58only time that you get to touch this

42:00document. This is the required update

42:03that you have to do every five years.

42:06We've made updates. I know we mentioned

42:08the the future land use plan or the

42:09flume. Well, based on the flume

42:11amendments that have occurred, we've and

42:13based on feedback that we got, we went

42:15in and did those updates and made sure

42:17that they were consistent, but just went

42:19out a little bit in some of those other

42:21areas, but we also updated the character

42:24areas. That is what sets the stage of

42:26what you want to see in your community.

42:29Those got um updated based on feedback

42:31that we received from the community. uh

42:34and uh that is also included as part of

42:37the document um uh that uh the that the

42:42folks at DCA reviewed.

42:44The process is we do the update, the

42:48document gets sent. Again, I was here a

42:50couple weeks ago asking to get a letter

42:52for transmitt so we could transmit it to

42:55have feedback from them on what they

42:57wanted us to tweak. Uh they there were

43:01some things that they didn't want some

43:02of the detail in that we took out and

43:04some things they wanted more detail in

43:05that we went ahead and put back and that

43:07we added. But for the most part they

43:09wanted a clean document that was very

43:11clear on how the implementation could

43:14occur who and who would who the partners

43:17could be and making sure that we were

43:20checking off with regards to looking at

43:22it as we developed our work programs for

43:24how we plan within the city and the

43:26county jointly.

43:29I know Mr. Miller uh mentioned that uh

43:32we could reach out and talk with the uh

43:34people at DCA regarding the the 31st

43:37deadline, but um from my conversations,

43:40it's a hard deadline if you don't want

43:42to make a recommendation today. Um you

43:45do have the option to do a special call

43:47meeting and that's up to you all if you

43:49decide you want to go that route if you

43:50didn't want to vote today. But um the

43:5331st um is what the deadline is and

43:58we've known that for you know over a

44:01year actually a couple years because the

44:04time frame is every five years from the

44:06approval month. So we got it approved

44:09five years from October. We're asking to

44:11get it approved this time. And think

44:13about it if you've got any grants and I

44:15can't stress this enough. If you've got

44:17any grants or any projects that are out

44:20there that DCA is looking or any uh

44:23Georgia department's looking at, if you

44:25don't have if you're not a qualified

44:27local government, it it ends up getting

44:29stopped. So, it's important to meet your

44:32deadline with regards to the October

44:3431st deadline if possible. But I do

44:36understand if you decide that you want

44:38to take some time, that's up to you. But

44:40I wanted to be very clear about what the

44:42impact would be uh with regards to

44:44winning. and I'll be glad to answer any

44:46questions.

44:46>> Let me just start off. I mean, I think

44:48um this is not necessarily specific to

44:50the NPC, but I wanted to make sure

44:52council was clear about how this came

44:55about. Now, I have no problems

44:57personally, but I think the work um that

45:00the NPC does and continues to do uh on

45:03our behalf. I think that the methodology

45:06has been sound. Um I have no problem

45:08voting on this today. Um, and so I would

45:12characterize this as being one of those

45:14emergent circumstances where we can make

45:17an exception. Uh, it's not a hard fast

45:19rule, but to everybody in this room,

45:21council has made it clear that, um, we

45:25just don't want to have to consider

45:28something and vote on it at the same

45:30time. and they want the time

45:32understandably to be able to uh workshop

45:35it uh then to digest it and then have

45:39the opportunity to vote on it. So we

45:41kind of create a uh an approach or a veh

45:46a vectoring pattern in which the city

45:49manager uh lays things into workshop and

45:52then of course you know at a uh next

45:56meeting or meeting afterwards then we

45:57actually vote on it. So, I mean, you

45:59know, council, we can I mean, again, I'm

46:01fine with voting on this today. I don't

46:02think this is I think given what it is,

46:05given uh the work that we many of us are

46:08engaged in all of the time, uh given

46:10it's important to us, um it's important,

46:12but I wanted to make sure that you all

46:15understood uh the reason why this was on

46:18workshop. Um why I assisted be on

46:20workshop because that is what we decided

46:22as a group we wanted to be able to do.

46:24So, yes, ma'am.

46:25>> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Uh thank you Ms.

46:28Wilson um for the presentation

46:31um the continuous um presentation on um

46:36initially plan uh 2040 and now with the

46:41the change of 20 45 uh because of of the

46:46work that I do outside of uh workshop or

46:50or city council regular meetings and

46:54more specifically with uh the

46:58the core MO um and knowing how important

47:03uh on a continuous base and we're

47:06talking about with transportation

47:08uh with monies and dollars that comes

47:11from DCH uh that's one aspect of of the

47:16work that I I know um that is so

47:19important to having this plan um

47:22approved and moving forward also with um

47:27the work that uh DCH um uh and and the

47:32funding uh with the legacy uh the the

47:36legacy and we have some v fantastic

47:39items on our city council today that

47:42hopefully will get passed uh with the

47:44legacy project and the fairgrounds. um

47:47those uh dollars that has come u from

47:51the state in reference to the awesome

47:53work that MPC continues to do um for us

47:57and having those additional dollars,

48:00those dollars that we do not have in our

48:03budget, but we get assistance um from

48:06the great work that is being done from

48:09our city manager and staff and uh and

48:12the relationship with our mayor and all

48:14these people around the state and the

48:16that we get these dollars in. It is

48:19necessary for tools like this to be in

48:23place. This is not anything new. Uh like

48:25Mrs. um Wilson said, this is not after I

48:28went and did a I had to do a deep dive

48:31into this on last night and I did. I did

48:34not rest until I came up um clear with

48:38this. So, and I and I'm clear. So with

48:42this due to the fact that it was

48:44presented to us uh back in October uh a

48:48year ago and uh it could have been and I

48:51don't know city manager but you you make

48:54up the schedule along with everybody

48:55else and uh probably

49:00um having a workshop on this um before

49:03today. Maybe that could have been

49:05scheduled a little bit differently.

49:07That's the only

49:09way that I see uh with this is that uh

49:13it's been before us um with uh Mrs.

49:17Wilson MPC schedules have been presented

49:20to us. Uh I walked past this bag and in

49:23my my room every day uh that has plan

49:272040. I picked it up last night to make

49:30sure that um I was clear on this. So

49:33today, I come in here today uh as the

49:36mayor just stated, I'm ready uh to move

49:38forward uh with this knowing also that

49:42uh the concerns of council um that uh if

49:46if uh uh amendments or addendums need to

49:49be done with this uh that can happen um

49:53with this right here. This is this is uh

49:55one of those necessary um things that

49:58has to be done uh due to the fact of how

50:01we get funding and um how funding is

50:04laid out. This is just one this is one

50:05of the aspects. This is not every all of

50:08the money that we get but this is

50:10thousands and thousands of dollars that

50:13we receive uh based on information like

50:17this particular uh plan uh for for for

50:21moving forward. And again, I'm clear

50:25that uh with the concerns of council uh

50:28that if there are some we're we're not

50:30locked step into um not changing things

50:33and we can move forward, but meeting the

50:36deadlines and we've had the information.

50:39This is not anything new. Uh like some

50:41of a few of these things that come

50:43before us when when when it's placed on

50:46the agenda and and they ask for us to to

50:49vote for it on the same day. This is not

50:52one of those cases. So, I just wanted to

50:54to state that.

50:56>> Anybody else?

50:57>> I have a whole bunch of stuff. The

50:59bottom line for me is,

51:01>> you know, Savannah, we shouldn't risk

51:04important funding unnecessarily, but

51:06neither should we rush into a long-term

51:08plan without answers.

51:10>> Exactly.

51:10>> Uh we need to make sure that uh the

51:14neighborhood is protected, the flooding

51:16is the dream, traffic and

51:18infrastructure, environment protection,

51:20and accountability. So, we got this

51:21vision in this plan, but the

51:23accountability

51:25is not stretching to where it needs and

51:27it's not for the people who live here.

51:30This plan that that you have, it's an

51:32update, but it's not we don't have a

51:34community plan. We need a community

51:36plan. And I didn't from reading this

51:38information, uh, it sounds good on

51:41paper, but it doesn't touch the people

51:42that I serve. and uh if this was so

51:46important and it it looks like okay we

51:49got a deadline and so y'all pressuring

51:51us to do this deadline because we may or

51:54may not lose this money. So my question

51:56and uh what protection are in place for

51:59neighborhoods, affordable housing,

52:00draining and natural resources and if

52:03we're going to do this can we change

52:05that and can we clarify whether any

52:08remaining deadlines or funding risk

52:10requires immediate adoption? That's what

52:13concerns me. So if there is any plan uh

52:17how do we avoid this? It's not going to

52:20uh from the reading from this DCA, we

52:22got a draft, right? But we got a draft

52:24that doesn't really have a lot of

52:25accountabilities for these communities

52:27and the people who live here. It's about

52:29uh developments and how they going to

52:32react, but it doesn't protect and

52:34change. It's it I don't want to change

52:36where I live at. And I know people in

52:39they don't want to change the quality of

52:41life. And if we are to sign off on

52:44something that doesn't address the

52:45questions that people who were not able

52:48to attend these meetings and that's what

52:50they're asking about how is this going

52:51to affect my tax basis, you know, how is

52:53this going to affect and the county and

52:56the city uh

52:58>> we working this plan together and from

53:00the reading I know that we have to

53:02address our concerns, right? and the

53:04county has confessed concern, but then

53:06the NPC is in is it's intermingled and

53:09they're over there voting on things that

53:11don't even concern them, but they're

53:12city stuff. And so I I would want that

53:15in a in a in a comprehensive plan, not

53:18the vision for the accountability, so

53:20that people who live in a community

53:22don't have to work. My children, whoever

53:24inherits my house knows that it's a home

53:26and it's a resident and it's not the

53:29infrastructure has not changed. We need

53:31to make sure we need to make sure that

53:33the status remains how it is. But there

53:36are certain things in this paperwork

53:37that I read that uh uh is supposed to be

53:41intended to guide growth over the years.

53:43But there's nothing specific for the

53:46growth in communities where people live.

53:48That's the main part. We're talking

53:50about uh housing. We're talking about

53:52infrastructure. We're talking about the

53:54environment, but it's not specific to to

53:57to the district that I that I live in

54:00and the people that I serve. And so, if

54:02this money, these block grants, I want

54:04to I would want to know uh if the vote

54:08is in November and they're saying, what

54:11is the rush? The key is balancing and

54:13meeting the state's planning

54:14requirements with making sure Savannah

54:16residents have a real voice in the

54:17decisions that shape the communities for

54:19years to come.

54:21>> We got to update. Let me provide a

54:23little

54:23>> accountability is the part that I'm

54:24talking about. I'm not saying, excuse

54:26me, I'm not saying that that that that

54:28we shouldn't vote for it, but I believe

54:30that there is some concern about um the

54:33year 2040 and what the expectation is

54:36and how it's going to affect u black

54:38historic neighborhoods.

54:39>> Thank you.

54:41If I could if I before Miss Wilson, I uh

54:44the the parts of the plan that you want

54:46to see differently

54:48or or or I think speak to Miss Wilson

54:52about how we how we may incorporate

54:54those into the planning. I just want to

54:56give an update around

54:58>> um what the firm deadlines are and what

55:01the consequences of not adopting.

55:03>> Consequences.

55:04>> We do and I've just confirmed this with

55:05DCA. We do have a firm deadline of

55:09October 31st. The consequence is if we

55:12do not have um proof of approval of a

55:15con of a of a comprehensive plan update

55:19um is that we lose qualified local

55:22government status um in the state, what

55:25they call QLG. Um and uh the consequence

55:29there is that you know you you risk not

55:32being eligible at the time for grants

55:35that require qualified local government

55:37status which which are several. Now the

55:40true consequence of that is let's say

55:43that you you didn't adopt the plan today

55:46but you adopted it on November 12th. we

55:49would then be we would regain um

55:53qualified local government status um on

55:56November 12th. So, you know, the a

55:5814-day

56:00um period um or a 21-day period may not

56:04be um

56:07well, we'd be a qualified government up

56:08until the 31st. So, um the 12 days in

56:12November where we don't have an approved

56:14plan, that's when we would not be a

56:16local qualified government. But I think

56:18your question is sound. But what I want

56:20to make sure of is that Melanie answers

56:22the question about scope because we I

56:25hear your point about what you want to

56:26see in the plan, the protections, the

56:28visions, the accountability, but making

56:31sure that that is that's actually an

56:34appropriate scope for a comprehensive

56:36plan and that could be something that

56:37could be achieved um in a formal state

56:41um document requirement. I I Yeah, I

56:44just want to reiterate uh something that

56:48I I think I've been saying since I've

56:49been here.

56:51>> I wasn't I wasn't finished. And so now

56:53we talking about what NPC did and what

56:56the city did and and

56:59could this not have been adopted earlier

57:01than October? Who's at fault here? I'm

57:02sitting here. You're saying we shouldn't

57:04get this.

57:05>> Sound like the city is at fault based on

57:07what she's saying.

57:08>> No, ma'am. I'm a memo.

57:10>> Wait, wait. Okay, hold on. My my point

57:11is if there is a deadline, why do we

57:14wait until a couple of days before the

57:17deadline and she presented this? Why are

57:19we now saying that we have to rush for

57:21things that that's that's not fluid for

57:24me? That's not going to have any

57:25protection.

57:25>> I'll give you the background. I have a a

57:28letter um and a memo um dated Thursday,

57:32May 21st from Miss Wilson to me.

57:35Includes Mayor Johnson, includes Chief

57:36Tomasimo, includes Assistant City

57:39Manager Taffy Young, includes Pamela

57:41Everett, um who is a staff member at

57:43NPC.

57:45Um for here on this email, um which was

57:51a followup to a May 19th call we had

57:53about the same subject. Um MPC requested

57:58I'll share this with city council

58:01uh requested that um on October 22nd

58:052026 presentation of final comp plan to

58:08city council for consideration and

58:10approval um October 31st 2026 state

58:14deadline for comprehensive plan

58:15adoption. Um so the city has met the

58:21request of MPC.

58:23the the the the other

58:27piece of this puzzle is that um the

58:30comprehensive plan draft um was provided

58:35um to city council months ago um and the

58:41city council voted to um submit the

58:44draft proposal to DCA.

58:47Also, we can't approve a plan until DCA

58:50gives a thumbs up on the draft plan.

58:53um which was done I believe last

58:55Wednesday or the Wednesday before.

58:58>> They basically um have to the the the

59:01the process is that DCA gets the

59:04documents. It goes to CRC first and then

59:07once the CRC looks at it, they send it

59:09to the DCA and that's the regional uh

59:12commission. Then it goes to the state

59:14and they get 45 days to do the review.

