2026-10-26 - City Council

00:00Learn more at michiganpublic.org/events.

00:06Michigan Public is W U O M 91.7 Ann

00:09Arbor-Detroit, W F U M 91.1 Flint, W R S

00:13X 91.3 Port Huron, W L N Z 89.7 Lansing,

00:18W V G R 104.1 Grand Rapids,

00:20michiganpublic.org.

00:23It's 7:00.

00:40>> Good evening. It is 7:00 on Monday,

00:42October 26th. I'd like to call this

00:44meeting of the Lansing City Council to

00:46order and ask that the clerk please call

00:47the roll.

00:48>> Councilmember Carter.

00:50>> Here.

00:50>> Councilmember Garza.

00:52Councilmember Hussain.

00:55Councilmember Kost.

00:56>> Here.

00:57>> Councilmember Martinez.

00:58>> Here.

00:58>> Councilmember Navarro Martinez.

01:00>> Here.

01:01>> Councilmember Polivanaglu.

01:02>> Present.

01:03>> And Councilmember Spadafore.

01:04>> Present.

01:05>> There are six members present, a quorum.

01:06Councilmembers Garza and Hussain are

01:08absent.

01:09>> Yes, also we will address this at the

01:11end of the meeting, but both both

01:12Councilmembers Hussain and Garza have

01:13requested an excused absence.

01:17>> Okay, we are to the meditation and

01:19pledge of allegiance.

01:20>> Uh is there anyone that folks would like

01:22us to keep in our thoughts this evening

01:23during our during our meditation?

01:27Vice President Polivanaglu.

01:29>> Oh, yeah.

01:31Um I would like to keep the um family

01:34and friends of our office manager,

01:36Sherry Boke, in our thoughts this

01:37evening as we reflect during our moment

01:39of meditation.

01:41>> Mr. Mayor.

01:43>> Um

01:44it's my understanding that Winnie

01:44Motherwell passed away, um and she has

01:47been an activist in our county and um

01:50representing

01:52Lansing and other areas with uh

01:53throughout the county. So, uh we will

01:55keep her in our thoughts and prayers.

01:57Thank you very much.

01:59If you'd all please rise.

02:35>> You have for your approval the council

02:38proceedings of October 12th.

02:39>> Vice President Peltonen.

02:41>> Thank you. I move the uh printed council

02:42proceedings for October 12th, 2026 as

02:45presented.

02:45>> Thank you. Any discussion? Seeing none,

02:47all those in favor, please say aye.

02:49>> Aye.

02:50>> All opposed? Motion carries.

02:52>> And we are to the consideration of late

02:53items.

02:54>> Vice President Peltonen.

02:55>> Thank you. I move suspension of council

02:57rule number nine, um, to allow

02:58consideration of a late item for

03:00referral.

03:01>> It's a proper motion. Is there any

03:02discussion?

03:04Seeing none, all those in favor, please

03:05say aye.

03:06>> Aye.

03:06>> All those opposed? Motion carries.

03:09>> Okay, uh, we are to comments by council

03:11members and the city clerk.

03:13>> We're not doing special ceremonies

03:14tonight.

03:15>> Oh, yes.

03:16>> Or maybe we're to special ceremonies.

03:18>> I like that idea.

03:20>> We have the 2026

03:23Citizens Academy graduates. Come on

03:26down.

03:54>> Tonight of paparazzi for you all

03:55tonight.

04:03>> So, tonight we have the opportunity to

04:04recognize the graduates of Lansing

04:06Citizens Academy. The Citizens Academy

04:08gives residents a behind-the-scenes look

04:11at how the city government actually

04:12works, or at least it's supposed to

04:14work. Uh you've met the people who keep

04:16Lansing running, learned about the

04:17services we provide, and gotten a better

04:18understanding of how decisions are made

04:20and how you can be part of them.

04:22I heard Adelisa say something tonight at

04:23your ceremony downstairs that really

04:25stuck with me and it says, "You can't

04:26change a city you don't engage in." And

04:28I think that's so important. Cities

04:30don't just get better because of the

04:31people sitting around this dais. They

04:33get better because residents show up,

04:35ask questions, share ideas, challenge

04:38us, and decide that their community is

04:39worth their time and energy. You've

04:41already taken that step, so on behalf of

04:43the Lansing City Council, I want to

04:44congratulate you. Thank you for engaging

04:46in your city, and remind you to please

04:48keep showing up because Lansing's better

04:49with you do.

05:01>> All right.

05:02>> He He asked me, so I I will. Um so, I I

05:05already did this downstairs, but I want

05:07to congratulate everyone up here. Um

05:08this is one of the first programs we

05:10created when we created the the

05:11Department of of Neighborhoods, at the

05:13time Neighborhoods and Citizen

05:14Engagement. We wanted to to get people

05:16involved. We saw other communities doing

05:18things like this. The police department

05:20does it. Um and we have seen nothing but

05:22excitement in this program in 9 years.

05:26Um these folks all come in wide-eyed and

05:28having no idea what they signed up for

05:29on day one, and by the end of the 11th

05:32week, they are the most knowledgeable

05:34people in the city outside of us that

05:36actually get paid to do the job. Um so,

05:39thank you. Uh for everybody watching,

05:41you too can be a part of Citizens

05:43Academy. Please keep an eye out in the

05:44next probably 3-4 months for

05:46applications to come back out. Um you

05:49two will get to hear from council and

05:51hear from the clerk and me, but even

05:53more importantly, you get to go visit

05:54parks. You get to see the wastewater

05:56facility. You get to really see the guts

05:58of the city. And um and honestly, people

06:01love it. So, um thank you uh and thank

06:04you to uh Delisa Fontaine. Thank you to

06:06Robin Anderson King. Uh this is very

06:08It's very staff intensive and our staff

06:11is the best in the world, so we

06:12appreciate them. Thank you, Mr.

06:13President.

06:16>> Delisa, do you want to say anything

06:17before I start reading these names?

06:19Yours are all right. All right.

06:21So, uh we have certificates to recognize

06:23uh y'all y'all's participation and they

06:25were dropped on my chair before I got in

06:27the room tonight, so please I didn't get

06:28a dry run with names, so I beg your

06:30forgiveness if I get them wrong.

06:31Uh Jessica Bibby.

06:39Yvonne Billington.

06:46Amy Bonkoski.

06:53Aaron Bootendorf. I knew that one.

06:59Amy Dyer.

07:06Diamelen Gatston.

07:13Clay Winters.

07:19She Ann Yu.

07:28Martha Bishop. There we go.

07:33And then I'll read the names of Deanne

07:34Garden and

07:38Melissa Zimmer.

07:44>> Thank you.

07:45>> Thank you all.

08:32>> All right.

08:33Now we are to comments by council

08:35members and the city clerk.

08:38>> Sure, I'm going to start if everyone

08:40wouldn't mind. Um

08:41this evening we had a chance to welcome

08:43back about two dozen of our former

08:45colleagues who used to sit around this

08:46table to commemorate this building, to

08:50celebrate our history here.

08:52I think there's something fitting about

08:53marking the closing of City Hall by

08:55talking this just about the building but

08:57the government that's lived inside it.

08:58So, you're going to have to sit here for

09:00just a few minutes while the history

09:01nerd in me lectures you for a few

09:03minutes.

09:04Lansing became a city in 1859. At the

09:07first meeting of city government, Mayor

09:08Hiram H. Smith presided alongside seven

09:11alderman. They weren't called city

09:13council members. In fact, the body

09:14itself was known as the common council

09:16until 1914. And its members continued to

09:19be called alderman for decades after

09:21that.

09:22Since those first seven alderman took

09:23office, roughly 300 people have had the

09:26privilege of serving Lansing as members

09:28of its legislative body. And here's

09:30something that puts the history of this

09:31building into perspective. Only about 75

09:34people have served on the Lansing City

09:36Council since 1958. For nearly seven

09:39decades, around 75 people have occupied

09:41these seats, debated the issues facing

09:43our city, cast votes on its future, and

09:45represented generations of Lansing

09:46residents from this building.

09:48This building arrived at a remarkable

09:49moment in Lansing's history.

09:51At least remarkable to me. Well, you all

09:52can decide. In 1957, a new city charter

09:55took effect in nearly a century uh after

09:58the title alderman gave way to the city

10:00title councilman.

10:01Lansing's government began to take on

10:02the form much more recognizable to us

10:04today. At almost exactly the same time,

10:06this building was rising across from the

10:08state capital.

10:09The new City Hall and Police Building

10:10was part of Mayor Ralph Crego's effort

10:12to modernize Lansing. It was completed

10:14in 1958 and formally dedicated in 1959.

10:18That was Lansing's centennial year. So,

10:20if you think about that timing, Lansing

10:21was celebrating its first 100 years, we

10:23just rewritten our charter, and alderman

10:25had become councilman. Lansing built

10:27this place as the physical home for a

10:28new era of city government. In 1978,

10:31Lansing adopted another new charter,

10:33giving us the council structure we know

10:34today.

10:35Eight members, four wards and four at

10:37large. And now, as we prepare to leave

10:39this building, Lansing's government is

10:41changing once again. In 2025, you all

10:44voted to adopt the city's first new

10:45charter since 1978, took effect this

10:47year, and will ultimately expand the

10:49council to nine members. We made sure

10:51there's room in the new building with

10:53five wards and four at large seats.

10:55There's a pretty remarkable symmetry to

10:57this moment. When we entered this

10:58building, we had just adopted a new

11:00charter, and as we begin a new chapter

11:02in how city government itself, we're

11:03leaving this building.

11:05There's a one detail about our new home

11:06that I particularly like.

11:09For decades, Lansing residents would

11:10walk through the door to address their

11:12elected representatives and get on an

11:14elevator and travel 10 stories. In our

11:15new home, the council chamber will be on

11:17the first floor.

11:19So, democracy is coming back to the

11:20ground floor. Buildings don't make

11:21government, people do, as we learned

11:23from the Citizens Academy tonight and

11:24the people in the audience who we're

11:25going to hear from later. Generations of

11:27Lansing residents have come through

11:28these doors to pay a bill,

11:30get a permit, register to vote, speak at

11:32a council meeting, protest a decision,

11:35celebrate a proclamation, or simply ask

11:36their government for help. Mayors have

11:38changed, council members have changed,

11:40clerks have changed, although not as

11:41often, and our titles, wards, and

11:43charters have changed. But, the basic

11:45idea that brought those first seven

11:47aldermen together in 1859 remains. A

11:49city is a community choosing to govern

11:51itself. So, for nearly 70 years, we've

11:53done a great deal of work inside this

11:54building. As we prepare to leave this

11:56building, it's not really goodbye to

11:57City Hall, it's good riddance, but it's

11:59also an opportunity to say thank you to

12:01this City Hall for the history it's

12:02held, and then carry this history with

12:04us as Lansing begins its next chapter.

12:06So, you all bear with me. Thank you very

12:08much. Others?

12:10Councilmember Navarro Martinez.

12:11>> Yes, so I wanted to announce that I have

12:13my constituent contact meeting coming up

12:15on Thursday. The exact date is I think

12:18it's the 29th. Um it's going to be yes.

12:23Let me just verify. Yeah, the 29th. Um

12:25it's going to be at fire station 44,

12:27located at 1435 East Miller Road.

12:31Usually, my constituent contact meetings

12:33are at um

12:35the election center on Jolly, but right

12:37now they're kind of busy, and so we're

12:39going to move for just this time. Um

12:43and we're going to actually have um

12:46uh Brad and Joe from Simtob uh coming to

12:49talk to us about a

12:51workforce um pilot housing project, uh

12:54which is on the southwest side, but it's

12:56on the south side, and we you know that

12:58what happens on the southwest side

12:59affects also the southeast side, and so

13:01we want to learn a little bit more about

13:02that. So, please come and learn about

13:04it. You'll learn about it tonight, too,

13:05but you can learn about it more than

13:07that uh at my constituent contact

13:09meeting as well.

13:11Thank you, Councilmember Carra.

13:12>> Uh yes, uh

13:13I would like to thank I'm I'm pretty

13:16sure the other at-large individuals like

13:18to thank those who participated in the

13:21uh at-large contact constituent meeting

13:23that was held a couple Saturdays ago. Um

13:26it was geared towards our youth. And so,

13:28we had um, Junior Achievement there,

13:31Superintendent there, we had CADCA

13:32there. We had a lot of different

13:34representation there, but it was more

13:36powerful to hear the voices of our

13:37younger generation. And it is our

13:40charge, they ta- they cha- challenged us

13:42with our charge to keep those voices at

13:45the table, which we will do. So, um,

13:48again, thank you to everyone that

13:49participated in the meeting on that day.

13:52And then also, uh, fun fact, that

13:55Councilwoman Pelivanaglu, Clare

13:58Martinez, and myself are now spotlight

14:01apple butter stirrers. We had the

14:02pleasure of being at Fenner Park. Yes, I

14:05did. I brought it. It's our seal. Um, we

14:08had the pleasure of being at Fenner Park

14:10this past weekend and stirred uh, apple

14:13butter um, and participated with lot of

14:16the individuals there and the youth that

14:17was there. So, it was a pleasure to be

14:19amongst those. Good music, good food,

14:22and good fellowship. So, thank you.

14:25>> Did you bring any apple butter?

14:27>> I do have some.

14:28>> Okay.

14:30Uh, next up is Councilmember Kost.

14:31>> Thank you. Um, I just wanted

14:33>> Kost. Sorry.

14:34>> Oh, I'm sorry. I'm sorry.

14:36>> Councilmember Martinez.

14:39>> I just wanted to announce first ward

14:42contact constituent meeting will be

14:44November 7th at Allen Neighborhood

14:46Center, 11:00 a.m.

14:48Um, for folks that are not aware,

14:50Kalamazoo Street is closed currently.

14:52You can get to Allen Neighborhood Center

14:54by going down Shepherd from Michigan

14:56Avenue or Allen Street um, to get into

14:59the parking lot to park and the back

15:00door is how you get in. Um, again, that

15:03will be the 7th of November at 11:00

15:06a.m. Thanks.

15:07>> Thank you, Councilmember Kost.

15:08Councilmember Martinez.

15:10>> Sorry, I got caught up with the apple

15:11butter. Um,

15:13threw me for that one. I just wanted to

15:15say congratulations to all the above Hip

15:17Hop Academy on a great gala. Uh,

15:19Councilmember Carter and I attended and

15:22it was again awesome to hear from and

15:25see the youth participate in a lot of

15:26different things, but also just so many

15:28people come together at the Lansing

15:30Shuffle

15:31and celebrate in the center of our city.

