2026-10-06 - Board of Health

00:00Um,

00:02opening the minutes.

00:06October 6th.

00:17>> Oh, for the Yeah, the minutes I

00:20I have reviewed them beforehand, too, so

00:22I

00:23make a motion to approve the minutes.

00:25>> I second the motion.

00:27All right, all in favor.

00:28>> I.

00:28>> All right.

00:31All right. New business, we have um, the

00:35Tobacco's appeal for Richdale.

00:3859 North Street.

00:39>> Yep.

00:40>> I mean, North of Franklin.

00:41>> North Franklin, sorry.

00:42>> Usually that Joyce goes first.

00:45>> Um.

00:47Hi Joyce.

00:48>> Hi.

00:51So,

00:53on August 20th, approximately 11:11,

00:57um, we did a we conducted a compliance

00:59check

01:00at 59 North Franklin, Richdale.

01:03Uh, the youth went in, asked for Zen

01:05Chill.

01:07Um.

01:09Didn't ask her age or ID, and it was

01:11sold to her.

01:13It was a 6%

01:18I think the board asked last time if we

01:21actually had the product, and just so

01:23you know,

01:24>> Is that one of the flavored ones?

01:25>> Uh, Zen Chill is a flavor. And the

01:28retail was were notified about from the

01:30city, um,

01:31back in May,

01:33and

01:35with a highlighted Zen Chill,

01:37specifically saying it was a flavor, and

01:39that we were going to start enforcing on

01:40that as a flavor, um, effective July

01:441st.

01:44>> Okay.

01:46>> So, can I just clarify this order

01:49to correct only indicates a sale of a

01:52tobacco product under the minimum legal

01:54sale age. It doesn't indicate sale of a

01:56flavor.

01:58>> You are

01:59>> The orders that we sent so

02:00>> Sent out, that's right.

02:01>> Okay. But, that was it was technically

02:03two violations.

02:04>> Yes.

02:06>> Okay.

02:10>> And it may be that when I send my uh

02:15my Excel spreadsheet,

02:16I highlight in yellow when there's a

02:18sale,

02:19and I highlight now in peach if it's the

02:22flavored products were on it. So, that

02:25one's probably overlooked because it was

02:27you saw that thing that, you know, they

02:29always see it as the yellow is the sales

02:30to a minor.

02:32>> Um so, does that still make it a fourth

02:33violation within a 36-month period?

02:36>> It was I think it makes it a double is

02:39what we determined.

02:41>> Well, the letter went out. The

02:42notification was at a sale of a tobacco

02:44product min under minimum legal sales

02:47age, and then it on the back it says

02:49fourth violation within 36-month period.

02:51>> Yes. And their last $5,000

02:56uh sale to a minor, so that was again in

02:59this 36-month period was 8 11 25. And

03:03that was 5,000. And this on my end says

03:065,000 because we don't have a place to

03:08put um

03:11the violation as a flavor in this.

03:14We don't have it on ours, but you I know

03:17that you guys stack your fines.

03:19But, it was missed, and I'm fine with

03:20that.

03:21>> So, the letter says $10,000 fine and

03:2330-day suspension.

03:24>> And that $10,000 fine is the double.

03:26>> Okay.

03:27>> to that. It just wasn't checked off that

03:29it was the flavor was the second half.

03:31>> Okay.

03:33>> So, is this is the fourth violation?

03:35>> Uh

03:36yes.

03:37>> And there was two prior, and then this

03:39was a double, so it went third and

03:40fourth.

03:42>> Uh yes.

03:44>> Do you know when the other just for like

03:45chronologically?

03:47>> Looking back, they're $2,000, so I don't

03:50have the one that went from there first,

03:52but they had one uh sale to a minor in

03:56February of 2025, a sale to a minor in

03:59August of 2025, a sale to a minor

04:03in

04:04August of '26, and it was flavored. But,

04:08the first one is I just don't have the

04:09record of it. I can look it up on the

04:11phone.

04:12But, those three are all like so close

04:14together. It's within a year and a half.

04:18And 2 years, August to August.

04:31>> So,

04:33So, it looks like

04:35we have the double reflected in the fine

04:39and the violation, but not checked off

04:42that for double on this.

04:44>> That's right.

04:45>> Okay.

04:49>> Is she

04:50Is this Is Franklin Street Is Richdale

04:51here?

04:53>> I think so.

04:54>> Is Richdale here? Okay. Okay.

04:59>> So, yeah, just to address um

05:01>> I'm sorry, your name?

05:02>> My name is Sunny.

05:03>> Sunny?

05:03>> Yeah, Sunny. I'm from Richdale, 59 North

05:05Bay Road.

05:06>> Okay.

05:06>> So, we're here about a violation that

05:08happened on August 20th, 2026.

05:11So, um I

05:13I've had a couple of handouts for

05:15if you guys

05:19>> Okay.

05:21Yeah.

05:23Here.

05:24>> Thank you.

05:26>> So, um our last violation that happened

05:29was last year, and I believe that was

05:35That was in November 30th.

05:38No, that wasn't That was the last

05:39violation.

05:42Okay, yeah, that was August

05:47>> August 11th.

05:48>> August 11th, um 2025.

05:52>> Mhm.

05:52>> But, prior to that, the last violation

05:55before that was on 2022,

05:59which is 4 years ago.

06:00So,

06:01um

06:02in my counts and my other the we have in

06:04our records, this is the second

06:06violation that happened in um

06:08>> Within 36 months.

06:09>> Within 36 months. Yeah.

06:12>> What 2 6?

06:15>> As you can see that this one says on the

06:16second page I actually have the

06:19ticket for the second violation that

06:20shows November 30th, 2022.

06:22>> Look, are you able to tap into Smart Gov

06:25right now?

06:25>> No, not at the moment.

06:26>> No?

06:27But can you use the computer over there

06:29to log in? Just maybe see what we can

06:31find underneath their license record.

06:34You know what's odd is I don't know what

06:35happened on 2 6 2025,

06:38but we have it as an enforcement

06:41and a sale.

06:47It's here.