59:1745 days. So, um, we got, uh, feedback

59:23from them. We sent it back. We got

59:25feedback. Again, that's why some of you

59:28talk to you. They ran it through AI and

59:29there was a couple things that we had to

59:31go through and, uh, now we know. But we

59:35got approval well within the timeline in

59:38order to meet the deadline that we had

59:39put together when I sent the follow-up

59:42memo to the manager actually April um

59:469th and I did a follow-up email to him

59:49which is what he was saying in May. Um

59:52and this schedule was also presented to

59:54you all in October when I did the

59:57presentation of last year. So these

59:59dates uh this schedule has been out for

1:00:02a year. uh with regards to what the

1:00:05timeline is for getting this moving

1:00:07forward. The deadline is always the end

1:00:09of October. That's not our arbitrary

1:00:12deadline date. That is always the

1:00:14deadline date for DCA. As far as the

1:00:17comprehensive plan document, I I really

1:00:19want to be clear about that because

1:00:20there's a lot of I think

1:00:21misunderstanding about what this is and

1:00:23what this is not. This is a this is an

1:00:26overarching document. That's why it's

1:00:27the city and the county. It's setting

1:00:30what the goals, visions to to look at

1:00:32what needs to happen in 2045

1:00:36in this case. It helps you hopefully

1:00:38with your capital improvements

1:00:40budgeting, which now you've got a CIE,

1:00:42which we're going to end up adding when

1:00:44we uh deal with putting the total

1:00:46document together, but is to help you

1:00:48with your planning. The [snorts]

1:00:51detailed pieces that you're talking

1:00:53about and you're going to see, they're

1:00:55not pieces. They're not planning that we

1:00:57do. What you're wanting to see are

1:01:00neighborhood plans. They are community

1:01:02plans where you meet with the people in

1:01:04the neighborhood. You go into more

1:01:06detail about what they want to see

1:01:09within their community. And that's you

1:01:11we use the character area. So if you

1:01:13look in the document, we've got

1:01:14character areas that describe what they

1:01:16would like to see the character of a

1:01:19particular area. If you said Southside,

1:01:21Southside character area is to have, you

1:01:23know, safe, decent, affordable housing,

1:01:25access to shopping and transportation

1:01:28and jobs. Well, that's sitting kind of

1:01:32like a general vision, but those but

1:01:33those neighborhood plans that the city

1:01:37[snorts]

1:01:37>> does

1:01:38>> through your planning group is the

1:01:41detail plans that go into setting up

1:01:44what the implementation will be of that.

1:01:47So, they're two different documents.

1:01:48This is the general

1:01:50>> you guys for what you want to see.

1:01:52They're the neighborhood plans. And I

1:01:53think that you you've heard staff that

1:01:54work on those area plans. You have a you

1:01:57have a a a a archive of past area plans.

1:02:02I think the the mayor kind of reminded

1:02:03me of one when we had a a subdivision um

1:02:08that happened that was in Woodville.

1:02:10Those planning documents haven't been

1:02:12updated in years, but they exist and

1:02:15they're in one place. So, uh, Miss Young

1:02:18basically sent me the link so that I

1:02:20could have all of them in one place

1:02:22because I couldn't find them. Those are

1:02:25the neighborhood plans. Those are the

1:02:26pieces that do what you all are saying

1:02:29that you would like to see with regards

1:02:31to getting additional work from the

1:02:33neighborhoods to see what they want to

1:02:35see. This again is setting the overall

1:02:38kind of vision of what you'd like to see

1:02:41happen. And when you talk about 2033,

1:02:44just to just incorporate the way that I

1:02:46look at that that document in that that

1:02:48that group and I am hoping I've said it

1:02:51number of times that they need to make

1:02:53sure the NPC is at the table and not at

1:02:56the kids table. There needs to be

1:02:57somebody there at least listening to the

1:02:59conversation so that we can know how to

1:03:01incorporate into our documents. Uh it's

1:03:04the implementation tool. That's why

1:03:05they've got partners from pooler and

1:03:08other jurisdictions because each one of

1:03:10those planning documents in the back has

1:03:13a work program and things that have a

1:03:16monetary cost. MTC doesn't pay for it.

1:03:19We don't pay for it. Sometimes it takes

1:03:21partnering and so there will be someone

1:03:24hopefully looking at all of those

1:03:25documents coming up with probablyus at

1:03:27some point where you can basically

1:03:29leverage your monies

1:03:32to jointly have either a shared facility

1:03:36or look at your infrastructure see if

1:03:38there's anou that you could do with

1:03:39that. That's that's why that one is more

1:03:41of a business community document because

1:03:44it's like what are they willing to pay

1:03:45for to get this document implemented and

1:03:49that's looking at everybody's plan.

1:03:50That's why it's short term. 2033

1:03:53is very short term. This 2040 2045 is a

1:03:58longer version of that.

1:04:00>> Yeah, that's the problem. So, I just

1:04:03wanted to make I just wanted to make

1:04:04sure what the differences were between

1:04:06what this document is and what you are

1:04:08wanting to see. What you're wanting to

1:04:10see are your air neighborhood area plans

1:04:13>> and who's responsible.

1:04:14>> One, one moment. One moment. So, back on

1:04:16the on the timeline, uh, make sure we

1:04:18stay on what this is about. Um, even

1:04:22from this timeline,

1:04:24um, the incorporation deadline was

1:04:27September the 15th. The NPC board

1:04:30meeting was on the 6th.

1:04:32Um so that is when they did the pre

1:04:36presentation of the final plan right

1:04:38>> that's when we did when we did the uh

1:04:41meeting for the NPC yesterday

1:04:42>> right so the county had only one meeting

1:04:45this month that was on the 16th last

1:04:47Friday

1:04:47>> that's correct

1:04:48>> so you know they only had one shot at it

1:04:51and then of course so I mean it's it's

1:04:53really a really tight timeline anyway

1:04:55>> it's a it's a tight timeline the way

1:04:57that uh uh that this is set up yes sir

1:05:00>> right Okay. All right. I um let's uh

1:05:03let's start with Alderwoman Laneir,

1:05:05Alderman Leget since they had not said

1:05:07anything and then we'll come back

1:05:08around.

1:05:08>> She actually was before all I saw Ler.

1:05:13>> Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Um

1:05:16I I think what we're seeing here

1:05:20is a several things. There's a lot going

1:05:22on here. Um we do want to make that

1:05:26deadline. that's important, but we can't

1:05:28just send something that that we're not

1:05:31comfortable with. Um, and

1:05:35what's happening if we pass this is

1:05:38business as usual

1:05:40>> and that's the problem. And um, back

1:05:43some years ago when I was a young public

1:05:45administrator

1:05:47and a community leader, I saw a future

1:05:51land use map. I forgot what year it

1:05:54depicted, but it was not in keeping with

1:05:58what the community wanted,

1:05:59>> right?

1:06:00>> Somebody had put that together and it

1:06:02did not include residents and and

1:06:05citizens uh of

1:06:07>> people who live in Savannah not coming

1:06:09to move

1:06:10>> everyday people was not included. Um, so

1:06:13since that time, and this was probably

1:06:15back in the 1990s or something, I was

1:06:17determined to to get involved to an

1:06:20extent of changing that. And so I came

1:06:24to this council with the the idea

1:06:27working with the old zo, working with

1:06:28the new zo. couldn't get none of that

1:06:30work. But been been very adamantly at

1:06:34the table trying to get this uh plane

1:06:38and that map the flume to represent the

1:06:41desire of of the community. Um when

1:06:45Melanie when you got hired here and came

1:06:46to Savannah, I met with you and we had

1:06:49this same conversation

1:06:50>> and I was very clear with you regards to

1:06:52the neighborhood.

1:06:53>> Some of my terminology was off and when

1:06:55I was saying master plan uh the area

1:06:58plan I switched that you corrected me on

1:07:00that. Um that we had some neighborhood

1:07:03plans

1:07:04>> but in working the work we were doing

1:07:06back in the early 2000 Victor Koopa and

1:07:09myself we want know we needed area plans

1:07:12>> um and because This would represent a

1:07:15more community benefit uh approach

1:07:18bubbling up where where where

1:07:21citizen-led and resident driven where

1:07:22the people are more involved at the

1:07:24table where these plans will bubble up

1:07:26to the point where they would get into

1:07:28this comprehensive plan. I don't think

1:07:30you all could just sit there and make

1:07:31stuff up and change the plan. It's a

1:07:34process. And so Jay, when you came on, I

1:07:36met with you and told you we needed to

1:07:38do these plans, but now we need to do

1:07:40two things. We need to create some area

1:07:42plans of the areas that never got

1:07:45planned and then we need to go back and

1:07:47revisit these because we did these in

1:07:49what 2006 7 8 9 10 of all the ones that

1:07:52exist

1:07:53>> and and some older um the historic

1:07:57districts. But so now we got all of

1:07:59these plans out here um outdated um

1:08:03haven't implemented anything to talk

1:08:04about. And then we got this

1:08:06comprehensive plan that that sort of

1:08:09combines all of those plans. Um,

1:08:14and it doesn't represent what the people

1:08:15want. So, I'm not comfortable right now

1:08:18because I need to look at that flume.

1:08:20And that's just a map. It's a lot of

1:08:23verbiage in that plan that that talks

1:08:26about the desire of and the direction

1:08:28that we're going in as a city and it

1:08:30really doesn't match up um with our

1:08:33current growth and development

1:08:35>> um if we wanted to be smart about it.

1:08:38>> So here we are in the 11th and a half

1:08:40hour needed to get this thing to the

1:08:43DCA. Um, I'm looking at this map over

1:08:46here in the corner and it represents

1:08:48industrial properties in the city of

1:08:51Savannah. Two things we need to go back

1:08:53and put in um unincorporated county

1:08:56because some of these city neighborhoods

1:08:59abut.

1:09:00>> So, so, so you're not getting a good

1:09:02depiction of where the industry is

1:09:05abutdding the people

1:09:06>> because you're leaving out the

1:09:08uninccorporated part. So, that's one

1:09:10thing. The other thing is I'm looking at

1:09:12the fifth district and I see some

1:09:14>> I think this is for our next that's okay

1:09:18the information is still good. This is

1:09:19industrial property and I'm looking at

1:09:21the fifth district and the fifth

1:09:22district is comfortable with what we

1:09:24have here today but on the flume is the

1:09:27flume saying that I'm comfortable I'm

1:09:29comfortable with it but due to the fact

1:09:32hold not let

1:09:34the elephant in the room finish please

1:09:36>> is a neighborhood plans

1:09:39saying that those quite clear.

1:09:42>> Uh in 2045,

1:09:45uh they're going to be uh next to other

1:09:47residential property or other

1:09:48industrial.

1:09:49>> If if I may to respond to your question,

1:09:52Alderman uh Alderwoman Laneir, one thing

1:09:55I just want to stress to you all.

1:09:58>> I talked about the character areas, and

1:10:00I talk about those character areas for a

1:10:02reason. You know, we went through, we

1:10:04did surveys, we talked to a variety of

1:10:06people. those character areas kind of

1:10:08set and establish what people want to

1:10:10see. The flume itself

1:10:13as part of the work program in that

1:10:15document, it says we need to work on we

1:10:17need to work to update the flume. So

1:10:20that can be sent later. Just because

1:10:22this gets approved does not mean it

1:10:25can't get amended, but generally when

1:10:29you deal with the flume, you deal with

1:10:31it

1:10:32>> as you're dealing with the updates for

1:10:34these neighborhood plans. So, just so

1:10:36you know, part of this update includes a

1:10:40work program in the back and it talks

1:10:41about updating uh or dealing with uh the

1:10:45updates for the flume. So, that can be

1:10:47done.

1:10:48>> It always sound good like this in these

1:10:50uh hundreds and hundreds of meetings

1:10:52through these years, many many decades.

1:10:54It always sound good like this just like

1:10:56it sound good in here today. But it

1:10:58never happens. The changes never come.

1:11:00>> Right, Alicia?

1:11:01>> Business as usual.

1:11:04you finish alder woman lane.

1:11:05>> So I want to talk about accountability.

1:11:09Um so we got the flume versus the desire

1:11:11of the community. Uh the area plans um

1:11:15we've been planning top down instead of

1:11:17bottoms up. Um

1:11:20and this comprehensive plan supposed to

1:11:22be a overarching document. So if a ball

1:11:26was dropped, then we did not submit to

1:11:29you the area plans or whatever you

1:11:32needed to change your document. I

1:11:34>> I think that what what what has happened

1:11:37uh again is that in the past and it's

1:11:40it's that it just depends on what the

1:11:42values were for people sitting in in

1:11:44office and and things of that nature at

1:11:46the time. You know, at one time you had

1:11:48a very robust neighborhood planning

1:11:51program. Miss Young ran that. She she

1:11:54she basically updated a ton of community

1:11:57plans. As I said, she sent me the

1:12:00archives for all these neighborhood

1:12:02plans cuz I asked I was like, "Where are

1:12:03these planning documents?" Because I

1:12:04couldn't even find them. Um, I've met

1:12:07with a number of you on occasions, just

1:12:08about all of you, and said one of the

1:12:11things that is really needed is having

1:12:14these neighborhood area plans done so

1:12:17that at least the citizens have an

1:12:19opportunity to talk more about what goes

1:12:23on with regards to their community. That

1:12:25still can happen as these area plans are

1:12:29being done that you are working on.

1:12:33Those documents can be uploaded and we

1:12:36can update the flume.

1:12:38We went in this case and in the previous

1:12:41case with character areas because based

1:12:44on information that we got from the

1:12:46people in the community about what they

1:12:48wanted to see. It's kind of like the

1:12:49mini vision. It was it was easier to say

1:12:53this is what these folks want to see. So

1:12:55when you do your area plan in your

1:12:57flume, you've got a baseline to start.

1:12:59If you're in a a suburban area, there's

1:13:01a characterization for what that needs

1:13:04to happen in that area and it rolls up

1:13:06and it is used as a guide as they're

1:13:08starting to deal with their their uh

1:13:10planning documents. But, you know, I

1:13:12understand that you all have started

1:13:14doing um area and neighborhood plans and

1:13:17as they move forward,

1:13:18>> I can speak to that

1:13:19>> then before you we'll start dealing with

1:13:21the updates from the future. before

1:13:23before Jay um when when I was in first

1:13:26district um I made sure every one of our

1:13:31neighborhoods at the time had a

1:13:32neighborhood plan.

1:13:33>> To Taffy's point,

1:13:35>> um we hired we had planners. We had a

1:13:37whole team

1:13:38>> right

1:13:38>> that worked for Taffany of planners that

1:13:41their job was to actually do the micro

1:13:44work of working with Right now at some

1:13:47point they started I mean I don't think

1:13:50we really have them anymore. Well, if I

1:13:52could speak

1:13:54I'm just I'm just saying that is why um

1:13:57their job was to be able to work with

1:14:00the neighborhoods to create the plans

1:14:02and then to update the plans and the

1:14:04point at which they became archaic is

1:14:07because we really stopped doing it on

1:14:09that planning level the way we used to

1:14:11and I'll hand it off to you Jay.

1:14:13>> So, um

1:14:14>> that's the problem. I I don't not sure

1:14:16when the neighborhood area planning

1:14:19capacity

1:14:21um came out years ago, maybe mid

1:14:24>> 2010s.

1:14:26Um we

1:14:28>> uh but we [clears throat] it's been a

1:14:31long time. We've done we have updated

1:14:34neighborhood plans as it is related to

1:14:37um scoring better on low-income housing

1:14:39tax credit programs and other grants

1:14:41that we've needed to do in my five years

1:14:43here. But the big step we took forward

1:14:45was last year which was creating the

1:14:47assistant director role for planning and

1:14:49urban design. We hired Edward Morrow um

1:14:52who you all know and one of his big jobs

1:14:55is to restart that um neighborhood and

1:14:59small area planning constructs. He's

1:15:01working on three now um three specific

1:15:05neighborhoods but they're all um

1:15:07attached um Oichington, Tmont, and Dolls

1:15:11Avenue. Um, I also want to say that

1:15:13we've done small area plans, though

1:15:15we've called them differently. Like the

1:15:17canal district plan, um, is a is a small

1:15:20area plan and a neighborhood plan. The

1:15:23work that we've done on the south side

1:15:25is also a small district plan um, as

1:15:29well. But we are, and I think you're

1:15:32absolutely right, need to get back to

1:15:34that neighborhood planning aspect, which

1:15:36is why we've added that capacity back to

1:15:39our office last year. Um, in the in the

1:15:42budget, you adopted that.