15:33It was a really beautiful and a

15:35remarkable experience. And then shout

15:38out again to

15:40Everett High School Principal Amy Boyles

15:41on Principal of the Year.

15:45Any others?

15:46All right, thank you, Mr. Clerk.

15:48>> Uh thank you.

15:49Thank you. Um

15:51it is election time.

15:53So

15:54uh

15:55we have early voting going on all the

15:57way up through Monday at both Foster

15:59Community Center and our Lansing

16:02Elections Office at 701 West Jolly. Um

16:05so please uh vote uh in in whatever way

16:09you want to. You can vote at home. Uh

16:12it's getting pretty tight on the

16:14timeline if you haven't already gotten a

16:15ballot mailed to you, but we are still

16:17mailing them out through Friday.

16:19Um we do have to have the voted ballot

16:21back by 8:00 Monday. At this point, I

16:24recommend that uh you use a drop box if

16:27you are here locally. Make sure you use

16:29a Lansing drop box if you are a Lansing

16:32voter. And make sure that you do not use

16:35a Lansing

16:36drop box if you are in a neighboring

16:38community.

16:39Um

16:41we have about 11,000 voters who still

16:45have an absentee ballot outstanding, so

16:47there's still time to get it back

16:50to us. Um I already mentioned early

16:52voting. Election Day, polls are open

16:547:00 a.m. until 8:00 p.m. just like they

16:57have always been.

16:58Um so there is still plenty of time and

17:00don't forget uh that uh you can still

17:04register. Michigan now has same-day up

17:06to same-day registration, so you can

17:08register and vote. Um

17:11and uh cast your ballot all in one trip,

17:14or you can

17:16register and take your um um

17:20take your ballot to I'm sorry, take a

17:23receipt and go to the polling place and

17:25vote. Um and then

17:27also really important, we have coming up

17:29our Halloween trunk-or-treat event. Uh

17:33that is this Saturday at 7:01 West

17:36Jolly. So, it's a fun event for the

17:38family. Uh we've we're going to have uh

17:41pizza and bands and kids voting

17:45activities and candy for the kids. We've

17:47got several organizations that'll be

17:49there working with us to give out candy.

17:51So, it's really a good event and the

17:53time is

17:54>> 2 to 4.

17:55>> 2 to 4.

17:58I think the pizza's going to be there an

17:59hour early, right? Pizza's showing up at

18:011, so.

18:03Um so, please

18:05vote.

18:06>> Come and get cold pizza.

18:08>> All right. Uh and with that, we are to

18:11community event announcements. If anyone

18:13in the audience has a community event,

18:14we'll give you a minute to tell us the

18:16details.

18:18>> Okay. So,

18:20this Halloween, uh Old Everett

18:22neighborhood, we're going to be doing a

18:24couple of our houses we're going to be

18:25doing a special trick-or-treating um

18:27where we'll probably be having be

18:29handing out have tables where we hand

18:30out uh candy as well as

18:33>> Sorry.

18:35Um go ahead.

18:36>> as well as So, yeah, again, Old

18:39Everett's um

18:40trick-or-treating on Saturday. Um and

18:43we're going to be having uh a few

18:44special tables where we're going to be

18:46um

18:47s- um giving out uh not just probably

18:50candy, but also cider and possibly

18:53donuts.

18:54Um so,

18:56um 411 West Willard um will be one of

18:58those. Um there's also I think going to

19:00be a house on Greenlawn. I forget the

19:02address for that, but

19:04um so, yeah, that's what we're going to

19:05be doing. Um and also, our next

19:07neighborhood meeting is going to be

19:08sometime in November. I'll try to get

19:11that negotiated with the library. And

19:13sometime in November as well, we'll

19:14consider doing a holiday party possibly

19:18at the elections office. Don't know if

19:20that's

19:21plausible, but we could but we will be

19:23considering that. That's all I'm going

19:25to say and I'll yield the rest of my

19:26time.

19:27>> Thank you. Any other community events?

19:38>> This year for the first time, we are

19:40holding a Halloween costume contest just

19:43before the race to restore 5K run/walk

19:46inside Mount Hope Cemetery on Halloween

19:48morning, Saturday, October 31st. The

19:51contest will be at 9:00 a.m. The race

19:53will be at 10:00 a.m. You can enter to

19:56win a $25 gift certificate to the Mason

19:59Depot Diner for the adult prize for the

20:01contest. A gift basket from Poppity Pop

20:04Popcorn for the under 18 prize for the

20:07contest. And there's even going to be a

20:09contest prize for the best pet

20:12costume. Our celebrity judges will be

20:15Dave Andrews and Tim Barron. And they

20:17will be scoring the contest entrance

20:19from 9:00 a.m. to 10:00 a.m.

20:22Votes will be tallied during the race

20:24and as winners

20:25as runners come in, winners will receive

20:28their prizes as they come in from the

20:29race. Your race entry your bib entry

20:33doubles as your contest entry and you

20:36can enter now online at runsignup.com.

20:40Thank you.

20:41>> Thank you. Other community events?

20:44All right. Then we are to um

20:48close of registration for public comment

20:51on legislative matters. Legislative

20:53matters includes the public hearings

20:56on the agenda as well as the items for

21:00action. So that on the printed agenda is

21:03items 3 through 20.

21:07Um and so we'll give you another minute

21:09to

21:10jump in and sign up with Maggie in the

21:11back who's former intern stepping in.

21:16And with that we're to the mayor's

21:18comments.

21:20>> Mr. Mayor.

21:21>> All right, thank you Mr. President. I

21:23got a few announcements. I'll try and do

21:24these quickly. First, I want to

21:26congratulate LEAP. They had their

21:2720-year anniversary of doing economic

21:29development in Lansing, which is

21:31excellent.

21:32I want to thank all of our mobile food

21:34pantry volunteers and I want to

21:37announce that we had 300 people

21:39served and we had 150 homebound that

21:42were served. So, that's great that we're

21:44able to help folks in need.

21:47Michigan Avenue, we had a ton of events

21:49over the weekend.

21:50The chili cook-off at the stadium was

21:53awesome. So, if you missed it,

21:55it was really a lot of fun. There were a

21:56lot of people there and I got to judge

21:58the chili cook-off. Had no idea what I

22:00judged, but it all tasted delicious. So,

22:02it was great. Um, the Eastside

22:05had a fall festival that was thrown by

22:08the Michigan Avenue Corridor Improvement

22:10Authority and that was really cool. It

22:13was a lot of fun to see everybody there

22:14with booths and things like that. And

22:16then tomorrow will be the Brick Row

22:19and ribbon cutting. So, we're getting

22:22going on Brick Row, which for those who

22:23don't know is the the old area that was

22:27the rescue mission who moved and went

22:29got bigger. So, right across from the

22:30Myer on Michigan Avenue. So, that's

22:32moving along nicely and and that'll be

22:34exciting. Um,

22:36this Friday the Eastside Fish Fry is

22:39doing a trunk or treat. Um,

22:41and on the on the Eastside. And then we

22:44also have trick or treat on the square

22:46downtown.

22:48Saturday the Lansing Empowerment Network

22:50is doing their trunk or treat at Rio. I

22:53think that's 6 to 8. I think it's normal

22:55time, yeah. Um,

22:57uh, so want to wish a happy and and a

23:00Halloween for for all the youngsters or

23:03not so youngsters. Um November 2nd, our

23:06yard waste will go to weekly. So, uh

23:10we're seeing the leaves fall now and

23:12it's going to be uh

23:14weekly. So, in about a week on November

23:162nd and that'll go through the first

23:18week of December. Um November 9th, our

23:21new fire station opens, fire station 9.

23:24So, we continue to um to to do good with

23:26the millage that our our voters passed

23:28and fire station 9 opens on November

23:319th, which is exciting.

23:32Um and then next Wednesday, this coming

23:36Wednesday, our Empower cohort graduate

23:40uh cohort 4 will be graduating. That's

23:42our

23:43um our equitable economic development

23:45program that we all passed during the

23:47pandemic um and we've kept it going for

23:504 years. So, I'll have our cohort

23:51graduate. And then, last but not least,

23:53uh you'll see this tomorrow. We'll have

23:55a press release tomorrow, but I wanted

23:57to share it with council and those

23:59watching council live. I first um over

24:01the summer I had several people in

24:03different areas ask me about um

24:06adopt-a-road or adopt-a-park. We used to

24:09have that program where people would

24:10adopt a road. It kind of fell off um and

24:14we got working on it and our staff has

24:16put together new programs where um we

24:19are going to have an adopt-a-park and an

24:21adopt-a-road where uh an individual or a

24:24group or a nonprofit or whatever um will

24:26be able to go online, adopt-a-road, um

24:29agree to to take care of a certain

24:31portion of a road or a full park or

24:33parts of a park if we have big parks. Um

24:36they'll get a sign put up that says

24:37their name, you know, the the whatever

24:39group or whatever neighborhood adopting

24:41this road. Uh and then they will agree

24:43to keep it clean. Um they don't have to

24:45make contributions or anything. They're

24:47agreeing to contribute their time. Uh we

24:49will give the the the pickers and we'll

24:51give the garbage bags and everything

24:52else. Um but we will be empowering

24:55people who

24:56again have requested this to keep our

24:59help keep our streets and our parks

25:01clean and we'll give them the

25:02recognition. So, we'll have that out

25:05tomorrow

25:06um and there'll be websites. It's

25:07lansingmi.gov/adoptaroad

25:10and lansingmi.gov/adoptapark.

25:13Um and hopefully we'll we'll be able to

25:15get this going

25:16um and then I'm sure it'll pause in the

25:18winter and then we'll get it going again

25:20as the weather gets warm. So, um I'm

25:22excited that we've been able to get that

25:23done uh cuz I'm really surprised at how

25:25many people have approached us about

25:27doing this and we can um help them to

25:30help us. So,

25:32that'll be exciting tomorrow. Thank you,

25:33Mr. President.

25:34>> Great. Thank you, Mr. Mayor. Mr. Clerk.

25:37>> Okay, we are to public comment on

25:40legislative matters and as I indicated

25:42it includes the action items that are uh

25:468 through

25:4720 as well as the public hearings which

25:49we have

25:51um

25:52item three, amending the noise

25:55ordinance. Items

25:56four, five, six, and seven are all

25:59payments in lieu of taxes uh for various

26:02properties uh all for workforce housing.

26:08>> All right, we'll go through the public

26:09hearings.

26:10>> Jonathan, have the overview.

26:12>> Yeah.

26:13>> Okay.

26:14>> Item three, uh

26:15Councilmember Martinez.

26:17>> Yes, thank you, President Spennyfor. Um

26:21I'm filling in for Councilmember Hussain

26:24uh on behalf of the Public Safety

26:26Committee um and then I'm going to turn

26:27over to the authors of the ordinance

26:31um amendment. So, the ordinance would

26:33make two operational changes, apply the

26:35regulations contained in the chapter

26:37currently to all property in the city

26:39rather than to non-industrial property

26:42only, and replace the decibel

26:45measurement method with a plainly

26:47audible standard enforced at fixed

26:49distances that vary by time of day and

26:52by type of noise source to allow for

26:55better enforcement of this chapter.

26:58The main goals in drafting this

26:59ordinance were to address the

27:01disturbances caused by motor vehicles

27:04operating throughout the city at all

27:06hours of the day and night with modified

27:08exhaust, amplified sound systems, and

27:11devices that create artificial or

27:13explosive noises, and to in general

27:16clean up and combine topics for easier

27:18understanding. And with that, I would

27:20defer to Councilmember Cost.

27:23>> Thank you, Councilmember Martinez. Um,

27:26you had did it so well. Um, so

27:29couple of things. Um,

27:31if this body remembers, we

27:34um tried to address this last year and I

27:36think there was some

27:37um

27:38misunderstandings when it came to the

27:40noise ordinance and so um

27:43Councilmember Martinez did cover um

27:46the biggest changes, which is changing

27:47that from a decibel reading device to a

27:51audible distance, specifically

27:54when we're talking about cars because

27:56that requirement for the

27:58uh decibel reading device is not

27:59currently on

28:02um

28:03the properties. And right now, there is

28:05a I

28:07cre- uh correct me if I'm wrong, City

28:08Attorney Banker, but there's no distance

28:12um

28:13buffer with property currently in the

28:16noise ordinance.

28:19>> For ve-

28:20>> vehicles, that's correct. There are some

28:21distances written in as it relates to

28:25non-vehicle noise.

28:26>> And then,

28:27just so folks are clear, if you're

28:29looking at this and you're seeing all of

28:31this crossed out like there's

28:33uh a lot of changes, um could you just

28:35kind of explain a little bit what that

28:37is?

28:38>> Yeah. Sorry. Um, I'll I'll say

28:42our office was pretty excited to get to

28:44modify this chapter because it has so

28:47many weird things that have been put in

28:49over time Uh

28:50and there are like competing definitions

28:52and competing sections. So, when you

28:54look at it,

28:55um

28:58starting with definitions, there are a

28:59lot of definitions that are taken out

29:01because we don't need them anymore.

29:02There are definitions that have been

29:04modified. A big one, the industrial

29:06property,

29:07there's an exemption in the current

29:09noise ordinance that any noise coming

29:10from any industrial property is exempt.

29:12So, even if it's non-industrial noise,

29:14um

29:15and so that has been corrected with a

29:17series of changes

29:18both to the definition of industrial

29:20property and then later on how

29:21industrial property gets utilized.

29:23Um

29:25and then the plainly audible standard is

29:28added and that's used throughout. Um

29:31there's a zoning correction where the

29:34old ordinance or the existing ordinance

29:36references

29:37several old zoning codes that just don't

29:40exist anymore.

29:41Um and we've got a map to figure out

29:43which one of those these all map onto,

29:45but that's an easy cleanup that we

29:47should be making

29:48in this instance.

29:50Um

29:50and then a lot of other definitions that

29:52have been pulled out are sound levels,

29:54sound pressure levels, um

29:57how to use a dosimeter, things like

29:58that. And then when you get to motor

30:00vehicles, there's a big removal of

30:02language and that was all about if it's

30:05this kind of vehicle it can be this many

30:07decibels, if it's this kind of vehicle

30:08it can be this many decibels measured

30:09from this distance. All that is taken

30:11out because that's a very difficult

30:13method to enforce um for an officer or

30:19any city official standing on the

30:20street. Um

30:22and I will just say the other area where

30:23decibel

30:24measurements were contained was when you

30:26got into like air handling equipment,

30:28air conditioners, things like that. Um

30:30that's been removed as well in in favor

30:32of a plainly audible standard. And then

30:35um

30:36after all of that removal,

30:38when you get to about page eight is a

30:40sort of a a statement of all the rules

30:43that apply to vehicles. And I say all

30:46because one of the other oddities of the

30:48existing ordinance is there's a

30:50collection of them at the end of the

30:52chapter

30:53that's just says

30:55extra stuff basically. I can't remember

30:57what the exact name they call it.