06:55Yes, and it was a sale of um an

06:58e-cigarette.

07:00>> So, we have 2 6 25 e-cigarette.

07:04>> Mhm.

07:05>> We have 8

07:0625.

07:08That's sale to a minor.

07:10>> Yep. Yes.

07:12>> That's okay. And 8 26 would be sale to a

07:15minor.

07:16>> Sale to a minor and the flavor.

07:17>> And the flavor.

07:19Okay.

07:20So, that's

07:221 2 3 4

07:26and within 36 months.

07:28So,

07:30>> just as a question um

07:33I never got any notice about a February

07:352nd, 2026. I don't have any ticket

07:37>> 2025.

07:39>> Yeah, February 2nd, 2025. I don't

07:41>> Okay, we're looking up to see what's

07:42Yeah, we're looking it up in the system

07:43right now to see what's there.

07:45>> And I wasn't given any kind of violation

07:47or any kind of store closing for that.

07:50>> Um

07:51that would have been a first violation,

07:53so that may have just been a fine.

07:55>> No, it would have been second. And the

07:57first one

07:58>> I don't know, the February one first

08:00>> 2025 is the first one in a 36-month

08:03period.

08:03>> But isn't it like a 3-day suspension on

08:04the first one?

08:05>> No, it was a two-day

08:06>> Yeah. Cuz they what they would find

08:08$2,000 and

08:10according to my records that's what we

08:12put in. It was second violation. Now I'm

08:14going to look back and see

08:17when I have record of the first

08:20violation.

08:21>> It looks like the first violation they

08:22provide us the information with was

08:24November 30th, 2022.

08:26>> You know what though? That wasn't their

08:27first. The problem That was their second

08:29violation ever. That's why it goes to a

08:32second and a second is because in a

08:3536-month tolling period something that

08:38was 36 months ago could have fallen off.

08:41So you are on your second second.

08:44And the same thing happens with the

08:455,000. If it was you were 5,000 last

08:48time you took fourth, it's 5,000 and a

08:50fourth violation. So I have this as

08:53their second second.

08:55>> Okay. So it looks like and we're

08:57checking the system right now that in

08:582022

09:00that was your second violation ever.

09:03>> Yeah.

09:03>> Okay.

09:052022 your second violation ever. And

09:07then you got one in February of 2025.

09:15You don't have any record of any of your

09:16violations?

09:20Okay. But we'll look that up. And what

09:22about August of 2025?

09:24Okay.

09:26>> And you paid $5,000 and had a 30-day

09:28suspension for

09:29>> Yes.

09:31But that was because that was in a

09:333-year period of something that happened

09:35>> from November

09:37>> So the the violation that happened in

09:392022

09:41there were two violations that happened

09:42in one month. So they sent somebody and

09:45then before we could you know modify our

09:47systems and get things up, then they

09:49sent someone else. That was within one

09:50month. So those two happened like right

09:53after each other. And then the third

09:55violation was 2025 which we paid a

09:58$5,000 fine.

09:59>> Which would have been considered a third

10:00violation because it fell in 36 months.

10:03>> That was the third violation.

10:05>> So

10:05>> But this would be a second.

10:07>> If if they can corroborate that, yeah.

10:10>> Yeah.

10:13>> Well,

10:14>> So, I have the very first. This is my

10:16record.

10:174 of 2021.

10:20Then they had a second violation

10:23in

10:26uh 11 22.

10:30So, you had a thousand and two thousand

10:32within 36 months.

10:34Then the one happens in

10:372025, which you're saying you never got

10:39notice of, which is fine, but that's why

10:41it was a second second cuz that first

10:43one fell off the

10:45the 36-month thing. And then right after

10:49within a year you had another sale to a

10:51minor, which made it a third.

10:53And now it's a year away from that and

10:56less than 36 months from what I have as

10:592000.

11:00>> So, the 36 months is a moving time

11:02period, right? So,

11:0420 and 20 21 and 22 is within a 36 time

11:0836-month time period. 22

11:12and 25 depending on the months, and it

11:16looks like November of 22 to 23 to 24,

11:20and then November of 25, yours was

11:23February of 25, so that fell within 36

11:26months.

11:27And then

11:28February of 25 to August of 25 was a

11:33year, and then August of 25 to August of

11:3526 is is a year. So, all of them

11:39not all together fall within 36 months,

11:41but each one keeps occurring within 36

11:44months.

11:45>> I just wasn't aware of that.

11:46>> Yeah, we're looking at we're looking

11:48that part up for you right now.

11:49>> Yeah, I think that's the

11:51that's the only thing in dispute, right?

11:53>> Yeah.

11:54>> So, we've got February 6.

11:57Get the certified letter dates of 213.

12:00>> Okay.

12:00>> And did they pay the fine? Cuz then they

12:02would definitely know about it.

12:05>> So, let me go and copy this for you so

12:06we can keep a copy for you.

12:08Oh, thanks, guys.

12:09>> Yeah, we have that right here at

12:10someone's side, but we have a copy of

12:11the certified letter here.

12:12>> Okay. All right, maybe I missed it maybe

12:14cuz now we're doing COVID and stuff.

12:15>> maybe I have

12:16>> 2025?

12:17>> Oh, no, 2025.

12:17>> 2022

12:19>> 2021 was it.

12:21>> Yeah.

12:21>> So, maybe yeah, I

12:25I also don't understand like it's the

12:27first time hearing about this being a

12:29double violation with that.

12:33This there's nothing in the letter that

12:34says about a double violation.

12:37>> So, you're familiar with the

12:38regulations, right?

12:39>> Yeah, I'm familiar with them.

12:40>> And the regulations tell you that you we

12:42can stack fines.

12:47>> Yeah, but like then

12:48I don't understand but where in our

12:50letter does it say which fines you're

12:52stacking or what violation it was? And I

12:55would see one violation here.

12:56>> Yeah, you're right. That letter was sent

12:58out incorrectly.

12:59Yeah, that your letter on September 28th

13:02of 2026 was sent out incorrectly.

13:04>> Okay.

13:06>> You understand why it was two

13:08violations?