1:15:44>> Do do you see me right now?

1:15:48>> My question is, what happened to the

1:15:50area plans that were already in

1:15:53existence? And why hadn't we done

1:15:55anything with those plans?

1:15:58Where are they?

1:16:00>> Because it was a lot of money. If you

1:16:02did when you were elected as a at I mean

1:16:06as the alderman of the district. What

1:16:08happened to those plans for all of those

1:16:10communities? Why are we so focused on

1:16:14the canal district and all these other

1:16:17new things, but we've not done anything

1:16:19with the old stuff that we've had.

1:16:21>> The focus plans. The plans are still

1:16:24there.

1:16:25>> All that stuff was in the plan.

1:16:26>> They're dated though. They're not

1:16:28getting

1:16:28>> they're dated. But that was a lot of

1:16:30money that was spent

1:16:33>> on those plans and

1:16:35>> well, we need to go and dust them off

1:16:37and start using them. Okay. I got a

1:16:40question. I'm first of all, when you

1:16:42speak of the flume for our general

1:16:44public to know what is the flume?

1:16:47>> Okay. Thank you. The the flume is the

1:16:50future land use. Okay. And I I just want

1:16:54to say um one of the things uh that has

1:16:58happened with regards to work that has

1:17:00been done yes for canal district and

1:17:03other things. It's getting down to the

1:17:05detail of dealing with the land use

1:17:07component of those areas. You've got

1:17:11policy and you've got some other stuff

1:17:13but the staff right now I know they are

1:17:15working on land use piece that goes with

1:17:19the canal district for example. Um, so

1:17:22but that's a piece that's really

1:17:24important. Um, those other documents

1:17:26again, uh, I found them. So we I've

1:17:30instructed my staff to look at them when

1:17:32we have some big cases because there's

1:17:34some policy in there that we just had no

1:17:36idea existed because, you know, we

1:17:39didn't even have all of the documents.

1:17:40We got access to

1:17:42>> Okay. I have a question for you in

1:17:45reference to Let me ask you this, Mr.

1:17:48City Manager.

1:17:50Who dropped the ball?

1:17:52>> Because our planning, we do have a

1:17:54planning department. Correct.

1:17:55>> Yes, we do.

1:17:56>> Okay. So, if we have a planning

1:17:58department, I would think that the

1:18:01planning department would connect with

1:18:07MPC and say we have these area map these

1:18:10these area plans and can we implement

1:18:13those plans inside of our comprehensive

1:18:18plan? Am I correct? Yes. Okay.

1:18:21>> I think we're we're missing we're

1:18:24overlaying comprehensive plan to mean

1:18:27that

1:18:28>> small area plans make up a comprehensive

1:18:31plan.

1:18:32>> Okay. So now let me ask you this because

1:18:34Miss Wilson just said that we could go

1:18:37back and put the area plans. Am I

1:18:40correct? I think I heard you say we

1:18:42could amend it to put

1:18:46>> that's you could you can basically amend

1:18:48the language. Let me finish. Sorry. So

1:18:50now my question is with the plans that

1:18:54were already in place that was sitting

1:18:58on the shelf.

1:19:00Why weren't those plans given to Miss

1:19:04Wilson and her department so that that

1:19:07could have been done as opposed to them

1:19:10sitting on the shelf and come back and

1:19:11done?

1:19:12>> Now now and and Taffy can help with

1:19:14this.

1:19:15>> Yeah, we

1:19:15>> they were the the point of really the

1:19:18neighborhood plans and the reason why we

1:19:20did them particularly with such urgency

1:19:22was for land use

1:19:23>> was to protect zoning,

1:19:25>> right? to make sure that those

1:19:26neighborhoods that were um residential

1:19:30in nature that were abudded by uh

1:19:32industrial uses

1:19:34>> will remain residential.

1:19:36>> Right.

1:19:36>> So that you know that those plans did

1:19:39what they're supposed to do.

1:19:40>> There has not been that type of

1:19:42intrusion. Those plans are still there.

1:19:44But I think you're complating the

1:19:46comprehensive future land use map. I

1:19:48mean, I think you know, Jay is saying

1:19:50that we're getting back into that

1:19:51process, but the neighborhood plans um

1:19:54are still there and they have done what

1:19:56they were supposed to do. We have not

1:19:58had the industrial

1:19:59>> we haven't done on the work plan.

1:20:01>> Well, not necessarily work, but but

1:20:03again, the primary purpose of it was not

1:20:05the work plan. The primary purpose was

1:20:06was to protect the zoning in those

1:20:08residential neighborhoods. So, we didn't

1:20:10have the industrial intrusion that is

1:20:12held. We have not had the industrial

1:20:14intrusion. Now to that end, I mean there

1:20:17were some things in hand. Some of that

1:20:19stuff has changed uh just because of

1:20:21time, because of funding. Some of the

1:20:22stuff we've done.

1:20:23>> That's correct.

1:20:24>> We've or we have done it. Um we just

1:20:26need to update those plans to reflect

1:20:28[clears throat] the work that's being

1:20:29done, but that is not necessarily this

1:20:32conversation.

1:20:33>> I mean, I think that's a conversation.

1:20:35>> The small area plans are the

1:20:37comprehensive plan is not made up of

1:20:39small area plans. The small area

1:20:40planning process was done in the early

1:20:442000s, 2010. So all of those plans has

1:20:48they they've they've existed.

1:20:50>> Um you know, when

1:20:54>> Yeah, that was done under city manager

1:20:55Stephanie Cutter. Yeah.

1:20:56>> Um and again, we've we've we're we've

1:21:00added capacity last year because of this

1:21:02need and we got to get back into that.

1:21:04and Taffne and I will will make sure

1:21:06that these plans um get the revivals

1:21:11that they need and we'll have an

1:21:13accounting for what was implemented when

1:21:15the plans were done, what still has to

1:21:18remain and what we've done um in the

1:21:21interim um with those small area plans.

1:21:24But I do want to the point to the the

1:21:26the budget enhancement that you all

1:21:29passed last year to include this new

1:21:32capacity there. So, but I don't want to

1:21:33conflate what a comprehensive plan is

1:21:36for the state with what small area plans

1:21:39are for communities.

1:21:42>> And that's why I've said that our

1:21:44comprehensive plan is macro. It's it's

1:21:46kind of looking city, county, broad. The

1:21:49neighborhood plans and the area plans,

1:21:50they're micro. And we did, if you look

1:21:53at the land use plan map, we took the

1:21:55land use pieces from those plans. That's

1:21:57what was used to deal with creating the

1:21:59flume that's in place. So, it's not like

1:22:02that document was done without

1:22:05incorporating that information when it

1:22:08was last updated.

1:22:09>> What I'm saying is that any new updates,

1:22:12any additional work that we want to see,

1:22:14I know that there's been some additional

1:22:17um work done on MLK for example and

1:22:20things of that nature. Then once those

1:22:22are done,

1:22:22>> we can add

1:22:23>> and uh you ready, then we will update

1:22:26the land use plan. not the character

1:22:29areas and stuff that's already been done

1:22:30to reflect some of the changes. It's

1:22:32that land use plan. And candidly

1:22:34speaking, you're not voting on a land

1:22:36use plan right now. You're voting on a

1:22:38document that has the character areas.

1:22:40It describes what the vision or what

1:22:42people want to see based on what we

1:22:44heard back from the people in the

1:22:45community. The flume, the flume or that

1:22:49future land use plan map is something

1:22:51that can be adopted

1:22:55more specifically at a later date once

1:22:58we get additional land use information

1:23:01working with your planning department.

1:23:03Generally, when they start doing that

1:23:05work, they'll give us a call and we

1:23:07always have somebody at staff at those

1:23:08meetings. We worked a lot with uh Miss

1:23:11Young when she was uh in those agent uh

1:23:13running running um

1:23:15>> uh that area of the department. In fact,

1:23:17one of the last documents that we

1:23:18assist, I think, was Hudson Hills

1:23:21document from the standpoint of looking

1:23:22at that land use plan. But that's all we

1:23:24would do. It's it is just the land use

1:23:27plan piece. We don't get into the micro

1:23:31piece, the little detail pieces. That's

1:23:33what you all do.

1:23:34>> Thank you for that understanding. Um,

1:23:38but this plan, this comprehensive plan,

1:23:42um, I've listened to you talk about the

1:23:45people

1:23:46>> who you reached out to

1:23:51and as we all know, a lot of people did

1:23:55not participate.

1:23:58I'm going say it like this. A lot of uh,

1:24:00African-American people did not

1:24:02participate in this. So, how do you

1:24:05reach out to those people to get their

1:24:08feedback or their input outside of what

1:24:11you normally did?

1:24:13>> Well, we went to um and I will be glad

1:24:16to share a list of the places that we

1:24:17went to.

1:24:18>> I heard you mention SCAD.

1:24:21>> They help you do a logo work.

1:24:24>> The the the SCAD serve basically, you

1:24:26know, they approached us and they said,

1:24:28"Hey, you know, we've got some students.

1:24:29They want a little bit a little bit more

1:24:30about planning and how to kind of uh

1:24:33show logo to you know and apply it. So

1:24:36they helped us with regards to the logo

1:24:38working with our team uh of my staff to

1:24:41develop the logo which I think is very

1:24:43reflective of the city and the county.

1:24:45It kind of shows the diversity and

1:24:46things of that nature within the

1:24:48community. But I've got a list of the

1:24:50places that we met. We went to the

1:24:51senior cit citizens uh facilities. We uh

1:24:55talked with a couple of the churches. We

1:24:58went out to um Foresight Park and any

1:25:02place that we could uh find where we

1:25:05thought we could reach a diverse group

1:25:07of people. We can't make people

1:25:10participate. All we can do is set up the

1:25:12opportunity for them to participate.

1:25:15With regards to that,

1:25:16>> I totally understand that. So, um, my

1:25:20question is

1:25:22the people that live in particularly

1:25:25West Savannah area in our low wealth

1:25:28communities, did you all go into those

1:25:32areas?

1:25:32>> Oh, absolutely. We went to the senior

1:25:34Oh, absolutely. In fact, we went there

1:25:36uh with a bag of trinkets and we found

1:25:39out that the

1:25:39>> I'm talking not specifically for senior

1:25:42citizens. I'm talking our young people.

1:25:44We went and we basically had we based

1:25:47our meetings at the facility because

1:25:49that's where we could meet. But we did

1:25:52go into um the communities that were

1:25:56>> Now you talked about SCAD. We have a

1:26:00HBCU

1:26:01here in our city, the oldest

1:26:05in the state of Georgia.

1:26:07>> Um Savannah State University. Mhm.

1:26:10>> I would like to see us as a a whole

1:26:14reach out to those.

1:26:15>> I I I will say that we did have a a

1:26:17Savannah State uh student work with us

1:26:20on the document. Uh and they will be

1:26:22recognized as a component of the

1:26:24document. So, it's not that I did not

1:26:26reach out to talk to the folks at

1:26:27Savannah State regarding uh providing

1:26:30assistance. It's just that I mentioned

1:26:32SCAD Serve because the logo that you see

1:26:35is something that they worked to create.

1:26:38But I I talk to anybody that would

1:26:40listen to me.

1:26:40>> Wilson, um, when I'm talking about

1:26:44Savannah State, I'm talking about young

1:26:48Africanameans

1:26:50>> who could give you input

1:26:53on what our city can use, what our city

1:26:57needs that actually live here, that's

1:27:00from here.

1:27:02Okay. Not just

1:27:05>> we had a we had a nice young uh

1:27:08African-American man that worked and

1:27:09lived in

1:27:10>> one I'm talking about a plethora

1:27:12>> I I understand I I understand but the

1:27:15SCAD students too were very diverse. It

1:27:17wasn't just a one note group of people

1:27:19but for for Savannah State I reached out

1:27:22to them. I talked with Dr. role when he

1:27:24came in and anybody that would listen to

1:27:26me beforehand to find any students that

1:27:28might be interested in working with us

1:27:31not only on this document but even offer

1:27:33internships. So I do what I can do with

1:27:36regards to to uh talking and reaching

1:27:39out to everybody

1:27:40>> please

1:27:43with Savannah State University

1:27:46>> Leot. Thank you Mr. Mayor. Thank you Mr.

1:27:48City Manager. Miss Wilson the uh

1:27:51Mr. Would we call this a living

1:27:54document, the uh comprehensive plan

1:27:56document?

1:27:57>> Yes, sir. Actually, that's a really good

1:27:58question. I think um you know, we have

1:28:00the ability to approve and amend it.

1:28:03>> Um there's nothing stopping us if we

1:28:06approve this document today uh for us to

1:28:10then workshop further

1:28:12>> and make additions. Um we can charge the

1:28:16city manager and Miss Wilson uh to work

1:28:18together to do that. That's right. Um it

1:28:21is I mean I think that's the most potent

1:28:23question of the day. I mean it is a

1:28:25living document.

1:28:26>> Um just because we submitted on the 31st

1:28:29it

1:28:29>> um you know doesn't mean it's a beall

1:28:31endall. It's a placeholder. And so uh it

1:28:34does allow us the flexibility and if we

1:28:36charge a city manager as a part of the

1:28:38work plan uh to uh give us additional

1:28:42information we can do that. So

1:28:44>> I would suggest if we do that we do that

1:28:46with the city's new engagement

1:28:49philosophy and and playbook

1:28:50>> correct

1:28:51>> where we do it with the community.

1:28:53>> So with that uh Mr. from you know the

1:28:55overarching thing that I think coming

1:28:57around this table is this is a quality

1:29:00of life issue when we start talking

1:29:02about the vision of 2033 when we first

1:29:04came in office we came into the 2033

1:29:07that was the vision and the community is

1:29:10looking at this 2045 plan of the vision

1:29:14of 2033 is

1:29:16how the plan that they're making for us

1:29:20and the the vision that they have for us

1:29:22in 2033 but the plan has to move us out

1:29:25in 2045.

1:29:26>> Come on.

1:29:26>> So the So I think what should have

1:29:30happened

1:29:31>> is a a better

1:29:33>> the black people

1:29:34>> the vision of 2033 when we came in

1:29:37office was to uh

1:29:39>> for them to see what they wanted to do

1:29:41with with Savannah. But the plan is in

1:29:442045 what I'm getting from the community

1:29:46to find a way to get us out of here.

1:29:48>> So this is what I'm hearing from the

1:29:50community from the community centers. So

1:29:52when we talk about

1:29:54>> African American,

1:29:55>> thank you

1:32:41is on the end zone. And so we got these

1:32:43plans, but they never reach the people

1:32:46that I need to do. And they are white,

1:32:49black, Indian, gay, straight. I'm

1:32:52talking about when we do, we got to fix

1:32:53this. Mr. City Manager and Van, we got

1:32:55to fix this before you leave. We got a

1:32:57comprehensive plan that does not include

1:32:59what the n she she said that we need to

1:33:01talk to the community. I talked to the

1:33:02community and they are afraid. And when

1:33:04he says moving out, you can't move a a

1:33:07you can't move a race out, but you can

1:33:09move them out where they live. That's

1:33:11what they're concerned about. You can

1:33:12change this. So I want to look I'm

1:33:14looking at that map. I'm looking at that

1:33:16map. And so I I got a question on this

1:33:19map right here. Just just out of

1:33:22thinking on that map, which which

1:33:24neighborhood or corridors that y'all

1:33:26believe are designated for more uh

1:33:29intense development

1:33:30>> in the in the fifth?