30:59Additional violations. And there's a

31:01whole bunch of things that just got

31:02tacked on over the years that nobody

31:03wanted to go in and recodify the whole

31:05thing or I guess rewrite the whole

31:06thing.

31:07Um and so those have been

31:09put where they belong including

31:11um stuff like uh discharge of explosive

31:14sounds from a vehicle.

31:15Um and then

31:17what we have is

31:19uh

31:20the noise that a vehicle

31:22uh can make

31:23uh between 7:00 a.m. and midnight and

31:26then the noises that a vehicle, how

31:27close, how far from midnight to 7:00

31:30a.m.

31:31Uh and so there's still

31:33a lot of the same stuff is captured.

31:34It's just

31:36uh written to a plainly audible standard

31:37instead. Um and then

31:40I again, if you'll permit me, when you

31:42get on into prohibited noises generally,

31:45there are a series of subsets and this

31:47was one

31:48uh in existing 64.07A

31:51and existing

31:53um

31:5464.07B.

31:58You can read them and make sense of

31:59them, but they seem to overlap and so we

32:02pulled them apart and redrafted it so

32:04that

32:05um

32:06you have one

32:08uh here's here's noise between 7:00 a.m.

32:10and midnight and then two, here's noise

32:11between midnight and 7:00 a.m. Three,

32:13here's how we're dealing with

32:15um noise in multi-unit dwellings. Um and

32:18then

32:20from there it's similar down through

32:21places of public entertainment

32:23and air conditioning. Um

32:26there's a definition emergency work is

32:28defined

32:29in 64.08C, but also in the definition

32:32section, so we didn't need that.

32:34Um there were a lot of cleanups like

32:36that. So there's a lot of places where

32:37things have been taken out, but it's

32:38mostly because they've been moved to a

32:40different section to match up with what

32:42we're trying to do so that you can look

32:43at one area and know here's where all

32:45the stuff about cars is. Here's where

32:47all the stuff about houses is. Here's

32:48where all the stuff about places of

32:50entertainment that make noise. Uh here's

32:52where all that stuff is. So,

32:55sorry if that's maybe more than you

32:56asked for, but um

32:58>> No, I appreciate it. And just to be

32:59clear, some of these some of these items

33:01that are in here, whether we took them

33:03out or not, are already state law. Um

33:06so,

33:07regardless of it being in here, it would

33:09still be enforced. Like if someone, you

33:11know, had a loud muffler.

33:13>> Muffler is on the books under the

33:15vehicle code. There's a lot of stuff in

33:17the vehicle code that's very similar to

33:18this. Ours is just more tailored to how

33:22what happens in Lansing.

33:23>> All right.

33:24Thank you.

33:25Thank you.

33:27Any questions or comments?

33:30Thank you.

33:31Uh next item we will go to Council

33:32Member Navarros Martinez.

33:35>> Yes, so this is a public hearing uh for

33:37proposed amendments to Chapter 887

33:39payment in lieu of taxes pilot for

33:42Baltic Flats at 911 to 1003 West

33:46Cavanaugh Road.

33:47Uh for Ventnor Flats at 1000 to 1156

33:51Dorchester Circle and 4612 and 4620

33:55South Martin Luther King Jr. Pacific

33:57Flats at 1317 to 1421 East Kalamazoo

34:02Street and Carolina Flats at 2411 and

34:052206 Rivers Dale Risdale

34:08um at for workforce housing at 4% and um

34:13for Carolina Flats at

34:174316 Pleasant Grove Road uh for

34:20workforce housing at 6%.

34:24>> Thank you. And we have um folks here to

34:26present this evening.

34:26>> Yes, we have Brad Simtob and Joe Neller

34:30from

34:31um

34:32uh Developments by Simtob Management

34:34Investments. Thank

34:36>> Gentlemen, have been here before, you

34:37know the drill.

34:47Yeah, City TV will pull up when you're

34:48when you're ready. And just a reminder

34:51for one of the last few times that

34:52button does not actually advance the

34:53slides, it just lets the folks in the

34:55back know you'd like to advance the

34:56slide, so give it a second. Don't don't

34:58get too excited.

34:59>> I'll try my best.

35:00>> Yeah, thank you.

35:04Uh City TV, whenever you're ready, I

35:05think they're good for their uh

35:07slideshow.

35:11It's up.

35:13Go ahead.

35:14>> So, good evening. My name is Joe Neller.

35:16I'm here with Brad Simtob, managing

35:18partner of Simtob Management. We're

35:20honored to be here to present on the

35:22company's workforce pilot applications

35:24for 440 units across four properties.

35:27First, I want to thank Director Van

35:28Faussen, Director Dryer, and the entire

35:31EDP staff for their work with us on the

35:32pilot applications.

35:34They certainly made sure the pro formas

35:36were in order and put us through the

35:37paces to clearly demonstrate the

35:38financial need and uses of the pilot

35:40investments, and we greatly appreciate

35:42their work.

35:45Now, before I turn it over to Brad, I

35:47want to quickly review what we hope to

35:49provide during this presentation. We

35:51hope that everyone will hear a success

35:52story of an emerging company that has

35:54chosen Lansing as its home and is

35:56heavily invested in its future.

35:58We hope everyone will see the commitment

35:59made to the revitalization and

36:01rehabilitation of neglected and

36:02distressed properties in Lansing.

36:05And we hope everyone will view these

36:06workforce pilot applications as a

36:08continuation of a partnership with the

36:10City of Lansing that has been

36:11established on shared work over the past

36:13few years.

36:17To start, I want to define some terms

36:19that will be used throughout the

36:20presentation. There's a lot of

36:22discussion about the need for {quote}

36:24affordable housing, but that term can

36:26mean different things to different

36:27people.

36:28In fact, HUD's technical definition of

36:30affordable is that rent is 30% or less

36:33of gross monthly income.

36:35AMI means area median income, which is

36:38calculated by HUD on a county level.

36:41Low income, as it relates to programs

36:43like LIHTC or the low-income housing tax

36:45credit administered by MSHDA, or as it

36:48relates to pilots, is defined as 60 to

36:5180% AMI.

36:53The city of Lansing has two payment in

36:55lieu of taxes programs or pilots,

36:58one for {quote} traditional or

36:59low-income properties, and one for

37:02workforce properties.

37:03Simtob Management is applying for

37:05workforce pilots, which are defined as

37:0780 to 120% AMI.

37:10And there is currently only one other

37:11workforce pilot approved in the city of

37:13Lansing.

37:14And to be clear, the pilot percentage

37:16rate is not the tax rate, but the

37:19percentage of rents collected at the

37:20property that is paid to the city of

37:22Lansing.

37:25Here's a chart to display the annual

37:26rent and income limits for Ingham County

37:28as defined by HUD. You can see the blue

37:31bracket to identify the definitions of

37:32low income, and the orange brackets to

37:35identify the definitions of workforce

37:37income with the overlap at 80% AMI.

37:40If these numbers seem high to you as a

37:42resident of Lansing, it's because they

37:44are.

37:45The US Census reports that the median

37:47and per capita incomes in the city of

37:48Lansing are much lower than the rest of

37:50Ingham County.

37:52This means any housing development here

37:53is a challenge economically. And now I'm

37:55happy to turn it over to Brad so he can

37:57discuss how his company helps solve

37:59these challenges.

38:00>> Hello. It's a privilege to be in front

38:02of you today. I'm grateful for the

38:03opportunity to discuss my company's

38:05history and these properties.

38:07I started Simtob Management in May 2020

38:10with my father, Richard, when we

38:11purchased Eagle Manor, an 11-unit

38:13property on Shiawassee Street. The

38:15property was my first experience in real

38:17estate management, and I got a full

38:19experience. I served as the property

38:22manager, landscaper, maintenance

38:24technician, and bookkeeper. I was at the

38:26property daily and built a relationship

38:28with each resident.

38:30After Eagle Manor, we purchased a

38:3232-unit property, Elm Oak Apartments,

38:34which was pink-tagged.

38:36I worked closely with the City of

38:37Lansing Code Enforcement team to

38:38renovate the property and receive its

38:40rental permit within 7 months of

38:42closing.

38:43Through this experience, I found a

38:44passion for acquiring distressed

38:47multi-family properties, investing

38:49significant time and money in the

38:51rehabilitation, and retaining as many

38:53residents as possible while keeping rent

38:55increases minimal.

38:57This experience solidified my decision

38:59to drop out of Michigan State University

39:01and pursue my passion for providing

39:03clean, safe, and affordable housing

39:05options that allows individuals and

39:07families to improve their lives.

39:09Today, Simtom Management has grown to

39:11600 units in the City of Lansing and

39:13remains headquartered at 1414 South

39:15Pennsylvania.

39:17To date, SMI has rehabilitated more

39:20pink- and red-tagged units in Lansing

39:22than any other private developer.

39:24Our company focuses on the

39:26rehabilitation and revitalization of

39:29distressed properties to return them to

39:30compliant use for residents.

39:32To date, we've invested 9 million in

39:34rehabilitation and have another 11

39:36million in planned capital investment

39:38over the next 5 years.

39:40All previous investment was privately

39:41funded, and these PILOT requests are the

39:43first tax incentives we have sought, but

39:46they are necessary to complete the full

39:4720 million investment in these

39:49properties.

39:50We offer the lowest rents in the City of

39:52Lansing and focus on community-first

39:54property management, which is handled

39:56in-house by Simtom Management employees.

39:58As a result, we see tenants stay for an

40:00average of 28 months, providing real

40:02housing stability and reflecting their

40:04satisfaction with the property.

40:07City Council has four workforce PILOT

40:09applications to consider.

40:11But from a company perspective, we see

40:12these as two properties.

40:14In October 2022, we acquired the

40:17portfolio called Monopoly Apartments

40:19from an out-of-state absentee owner.

40:22These properties were Belmont Park,

40:23Marvin Gardens, and Beverly Place. And

40:25they were not in compliance with rental

40:27certificates for 7 years prior to our

40:30acquisition. And almost all of the units

40:32were red or pink tagged.

40:34Many people told me I was crazy to take

40:36on this project, but these properties

40:38were adjacent to others in my portfolio.

40:40One day on a property visit, I ran into

40:43a former resident from Eagle Manor, my

40:45first property, who now lived in Marvin

40:47Gardens. They took me into the property

40:49and I saw the terrible conditions.

40:51Other neighbors opened their doors and

40:53brought me into their apartments to see

40:54even more of the property first-hand. I

40:56then knew I wanted to invest in the

40:58rehabilitation and revitalization for

41:00these residents.

41:02About 5 months after the Monopoly

41:04Apartments acquisition, I had an

41:06opportunity to visit Stonecrest

41:07Townhomes.

41:08I was on the property early one morning,

41:10and the lasting memory I have from the

41:12visit is the number of children I saw

41:14leaving their homes for the school bus.

41:16I immediately understood that that this

41:18was a family-oriented community, and

41:20there was a real opportunity to improve

41:22the lives of generations of Lansing

41:24residents.

41:25This mixed-income property, now called

41:27Carolina Flats, offers some of the only

41:29three-bedroom townhomes in the city. And

41:31we were able to take in residents

41:33stranded at Sycamore Townhomes in 2025

41:36as that property continued its decline.

41:39These next few slides show pictures of

41:40the conditions of these properties at

41:42the time of acquisition.

41:44As you could see, the properties were

41:46all similarly distressed.

41:47All properties had extensive exterior

41:49damage, and interior units were in

41:51conditions unfit for the people living

41:53there.

41:55Generally, these properties had damaged

41:57to roofing, siding, and balconies.

41:59There were many broken and boarded-up

42:01windows.

42:02Often, attics lacked insulation or had

42:04water damage from leaks.

42:06Many of the buildings' furnaces and

42:07boilers were not functional and needed

42:09to be replaced.

42:12The interiors of the units, many of

42:14which were still occupied, were in

42:15terrible shape. It was common to find

42:17water damage in the units, either from

42:19ceiling leaks or other plumbing or sewer

42:21issues.

42:22Visible damage to the drywall, flooring,

42:24and/or cabinets had not been repaired

42:26for years.

42:28In most units, including appliances, had

42:30not been upgraded since the properties

42:32were originally constructed 50 to 60

42:34years ago.

42:35I'm proud of the investments we have

42:37made to make to bring these properties

42:38back to functional and compliant use,

42:40but most importantly, I'm proud to

42:42improve the lives of the residents who

42:43live there.

42:47>> I want to take a moment moment to

42:48discuss what happened to the property

42:50taxes historically and the app impact of

42:52property taxes under the pilot

42:54application.

42:55Brad showed the conditions of these

42:57properties at acquisition and at the

42:58same time, the property taxes increased

43:00by 30 to 268%.

43:04These pilot applications provide a

43:06return to what the city would have

43:08collected as taxes if these properties

43:10had never been acquired and continued to

43:12fall into further distress. In fact, the

43:15pilot payment at Carolina Flats is still

43:18more on an annual basis than the

43:20property taxes when it was Stonecrest

43:22Townhomes.

43:23And on top of that, Simtob Management

43:25has paid a significant amount of taxes.

43:28At the same time, it has invested in the

43:30rehabilitation of these properties.

43:32Specifically, Simtob Management has paid

43:34close to $3 million in property taxes

43:37with about half of that amount coming

43:38from these four properties alone.

43:42>> I do want to take some time to address

43:44the lawsuit by the city of Lansing in

43:46March 2023.

43:48It would be easy to sit here and say

43:49that the lawsuit was the result of

43:51problems inherited with the acquisition

43:52of these properties, but I want to

43:54recognize that our company made mistakes

43:56in our understanding of code compliance

43:58and managing licensed contractors, gaps

44:00in our team structure, and in our

44:02communication with city officials. It

44:04was not fun at the time, but today I'm

44:06grateful for the lawsuit, which has led

44:07to significant changes in how we operate

44:10and help build a better relationship

44:11with the city.

44:14In Ap- In April 2023, I contracted with

44:17Joe Neller to be our government liaison

44:19to the city of Lansing.