13:09>> Yeah, but the

13:11the name chill

13:15Because this was happening they're

13:16saying it happened in July.

13:18>> Septem-

13:18>> It happened in July it was August 20th.

13:21>> No, no, no, he's saying the letter

13:22>> Oh, the change.

13:23>> The letter went out in May of 2026.

13:26>> Effective in July.

13:27>> And it said in the letter and with the

13:30accompanying

13:31information, Zynchill specifically was

13:34highlighted as a flavor and said

13:36enforcement would begin July 1st.

13:38>> That's correct. So, you're right about

13:39that.

13:40>> Okay.

13:40>> We just wanted to do in the one month

13:43we were going through all of that.

13:45Taking them all out from the shelves,

13:46maybe there was one left out.

13:48>> Okay.

13:48>> Sorry about that but we had taken every

13:50other flavor out. I think we had taken

13:51that.

13:52>> Okay.

13:53>> Okay.

13:54Um the rest of the thing was really

13:56about what steps we've taken to um kind

13:59of address this.

14:01So, um if you can see um the this is a

14:04um some printouts of our screens.

14:06Um

14:07Here's two things we've done previously

14:10um in our system. Um

14:12well, we we already have a restricted

14:14page over there for anyone so

14:16tries to ring something up,

14:17they can't ring it. And then there's

14:19this additional thing that we've added

14:21since then, and it's called

14:23disable DOB skip button.

14:25>> Oh, I see that on the last page. Yeah.

14:26>> Yeah. So, before what could

14:29cashier could do is

14:32they could press a button that says over

14:3440, and then they could continue with

14:36the sale.

14:37>> Right.

14:37>> So, we've disabled that. So, now nobody

14:39can sell anything without scanning a

14:41valid ID.

14:42>> Oh, it has to be scanned?

14:43>> It has to be scanned. Yeah.

14:45They can't Yeah,

14:46we don't even have the thing that check

14:48that says enter from date of DOB

14:49manually. So, they must scan. So, this

14:52is for all tobacco tobacco products, all

14:54cigarettes,

14:56anything in those departments.

14:58So, we've taken these steps um

15:00for the last violation that we had, we

15:03we didn't do that. We should have

15:04probably done it at that time, but we

15:06did um fire the employee that did that

15:09sale. He was very experienced. I don't

15:11know how that happened to him.

15:13Um

15:15but at this point, you know,

15:17what I really would like to say here is

15:20that

15:21that fine amount and that closure

15:24would completely demolish our business.

15:27We can't It's a very tough economic

15:29climate. We barely make anything in that

15:32store.

15:33Um

15:34we don't have the $10,000. We'll have to

15:36figure out how to get it obviously if it

15:38makes sense.

15:39And then furthermore, if we're closed

15:42for 30 days, you know, it's just um

15:45it's very It's going to be very tough

15:47for us. So, we're really looking for

15:49some leniency.

15:50>> If I could just clarify, your store does

15:53not have to close. You cannot sell

15:55tobacco products for 30 days.

15:57>> But that's the We're not going to make

15:59We're not going to make payroll even.

16:00So, obviously, you know, that's one of

16:02the things that convenience store sell.

16:05So, it would be very

16:07you know, it would be a hardship on us

16:09that probably the store wouldn't be able

16:11to recover from.

16:12>> Every second. I don't know why someone's

16:15selling something that we just have a

16:17you know, we have an employee. You know

16:18how much tell them and you tell them

16:19that they shouldn't be doing this. Last

16:21you be paid a $5,000 fine, which it

16:23sounds like it's very heavy. The first

16:25time it happened to us you know, months

16:27to be cooked on that.

16:29So, this is just going to be that final

16:31nail in the coffin kind of thing. It's

16:32just

16:34loving the work.

16:35Finding the store. It's just difficult

16:37to find good quality and what not.

16:39>> Yeah, but we've taken the proper

16:40precautions to make sure that like it's

16:43not up to the employee anymore.

16:44>> Right.

16:45>> Now like

16:46>> Yeah, it's a good point.

16:47>> the register won't ring it up. So.

16:49>> And when did you put that in place?

16:51>> Oh, we did that like right after right

16:53after we got that because I was like I

16:55can't trust these employees anymore.

16:57>> Yeah.

16:58>> And they they were like, "Oh, but like a

16:59lot of the

17:01people don't have IDs. I'm like, "No,

17:03they're above 21, but they don't have

17:05IDs." I'm like, "Well, that's too bad.

17:07They just have to be going on the

17:07floor."

17:08>> Yeah.

17:09>> And actually just for everybody's

17:11information, that's state law. You're

17:12supposed to be It didn't matter if they

17:14were 40 or 80. Since 2020, the state law

17:17says every person every time. It's like

17:20the Fenway rule. If you go to Fenway and

17:22ask for a

17:23glass of beer, if you walk up with a

17:24cane and have gray hair and, you know,

17:27obviously you're

17:28old.

17:29>> Yeah.

17:29>> They still ask you.

17:30>> I don't know.

17:31>> So, um, that's what state law has

17:33required since 2020. Every person every

17:35time.

17:37>> So, I guess question for you guys. So,

17:39uh,

17:40are any of these, now that you have the

17:41documentation here, are any of these

17:44violations in dispute?

17:46>> No. I mean, we don't dispute

17:47>> Well,

17:48well, I dispute the double fine.

17:50>> Yeah, I guess that that's

17:52Yeah.

17:54But I guess the pre- any of the previous

17:55ones.

17:56Yeah.

17:58Um,

18:00cuz I think like unfortunately with the

18:02way the rules are there's like very

18:03little leeway that we have. I think the

18:06one thing that I I think it is a little

18:08confusing that the way this was sent out

18:11it's not clear that it's a double fine.

18:13>> I agree.

18:14>> Um,

18:15I don't think that changes that didn't

18:17happen. I mean, I I have evidence that

18:19it did. Um

18:22So, yeah.

18:23>> I guess I to clarify that, if it was a

18:25third violation, what would the fine be

18:27for that? Cuz everyone was notified for

18:28one.