1:33:31>> Okay. So So they're at risk

1:33:33>> and the first and the sixth.

1:33:34>> The second is a big one right now.

1:33:36>> Okay. So So we we we got a comprehensive

1:33:39plan and the plans don't include um uh

1:33:42goals of how we make these things.

1:33:44>> I just want to make you know the these

1:33:46maps are for the next

1:33:48>> No, no, no. I'm just looking at the map.

1:33:49I'm just using it. That's a map of the

1:33:50city here. I'm just saying. And so the

1:33:52question was whether we have a map or

1:33:54not who's at risk for development.

1:33:57>> Melanie can answer the question about

1:33:59where the where the density lies. the

1:34:02the the growth areas for the city where

1:34:04we're seeing

1:34:07um the most permitted housing activity

1:34:09are in what I'll call recently or newly

1:34:13annexed places in New Hampshire which is

1:34:16going to be building out similarly to

1:34:18how the Highlands has been built out

1:34:20over the last 20 years. Um we also have

1:34:23seen in the last census last census

1:34:27increase residents um in our downtown um

1:34:31area as well. Um, I know that, you know,

1:34:35when the housing tools that council is

1:34:39still discussing, those would allow for

1:34:41greater housing density in some of the

1:34:44business corridors along

1:34:46>> um, uh, the south side um, and other

1:34:50places as well as um, East Bay Street.

1:34:53And I know we're still working on

1:34:54whether or not those are the right

1:34:56policies, but I think like the the

1:34:58zoning document itself is going to

1:35:01dictate where we think density and

1:35:04development is going to happen. Um the

1:35:07comprehensive plan, as Melanie stated,

1:35:10is trying to define character areas. So

1:35:13there's a character area downtown.

1:35:15>> There's a character area for from places

1:35:17and the in the maps that we've got.

1:35:19Again, as I said, they do reflect what

1:35:21we've got right there. But the character

1:35:23but but the character notice basically

1:35:26kind of set the stage. It tells the

1:35:27story sort of what the community says

1:35:28they want to see the land use plan which

1:35:31again we can work to update the future

1:35:35land map if that is the will of the

1:35:38group they're but they're different

1:35:42beasts. A lot of growth that's taking

1:35:44place in Midtown downtown again up by

1:35:48Hemstead took places off of um how a lot

1:35:51of stuff going on off of each.

1:35:53>> My turn. We coming around.

1:35:54>> Oh, my turn next.

1:35:56>> No, then me then you

1:36:00a lot of work going on as was mentioned

1:36:02in New New Hstead. Midtown has seen a

1:36:05lot of like multif family growth. uh

1:36:07Oichi in that area uh has seen a lot of

1:36:11u multif family um growth as well with

1:36:14regards to uh housing type. Um,

1:36:19but with that said, I think that, you

1:36:22know, I at least I've heard you with

1:36:25regards to wanting to have more um

1:36:31information um

1:36:34from uh staff on Lang's plans in these

1:36:39neighborhoods. I just really do want to

1:36:40be clear that uh the comprehensive plan

1:36:43really is the macro. It's a overarching

1:36:47larger document and the micro documents

1:36:50which is what I'm hearing you really be

1:36:52concerned about are those neighborhood

1:36:54and area plans which get into the detail

1:36:57of what the people in the community want

1:37:00to see in their neighborhoods. And we do

1:37:01have documents again the future language

1:37:04plan that we have in place right now

1:37:06reflect

1:37:08what the community wanted to see when

1:37:13they participated in

1:37:16>> and and to that end um you know we have

1:37:19a a GPS plan that talks about equity and

1:37:24engagement and again we we can you know

1:37:28this this does not prevent us again from

1:37:30charging city manager

1:37:32>> to to to continue this

1:37:36>> uh to engage and to continue to improve.

1:37:39>> I'm happy to come back with a plan and

1:37:41I'll work with Miss Wilson on it on a on

1:37:45a GPS style engagement strategy over the

1:37:48next year where regardless of whether or

1:37:52not council adopts this plan today or

1:37:54not, how we connect all of our planning

1:37:57documents together and what does that

1:37:58look like for community, right? and

1:38:00trying to explain. We've got a we've got

1:38:03a zoning ordinance. We've got a future

1:38:05land use map. We've got a comprehensive

1:38:08plan that details character areas which

1:38:10are planning phrases. We have

1:38:12neighborhood plans. We have district

1:38:14plans. Um and you know we can uh we can

1:38:21design a based on the preference and

1:38:23priorities of council. If neighborhood

1:38:25plans if we want to revitalize that in

1:38:28the same ways that we revital we did

1:38:30that 20 years ago

1:38:31>> then we can we can we can do those um

1:38:35and connect them more to how all of

1:38:38these other planning documents are done.

1:38:40And we can do that in the way that we

1:38:41have started to engage our community

1:38:44more recently in a more GPS way. Um and

1:38:47I can come back with a plan on council

1:38:49about that. I can also come back with an

1:38:51update on where we are with um the small

1:38:54area plans that we've already begun with

1:38:56the new capacity that we added um last

1:38:59year. Taffne can give an update on the

1:39:03small area plans that were done in the

1:39:05past, where they sit today, um how often

1:39:08they've been updated, um etc. as well.

1:39:12Um as she was an expert on that, um and

1:39:15was involved when in that when those

1:39:16plans were done. So, I think that's a

1:39:19that um is a I think a really smart path

1:39:23forward and I'm happy to pull that

1:39:25together.

1:39:26>> How much time do you do you think you

1:39:27need to be able to get back to? Well,

1:39:29I've got a a budget budget.

1:39:31>> We've got a budget um

1:39:33>> first quarter of next year.

1:39:35>> Um yeah, and I can give the outlines of

1:39:37a plan probably quicker than that. Um

1:39:40and certainly we can give an update on

1:39:41where we are with the small area

1:39:43planning that has begun under this new

1:39:45capacity. Um uh and uh and and and share

1:39:50with council the archive of the uh

1:39:53existing neighborhood plans. Let me say

1:39:56just before I get to uh Linda um you

1:39:58know the conststonation is and I mean I

1:40:01understand it now I didn't always

1:40:02understand it um is that we have a lot

1:40:05of plans.

1:40:06>> Yes,

1:40:07>> we have hundreds of plans for hundreds

1:40:10of reasons

1:40:12that often overlap.

1:40:15>> Yes.

1:40:16>> Um some say what is the plan and the

1:40:18fact is depends on who you're asking and

1:40:21what for. um our goal and you know what

1:40:25I would really like to see at some point

1:40:28[cough and clears throat] for us to

1:40:28really be able to thread as much as we

1:40:30can them together so we able to see the

1:40:33interlap and I would love one day just

1:40:36even by by the time we come back to kind

1:40:39of see an overlay of all of the

1:40:41different plans that we have because

1:40:42they're all necessary again this is

1:40:44state funding that is absolutely

1:40:45necessary the feds asked us to do

1:40:48planning for this and then of course

1:40:49locally we do this and then people come

1:40:51up and say well I want to do a plan for

1:40:52this. I mean, you know, and so I think

1:40:54for John Q Citizen, it's like, well,

1:40:57dang, it's it's a bunch of plans. And I

1:40:59don't think it's anything nefarious

1:41:00going on. It's just depending on who's

1:41:02the funding agency, what their

1:41:04requirements are. And obviously, as a as

1:41:06a municipal government, um, you know,

1:41:08we're required to do all of them and be

1:41:11engaged in all of them. And so it gets

1:41:13confusing to the public. And so, you

1:41:14know, that's absolutely understandable.

1:41:16Linda.

1:41:16>> Yes, sir. Uh, I wanted to ask um, and I

1:41:20had it here.

1:41:23The city manager, you know, a lot of

1:41:24times we sit about uh, and we ask for

1:41:27plans, but we never get dates. Can we

1:41:29get an itemized list like this date by

1:41:31date to say what we're doing uh, as far

1:41:34as planning with these communities and

1:41:37how they actually going to be

1:41:38incorporated into protecting them

1:41:40because that is the bottom line right

1:41:42here, accountability and protecting

1:41:44them. I'm not saying that we should not

1:41:45vote for this. I'm saying that there are

1:41:47people who are afraid of how it's going

1:41:49to affect them, how it's going to affect

1:41:51their neighborhoods. And what I'm

1:41:52hearing her say is that she's not

1:41:54responsible that that that we're

1:41:56responsible for making this happen. So

1:41:58in this comprehensive plan, it should

1:42:00describe some goals of how the people

1:42:02going to be protected and that's the

1:42:03only thing that I'm saying. But hold on,

1:42:04hold on. But if we can come back and do

1:42:06that, that's fine. But I would want to

1:42:08see some dates. I would want to see some

1:42:10dates, some accountability of when

1:42:12you're going to come back to us to say

1:42:13that we incorporated the plans that we

1:42:15have. How are they going to affect and

1:42:17how we going to protect citizens based

1:42:18on the plans that they want in the

1:42:21community and that they said they

1:42:22wanted, right? Who's going to protect

1:42:24that? The other question is the

1:42:26compliance. We got these plans. We got a

1:42:28plan. And so who's going to make sure

1:42:30that these plans are in place and

1:42:32they're going to be protected by this

1:42:35this this comprehensive plan that that

1:42:37she's saying that we have to macro it.

1:42:39So we have to macro it. I want to see

1:42:41some dates like you have this the

1:42:42meetings the mile the description and

1:42:44the action something concrete not saying

1:42:46that you're going to get back with us

1:42:48and tell us that. Can you can you make

1:42:49sure that happens for us and then I

1:42:50would be a happy camper cuz right now

1:42:53that what she's saying and what I'm

1:42:54hearing is that that's not her charge.

1:42:56That's not her mission. That's her

1:42:57scope. She got a plan but the plan does

1:42:58not include I describe how people going

1:43:00to be protected. That that's what we are

1:43:02all saying. How are we going to protect

1:43:03people's citizens?

1:43:04>> Yes ma'am. I can come back to you. I

1:43:05will say that MGC

1:43:07>> Yes sir.

1:43:07>> Um as our planning agency is absolutely

1:43:12um has responsibility for that alongside

1:43:15of them and I will do that with MPC as

1:43:18well.

1:43:19>> Okay. So what is the responsibility of

1:43:20our planners? So, um, our planners,

1:43:25um,

1:43:28they, um, confirm and interpret zoning

1:43:32ordinances and decisions on behalf of

1:43:34people who are, um, looking to, uh,

1:43:37confirm what's allowed on their

1:43:39property, etc., business license, um,

1:43:43location approvals. Um they lead um

1:43:47planning efforts like the Southside um

1:43:52uh revitalization plan, like the Canal

1:43:54District plan, like the fairgrounds

1:43:57planning. Um they're engaged in uh plans

1:44:00that we do for um other lines of

1:44:03business. For instance, our Savannah

1:44:05Moves plan, which is our transportation

1:44:07plan, uh for our service delivery

1:44:10strategy, which talks about all of our

1:44:13services, specifically public safety, um

1:44:16and how our public safety apparatus,

1:44:18location, and personnel are able to

1:44:20serve the entire community. Um we look

1:44:23at um aspects around um especially after

1:44:27GPS goals, how close is any one

1:44:30neighborhood to the nearest community

1:44:32center, to the nearest park, to the

1:44:34nearest recreation facility. There's a

1:44:36tremendous amount of planning uh that

1:44:40happens. We also um do a lot of work in

1:44:43the historic preservation space and um

1:44:46and and um working with those entities.

1:44:50So that's a lot of what our planning

1:44:52department does. And as of last year,

1:44:54we've added an assistant director and a

1:44:57capacity to um start once again to focus

1:45:01on small area and neighborhood plans.

1:45:04And I told you the first three

1:45:05neighborhoods that um our our team is

1:45:08working on which is Oichington, Tmont,

1:45:11and Daws Avenue. Um so um and I would

1:45:16love to give you bring back an update on

1:45:19that as well. That's what our planning

1:45:21department does. MPC staff um

1:45:27they hear and receive petitions for

1:45:31changes to zoning requests for both the

1:45:34city and uninccorporated county. Um they

1:45:37provide recommendations to city council

1:45:39about um reszoning and entitlement

1:45:42request. They also um decide zoning

1:45:46variances for the city of Savannah and

1:45:49unincorporated Chattam County. Um as

1:45:51well they also lead the metropolitan

1:45:53planning organization which is the

1:45:55federal transportation

1:45:57region um that uh that coordinates on

1:46:01federal funding for transportation as

1:46:03well. Um so

1:46:04>> and we do all the historic preservation

1:46:06>> and the historic preservation for the

1:46:08the the two historic review boards um

1:46:12that exist for the historic districts in

1:46:14town. So there's um two [clears throat]

1:46:16different functions operations and

1:46:18interpretations

1:46:20um planning and um recommendations

1:46:23policy and um variance approvals.

1:46:26>> Okay. So my question is who's going to

1:46:28be responsible? Are you saying that the

1:46:29planning department? I'm going to be

1:46:32responsible for getting the document

1:46:34that you asked me for.

1:46:35>> Don't drop the ball, J.

1:46:37>> Our planning department, Bridget Litty,

1:46:40Edward Marorrow, and those individuals.

1:46:43>> That's right. They're going to be key

1:46:44components to that as well.

1:46:46>> Um,

1:46:49>> thank you, Mr. Mayor.

1:46:52uh as I initially opened up my comments

1:46:56on this table, I'm closing with almost

1:46:58the same thing that I am ready uh and

1:47:01very very clear uh especially with my

1:47:04constituency on what we uh must do today

1:47:08and and we are ready to move forward

1:47:10[clears throat] with all the

1:47:11conversation that has been taking place

1:47:13on the table. I I end with this because

1:47:16it's how I started and I was clear. Um

1:47:20we can uh move forward with uh approving

1:47:23this document and also come back and do

1:47:27uh the amendments uh to to the work

1:47:31especially

1:47:33and going back city manager and when I

1:47:36did my deep dive I I I located some of

1:47:39the neighborhood plans planning

1:47:41documents uh that uh I was working on uh

1:47:45back in uh before 2020.

1:47:48uh uh and those we were doing that type

1:47:51of work as the mayor stated uh in

1:47:54neighborhoods and what I've heard on the

1:47:57table today is that uh our council

1:48:00members along with myself we've got to

1:48:02protect our people and protecting our

1:48:04people. We've got to go back and uh go

1:48:07back to you know some things that has

1:48:10happened in the past uh is is is not

1:48:14bad. So going back to doing neighborhood

1:48:19planning and touching the people and

1:48:21that is how we touch each person door by

1:48:25door, person by person into what their

1:48:29needs and wants are. And then we come to

1:48:33this overarching

1:48:35uh comprehensive plan. But we've got to

1:48:39without a shadow of a doubt, city

1:48:40manager, got to go back to the old

1:48:42school and pick that pick picked up that

1:48:46work. I mean, it's been there. We still

1:48:48have we still have our assistant city

1:48:50manager who I think she is extremely

1:48:53brilliant when it comes to uh this work

1:48:56and and she's been there from the ground

1:48:58up and making sure that uh that work was

1:49:02done.

1:49:03>> Thank you.

1:49:04>> Thank you, Carol. Just quickly um Jay,

1:49:06I'd like to ask that

1:49:09um

1:49:11you identify

1:49:14the goal or the purpose of each of those

1:49:17plans because it's clear to me after

1:49:19listening to discussions for the last

1:49:21hour and a half. So, I'm not sure that's

1:49:24clear.