44:21Joe began meeting with city leadership,

44:22including the mayor's administration,

44:24the Department of Economic Development

44:25and Planning, and the City Council.

44:27I want to personally thank Council

44:29members Hussain and Cos for their

44:30leadership during this time. They worked

44:32with Joe to provide construction

44:33timelines and monthly project updates at

44:36the Committee of Public Safety.

44:37It was through these conversations that

44:39we decided to open on-site leasing

44:41offices at these properties.

44:43We also hired key team members who

44:44continue to lead our company, including

44:46Jen Bauer as our Director of Finance and

44:48Jeremy Matthews as our Director of

44:50Property Management.

44:52Jeremy has an extensive background in

44:53property management and civic

44:55engagement. He has met regularly with

44:57the Housing Ombudsman, Joe McDonald, to

44:59discuss any resident issues and is now a

45:01business representative on the South MLK

45:04Corridor Improvement Authority.

45:06And I'm proud to say that with all of

45:08these changes to our staff and to our

45:09operation, we are able to achieve full

45:11compliance at all properties by November

45:142024, only 25 months after our

45:17acquisition of Monopoly Apartments.

45:19These next few slides show the exterior

45:21and interior renovations completed at

45:23these properties.

45:24We repaired all exterior damage.

45:27Windows, siding, and roofing are no

45:29longer leaking into any apartments. In

45:31addition, we invested heavily across

45:33these four properties and up- dated

45:35signage, attic insulation, lighting,

45:38landscaping, interior unit upgrades,

45:40common area improvements, and HVAC,

45:42plumbing, parking lot replacements, and

45:45electrical upgrades.

45:47We will get into more detail shortly,

45:49but about half of all interior units

45:50have been renovated. We renovated the

45:52unoccupied units first, adding new

45:54flooring, paint, cabinets, and

45:56appliances.

45:57We gave existing residents the option to

45:59move into renovated units if they wanted

46:01to.

46:02Some chose to move, but others wanted to

46:03stay where they were. The plan to

46:05complete the remaining renovations is to

46:07renovate these units as residents make

46:08them available.

46:10To date, we've invested 9 million in

46:12these properties, and we have another 11

46:14million planned over the next 5 years.

46:17These pilot applications are to support

46:18the second phase of the investment,

46:20which is needed to complete the crucial

46:22renovations at these properties to a

46:24uniform standard.

46:28>> As we begin to look at the specifics of

46:30the pilot applications, I want to

46:32provide some data on the occupancy,

46:33rent, and income trends at these

46:35properties. We've seen the conditions of

46:37these properties when Simtob Management

46:39acquired them. Even in these conditions,

46:41there were residents stuck living at

46:43these properties. Either they were on

46:45vouchers and could not find another

46:46property to accept them, or in the case

46:49of Carolina Flats, were stuck by their

46:51need for a three-bedroom unit with

46:53limited other options in Lansing.

46:55Simtob Management did not significantly

46:57increase rents on these residents to

46:59recover the rehabilitation costs, and

47:01continues to offer the lowest average

47:03rent in the city of Lansing.

47:08Simtob Management has taken distressed

47:10properties and turned them into viable

47:12mixed-income properties. Simtob

47:14Management has increased occupancy to

47:1593% or higher at all properties. The

47:19occupancy still includes individuals on

47:21housing vouchers, but that has decreased

47:23from 100% to 25% of residents.

47:27The average resident still earns about

47:29the median income for the city of

47:30Lansing, but property improvements have

47:33begun to attract higher income residents

47:35who are looking to improve housing

47:37affordability.

47:38The rents and income limits qualify

47:40Simtob Management for a low-income

47:42pilot, but the company does not want to

47:44turn away higher-income earners

47:45interested in these properties, and it

47:47does not want to force lower-income

47:49earners to leave if they begin to

47:51improve their financial outlook. A

47:53workforce pilot allows the company to

47:55continue serving all populations, and

47:57provides mutual growth opportunities for

47:59the company and the residents it serves.

48:09Simtom management, oh, excuse me, a

48:11well-managed property is less of a

48:12strain on city resources. We mentioned

48:15the condition of these properties and

48:16that almost all units were red or pink

48:18tagged.

48:19This means frequent visits from code

48:21enforcement at properties over the

48:22years. Today, these properties are in

48:24full compliance with the city and

48:26recently Ventnor Flats was awarded a

48:283-year rental certificate, one of the

48:30first in the city of Lansing due to its

48:32status at the last inspection.

48:34Similarly, we compared the number of

48:36police, fire, and EMS calls to these

48:38properties from the year prior to

48:39acquisition and the last full calendar

48:41year of 2025.

48:43There have been significant reductions

48:45across all properties, particularly at

48:47Monopoly Apartments, where there has

48:49been an average 82% reduction in public

48:52safety dispatches.

48:58These properties and pilot applications

48:59have relevant public support. The

49:01application packets included letters of

49:03support from various community

49:04organizations, charities, contractors,

49:07and individuals who have seen the

49:09improvements at these properties and

49:10felt the impact. We are proud to be

49:12active members and civically engaged in

49:15the Lansing community at large.

49:18So, why ask for a pilot now after years

49:20of private investment? The short answer

49:22is to support the second half of the

49:24planned investment without raising rents

49:26on residents. These properties are not

49:28sustainable and lose money every month,

49:30even under the pilot application, these

49:33properties continue to lose money for

49:35the first 5 years of the 15-year term

49:37and are only sustained by capital

49:39injections from the owners.

49:41The company is seeking tax relief to

49:43avoid raising rents or abandoning the

49:44remaining rehabilitation projects yet to

49:47be completed.

49:50The company is seeking a 6% workforce

49:52pilot at Carolina Flats and a 4%

49:55workforce pilot at Monopoly Apartments

49:57for 15 years.

49:58To date, there has been $9 million in

50:00capital investment at these properties

50:02and the pilot requests are to support an

50:04additional $11 million in continued

50:06investment to achieve a uniform

50:08standard.

50:10The pilots support the transformation of

50:12distressed properties into viable

50:14mixed-income properties.

50:15I'm going to turn it back over to Brad

50:17to walk through the actual financials

50:18for each property, but we are asking for

50:21the city to invest roughly $100 per unit

50:23per month to avoid equivalent rent

50:26increases for tenants.

50:29>> Since these acquisitions, and in

50:31addition to the purchase prices, we've

50:33invested over $9 million of owner's

50:35equity to bring the properties into

50:37compliance and complete many significant

50:38renovations. While we have made much

50:40progress in improving the financial

50:42condition of these properties, they

50:43still lose money each month and require

50:46significant owner's equity to operate.

50:48Without the support of the proposed

50:50workforce housing pilot, there's

50:52significant pressure to raise rents or

50:54defer needed property improvements.

50:56Even with a workforce housing pilot,

50:58there's still an owner's equity

50:59requirement of 5 and 1/2 million over

51:02the first 5 years of the pilot's term.

51:04By approving these workforce pilot

51:05requests, the city of Lansing is

51:07supporting the full rehabilitation of

51:09these properties. Over the next 5 years,

51:11there are $11 million in needed capital

51:13expenditures that are not feasible

51:14without support from the city of

51:15Lansing.

51:17Looking at each property individually,

51:19starting with Vatt or Flats. To date,

51:2154% of the 137 units have been renovated

51:24and we've invested $3.3 million.

51:27We are forecasting the need for an

51:28additional 2 and 1/2 million in capital

51:30improvements, including the remaining

51:31unit renovations, replacement of old

51:33windows and sliding doors, replacement

51:35of deteriorated sewer piping, and full

51:37roof replacements.

51:40At Baltic Flats, we have renovated 62%

51:42of the 84 units and invested $1.2

51:45million.

51:46We are forecasting the need for an

51:47additional 1.3 million in capital

51:49improvements, including the remaining

51:51unit renovations, replacing all windows

51:53and sliding doors, full roof and vinyl

51:56siding replacements, and improvements to

51:58all common areas.

52:00At Pacific Flats, we've renovated 45% of

52:03the 103 units and invested 2.6 million.

52:06We are forecasting the need for an

52:07additional 2 and 1/2 million in capital

52:09improvements, including the remaining

52:11unit renovations, replacing replacing

52:13all windows and sliding doors, full

52:16vinyl siding replacements, and finishing

52:17the three unoccupied down units to

52:20create two additional one-bedroom units

52:22and a three-bedroom unit.

52:25At Carolina Flats, we've renovated 65%

52:28of the 116 units and invested 1.2

52:30million.

52:31We are forecasting the need for an

52:32additional 4.3 million in capital

52:34improvements, including completing the

52:36remaining unit renovations, replacing

52:38all sewage piping on the property,

52:40replacing the remaining roofs, windows,

52:42and siding, replacing all HVAC systems

52:45and water heaters, and repaving the

52:46parking lots.

52:49>> As part of the workforce pilot

52:51applications, Sim Town Management has

52:52agreed to a deeper affordability

52:54commitment. The workforce pilots are

52:56designed to address up to 120% AMI.

53:00At the three properties that make up

53:01Monopoly Apartments, 51% of the units

53:04will remain at 80% AMI or below during

53:08the full 15-year duration of the term.

53:11All remaining units, including at

53:12Carolina Flats, will remain at 120% or

53:15below.

53:19We believe these pilot applications are

53:20a good investment for the city of

53:22Lansing and its residents. For about

53:24$100 per unit per month, the city of

53:26Lansing can leverage a $20 million

53:28private investment to return distressed

53:30and blighted properties to sustainable

53:32use as mixed-income workforce housing.

53:36These properties are no longer a drain

53:37on city resources and now provide 440

53:40units of clean, safe, and affordable

53:42housing for individuals and families in

53:44Lansing.

53:45We appreciate your consideration of

53:47these requests and hope you will approve

53:48these pilots. Thank you and we're happy

53:50to answer any questions.

53:53>> Thank you very much. Are there questions

53:54from the Council member Navarro

53:56Martinez?

53:57>> Thank you, Mr. President. First, I want

53:58to say thank you to Sim Town Management

54:00for this presentation. Usually, we don't

54:02get as in-depth information and I really

54:05appreciate that.

54:06Um thank you.

54:08Um as someone who likes to really get

54:10into the weeds of this, I really

54:12appreciate that. And I also appreciate

54:13that you're going to come do that with

54:15my constituents on Thursday. Um but I do

54:18have a couple of questions. So, you

54:20mentioned in one of the slides, I don't

54:22remember which one that the vouchers

54:25dropped from a pretty substantial number

54:27to like about 25%. How did that happen?

54:30Um

54:31is it regular turnover or was what

54:34happened?

54:36>> It was really regular turnover as

54:38residents moved out. Um

54:40we move new residents in, whoever the

54:42first applicant.

54:43>> Okay. And and those folks were people

54:45with vouchers were not prioritized or

54:48>> No, they were of course prioritized. We

54:49prioritize every agency. We work with

54:51every agency in the city of Lansing

54:52that's willing to work with us. Um I

54:54don't think there's one that we don't

54:55work with. Many of the properties were

54:57also very low occupied. For example,

54:59Baltic Flats was in the 30% occupancy.

55:02Um we were able to bring that up to 93%

55:04occupancy today. We moved in many

55:06Section 8 residents at all four of the

55:08properties.

55:09>> Okay.

55:09Perfect. Um so, I do have a question. I

55:12think this might be for City Attorney

55:14Benker on the assurances of

55:17affordability. I know that they've made

55:19assurances to us that are going to be in

55:21like our contract for the pilot. Um but

55:24I know that our community has always

55:25been very wary that, you know,

55:28developers say they're going to do

55:29something but they're not going to do

55:30it. Um

55:31but it's all in writing. And so, I want

55:33to make sure that our community knows

55:36how that works.

55:39>> So, when you say affordability, do you

55:40mean where they are setting their in or

55:43their

55:45where they are targeting their rents?

55:46Like how they are setting their rent?

55:47>> Well, so several things, right? So, this

55:49is supposed to last for 15 years at

55:51these prices or at affordability for

55:54folks. But then also they have committed

55:56to go even deeper affordable in some

55:58instances.

55:59Um how do we make sure or how do we as a

56:01city make sure that that actually

56:03happens and they didn't just tell us so

56:04we give them the pilot is what my I what

56:07I want people to understand.

56:08>> Sure. Um so,

56:11very much like in a normal pilot

56:12process,

56:14they

56:15still communicate with Mishda about

56:17everything that's happening. Uh they

56:18communicate with us. They still have to

56:20file with us every year.

56:22Um

56:23their

56:24uh financials essentially, their um

56:27what's the word I'm looking for? Audit.

56:29They have to give us their audit

56:29information. Um

56:32so, and then that gets turned over to

56:33the department. The department reviews

56:34that. Um

56:37and in terms of the agreement, it's a

56:39little bit different, but they have an

56:40agreement with us and there's also a

56:41covenant as to how all this happens that

56:44gets more or less recorded. Um so, then

56:48every year we audit that, audit against

56:51what they have promised and to make sure

56:52that they are I don't know, delivering.

56:55If at any point they stop delivering or

56:57don't deliver or deliver half, for

56:58example, they go back to paying taxes.

57:01Um and they go back to paying taxes in

57:02the amount of whatever they have not

57:04delivered to us.

57:05>> Perfect.

57:06>> I hope that answered your question.

57:07>> Yes.

57:08>> Okay.

57:10Are there other questions?

57:11Councilor Costa.

57:13>> In

57:14uh this is actually for the city

57:15attorney. With the workforce housing

57:18pilot, if

57:20they don't follow through because that

57:22is just a city process, that also can be

57:24revoked, correct?

57:26>> Yeah, so

57:28it it with pilots, it is not so much

57:30that it gets revoked, it's just that

57:32automatic if they aren't delivering it

57:34automatically, they just pay full taxes.

57:36So, if if when the time comes cuz this

57:39happens before July, they give over

57:41their audit,

57:42uh it gets reviewed by the department

57:44and by assessing. Um and if they look at

57:47it and say, "Well, actually you're

57:48you're not renting these at these

57:50rates." Then they get a tax bill and

57:53then we collect the taxes. Um and I

57:57don't think anybody wants that, but it's

57:58not so much that we come back and revoke

58:00the PILOT. It's that they pay full

58:02taxes. So, we get they they don't get

58:04the benefit of the PILOT uh reduction.

58:06>> Sure, but it is doable, correct?

58:08>> Yes. Yeah.

58:10>> Different from a standard PILOT.