18:29>> If it was a third one.

18:30>> 5,000.

18:34>> Would it still be a suspension?

18:36>> Yes.

18:36>> 30 days.

18:37>> 30 days.

18:38>> 30 days, so 5,000 and 30 days.

18:40>> Correct.

18:48>> So, I guess do we have the leeway to say

18:52this this document only says one, even

18:55though we know it was two?

18:56>> Right.

18:57>> And then it does say double that you

18:59can't stack, it just doesn't reflect it

19:01on this.

19:02>> Yeah. I mean

19:03it it it went out incorrectly.

19:05>> Yeah.

19:08>> Still I mean there's still a violation.

19:11So, it's it's it's to me the

19:12determination that the board makes is

19:14it's either a third or a fourth

19:15violation.

19:19>> I would be fine with the third.

19:20>> Yeah, I was going to say that, too,

19:21because

19:24sent out correctly.

19:27>> Ah, well, I don't think we can do that.

19:31It's clearly a third violation date even

19:34date-wise. I mean, this is all pretty

19:36uh

19:37so

19:41>> I think we will accept it's the third

19:43violation, but again, like I said, like

19:45um

19:45the economic climate right now, I mean,

19:48if I strike down tobacco for 30 days

19:51I'm going to be like in trouble. If

19:54there's any leniency you could have in

19:56terms of the closure

19:57that would really help.

19:59You know.

20:00Cuz that's a long time, and

20:04>> I mean, we just had that last year, as

20:05well.

20:05>> Yeah.

20:07>> Back to back. And I can assure you,

20:09like, the systems right now are not

20:10going to allow this to happen. So.

20:14>> I think the only leniency you really

20:16have is when you can do it.

20:17>> Right.

20:18>> Um I mean, it's it's fairly clear for

20:20both of it's 30 days.

20:22>> Yeah. I mean, and I just want to be

20:24clear like there are times that people

20:25come in and they have like a 3-day

20:27suspension or a 7-day

20:29and it's 3 days, okay, we can change it

20:31Sunday, Monday, Tuesday. 30 days is 30

20:33days. You're getting

20:35a lot of Sunday, Monday, Tuesday,

20:36Wednesday, Thursday, Friday, Saturdays

20:37in that, right? Like

20:39I don't think we can say, "Oh, well, you

20:41can do it in February." Right? Like

20:43>> Yeah, no.

20:44I think

20:45within the next month you can say what

20:48day you want it to start, but I think

20:49that's about

20:50>> Right. Like if you need you Yeah, that

20:52that's well for given

20:54um

20:55you know, the time frame that you need

20:57to

20:57get all that stuff out of the store cuz

20:59it all needs to be out of the store for

21:0030 days.

21:02When was your suspension supposed to

21:03start?

21:05>> It was September 16th of last

21:06>> Okay, so it was put in abeyance. Yep,

21:08okay.

21:10>> I I only just want to mention that we

21:11have never been tested. I didn't even

21:13know this

21:14ever. This is the first time we came in.

21:17>> Yeah.

21:17>> So, I was hoping given our history that

21:21since this was the first time the

21:22punitive award

21:23>> All right. Yeah, I mean, I

21:25Our hands are kind of tied here. Like I

21:27I totally get the

21:29um

21:30the financial hardship of it, but like

21:32our responsibility as a board is to

21:34protect

21:35you know, the the citizens of Lynn and

21:37especially the kids and I think this is

21:39a clear

21:40>> Absolutely.

21:40>> thing. So,

21:42I don't

21:43I think I'm okay with the third

21:45violation, too, but I don't think we can

21:47modify the

21:48the amount of suspension.

21:50>> Yeah.

21:50>> I and I'm okay with picking the date you

21:53want to start it, but a 30 days is 30

21:55days. Yeah.

21:57>> Unfortunately.

21:57>> When did you want to start it?

21:59>> You said you can't cut it up cut it up

22:00>> No, the regulations are what they are.

22:03Do you know what I mean? Like a third

22:04violation is a third violation. It's

22:06like the third time that something

22:08happened.

22:09And what you can come to the board to

22:12discuss and request an appeal for is

22:15whether or not something happened or

22:17whether you were notified correctly um

22:21due to our sending a letter out

22:23incorrectly.

22:25You guys aren't looking at a fourth

22:26violation.

22:27Because it doesn't change what actually

22:30happened. We're just holding ourselves

22:32accountable to making sure that we are

22:35transparent and provide you with correct

22:37information at the time.

22:38>> Yeah.

22:39>> So.

22:41>> Yeah, we don't have the leeway to change

22:43the punishment. It's like written in the

22:45rules.

22:46Yeah.

22:48>> So when is the latest we can do that?

22:51>> This is closing as

22:54Can we do it in December?

22:56>> It's October right now.

22:57>> Yeah, okay, that's so far out.

22:59>> I mean, I was going to suggest you guys

23:01to you know, you appealed it and it was

23:04supposed to start the 16th. Do you could

23:06start it October 16th?

23:10I mean, I think it needs to start

23:11relatively reasonable. Like if you need

23:14How much time do you need to get all

23:15that product out of your store?

23:17>> Oh, that's not a problem.

23:20>> Okay, so you want to do October 16th?

23:22>> I'm trying to if we Um

23:24with the timeline I'm trying to like

23:26kind of reduce our hardship a little

23:27bit.

23:27>> Right, I know, but you also have to

23:29understand like we we can't just let

23:31everybody come in and randomly

23:33pick things months after it should be

23:35happening.

23:36Right? So I mean, I it's today's the

23:396th. You know, giving you

23:42almost 2 weeks to get organized, to get

23:45the stuff out there, I think is

23:47reasonable.

23:48>> Yeah, then can we just do November 1st

23:49and November 30th? That's really easy.

23:51>> Is that easier for you? That's fair.

23:53>> Yeah.

23:53>> That's fair.

23:56>> So do you need a motion for that?

23:57>> Yes, please.

23:59>> So make a motion to

24:01uh accept the appeal and make it a third

24:03violation with the 30-day suspension to

24:07start November 1st.

24:08>> November 30th.