1:49:25Um, I think the mayor made a very

1:49:28important statement statements

1:49:31[clears throat]

1:49:31when he talked about the purpose of the

1:49:35neighborhood plans that were developed

1:49:37years and years ago and indicated I'm

1:49:40not really sure that

1:49:42was clear to all of us but indicated

1:49:46that they serve that the purpose of the

1:49:49neighbor the planning at the

1:49:51neighborhood level

1:49:53uh as it was done at that time served

1:49:56its purpose but and I think there was

1:49:59other discussion about what purposes uh

1:50:01some of the other plans

1:50:04um had and whether or not the purpose

1:50:06was served in but there seem to have

1:50:08been so many different plans a

1:50:11compilation so many of them I think it's

1:50:14confusing so I think if we clearly state

1:50:17when you do prepare your presentation if

1:50:20you clearly state the purpose of each of

1:50:24those plans and um some of them are for

1:50:27are for funding purpose too. Um but let

1:50:31us know that um I think it would be

1:50:34helpful for this body as well as for

1:50:36these uh citizens

1:50:39>> certainly and plans take many forms.

1:50:41Some are [clears throat] policy plans

1:50:44like the uh strategic plan on

1:50:47homelessness for the CH. Some are

1:50:50operational um plans like the Savannah

1:50:53um moves plan that's being developed um

1:50:57and uh and I'll I'll happy to provide a

1:51:00list of of the plans. Some are are going

1:51:03to be more helpful and useful than

1:51:04others and some have better purposes

1:51:06than others.

1:51:07>> And and as you say, I mean and we have

1:51:09to do a now we do have to do a better

1:51:11job of documenting the work. Um the West

1:51:14Savannah redevelopment plan had in there

1:51:17uh about the improvements there uh Moses

1:51:21Jackson resource center tap was a part

1:51:24of that but I don't think we ever

1:51:27updated the plan say it had been done

1:51:29the now the gym the Moses Jackson gym um

1:51:33again that was something

1:51:36in Woodville one of the action items

1:51:38banetta was about the community center

1:51:40well the community center is being

1:51:42renovated again I don't We updated the

1:51:43plan to say that we've done that in

1:51:46Hudson Hill. I mean, it, you know, it

1:51:48fell down, but it have a brand new

1:51:50community. So, I think what you bring to

1:51:52us is really we have to be able to do a

1:51:54better job of once we create these

1:51:56plans. Uh, and the work is done to go

1:51:59back and check that off. And that keeps,

1:52:02you know, that keeps us looking at it to

1:52:04say that we've done it. I think you will

1:52:06probably be surprised some of the work.

1:52:07I know Brenetta, in in Woodville, there

1:52:09was issue about the train tracks over

1:52:11there. We're still dealing with issues

1:52:12of of truck traffic. Um we've done some

1:52:15of those things. Um the water

1:52:17improvements over there. Some of that

1:52:18has been done. Again, we have not gone

1:52:21back to the plan, the neighborhood plan

1:52:23and say done. And so I just think, you

1:52:26know, that's what we probably have to

1:52:28revive. Um you know, but I think you

1:52:30will see uh as opposed to thinking

1:52:33nothing has been done, I think we've

1:52:34done the work. We just have not done a

1:52:36good job of documenting the work that

1:52:38we've done. And to add on to that, the

1:52:39next council meeting, I'll be asking for

1:52:41an amendment to change um some of our

1:52:44traffic enforcement so that we can

1:52:45enforce a new truck ban on Alfred Street

1:52:49in Woodville, which I know has been a

1:52:50law

1:52:51>> for years.

1:52:51>> And we we've just now gotten um

1:52:55compliance with GOD and with Port

1:52:57Wentworth um to be able to do that. Um

1:53:00that's in an enforcable way. So um I'll

1:53:03be happy to bring that one forward in

1:53:04two weeks as well.

1:53:05>> Okay. Um so I think Oh, you want to go

1:53:09ahead?

1:53:09>> All right, we'll we'll go ahead. We'll

1:53:10do Brenetta and then

1:53:12>> All right, then let's let's move on if

1:53:13we're going to have

1:53:16>> If not, it'll it'll end up being council

1:53:17meeting today.

1:53:19>> Jay, when I come and visit you on the

1:53:22regular and I have those uh pages of of

1:53:25requests, those items, [snorts] you're

1:53:27going to see them in those community

1:53:29plans, right?

1:53:30>> These things just didn't happen.

1:53:33[snorts]

1:53:33>> These are ongoing issues. Um, and I see

1:53:37how we got here just by how we kind of

1:53:39handling this. I see how we got in this

1:53:42situation. Um, how we have a a a flume

1:53:47um that has so much in it that isn't the

1:53:50current desire of the community. Um, and

1:53:54I see why some of this stuff go on for

1:53:5620 and 30 years um the way we have to.

1:54:01and it's right in our face and we're

1:54:03going to sit on this council and we're

1:54:04going to come and go and things going to

1:54:05still continue and we we we discussing

1:54:08these things and trying to address them.

1:54:10But I hope we come back and and make

1:54:13some changes. You would not believe how

1:54:15many times I've said in similar meetings

1:54:18where we said we'll come back and we'll

1:54:19fix this or we kick the can down the

1:54:22road and we still are dealing with some

1:54:24of those issues and some people are

1:54:26happy because they don't want those

1:54:27things to change. Um, I I need to see

1:54:30those character areas a little closer

1:54:32and I'll I'll make a point to to get

1:54:35with um whomever or open up my books and

1:54:37find that. I needed to be large enough

1:54:39where I can kind of see what's really

1:54:41going on. Now, we've been talking a lot

1:54:43about policies that um lend itself to

1:54:47affordable housing and and we had an

1:54:50issue where um we had an item that

1:54:53seemed like the whole Savannah was

1:54:55looking at um and it didn't pass. But

1:54:58when we were discussing when I brought

1:55:00the overlay the uh we need to make the

1:55:03industrial overlay a critical part of

1:55:07this conversation and these proceedings

1:55:09because if we're trying to identify um

1:55:12how we need to change the future land

1:55:15use map and we know we are having these

1:55:18these problems

1:55:20um with with industry.

1:55:23We've been discussing solutions and we

1:55:25discussed the industrial overlay.

1:55:28So let that be a part of this

1:55:31conversation. [clears throat] It needs

1:55:32to be uh we can't separate those two um

1:55:36because that would help us make

1:55:37decisions about where we need to alter

1:55:40these industrial zones. Um

1:55:44we talked about inclusionary zoning. Had

1:55:48we embraced that when that was

1:55:50introduced,

1:55:53suppose we have built 5,000 apartments,

1:55:57uh 500 of those would have been

1:55:59affordable,

1:56:01but we didn't do that. We were talking

1:56:03about placing this in certain areas and

1:56:06it needs to be citywide because we need

1:56:08affordable housing all over. Um, so

1:56:10there have been other policies

1:56:12introduced that would lend itself to

1:56:14help with our affordable housing, but we

1:56:17did not give that the attention that we

1:56:19gave that um commercial property

1:56:24>> accommodating um multifamilies. We we

1:56:26didn't give those the same attention

1:56:28because people in the building community

1:56:29and the real estate community were

1:56:31against it. So we let special interests

1:56:33dictate what we do when we looking to

1:56:36achieve a certain result. So

1:56:37inclusionary zoning should have been

1:56:39something we embraced back when I asked

1:56:41for it in 2020. So we would have had so

1:56:44many more units at this point um

1:56:47considered uh affordable. Um, but back

1:56:51to this this plan here. Um, think about

1:56:56the industrial overlay and how that

1:56:59plays a part in us making decisions

1:57:03about um, future land use around these

1:57:06neighborhoods. And when you say

1:57:07industrial overlay, because there isn't

1:57:10to m mind an an overlay, an industrial

1:57:13overlay, you meaning the the the the

1:57:15specific zoning districts in which

1:57:18industry is allowed. I've had some

1:57:21discussion with staff and we've just

1:57:22been discussing solutions and this one

1:57:25tapping to go back to uh Dennis Hutton

1:57:28when we were talking about changing the

1:57:31zones when a property changes hands to

1:57:34have taken that as an opportunity

1:57:36>> and we didn't have a mechanism in place

1:57:38and property have changed hands several

1:57:41times in the last 20 25 years

1:57:42>> and that's what I mean the specific the

1:57:44specific district.

1:57:45>> Yes.

1:57:46>> Yes. Some of that got some of that got

1:57:48changed when we did the new z things got

1:57:51zoned. Some of those properties based on

1:57:53those plans got zoned based on the plan.

1:57:56>> But to have something to to trigger and

1:57:58alert us that a property, an industrial

1:58:01property is being um transferred. Then

1:58:04we have an opportunity then to decide

1:58:07whether we want to place the

1:58:09>> This is just something that been

1:58:11discussed at the staff level. But let's

1:58:13let's make sure we um finish discussing

1:58:16this and and have an idea if this is a

1:58:18tool that that we can use for each

1:58:21other.

1:58:22>> All right, last last point.

1:58:23>> Oh, the last thing last thing. I'm

1:58:24sorry. The numbers. The numbers. Um

1:58:27Alderman Leot was talking about the

1:58:29people being concerned about being

1:58:31displaced. Um

1:58:34and of course that's a concern and we

1:58:37need to be concerned about that. And

1:58:38this just in an arbitrary thing that

1:58:40people are feeling. We have the numbers

1:58:42and y'all heard me say so many times in

1:58:44the in the last census we lost 10,000

1:58:47African-Americans out of um uh most out

1:58:50of the second district.

1:58:51>> Um so we have is that a trend? We need

1:58:56to look at what happened in 20 in ' 09.

1:58:59Um because in 29 we need to make sure

1:59:01that we need to put a lot of energy

1:59:03behind this census. It was a lawsuit the

1:59:07last time and the count stopped. Um but

1:59:10this time we need to make sure that uh

1:59:12we go into these areas and make sure all

1:59:14of these people are are are using the

1:59:17census um filling out the census because

1:59:2010,000 people and remember it was the

1:59:22first district that grew the most and we

1:59:24had to give up some areas. Um and it

1:59:27looked like the fifth district just

1:59:28basically looking at it looked like the

1:59:30fifth district might have that same kind

1:59:31of growth that the first district

1:59:33experienced. Um but we know that we're

1:59:37going to have to make sure that these

1:59:38people are a part of the census because

1:59:41that determines and let us know if

1:59:43people are being displaced

1:59:46>> and and we don't want to just sit there

1:59:47and watch it. We want to do something

1:59:48about it. So, we have to line up our

1:59:50policies with what we see happening,

1:59:53right?

1:59:53>> Um so, we don't want to see two census

1:59:55on our watch and [clears throat] each

1:59:57time, you know, we losing the same

1:59:59population and and we didn't put

2:00:01anything in place to stop the leak.

2:00:04>> That work is happening now. Alicia,

2:00:06that's your last point.

2:00:07>> Thank you so much. Um, [snorts] we're

2:00:09talking about our city. We're talking

2:00:11about growth, development, and what have

2:00:13you. I found out yesterday that uh there

2:00:16was a tour

2:00:18from city employees

2:00:20of SCAD and all of their properties and

2:00:22what have you. So, I would like for us

2:00:24as a city council to take a tour like

2:00:28the one that was done yesterday. You

2:00:30familiar with what I'm talking about?

2:00:31>> No. No.

2:00:32>> Okay. Well, I would like to take a tour

2:00:35our city council of um the properties

2:00:39that SCAD has and how they are moving

2:00:41into the city in certain areas and what

2:00:44have you so that we will know as a

2:00:47council.

2:00:47>> You let me make sure I understand their

2:00:49you want me to work with SCAD on a tour

2:00:51for city council of their properties?

2:00:53>> Yes. Yes. Just similar to the one that

2:00:55they did yesterday.

2:00:56>> Okay. I will make

2:00:57>> Who did it yesterday?

2:01:00Can I just do

2:01:00>> they have about a hundred and change?

2:01:04>> Well, I mean

2:01:05>> I don't know. It wasn't a city

2:01:06>> certain area. It

2:01:08>> was a city tour.

2:01:09>> Well,

2:01:10>> I'm not aware of what

2:01:12>> why you want to have the tour. Why you

2:01:13want

2:01:13>> I want to know. I want to know where

2:01:15SCAD is in our city. What they're

2:01:18building, how they're building. I just

2:01:20want to know. I

2:01:21>> They gave us the same tour in Atlanta of

2:01:23their uh properties that they have

2:01:25there.

2:01:25>> They did in Atlanta, but not in our

2:01:28city. So, we need it here in our city.

2:01:30We want to see what that that entity um

2:01:33is doing in our city as it affects our

2:01:36neighborhoods.

2:01:38>> I'll make the request.

2:01:39>> Thank you.

2:01:40>> All right. Thank you, Miss Wilson. Um

2:01:42let me just uh council. I mean, I think

2:01:44we need we need to go ahead and vote. Uh

2:01:47I think the the the manager is committed

2:01:49[clears throat] to

2:01:51>> uh getting back to us. We'll hold you to

2:01:53that, Mr. Manager. Um, and again, I

2:01:56think, you know, to Alman Le's point of

2:01:59being a living document, um, we get to

2:02:02we get to add and get to change if if we

2:02:04want to, and I think we we should.

2:02:08>> Miss Wilson, thank you.

2:02:09>> Thank you, Mrs. Wilson.

2:02:10>> Miss Belda, thank you.

2:02:12>> I appreciate the conversation.

2:02:13>> All right. So, Mr. Maxwell, you're

2:02:15presenting now.

2:02:17[clears throat]

2:02:18[laughter]

2:02:21>> Mr. Maxwell is presenting on data

2:02:22centers. Um so let me

2:02:26let me start this uh next workshop item

2:02:29on data center ordinance development to

2:02:32just key in on timeline. Okay. So city

2:02:36council adopted a moratorum on largecale

2:02:41data center development within the city

2:02:43limits um uh several weeks ago. Um that

2:02:48moratorum has a time limit which expires

2:02:52in January. Um we are working uh not

2:02:57only city staff but county staff and MPC

2:03:00on developing um a draft ordinances for

2:03:04city council to um consider that would

2:03:09uh replace that moratorum. And the

2:03:10moratorum is in place because we didn't

2:03:13h we don't have a zoning uh ordinance on

2:03:16the books right now that categorizes

2:03:18data centers.

2:03:19>> The county did the same thing we did,

2:03:21right?

2:03:21>> The county did the same thing that we

2:03:23did. That's why we're working with the

2:03:24county. We're trying to develop um uh

2:03:27similar um or corresponding

2:03:31um zoning ordinances. Um, you're going

2:03:35to hear from several members of the team

2:03:37today, but I want you to know this is

2:03:38going to come back to council. So, we're

2:03:40coming to council now to give an update

2:03:43on just where we are in the thinking,

2:03:46what we've learned so far, how we've

2:03:49begun to approach drafting an ordinance.

2:03:53There are going to be several

2:03:54opportunities for city council along

2:03:56with the county commission to think

2:03:58about data centers. One is the city of

2:04:02Savannah along with with Chattam County

2:04:04is going to be hosting a um a workshop

2:04:08with Georgia Tech um who is leading in a

2:04:11lot of this work in Georgia helping

2:04:13communities think through data center

2:04:15growth and development whether or not

2:04:17it's right for one community or another

2:04:20as a part of the Chattam Municipal

2:04:21Association and um Megan will talk

2:04:24through that schedule but I want you to

2:04:26connect this workshop and the feedback

2:04:28you give in this workshop

2:04:30with the the draft ordinances that are

2:04:33come going to come back to council at

2:04:36the beginning of next year um so that we

2:04:39can be in compliance with the moratorum.