58:12>> Um

58:14it's very similar. I mean, it ends up

58:15being very similar. Uh

58:17>> But we can't revoke a standard PILOT,

58:18right?

58:19>> Correct.

58:20>> normal low-income one.

58:22Okay.

58:23Can I jump in?

58:24>> Please.

58:24>> So, so uh this is a workforce PILOT. We

58:28do not have any component. So, a lot of

58:30the PILOTs in the city of Lansing are

58:32LIHTEC, which is administered partly

58:34through MSHDA,

58:36uh which is I think some of the

58:37challenge that you're talking about the

58:38city not having full authority because

58:41MSHDA is also involved. There is no

58:43MSHDA component to this workforce PILOT.

58:45It is simply the city of Lansing. And as

58:47the city attorney mentioned, uh this

58:49agreement will be

58:50uh memorialized in a deed covenant at

58:53these properties.

58:54>> Okay.

58:57No, and I understood that. I I think I

58:58was just trying to get at the difference

59:00to the two um because of uh some of the

59:02questions that were leading up to it. In

59:04In no way am I insinuating that this is

59:08this was just playing out in general.

59:12>> Are there other questions or comments?

59:15Thank you very much. That covers 4

59:16through 7. No, that's our public hearing

59:18for the evening.

59:20>> The The public will now be talking

59:22about. Our first speaker is Rich Howard

59:24followed by Jeremy Matthews.

59:31>> Well, good evening.

59:33Honorable Mayor Shore,

59:35President Spadafore, and the rest of the

59:39esteemed members of the Lansing City

59:40Council.

59:41I am Rich Howard, and I am Associate

59:43State Director for Outreach and

59:46Engagement at AARP Michigan.

59:48And I've been here before talking about

59:52the

59:54difficulty that seniors as well as

59:59everyday citizens have been having with

1:00:02cryptocurrency

1:00:03kiosks.

1:00:05Last year, 2025,

1:00:08nationwide,

1:00:10about $390 million

1:00:14was scammed from Americans.

1:00:17In the state of Michigan, about $12

1:00:19million

1:00:21through the cryptocurrency kiosk.

1:00:24Let me Let me be clear.

1:00:25AARP has no issue with cryptocurrency.

1:00:29It's the tool of the kiosk that's

1:00:31causing um

1:00:34our scammers to have a little bit

1:00:37more of a

1:00:39of of success. And so we're here I'm

1:00:42here representing 1.25 million AARP

1:00:46members to ask that you support

1:00:50agenda item number 20 in providing

1:00:55as well providing regulation and

1:00:58licensure to something that is yet

1:01:01unregulated. And we're

1:01:04very interested in protecting our

1:01:06citizens

1:01:07as are you.

1:01:08Thank you for your time.

1:01:11>> Thank you. Jeremy Matthews followed by

1:01:13Jen Bauer.

1:01:26>> It's kind of scary up here.

1:01:30>> Good evening, Council members. My name

1:01:32is Jeremy Matthews.

1:01:33I am the director of property management

1:01:35for Sim-Tom Management.

1:01:37Uh

1:01:38since June um of 2023, I'm here tonight

1:01:42to ask for your support in the workforce

1:01:44housing pilot applications.

1:01:47In my role at the company, I am

1:01:48responsible for overseeing all property

1:01:51um all of our properties and making sure

1:01:53that we provide quality housing and

1:01:55responsive management to our residents.

1:01:58I also serve on the South Martin Luther

1:02:00King Jr. um Boulevard Corridor

1:02:02Improvement Authority um because I

1:02:04believe that our responsibility extends

1:02:07um beyond just the properties we own. Um

1:02:10we are a part of These properties are

1:02:11part of our neighborhood and we have a

1:02:13responsibility to make them better.

1:02:16Um one example is

1:02:18our commitment to accountability is um

1:02:21there's a relationship we built with the

1:02:22city Ombudsman Officer Joe McDonald. And

1:02:25for the first um when we first started,

1:02:27we held quarterly meetings with Joe to

1:02:29discuss resident concerns and make sure

1:02:32we're addressing issues at our property.

1:02:34As we continue making these

1:02:35improvements, the number of issues

1:02:36declined um to the point where regular

1:02:39meetings were no longer necessary. Um we

1:02:42still remain uh maintain that

1:02:43relationship with him. Uh Joe knows he

1:02:46can call me directly if any issues come

1:02:48up.

1:02:50I think it's an important example of

1:02:52what good property management can

1:02:53accomplish. Um when owners invest in

1:02:56their properties and we respond to our

1:02:58residents, it benefits everyone.

1:03:01Uh residents have a better place to

1:03:03live, neighborhoods become more stable,

1:03:05and the city spends less resources

1:03:07addressing our problems. Uh Sim-Tom

1:03:09Management is headquartered in Lansing,

1:03:11and manages its properties in-house, and

1:03:13has made a long-term commitment to our

1:03:16communities. Um our pilot applications

1:03:18can help us continue work while keeping

1:03:21housing affordable for Lansing

1:03:23residents. I respectfully ask that you

1:03:25support this initiative. Thank you.

1:03:29>> Thank you. Next is Jen Bauer followed by

1:03:32Cherissa Williams.

1:03:42>> Good evening council members. My name is

1:03:44Jen Bauer and I've served as director of

1:03:46finance for Sim Tob Management since

1:03:48February 2024. I'm here tonight to

1:03:51support our workforce housing pilot

1:03:52applications. Before joining Sim Tob

1:03:55Management, I worked in the country club

1:03:56industry where attention to detail,

1:03:58financial accountability, and managing

1:04:01expenses were essential along with a

1:04:03level of hospitality and customer

1:04:05service.

1:04:06I brought that same approach to my work

1:04:08at Sim Tob Management. One of the things

1:04:10I focus on is making sure on-site

1:04:12management teams understand the

1:04:14financial performance of their

1:04:16properties and the role they play in

1:04:18controlling costs.

1:04:21Every month we review financial results

1:04:23with our on-site teams. We look closely

1:04:25at expenses, identify opportunities to

1:04:28operate more efficiently, and work

1:04:30together to make responsible financial

1:04:31decisions. And there's a very simple

1:04:33reason we do that. Every dollar we can

1:04:35save is one less dollar we raise rents.

1:04:39That matters when you're providing

1:04:40quality housing for people while

1:04:41offering the lowest rents in Lansing.

1:04:44Operating costs continue to rise often

1:04:46by 5 to 10% annually. Insurance,

1:04:49utilities, maintenance, other expenses,

1:04:52they don't stop increasing just because

1:04:54we're trying to keep rents low.

1:04:56We can't control every expense, but we

1:04:58work hard to manage the ones that we

1:04:59can.

1:05:00That's why these pilot applications are

1:05:02so important. They provide greater

1:05:04predictability in one of our significant

1:05:06operating expenses, allowing us to plan

1:05:08for the future, continue investing in

1:05:10our properties, and avoiding rent

1:05:12increases for our residents.

1:05:15Our goal is to operate responsibly while

1:05:16keeping rents affordable for the working

1:05:18individuals and families who live there.

1:05:20I hope you'll support these applications

1:05:22and help us continue that commitment.

1:05:25Thank you.

1:05:29>> Uh thank you.

1:05:32Next is Sharissa Williams followed by

1:05:34Susan Kankro.

1:05:43>> My name is Sharissa Williams and I'm a

1:05:45lifelong resident of Lansing. I

1:05:47currently serve as the community manager

1:05:48at Pacific Flats located at 1317 East

1:05:51Kalamazoo Avenue, I'm sorry, East

1:05:52Kalamazoo Street, not Avenue, a role

1:05:54that I have held for just short of 3

1:05:56years.

1:05:57In addition to working with residents

1:05:58every day, I am also a Simtob Management

1:06:00tenant.

1:06:01For about 2 years ago, my family and I

1:06:02moved into Carolina Flats at 43, I'm

1:06:05sorry, 2411 Pleasant Grove Road, we

1:06:07moved. I'm writing to express my strong

1:06:09support for Simtob Management's pilot

1:06:11applications for its Lansing properties.

1:06:13I grew up in Lansing and I have seen how

1:06:15property neglect can affect

1:06:16neighborhoods and families.

1:06:18My experience working at at Pacific

1:06:19Flats gave me a front row view of the

1:06:21investment Simtob Management has made

1:06:23and how quality affordable housing

1:06:25improves people's lives.

1:06:27That experience is the reason I chose to

1:06:29move my own family into Carolina Flats.

1:06:31As a parent, choosing where to live is a

1:06:33very important decision. The Carolina

1:06:35Flats location has been a great fit for

1:06:36my family. The nearby schools, parks,

1:06:38and the Boys and Girls Club provide

1:06:40positive opportunities for my children.

1:06:42My experience working at Simtob

1:06:44Management and seeing their commitment

1:06:45to safe affordable housing gave me the

1:06:47confidence that this was the right place

1:06:48for us.

1:06:49From both a professional and personal

1:06:51perspective, I believe Simtob Management

1:06:53has shown a genuine long-term commitment

1:06:55to these properties and the city of

1:06:57Lansing.

1:06:58The pilot will allow them to keep

1:06:59housing affordable for Lansing families

1:07:01like mine. I respectfully urge your

1:07:03support of Simtob Management's pilot

1:07:05applications.

1:07:06These approvals will help ensure that

1:07:08these properties remain clean, safe, and

1:07:10affordable to residents who need it in

1:07:12our community. Thank you for your time

1:07:13and consideration.

1:07:15>> Thank you. Next we have Susan Cancrow

1:07:18followed by Zachary Sperlock.

1:07:31>> Good evening.

1:07:33Uh I'm Susan Cancrow. I am the executive

1:07:37director at Advent House Ministries and

1:07:40I do not work for Simtob.

1:07:42As I know that we've had a a good line

1:07:44of of the workers

1:07:46for a good company.

1:07:48But uh I have not had that pleasure, but

1:07:51I've had the pleasure of working with

1:07:54Simtob, with Brad,

1:07:56and with his staff over a number of

1:07:58years.

1:08:00As some of you may know, I've been at

1:08:01Advent House for 32 years, almost 33.

1:08:06So I've seen the properties that were in

1:08:08poor shape that were renovated and

1:08:11restored because of Simtob's efforts.

1:08:16And I will say this because we are also

1:08:18at Advent House, the HARA, which is the

1:08:20Housing Assessment Resource Agency for

1:08:22Lansing, East Lansing, and Ingham.

1:08:24Most of our work is done in Lansing.

1:08:27We need landlords. We need to support

1:08:30landlords.

1:08:32I know some individual landlords who

1:08:34struggle,

1:08:35but they manage to keep their properties

1:08:37in good shape. They need to be rewarded.

1:08:40I know some landlords who have resources

1:08:43beyond anything I'll ever have, who

1:08:44don't do a darn thing with their

1:08:46properties,

1:08:47and I think when I say their names, I

1:08:49get a chuckle or a an eye roll

1:08:52from the people who know what they do.

1:08:55They should not even have property.

1:08:57But there are good people out there. We

1:08:59need to support them. So if that means

1:09:02allowing for a tax credit or reduction

1:09:05in taxes so that

1:09:08a property can continue to grow and a

1:09:11company can continue to do that good

1:09:13work, we need it.

1:09:15We are in a housing crisis.

1:09:19All of us need to figure out what we can

1:09:21do as a city, as individuals, as

1:09:24businesses

1:09:25to make this better.

1:09:28And thank God, I will tell you because

1:09:30we ran the uh

1:09:32warming center. We didn't lose anybody

1:09:34last winter.

1:09:36And we didn't lose anybody because we

1:09:37did have good housing when people could

1:09:39be housed.

1:09:41And we had a place for them to go when

1:09:43they couldn't.

1:09:45We need to improve the housing. We need

1:09:47to make it more accessible. And one

1:09:49other thing, you asked about vouchers.

1:09:52Mishda is the state that had the most

1:09:54vouchers in the country until they were

1:09:56cut.

1:09:58We got many, many fewer vouchers this

1:10:00year.

1:10:02It's tough.

1:10:04But a good landlord is our base. So, I

1:10:07really encourage you to support Sim Tab

1:10:10in their work in this effort. Thank you.

1:10:14>> Thank you. Next, we have Zachary

1:10:16Spurlock followed by Ivan Drosty.

1:10:30>> Hello and good evening, Mayor Shore and

1:10:32council members.

1:10:33I'm here tonight to raise some concerns

1:10:35about the payment in lieu of taxes or

1:10:38pilot program.

1:10:40Uh I don't think it comes as a surprise

1:10:42that I support true working-class

1:10:44affordable housing. But affordable

1:10:46housing can't just mean it's cheap. It

1:10:49also has to mean safe, habitable housing

1:10:52that stays that way in a continuously

1:10:54verifiable way.

1:10:56When we offer a property owner a

1:10:57substantial tax benefit, the public

1:11:00deserves more than promises in return.

1:11:03We've seen what promises and

1:11:04behind-the-scenes handshakes get tenants

1:11:06throughout the city. They get screwed.

1:11:09This is where, to be quite frank with

1:11:11you, this is where I was going to talk

1:11:12about the lawsuit against CHTA and why

1:11:14it happened, but the presenters beat me

1:11:17to it in an insanely informative and

1:11:20very transparent way.

1:11:22So, wherever you guys are, kudos kudos

1:11:24to you both.

1:11:26Uh it is very rare that I am left

1:11:28somewhat speechless on topics I'm very

1:11:30passionate about.

1:11:32Uh and I kind of had to change my entire

1:11:34comments for tonight. So, thank you

1:11:35guys.

1:11:36Um so, while I do understand that CHTA

1:11:39has been making amazing strides in our

1:11:41city, this pilot program isn't just for

1:11:44the good property owners.

1:11:46Uh before looking at approving any pilot

1:11:48applicants, I urge council to require

1:11:50stricter, legally binding, and more

1:11:53comprehensive safeguards for all pilot

1:11:55program applicants. Current inspection

1:11:58and rental compliance records, clear

1:11:59affordability requirements, specifying

1:12:02the number of restricted units, income

1:12:04limits, maximum rents and utility

1:12:06allowances, annual compliance reports,

1:12:09independent audits, and impactful

1:12:11penalties or payment provisions if the

1:12:13owner fails to meet those obligations,

1:12:15some of which uh city attorney did touch

1:12:17on earlier. So, thank you.