24:11That sounds good. Okay.

24:12So November 1st, 30 days.

24:16So I I second the motion.

24:17>> All

24:18in favor?

24:19>> I.

24:20>> I.

24:21>> So we'll um we will send you updated um

24:25closure letters.

24:30>> Thank

24:30>> you guys.

24:37And next on the list we have Shop Quick

24:40way.

24:41>> Shop Quick

24:46>> This is Shop Quick back in May.

24:49Last month they um went they were in

24:51front of the board requesting an appeal

24:53to the timeline to request their appeal

24:56because apparently they did not get the

24:58letter until months later that they had

25:01self-service cigars.

25:03So this is now an appeal for the

25:05violation that was received for

25:07self-service cigars.

25:08>> So I was not the um inspector who found

25:12the humidor unlocked and the picture you

25:15guys have it's actually Chris Poole who

25:17was um from my esteemed in there.

25:20And he took a picture of the humidor the

25:23lock

25:24>> Excuse me.

25:25>> It's here.

25:26>> It is.

25:27>> It's black and white.

25:28>> Oh right here.

25:29>> And a sign that says you know this isn't

25:31self-serve. Now I'm assuming Chris could

25:35pull it when he was there and clearly

25:37the sign indicates like you can't go in

25:39this yourself. So um I went in because

25:43they also had a DOR suspension of their

25:47permit for

25:49I believe it was 30 days.

25:51Maybe longer.

25:52Um and I went in as a follow-up to

25:56the DOR permit. If your DOR permit is in

25:59it's not in good standing then they

26:00automatically lose their local permit

26:03because they don't have a DOR permit in

26:05good standing.

26:07Um

26:08This is the gentleman I spoke to the

26:10owner and he did have information from

26:13the Department of Revenue that he had uh

26:16submitted an appeal for the DOR permit.

26:19So that was fine then it was okay that

26:20he was selling

26:22tobacco during that time.

26:24>> Back in May?

26:25>> Uh

26:26>> Cuz the only thing we're dealing with

26:27here right now is May.

26:29>> Mhm. When I went in,

26:30>> In May?

26:31>> No. I didn't go in. Chris

26:33>> Right, that's what I'm saying. The only

26:34thing that we're talking about tonight

26:35at the board meeting is the May thing.

26:37>> At this visit,

26:39I

26:40checked the humidor and they looked the

26:42same and it was locked.

26:43>> Okay.

26:44>> So, I was not there in May. It was Chris

26:46Poole.

26:46>> Okay.

26:47Is Chris do you know Chris is still

26:48upstairs?

26:50>> Might be.

26:50>> You check.

26:58>> Okay. So, it's we're talking about May

27:0014th. Yeah. Right. Okay.

27:06So, the

27:07the violation then is

27:10that it was self-service

27:12but there's a sign the sign but when he

27:15there's the lock but when he

27:17tried to pull it he could open it.

27:19>> Apparently. I again it wasn't me but the

27:21sign also indicates that it's not

27:23self-service so if someone probably

27:25could have opened it at the time

27:27otherwise there wouldn't be a sign.

27:29>> Okay.

27:31>> How much is the fine here?

27:34>> $1,000 I think.

27:36>> First violation.

27:37>> Okay, I think it's fine.

27:38>> It's not a sales from my perspective.

27:40There's no suspension.

27:40>> Right.

27:42>> Okay.

27:46>> Thank you for letting Kenny

27:49appeal late.

27:50Uh

27:51if you saw his letter he was in India in

27:54May and June.

27:55So, I wasn't there on the 14th and and

27:58Kenny wasn't there so I can't say

28:00whether it was locked or not. So, I'm

28:01really here in two capacities.

28:04Um I'm a customer of Shaw's Quick as

28:06many people who live off Linfield Street

28:08in Ward One I.

28:10Um I used to smoke cigars years ago

28:13but I

28:14I can't say in recent times whether it's

28:17locked or unlocked but when I go in I've

28:18seen the sign. So, I'm serving here as

28:22as a customer and a and a and and a

28:23witness.

28:25Um

28:26I can tell you that uh

28:28the clerk that was working is no longer

28:30working.

28:31Uh Kenny

28:32believed he had in place the proper

28:35uh, procedures.

28:37Um, so we're not we we can't dispute it

28:40because neither of us was there.

28:42But, I know I can tell you that I've

28:45seen the sign as a as a person as a

28:47customer in the store. And uh,

28:51and Ken's run the store for many many

28:53years.

28:54Uh,

28:54and I think his greatest concern was

28:57whether minors could uh,

28:59be sold. Um,

29:02and so I would hope that you would take

29:03that into consideration. It's a

29:05family-run business, Ken and his wife.

29:07Um,

29:08I think many people go there from

29:10Woodlawn like I do.

29:12Uh, but uh, I would hope you would give

29:14him some consideration and give me some

29:16consideration. I got to go back up to

29:17the Board of Appeals, but but Ken is

29:19here and uh, essentially what he would

29:22tell you is what the letter says.

29:24>> Yeah. I do think it's it's important

29:26that when you leave the country you do

29:28have someone responsible for getting

29:30mail that's business-related. You must

29:33have gotten bills and stuff in the time

29:34that you were gone. I don't know if

29:36those just go unpaid while you're gone

29:38because no one's checking them, but it

29:40is really important to designate someone

29:42to be in charge, yeah.

29:43>> I understand.

29:44I apologize.

29:46>> Wait, there was Chris there?

29:47>> He's coming down.

29:47>> Oh, great. Chris is here. He's going to

29:48come down. Chris is the person who um,

29:53must have seen this.

29:56>> And just when you went did the lock look

29:57like this still with the duct tape?

29:59Okay.

30:02>> Is it Yeah, that's the picture, right?

30:04>> Yeah.

30:10Does the lock work?

30:15How come there's tape on it?

30:19>> Um, so

30:20>> W- Why is there tape on the lock?

30:22>> Um,

30:23>> Oh, that was little broken, but it's

30:26what everything when you take out.

30:28>> you know, not like uh,

30:29pull out and pull like You know?