2:04:41All right. So this is really about

2:04:43getting these items in front of council

2:04:45so that we can hear feedback and so that

2:04:47you can continue to think with us as we

2:04:50develop that ordinance. Is that

2:04:54>> is that make sense?

2:04:55>> Yes.

2:04:55>> Okay. Thank you. So with that, let me

2:04:57turn it over to Megan Seabold um uh who

2:05:01has been helping to facilitate this

2:05:03intergovernmental

2:05:04process for thinking through how we're

2:05:06going to approach data center ordinance

2:05:08development. And you are going to hear

2:05:10um from others today um including Fay

2:05:14Deasimo um Ron Felner um and I think

2:05:20John Anagost um and perhaps Bridget

2:05:22Litty who's sitting here as well as

2:05:24Melanie Wilson. Let before she starts,

2:05:26uh um Kurt and I were uh at GMA uh board

2:05:30meeting Friday. This is the hot issue

2:05:33around the freaking world. So So we're

2:05:36in a good space because everybody's

2:05:38trying to figure it out. So um there's a

2:05:40lot of um data being gathered, data um

2:05:44being gathered, um but also a lot of

2:05:46talk and also I think it might be really

2:05:48hot on um the legislative agenda uh this

2:05:52year um on a lot of cities. So I think

2:05:54you know again it's a good time to be

2:05:56really discussing. I think we're really

2:05:58in a good space.

2:05:58>> Commission mayor also uh December 12th I

2:06:01think is GMA is bringing in a group of

2:06:03individuals to headquarters at GMA to

2:06:06discuss what data centers looks like for

2:06:08other communities how that's going to

2:06:10impact what you know and I guess some

2:06:12concerns that we have uh specifically

2:06:14local here to Georgia. So

2:06:16>> we might want to have somebody there.

2:06:17>> Mr. Mayor, are we looking at any type of

2:06:19litigation after this? We said we create

2:06:22not really have a moratorum but we do

2:06:24ordinance.

2:06:25>> No.

2:06:26>> Anybody want to sue us like anybody?

2:06:28>> They said I dare you.

2:06:29>> Y'all going to give me apoplelexi as my

2:06:31mom used to say. [laughter]

2:06:34>> We do not have a mortorium.

2:06:36>> That's right. We don't

2:06:36>> we have a change.

2:06:37>> We have a pause.

2:06:38>> You changed your ordinance.

2:06:41>> We changed the ordinance ordinance

2:06:43sunsets in first.

2:06:45>> Everybody say pause.

2:06:47>> All right.

2:06:49For the record,

2:06:51>> repeat after me.

2:06:52>> Term of art which are illegal. We don't

2:06:54have pauses. We changed your ordinance.

2:06:57>> We changed our ordinance.

2:06:59>> So it's a change of ordinance.

2:07:01>> Everybody say change the community her

2:07:05morator along with all of us.

2:07:08>> Okay.

2:07:09>> City manager. This young lady I don't

2:07:12who where does she work at?

2:07:13>> Megan Seabold is um our senior policy

2:07:16adviser. the role that Joe was in before

2:07:19he became chief of information and

2:07:20public affairs. Um Megan joined a year

2:07:24ago. Um she was with the uh federal

2:07:28government as a policy adviser. She was

2:07:29also a policy adviser for the city of

2:07:31Seattle. Um and she and Joe um have been

2:07:35working with all of you I know on your

2:07:36legislative agenda um meetings that I

2:07:40hope are going well as we work toward

2:07:42our legislative agenda. So um you

2:07:46>> magn

2:07:48>> hi good afternoon everyone. Uh my so my

2:07:51policy portfolio covers local state and

2:07:54federal. So last workshop we were

2:07:56talking about the state legislative

2:07:57[clears throat] agenda. Now we're

2:07:58talking about local one of the hottest

2:08:02policy issues locally nationally and

2:08:04internationally which is which is data

2:08:06centers. So as the city manager

2:08:08introduced you passed a moratorum a that

2:08:12gives staff time.

2:08:14No, we changed. [laughter] We changed in

2:08:17the ordinance.

2:08:18>> Somebody get the the a um the automatic

2:08:20defibrillator for please help [laughter]

2:08:24us

2:08:25>> a change in the ordinance.

2:08:25>> We changed our ordinance.

2:08:27>> I heard a change in the ordinance.

2:08:29>> Change in the ordinance at the first of

2:08:31the year.

2:08:32>> Yes. Thank you.

2:08:34>> So, we are on a time

2:08:36>> before [laughter]

2:08:38this expires on January 29th to

2:08:43>> figure out what fits for Savannah

2:08:45[snorts] for our unique land use,

2:08:47infrastructure, and community needs. So,

2:08:49we uh the city manager sent out a memo

2:08:52on September 28th. That was the outline

2:08:54of our plan of how we're going to

2:08:55approach this work. So, we're going to

2:08:57expand on that today and um get your

2:09:00feedback. So to start, we need a

2:09:03foundational definition of what a data

2:09:05center is. You can't regulate what you

2:09:07can't define. So policy 101 is getting

2:09:10on the same page with what it is we're

2:09:12regulating. So a data center is a

2:09:14facility that holds computers, servers,

2:09:17networking equipment, and associated

2:09:19infrastructure for data storage, data

2:09:21processing, and data distribution. A

2:09:24data center can be a single room serving

2:09:26a single business or it can have

2:09:28multiple facilities of several million

2:09:31square feet serving millions of people.

2:09:34This data center definition encompasses

2:09:36all types and purposes of data centers

2:09:39and so our ordinance for Savannah needs

2:09:41to also consider these types and

2:09:44purposes.

2:09:46So, while the data center

2:09:50conversation has been one of the most

2:09:52high-profile conversations

2:09:55out there, data centers are in fact not

2:09:57new. They've been around since 1946.

2:10:01In the 1960s, there were mainframes and

2:10:04server rooms that run hospitals, banks,

2:10:07and governments. During the internet

2:10:09boom and cloud computing in the early

2:10:112000s, there was large construction of

2:10:14data centers. And now in our day and

2:10:16age, banking, utilities, healthcare,

2:10:18911, government services run on data

2:10:21centers. Schools and local businesses

2:10:23rely on them for records and email. And

2:10:26everyday apps like streaming, maps, and

2:10:28online shopping de depend on them.

2:10:31>> Data centers are critical

2:10:33infrastructure.

2:10:34>> Online. However, what is new is the

2:10:37scale of growth and the purpose of data

2:10:40centers which more recently has been

2:10:42supporting the expansion of artificial

2:10:44intelligence. Rapid growth in AI, cloud

2:10:47computing and digital infrastructure is

2:10:49producing an unprecedented number of new

2:10:52facilities, some of which have

2:10:54exponentially exponentially higher uses

2:10:57of resources.

2:10:59US spending on AI ready data centers has

2:11:01tripled in the last three years and in

2:11:03the next year alone AI data center use

2:11:06is expected to double and the US power

2:11:09demand from AI data centers is projected

2:11:11to grow times 30 by 2035.

2:11:15Globally the sector is projected to

2:11:16double between 2025 and 2030. These data

2:11:20centers are larger and arriving faster

2:11:22than the older ones. So Savannah needs

2:11:25to be prepared to determine what our

2:11:27infrastructure can and cannot

2:11:29accommodate. Our task for the ordinance

2:11:32is to find the lines between critical

2:11:34infrastructure and community benefit and

2:11:36community harm. And with that, I will

2:11:39pass it off to Melanie Wilson of the MP.

2:11:53should say good afternoon. Uh this

2:11:55really is a hot item um that has been on

2:11:58the radar I think for probably the past

2:12:0020 years uh across the country. It's

2:12:02just more uh relevant right now. What

2:12:06you're seeing are u with this slide is

2:12:08that the rapid growth highlights the

2:12:11clear need to deal with having land use

2:12:14regulations in place and of course our

2:12:16role is to try to help support uh

2:12:20support that.

2:12:22Uh there are different types of data

2:12:23centers. You've got the accessory data

2:12:26center which generally are small sites.

2:12:29Um

2:12:30we saw one that we thought was um in the

2:12:34historic district and that that kind of

2:12:36raised a lot of alarms. Uh it was small

2:12:39but it basically was considered an

2:12:42accessory. You've got minor which are

2:12:44your 20 to 100,000 square feet um in

2:12:48size. You've got the major ones which um

2:12:51you're starting to see throughout uh the

2:12:54state of Georgia and then you've got the

2:12:55hypers scale one which is what you see

2:12:57in Effingham which is the larger um data

2:13:01centers that are out there. H

2:13:06>> one of the things that uh I wanted to do

2:13:09was to look and see how many um

2:13:12industrial and manufacturing parcels uh

2:13:16would be able to support a data center

2:13:19throughout the county. So that includes

2:13:22not only Savannah but Chattam County,

2:13:25Puler, Thunderbolt and and all of them.

2:13:28And what I found is that the total

2:13:29amount of acreage

2:13:31um that uh we've got that could support

2:13:34a data center is 29,337

2:13:38acres and that spreads across 516

2:13:41parcels.

2:13:42Uh 335

2:13:45of those parcels are between 10 and 40

2:13:48acres and that's uh indicated on the map

2:13:51in the bright fuchsia.

2:13:55So as you can see those are u pretty

2:13:58large areas. The 181 remaining parcels

2:14:02are greater than 40 acres and they are

2:14:05in the light pink

2:14:09>> and they're and this is this is all over

2:14:11not just

2:14:12>> as I said this is countywide. Um because

2:14:15we're partnering with the county to look

2:14:17at this topic. I wanted to make sure

2:14:18that we looked at all of the

2:14:20jurisdictions and where uh these uh

2:14:24facilities could go because data centers

2:14:26are just like water. They don't stop at

2:14:28a particular line. It keeps going and it

2:14:30impacts everybody's systems especially

2:14:33when you're starting to look at

2:14:34electricity. So, we wanted to make sure

2:14:35that we highlighted that. Uh this

2:14:38provides a great starting point in our

2:14:39opinion to look at evaluating uh

2:14:42potential locations

2:14:44um not to confirm suitability but it

2:14:48gives you an idea of where they could be

2:14:50located based on size. It also serves as

2:14:54a guide with regards to looking at the

2:14:56surrounding land uses and infrastructure

2:14:58and zoning compatibility which are the

2:15:00things that we will be looking at.

2:15:03Um

2:15:05Georgia uh has a data center projects

2:15:08tracker. Um it basically demonstrates a

2:15:11significant difference in scale for

2:15:14acreage and resource demands. Um these

2:15:17examples help to inform appropriate

2:15:20classifications and development

2:15:22standards. And um this basically came

2:15:26from the uh uh location and data tracker

2:15:29that is um being used statewide.

2:15:35uh data centers basically from looking

2:15:38at it we wanted to look at what the pros

2:15:40and the cons are and you know let's face

2:15:41it we do everybody uses data center

2:15:44whether you uh want to or not it

2:15:47basically um provides a a significant

2:15:51tax investment uh tax revenue existing

2:15:55infrastructure for industrial properties

2:15:57some that uh have long dormant just

2:16:00because they're no longer uh being used.

2:16:03Um but one of the challenges that we

2:16:05found is that you have very few

2:16:09placement on on-site jobs. Um we found

2:16:12that environmental um injustice or

2:16:15socioeconomic issues exist especially

2:16:17based on where our industrial properties

2:16:18are located within our community. Um

2:16:21looked at climate change and process uh

2:16:24priorities with regards to grid uh

2:16:27stability. So those are some of the

2:16:29challenges that we think come with

2:16:31regards to having these data centers and

2:16:34uh we wanted to make sure that we

2:16:35highlighted it so that we looked at it

2:16:37as we are doing um in partnership the

2:16:39review of this document.

2:16:47>> Please ignore the M word up there.

2:16:50Um, so the Savannah temporary pause that

2:16:54was put in place, council paused

2:16:55large-scale data centers to give staff

2:16:58time to research and tailor regulations

2:17:01to our community. Um, you adopted the

2:17:06155day pause on large-scale data centers

2:17:09on August 27th. Second vote was held on

2:17:12the 10th and then the moratorum or

2:17:14excuse me, the pause will sunset with a

2:17:16>> change in law

2:17:17>> change in law. the change in the

2:17:18ordinance that sunsets on

2:17:20>> the change in law will yeah it will

2:17:22sunset at that time and then there will

2:17:24be a you know there's a possibility of a

2:17:2630-day extension. So the why there's

2:17:29important city ordinances as the city

2:17:31manager uh mentioned in his opening

2:17:33remarks have no classifications or

2:17:34standards tailored to data centers and

2:17:37this prevents large-scale data centers

2:17:39from moving forward before regulations

2:17:41are established. again uh wise uh

2:17:44activities by our council to make sure

2:17:46that we continue to have the community

2:17:48that we want to have. Hang on there a

2:17:50minute

2:17:52there within the next 155 days. Wanted

2:17:56to um go over this and and talk a little

2:17:59bit about what are we doing right now.

2:18:00So our team um our working group um is

2:18:04looking at all of those future

2:18:06infrastructure considerations and

2:18:07implications, zoning and development

2:18:09standards, the conversion of existing

2:18:11warehouses, which is a particular focus

2:18:13area, uh updates that will be needed to

2:18:16the comp plan and zoning ordinance,

2:18:18working with our partners in Chattam

2:18:20County and at MPC, and then returning to

2:18:23council with recommendations.

2:18:26So a lot of work that's happening.

2:18:28There's three parallel work streams.

2:18:30There's an ordinance working group um

2:18:32that's uh subject matter expert staff

2:18:35from the MPC, from Chattam County and

2:18:37the city. Um from policy and

2:18:39intergovernmental affairs, planning and

2:18:41economic development and water resources

2:18:43are d working on the draft of that

2:18:44agreement. Um there's stakeholder input

2:18:47that is happening. There's a public web

2:18:49page with a comment form and there will

2:18:52are plans for roundts um around some of

2:18:55these special areas that would also help

2:18:57to inform that second draft and then

2:19:00there would be council engagement. So

2:19:02there's today's workshop public hearings

2:19:04and a council vote with Chattam County

2:19:06and the MPC kept in the loop so that

2:19:09again that thoughtful and deliberate

2:19:11process leading up to decision making

2:19:13can occur.

2:19:15So what is best for Savannah? That's

2:19:18always the question that we are

2:19:19committed to, that you are committed to,

2:19:21and that we ask. Um, we look at whether

2:19:24or not things that we might do carry

2:19:26legal risk. We want to be sure that

2:19:28we're thinking carefully about what we

2:19:30can regulate and what we can't. And you

2:19:32can see some of those things um

2:19:33reflected above.

2:19:37And the draft ordinance considerations,

2:19:39there's a number of things listed here.