1:12:20I am glad to see that there is a wider

1:12:21conversation about these properties,

1:12:23including council members taking an

1:12:25active means to get these conversations

1:12:27to the public because an applicant's

1:12:28paperwork should never be the end-all

1:12:31be-all measure of whether these

1:12:32buildings are being maintained

1:12:34responsibly.

1:12:35I also want to thank CHTA again for

1:12:37being here today to give their history

1:12:38and speak on their positive impact. And

1:12:41please note that my recommendations

1:12:42tonight are for the grander pilot

1:12:44program in general, not specifically the

1:12:47line items tonight.

1:12:48CHTA aside, management companies that

1:12:51apply for public assistance for their

1:12:53property should be willing to accept

1:12:55public accountability in return.

1:12:57So, while I am in support of passing

1:12:59line items 4 through 7, in general, I do

1:13:02not think that we should grant multi

1:13:03years of tax relief on the strength of

1:13:06promises and perceived goodwill alone,

1:13:08nor should we grant such long terms if

1:13:10we're already struggling to manage code

1:13:12violations in general throughout the

1:13:14city.

1:13:15Uh require verifiable evidence,

1:13:17establish enforceable conditions, and

1:13:19protect Lansing's residents and

1:13:21taxpayers approving before approving

1:13:24these agreements. And again, seriously,

1:13:27it never happens. I was left totally

1:13:29speechless by that presentation. So,

1:13:31thank you for that.

1:13:33>> Thank you. Next, we have Ivan Drastic

1:13:35followed by Nicholas Sandy.

1:13:45>> Ivan Drastic, Ward 3. Um typically when

1:13:48pilot applications come across your

1:13:49desk, it's for proposals for uh new

1:13:52developments or new redevelopments.

1:13:55And um you know, the argument typically

1:13:56goes that

1:13:59um

1:14:00the project is not financially possible

1:14:01without the the pilot, and so it's not

1:14:04really fair to talk about it as a tax

1:14:06abatement because we're comparing either

1:14:09some taxes or no taxes at all.

1:14:12Um but that's not the case with these uh

1:14:14pilots that we're considering here

1:14:15today, right? These are for

1:14:17um projects that are ongoing. Um the

1:14:20property's already partially renovated,

1:14:22and um they're asking for a pilot so

1:14:25that they can finish this renovation.

1:14:27So, this is genuinely a tax cut.

1:14:30Um and I think that that changes the

1:14:32calculus quite a bit compared to other

1:14:34uh pilot applications that you've

1:14:36reviewed. So, I hope you consider that

1:14:38as you decide how to vote.

1:14:41And um

1:14:42look, if if this body is interested in

1:14:45subsidizing housing, I think that that's

1:14:47fantastic.

1:14:48We're in the midst of an ongoing housing

1:14:49crisis. We certainly need more housing

1:14:52in this city.

1:14:53Um

1:14:55but

1:14:56if we are going to subsidize housing, I

1:14:59would like to see it done in a way that

1:15:01affords the public more agency in the

1:15:03process.

1:15:05Um you know, with a pilot, we don't get

1:15:07to decide which properties get renovated

1:15:11or where new buildings get erected. We

1:15:14don't get to decide how large the

1:15:16buildings are, how many units there are,

1:15:18what the rent should be. Um right, the

1:15:21the developers get to decide all that

1:15:22stuff. And then they're entitled to all

1:15:25the profits.

1:15:27And um you know, we can draw a box

1:15:29around it and and provide some outlines

1:15:33that they have to work within and then

1:15:35we get to give a thumbs up or thumbs

1:15:36down at this meeting. Um but that's

1:15:38really it, right?

1:15:40Um so, you know, personally, I don't

1:15:42really think that we ought to be

1:15:43subsidizing workforce housing, not as a

1:15:45priority at least, right? Um I think

1:15:47that if we're going to subsidize

1:15:48housing, we should be doing that um

1:15:51for our poorest and most vulnerable

1:15:54population.

1:15:56And my concern is that we are

1:16:01you know, with these pilots, only

1:16:02further entrenching ourselves into a

1:16:06system

1:16:07whereby the only way any of us get to

1:16:11sleep with a roof over our head tonight

1:16:13is on the condition that a rich person

1:16:16gets to make a profit.

1:16:18And I think that that

1:16:21uh system is is kind of the main reason

1:16:23why we find ourselves in this problem to

1:16:25begin with. So, I would really like to

1:16:27see us try to find solutions

1:16:30that get us away

1:16:31from this and not closer to it. Thank

1:16:34you.

1:16:35>> Thank you. Next is Nicholas Zandy

1:16:37followed by Darren.

1:16:42>> Hello. Um this is Nick Zanny, president

1:16:45of the Old Erie Neighborhood

1:16:46Association.

1:16:47Um, first, uh,

1:16:49I guess hats off to Mr. DeLine for being

1:16:52reappointed to Board of Ethics. But, on

1:16:56another note, I'm going to be speaking

1:16:58on the, uh,

1:17:00um, cryptocurrency machine license.

1:17:03And I want to speak about this with the

1:17:07historical context with the city, and I

1:17:09know it's weird that I'm going to have

1:17:11to bore people with a, uh, history

1:17:13lecture, but

1:17:15uh, just a couple of centuries ago, we

1:17:17were having a similar debate on

1:17:20currency, and that was through whether

1:17:22or not we should be backed up by gold or

1:17:25silver or any, um, mineral, raw minerals

1:17:29at all.

1:17:31Um,

1:17:32and

1:17:33I want to remind you that Turner and

1:17:36Dodge, despite being of opposite

1:17:38political parties, one was a Democrat,

1:17:40one was a Republican, um,

1:17:43not necessarily in that order, they but

1:17:46they have both were diametrically

1:17:48opposed to the gold standard and were

1:17:50very much in favor of the idea of at

1:17:52least either free silver or green

1:17:54backing.

1:17:55And I will come out and declare that I

1:17:58am officially a green backer in this

1:18:00case because I do not believe we should

1:18:03be backed up by an online digital

1:18:05currency, and those kiosks are a danger

1:18:10to us because, as someone has said

1:18:12before, um, it's they're so unregulated

1:18:15that they just lead to people literally

1:18:17use losing their money thinking that

1:18:19it's an ATM and they just get scammed

1:18:21out of them. So, yes, I do believe we

1:18:23should have licenses and regulations for

1:18:25now, but further than that, we should at

1:18:28least ask Congress to regulate all

1:18:30cryptocurrencies

1:18:32to

1:18:33specifically online usage and nowhere

1:18:38else because

1:18:40crypto is a digital currency and it

1:18:42should not be a physical currency.

1:18:45And as William Jennings Bryan once said,

1:18:49um thou shall not crucify humankind on a

1:18:53cross of gold, thou shall not crucify

1:18:56humankind on a cross of crypto. That is

1:19:00all I'm going to say and I'll yield the

1:19:01rest of my time.

1:19:03>> Thank you. Next is Darren followed by

1:19:05Chelsea Ransom.

1:19:15>> One thing I'm realizing is that there's

1:19:17a communication hiccup with some Falcon

1:19:19City leadership. Um as someone with

1:19:21ADHD, autism,

1:19:23pretty substantial dissociation and

1:19:24regressive burnout and some speech

1:19:26impediments, articulation has always

1:19:29been a personal challenge for me.

1:19:31People from different cultures,

1:19:32backgrounds, neurotypes, and ideologies

1:19:35can swing and miss each other

1:19:37because they understand the world in

1:19:38different ways and communicate from a

1:19:40different understanding and thus aren't

1:19:41able to meet each other.

1:19:44We're practically speaking different

1:19:45languages and it's unfortunate, really.

1:19:47I think that the breakdown in

1:19:48communication might be the issue of why

1:19:49discussing matters of surveillance or

1:19:51even encampment sweeps.

1:19:54Other municipalities have canceled

1:19:55contracts with companies providing ALPRs

1:19:58or have stopped targeting unhoused

1:19:59people without any issue. I think we all

1:20:01want to make the community safer. We

1:20:03just understand public safety a little

1:20:04bit differently.

1:20:07It is essential to have a proper

1:20:08community-wide conversation about what

1:20:10public safety is prior to implementing

1:20:11new technologies.

1:20:13My grandmother was a professional

1:20:14photographer who followed around

1:20:16followed us around constantly taking

1:20:17pictures for her giant photo collection.

1:20:20I spent 11 years freelancing in the

1:20:22media with extensive travel. I've

1:20:24collaborated with at least 350

1:20:26photographers and over a thousand

1:20:28multimedia artists.

1:20:30I've been published on five continents

1:20:31in magazines, newsletters, books, and

1:20:33I've had collaborations hung at hundreds

1:20:35of galleries worldwide. Most of my jobs

1:20:38over the last decade have been in

1:20:39healthcare and government facilities. I

1:20:41always assume that I'm on camera, and if

1:20:43I'm aware of and have consented to the

1:20:45imaging and how it's stored and used, it

1:20:47is of no offense to me.

1:20:49But if I am not aware or have not

1:20:50consented, this is when the trust breaks

1:20:53down.

1:20:54This is when I might feel violated.

1:20:55Transparency and consent are vital to

1:20:57building community trust with these

1:20:58types of security measures.

1:21:00I would like to acknowledge the Ways and

1:21:02Means Committee and everyone who is at

1:21:03the most recent meeting for addressing

1:21:05the issue of how grant money is used,

1:21:07and I look forward to seeing you work

1:21:08with municipalities who have removed or

1:21:10banned mass surveillance technology on

1:21:13creating a full ordinance designed to

1:21:15limit and eventually end its use in

1:21:16Lansing. Thank you.

1:21:19>> Thank you. Next is Chelsea Ransom Ransom

1:21:21followed by Loretta Stanaway.

1:21:28>> Hello. Um I also want to thank the

1:21:30Committee on Ways and Means for the new

1:21:32and improved language in the Auto Theft

1:21:34Prevention Authority Grant Resolution.

1:21:36Um it was a beautiful thing to sit in

1:21:38that conference room last week and see

1:21:40collaboration between Council, the

1:21:43administration, the community, and the

1:21:45police department. So, I have the utmost

1:21:48faith that our City Council is going to

1:21:50do the right thing and vote yay on this

1:21:52resolution tonight. So, I am looking

1:21:53forward to seeing how it's implemented

1:21:56um to promote community-based safety

1:21:58that is proactive rather than reactive.

1:22:01Um

1:22:02I think of that it's a step in the right

1:22:03direction as Council Member Poli Van

1:22:05Glou said after the data center

1:22:07moratorium was passed. I believe it was

1:22:11I don't like to build the plane while

1:22:13I'm flying it.

1:22:15Love that phrase, and I feel like with

1:22:17this resolution tonight, what we're

1:22:18doing is we're putting some landing gear

1:22:20on this ALPR plane so that we can get it

1:22:24down on the ground. So, thank you again

1:22:26for that. Um just also want to say that

1:22:29I really appreciate seeing some

1:22:30regulation being brought to

1:22:31cryptocurrency in our city because

1:22:34I don't really see it as a currency. I

1:22:36think that it's a scam and these

1:22:38machines will dispense nothing but

1:22:39regret. It's only a question of how long

1:22:42it takes someone to realize that regret

1:22:43is all that they got. So, thank you for

1:22:45bringing some regulation to that

1:22:47technology in our city as well.

1:22:49Thank you again. Have a good night.

1:22:52>> Thank you. Next is Loretta Stanaway and

1:22:54she's the final speaker.

1:23:01>> Okay, you know my stance on pilots and

1:23:04tax breaks, Oprah's, and whatever. But I

1:23:06would like to uh just make two points

1:23:07tonight in regards to the Sim Tab and

1:23:09other uh pilot requests. First, all

1:23:12businesses are in business to make

1:23:14money. We know that. They're not

1:23:15nonprofits. So, the question becomes

1:23:18whether it's a 10%, a 4%, a 6%, a 2%,

1:23:21whatever the pilot level is,

1:23:23how much profit is enough for the

1:23:25citizens to bear on behalf of the profit

1:23:28maker?

1:23:29And then secondly, uh you know, you're

1:23:31looking at um

1:23:34I lost my train of thought. Um

1:23:40I lost it. I'll come back in the next

1:23:41session.

1:23:44>> Thank you. That was our final speaker

1:23:46for this session and uh the referral of

1:23:49the public hearings items, item three.

1:23:52>> Um public safety.

1:23:54>> And items

1:23:56um four through seven.

1:23:58>> Development and planning.

1:23:59>> Okay. We are to the consent agenda.

1:24:03>> Vice President Palvanoglou.

1:24:06>> Thank you, President Spadafora. Um I

1:24:07believe that we have um some items.

1:24:10>> Yes.

1:24:10>> Yeah. So, I will call on Councilwoman

1:24:12Carter if that's okay or

1:24:14>> Yeah, absolutely.

1:24:16>> Thank you. Um I am uh pulling item 15,

1:24:20the Grant Acceptance Automobile Theft

1:24:22Prevention Authority, ATPA. Department

1:24:26item. Just to just share a little bit of

1:24:28more information that came out of the

1:24:30Committee of Ways and Means on October

1:24:3215th. It has been addressed already in

1:24:35public comment today, but just wanted to

1:24:38share a little bit of additional

1:24:39information for those who were not in

1:24:40attendance.

1:24:42This grant agreement does list the

1:24:44expenditures in its full entity and was

1:24:46submitted to the state back in June, so

1:24:48that includes vehicle lease, field

1:24:51operations,

1:24:52hermit cam, protective vest, travel and

1:24:55training,

1:24:56office operations, cell phone, office

1:24:59supplies, and so forth

1:25:01with 37% usage requiring a 63% match.

1:25:05And again, this is for non-flock

1:25:07compatible equipment. And I do want to

1:25:09also share that this is also including

1:25:12wages and fringes as well. But the two

1:25:15pieces that was very

1:25:17enlightening and to add into the

1:25:19resolution was we've added a couple

1:25:22pieces that will really speak to the

1:25:24flock

1:25:26piece that was brought to public

1:25:28comment. So, I want to just make sure I

1:25:30inform everyone that the resolution has

1:25:33added two pieces, two forms

1:25:35in the resolution that acceptance of

1:25:37these grant funds is conditioned upon no

1:25:39portion of the grant funds or local

1:25:41match being expended on automated

1:25:44license plate readers ALPR technology

1:25:47including related equipment, software,

1:25:49installation, maintenance, or data

1:25:52services as well as that the City

1:25:53Council requests that the Lansing Police

1:25:55Department provide the final report of

1:25:57use of funds which is provided to the

1:25:59grantor to the Committee on Ways and

1:26:02Means for review. So, adding those

1:26:04pieces, my time is up.