30:31>> So, you just lock it. You have to pull

30:34it

30:35And then what I mean we come personally

30:37even though five person stand over

30:39there.

30:40Even though my clerk come

30:43open them self and stay.

30:45>> Okay. And

30:46>> All the time since the Joyce told me

30:48four five year before. It show me how to

30:51do it and what to do it.

30:53>> And I think

30:55because I've been in the store before

30:56like you have the counter here and then

30:58the humidors like right after the right.

31:00Yeah, it's like in the view of the It's

31:02not behind the counter.

31:03>> Yeah.

31:04>> But

31:05like you'd have to be a very inattentive

31:07clerk to see somebody opening it without

31:10or not be there I guess but maybe you're

31:12going to be in the back.

31:16It's not in like the back corner of the

31:18store where there's nobody watching.

31:21>> It's in the front side.

31:22No, inside.

31:24>> Yeah, it's like right next to the the

31:26counter. Yeah.

31:27>> Next to the cashier.

31:35>> It sounds like the professional shoes so

31:37that some

31:50And uh

31:53the

31:54I guess what does the actual

31:58um

31:59regulation say? Just says like not

32:01self-service?

32:02>> Correct.

32:02>> Okay.

32:03Okay. It doesn't say it has to be

32:05locked. It just says not self-service?

32:07>> Well, no. But self-service would be you

32:09>> Well, yeah. I mean it's assumed. Yes,

32:11but it

32:12>> But there's not an additional

32:13requirement that it's locked.

32:16>> Like it doesn't say specifically

32:19I guess what I'm getting at like the

32:20sign clearly says it's not self-service.

32:23>> That's what I know.

32:24>> Well, I understand for safety reasons

32:26but like if you forgot to lock it

32:29>> So it's supposed to have a working lock.

32:31>> Yes.

32:31>> And that's in the regulations.

32:34>> I can look it up like the wording but I

32:36I think I'm not sure but it it still

32:38would self-service and if someone knew

32:40if it was a regular and I'm not saying

32:42this is but I have seen this.

32:45If

32:46the store has a regular thing where the

32:48lock wasn't turned on to lock so it was

32:51just just slid it off and that was a

32:54regular practice which I have no idea if

32:55that's a regular practice there but that

32:57means it's self-served. If we went in

32:59and you could slide the lock off

33:02it would be a fine for a violation.

33:04>> Because it's available to self-service

33:06is what you're saying.

33:07So I think that's the word of being

33:09available to self-service.

33:10>> I can look up the exact definition. I

33:12don't know if it says locked humidor or

33:16>> I think that's helpful.

33:38Thanks Chris. Sorry to grab you last

33:40minute.

33:42>> Good. How are you?

33:45>> Okay, that's good.

33:46Um so Chris, we were just talking with

33:49with Shop Quick here and Joyce was

33:51saying that you were the person who

33:52noticed that this the humidor at Shop

33:54Quick back in May was available for

33:56self-service.

33:57>> Yeah.

33:58>> Meaning that someone could open it cuz

33:59it wasn't locked.

34:01>> I should look that to me.

34:02>> Okay. Did you see anybody open it?

34:04>> I did not see anybody.

34:04>> Okay.

34:06Did you try to open it?

34:08>> I don't remember that but it looked like

34:09it was the lock was all broken and that

34:12duct tape and everything wrapped around

34:13it.

34:14>> Okay.

34:14>> Looked like it was in tough shape.

34:18They got it reported and then someone

34:19else went.

34:19>> Yeah.

34:20Well then Joyce went later and then

34:23>> I did try and unlock it.

34:24>> And then you could not.

34:25>> Could not pull it open and all that duct

34:28tape was there and it has been for a

34:29long time.

34:30>> Yeah.

34:32So I mean I I think

34:34I we don't have any evidence that it was

34:36unlocked. Um

34:38I I think the intent is clear with the

34:41sign.

34:42>> Yeah.

34:42>> Um

34:44I think I'm okay with it not being a

34:45violation. I would make a suggestion

34:48if you could take some of the $1,000 you

34:49would have given to us and get a new

34:51lock.

34:58>> My next question was going to be is this

35:01a

35:03>> Okay.

35:07Usually come for coffee.

35:10Right way after Joyce came.

35:12>> Mhm.

35:13>> We must have to do it because you know

35:15Joyce is on her way inside.

35:17>> Okay.

35:18>> So yeah.

35:19>> Going to do it that. Plus we change the

35:21register system also. Just we bought it.

35:25You know

35:26a couple of weeks before.

35:28And that's going to be

35:29changed also.

35:30>> Okay.

35:31Okay.

35:32>> It's like there's a Mr.

35:3559 North Street. Same kind of

35:37>> Yeah, that's a great system actually. I

35:38didn't

35:39Very helpful for you guys as owners.

35:44>> So

35:45So yeah, I guess I make a motion to

35:48excuse the violation.

35:52You can't make a motion to make you get

35:53a new lock.

35:54That would be my suggestion.

35:55>> So motion to grant the appeal

35:57grant the appeal.

36:02>> I I second the motion.

36:03>> All right, I'm in favor.

36:04>> I.

36:04>> I.

36:05>> You also?

36:06>> Thank you.

36:07>> There you go.

36:13Thank you.

36:13>> Thank you. Thank you for coming in,

36:14guys.

36:15>> Thanks.

36:18>> Okay, what's next?

36:20>> Old Old

36:21Old business.

36:22>> Yep. Body art. We keep talking about it.

36:25We're not getting to it by the end of

36:26the year. However, actually good note,

36:28this is Rick Nelson. This is the chief

36:30health the chief health inspector. He

36:33was filling in for April while she was

36:34gone. He's now officially the chief

36:35health inspector. So he's been doing the

36:37work since what like May?

36:40>> Uh a little before that.

36:41>> Okay. I was going to say April, but then

36:42I'm like no, that's her name."

36:45So, yeah, so he's been doing it. He He

36:46is officially been appointed to that

36:48position. Um

36:50he, you know, I wanted to introduce you

36:52to him because he is doing all the work

36:54that I used to do, that April used to

36:56do.