2:19:41There's one I want to uh hone in on a

2:19:43bit because I I believe it would be a ma

2:19:45a matter of interest. We've done quite a

2:19:47bit of research on community benefit

2:19:49agreements. Um, and we've looked at

2:19:52Lancaster, Pennsylvania, and uh, Cedar

2:19:55City, Idaho. They took very different

2:19:57approaches to their community benefits

2:19:59agreements. Um, Iowa was really more one

2:20:02that focused on was a, I would say, a a

2:20:06more traditional type of approach. They

2:20:09uh, discussed construction phasing. They

2:20:12established a minimum for investment

2:20:14that was going to be required. Um they

2:20:17also established minimums around the

2:20:19amount of jobs that had to be created

2:20:22with each phase of construction and what

2:20:24those jobs needed to be able to pay. Um,

2:20:27and they established this community uh

2:20:29or a framework for a community

2:20:31betterment fund and received uh uh a

2:20:35commitment from the data center um uh

2:20:39construction folks on uh how those

2:20:42payments would be made into that

2:20:44community betterment fund and again what

2:20:46those things would look like in terms of

2:20:48minimums and such. So there's a lot of

2:20:50good information there. the information

2:20:52from Lancaster, Pennsylvania.

2:20:54They have an entire sort of they call it

2:20:56their Lancaster AI hub and theirs was

2:20:59quite comprehensive and very detailed

2:21:02and covered all sorts of things from

2:21:04noise, air quality, energy, water and

2:21:07wastewater, things about site design

2:21:10like landscaping and buffers and

2:21:12lighting, community engagement and

2:21:14workforce commitments, financial

2:21:16contributions and enforcement and

2:21:18accountability, but are very detailed,

2:21:20very rigorous. So, we are I wanted you

2:21:23to know that we're digging in deeply in

2:21:25the research that's happening in all of

2:21:27these areas that are reflected in the

2:21:29ordinance considerations, but

2:21:30particularly in that community benefit

2:21:32area to learn from the experiences of

2:21:34others that have already are in that

2:21:36space and things that we can bring back

2:21:38to you.

2:21:40And with that, I'll turn it over to Ron.

2:21:48>> All right. Thank you, Fay. Um

2:21:50you can see the narrative and wording we

2:21:52put together on the slide regarding the

2:21:54water resources aspect of data centers

2:21:56and this future project

2:21:59uh exercise. a little bit of background

2:22:01on on what we've been doing in water

2:22:04resources for the better part of a year

2:22:06more is working and communicating with

2:22:09our u pure utility partners especially

2:22:12up in the metro Atlanta region that have

2:22:14been uh dealing with data centers for a

2:22:16much longer period of time in terms of

2:22:17construction uh their experiences and

2:22:20lessons learned I think have been really

2:22:22important to us to inform us as we've

2:22:24been asking questions and listening to

2:22:26how they've been dealing with data

2:22:27centers there and through that process

2:22:30we have been uh developing uh some

2:22:34thoughts on how our policy and

2:22:36regulations would look going forward. Uh

2:22:38once again, based on those lessons

2:22:40learned up in metro Atlanta and other

2:22:42parts of the state.

2:22:43>> Uh so we have a lot of confidence that

2:22:46uh that collaboration we've had with our

2:22:48peer utilities is going to inform us

2:22:50well on how we're going to put together

2:22:52the water resources aspect of the

2:22:54regulation and ordinance going forward.

2:22:56Lastly, I'll say that you know the

2:22:58existing tools that we have in in water

2:23:01resources uh you know are water and

2:23:03sewer agreements and sometimes the water

2:23:05and sewer component is part of a larger

2:23:06development agreement. Uh it's our uh

2:23:10approach that that we want to uh endorse

2:23:12here where uh what we uh require of the

2:23:17data center or any large water and sewer

2:23:19uh customer is that we uh formalize that

2:23:23that relationship and those

2:23:24responsibilities financially,

2:23:26technically, operationally in some to

2:23:29form of a written document so that uh

2:23:32you all the city council will of course

2:23:33review development agreements, water and

2:23:35sew agreements uh will have awareness as

2:23:38to what specific uh obligations the city

2:23:42has, but more importantly, what

2:23:43obligations a developer or a data center

2:23:46developer in particular would have when

2:23:48it comes to water resources issues,

2:23:49water supply, wastewater treatment,

2:23:51[clears throat]

2:23:51storm water management. So, I'm

2:23:53confident that we've got a a

2:23:54wellressearched um history on this in

2:23:57terms of our staff and then a good

2:23:59proposal and plan to go forward uh with

2:24:01the team.

2:24:07We we've mentioned this a little bit

2:24:09earlier um in our presentation but

2:24:12wanted to remind um us all that our

2:24:15leverage on electricity is a little bit

2:24:17limited um and um but we continue in the

2:24:21spaces where we can obviously

2:24:22collaborate and coordinate. Um uh we we

2:24:26we are doing so especially with um with

2:24:29Georgia Power on warehouse conversions.

2:24:32Um we do think that's a likely um target

2:24:35for these um data centers, likely

2:24:37conversion targets and the city does set

2:24:40the land use rules. So this is something

2:24:43again that is a part of and it was

2:24:44mentioned in that earlier slide. This is

2:24:46one of our focus areas is to really

2:24:48think carefully because that seems to be

2:24:50the most opportunistic area for um data

2:24:54centers to enter into our area.

2:24:57That I'm going to turn it back over.

2:25:03We've got a lot of questions at this

2:25:06phase and the ordinance drafting has

2:25:08open questions on purpose. So, we want

2:25:10to work with you and our our

2:25:12neighborhoods and our industries to help

2:25:14answer each of these questions for key

2:25:18dates between now and know January 29th.

2:25:22>> Some of those questions just for the

2:25:23record.

2:25:24>> Yeah.

2:25:26Our approach now we're we're considering

2:25:29using a special use permit as the avenue

2:25:32for four data centers

2:25:36uh based on square footage and

2:25:40within each of those would have noise

2:25:44buffers each of the the elements that

2:25:47Fay went over earlier

2:25:49but we have to figure out where the

2:25:51framework lies if we if it's 100,000

2:25:53square feet if it's 50,000 square feet.

2:25:55So determining what it is that we're

2:25:58defining for major, minor, hyperscaler,

2:26:01and accessory. And we also need to

2:26:05consider locations. So there's

2:26:07industrial zones next to residential.

2:26:10There's uh downtown that has some

2:26:13warehouse space. So considering each

2:26:15neighborhood and what data centers could

2:26:19look like there and then how to respond

2:26:21to that through the ordinance. Uh FY

2:26:24also touched on the community benefits,

2:26:26whether that would be a separate

2:26:27agreement or it would be built into the

2:26:28ordinance under a development agreement.

2:26:31And then um ensuring we're we're

2:26:35building in all oversight mechanisms for

2:26:38reporting and

2:26:40uh reporting water use and electricity

2:26:42use that's transparent and shared with

2:26:44the public.

2:26:48>> Yeah. And and one more is is

2:26:51you know AI is is evolving so quickly in

2:26:54a few years a data center may look very

2:26:56different. So how do we also plan long

2:26:58term for what that space would be used

2:27:01for in five or 10 years.

2:27:06>> One of the other keys is she prepares to

2:27:08move on is Fate discussed is the

2:27:11decommissioning. Right. So a lot of

2:27:13times we permit the development of

2:27:15something but have no regulation for the

2:27:18decommissioning of that development if

2:27:21it goes out of use. Um and I think

2:27:24that's an important aspect of a data

2:27:27center ordinance is to think through and

2:27:29have very clear decommissioning

2:27:31regulations should um we allow a data

2:27:34center of any type. um if it if it were

2:27:37to to to go out of service, how the how

2:27:41the owner would be responsible for the

2:27:43decommissioning of it.

2:27:46>> Thank you.

2:27:49>> For key dates with our parallel work

2:27:51streams, we're we're hosting Georgia

2:27:55Tech at the Chattam Municipal

2:27:57Association meeting. It's a special

2:27:59meeting called [clears throat] for

2:28:00November 10th and the intention of that

2:28:03is is to get uh an understanding of all

2:28:07of the activity around Georgia that's

2:28:10that is regulating data centers so that

2:28:13then we can take that and apply it to

2:28:15Savannah. Uh we're also we just

2:28:19published a web page with a survey and

2:28:22comment portal that has FAQs and we'll

2:28:25have a comms roll up for that next week.

2:28:28So that will be a good way to gather

2:28:30input across the community about what's

2:28:33most important and most concerning for

2:28:36our residents.

2:28:38And uh then we're working right with MPC

2:28:42and the county along with this ordinance

2:28:44development to share a draft with you

2:28:48at the beginning of December so that

2:28:51you're you're very much

2:28:54caught up on this before you get to the

2:28:56the point of voting.

2:29:01>> Any questions? I'm sure there are many.

2:29:03>> And if sorry if I could wrap it. Are you

2:29:05done? Yes. Okay. So just to wrap it up,

2:29:09>> the ordinance has to be able to define

2:29:11different types of data centers because

2:29:13there are different types. And so that's

2:29:15really where we got to key in um on our

2:29:19ordinance too is how do we define these

2:29:21different types and what do we use to

2:29:23define these different types and what

2:29:25are the restrictions

2:29:27um or the requirements we would have for

2:29:29any of those types of data centers. If

2:29:32you go back to the beginning of the

2:29:33presentation,

2:29:35um data centers exist in all shapes and

2:29:37sizes. They are critical infrastructure.

2:29:39Our hospitals have them. Uh we have a

2:29:42small um data center if if you'd like to

2:29:45call it that one. Schools do. Um uh

2:29:48there are there are um server farms that

2:29:51exist downtown today and have for um

2:29:53decades. So, we need to be um able to

2:29:57identify those different types um and

2:30:00the restrictions around them. So, I want

2:30:01you to think through that. The other

2:30:04point that FA made that I want to lift

2:30:06up is we think the the most likely place

2:30:11that a data center might want to crop up

2:30:13in Savannah is in an existing warehouse

2:30:15space.

2:30:16>> Um, warehouse spaces right now have have

2:30:19been overbuilt and there are there's

2:30:21existing empty-free warehouse spaces um

2:30:24that maybe data center users would think

2:30:26would be ripe for conversion. and what

2:30:29do we think about that? Um, and do we

2:30:32think about that differently depending

2:30:33on the its location, its buffer between

2:30:37other types of zoning, etc.

2:30:40>> Um, so those are the big questions that

2:30:42I think we have to tackle from a policy

2:30:44perspective um when drafting this

2:30:46ordinance. So, I just wanted to kind of

2:30:48put those all together for you as we

2:30:50start the Q&A.

2:30:52>> All right. I think I saw Banetta first,

2:30:54then Carol, and then we'll figure it

2:30:56out.

2:30:57>> Yes. Thank you all. Um I I think that

2:31:03it's it's a lot of different kind of

2:31:04data centers and we have all these

2:31:06warehouses and I'm glad you all looked

2:31:10at the community benefit piece but it

2:31:13concerns me because community benefit

2:31:15agreements are for residents where they

2:31:17have an opportunity to negotiate for

2:31:20benefits based on negative

2:31:22[cough and clears throat] impacts of

2:31:23development. So if if we got to enter

2:31:27into a community benefit agreement, I

2:31:29already have a problem with it. So I'm

2:31:31glad that we have the special use permit

2:31:33so we could have that discussion prior

2:31:35and they can't do that by right. Um

2:31:39because

2:31:41it may be one that's compatible in a

2:31:43certain area and another one may not be

2:31:46compatible in that area. But if we got

2:31:48to bring residents out to negotiate

2:31:50about noise or lights or vibrations,

2:31:54then it's already a bad fit. Um so being

2:31:57that the community uh the um special use

2:31:59permit is in place, then that will give

2:32:02us council opportunity to to not allow

2:32:06that type of impact um to go near those

2:32:09residents. So, I don't know we're going

2:32:11to need the community benefit agreement

2:32:13piece, but I guess it's a safe

2:32:18just just to have it in there to give a

2:32:20a piece of mind, I guess, to residents.

2:32:23But I hope we shouldn't be in a

2:32:24situation where we have to

2:32:26>> that and to be I think good point. But

2:32:28that and also to be clear that if you do

2:32:31if council says, okay, there are some

2:32:33data centers that we would consider buy

2:32:35a special use in certain locations if

2:32:37they met these certain specs, etc.

2:32:40If we had a community benefiting piece

2:32:42to the ordinance, it would also signal

2:32:44to anyone thinking about wanting to

2:32:46develop a data center in town that this

2:32:47is going to have to be part of the

2:32:49process as well. You go through a

2:32:51special use and there's a community

2:32:53benefit whether or not the because to

2:32:57your point, you know, there may be a

2:32:59good fit, right? But there may be also

2:33:02an impact or an opportunity for a

2:33:04community to benefit to exist. um

2:33:07>> excuse me,

2:33:08>> regardless of where those impacts fall

2:33:11on the severity of it in terms of its

2:33:13impact on residents. So, I would I would

2:33:16I would suggest that we continue to to

2:33:19look through and research the community

2:33:21benefits um portion of that. So, that's

2:33:23at least something that city council can

2:33:25consider um as a part of it.

2:33:28>> Okay.

2:33:31related to that is that the ones that we

2:33:34looked at did all have pieces in

2:33:36addition to sort of the impact.

2:33:38>> Say that again. you started speaking but

2:33:40here

2:33:42[clears throat and cough]

2:33:43>> the ones that we looked at um in

2:33:45addition to um shaping or commenting on

2:33:49the kind of impacts that we could not

2:33:52permit to happen at all which is I think

2:33:54um what you're referencing those

2:33:56community benefit agreements also

2:33:58covered though job creation and

2:34:00contributions to a community benefits uh

2:34:04fund so it it it also involves some true

2:34:07benefit things that you might want to

2:34:10require in order to even um be allowed

2:34:13to operate here and so forth. So I think

2:34:16that there are some other pieces to the

2:34:17CBAs that you know you might want to

2:34:19retain.

2:34:20>> Get something out of my question.

2:34:23Um, in your section, how are we doing?

2:34:26How are we informing the public of the

2:34:29stakeholder engagement, the web page,

2:34:32and making sure that know that they can

2:34:36speak out and they have a voice?

2:34:40>> Yes, ma'am. um Megan has really been

2:34:42leading that part of how we're shaping

2:34:45um the public engagement, those roundts

2:34:48that were mentioned in the slide

2:34:49presentation with the working group is

2:34:51all committed to that along with

2:34:53[snorts] our partners at NPC um and the

2:34:56county. And so we're trying to do that

2:34:58in a very collaborative fashion, but the

2:35:00exact schedule of all that and that sort

2:35:02of thing I think has been being worked

2:35:04out through the um the you know the

2:35:07overall uh project leadership that Megan

2:35:10>> has and as Megan said um our public push

2:35:14on the public website that's already up,

2:35:16our public comment, the different um

2:35:19engagement opportunities um for citizens

2:35:22to hear, learn and give feedback is

2:35:25starting next week. Right.

2:35:27>> Okay. So, Alicia,

2:35:28>> thank you so much. Um, I wasn't in here

2:35:31for your presentation,

2:35:33but my and I'm I'm sure you did a pretty

2:35:36good job, so thank you. Um,

2:35:40when we talk about these data centers

2:35:44as it relates to the city of Savannah,

2:35:48has someone approached the city saying

2:35:51that they want to put data thinners in

2:35:55the areas where the warehouses and the

2:35:58same way we did the baits, not the

2:36:02moratorum,

2:36:03what is it called?

2:36:04>> Change in policy.

2:36:05>> The change in policy. Can we just do a

2:36:08policy where we just don't have data

2:36:11centers in the city of Savannah? Is that

2:36:14a possibility?