1:26:08Adding those pieces, I wanted to make

1:26:09sure that that is publicly shared that

1:26:12came out of Committee of Ways and Means.

1:26:13So, thank you to all those that came as

1:26:16participants in sharing their public

1:26:18comment and also to President Spadafore

1:26:21for these two resolutions. So, thank you

1:26:23again.

1:26:24>> Thank you, Councilmember

1:26:25Vice President Pelavin.

1:26:27>> Thank you. And just another note

1:26:30>> You're fine.

1:26:32You're fine.

1:26:33>> Okay.

1:26:34To pull item number 17 from the consent

1:26:37agenda. It turns out that this has to do

1:26:39with a fee for virtual currency machine

1:26:42license, but we're not able to move on

1:26:43this until after we move on the item

1:26:46that comes before that,

1:26:48setting the regulations for virtual

1:26:50currency machines. So, after pulling

1:26:52item number 15 and 17

1:26:55then I would move the amended consent

1:26:58agenda.

1:26:59>> Thank you very much. All those in favor,

1:27:00please say I.

1:27:01>> I.

1:27:02>> All those opposed, motion carries.

1:27:04Okay. We are now to item 15, the

1:27:07automobile theft prevention grant.

1:27:11Councilmember and there's no time this

1:27:12time.

1:27:14No time.

1:27:15>> I think we I've covered it all, but this

1:27:17is again the grant for a total of

1:27:20246,783

1:27:23with 86,374.05

1:27:26to ATPA portion with 63% of 160,408.95

1:27:31match. And I already spoke to how the

1:27:34summary of the grant purpose will be

1:27:35utilized.

1:27:37>> Thank you very much. Is there further

1:27:38discussion? I will remind the body this

1:27:40is a six-item vote. Six-vote item.

1:27:43See no further discussion. All those in

1:27:44favor, please say I. I. Opposed?

1:27:47Motion carries.

1:27:50Okay. We are to ordinances for

1:27:53introduction and setting of public

1:27:54hearings.

1:27:56We have an ordinance of the city of

1:27:58Lansing, Michigan to amend section

1:27:591310.13 of the sign ordinance being part

1:28:0213 title two of the Lansing codified

1:28:04ordinances to remove references to

1:28:06zoning districts that no longer exist,

1:28:08modify the minimum setbacks, allowable

1:28:10height, and total size of free-standing

1:28:11signs in certain zoning districts

1:28:14and regulate free-standing signs near

1:28:15driveways in certain zoning districts.

1:28:17The ordinance is read a first time by

1:28:18its title and referred to the Committee

1:28:19on Development and Planning.

1:28:21>> Council Member Navarro-Martinez.

1:28:22>> Yes, so um it is my understanding that

1:28:25we have to introduce the substitute um

1:28:28resolution first or

1:28:31>> Yes.

1:28:31>> Yes.

1:28:32To uh set the hearing for

1:28:35um amending section 1310.13

1:28:39free-standing signs and modifying the

1:28:40regulation

1:28:41um for November 16th, 2026 at 7:00 p.m.

1:28:46>> That's proper motion. And just as a

1:28:48further explanation, we received notice

1:28:50that because of the tight window between

1:28:51our two council meetings this this month

1:28:54be put to put 15 days notice in the

1:28:56paper, we would need to move the date to

1:28:57the 16th. So, that's why we're changing

1:28:58this tonight. In case those of you are

1:29:00curious why we're moving the hearing out

1:29:02to November 16th.

1:29:04So, the on the question of adopting the

1:29:06substitute, all those in favor, please

1:29:07say I.

1:29:08>> I.

1:29:09>> All those opposed? Motion carries. The

1:29:11substitute is before us. Vice Council

1:29:13Member Navarro-Martinez.

1:29:15>> Yes, so this is to set the hearing for

1:29:1711/16/2026

1:29:19for amending section 1310.13

1:29:23um

1:29:24for free-standing signs and modifying

1:29:26the regulation. This is going to amend

1:29:28the section to

1:29:29um update to zones that we no longer

1:29:32have in our code and also a couple of

1:29:34more substantive changes about the size

1:29:36of free-standing signs.

1:29:39>> Thank you very much. There's a motion

1:29:41before us. Is there any discussion?

1:29:43Seeing none, all those in favor, please

1:29:44say I.

1:29:45>> I.

1:29:46>> All opposed? Motion carries.

1:29:49>> Okay, we are two ordinances for passage.

1:29:52Um

1:29:53Item 19, we have an ordinance of the

1:29:54City of Lansing, Michigan to amend

1:29:56chapter 230 of the Lansing Codified

1:29:58Ordinances by adding chapter 230 section

1:30:00230.02 to allocate a portion of those

1:30:03funds from the City of Lansing general

1:30:05fund budget dedicated to basic human

1:30:07services to provide for supportive

1:30:09housing services is read a second time

1:30:11by its title. Was reported from the

1:30:13committee on ways and means and is on

1:30:15the order for immediate passage.

1:30:17>> Council member Carter.

1:30:18>> Thank you, President Spadafore. Um yes,

1:30:20so this was brought to

1:30:24uh ways and means, but it also we had a

1:30:25presentation and public hearing that was

1:30:27set back in September on the 14th. And

1:30:29just to share, there was a couple of

1:30:32different amendments that came out of

1:30:33that presentation and also public

1:30:35comment. So there was a uh the one of

1:30:37the larger changes within the the uh

1:30:40ordinance is one of the sections under

1:30:45the first section

1:30:46number three, uh we decided to add the

1:30:49accessibility and ADA related

1:30:51modifications, including reasonable

1:30:53physical modifications or improvements

1:30:55necessary to improve accessibility for a

1:30:58person with a disability, including

1:31:00modifications that support safe access

1:31:02to and safe use of at home. And so with

1:31:06that amended, we had some further

1:31:09discussion in ways and means. And with

1:31:11that, that is what I have for the

1:31:13amending chapter 230 by adding section

1:31:15230.02 to allocate funding for the

1:31:17supportive housing services. Oh, excuse

1:31:20me, I'm going to actually make that

1:31:22correction, safe and secure housing

1:31:23initiative.

1:31:24>> Thank you. This is proper motion for us

1:31:27to discuss.

1:31:30Seeing now this is a roll call vote,

1:31:31will the clerk please

1:31:33uh

1:31:33call the roll?

1:31:36>> Council member Carter.

1:31:38>> Yes.

1:31:39>> Council member

1:31:41Cost.

1:31:43>> Yes.

1:31:44>> Council member Martinez.

1:31:45>> Yes.

1:31:46>> Council member Navarros-Martinez.

1:31:48>> Yes.

1:31:48>> Um Council member Polivanoglu.

1:31:50>> Yes.

1:31:51>> Council member Spadafore.

1:31:52>> Yes.

1:31:53>> 6 yes, 0 nays, the ordinance is adopted.

1:31:55>> Thank you very much.

1:31:57>> Uh we have

1:31:59next item 20 is an ordinance of the city

1:32:03of Lansing, Michigan to add chapter 873

1:32:06sections 873

1:32:08.01 to 873.11 to the codified ordinances

1:32:11of the city of Lansing to provide for

1:32:13licensing procedures and regulations for

1:32:15virtual currency machines to include

1:32:17requirements for operators and providers

1:32:19to give disclosures and warnings to

1:32:20customers to regulate transactions with

1:32:22new customers and set penalties for

1:32:24operators and providers who violate this

1:32:26ordinance.

1:32:27The ordinance is read a second time by

1:32:29its title, was referred from the

1:32:30committee on diversity, equity, and

1:32:33inclusion and is on the order for media

1:32:34passage.

1:32:35>> Councilmember Cost, anything to add?

1:32:37>> I would move

1:32:39the resolution or the ordinance.

1:32:41>> It is a proper motion. Any discussion

1:32:42from the council?

1:32:44Seeing none, if the clerk would please

1:32:45call the roll.

1:32:46Councilmember Cost.

1:32:47>> Yes.

1:32:48>> Councilmember Martinez.

1:32:50>> Yes.

1:32:50>> Councilmember Navarro-Martinez.

1:32:52>> Yes.

1:32:52>> Councilmember Pelivanoglu.

1:32:53>> Yes.

1:32:54>> Councilmember Spadafore.

1:32:55>> Yes.

1:32:55>> Councilmember Carter.

1:32:56>> Yes.

1:32:57>> 6 yay, 0 nay, the ordinance is adopted.

1:33:00And now back to item 17, the associated

1:33:04fee with the ordinance just adopted.

1:33:06>> Councilmember Cost.

1:33:10>> So, this would be the fee that we are

1:33:11setting for the currency machine and I

1:33:13don't have it in front of me, but we did

1:33:15set the

1:33:16um the fee at the last

1:33:19um

1:33:21meeting.

1:33:23And I believe it was

1:33:26was it 35 or 55?

1:33:29>> Councilmember

1:33:30>> Pelivanoglu.

1:33:31>> I checked my notes.

1:33:33>> So,

1:33:34>> 75 to apply, 35 per criminal background

1:33:37check.

1:33:37>> Thank you.

1:33:40So, with that being willfully

1:33:41unprepared, I will move the resolution.

1:33:44>> Well, I got locked out of my my packet,

1:33:46so I couldn't get there either.

1:33:48>> Well, there you go.

1:33:49>> Uh thank you. That is a proper motion.

1:33:51Would all those in favor please say I?

1:33:54>> I.

1:33:55>> All opposed?

1:33:56Motion carries.

1:33:58>> Okay, then we are to

1:34:03Speaker registration for public comment.

1:34:06Uh if you need to sign in uh

1:34:09to speak and have not already done so,

1:34:12we will give you one more minute to sign

1:34:13in with Maggie in the back.

1:34:15And with that, we are to the referral

1:34:18items.

1:34:19>> Vice President Pelvanoglu.

1:34:21>> Thank you. I move that all items be

1:34:22considered as being read in full and the

1:34:24proper referrals be made by President

1:34:26Spadafore.

1:34:27>> That is a proper motion. All those in

1:34:29favor, please say I.

1:34:30>> I.

1:34:31>> All opposed? Motion carries.

1:34:33Uh from the clerk, minutes of boards and

1:34:34commissions.

1:34:35>> Placed on file.

1:34:36>> Affidavit of Michael Lynn Jr.

1:34:37>> Ethics board.

1:34:39>> Uh appointment items from the mayor, the

1:34:41appointment of Christopher Buck to the

1:34:43Downtown Lansing Inc. Board.

1:34:45>> Development and

1:34:47Hold on, I lost my spot.

1:34:49Development and planning. Yeah.

1:34:50>> Uh two items on amending chapter

1:34:54887

1:34:57uh payment in lieu of taxes for

1:34:59Brightwood Crossing, although I believe

1:35:01the attorney said it's a different

1:35:02chapter. Is that the one you were

1:35:03talking about?

1:35:03>> Uh yes.

1:35:05>> It's not chapter 87, but it's still the

1:35:07same topic.

1:35:08>> Both to development and planning.

1:35:11>> And

1:35:13we have three traffic control orders,

1:35:15one to regulate parking on Derby Drive,

1:35:17one regulate parking on West Ionia, and

1:35:19one to install a stop stop sign on State

1:35:22Street at Dale Ford Ave.

1:35:23>> Uh city operations.

1:35:25>> Uh fee, monthly parking permit at lot

1:35:28eight.

1:35:29>> Ways and means.

1:35:30>> Donation acceptance uh police

1:35:32department's

1:35:34National Indigenous Peoples Day

1:35:35celebration.

1:35:36>> Ways and means.

1:35:37>> Two items on orders to make safe or

1:35:39demolish to the owners of 1606 Rio Road.

1:35:43>> Public safety.

1:35:44>> And we have uh two items on the rezoning

1:35:48and two items on the special land use,

1:35:51both on 505 North Pennsylvania Avenue to

1:35:55allow for a sheltered care facility.

1:35:58>> All four to development and planning and

1:36:00the planning commission.

1:36:04>> All right, with that we are to public

1:36:07comment on

1:36:08>> Um Mr. Clerk, we need a motion to excuse

1:36:10the absent

1:36:10>> sorry.

1:36:11Thank you.

1:36:12>> Is there anyone like I make a motion to

1:36:14excuse absent members? Vice President

1:36:15Pelvanigo.

1:36:16>> Thank you. I move to excuse council

1:36:18members Hussein and Garza from this

1:36:19evening's meeting.

1:36:21>> Thank you. All those in favor, please

1:36:22say I.

1:36:23>> I.

1:36:24>> All opposed? Motion carries.

1:36:27>> Okay, we have Darren followed by Chase

1:36:30Chelsea Ransom.

1:36:31>> Unless there are remarks by council

1:36:32members.

1:36:36It's election season. It's election

1:36:37season.

1:36:41We good? Everyone good? We're all good.

1:36:42All right. Darren.

1:36:47>> Darren.

1:36:47>> 78 degrees up here.

1:36:50>> Chris, you have a job.

1:36:54>> Wake up.

1:36:58>> So, I'd like to be the Crudités I have

1:37:00and offer you some trinkets for holiday

1:37:02um for Chris Swope to pass along.

1:37:05Um I came from a conservative religious

1:37:07family and am very much an animist. I

1:37:09was raised with and still value All

1:37:11Souls' Day and All Saints' Day, but I've

1:37:13actually never celebrated Halloween. So,

1:37:15I don't know how it's supposed to work.

1:37:16Um trick or treat.

1:37:19Um

1:37:21I'd like to address Mayor Shore

1:37:22directly. Um recently um during a

1:37:25carpool I was in a young woman pointed

1:37:27out your old house and he told us she

1:37:29told us about this time years ago when

1:37:31she was a young child and

1:37:34she wandered off and got lost and then

1:37:35she saw you outside and she walked up to

1:37:38you crying and asked you for help.

1:37:40And then you walked this young woman

1:37:41home.

1:37:43Apparently, once upon a time there was a

1:37:44part of you that was happy to help

1:37:46people.

1:37:48There has been this Ms. Nadia Sellers

1:37:49who's been coming to meetings um

1:37:51advocating for a Ms. Washington and it

1:37:53appears that there has been no help for

1:37:55Ms. Washington's unpleasant situation.

1:37:57Now, I don't personally know them. I've

1:37:59never really talked to them, but I have

1:38:00seen them here multiple times.

1:38:02If you're unable to or unwilling to

1:38:05effectively resolve this matter

1:38:06yourself, would you please delegate that

1:38:08her situation to someone who can? If you

1:38:10haven't already gotten that ball

1:38:11rolling, could you please do so? That

1:38:12would be really fantastic.