36:57Rick is going to start working with the

36:59regional hub

37:00on

37:02learning to do the body art inspections,

37:05and that will be a way to learn the body

37:06art regs, so that we can feel good to

37:09get ready to implement them here in

37:11Lynn.

37:12Um and also, while we're at that, Rick

37:14we're we're working more closely with

37:15Maleeka. Um there's been a lot of

37:17confusion on the flavor stuff and what

37:19have you. So, we actually have a tobacco

37:22resource page set to go on our website,

37:24so people can go to the webpage, look at

37:27archive copies of letters that were sent

37:29out, check links like the FDA website,

37:31like did the FDA just add this as a

37:33flavored product? Is this okay? Um

37:35because we know manufacturers and

37:37distributors are just they they want to

37:39make a sale. So, they're they're selling

37:41things to retailers and saying, "Oh,

37:43don't worry about it."

37:44>> a letter, though.

37:45>> Yeah, I've got a letter. And some people

37:47really are trying to do the right thing,

37:49and and they just don't know. Um so,

37:51we're trying to make that information

37:52more easy for easier for them to find.

37:55Um

37:56we have also we will be sending out a

37:58letter

37:59to all retailers that Zen Smooth is in

38:02fact flavored.

38:04Um and we are will be giving people 14

38:07days to remove any Zen Smooth from the

38:10premises.

38:11Um just because that was a a

38:12miscommunication or a a change at the

38:14FDA somewhere. So, we wanted to give

38:16people that notice. So, those letters

38:18are going out along with the information

38:20about the tobacco resource page. So,

38:22yeah.

38:23>> Yeah, I think that'd be good.

38:24>> Yeah.

38:25>> I feel like there's been some rocky

38:27implementation since

38:29since July.

38:30>> Yeah.

38:30>> Yeah.

38:31>> There's been rocky what?

38:32>> Implemented like people come in say they

38:34don't know. So, I think reminding them

38:36>> Yeah. And I think just it's it's hard.

38:38You know what I mean? Like not using

38:40grape and strawberry, and using things

38:42like smooth. Like

38:44what does smooth taste like?

38:46>> Well, I I doubt they're testing

38:48products, yeah.

38:49>> What was it?

38:49>> I doubt they're testing most of their

38:50products.

38:51>> No, but actually in um

38:53June of 2024

38:56um if you remember it hit the news.

38:59Thank you. Um the

39:01Chelsea

39:03this has just to do with Newport flavor.

39:05So, Newport non-menthols came out. And

39:08they looked just like the regular

39:09menthols that Newport used to sell. They

39:11called it non-menthol. But when they

39:13were tested, they had a flavor, a

39:16cooling flavor.

39:17So,

39:18um it was upheld by the Board of Health.

39:21And RJ Reynolds never filed an appeal,

39:25which meant they

39:26consented that it was flavor.

39:29It came off the shelves and DPH sent out

39:32a letter saying, "It's no longer It was

39:34never only about the manufacturer's

39:36letter.

39:37But

39:38now we're sending a notification, you

39:40need to do more. You as the retailer

39:43need to know what you're selling."

39:44And they sent them very specific

39:46guidelines to help retailers. And that

39:49didn't come from us. That came from DPH

39:52and they used the active DOR permit list

39:55at the time. So,

39:58we have to assume everybody got it. It

40:00made the news. There was some news about

40:01it. And

40:03I can tell you I I think we've had it

40:06here. Like the Crave pouches

40:09that are supposedly non-flavored.

40:13They smell like you're in a peppermint

40:16candy factory. So, retailers who say

40:19they don't know, I don't believe it. I

40:21It's too obvious. Now, the Zyn Smooth

40:24and Zyn Chill, I will tell you is not

40:27easily easily uh determined by just

40:30scent. I've actually tested them, put

40:33them in my mouth, and get that mint

40:35flavor after they're wet. So, I get it.

40:38That I would say there's some confusion,

40:40but mostly the other stuff out there is

40:42not that confusing.

40:44>> Well, I guess it

40:45If our goal is to get it off the

40:47shelves, I think sending a notice to

40:48people so that they get off their

40:49shelves, please.

40:51>> The problem is that we because they

40:53filed with the FDA, so they had to

40:56supply the ingredients.

40:59And so in Zen Smooth

41:02Zen Smooth and Zen Chill, they

41:04identified the

41:06chemical. I think it's M3 or M something

41:08and it's the same thing they use in gum

41:10that has that cooling sensation. But in

41:13all the others because and I know we're

41:16talking about the which there's a

41:18lawsuit going on, so we're not using

41:20that as the criteria. We're just saying

41:21flavor.

41:23But a lot of the other products that are

41:24out there are flavored and all they have

41:27is the manufacturer's letter. We don't

41:29have anything attesting that those

41:32are in fact flavored other than our

41:34program our programs and our boards of

41:37health have been offered the opportunity

41:39to open some of the vape products and

41:41smell it, smell some of the pouches. And

41:44at some point we're going to have you

41:45know, we can't just say okay because we

41:47know Zen Smooth and Zen Chill are, but

41:49all these others because you have a

41:51manufacturer's letter we're going to

41:52turn a blind blind's eye and

41:55Rich can say

41:56his inspectors have gone out and seen

41:58walls of this and say there's no way

42:00this isn't flavored. I mean it's one

42:02it's Aris and it's 20 different color

42:04packages and it's clear emerald, clear

42:07ruby, clear this and they say it's not

42:09flavored it's clear. Clear doesn't mean

42:11it's not flavored. So there has to be

42:13some responsibility put on the

42:14retailers.

42:15>> Oh, for sure. Well and

42:17you said that it's admissible in in

42:19court to like smell it and that's like

42:21good enough.

42:22>> Yes.

42:22>> Yeah.

42:23>> Yes.

42:23>> Yeah.

42:23>> They said it's not the only

42:25determination. Well, smell is one but

42:26even taste or you know, it's not

42:28exclusively the manufacturer's letter.