2:36:15>> Uh yes, it is. The it is. The reason I

2:36:20would say where I started off was making

2:36:23sure we understand the different types

2:36:25of data centers is to know that there

2:36:28are data centers that exist

2:36:30>> in in the city and they're part of our

2:36:32critical infrastructure and we need now

2:36:34what we have in our mind today when data

2:36:36centers is we're thinking about these

2:36:38big hyperscale

2:36:40data centers that are being built to

2:36:42support AI. we need to be able to define

2:36:45those as well. And maybe those aren't

2:36:47what we want to see. Um, and that's a

2:36:50that's a decision that council will

2:36:51make. Um, then you've got major and

2:36:54minor and then more local data centers.

2:36:56And that's where the importance is is to

2:36:59define what those different sizes and

2:37:02shapes of the data centers are. And you

2:37:04can define that by square footage, you

2:37:06can deci um define that by megawatt

2:37:09usage, you can define that a number of

2:37:11different ways. But that's going to be

2:37:13key to the policy because if you just

2:37:15outlawed

2:37:17um facilities that have server farms,

2:37:19well, we're going to have to get rid of

2:37:21ours.

2:37:21>> No, no, no. That's not what I'm talking

2:37:23about. You know what I'm talking about.

2:37:25But let me ask you this. Has somebody

2:37:27reached out? Has any

2:37:29>> uh organization entity or I

2:37:32>> I'm only aware of two instances.

2:37:36um one in which um a group had a

2:37:40proposal for a a conversion of an

2:37:43existing warehouse uh which would would

2:37:45probably fit in if you go back to the

2:37:47slide where it talks about major minor

2:37:50um might be like one of the mediumsiz

2:37:53ones like 100,000 square foot to 200,000

2:37:56square feet um and then I'm aware that

2:37:58though I I have no um I wasn't involved

2:38:02in this I know that there was one other

2:38:04that um called our economic development

2:38:07authority CEDA um inquiring about um

2:38:11spaces. So that's why we went to change

2:38:13the law, right? Um because we wanted to

2:38:16make sure that we had the right policies

2:38:17in place because

2:38:19um they are looking to go everywhere,

2:38:23right? So there's a there's a big big

2:38:24large expansion of data centers and in

2:38:28Georgia specifically where for the first

2:38:29time uh you know the permitted square

2:38:33footage anywhere other than you know

2:38:36>> [snorts]

2:38:36>> uh Georgia is now outpacing Northern

2:38:38Virginia in terms of new square footage

2:38:41space for data centers. So So Georgia is

2:38:43quickly becoming a a a a new hub for

2:38:48data centers. You know, we all hear the

2:38:50term data center alley, which is in

2:38:52Lowden County, Virginia, Northern

2:38:54Virginia. Um, and they've been they've

2:38:57been there for 25 years and continue to

2:39:00to permit um large scale data center.

2:39:03>> The answer your minds is three three

2:39:05times. I'm not sure if they overlap, but

2:39:08they probably do at least on two of them

2:39:10uh about being approached, which kind of

2:39:12precipitated the discussion uh between

2:39:15myself, the attorney, and the manager

2:39:17about um how do we approach this, which

2:39:19is why we came to council about a change

2:39:22in policy um that would allow us to be

2:39:25able to really determine what this is.

2:39:27But we have to become educated about it.

2:39:29to so many um and we did not want to um

2:39:33unilaterally do something that would

2:39:34ultimately hurt our community,

2:39:36>> right?

2:39:36>> Um affect our community, affect our

2:39:38city's ability to provide services. Uh

2:39:41and you will find now um the city did it

2:39:44and the county did it afterwards. You

2:39:46see now municipalities doing what we

2:39:47have done.

2:39:48>> Uh and now you see across the state, you

2:39:50know, cities that have done it that wish

2:39:53they had not. Um because now you know

2:39:56they they and the technology even with

2:39:58this is evolving. So by next year you

2:40:00know I mean we're hearing now of closed

2:40:02water closed loop water systems and

2:40:04other types of things that they're

2:40:06they're doing. But this is really I

2:40:08think and I appreciate council um

2:40:10because this is really the more

2:40:12thoughtful approach. We have to have

2:40:14everybody at the table. We have to

2:40:15invite the utilities Georgia Power all

2:40:17at the table. We need to be able to

2:40:19really talk about this so that we're

2:40:21very cleareyed. And I think the most

2:40:23important part for me and probably for

2:40:25you is that no matter what happens that

2:40:28comes back through here.

2:40:30>> Yes.

2:40:31>> That the public is still at the table.

2:40:33And you know, you know some very

2:40:35high-profile examples where the public

2:40:37was not at the table.

2:40:38>> Right.

2:40:39>> Um I saw I thought I saw Nick and then

2:40:41I'll come around.

2:40:42>> Uh thank you Mr. Mayor. Thank you team

2:40:44for the presentation and thank you to

2:40:45the government affairs team and our city

2:40:47attorney's office for staying on top of

2:40:49this ordinance change that gives us the

2:40:51breathing room to have this discussion

2:40:53where it's not in a panic and it's not

2:40:54in a vacuum and we do have to understand

2:40:57the macro level of why this is happening

2:40:59because Georgia does exist at the eye of

2:41:01the perfect storm when it comes to this

2:41:03issue. Georgia has space. Georgia has

2:41:06water that we paid for and invested in

2:41:09uh thanks to the governor's office. Our,

2:41:11you know, we have water and we have the

2:41:13newest nuclear power plant I believe on

2:41:16the face of the planet. Uh we've got

2:41:18power too. That's why they're here. Uh

2:41:21and so these companies who are not

2:41:24profitable today, none of them are. They

2:41:26don't know their path pathway to

2:41:28profitability. Anthropic, Open AI, uh

2:41:31even Google's elements, none of them are

2:41:33actually profitable yet. They're banking

2:41:36on developing an advanced general

2:41:38intelligence that may make them

2:41:40profitable someday. And right now,

2:41:42they're burning through venture capital,

2:41:44which they've uh gathered together to

2:41:46spend this. So, they have money burning

2:41:48a hole in their p pocket. They're going

2:41:50to build it. I encourage us to please be

2:41:52as deliberative as possible, be as

2:41:55selective as possible, and the work to

2:41:58decommission them uh as diligent as

2:42:01possible. Uh it's an enormous bankroll

2:42:04right now. We don't know where it's

2:42:05going to go. We don't know how long

2:42:06they're going to be around. I mean,

2:42:08that's the flavor of the day. But, uh I

2:42:10want the council, the community, the

2:42:12public to know that we invested in these

2:42:14utilities. Ultimately, it's up to you

2:42:16how we choose to determine their future

2:42:18and how they're built. So, I encourage

2:42:20the the government affairs team to

2:42:22continue engaging uh through Holland

2:42:25Knight to the public service commission

2:42:27about that, you know, nuclear power

2:42:30plant that all of us paid for, you know,

2:42:32as a line item on our Georgia power

2:42:34bill, you know, uh the tax dollars that

2:42:36we use to expand the water capacity from

2:42:39the Savannah River that we paid for. Uh

2:42:42and is the costbenefit analysis good

2:42:44enough for the jobs that are provided

2:42:46for what's there? It's not as [snorts]

2:42:48many as you'd get on a warehouse or

2:42:49logistics or manufacturing or anything

2:42:51else. Uh but only the rest of the public

2:42:53can determine that. For the team today,

2:42:56it's be as deliberative as we possibly

2:42:58can. Uh be as restrictive as we possibly

2:43:01can. So we know that we're going to

2:43:03change by chance or choice. Uh but my

2:43:06feeling is that a couple years from now,

2:43:08we're going to be back to this table to

2:43:09decide how we're going to take them

2:43:11apart. Uh so thank you for your work on

2:43:13it and we'll keep on it. Thank you.

2:43:16Thank you, Aldo.

2:43:17>> Thank you. Uh, Mr. Mayor, as your next

2:43:20slide stated um in next steps and asking

2:43:24me in reference to being reference to

2:43:26being the voice of of uh my district and

2:43:29throughout the city of Savannah and the

2:43:31question is

2:43:33um we are asking council which matters

2:43:38most in your district and in reference

2:43:41to talking and this is really a hot

2:43:44topic uh that u my constituents and just

2:43:48listening to uh residents in the city of

2:43:50Savannah. And because it is so

2:43:53publicized

2:43:55uh uh throughout the media and in the

2:43:57news uh locally, county, state,

2:44:01national, international,

2:44:03uh it's in front of everybody. So

2:44:07asking that question um to me in

2:44:09reference to what I've been hearing from

2:44:11the people and that has been no data

2:44:15centers in the city of Savannah. I'm

2:44:17just making it plain to you what I'm

2:44:18hearing. And and the other question that

2:44:21you you have down here is where are you

2:44:25hearing the most concern

2:44:28throughout the city of Savannah? Uh that

2:44:31there are people are stating that they

2:44:34do not want data centers in the city

2:44:38limits of the city of Savannah. So I

2:44:41just wanted to make uh those comments on

2:44:43what I've heard thus far. I'm glad that

2:44:46we have um stepped up to the plate uh

2:44:49initially um you know being the example

2:44:53most times a lot of times uh for the

2:44:56state of Georgia in in these four cities

2:44:59um with our what do you call this this

2:45:02pause or change of law

2:45:04>> change

2:45:06>> change of law

2:45:08>> and um and that we are are doing this

2:45:11work that we're doing now so city

2:45:13manager I applaud

2:45:15in having um us on the ground and and

2:45:20making sure that

2:45:21>> and the mayor

2:45:22>> and and Mr. Mayor and our attorney uh

2:45:25the work that you all are doing and

2:45:26making sure that uh we are safe in our

2:45:31city, Mr. Felner, I know that you are

2:45:33having nightmares in reference to our

2:45:35water system. Um this thing is so real.

2:45:37Uh, so thank you all so much and Chief

2:45:41Messammore for for just staying on on on

2:45:44the top of this for the benefits of our

2:45:46city. The other thing that I wanted to

2:45:49state is that I'm so serious about this.

2:45:53if we've got to have [clears throat] a

2:45:56citywide meeting

2:45:58>> in that inmarket arena in reference to

2:46:01this this um this subject matter and

2:46:05just having a listening session. Not

2:46:07necessarily having a uh talk back to to

2:46:11us session but having a on the grounds

2:46:14physical uh uh meeting of calling the

2:46:19city together for data centers. I would

2:46:22recommend us doing that so we don't have

2:46:25this excuse. You know, I'm in these

2:46:27different spaces and and and and

2:46:29information is supposed to be getting

2:46:30out for public outreach and the public

2:46:32don't get the outreach because

2:46:35uh information is placed in in different

2:46:37places where people can't reach. So that

2:46:39is one of my recommendations that we

2:46:41make a a loud noise and in advertising

2:46:45and then having a a even we can have all

2:46:47these the district meetings that we we

2:46:49need to have but also calling the city

2:46:53uh to one place and and and and having

2:46:56them to listen to what we're talking

2:46:57about because everybody don't listen to

2:46:59our city council meetings um and getting

2:47:01this information. Thank you, Mr. Mayor.

2:47:03>> Thank you. Um Betta.

2:47:07>> Yes. Um

2:47:10this is a a relatively well it's not a

2:47:13new industry but the way it's growing

2:47:16it's new to a lot of people and

2:47:17understanding

2:47:19um the negative and the positive aspects

2:47:22of these data centers and

2:47:27this this this discussion is good this

2:47:29work we're doing is good because I don't

2:47:33think we should just have a blanket

2:47:35policy that says you no data. We out in

2:47:40front of this and I think that's what

2:47:41we're doing, trying to get out in front

2:47:42of this and and deciding how we're going

2:47:45to um legislate uh these new policies.

2:47:50Um, of course, we wouldn't want anything

2:47:53in neighborhoods that's going to

2:47:55negatively impact the residents. In the

2:47:58first district, we voted on changing

2:48:02the use of industrial places where we

2:48:05could add entertainment. And I was

2:48:07against that because we have so many

2:48:09problems in the first district with

2:48:12industrial zoning that that had not been

2:48:16solved. And we were adding yet another

2:48:18use. Now, here is another use um with

2:48:23the data centers and um so but I'm not

2:48:28here to say we should have no data

2:48:30centers in the city of Savannah. I'm

2:48:32saying that we should have um some

2:48:34regulations in place to protect the pe

2:48:37the people. Um and I'm not going to

2:48:39support any data center if it comes

2:48:41before us for a special use permit um

2:48:44that we've got people sitting in the

2:48:46room

2:48:47>> saying that.

2:48:48>> Okay. of that particular type would

2:48:50bring noise or lights or or whatever um

2:48:54any kind of negative impact. In me

2:48:57showcasing the first district in the

2:48:59last several months, I've been touring

2:49:02and showing people the different

2:49:04development opportunities in the first

2:49:06district, which they are a plethora of

2:49:10development opportunities, not only for

2:49:12the first district, but for the entire

2:49:13city and the district in the southeast

2:49:16as far as I'm concerned. what's

2:49:17happening in that railroad district, the

2:49:19canal district, the historic area around

2:49:21the weeping time property and IP

2:49:23property and showing all that the first

2:49:26district brings to bear right now. there

2:49:29have been two people uh capable of doing

2:49:32uh that type development and they're

2:49:34interested in the IP property um um

2:49:39that is not in the city and so that's

2:49:42why I mentioned on this map is isn't a

2:49:44true depiction of the impact of

2:49:47industrial properties because some of

2:49:48that property is really in

2:49:49unincorporated

2:49:50>> Chattam

2:49:51>> um so we need to include those also um

2:49:56>> and the industrial zone

2:49:58>> most people think that that IP property

2:50:00is city of Savannah because it sit right

2:50:02there in the midst of all of those

2:50:03neighborhoods, but it's actually in the

2:50:06county.

2:50:06>> That's true.

2:50:07>> In an industrial chat and they're uh

2:50:10people interested in and knowing that

2:50:12that would be a good fit for whatever

2:50:14kind of data center uh they have in

2:50:17mind. Um,

2:50:20so anything with the negative impacts,

2:50:23absolutely not. After all of these

2:50:25decades of suffering from the

2:50:27environmental injustice, we wouldn't

2:50:29want to welcome a whole new um negative

2:50:32impact in in the area. But again, we got

2:50:36so many different sizes and kinds of

2:50:40data centers that

2:50:41[cough and clears throat] you just

2:50:42couldn't sit here and make a policy for

2:50:44one size fit all. we would really have

2:50:46to look at all of them individually on

2:50:49how they would fit a particular area. So

2:50:51the the best thing I heard so far is

2:50:53that special use permits so we um could

2:50:56take the necessary precautions and and

2:50:59measuring how these things fit.

2:51:03>> All right. Well, I think you know again

2:51:07I think we like what we see a very

2:51:10measured, very thoughtful, very

2:51:12comprehensive whole of government

2:51:14approach. um involving [snorts] equity

2:51:17and community engagement. So um this was

2:51:20just an update on where we are. We still

2:51:23on a clock as it relates to um the first

2:51:27the second meeting in January of 2027

2:51:31uh in which you will let us know where

2:51:32we are uh what we need to do. So um

2:51:37let's go ahead and go into Thank you all

2:51:39so much. Thank you Megan Joe. Thank you

2:51:41team. Um let thank you everybody who

2:51:45participated. Um time has gotten away

2:51:49>> so it's going to be needed discussion.

2:51:50>> I know no that's why I I didn't so let's

2:51:54uh um go into executive session um so

2:51:57move for

2:51:59>> for litigation and for real estate and

2:52:02eat lunch while we're walking. All in

2:52:03favor indicate by saying I opposed.

2:52:06>> Motion passes. Thank you all. Miss

2:52:08Wilson. Thank you.

2:52:11Yeah, we got we got moves. We got Come

2:52:15on. It's taco time.