1:38:14Um next I'd like to clear up some

1:38:16confusion. I've been picking on

1:38:18Councilman Hussein a fair bit lately and

1:38:20some of you have asked if I've been

1:38:21hitting on him, which I was not. Um

1:38:24if it hasn't been clear, my rainbow is

1:38:27very much the whole prism color set and

1:38:29I'd like to apologize to Adam who is not

1:38:31here. I did not realize I was coming

1:38:33across that way. He has, however, been a

1:38:35great sport.

1:38:36Councilman Cost,

1:38:38your jealousy has been adorable and you

1:38:40know, I I actually do genuinely

1:38:41appreciate your presence as my council

1:38:43representative. Um

1:38:45you notice so many of the smaller

1:38:46details that are so intrinsic to this

1:38:48community. It probably comes from you

1:38:49walking around so much.

1:38:52The time that you spend researching, the

1:38:53difficult and direct questions that you

1:38:55ask, and your time connecting with local

1:38:58residents is exactly what I want in

1:39:00local elected leadership.

1:39:03Now, I'll I'll pick on you at some

1:39:04point, but for now, can I make it up to

1:39:06you by henceforth referring to you as

1:39:08Ryancé?

1:39:14Councilman um

1:39:16Dr. Nerdy Navarez Martinez, as you

1:39:18requested, I have picked you a song. Hit

1:39:20me up after.

1:39:22And finally, um have you all considered

1:39:23having a dodgeball game? Like um

1:39:27city council dodgeball once a year for

1:39:29some local nonprofit. I mean, you could

1:39:31get people so engaged in local issues by

1:39:34watching their local government throw

1:39:35things at each other. It would be so

1:39:36much fun.

1:39:38Um thank you.

1:39:40>> Thank you. Next is Chelsea Ransom,

1:39:42followed by Mike Smolligan.

1:39:50>> Darren, you just gave them rocks. Let's

1:39:52not start talking about throwing things

1:39:54at each other right now.

1:39:56Um

1:39:57All right. Well,

1:39:59uh

1:40:02Mr. Mayor, I um

1:40:06got a little cut off on time uh last

1:40:08time when I was speaking to you and

1:40:11I think that it was an inopportune

1:40:13moment and the message that I was trying

1:40:14to pass along. I was talking about a

1:40:17game that we played called Pin the Blame

1:40:19on the Mayor

1:40:20and how people that we haven't even met

1:40:23working on this ALPR issue showed up to

1:40:25play it. I say this

1:40:27not to humiliate you, but to illustrate

1:40:30the fact that while you may have the

1:40:32office, you don't necessarily have the

1:40:34people.

1:40:35And

1:40:38while I did say that you may have missed

1:40:39your moment, the thing is that

1:40:42as long as we keep breathing, we have

1:40:43new moments that come to us and

1:40:46I just hope that you'll keep that in

1:40:48mind was

1:40:50more regulation or ordinances related to

1:40:52ALPR comes forward. It could be a

1:40:55wonderful beginning to a redemption arc

1:40:58for you in the eyes of a lot of the

1:40:59people in the city.

1:41:02Um and now I bring myself to the reason

1:41:06that I signed up for this comment. Um

1:41:08I've been reading the city charter. Uh

1:41:11I'm feeling a little rather nerdy for

1:41:12it, but I'm really enjoying it and I'm

1:41:14finding some interesting stuff in there.

1:41:16Um so, in article 3, chapter 103,

1:41:20section 3, um it says the rules uh this

1:41:23is in relation to rules for city council

1:41:25meetings. The rules shall provide that

1:41:27there shall be a time on the agenda of

1:41:28each council meeting for a report from

1:41:30the mayor and a time for the mayor or a

1:41:32representative of the mayor to respond

1:41:33to questions.

1:41:36Article 4, chapter 102, Section 2, um

1:41:39Executive Branch, it says the mayor or

1:41:41the deputy may to the mayor shall attend

1:41:43all regular and special meetings of the

1:41:45City Council to submit such reports and

1:41:46proposals to the City Council and as are

1:41:49appropriate and to respond to questions

1:41:51of the council members and citizens.

1:41:54Since we don't really have an official

1:41:57time for citizens to ask the mayor

1:41:59questions in the council agenda to the

1:42:01best of my knowledge, I'm going to use

1:42:04that time now.

1:42:05So, Mr. Mayor,

1:42:08how does mass surveillance support your

1:42:11strategic vision for the City of

1:42:12Lansing?

1:42:13And

1:42:14what room is there for you to adjust

1:42:17that vision based on what the public

1:42:19wants?

1:42:28>> Chelsea, I remind you during public

1:42:29comment, we don't generally respond.

1:42:31Just

1:42:32>> I I understand that council members

1:42:33don't generally respond to questions and

1:42:35there's nothing in the charter about

1:42:36that, but the language in the charter

1:42:37does say that the mayor has to be here

1:42:39to respond to questions from citizens.

1:42:52Thanks for nothing, I guess.

1:42:53>> Next is Mike Small again followed by

1:42:56William Dankey.

1:43:05>> Good evening, City Council and Mr.

1:43:06Mayor. Mike Small again, I live over in

1:43:08the Cherry Hill neighborhood over by the

1:43:10new City Hall. Welcome to the

1:43:11neighborhood Shirley.

1:43:13Tonight I've got one thank you and two

1:43:15requests. So, first a quick shout out to

1:43:17the City Clerk. I appreciate getting an

1:43:20email letting me know that you've

1:43:22received my absentee ballot and I

1:43:24appreciate our City Clerk running free,

1:43:26fair, safe, and secure elections. So,

1:43:28thank you very much. The two requests.

1:43:31First, I would request that you a city

1:43:33council get some data from the Board of

1:43:35Water and Light about how many residents

1:43:38in Lansing are not able to afford their

1:43:41utility bills.

1:43:43As I attend various meetings, I've

1:43:45talked to both City of Lansing staff and

1:43:47Board of Water and Light staff, and they

1:43:49have told me that 25% of Board of Water

1:43:52and Light's 100,000 customers struggle

1:43:55to pay their utility bills.

1:43:57That seems like a really high number.

1:43:5925,000 people is a lot of people in

1:44:02Lansing, and I don't know the definition

1:44:03of struggle. So, I would ask that you

1:44:06would get some data from the Board of

1:44:07Water and Light and find out, you know,

1:44:09how many people in Lansing are

1:44:10struggling to pay their utility bills.

1:44:12What is the default rate? What is the

1:44:14shutoff rate here in Lansing? Detroit

1:44:16gets a lot of press for water shutoffs,

1:44:20and uh I don't know uh the extent of

1:44:23that problem here in Lansing. I'm on the

1:44:25board of the Capital Area Friends of the

1:44:26Environment, and we did a survey of the

1:44:29community this past year asking about

1:44:32energy and water affordability. We don't

1:44:34have those data back yet. We're working

1:44:36with MSU to, you know, do the survey

1:44:38analysis. When we get those data, I'll

1:44:40be sure to share them with you, but

1:44:41please start investigating this issue

1:44:43sooner than that.

1:44:45My second request is that you uh do a

1:44:48little reading about um House Bill 4555.

1:44:52And this is from Lansing's own

1:44:54representative Emily Dievendorf, who is

1:44:57trying to address the water

1:44:58affordability issue statewide. Where

1:45:01this is a very innovative approach to

1:45:03cap water bills between 2 and 3% of

1:45:08income for eligible low-income

1:45:10customers. And this approach gives water

1:45:13utilities flexibility in terms of

1:45:17charging the rest of us a little more to

1:45:18make sure that they're still, you know,

1:45:19profitable, but, you know, actually

1:45:22making sure that our most vulnerable

1:45:24neighbors, our lowest-income residents,

1:45:26people that are struggling to pay their

1:45:28bills, are actually, you know, capping

1:45:31their water bill at 2 to 3%. There's

1:45:35another approach in the Michigan Senate.

1:45:38Senator Chang has another approach on

1:45:40water affordability, but the more I

1:45:42learn about Emily Dievendorf's approach,

1:45:44this is a really interesting way to help

1:45:48potentially 25,000 people here in

1:45:50Lansing. And I

1:45:52I have very little confidence that the

1:45:55eight people on the Board of

1:45:56Commissioners at BWL are going to solve

1:45:58this problem without some serious input

1:46:01and oversight from City Council to make

1:46:04sure that our monopoly utility is here

1:46:06to serve the people of Lansing, not just

1:46:08the corporations of Lansing. Thank you.

1:46:11>> Thank you. Next we have William Donahue

1:46:13and then

1:46:15Nathan Ford.

1:46:21Okay, apparently he's gone. So, Nathan

1:46:24Ford.

1:46:47>> Good evening, Council members. My name

1:46:49is Nate the Great and I'm here for the

1:46:51Lansing Entheogens and Psychedelics

1:46:53Society or LEAPS for short, l e a p s.

1:46:57We're an educational group that meets

1:46:59once a month in Lansing and we're

1:47:01organizing as a nonprofit to educate and

1:47:03support our community.

1:47:06I'm here because our veterans and our

1:47:07neighbors deserve better options.

1:47:09Tonight, I want to talk about veterans

1:47:11because this is something we all can

1:47:13agree on.

1:47:14Everyone here knows someone who served.

1:47:17The VA's

1:47:19newest report found 6,488

1:47:22veteran suicides nationwide in 2024,

1:47:26about 17.7 every day.

1:47:29And 62% of them hadn't received VA

1:47:31healthcare in the year they died or the

1:47:33year before.

1:47:35VA Secretary Doug Collins said in

1:47:37this in August, "Far too many veterans

1:47:40are living with mental health conditions

1:47:42that don't respond to available

1:47:43treatments." Unquote.

1:47:45The VA is now running a psilocybin trial

1:47:47at five VA medical centers

1:47:50with 20 other psychedelic studies

1:47:52underway.

1:47:53In April, an executive order told

1:47:55federal agencies to speed this research

1:47:58up. And in September, the FDA held a

1:48:00public hearing. Washington is moving.

1:48:03Lansing should be ready.

1:48:05I'm asking for two things.

1:48:07First, that Lansing join Ann Arbor and

1:48:09Detroit in making enforcement against

1:48:11personal non-commercial possession of

1:48:13entheogenic plants and fungi one of its

1:48:16lowest law enforcement priorities.

1:48:19Veterans and neighbors looking for

1:48:20relief shouldn't risk a criminal record

1:48:22to find it.

1:48:23Second, that this council be open to

1:48:26partnership. Michigan Psychedelic

1:48:28Research Center is in Ann Arbor. Lansing

1:48:31has nothing like it, but Michigan State

1:48:33University is right next door to us.

1:48:35Research brings grants, researchers,

1:48:38clinicians, and the jobs and businesses

1:48:40that follow. In Wisconsin, a nonprofit

1:48:44called Usona Institute works with

1:48:47University of Wisconsin hospitals on a

1:48:49psilocybin trial. I'd like Lansing and

1:48:50MSU to start the that conversation. I'm

1:48:53not asking this council to approve any

1:48:54treatment. That's the FDA's job. I'm

1:48:57asking Lansing to stop treating the

1:48:58people who served this country as

1:48:59criminals for looking for relief and to

1:49:02be ready when the research arrives.

1:49:04These are our neighbors and they've

1:49:05waited long enough. Thank you for your

1:49:07time for listening tonight. I'd be glad

1:49:08to talk with any of you

1:49:10and I'm happy to share my sources.

1:49:13Goodnight.

1:49:14>> Thank you. Next is Loretta Stenaway, and

1:49:17then Michael Mercer.

1:49:28>> Okay, my brain caught up and I

1:49:29remembered the other point on the pilots

1:49:32was that I think from here forward it

1:49:34behooves us to look at putting into all

1:49:37the pilots that come after these a

1:49:39requirement that they stipulate to their

1:49:41best predictability when their

1:49:43break-even point will be in the 15 or

1:49:45whatever 20-year margin it is that this

1:49:47pilot particularly is requesting and

1:49:50when the city's break-even point would

1:49:51be. So that we know going into it that

1:49:54we're we're affording them

1:49:56predictability profitability up to a

1:49:58certain level and then we at a certain

1:50:00point we expect a city to start gaining

1:50:03again on that uh

1:50:06relieved tax structure. So that's that's

1:50:09my advice, my recommendation. Put

1:50:11stipulations into these pilots that say

1:50:13at this point the developer expects to

1:50:15be a profit and at this point the city

1:50:18should start breaking even.

1:50:20And then lastly um

1:50:22since this is our last session to my

1:50:23knowledge here in the city hall for a

1:50:25city council meeting

1:50:26I want to It isn't? When is our last

1:50:29one?

1:50:30>> The rest of November will be in the

1:50:32meeting in this chamber.

1:50:33>> Okay. All right.

1:50:35Gives you time then to work on this.

1:50:37There is a significant difference in the

1:50:39level or perception of the level of

1:50:42safety outside of this building and

1:50:44outside of the new building opposite

1:50:46CADA.

1:50:48There is a very distinct difference.

1:50:51So I think it is entirely appropriate

1:50:53that the city look at and consider

1:50:55budgeting for some sort of an escort so

1:50:58that people coming in and going out of

1:51:00council meetings in particular at night

1:51:02when it's dark even with the street

1:51:03lights

1:51:04can feel safe walking from the meeting

1:51:06to their cars, wherever their cars are

1:51:08on a street, in a ramp, wherever they

1:51:10might be because frankly outside of Cada

1:51:13is not a safe place in the daylight,

1:51:15let alone in the dark.

1:51:17So, I think it's appropriate and

1:51:19imperative that that start being

1:51:21discussed. Thank you.

1:51:24>> Thank you. And our final speaker is

1:51:26Michael Mercer. And no

1:51:30Thank you. With no further business for

1:51:31Lansing City Council at 8:51, we are

1:51:33adjourned.

1:51:53>> allow Donald Trump to win that first

1:51:57presidential election here in Michigan.

1:52:00>> David, when I think back on elections in

1:52:04the past, I actually feel like

1:52:08I don't find Michigan voters

```*

## Sources

- Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GluUsXc3Xlw

- Agenda: https://lansingmi.api.civicclerk.com/v1/Meetings/GetMeetingFileStream(fileId=16016,plainText=false)

- Packet: https://lansingmi.api.civicclerk.com/v1/Meetings/GetMeetingFileStream(fileId=16019,plainText=false)