42:30So we may be doing compliance checks or

42:33inspections and telling the

42:36retailers they have to get rid of this

42:37cuz it doesn't fit the criteria

42:39regardless of your manufacturer's

42:41letter.

42:41>> Right.

42:41>> And then if we go back and that's still

42:43there or there's a different product and

42:45they haven't done their due diligence,

42:48there's there's going to be like a fine

42:50or you know, some onus on retailers.

42:53>> Yeah, cuz my point is like we're not

42:55doing this to like oh got you, like you

42:57>> No, exactly.

42:57>> We want everybody to know as much as

42:59possible to get off the shelves.

43:00>> Well, that's why we're doing the

43:01resource page, too, because I think we

43:03do recognize that for a lot of

43:04retailers, you know,

43:06it's not that easy for them to find it,

43:09whether we think it should be or not.

43:10So, why not just make it easier?

43:13>> the resource page.

43:13>> Yeah, and put all that stuff up there,

43:15you know. Plus, it helps keep us up to

43:16date and and everything's right there.

43:18We actually have listed the

43:20information on kratom on that, too, the

43:22the state's one-year emergency ban. So,

43:24>> Well, it seems like their strategy is to

43:26be ahead of the game and just send flood

43:28the zone

43:30so that you can't keep up with it,

43:31right?

43:32>> That's Yeah, exactly.

43:34And the

43:35I will speak for the group, the

43:37collaborative um

43:39members have decided to We've spoken

43:41with the AG's office, myself personally,

43:44and they were shocked, but nothing's

43:45happened as a result of it. And then the

43:46FDA stuff came, so I think that kind of

43:49gave the AG's office an opportunity to

43:51like we don't have to chase this cuz the

43:53FDA NGO was part of the thing. Now,

43:56there's a lawsuit, so it's back to wait

43:58a minute, you know, the the AG's office

44:00has to

44:02help because this is a issue of

44:04commerce, it's an issue of um

44:07What is it when you put um

44:09like an ingredient, you lie about it?

44:11>> Misleading.

44:12>> No, cuz I found the I can't find the

44:14word.

44:15What is it?

44:16>> Synthetic?

44:17>> No, no, no, I mean like even in food, if

44:19you say this is not gluten If you say

44:21this is gluten-free and it's not, you

44:23it's a um consumer protection issue.

44:26>> Oh, okay.

44:26>> So, all these manufacturers are saying

44:28this is not flavor and it's only this

44:30many milligrams, but none of it We don't

44:32know if that's true. We're going by the

44:34manufacturer's letter, and we know

44:35they're lying on some of them, right?

44:37So, we can't hold them accountable at

44:40our level. So, the collaborative, our

44:43collaborative, once again, the strongest

44:45collaborative I think in the state, um

44:47have decided to send a letter to the

44:49AG's office with information and

44:52evidence of

44:55companies that have sent manufacturers

44:57letters that we know are flavored,

44:59including Zen.

45:00Um

45:01and

45:02they have not and so they're the

45:04manufacturer is not being held

45:06accountable and the distributor is not

45:07being held accountable. So, our

45:09collaborative collectively is sending a

45:11letter to the AG's office in Mass in

45:14um requesting that they investigate this

45:16and hold them both accountable, not just

45:18the retailers.

45:18>> So, we're trying to help the retailers.

45:20>> Absolutely.

45:20>> You know what I mean? By saying, you

45:21know what? It's time that we say, we

45:23need someone to go after these little

45:25deliberately untrue statements by

45:28manufacturers and distributors, you

45:30know?

45:31>> Yeah, cuz they're the only ones getting

45:32punished.

45:32>> Yeah. Right. Right.

45:34>> understand like but you can't you can

45:36also not say you're ignorant for 6

45:38years.

45:39So, but I agree that it's not fair that

45:42there isn't an opportunity for I say I

45:44think the retailers should get together

45:46and sue the distributors because they're

45:48being fined. Why not, you know,

45:50collectively get together and say,

45:52you're giving us this information. But,

45:54we'll at least do our part and notify

45:56the AG and ask and request them for

45:58assistance in this.

46:00And I can't wait to hear what happens

46:01because I think it's really important

46:03and it's long overdue.

46:04>> Yeah.

46:06>> All right.

46:10Next agenda item?

46:12>> Next meeting's date?

46:15>> Um so, the next Tuesday in November is

46:18election day, which we cannot meet on.

46:20So, we would be looking at November

46:2210th.

46:23>> Okay. What time works?

46:25>> Does that work?

46:31>> I cannot do the 10th.

46:33>> No.

46:35>> So, you can't either?

46:36>> I can't.

46:37The 17th?

46:40>> 17th I can do.

46:43>> I can do that one.

46:44>> 17th?

46:49>> All righty, then.

46:53>> Before you make a motion to adjourn, um

46:55in your own regulation and I didn't find

46:57it in state law um any display from

47:00which customer may select a tobacco

47:02product as defined here in without

47:04assistance from an employee or store

47:06personnel. So it doesn't say

47:08you know it

47:09humidor a slide lock of this

47:11>> Doesn't specify.

47:13>> It just says they can't get out of

47:14themselves.

47:15>> Thanks for that.

47:16>> Right.

47:17>> So I guess it's up to your

47:18interpretation whether a sign counts.

47:20>> Right.

47:20>> Right. You know whether but I would I

47:23would have

47:25I did when I went back to follow up on

47:26this. I went over to the slide lock

47:28because we've seen

47:29>> Yeah.

47:30>> keys in them like they're across the

47:32room and then you can't leave the key in

47:34it. You can't leave it unlocked. I can't

47:36unslide it.

47:37>> Right.

47:37>> Yeah.

47:38>> So I did check it but I you know the

47:40sign also indicates that that seems like

47:43this is not self-service. You don't have

47:44to say that if you pulled it and it

47:46didn't open, right?

47:50>> Ready to use favorite motion.

47:52>> Yeah, motion to approve. I'll make that

47:53motion.

47:54>> I second the motion.

47:55>> All in favor.

47:56>> I.

47:56>> I.

47:57All right. It's good to see you as

47:59always.

47:59>> Thank you.